Author Topic: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless  (Read 7829 times)

sean

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #50 on: October 31, 2012, 07:17:43 AM »
Ah HA,I knew, it your a Pitbull Nutter, I knew you were carrying a grudge and looking to find a way to push your twisted agenda.  Since we last spoke about pitbulls, over 20 people have been brutally killed and many more seriously maimed.  I will never back down from my stance on BSL and Pitbulls, and it is those that advocate for the breed while people are being regularly killed by them and pretending as if their isn't an issue is socipathic and pathological in the extreme.  I have never met a Pitbull Nutter who I would consider a decent human being, they are always insecure, anti-social and inferior personalities, hence the reason they choose a fighting breed of dog to prop up their deficient personalities.  

I never said all Pitbulls should be rounded up and killed, but they should be sterilised and grandfathered out of existence.  In one 85-day period from July to September 2008, pit bulls were involved in 127 dog attacks, 57% of which occurred off the owner’s property. In these attacks, 158 people were injured, 63% of them severely; 10% of the victims suffered severed body parts; and 6 victims were killed. 12 In the same period, 128 dangerous pit bulls had to be shot to death by police officers or citizens. A closer look at these figures indicates that 1 person is killed by a pit bull every 14 days, a person loses a body part to a pit bull attack every 5.4 days, 2 persons are injured by pit bulls each day, and 1.5 pit bulls are shot to death each day.  Why anybody would want to own such a dog is proof positive of their distorted sociopathic personality.  As to responding to the other points in your post, I won't bother, once I realise someone is a Pitbull Nutter, I know more than enough to know they are full of shit and spend most of their time spreading lies and nonsense.

Interesting stats. Can you share your source on those? Comedic conclusions on the "personality-typing" which, I'd say you're probably quite accurate. I, however, think they are good looking, loyal dogs, and their short hair makes for less maintenance.

Radical Plato

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #51 on: October 31, 2012, 07:34:02 AM »
Interesting stats. Can you share your source on those? Comedic conclusions on the "personality-typing" which, I'd say you're probably quite accurate. I, however, think they are good looking, loyal dogs, and their short hair makes for less maintenance.
Those stats are from the study Mortality, Mauling, and Maiming by Vicious Dogs 2011 -
John K. Bini, MD, Stephen M. Cohn, MD, Shirley M. Acosta, RN, BSN, Marilyn J. McFarland, RN, MS,bMark T. Muir, MD, and Joel E. Michalek, PhD; for the TRISAT Clinical Trials Group

Here are some more quotes from the study, I have been a BSL advocate ever since I was attacked and seriously injured by two Pitbulls three years ago.

Compared with attacks by other breeds of dogs, attacks by pit bulls were associated with a higher median Injury Severity Scale score, a higher risk of an admission Glasgow Coma Scale* score of 8 or lower, higher median hospital charges , and a higher risk of death

* GCS is used to assess level of consciousness after head injury, The scale is composed of three tests: eye, verbal and motor responses. The three values separately as well as their sum are considered. The lowest possible GCS (the sum) is 3 (deep coma or death), while the highest is 15 (fully awake person).

Attacks by pit bulls are associated with higher morbidity rates, higher hospital charges, and a higher risk of death than are attacks by  other breeds of dogs. Strict regulation of pit bulls may substantially reduce the US mortality rates related to dog bites.

As pit bulls have become more popular and their numbers have increased, so have the numbers of deaths attributable to their attacks. They now are the single breed responsible for the vast majority of deaths due to dog attacks. In 2007, 33 fatal cases of dog mauling were reported in 17 states. Texas led the nation with 7 deaths, 6 of which were caused by pit bulls. In 2008 there were 23 fatal dog attacks, and pit bulls were responsible for 65% of these attacks and for all but 1 death due to dog attacks against persons aged more than 3 years.

