Juice is for the weak.

[BEAST 8692]

any extra years of life they may have over the juicers is spent whinging and bitching about them.

anyway, food for thought
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Yes, But The drugs are overdone IMO. I hate these guys,,, "I been training for 8 months now and want to ..

God, I could likely DOUBLE THEIR bench NAT in 12 months! (Thats because they lift so shity and wrong to start )

ok, but they're not hurting anyone but themselves, if even that. i really don't see the evidence that moderate dosages of roids (especially injectables) are really hurting anyone.

i mean, they could be out shooting heroin or smoking crack and robbing convenient stores.

each to their own i say. too many other things much more important than what some guys shoots into his muscle.

[trab]

ok, but they're not hurting anyone but themselves, if even that. i really don't see the evidence that moderate dosages of roids (especially injectables) are really hurting anyone.

i mean, they could be out shooting heroin or smoking crack and robbing convenient stores.

each to their own i say. too many other things much more important than what some guys shoots into his muscle.

Yeah , I write more on the steroid board than anywhere else here .  I think moderate intermitant use can be downright healthy. Many Guys are overbaord though. They feel like shit and wonder why .
Not everyone needs 800mg of TE and 600 deca a week.
You should see what some these jokers thinking about running for a 1st time. God!
Ive seen ... insulin, DNP,HGH,HCG & 6 different aas... as a intended 1st time stack!

[Rimbaud]

When i used to cycle, i remember looking at those guys around me in the gym that i knew did not use, and think to myself how bad i wish i had the confidence they did to train natural.  IT was like a never ending rat race.  I used for a few months, got huge, a lot of attention, but in the back of my mind i was always thinking, crap only 8,7,6,5 more weeks till i come back down to earth.  No matter what anyone sais, even with proper PCT you will not maintain the size you had while you were on.  There are 3 older guys(early 40's i think) in my gym who are very blatent about their use.  They are pathetic.  Huge, red, and bloated.   Squating 500 lbs on the smith machine, bouncing it off the rubber stoppers with a flat bench under their butts.  And this is the best part.  He gets up screams and sais "STICK THAT IN YOUR PIPE AND SMOKE IT"  If i wasnt there myself i would not have believed it.  Those guys like that who feel the need to juice are making up for something.  Im convinced.  I dont care what anyone sais on the steroid boards, they would love to be able to train naturally with confidence.  This is coming from personal experience.  Some i assume are able to do a cycle every now and then, but the majority are always cycling on and off.  If you dont compete, whats the point?  Some of this idiots need to start looking inside themselves and have a little heart to heart. 

My friend (I can say that because he his my friend  ) you make some excellent points. I personally don't care if I have take steroids or not. IMO - it doesn't matter to me one way or the other. I've noticed at least with myself my training methods &/or intensity doesn't change when on or off. I've always used gear like a tool & not a crutch (but that's just me).

[strength]

My friend (I can say that because he his my friend  ) you make some excellent points. I personally don't care if I have take steroids or not. IMO - it doesn't matter to me one way or the other. I've noticed at least with myself my training methods &/or intensity doesn't change when on or off. I've always used gear like a tool & not a crutch (but that's just me).

Because i know Rim personally hes got his shit together.  Good Career, family.  You have the correct attitude.  Using it as another element of your training system.  Unfortunately for a majority, juice becomes a crutch for a lot of guys,  They can't train without it, or wont.  Youve seen them as much as i have.  The doseages that are common today for guys that will never set foot on stage, are outragious. 

[strength]

well, you've got a point there, but from what i can see, it seems it's the guys that are natural that have the insecurity.

think about it, these kind of threads are a dime a dozen on getbig. it's always guys that are natural pointing the finger and saying, "all drugs" while the juice heads just seem to go about their business.

you don't see the juicers pointing fingers at the naturals and complaining do you?

i remember Matt C would seemingly start a topic every day about juice this and juice that and you could just see that this guy was just dying to get on the gear.

if the these guys actually felt secure they wouldn't go on about it every 5 seconds.

any extra years of life they may have over the juicers is spent whinging and bitching about them.

anyway, food for thought.

You are right, on the boards most guys are well informed and just go about their business.  I am talking about these idiots in our gyms that walk around like everyone's intimidated by them and all the girls love them.  That is whats pathetic.  Because when they go off, you dont see them anymore.  Then outa nowhere they come back in, small, looking like someone let the air of of them, start working out again, and in 4 weeks blow right back up and start strutting their stuff. 

