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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: syntaxmachine on October 16, 2013, 04:44:00 PM
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Tea Party tactics: engage in futile brinksmanship in an effort to oppose already well-ensconced law (Obamacare), in exchange for: sinking the Republican brand's favorability rating to its lowest level in at least three decades (the data go back to 1993 but it's unlikely Republicans were less popular in the 1980's than now, given presidential election results), increase the rift between moderate and conservative Republicans and thus damage future presidential campaign efforts, hamper US economic growth to the tune of $20+ billion this quarter, and potentially threaten the creditworthiness of the country for...well, nothing. Brilliant!
(http://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/mmj6rr5b6kem323wnfrlva.png)
Markets rise as US strikes deal to avert debt crisis
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/10384399/Markets-rise-as-US-strikes-deal-to-avert-debt-crisis.html
"Markets rose sharply as President Barack Obama and Republicans agreed to reopen the US government and, crucially, increase the country’s $16.7 trillion (£10.5 trillion) borrowing limit, with just hours to go before a final deadline.
The eleventh-hour deal came as companies on both sides of the Atlantic made contingency plans in case lawmakers in Washington had failed to reach an agreement, which could have thrown the global economy back into recession."
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Syntax
If you think this is a great victory for Obama and America get ready. Let me ask you this my liberal friend. A 2700 page bill that your defacto co-leader Pelosi stated to pass without reading it first is being forced upon our great country. It is a pity that the website to sign up for the state run exchanges is so broken that 99% of the people cannot even register. It is alarming that a Democratically controlled Senate balked at the idea brought up by the House Republicans that if the general public were going to get this deal, then all Congressman and the President himself should join the party and enroll with the Affordable Care Act. Moreover, the high dollar Democratic donars and companies exempt from the AAC or Obamacare cried foul...not us. Nice going Dems, pass a bill you want no part of if you are one of the liberal elite. Meanwhile, taxes are going up and many of the poor who could get on insurance still make too much money to get Medicaid, but make too little to get the Federal subsidy. Thus, over 30 million Americans will still have no insurance and the cost will to the working class Americans will be tremendous. If this makes you happy Syntax, rejoice.
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http://www.californiahealthline.org/articles/2013/6/10/30m-americans-will-still-be-uninsured-in-2016-under-aca-study-says
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Ok Syntax, here is your great Democratic representatives so proud of Obamacare.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/erik-wemple/wp/2013/10/02/from-politico-to-hannity-the-trajectory-of-congresss-obamacare-exemption-myth/
http://townhall.com/tipsheet/danieldoherty/2013/10/01/reminder-every-senate-democrat-voted-in-favor-of-exempting-themselves-from-obamacare-n1714217
I would love to hear from the liberal schmoes on the board. How do you as a liberal tolerate your representatives excusing themselves from the very law that is to be the defining legislation of their beloved leader "Osama" Hussein Obama ;-)
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(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-h0rtL6JS3_w/Tb7F8nI_J5I/AAAAAAAAC4w/jP81mGUK3Os/s320/Kick%2BThe%2BCan.jpg)
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If you think this is a great victory for Obama and America get ready. Let me ask you this my liberal friend. A 2700 page bill that your defacto co-leader Pelosi stated to pass without reading it first is being forced upon our great country. It is a pity that the website to sign up for the state run exchanges is so broken that 99% of the people cannot even register. It is alarming that a Democratically controlled Senate balked at the idea brought up by the House Republicans that if the general public were going to get this deal, then all Congressman and the President himself should join the party and enroll with the Affordable Care Act. Moreover, the high dollar Democratic donars and companies exempt from the AAC or Obamacare cried foul...not us. Nice going Dems, pass a bill you want no part of if you are one of the liberal elite. Meanwhile, taxes are going up and many of the poor who could get on insurance still make too much money to get Medicaid, but make too little to get the Federal subsidy. Thus, over 30 million Americans will still have no insurance and the cost will to the working class Americans will be tremendous. If this makes you happy Syntax, rejoice.
I'm relieved that I don't hold (and didn't assert) any of the views ascribed to me in this post, and thus don't have to respond in any detail.
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Hey you called them Tea Baggers so I assumed you were a lib. Forgive me kind sir ::) ::) ::)
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The Tea Party stands on one main principal. The government spends more money than it takes in. For this liberals classify them as mean spirited wackos. It is the other way around.
The Republicans said to the Democrats you can open the 13% of government that was closed except for the affordable health care act. It was the Democrats that said all or nothing then planned on strategies on how to maximize the pain to blame the Republicans.
The Government subsidizing the massive amount of health care exchange policies will cost a massive amount for this entitlement.The government is broke. Look at the mismanagement of it so far. 80 million dollars for a health care exchange web site that still doesn't work. 80 million to make a web site? 600 million dollar budget to advertise it. Almost everyone who doesn't have insurance will receive money toward paying the premium from government. I guess that sounds fantastic to a liberal but it will cost this country dearly.
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The Tea Party stands on one main principal. The government spends more money than it takes in. For this liberals classify them as mean spirited wackos. It is the other way around.
The Republicans said to the Democrats you can open the 13% of government that was closed except for the affordable health care act. It was the Democrats that said all or nothing then planned on strategies on how to maximize the pain to blame the Republicans.