Pit bulls not only are notorious for their indiscriminate attack pattern but also are well known for the tenacity with which they continue with an attack. The case fatality reported above involved an infant that was mauled by 2 pit bulls. These dogs had previously bitten an 8-year-old relative in the face. When the dog’s owner attempted to stop the attack on the infant by stabbing the dogs with a knife, she became a victim herself, and police officers had to shoot (kill) the dogs at the scene. It is not uncommon to hear of witnessed attacks in which the pit bulls could not be stopped from attacking

The inbred tenacity of pit bulls, the unrelenting manner in which they initiate and continue their attacks, and the damage they cause are the result of both genetics and environment. Therefore, this breed of dog is inherently dangerous

Over a recent 3-year period from January 2006 to March 30, 2009, a total of 98 dog bite fatalities involving 179 dogs occurred; 60% of the deaths were caused by pit bulls, and 76% were caused by pit bulls and Rottweilers. A total of 113 pit bulls were involved in these deaths, and they accounted for 63% of the dogs involved in fatal attacks. If the risk of fatal attack is normalized to Labrador Retrievers and Labrador-mix breeds (the most common registered dog in the United States), the relative risk of death related to pit bull attacks is more than 2500 times higher.

Dog bite ordinances vary widely across the United States.  Seventeen states have “one bite” laws that do not hold the dog owner accountable for the actions of a dangerous dog until after the dog has caused harm, at which point it can be considered potentially dangerous or vicious. Twelve states have laws that specifically forbid municipalities to enact breed-specific laws or rdinances. Currently, 250 cities in the United States have breed-specific ordinances, even though some of these cities are in states that prohibit breed-specific laws. Texas, the state that leads the nation in dog bite fatalities, is a “one bite” state that prohibits breed-specific laws.

Dog bites are a serious public health concern in the United States and across the world. They result in substantial emotional and physical trauma and in a substantial economic cost to the victims and to society. Fortunately, fatal dog attacks are rare, but there seems to be a distinct relationship between the severity and lethality of an attack and the breed of dog responsible. The unacceptable actuarial risk associated with certain breeds of dogs (specifically, pit bulls) must be addressed. These breeds should be regulated in the same way in which other dangerous species, such as leopards.

Dog attack deaths and maimings, U.S. & Canada September 1982 to December 22, 2009
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Temperament is not the issue, nor is it even relevant. What is relevant is actuarial risk. If almost any other dog has a bad moment, someone may get bitten, but will not be maimed for life or killed, and the actuarial risk is accordingly reasonable. If a pit bull terrier or a Rottweiler has a bad moment, often someone is maimed or killed--and that has now created off-the-chart actuarial risk, for which the dogs as well as their victims are paying the price.

There is a persistent allegation by pit bull terrier advocates that pit bulls are overrepresented because of misidentifications or because “pit bull” is, according to them, a generic term covering several similar types of dog. However, the frequency of pit bull attacks among these worst-in-10,000 cases is so disproportionate that even if half of the attacks in the pit bull category were misattributed, or even if the pit bull category was split three ways, attacks by pit bulls and their closest relatives would still outnumber attacks by any other breed.

There is a persistent allegation by pit bull terrier advocates that the use of media accounts as a data source is somehow suspect. Reality is that media coverage incorporates information from police reports, animal control reports, witness accounts, victim accounts in many instances, and hospital reports. Media coverage is, in short, multi-sourced, unlike reports from any single source.

Of the breeds most often involved in incidents of sufficient severity to be listed, pit bull terriers and their close mixes make up only about 3.3% of the total U.S. dog population, according to my frequent surveys of regionally balanced samples of classified ads of dogs for sale, but they constitute 29% of the dog population in U.S. animal shelters at any given time, according to my 2011 singleday shelter inventory survey, which followed up similar surveys producing similar results done in 2004, 2008, and 2010.