[trab]

Because i know Rim personally hes got his shit together.  Good Career, family.  You have the correct attitude.  Using it as another element of your training system.  Unfortunately for a majority, juice becomes a crutch for a lot of guys,  They can't train without it, or wont.  Youve seen them as much as i have.  The doseages that are common today for guys that will never set foot on stage, are outragious. 

I agree w/ most here, (Rim seems pretty cool to Bud)...
But do remember, AAS were not developed for the pursuit of a 20" arm & a trophy !
BBing is but 1 use of the stuff. People use them for various reason. They sure make throwing around scaffolding & Plank & Manuvering a upright 40' extension ladder a whole lot easier for a 40 yr old guy!
Doses are way over blown, I agree. If your gonna hit hard, hit fast IMO. Running long term on a Gr is prolly not good
regardless if Magnus and the boys aint dropping like flies.

[musclehedz]

If you want to juice, it's fine, but maybe you should just go over to the steroid section instead of flaming here. 

This topic is a big bad flame against juicers...

[trab]

This topic is a big bad flame against juicers...

AAS CAN  do bad things, people should know the facts. Prob is those who talk the most about them never used any...  Many these young 1st timers are clueless.They have no idea about shutdown of Nat test and implications.
 They think like take a tylenol for a  headache, take a Di-loboll for some muscles...
It aint quite that simple....

[musclehedz]

AAS CAN  do bad things, people should know the facts. Prob is those who talk the most about them never used any...  Many these young 1st timers are clueless.They have no idea about shutdown of Nat test and implications.
 They think like take a tylenol for a  headache, take a Di-loboll for some muscles...
It aint quite that simple....

Exactly, if you use them smart i can also improve your _normal_ life, not just the bodybuilding part.

Die-hard naturals have no idea what they are missing.

[Rimbaud]

The key is to educate yourself. Natty's want to flame juicers & juicers want to flame natty's. Who cares it's all about your personal choice. Do I use AAS's sometimes? Yes. Do I consider myself better then anyone else? No. It's my choice & really no one elses business.

[overcome]

newbie...  we will see how you feel in about 5 years after your growth slows down.  a year?  that is nothing son, nothing!  mark my words if you are still lifting you will think about it.  as a matter of fact, I bet you are thinking about it right now.

really man, the first 2 or 3 years you will grow easy, then you will hit platues, and it will take some time but you'll get over them.  but when you hit one you cant break... i'm still growing so i'm not worrying to much or thinking about it much yet.  but trust me you will think about it, and its just preferance really.  some guys will hit there limit and be happy with it, and some will want to go farther.  whats the point of calling them pussy's for going farther, when they can just as easily call you a pussy for stopping?

[bmuscle90]

Just do it natural.. build up the muscle, eat good, train hard.. dont need it.  Some of these guys taking these steroids are nothing.. dont even look muscular or healthy.  Ive seen many natural lifters dont even take supplements like protein powders and have bigger body then some of these guys taking the juice. Just eating real food and training.  When you train natural you can look at yourself and know that you earned it through hard work. Dont need to waste hundreds of dollars.. spend the money on something else.

[trab]

Just do it natural.. build up the muscle, eat good, train hard.. dont need it.  Some of these guys taking these steroids are nothing.. dont even look muscular or healthy.  Ive seen many natural lifters dont even take supplements like protein powders and have bigger body then some of these guys taking the juice. Just eating real food and training.  When you train natural you can look at yourself and know that you earned it through hard work. Dont need to waste hundreds of dollars.. spend the money on something else.

Not a bad idea at all.

[musclehedz]

Just do it natural.. build up the muscle, eat good, train hard.. dont need it.  Some of these guys taking these steroids are nothing.. dont even look muscular or healthy.  Ive seen many natural lifters dont even take supplements like protein powders and have bigger body then some of these guys taking the juice. Just eating real food and training.  When you train natural you can look at yourself and know that you earned it through hard work. Dont need to waste hundreds of dollars.. spend the money on something else.

Yeh juicers don't have to work hard 

[trab]

Yeh juicers don't have to work hard 

Hey, Ive trained natural for years, and Ive used steroids. I got to say, you will work much harder on steroid.
That's why we take them. Thats why they call them Peformance enhancing drugs...

Is it necessary to take them to build a decent look and strength? No.
Can they be harmfull? Yes.

Can you use them and not hurt yourself/ minimize bad effects? Yes.

Great that you want to train naturaly, but I got no issue with someone who wants to see some better results after years of hard natural training, But I dont think anyone should use the stuff before they have trained that way for at least a couple years. Actualy a lot longer IMO.

[musclehedz]

Me neither, it's just the misconceptions that are annoying. After all we are all bodybuilders.

