Author Topic: Why won't she look at her choice?  (Read 24477 times)

Simple Simon

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #125 on: July 05, 2014, 11:17:49 PM »
What a ridiculous generalization.  Most aborted babies would of had a CHANCE at life were they not killed.
No more ridiculous than saying abortion is evil.

Primemuscle

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #126 on: July 05, 2014, 11:54:08 PM »
What a ridiculous generalization.  Most aborted babies would of had a CHANCE at life were they not killed.

Your original post to which I responded read, "AS if that child should be denied the chance to FIND LOVE IN LIFE." This statement is vastly different than the one above where you merely state, "Most aborted babies would of had a CHANCE at life were they not killed." These two statements have very different meanings. And further, I will correct your latter post to more accurately read, All aborted babies would of had a chance at life were they not killed (aborted).

The facts demonstrate that sometimes when babies are unwanted, they are subjected to horrific lives, very often devoid of any nurturing or love and much worse, hatefully abused with physical and mental torture, which sometimes results in the innocent baby's death. Just to be clear, I am allowing that this doesn't always happen. Many babies get lucky because regardless that their parent or parents did not want them, they will love them and nurture them once they are born and they go on to have good lives. But when things go wrong, it is heartbreaking to even imagine even one innocent baby suffering because they were unwanted and remained so though out their sometimes very short lives.

You will note, that I have responded to you a few times now without resorting to calling you derogatory names or posting untrue and unpleasant remarks about your character. I gather that you are not in good control of your emotions, at least with regards to this subject matter.

 


The Ugly

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #127 on: July 06, 2014, 01:46:21 AM »
Your original post to which I responded read, "AS if that child should be denied the chance to FIND LOVE IN LIFE." This statement is vastly different than the one above where you merely state, "Most aborted babies would of had a CHANCE at life were they not killed." These two statements have very different meanings. And further, I will correct your latter post to more accurately read, All aborted babies would of had a chance at life were they not killed (aborted).

The facts demonstrate that sometimes when babies are unwanted, they are subjected to horrific lives, very often devoid of any nurturing or love and much worse, hatefully abused with physical and mental torture, which sometimes results in the innocent baby's death. Just to be clear, I am allowing that this doesn't always happen. Many babies get lucky because regardless that their parent or parents did not want them, they will love them and nurture them once they are born and they go on to have good lives. But when things go wrong, it is heartbreaking to even imagine even one innocent baby suffering because they were unwanted and remained so though out their sometimes very short lives.

You will note, that I have responded to you a few times now without resorting to calling you derogatory names or posting untrue and unpleasant remarks about your character. I gather that you are not in good control of your emotions, at least with regards to this subject matter.

 



If you're gonna correct it, why not change "of" to "have" as well?

avxo

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #128 on: July 06, 2014, 02:18:36 AM »
What a ridiculous generalization.  Most aborted babies would of had a CHANCE at life were they not killed.

Objection. Assumes facts not in evidence. So let me give you some facts:

Research and studies have shown that about 54% of fertilized eggs fail to even implant into the womb and are aborted without the woman becoming pregnant or before knowing that she is pregnant, usually in under 4 weeks. Let that sink in for a moment - more than half of fertilized eggs fail to implant and are lost or result in a miscarriage in the first month. And what of the 46% of fertlized eggs that do implant? Well, things aren't all that rosy for them either: the miscarriage rate is still about 15% so they aren't out of the woods yet.

The fact is that, even if abortion were not practiced, only about 30% of all conceptions result in a live birth. So no... most aborted babies would not have had a chance at life.

Bertha Butt

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #129 on: July 06, 2014, 03:29:55 AM »
You mock religious views on family but think YOU can play god when it comes to KILLING/MURDERING.

Just curious: according to you, is it okay to create life where nature (or God) failed? So, is IVF okay?

Complex Carbs

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #130 on: July 06, 2014, 05:22:05 AM »
What if the mother has aids?

Agenda21fag wants it to be his choice, rather than the many women out there he never met and they all have their reasons.

If it's legal, it's legal.

If it's illegal, some women might do the abortion themselves or travel abroad to have it done.

And yes, are the "pro life" people getting in line to adopt the surplus of african kids out there?


phreak

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agenda21nwo

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #132 on: July 06, 2014, 06:03:59 AM »


Agenda21fag wants it to be his choice

You're not too bright are you?  Maybe your mom should have aborted you.

I never once said that it is my choice.  I never once said I want to stop these women from doing anything.

agenda21nwo

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #133 on: July 06, 2014, 06:05:05 AM »
Just curious: according to you, is it okay to create life where nature (or God) failed? So, is IVF okay?