Of the breeds most often involved in incidents of sufficient severity to be listed, pit bull terriers and their close mixes make up only about 5% of the total U.S. dog population, according to my frequent surveys of regionally balanced samples of classified ads of dogs for sale, but they constitute more than 20% of the dog population in U.S. animal shelters at any given time

Pit bulls are noteworthy on the chart above for attacking adults almost as frequently as children. This is a very rare pattern: children are normally at greatest risk from dogbite because they play with dogs more often, have less experience in reading dog behavior, are more likely to engage in activity that alarms or stimulates a dog, and are less able to defend themselves when a dog becomes aggressive. Pit bulls seem to differ behaviorally from other dogs in having far less inhibition about attacking people who are larger than they are.

Pitbulls are also notorious for attacking seemingly without warning, a tendency exacerbated by the custom of docking pit bulls’ tails so that warning signals are not easily recognized. Thus the adult victim of a pit bull attack may have had little or no opportunity to read the warning signals that would avert an attack from any other dog.

The traditional approach to dangerous dog legislation is to allow “one free bite,” at which point the owner is warned. On second bite, the dog is killed. The traditional approach, however, patently does not apply in addressing the threats from pit bull terriers, Rottweilers, and wolf hybrids. In more than two-thirds of the cases I have logged, the life-threatening or fatal attack was apparently the first known dangerous behavior by the animal in question. Children and elderly people were almost always the victims.

Any law strong enough and directed enough to prevent the majority of lifethreatening dog attacks must discriminate heavily against pit bulls, Rottweilers, wolf hybrids, and perhaps Akitas and chows, who are not common breeds but do seem to be involved in disproportionate numbers of life-threatening attacks.

One might hope that educating the public against the acquisition of dangerous dogs would help; but the very traits that make certain breeds dangerous also appeal to a certain class of dog owner. Thus publicizing their potentially hazardous nature has tended to increase these breeds’ popularity.

Meanwhile, because the humane community has demonstrated a profound unwillingness to recognize, accept, and respond to the need for some sort of strong breed-specific regulation to deal with pit bulls and Rottweilers, the insurance industry is doing the regulating instead, by means which include refusing to insure new shelters which accept and place pit bulls. That means a mandatory death sentence for most pitbulls, regardless of why they come to shelters.

The humane community does not try to encourage the adoption of pumas in the same manner that we encourage the adoption of felis catus (domestic cat), because even though a puma can also be box-trained and otherwise exhibits much the same indoor behavior, it is clearly understood that accidents with a puma are frequently fatal. For the same reason, it is sheer foolishness to encourage people to regard pit bull terriers and Rottweilers as just dogs like any other, no matter how much they may behave like other dogs under ordinary circumstances.

Pit bulls and Rottweilers are accordingly dogs who not only must be handled with special precautions, but also must be regulated with special requirements appropriate to the risk they may pose to the public and other animals, if they are to be kept at all.
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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #52 on: October 31, 2012, 07:48:39 AM »
Gary Wilkes is a respected dog trainer and behaviourist, his grandfather also fought Pit bulls all across the South, the man knows pitbulls, ironically the DOGMEN are far more honest about the breed than the average working/middle class Pitbull onwer.  Dogmen would have never kept a pitbull as a house-pet, they knew they were dangerous.  Sadly, it's the do-gooders who have tried to breed the gameness out of them to make a buck selling to all the wanna be tough guys or bleeding heart animal nuts that have made the situation dangerous.
Everyone was safer when DOGMEN who used Pitbulls for Fighting were the only ones who owned such dogs. They were aware of the Genetic history of the breed, it's bloodlines full of Game. They kept their dogs well away from the Public for fear of their hobby of dogfighting being discovered. Their was no confusion, Pitbulls were killers alright, and none of the DOGMEN would be foolish enough to keep one as a house-pet. Enter the Breeders, the profiteers and the bleeding heart Animal activists, all with their own agenda, some trying to preserve the game blood line, some trying to breed it out, some trying to rescue a dog no matter how much danger it poses to the general public.