The Government subsidizing the massive amount of health care exchange policies will cost a massive amount for this entitlement.The government is broke. Look at the mismanagement of it so far. 80 million dollars for a health care exchange web site that still doesn't work. 80 million to make a web site? 600 million dollar budget to advertise it. Almost everyone who doesn't have insurance will receive money toward paying the premium from government. I guess that sounds fantastic to a liberal but it will cost this country dearly.
Nice to hear a little common sense than the usual liberal media BS that is spewed incessantly. People should inform themselves of the issues before they pile on the Republicans. The Democrats are criminals.
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Hey you called them Tea Baggers so I assumed you were a lib. Forgive me kind sir ::) ::) ::)
1. It is true that I am not particularly fond of so-called Tea Party politicians.
2. What do you think would be an optimal setup for America's healthcare system(s)? I think we can agree the status quo was unacceptable -- high expenditures for inferior patient outcomes relative to all OECD nations.
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1. It is true that I am not particularly fond of so-called Tea Party politicians.
2. What do you think would be an optimal setup for America's healthcare system(s)? I think we can agree the status quo was unacceptable -- ridiculous expenditures for inferior outcomes relative to all OECD nations.
Ok Syntax, let me try one on for you. First I am a physician so I have some experience. If you don't believe, OMR and Galeniko can confirm. Regardless, lets try something that would not add to the debt and probably get healthcare for all.
Assume that one in ten Americans does not have insurance. That means when a physician sees that patient in the hospital or unlikely a clinic setting, he very well may not get paid a dime. However, thanks to trial attorneys and the Democrats refusal for TORT reform, the patient can still sue the pants off of you if his outcome is poor. Consider that many of the uninsured abuse tobacco and alcohol for years, and have not been seen by physicians for decades. Thus, by the time they present, they are usually pretty ill. It is a lose lose for the physician.
However, what if the government instead of taxing the hell out of anyone who works and makes a buck did the opposite. Why not allow physicians to care for indigent patients without risk for senseless lawsuits. Essentially, you shield them from frivolous lawsuits brought on by ambulance chasing lawyers. Then, allow physicians to write off against their taxes a percentage (say 80%) of Medicare allowable billing. Then, if the physician is an owner of a small business that employs a certain number of employees, give them a tax benefit to allow insurance for their employees and a tax break.
If you look at the ACA, a large percentage of these uninsured will get on the government and state dole via Medicaid, which is accepted by a very low percentage of physicians. The pay is piss poor, and the patient's are notorious for being difficult and quick to sue. Thus, shield the physicians, give them a tax break, and don't needlessly tax working Americans to make a system that is patently flawed and that has been put together in haste without forethought.
I can go on but my brothers on GB are probably bored to tears. I anxiously await your retort.
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Ok Syntax, let me try one on for you. First I am a physician so I have some experience. If you don't believe, OMR and Galeniko can confirm. Regardless, lets try something that would not add to the debt and probably get healthcare for all.
Thanks for your comments!
OK, tort reform sounds good. However, one influential paper [1] cites the prices of medical goods and services in the United States as the dominant driver of expenditures, despite below median utilization rates. This seems to be the dominant view among the relevant experts. A 2012 international survey of health insurance groups seems to corroborate this, indicating that the cost of virtually every major procedure is significantly higher in the U.S. than any OECD country. [2]
I don't know that your proposal would deal with the problem of prices. It would increase utilization rates but perhaps not drive prices down much, leading to a net increase in expenditures.
A proposal that mitigated prices (as public options across OECD nations do, enabling such nations to spend much less) wouldn't be in your self-interest as a physician. Would you oppose any proposal that was against your self-interest, or are there any models that you could stomach if they were good for the nation?
[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12757275
[2] http://hushp.harvard.edu/sites/default/files/downloadable_files/IFHP%202012%20Comparative%20Price%20Report.pdf
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Liberal tactics..
1. Lie your ass off
2. Demonize, because defending a liberal issue is impossible
3. Support and sympathize with terrorist
4. Shread the constitution unless it benefits them
5. Blame Bush
6. Keep borrowing because we all know it keeps us out of debt
7. Defend Obama under any circumstances
8. If you don't agree with them, then obviously you're racist
Add to this if I missed anything. I'm sure I did.
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Sensible reform to tort law is a must. It's a huge factor in the cost of care today. And it's important beyond just healthcare. We need tort reform yesterday.
Liberal tactics..
1. Lie your ass off
2. Demonize, because defending a liberal issue is impossible
3. Support and sympathize with terrorist
4. Shread the constitution unless it benefits them
5. Blame Bush
6. Keep borrowing because we all know it keeps us out of debt
7. Defend Obama under any circumstances
8. If you don't agree with them, then obviously you're racist
Add to this if I missed anything. I'm sure I did.
Quiet Joey. The adults are talking.
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as predicted, a last minute bullshit agreement that changes absolutely nothing to the state of decay already reached. Just playing scare. How long will this grotesque farce last noone knows. Fact is the average joe while thinking "everything is fine we ve been saved by our "elites" he s getting poorer by the day. You have to stick it slowly to the common people, for them not to understand what s going on. Good news, politicians and megacorps bosses are very patient individuals, this is how they got at the top of the pyramid.
