Dave Palumbo pic, immediately after prison release

[Van_Bilderass]

Are you honestly telling me you never seen a guy use stroids, stop and not permanently alter his muscle mass?
If so all the guys you see used junk and were VERY poor subjects and mucked it up baddly.

Im not talking keeping all the outlandish mass of a top level competitor, taht aint happenin'.
But a hormonal surge puts the body in a state to build muscle, stay there long enough and come off correctly and slowly and you can keep a lot more than you think.

If you've used, you got a right to say so, if not, your just blowin smoke.

Like I said, I believe you can alter the set-point to a degree and there's some science supporting that also. Not a whole lot, but a little sure. Hard to put a percentage on it.

Yes, I've used. For myself I'd guess maybe 15lbs above my natural limit and I'm able to keep a whole lot of strength.

Usually the ones who keep training after getting off for extended periods of time put on bodyfat so it's kind of hard to say how much lbm they kept. What's strange is that the one's whom I've seen maintain best never used any PCT of any kind and admittedly had problems with their natural production (poor libido etc).

[Van_Bilderass]

mike morris was sick also. he even says himself he purposely went down in weight to be healthy.
i agree about boresen...like i said that is one of his theories i agreed on...there aren't many others

He said his kidney markers were high. Don't know if he really lowered his protein intake or if he was seriously sick in the first place. I'm sure he tried to keep as much mass as possible via food and training when he did his last show.

I don't know Mike so there may be more to the story of why he stopped competing, as is often the case. Who knows?

[trab]

Like I said, I believe you can alter the set-point to a degree and there's some science supporting that also. Not a whole lot, but a little sure. Hard to put a percentage on it.

Yes, I've used. For myself I'd guess maybe 15lbs above my natural limit and I'm able to keep a whole lot of strength.

Usually the ones who keep training after getting off for extended periods of time put on bodyfat so it's kind of hard to say how much lbm they kept. What's strange is that the one's whom I've seen maintain best never used any PCT of any kind and admittedly had problems with their natural production (poor libido etc).

*********************************************************************
Fat from the estrogen and steroid, if on a guy that has nice frame and was very lean to start - LOOKs Good to a point.

Steroids put on more fat also, theres research support that too. Its all about a pleasing filled out shape in the end or
strength.

Going WAY up like a pro and keeping it all aint happenin unless the guy was a Gorrila to start.
THeres Plenty guys like that out there that never touched a dumbell or steroid.

[THEBOSS]

Is it just me, or is "BOSS" a total assh0le?

Lets see ! Im calling a clown on what is obvious bullshit and he acting the tough guy but Im an asshole ? You tools are to much ! 

[local hero]

ive got to ebb in,,,, anyone whos used for a few yrs and been on and off for extended periods will know that u keep the majority of what youve got.  I trained naturaly from 15 to 19 and gained around 30lbs, then gained another 30lbs on gear... i usualy drop around 10 to 15lbs when im off...dont look any smaller just lack condition and fullness, u wouldnt know the difference in clothes.. and ive had upto a yr off completely, and until recently never ran long or frequent cycles

[trab]

ive got to ebb in,,,, anyone whos used for a few yrs and been on and off for extended periods will know that u keep the majority of what youve got.  I trained naturaly from 15 to 19 and gained around 30lbs, then gained another 30lbs on gear... i usualy drop around 10 to 15lbs when im off...dont look any smaller just lack condition and fullness, u wouldnt know the difference in clothes.. and ive had upto a yr off completely, and until recently never ran long or frequent cycles

I also really dislike the disrespect to Dave and Paul. 2 of the 3 only REAL AAS "Gurus".

(Aurthor El Rae also)

They were all LARGE and powerfully built, knew their shit, shared it, very technical and passionate about BBing and performance enhancement....

I should scan in the Pic of Paul off cover of The Stack... Of coures all these guys are bigger 

Yes he was a nut, a self admitted nut with substance abuse issues. That makes his condition in that Pic all the more impressive. If a narcotic/benzo user can put on that mass god know what he'd been capable of without that burden.

[20inch calves]

He said his kidney markers were high. Don't know if he really lowered his protein intake or if he was seriously sick in the first place. I'm sure he tried to keep as much mass as possible via food and training when he did his last show.

I don't know Mike so there may be more to the story of why he stopped competing, as is often the case. Who knows?

i have read in interviews he did drop his protien intake to give he kidneys a break because his blood work was off. the doc told him at the rate he was going his kidneys were going to
shut down. so mike is a bad example because he could have kept a great deal of mass if he had chosen to

[trab]

It sounds nice in theory... having a new set-point of 260lbs. I do think you can push you natural set-point a little, but look at the pros who really come off for an extended period of time. The guys I know who have gone off and not lost much weight have all gotten FAT! Really fat. Dorian keeps pretty good size but he is still ON, imagine if he was totally clean? Look at Mike Morris... he kept training and even did a show clean. How much did he keep?

BTW, Borresen was a lunatic junkie.

Yup, basically a selfproclaimed, powerfully built lunatic junkie who was one of the 1st to lay the insulin/HGH puzzle keys on the general public, among other thing. I suppose all the haters are better built though, and own 3 Gyms, a ocean front mansion ...
Bla Bla Bla...

I dont know, that looks like awesome thickness to me, esp for a Nubian/ benzo user. Guy must have known something?

[tommywishbone]

  Dude actually posted that picture? 

[trab]

Dude actually posted that picture? 

That's not a thick and powerfull muscle base?