Back in the day, it was easy to tell a dangerous Pitbull, it was every Pitbull you saw, for the DOGMEN did away with dogs that weren't GAME, they had no purpose for them. Now, everybody knows that any moment now, a Pitbull is going to either maim, maul or kill someone, as it has been doing for decades now, but no-one can tell which one it is, The breed has been too interfered with, the DOGMEN couldn't contain their wilder-beast, and those who had no purpose with such a breed got a hold of it. Pitbulls were bred for the sole purpose of being a game fighting dog, never to be a house-pet, and those who have tried to breed the game out of them have only made it worse for everyone, more unpredictable and more dangerous. This is why we hear regularly now of family pit bulls scalping or killing the baby, and the naive owner expressing their disbelief and just last night the pitbull was snuggled up next to the child licking their face.
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Radical Plato

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #53 on: October 31, 2012, 07:50:45 AM »
More .....
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Twaddle

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #54 on: October 31, 2012, 07:51:19 AM »
Those stats are from the study Mortality, Mauling, and Maiming by Vicious Dogs 2011 -
John K. Bini, MD, Stephen M. Cohn, MD, Shirley M. Acosta, RN, BSN, Marilyn J. McFarland, RN, MS,bMark T. Muir, MD, and Joel E. Michalek, PhD; for the TRISAT Clinical Trials Group

Here are some more quotes from the study, I have been a BSL advocate ever since I was attacked and seriously injured by two Pitbulls three years ago.

Compared with attacks by other breeds of dogs, attacks by pit bulls were associated with a higher median Injury Severity Scale score, a higher risk of an admission Glasgow Coma Scale* score of 8 or lower, higher median hospital charges , and a higher risk of death

* GCS is used to assess level of consciousness after head injury, The scale is composed of three tests: eye, verbal and motor responses. The three values separately as well as their sum are considered. The lowest possible GCS (the sum) is 3 (deep coma or death), while the highest is 15 (fully awake person).

Attacks by pit bulls are associated with higher morbidity rates, higher hospital charges, and a higher risk of death than are attacks by  other breeds of dogs. Strict regulation of pit bulls may substantially reduce the US mortality rates related to dog bites.

As pit bulls have become more popular and their numbers have increased, so have the numbers of deaths attributable to their attacks. They now are the single breed responsible for the vast majority of deaths due to dog attacks. In 2007, 33 fatal cases of dog mauling were reported in 17 states. Texas led the nation with 7 deaths, 6 of which were caused by pit bulls. In 2008 there were 23 fatal dog attacks, and pit bulls were responsible for 65% of these attacks and for all but 1 death due to dog attacks against persons aged more than 3 years.

Pit bulls not only are notorious for their indiscriminate attack pattern but also are well known for the tenacity with which they continue with an attack. The case fatality reported above involved an infant that was mauled by 2 pit bulls. These dogs had previously bitten an 8-year-old relative in the face. When the dog’s owner attempted to stop the attack on the infant by stabbing the dogs with a knife, she became a victim herself, and police officers had to shoot (kill) the dogs at the scene. It is not uncommon to hear of witnessed attacks in which the pit bulls could not be stopped from attacking

The inbred tenacity of pit bulls, the unrelenting manner in which they initiate and continue their attacks, and the damage they cause are the result of both genetics and environment. Therefore, this breed of dog is inherently dangerous

Over a recent 3-year period from January 2006 to March 30, 2009, a total of 98 dog bite fatalities involving 179 dogs occurred; 60% of the deaths were caused by pit bulls, and 76% were caused by pit bulls and Rottweilers. A total of 113 pit bulls were involved in these deaths, and they accounted for 63% of the dogs involved in fatal attacks. If the risk of fatal attack is normalized to Labrador Retrievers and Labrador-mix breeds (the most common registered dog in the United States), the relative risk of death related to pit bull attacks is more than 2500 times higher.

Dog bite ordinances vary widely across the United States.  Seventeen states have “one bite” laws that do not hold the dog owner accountable for the actions of a dangerous dog until after the dog has caused harm, at which point it can be considered potentially dangerous or vicious. Twelve states have laws that specifically forbid municipalities to enact breed-specific laws or rdinances. Currently, 250 cities in the United States have breed-specific ordinances, even though some of these cities are in states that prohibit breed-specific laws. Texas, the state that leads the nation in dog bite fatalities, is a “one bite” state that prohibits breed-specific laws.