One day china will have enough of worthless dollar, but politicians want someone else to deal with the hot potato and start the whole debacle. Good argument for a war.
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Sensible reform to tort law is a must. It's a huge factor in the cost of care today. And it's important beyond just healthcare. We need tort reform yesterday.
Quiet Joey. The adults are talking.
As long as we understand that little list is dead on and I've been rarely wrong since Obamas first term. Continue.
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There is a single statist party masquerading as two. Anything that increases the power of the federal government, whether that is through increased military, increased homeland surveillance or increases in dependent citizens will always pass and become "law". This is the way of empires.
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I live near a few major metropolitan hospitals. Everyday I see fat, old people, who have never exercised or practiced proper nutrition in their lives, pile onto buses and go to the doctor, not because of sickness, but as a social activity. The Doctor examines these things and says "You're getting old. Come back in two weeks."
Now if the buses were to drive into the East River, instead of the Hospital, a lot of money could be saved.
There is a single statist party masquerading as two. Anything that increases the power of the federal government, whether that is through increased military, increased homeland surveillance or increases in dependent citizens will always pass and become "law". This is the way of empires.
You basically have the Socialist Party and the Party that pays lip service to limited government.
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As long as we understand that little list is dead on and I've been rarely wrong since Obamas first term. Continue.
Coming from the manchild who believes that Obama was born in Kenya, thinks nothing of the fact that the birth certificate he claims proves it was issued by a country which did not yet exist at the time of issuance and refuses to address arguments which demolish the copy-pastes and the meltdowns, this is just rich.
Did you have way too much today or something?
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I just can't get over the fact that u can sign up for Obamacare, without verifying your income. All you have to do is lie and the government will subsidize the insurance for u. Same as the free cell phone scam.
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Thanks for your comments!
OK, tort reform sounds good. However, one influential paper [1] cites the prices of medical goods and services in the United States as the dominant driver of expenditures, despite below median utilization rates. This seems to be the dominant view among the relevant experts. A 2012 international survey of health insurance groups seems to corroborate this, indicating that the cost of virtually every major procedure is significantly higher in the U.S. than any OECD country. [2]
I don't know that your proposal would deal with the problem of prices. It would increase utilization rates but perhaps not drive prices down much, leading to a net increase in expenditures.
A proposal that mitigated prices (as public options across OECD nations do, enabling such nations to spend much less) wouldn't be in your self-interest as a physician. Would you oppose any proposal that was against your self-interest, or are there any models that you could stomach if they were good for the nation?
[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12757275
[2] http://hushp.harvard.edu/sites/default/files/downloadable_files/IFHP%202012%20Comparative%20Price%20Report.pdf
The articles you present discuss exorbitant prices for medical services and pharmacy. If you look at a typical hospital bill, the physician fee is the one that is usually in the hundreds of dollars. The true cost is the mark up the hospital charges for antibiotics, IVF's, anesthesia, room bill, ER visit, etc. It is the hospitals that drive the cost up. A CT scan costs thousands of dollars. The physician fee to read is a few hundred if that. Thus, if true change were to be afforded you don't go after the overworked physicians providing services; you go after fat cat hospitals like HCA, etc that make a fortune. They excessively charge those who have insurance to subsidize those that do not.
Also, you act as if physicians should compromise their value for the good of society. Last I heard, lawyers never sacrifice anything. Liberal politicians won't sacrifice their own medical benefits for a busted plan that provides a fraction of the coverage but for which they passed unanimously without a single Republican vote. Go to a grocery store and ask for a free handout.
My way would work. Give physicians, who on the front line, reprieve from spurious lawsuits. Have the government put resources toward primary preventive care like cheaper generic meds, reasonable radiology reports, and tax write offs for physicians and companies that provide services. Charge a minimum fee based on wages. Encourage cessation of disgusting habits like smoking.
Obama is so short sited he has to bludgeon the American people with a plan that is doomed to failure. A grade schooler could have thought it out better. The liberal media has eaten it up without giving a conscious thought to the enormity of its pricing structure. I could go on.
Ok Syntax, why should I like the ACA again.
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We are back in business for a few days.
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The articles you present discuss exorbitant prices for medical services and pharmacy. If you look at a typical hospital bill, the physician fee is the one that is usually in the hundreds of dollars. The true cost is the mark up the hospital charges for antibiotics, IVF's, anesthesia, room bill, ER visit, etc. It is the hospitals that drive the cost up. A CT scan costs thousands of dollars. The physician fee to read is a few hundred if that. Thus, if true change were to be afforded you don't go after the overworked physicians providing services; you go after fat cat hospitals like HCA, etc that make a fortune. They excessively charge those who have insurance to subsidize those that do not.
Also, you act as if physicians should compromise their value for the good of society. Last I heard, lawyers never sacrifice anything. Liberal politicians won't sacrifice their own medical benefits for a busted plan that provides a fraction of the coverage but for which they passed unanimously without a single Republican vote. Go to a grocery store and ask for a free handout.