I have no strong opinion on IVF.

Bertha Butt

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #134 on: July 06, 2014, 06:18:01 AM »
I have no strong opinion on IVF.

Why not? Surely you have thought this over before...
If abortion is evil, would that make IVF just as evil (playing God), or good (creating life instead of ending life)?
 ???

agenda21nwo

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #135 on: July 06, 2014, 06:45:22 AM »
Why not? Surely you have thought this over before...
If abortion is evil, would that make IVF just as evil (playing God), or good (creating life instead of ending life)?
 ???

Why would I have thought this over?  And how can you compare the assisted creation of life (ivf) to killing a life (abortion)?   

phreak

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #136 on: July 06, 2014, 07:05:19 AM »
Why would I have thought this over? 
So this wasn't yet covered by Alex Jones?

Bertha Butt

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #137 on: July 06, 2014, 07:16:35 AM »
Why would I have thought this over?

Indeed, why would you have thought...  ::)

Quote
And how can you compare the assisted creation of life (ivf) to killing a life (abortion)?  

So when you're talking about IVF, it's assisting creating. And abortion is killing, not assisting ending... hmmm...
Come on, you can do better than just blurting that killing is bad.

Primemuscle

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #138 on: July 06, 2014, 11:07:03 AM »
If you're gonna correct it, why not change "of" to "have" as well?

I didn't want to go overboard, correcting his English as well.

2Thick

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #139 on: July 06, 2014, 01:24:55 PM »
It's funny too that these anti abortion hypocrites are  in favor of the death penalty/capital punishment.

I have mixed emotions on abortion. But at the end of the day it may be the best or only option for some situations, and should therefore be up to the individual and not the government IMO. I just don't think it's something to brag about or celebrate if one chooses to do such a thing.

But I've never understood comparing abortion to the death penalty. I am 100% in favor of the death penalty as punishment for certain crimes committed by adults. As long as they were tried and convicted by a jury of their peers, I'm all for it for certain crimes. In fact I believe the excessive appeals process should be trimmed down considerably to make the process quicker and less expensive.

And if you want to take the government out of it and let it be a matter handled privately, I'm sure family members of many victims of capital crimes would gladly assume the role of executioner instead of letting the state do it.

Guys like John Wayne Gacy, Ted Bundy, Tookie Williams, and many others have shown themselves to be inhuman monsters incapable of remorse, empathy, rehabilitation, or redemption. They've actually EARNED such a fate.

Shouldn't these animals be euthanized?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murders_of_Channon_Christian_and_Christopher_Newsom
A

Primemuscle

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #140 on: July 06, 2014, 02:22:13 PM »
I have mixed emotions on abortion. But at the end of the day it may be the best or only option for some situations, and should therefore be up to the individual and not the government IMO. I just don't think it's something to brag about or celebrate if one chooses to do such a thing.

But I've never understood comparing abortion to the death penalty. I am 100% in favor of the death penalty as punishment for certain crimes committed by adults. As long as they were tried and convicted by a jury of their peers, I'm all for it for certain crimes. In fact I believe the excessive appeals process should be trimmed down considerably to make the process quicker and less expensive.

And if you want to take the government out of it and let it be a matter handled privately, I'm sure family members of many victims of capital crimes would gladly assume the role of executioner instead of letting the state do it.

Guys like John Wayne Gacy, Ted Bundy, Tookie Williams, and many others have shown themselves to be inhuman monsters incapable of remorse, empathy, rehabilitation, or redemption. They've actually EARNED such a fate.

Shouldn't these animals be euthanized?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murders_of_Channon_Christian_and_Christopher_Newsom

You've provided some excellent examples of people who did not deserve to go on living, regardless of whether they were locked up or not. Unfortunately on rare occasion, an innocent person is convicted of a capital crime. There are innocent people who've been executed. I'm against the death penalty.

As for abortion, it strikes me as ironic that so many men have such strong opinions regarding it. Men cannot get pregnant. With respect to this, they cannot fully understand all the ramifications of what for many is probably the most difficult decision a woman could ever make.

On a personal level, my wife and I wanted both our children. Abortion was the farthest thing from our minds. My wife had an easy time with pregnancy, the fetuses were healthy and the births went relatively well. Our babies were healthy and grew to be healthy adults. If I were young, I'd do it all again and I suspect my wife would too. Having said this, we didn't have much financial stability when either of our two children were born, but we managed and it all turned out well in the end.