Dog bites are a serious public health concern in the United States and across the world. They result in substantial emotional and physical trauma and in a substantial economic cost to the victims and to society. Fortunately, fatal dog attacks are rare, but there seems to be a distinct relationship between the severity and lethality of an attack and the breed of dog responsible. The unacceptable actuarial risk associated with certain breeds of dogs (specifically, pit bulls) must be addressed. These breeds should be regulated in the same way in which other dangerous species, such as leopards.

Dog attack deaths and maimings, U.S. & Canada September 1982 to December 22, 2009
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Temperament is not the issue, nor is it even relevant. What is relevant is actuarial risk. If almost any other dog has a bad moment, someone may get bitten, but will not be maimed for life or killed, and the actuarial risk is accordingly reasonable. If a pit bull terrier or a Rottweiler has a bad moment, often someone is maimed or killed--and that has now created off-the-chart actuarial risk, for which the dogs as well as their victims are paying the price.

There is a persistent allegation by pit bull terrier advocates that pit bulls are overrepresented because of misidentifications or because “pit bull” is, according to them, a generic term covering several similar types of dog. However, the frequency of pit bull attacks among these worst-in-10,000 cases is so disproportionate that even if half of the attacks in the pit bull category were misattributed, or even if the pit bull category was split three ways, attacks by pit bulls and their closest relatives would still outnumber attacks by any other breed.

There is a persistent allegation by pit bull terrier advocates that the use of media accounts as a data source is somehow suspect. Reality is that media coverage incorporates information from police reports, animal control reports, witness accounts, victim accounts in many instances, and hospital reports. Media coverage is, in short, multi-sourced, unlike reports from any single source.

Of the breeds most often involved in incidents of sufficient severity to be listed, pit bull terriers and their close mixes make up only about 3.3% of the total U.S. dog population, according to my frequent surveys of regionally balanced samples of classified ads of dogs for sale, but they constitute 29% of the dog population in U.S. animal shelters at any given time, according to my 2011 singleday shelter inventory survey, which followed up similar surveys producing similar results done in 2004, 2008, and 2010.

Of the breeds most often involved in incidents of sufficient severity to be listed, pit bull terriers and their close mixes make up only about 5% of the total U.S. dog population, according to my frequent surveys of regionally balanced samples of classified ads of dogs for sale, but they constitute more than 20% of the dog population in U.S. animal shelters at any given time

Pit bulls are noteworthy on the chart above for attacking adults almost as frequently as children. This is a very rare pattern: children are normally at greatest risk from dogbite because they play with dogs more often, have less experience in reading dog behavior, are more likely to engage in activity that alarms or stimulates a dog, and are less able to defend themselves when a dog becomes aggressive. Pit bulls seem to differ behaviorally from other dogs in having far less inhibition about attacking people who are larger than they are.

Pitbulls are also notorious for attacking seemingly without warning, a tendency exacerbated by the custom of docking pit bulls’ tails so that warning signals are not easily recognized. Thus the adult victim of a pit bull attack may have had little or no opportunity to read the warning signals that would avert an attack from any other dog.

The traditional approach to dangerous dog legislation is to allow “one free bite,” at which point the owner is warned. On second bite, the dog is killed. The traditional approach, however, patently does not apply in addressing the threats from pit bull terriers, Rottweilers, and wolf hybrids. In more than two-thirds of the cases I have logged, the life-threatening or fatal attack was apparently the first known dangerous behavior by the animal in question. Children and elderly people were almost always the victims.

Any law strong enough and directed enough to prevent the majority of lifethreatening dog attacks must discriminate heavily against pit bulls, Rottweilers, wolf hybrids, and perhaps Akitas and chows, who are not common breeds but do seem to be involved in disproportionate numbers of life-threatening attacks.