My way would work. Give physicians, who on the front line, reprieve from spurious lawsuits. Have the government put resources toward primary preventive care like cheaper generic meds, reasonable radiology reports, and tax write offs for physicians and companies that provide services. Charge a minimum fee based on wages. Encourage cessation of disgusting habits like smoking.
Obama is so short sited he has to bludgeon the American people with a plan that is doomed to failure. A grade schooler could have thought it out better. The liberal media has eaten it up without giving a conscious thought to the enormity of its pricing structure. I could go on.
Ok Syntax, why should I like the ACA again.
You shouldn't , it's was meant to help the patients, not the doctors per se. I understand what you are saying, and I don't disagree, non-compliance and poor lifestyle choices are the etiology of most concerns. I don't see your rationale on how it is doomed to failure? I don't think anyone can quite predict it's outcome yet as it is a novel piece of American history. I would say that in theory it can work, that much is obvious, will it in practice remains to be seen.
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I shut the government down and all I got was this lousy GOP T-shirt.
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I shut the government down and all I got was this lousy GOP T-shirt.
Coach is involved with this.
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Coach is involved with this.
'Involved' is a strong word, but he certainly doesn't help. ;D
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as predicted, a last minute bullshit agreement that changes absolutely nothing to the state of decay already reached. Just playing scare. How long will this grotesque farce last noone knows. Fact is the average joe while thinking "everything is fine we ve been saved by our "elites" he s getting poorer by the day. You have to stick it slowly to the common people, for them not to understand what s going on. Good news, politicians and megacorps bosses are very patient individuals, this is how they got at the top of the pyramid.
One day china will have enough of worthless dollar, but politicians want someone else to deal with the hot potato and start the whole debacle. Good argument for a war.
;D
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You shouldn't , it's was meant to help the patients, not the doctors per se. I understand what you are saying, and I don't disagree, non-compliance and poor lifestyle choices are the etiology of most concerns. I don't see your rationale on how it is doomed to failure? I don't think anyone can quite predict it's outcome yet as it is a novel piece of American history. I would say that in theory it can work, that much is obvious, will it in practice remains to be seen.
The theory was poorly thought out. It is a 2700 page playbook on socializing medicine with the ultimate goal for a one payer US medical health system. If it were such a phenomenal plan, Democratic congressman and their staffers would not be so repulsed by the idea that they would be beholden to the ACA. Maybe, the best way to manage the country is for all Congressional leaders to follow the laws they push on the American people. Why is it that Congressional leaders and their staffers get 5000 dollars or more toward their "Cadillac" insurance plans, but honest hard working Americans are seeing their premiums rise in order to pay for ACA (i.e. Obamacare).
Why didn't somebody read the damn bill before the Democrats in their rush to judgement passed it. Mark my words, Obama will drive this country in financial ruin. Not to mention the fact that there will be a tremendous physician shortage in the coming years as the best and brightest are bypassing med school to go into private business. One thing that ticks me off about the Democrats in general is that responsibility for ones actions is never espoused. Instead, blame the rich elite, which is kind of funny because the Democratic party as it is now is rich, arrogant elites caring for their dumber, less fortunate brethren....i.e. house negro.
Do some research and you will see that blacks, who voted for Obama 99 out of a 100 practically in the last election, are worse off financially today than under George Bush. It is shocking.
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The theory was poorly thought out. It is a 2700 page playbook on socializing medicine with the ultimate goal for a one payer US medical health system. If it were such a phenomenal plan, Democratic congressman and their staffers would not be so repulsed by the idea that they would be beholden to the ACA. Maybe, the best way to manage the country is for all Congressional leaders to follow the laws they push on the American people. Why is it that Congressional leaders and their staffers get 5000 dollars or more toward their "Cadillac" insurance plans, but honest hard working Americans are seeing their premiums rise in order to pay for ACA (i.e. Obamacare).
Why didn't somebody read the damn bill before the Democrats in their rush to judgement passed it. Mark my words, Obama will drive this country in financial ruin. Not to mention the fact that there will be a tremendous physician shortage in the coming years as the best and brightest are bypassing med school to go into private business. One thing that ticks me off about the Democrats in general is that responsibility for ones actions is never espoused. Instead, blame the rich elite, which is kind of funny because the Democratic party as it is now is rich, arrogant elites caring for their dumber, less fortunate brethren....i.e. house negro.
Do some research and you will see that blacks, who voted for Obama 99 out of a 100 practically in the last election, are worse off financially today than under George Bush. It is shocking.
Relax, loony. It's only politics.
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That was one brutal shutdown is over. I was very concerned that the White House garden was full of weeds.
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That was one brutal shutdown is over. I was very concerned that the White House garden was full of weeds.
Don't worry everyone will get paid for the 16 day vocation.
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Syntax reminds me of a Vulcan. He's much to rational to be contained within the boundaries of party politics.
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The theory was poorly thought out. It is a 2700 page playbook on socializing medicine with the ultimate goal for a one payer US medical health system. If it were such a phenomenal plan, Democratic congressman and their staffers would not be so repulsed by the idea that they would be beholden to the ACA. Maybe, the best way to manage the country is for all Congressional leaders to follow the laws they push on the American people. Why is it that Congressional leaders and their staffers get 5000 dollars or more toward their "Cadillac" insurance plans, but honest hard working Americans are seeing their premiums rise in order to pay for ACA (i.e. Obamacare).