[bmuscle90]

Yeh juicers don't have to work hard 

Need to go back and read my post over.  I did not say people who take juice dont work hard.. I said some natural bodybuilders are bigger than ones who take juice. 

[bmuscle90]

I have respect for anyone who trains seriously.. wether they take steroids or not.  I just dont like it when someone sees a guy who is big or has taken steroids and thinks that its all steroids.  Just take it and then you look like that.  It doesn't work that way.  You have to train hard if your using or natural..doesn't matter.  I hope bodybuilding grows larger and more people realize what it takes to get there.

[trab]

I have respect for anyone who trains seriously.. wether they take steroids or not.  I just dont like it when someone sees a guy who is big or has taken steroids and thinks that its all steroids.  Just take it and then you look like that.  It doesn't work that way.  You have to train hard if your using or natural..doesn't matter.  I hope bodybuilding grows larger and more people realize what it takes to get there.

Brilliant!  You could open the back door to the Pharmacy and it wouldnt matter all that much to a lot of guys.
IT WOULDNT MATTER AT ALL W/  OUT  CONSISTENT WORKOUTS AND EATING.

There's a lot of big dudes that can bulk naturaly. Many Big Guys that dont even lift iron... Ripping it up is where the AAS REALLY shine.  It saves that muscle on low carb diet and cardio.

[Rimbaud]

I have respect for anyone who trains seriously.. wether they take steroids or not.  I just dont like it when someone sees a guy who is big or has taken steroids and thinks that its all steroids.  Just take it and then you look like that.  It doesn't work that way.  You have to train hard if your using or natural..doesn't matter.  I hope bodybuilding grows larger and more people realize what it takes to get there.

Excellent post.

[strength]

Just do it natural.. build up the muscle, eat good, train hard.. dont need it.  Some of these guys taking these steroids are nothing.. dont even look muscular or healthy.  Ive seen many natural lifters dont even take supplements like protein powders and have bigger body then some of these guys taking the juice. Just eating real food and training.  When you train natural you can look at yourself and know that you earned it through hard work. Dont need to waste hundreds of dollars.. spend the money on something else.

actually steroids are often cheaper than running a natural surplus of supps. 

[trab]

actually steroids are often cheaper than running a natural surplus of supps. 

Much cheaper, esp out of the USA. 2 tabs of Dbol sells for less than the cost of a Pepsi right off the counter of most Thai Gyms.

Also, steroids are safer and less harsh than many OTC legal "Supplements".  Just because its legal, dont mean it cant be harmfull.....
 JacK Daniels and Tylenol are legal. Have a bottle of each and compare THAT to eating a whole bottle of Dbol.
That is - if your still alive after the Whiskey & Tylenol.

[Tatyana]

Me neither, it's just the misconceptions that are annoying. After all we are all bodybuilders.

I think this is an important point.

Bodybuilding is such a misunderstood sport.

I have been on some BBing forums where there are never-ending debate threads on 'Is bodybuilding a sport' for goodness sake!

The only thing that I have noticed is that the performance enhancing drugs have more of a tendency to DAMAGE the reputation of the sport.

As soon as you say 'bodybuilding' or 'bodybuilder' the social schema/stereotype for this is

1. Steroids

2. Women who look like men

x
x
x

T

[trab]

I think this is an important point.

Bodybuilding is such a misunderstood sport.

I have been on some BBing forums where there are never-ending debate threads on 'Is bodybuilding a sport' for goodness sake!

The only thing that I have noticed is that the performance enhancing drugs have more of a tendency to DAMAGE the reputation of the sport.

As soon as you say 'bodybuilding' or 'bodybuilder' the social schema/stereotype for this is

1. Steroids

2. Women who look like men

x
x
x

T

Yes, but it's pretty stupid for us to deny it. These days even any little old Blue hair lady knows about steroids in sports.  BBers are the Offical whipping boy, Finger pointing target because appearance is the end goal in itself.

Im sure If we had a behind the scenes look at many other sports (Cycling in particular) the stuff BBers do would seem conservative.

I think that the public is getting more aware of that.
Female BBers in top Contest condition have a hard time gaining popular support even if they are natural.
The appearance just runs against what the public is conditioned to consider as a female ideal.

Tough crap! They are not doing it for the benifit of being sex objects to the majority of men.
Its about getting as close to becoming a walking Human Anatomy chart as possible.

[musclehedz]

Need to go back and read my post over.  I did not say people who take juice dont work hard.. I said some natural bodybuilders are bigger than ones who take juice. 

Yes that's sad. Take a look at goodbum/bguns/adonis.