One might hope that educating the public against the acquisition of dangerous dogs would help; but the very traits that make certain breeds dangerous also appeal to a certain class of dog owner. Thus publicizing their potentially hazardous nature has tended to increase these breeds’ popularity.

Meanwhile, because the humane community has demonstrated a profound unwillingness to recognize, accept, and respond to the need for some sort of strong breed-specific regulation to deal with pit bulls and Rottweilers, the insurance industry is doing the regulating instead, by means which include refusing to insure new shelters which accept and place pit bulls. That means a mandatory death sentence for most pitbulls, regardless of why they come to shelters.

The humane community does not try to encourage the adoption of pumas in the same manner that we encourage the adoption of felis catus (domestic cat), because even though a puma can also be box-trained and otherwise exhibits much the same indoor behavior, it is clearly understood that accidents with a puma are frequently fatal. For the same reason, it is sheer foolishness to encourage people to regard pit bull terriers and Rottweilers as just dogs like any other, no matter how much they may behave like other dogs under ordinary circumstances.

Pit bulls and Rottweilers are accordingly dogs who not only must be handled with special precautions, but also must be regulated with special requirements appropriate to the risk they may pose to the public and other animals, if they are to be kept at all.

Good post.  I love how the pit bull nut huggers are always the first ones to cry foul when their beloved friends are ridiculed.  Bottome line, ALL DOGS WILL BITE IF PROVOKED ENOUGH.  If you get attacked by chihuahuas are probably the most aggressive little fuckers there are, and account for many many bites and attacks.  However, when was the last time you heard of a chihuahua killing someone.  Fact, your 80lb pit bull is very capable of killing if he ever decides to bite.

Radical Plato

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #55 on: October 31, 2012, 07:53:45 AM »
Interesting stats. Can you share your source on those? Comedic conclusions on the "personality-typing" which, I'd say you're probably quite accurate. I, however, think they are good looking, loyal dogs, and their short hair makes for less maintenance.
A recent British Study found that the strongest predictor for choosing a dog associated with aggression was to have a personality which was "lower in agreeableness". This meant they were more likely to have traits such as being less interested in the well-being of others, being more suspicious, unfriendly and competitive.
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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #56 on: October 31, 2012, 08:32:01 AM »
If you're really considering getting a CCW and CHL, you need to take an afternoon, and go to your local range.  Rent a 9mm and get a range officer to give you a one on one lesson.  Try to find an outdoor range, it's much less intimidating and less loud compared to an indoor range.  Most first time shooters are intimidated by guns at first, but after one good range session, they leave with a competitive mentality, and want to get more proficient and accurate. 

As far as thinking you wouldn't be good in a panic situation, that's entirely up to you.  If you buy a CCW, and only practice with it a couple of time a year, then you're probably right, you won't do good in a panic situtation.  If however, you practice every 2-4 weeks, become comfortable and proficient with your CCW, then you will have to problem in a panic situtation.  It becomes second nature. 

As for the tazer, you'd be better off with pepper spray.  Pepper spray is just as effective as a tazer, and there is much less room for error.

Hasn't been my experience

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #57 on: October 31, 2012, 08:52:52 AM »
If you're really considering getting a CCW and CHL, you need to take an afternoon, and go to your local range.  Rent a 9mm and get a range officer to give you a one on one lesson.  Try to find an outdoor range, it's much less intimidating and less loud compared to an indoor range.  Most first time shooters are intimidated by guns at first, but after one good range session, they leave with a competitive mentality, and want to get more proficient and accurate. 

As far as thinking you wouldn't be good in a panic situation, that's entirely up to you.  If you buy a CCW, and only practice with it a couple of time a year, then you're probably right, you won't do good in a panic situtation.  If however, you practice every 2-4 weeks, become comfortable and proficient with your CCW, then you will have to problem in a panic situtation.  It becomes second nature. 

As for the tazer, you'd be better off with pepper spray.  Pepper spray is just as effective as a tazer, and there is much less room for error.