I don't care how long the "playbook" is, that's meaningless in the context we are talking and many people's premiums have gone down. Government is corrupt is the answer.
Why didn't somebody read the damn bill before the Democrats in their rush to judgement passed it. Mark my words, Obama will drive this country in financial ruin. Not to mention the fact that there will be a tremendous physician shortage in the coming years as the best and brightest are bypassing med school to go into private business. One thing that ticks me off about the Democrats in general is that responsibility for ones actions is never espoused. Instead, blame the rich elite, which is kind of funny because the Democratic party as it is now is rich, arrogant elites caring for their dumber, less fortunate brethren....i.e. house negro.
They obviously read the bill, are you saying no one read the bill before they passed it? Obama has been doing the opposite of driving the country to financial ruin, lowering the deficit at record pace amongst a few other key economic markers. The right however, has just wasted 26 billion on a frivolous fight and caused economic and social regression
Do some research and you will see that blacks, who voted for Obama 99 out of a 100 practically in the last election, are worse off financially today than under George Bush. It is shocking.
Ya, there's nothing that could explain that besides Obama purposely keeping them in poverty. That great recession wouldn't have matterer
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Hearing Palin, Rush, Boehnner and Levin calling this a huge loss for republicans...
yikes...
lots of ammo for dems to use against them. Repubs can't get on message boards and diss the dems when their own leaders admit it was a loss, or as palin said, "Obama got 100% of what he wanted".
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Where the hell do you get your information. The deficit is coming down at a record pace. It is a complete play on words moron. Compare the deficit now to 2008 when your highness came into office. You are nothing but a syncophant who is unintelligible. Pelos's own words were to pass the bill and read it later. Do you even read ::) ::)
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/DC-Decoder/2013/0916/Obama-Deficits-falling-at-fastest-rate-since-WWII.-Is-that-true
You have proven yourself to be nothing but a liberal shill Necrosis ::) ::) ::)
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Where the hell do you get your information. The deficit is coming down at a record pace. It is a complete play on words moron. Compare the deficit now to 2008 when your highness came into office. You are nothing but a syncophant who is unintelligible. Pelos's own words were to pass the bill and read it later. Do you even read ::) ::)
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/DC-Decoder/2013/0916/Obama-Deficits-falling-at-fastest-rate-since-WWII.-Is-that-true
You have proven yourself to be nothing but a liberal shill Necrosis ::) ::) ::)
Did you just send me a link to the Christian Science Monitor and cite it as evidence? you are a fucking loon my friend. What are you religious too? you are dead fucking wrong, do you know what rate means? It is falling at the fastest rate, I won't explain further. I am unintelligible? you are quoting right wing religious rags and calling me a shill, all while not understanding the very thing we are arguing.
Again, you are wrong and even your shitty article is wrong. The claim was the deficit is falling at the fastest RATE since WW2, not total amounts, which is obviously based on overall deficit. Good job on making yourself look like an idiot.
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Where the hell do you get your information. The deficit is coming down at a record pace. It is a complete play on words moron. Compare the deficit now to 2008 when your highness came into office. You are nothing but a syncophant who is unintelligible. Pelos's own words were to pass the bill and read it later. Do you even read ::) ::)
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/DC-Decoder/2013/0916/Obama-Deficits-falling-at-fastest-rate-since-WWII.-Is-that-true
You have proven yourself to be nothing but a liberal shill Necrosis ::) ::) ::)
The second video or link again shows your lack of comprehension. She said we have to pass it so YOU can see what's in it, with out all the controversy. Which means people are getting inaccurate info from media etc. You indicates others, it does not indicate her, she would use the pronoun I moron.
Another great find!
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Did you just send me a link to the Christian Science Monitor and cite it as evidence? you are a fucking loon my friend. What are you religious too? you are dead fucking wrong, do you know what rate means? It is falling at the fastest rate, I won't explain further. I am unintelligible? you are quoting right wing religious rags and calling me a shill, all while not understanding the very thing we are arguing.
Again, you are wrong and even your shitty article is wrong. The claim was the deficit is falling at the fastest RATE since WW2, not total amounts, which is obviously based on overall deficit. Good job on making yourself look like an idiot.
The Christian Science Monitor is, actually, a respected publication. It's not perfect or bias-free, but its reporting is better than many – if not most – newspapers and news magazines.
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The Christian Science Monitor is, actually, a respected publication. It's not perfect or bias-free, but its reporting is better than many – if not most – newspapers and news magazines.
I know many liberals who subscribe to The Christian Science Monitor.
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Clinton was talking about Tort Reform 20 years ago. This isn't new.
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The Christian Science Monitor is, actually, a respected publication. It's not perfect or bias-free, but its reporting is better than many – if not most – newspapers and news magazines.
Ya I am weary of anything with such a contradictory name. I am not actually all that familiar with the paper but am pretty hostile to anything with religion and science amalgam.
Point still stands.