If folks are using abortion as a rather inconvenient form of contraception, then shame on them. I posted information about the Catholic church's doctrine on contraception. Fortunately, many priests take a different stance with their parishioners when it comes to birth control. I know people who chose to not have children for various reasons. I see nothing wrong with this decision as long as it is thoughtfully made and not just something someone choses as a matter of convenience. Raising children is serious business. It is at minimum an 18 year commitment. Almost anyone can pop out babies, being a good parent is a bit more of a task and a huge commitment. I've seen what sometimes happens when people don't live up to that commitment and it is often very sad.

Simple Simon

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #141 on: July 06, 2014, 02:24:25 PM »
You've provided some excellent examples of people who did not deserve to go on living, regardless of whether they were locked up or not. Unfortunately on rare occasion, an innocent person is convicted of a capital crime. There are innocent people who've been executed. I'm against the death penalty.

As for abortion, it strikes me as ironic that so many men have such strong opinions regarding it. Men cannot get pregnant. With respect to this, they cannot fully understand all the ramifications of what for many is probably the most difficult decision a woman could ever make.

On a personal level, my wife and I wanted both our children. Abortion was the farthest thing from our minds. My wife had an easy time with pregnancy, the fetuses were healthy and the births went relatively well. Our babies were healthy and grew to be healthy adults. If I were young, I'd do it all again and I suspect my wife would too. Having said this, we didn't have much financial stability when either of our two children were born, but we managed and it all turned out well in the end.

If folks are using abortion as a rather inconvenient form of contraception, then shame on them. I posted information about the Catholic church's doctrine on contraception. Fortunately, many priests take a different stance with their parishioners when it comes to birth control. I know people who chose to not have children for various reasons. I see nothing wrong with this decision as long as it is thoughtfully made and not just something someone choses as a matter of convenience. Raising children is serious business. It is at minimum an 18 year commitment. Almost anyone can pop out babies, being a good parent is a bit more of a task and a huge commitment. I've seen what sometimes happens when people don't live up to that commitment and it is often very sad.
If one innocent person is put to death then its one too many, thats why Im not comfortable with the death penalty.

phil mcgroin

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #142 on: July 06, 2014, 02:55:16 PM »
It's funny too that these anti abortion hypocrites are  in favor of the death penalty/capital punishment.





Doesnt seem to make sense but somhow they are anle to rationalize it

Primemuscle

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #143 on: July 06, 2014, 02:57:48 PM »




Doesnt seem to make sense but somhow they are anle to rationalize it

Yes it is very ironic.

The Ugly

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #144 on: July 06, 2014, 03:20:54 PM »
Yes it is very ironic.

The irony/hypocrisy is staggering on both sides.

NordicNerd

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #145 on: July 06, 2014, 03:36:39 PM »

Doesnt seem to make sense but somhow they are anle to rationalize it

Actually, it makes sense if you accept the premises they follow.

The conservatives believe that all human behavior and all moral is best understood as a process called "free will". Thus, if a person behaves badly and kills another human being, this is a voluntary, free will caused action that renders the perpetrator fully responsible for his action. Thus, the person is morally 100% to blame and hence does not deserve to live.

The fetus on the other hand, has done no wrong and deserves to live. Add to this the propensity for conservatives to give the embryo the same status as a living, born child, and you can follow their thinking.

This is of course an oversimplification :-). but I think it covers some of the important factors.

NN








Primemuscle

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #146 on: July 06, 2014, 04:15:53 PM »
Actually, it makes sense if you accept the premises they follow.

The conservatives believe that all human behavior and all moral is best understood as a process called "free will". Thus, if a person behaves badly and kills another human being, this is a voluntary, free will caused action that renders the perpetrator fully responsible for his action. Thus, the person is morally 100% to blame and hence does not deserve to live.

The fetus on the other hand, has done no wrong and deserves to live. Add to this the propensity for conservatives to give the embryo the same status as a living, born child, and you can follow their thinking.

This is of course an oversimplification :-). but I think it covers some of the important factors.

NN









So it would follow that if someone uses their free will to abort a fetus, they should be executed for their crime. People play God's role, is what it seems like to me.

agenda21nwo

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #147 on: July 07, 2014, 01:15:22 AM »
Indeed, why would you have thought...  ::)

So when you're talking about IVF, it's assisting creating. And abortion is killing, not assisting ending... hmmm...
Come on, you can do better than just blurting that killing is bad.
Are you serious?  You must have a messed up moral radar.

Kwon_2

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #148 on: July 07, 2014, 07:24:54 AM »
lol, calm down Hebrew

Necrosis

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Re: Why won't she look at her choice?
« Reply #149 on: July 07, 2014, 09:29:13 AM »
I believe in pro choice, blah blah blah.

Sure you do you child killing whore.



That child doesn't look normal for some reason? how old was he when she took that picture?