This is good advice.  My wife is a 110 pounds.  I took her to buy a pistol for home defense when I was traveling so much.  The dealer tried to sell her on "girl" guns like 38 snubbies and sub-compact 380s.  Instead I had my wife choose the gun that jumped out at her and fit her hand and shooting posture the best.  She choose a Glock23 40 caliber (a full size handgun).  She got determined to use correctly, took a couple of lessons, learned how to dismantle and clean her weapon, and goes to the range at least twice a month.  She found herself coincidentally running into the same guy on her lunch walk and determined that he was a potential threat.  This prompted her to get her CCW license and then a small 9mm (Kahr cw9) pistol that fit what she wears everyday.  She now can outshoot me with it (no homo?)   It's a tool and she cow-girled up and learned how to master it.  Now she wants to take more advanced shooting classes (weak hand shooting, moving targets, multiple targets, clearing a house, etc).  I encourage this because it made her from a "victim" to being in charge and feeling confident in new situations.

There's no guarantee in life but you should at least be competent in as much as you can be.  That competence will help other areas of your life.

Agnostic007

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #58 on: October 31, 2012, 10:53:21 AM »
This is good advice.  My wife is a 110 pounds.  I took her to buy a pistol for home defense when I was traveling so much.  The dealer tried to sell her on "girl" guns like 38 snubbies and sub-compact 380s.  Instead I had my wife choose the gun that jumped out at her and fit her hand and shooting posture the best.  She choose a Glock23 40 caliber (a full size handgun).  She got determined to use correctly, took a couple of lessons, learned how to dismantle and clean her weapon, and goes to the range at least twice a month.  She found herself coincidentally running into the same guy on her lunch walk and determined that he was a potential threat.  This prompted her to get her CCW license and then a small 9mm (Kahr cw9) pistol that fit what she wears everyday.  She now can outshoot me with it (no homo?)   It's a tool and she cow-girled up and learned how to master it.  Now she wants to take more advanced shooting classes (weak hand shooting, moving targets, multiple targets, clearing a house, etc).  I encourage this because it made her from a "victim" to being in charge and feeling confident in new situations.

There's no guarantee in life but you should at least be competent in as much as you can be.  That competence will help other areas of your life.

That's cool. I got to the "clearing a house" part and just gotta say, if she is in a position she feels she would need to clear a house with a gun.. probably time to call 911 and wait barracaded till they get there. Now if you meant "cleaning a house" then my bad..

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #59 on: November 02, 2012, 05:48:53 PM »
That's cool. I got to the "clearing a house" part and just gotta say, if she is in a position she feels she would need to clear a house with a gun.. probably time to call 911 and wait barracaded till they get there. Now if you meant "cleaning a house" then my bad..

she could definitely use a class on cleaning a house!   ;D :'(

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Re: Restraining Orders are pretty much worthless
« Reply #60 on: November 02, 2012, 07:38:06 PM »
This is good advice.  My wife is a 110 pounds.  I took her to buy a pistol for home defense when I was traveling so much.  The dealer tried to sell her on "girl" guns like 38 snubbies and sub-compact 380s.  Instead I had my wife choose the gun that jumped out at her and fit her hand and shooting posture the best.  She choose a Glock23 40 caliber (a full size handgun).  She got determined to use correctly, took a couple of lessons, learned how to dismantle and clean her weapon, and goes to the range at least twice a month.  She found herself coincidentally running into the same guy on her lunch walk and determined that he was a potential threat.  This prompted her to get her CCW license and then a small 9mm (Kahr cw9) pistol that fit what she wears everyday.  She now can outshoot me with it (no homo?)   It's a tool and she cow-girled up and learned how to master it.  Now she wants to take more advanced shooting classes (weak hand shooting, moving targets, multiple targets, clearing a house, etc).  I encourage this because it made her from a "victim" to being in charge and feeling confident in new situations.

There's no guarantee in life but you should at least be competent in as much as you can be.  That competence will help other areas of your life.
Great post

A day at the range makes a nice date once in a while