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Did you just send me a link to the Christian Science Monitor and cite it as evidence? you are a fucking loon my friend. What are you religious too? you are dead fucking wrong, do you know what rate means? It is falling at the fastest rate, I won't explain further. I am unintelligible? you are quoting right wing religious rags and calling me a shill, all while not understanding the very thing we are arguing.
Again, you are wrong and even your shitty article is wrong. The claim was the deficit is falling at the fastest RATE since WW2, not total amounts, which is obviously based on overall deficit. Good job on making yourself look like an idiot.
Dipshit, because the deficit got up to such unfathomable levels, the rate of fall looks great to the typical sycophantic moron such as yourself. But the reality is that the deficit is huge. Wow, the deficit is only 700 billion now. Yeah it is coming down fast but it was 1.4 billion. What is going to happen when the working people run out of money. Welfare pups like yourself will be shit out of luck.
http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/federal_deficit_chart.html
Look at GWB's deficit. Until the loony Democrats took over congress in 2006, the deficit was less than 250 billion and unemployment was down at less than 5%. I am happy that the deficit is coming down, but if you are attributing that to the great governing of Obama you are dreaming. Fortunately, hard and intelligent Americans have found a way to bypass the restrictions and have thrived despite Obama and not because he is some saint to business.
And BTW dipshit, Pelosi did not read the 2700 page amendment. I would doubt that any of the Congressman who voted for it did so. You are a typical liberal. So I referred to the CSM, what do you read and absorb. Moveon.org or the Daily Kos. Better yet, I bet you get your information from MSNB, politico, and the Huffington Post lol. Oh brother.
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The second video or link again shows your lack of comprehension. She said we have to pass it so YOU can see what's in it, with out all the controversy. Which means people are getting inaccurate info from media etc. You indicates others, it does not indicate her, she would use the pronoun I moron.
Another great find!
What the fuck does that mean. If the bill were so transparent it would be obvious prior to passing it what the bill's benefits would be. Are you such a moron. What, I think you should buy this used care without the Carfax or warranty so you can see what a lemon it is after it is bought and paid for. Your reasoning as always is suspect. Your arguments are laughable. Your IQ is barely above that of your average dopehead on the street. It is quite comical your commenting on a typographical error as a grammar lesson.
The ACA was such a glorified mess that many in Congress did not comprehend all of the repercussions, the taxes, and limitations of the bill. Even if it were implemented perfectly, over 30 million Americans would still be without healthcare. Simple lesson, nothing in life is free. Your welfare check Necrosis is coming off of the shoulders of a working American. What is going to happen when everybody decides to quit working and let Uncle Barack take care of them?
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http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/cbo-uninsured-under-obamacare-never-falls-below-30-million_733740.html
Now Necrosis I know this is a conservative website, but maybe if you can take away the Koolaid glasses for ten minutes and attempt to read and comprehend, the CBO (Congressional Budget Office to help you out) has clearly projected the number of uninsured by 2023 under the ACA law. Lets see, twenty million will gain insurance, but 31 million will still be uninsured under your savior's plan. Great plan. Pelosi really studied hard trying to slog her way through the 2700 pages so she can better inform the American public ::) ::) ::)
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Dipshit, because the deficit got up to such unfathomable levels, the rate of fall looks great to the typical sycophantic moron such as yourself. But the reality is that the deficit is huge. Wow, the deficit is only 700 billion now. Yeah it is coming down fast but it was 1.4 billion. What is going to happen when the working people run out of money. Welfare pups like yourself will be shit out of luck.
http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/federal_deficit_chart.html
Again it has nothing to do with anything, my statement still stands and you are incorrect
Look at GWB's deficit. Until the loony Democrats took over congress in 2006, the deficit was less than 250 billion and unemployment was down at less than 5%. I am happy that the deficit is coming down, but if you are attributing that to the great governing of Obama you are dreaming. Fortunately, hard and intelligent Americans have found a way to bypass the restrictions and have thrived despite Obama and not because he is some saint to business.
There was a global great recession moron, of course they went up, that's like citing WW2
And BTW dipshit, Pelosi did not read the 2700 page amendment. I would doubt that any of the Congressman who voted for it did so. You are a typical liberal. So I referred to the CSM, what do you read and absorb. Moveon.org or the Daily Kos. Better yet, I bet you get your information from MSNB, politico, and the Huffington Post lol. Oh brother.
Oh ok, she didn't any proof of this other then the video you posted which shows the fucking opposite of your claim?
You didn't address my points, you just brought up some bullshit and then claimed that Pelosi didn't read the law.
Try again. Use facts, it will help.
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Also, I am not a lib, just pointing out facts you seem to have left out.
I don't particularly like Obama, I disagree with a lot of his policies, social and economic. I however, don't find comfort in believing falsehoods.
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Syntax
If you think this is a great victory for Obama and America get ready. Let me ask you this my liberal friend. A 2700 page bill that your defacto co-leader Pelosi stated to pass without reading it first is being forced upon our great country. It is a pity that the website to sign up for the state run exchanges is so broken that 99% of the people cannot even register. It is alarming that a Democratically controlled Senate balked at the idea brought up by the House Republicans that if the general public were going to get this deal, then all Congressman and the President himself should join the party and enroll with the Affordable Care Act. Moreover, the high dollar Democratic donars and companies exempt from the AAC or Obamacare cried foul...not us. Nice going Dems, pass a bill you want no part of if you are one of the liberal elite. Meanwhile, taxes are going up and many of the poor who could get on insurance still make too much money to get Medicaid, but make too little to get the Federal subsidy. Thus, over 30 million Americans will still have no insurance and the cost will to the working class Americans will be tremendous. If this makes you happy Syntax, rejoice.
Here's what the Rude Pundit (who writes like a getbigger) says about the whole dem pols too good for ACA baloney:
10/16/2013
"If It's So Great, Why Don't You Do It?": One of the Stupidest Anti-Obamacare Arguments:
On Morning Starbucks with Joe Scarborough's Beady Eyes, Mika Brezinski's Sneer, and the Pickled Corpse of Mike Barnicle, Rep. Sean Duffy, Republican of Wisconsin, said the hosts should ask "liberal guests" on the show, "Why won’t you join Obamacare? If it’s good for Americans, why isn’t it good for you?”
This question and its variants has been a talking point for Republicans both before and during this crisis they brought on. Rand Paul, giving Ted Cruz a moment to shit his diaper in peace during the notafilibuster, asked the question of Barack Obama: "'Mr. President, are you willing to take Obamacare? If you don’t want it, why are we stuck with it?'"
It's the question at the core of the Vitter Amendment, named for the Senator who wishes he could shit his diaper on the floor of the Senate. It would make all members of Congress and their staffs find insurance on the Affordable Care Act exchanges and, just because if you're gonna be a prick, you may as well be a mega-prick, receive no subsidies from their employer (you know, the government) to help. Rep. Tim Huelskamp, Kansas GOP nut, on Al Sharpton's just terrible MSNBC "show," fluffing Vitter like a New Orleans prostitute, said that if it’s good enough for the rest of the country, "it should be good enough for the President of the United States" and other federal employees.
On and on this could go, with more and more members of Congress, with right-wing media, with knuckle-dragging bloggers all joining into a dissonant chorus of farts and vomit noises around a single line: "If it's so good/great, why isn't Congress/the President/Kathleen Sebelius/Mitch McConnell's shell shiner being forced onto it?"
Dear, sweet conservatives, especially those of you devoid of thought except for what Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity piss into your ears, listen closely. Here's the answer to your question: It's because the law is meant to cover people who don't have access to health insurance, you dumb fucks. It's meant to be something for people who have nothing, people who aren't poor enough for Medicaid or have preexisting conditions that prevent them from getting insurance. If it was meant for everyone, we would call it "single payer" or "universal health care" or "socialized medicine" or "that thing that works in every other fucking country but we're too deluded to enact here."
It's goddamned childish, like saying, "If you like Obamacare so much, why don't you marry it?" It's like saying that if public housing is so awesome, why doesn't everyone live in it? Would you support a bill to force members of Congress to live in Barry Farm?
You know who it wasn't meant for? People who already get health insurance through their jobs. That's a benefit, something that people get instead of higher pay. If you want to kick anyone off their health insurance and not provide subsidies, you better fucking pay 'em more with the money that's not being used to give 'em insurance, but that's not in the Vitter Amendment, is it?
Sure, sure, go ahead and cite the very few examples of companies who have been total assholes to their employees. But 96% of companies aren't affected by the Affordable Care Act (except in that it will lower health costs overall). And of the 4% that are affected, nearly 95% of them won't be bothered by it. But, no, really, go ahead and dig out your exceptions, like your invisible welfare queens and your phantom voter fraud cases.
Stop being such pussies and admit what's really going on here. The Vitter Amendment's purpose was to drive people away from government jobs. And, as so many have pointed out, there is a deep, deep fear in right-wingers that, once they have insurance and are getting regular health care, people will think that this program that's supposedly as bad as slavery times the Holocaust to the power of 9/11 isn't so bad and that the streetcorner screamers of the right are full of shit.
The battle is over, motherfuckers. Put down your weapons and return to your homes. Kiss your loved ones. And we can all warm ourselves by the fire made from the corpses of Republicans who threw themselves at the barricade only to get themselves impaled right through their cold, awful hearts.
// posted by Rude One @ 11:33 AM
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Is ACA "as bad as slavery times the Holocaust to the power of 9/11"? Who cares. That is getbig poetry.
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A debt based currency system, meaning one in which the currency created is loaned to the people to be paid back at interest, will require ever increasing amounts of new debt to sustain itself. Everything else is theater.
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It is a 2700 page playbook on socializing medicine with the ultimate goal for a one payer US medical health system.
How is single-payer not a good thing? For those not working in the insurance industry, that is.
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How is single-payer not a good thing? For those not working in the insurance industry, that is.
He is a moron, he doesn't understand the arguments being presented, the important point is how he keeps harping that those who disagree are Liberal Shills, meanwhile he posts nonsense that doesn't support his claims.
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He is a moron, he doesn't understand the arguments being presented, the important point is how he keeps harping that those who disagree are Liberal Shills, meanwhile he posts nonsense that doesn't support his claims.
Single payers is vastly superior to the ACA. The government would have at least some negotiating power over drug costs.
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Single payers is vastly superior to the ACA. The government would have at least some negotiating power over drug costs.
Certainly.
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Certainly.
Costs go down when there is competition. Single payer AND the ACA are both collusions of big government and big business. Both seek to control what you can have and what it costs you.
Eliminate the monopolies of each and prices will come down to what people can afford. The price discovery mechanism can only funtion in a free market.
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The Tea Party sympathizers moan on and on about how bad the rollout of Obamacare is going. The hypocritical part of this is that they really want it to fail - so why all the moaning and negativity. They should be celebrating. The American people (about 70 percent of the American people) can all see right through this, thus the 28 percent approval rating. Let's hear some solutions, not just constant tearing down. The negativity is getting OLD.
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Costs go down when there is competition. Single payer AND the ACA are both collusions of big government and big business. Both seek to control what you can have and what it costs you.
Eliminate the monopolies of each and prices will come down to what people can afford. The price discovery mechanism can only funtion in a free market.
This
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Single payer is politically impossible in the U.S. at this point in history ("socialized medicine" even though it only deals with the payer side, not the provider side). Eliminating insurance companies and going with a pure free market pricing model is ridiculous. Where's the protection against catastrophic health care costs for the individual or family? Insurance underwriting standards MUST largely be eliminated to ensure access for all. Otherwise insurance companies can simply deny coverage (pre-existing conditions) as they have done in the past or charge unbearably high premiums for people with health problems such that these individuals end up without coverage. Telling the insurers they cannot turn anyone down but that every American will come to them for a policy makes the finances work out (we hope).
The Affordable Care Act represents a reasonable compromise in regard to these considerations. It gives everybody coverage (in fact, requires coverage in the same way as most states require automobile liability coverage), largely eliminates insurance underwriting (carriers must sell to everyone) and avoids giving the payer role to the government. Think about strengths and weaknesses of Medicare to form your own opinion as to whether the government is an efficient payer. I prefer an efficiently run insurance company (despite profits)to the government taking on this role.
Obamacare basically makes good sense!
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Yeah it does...too bad it was created by academics, not businessmen/women, programed by idiots (how do you like the cool rollout) and run by bureaucrats. Its so F'ed up my wife's plan Blue Cross will double Jan. 1st.
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Hey there trendy, enjoy the few extra months of life support.
Tea Party tactics: engage in futile brinksmanship in an effort to oppose already well-ensconced law (Obamacare), in exchange for: sinking the Republican brand's favorability rating to its lowest level in at least three decades (the data go back to 1993 but it's unlikely Republicans were less popular in the 1980's than now, given presidential election results), increase the rift between moderate and conservative Republicans and thus damage future presidential campaign efforts, hamper US economic growth to the tune of $20+ billion this quarter, and potentially threaten the creditworthiness of the country for...well, nothing. Brilliant!
(http://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/mmj6rr5b6kem323wnfrlva.png)
Markets rise as US strikes deal to avert debt crisis
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/10384399/Markets-rise-as-US-strikes-deal-to-avert-debt-crisis.html
"Markets rose sharply as President Barack Obama and Republicans agreed to reopen the US government and, crucially, increase the country’s $16.7 trillion (£10.5 trillion) borrowing limit, with just hours to go before a final deadline.
The eleventh-hour deal came as companies on both sides of the Atlantic made contingency plans in case lawmakers in Washington had failed to reach an agreement, which could have thrown the global economy back into recession."
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H0LY SHIT Y0U GUYS HAVE N0 LIFE.
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H0LY SHIT Y0U GUYS HAVE N0 LIFE.
Obama wants to give you free things~ Cheer up! Never mind us folk who have a fully functioning brain - I know we can be so ANNOYING!
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Ass bruise.
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Shows WE HAVE A LIFE much more when we post back and forth about the size of Kai's chest.
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Its pretty obvious they ll keep printing money as they cant do anything else... until china says stop. When it happens china will be held responsible, and not the american politicians , megacorp bosses, journalists etc. They dont want to be held responsible and want the hot papato to end in china's hands. Then mass poverty, then after a decade or two, wars, with the rich ones from all countries at the top of the human pyramid, leading the dumbest, poorest ones, against each others...again. When there s no more growth , you have to destroy, to rebuild, and recreate growth. How many times in the past have we seen the exact same scenario happen.
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and
Commie Obamacare still sucks and will continue to sink the government more and more into debt.
Oh yea, lets blame tea parties and republicans for trying to be somewhat fiscally responsible and save some fucking money.
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tea party was 100% right ot want to slash spending. RINOS and DEMS are blowing $ we won't have for a hundred years.
However, it is cruz/tea party that fought for months to achieve a shutdown, so their sudden "don't put my name on it!" reaction is piss poor also, now that Palin, Rush, and other repubs are calling obama the winner and tea party fail.
SO it's like both sides are right, and wrong.
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Agree we need to slash spending, including entitlements! Lots of time we look in all the wrong places. Yesterday Wall Street Journal article detailed the trend for American candy manufacturers to take all their jobs overseas because sugar costs twice as much in USA as overseas. Why? Nice fat subsidies to the agri-business sugar producers. (I'm still in favor of Obamacare - a developed nation like ours should not have millions of people running around without health insurance).