Author Topic: Brokered Convention  (Read 16549 times)

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #50 on: February 22, 2016, 09:39:13 AM »
you shouldn't talk like that.   really.

You shouldn't talk.  Period.  Really. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #51 on: February 22, 2016, 09:42:26 AM »
Some South Carolina and overall numbers:

South Carolina
239,851 = Votes for Trump
498,066 = Votes for other candidates (a difference of 258,215)

Total (Iowa, NH, SC)
285,684 = Votes for Trump
818,251 = Votes for other candidates (a difference of 532,567)


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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #52 on: February 22, 2016, 11:01:51 AM »
You shouldn't talk.  Period.  Really. 

are you ready to admit (what I predicted last summer when he announced running) that the idiot third of the GOp is going to hand the nomination to the liberal moron trump?

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #53 on: February 24, 2016, 08:34:45 AM »
Nevada and overall numbers:

34,531 = Votes for Trump
40,347 = Votes for other candidates

Total (Iowa, NH, SC, NV)
320,215 = Votes for Trump
858,598 = Votes for other candidates

Trump gets less than 50 percent of the vote in Nevada.  Delegates split again.  In fact, the other candidates received more delegates than Trump in Nevada.  The current projections through Super Tuesday show the same kind of outcome, unless the field gets smaller. 

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #54 on: February 24, 2016, 02:14:29 PM »
The real question is how much Trump picks up from either candidate as they bow out. If Rubio loses Florida to Trump he's gone. So there is your answer.

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #55 on: February 24, 2016, 02:28:49 PM »
The real question is how much Trump picks up from either candidate as they bow out. If Rubio loses Florida to Trump he's gone. So there is your answer.

I agree in part.  Trump obviously will roll if the former candidates' supporters get behind him.  I disagree it comes down to Florida for Rubio (or anyone else).  Florida has 99 delegates.  The winner needs 1237.   

polychronopolous

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #56 on: February 24, 2016, 02:45:04 PM »
I agree in part.  Trump obviously will roll if the former candidates' supporters get behind him.  I disagree it comes down to Florida for Rubio (or anyone else).  Florida has 99 delegates.  The winner needs 1237.   

If Trump has the delegate lead and the RNC tries to put the crown on someone else he goes third party.

People just aren't seeing how this all plays out with that scenario.

This guy is a hardcore fighter and do you really think he is gonna allow himself to get f'd over in that manner? Hell no.

In the end Trump has all the leverage in the world if he continues to rack up first place finishes. He WILL have the delegate lead and the RNC won't be able to dick him around. Trump has more power than the RNC at this point, an inconvenient truth for many it seems.

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #57 on: February 24, 2016, 02:47:51 PM »
If Trump has the delegate lead and the RNC tries to put the crown on someone else he goes third party.

People just aren't seeing how this all plays out with that scenario.

This guy is a hardcore fighter and do you really think he is gonna allow himself to get f'd over in that manner? Hell no.

In the end Trump has all the leverage in the world if he continues to rack up first place finishes. He WILL have the delegate lead and the RNC won't be able to dick him around. Trump has more power than the RNC at this point, an inconvenient truth for many it seems.

It will be too late.  He will not have enough time to get on the ballot as an independent in all 50 states.  Even if he does, he isn't going to win as an independent.   

I think most people are not paying attention to the massive amounts of voters who don't like Trump and have not voted for him in the first four states. 

polychronopolous

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #58 on: February 24, 2016, 02:58:15 PM »
It will be too late.  He will not have enough time to get on the ballot as an independent in all 50 states.  Even if he does, he isn't going to win as an independent.   

I think most people are not paying attention to the massive amounts of voters who don't like Trump and have not voted for him in the first four states. 

Trump loses Iowa and probably loses Texas.

Florida is a potential coin flip.

Kasich is a wounded animal and Trump likely takes Ohio.

That being said we could very well see a scenario where Trump wins 46 states.

I live in the South where there are a ton of Cruz supporters...guess who their second choice is? Trump.

So we have a situation where Trump collects a ton of first place finishes while Cruz and Rubio battle for second AND if Cruz does drop out, many of those supporters will go to Trump because Rubio SUCKS on immigration and immigration is the 800 pound gorilla issue in this primary. THE MOST important issue.

Trump also benefits more from a Carson withdrawal than Rubio does.

Even if it was Rubio vs. Trump mano a mano I would put my money on Trump.

And I know alot of really good people who hate Trump but they are absolutely delusional if they think he will not be the nominee.

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #59 on: February 24, 2016, 03:05:11 PM »
It will be too late.  He will not have enough time to get on the ballot as an independent in all 50 states.  Even if he does, he isn't going to win as an independent.   

I think most people are not paying attention to the massive amounts of voters who don't like Trump and have not voted for him in the first four states. 

He's saying that a Trump Indy run would cost the Republican and give it to Hillary.  So if the Republican "leadership" wants to keep Hillary out of power, then they'd have no choice but to run Trump.

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #60 on: February 24, 2016, 03:08:23 PM »
Maybe that explains the stories appearing in the RW media about how Trump is "worse" than Hillary.

I swear, everything keeps pointing to Hillary.  So help me, I'd nearly be willing to say her people are behind all of this.

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #61 on: February 24, 2016, 03:12:18 PM »
Trump loses Iowa and probably loses Texas.

Florida is a potential coin flip.

Kasich is a wounded animal and Trump likely takes Ohio.

That being said we could very well see a scenario where Trump wins 46 states.

I live in the South where there are a ton of Cruz supporters...guess who their second choice is? Trump.

So we have a situation where Trump collects a ton of first place finishes while Cruz and Rubio battle for second AND if Cruz does drop out, many of those supporters will go to Trump because Rubio SUCKS on immigration and immigration is the 800 pound gorilla issue in this primary. THE MOST important issue.

Trump also benefits more from a Carson withdrawal than Rubio does.

Even if it was Rubio vs. Trump mano a mano I would put my money on Trump.

And I know alot of really good people who hate Trump but they are absolutely delusional if they think he will not be the nominee.

That's not what I'm seeing.  In looking at Nate Silver's polling/projections, this is what he currently shows:

Georgia:  dead heat between Trump and Rubio
Mass:  big lead by Trump, but still under 50 percent, with Rubio second
Okla:  Trump in first by first by small margin over Cruz
Texas:  Cruz in first, Rubio and Trump essentially tied for second
VA:  Rubio first, Trump, then Cruz

That's just the 1 March "SEC" primary.  

polychronopolous

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #62 on: February 24, 2016, 03:14:12 PM »
He's saying that a Trump Indy run would cost the Republican and give it to Hillary.  So if the Republican "leadership" wants to keep Hillary out of power, then they'd have no choice but to run Trump.

Yeah it's all summed up with one word: Leverage.

That plus this guy is an obvious competitive maniac who isn't going to sit back and take it in the a*s after he wins 40 states.

Literally EVERYBODY but Rubio would have to drop out today, and then Marco would have to start racking up first place finishes head to head all the way to the convention.

You have a scenario where that happens AND Rubio comes in with more delegates and then Trump would probably accept his loss.

Some backhanded fuckery by the RNC? Forget about it....Trump is a 70 year old billionaire with a great lifestyle, a great business and a great family. Absolutely zero to lose with his actions. He would put a knife through the heart of the RNC in a second if they choose to go down that road.

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #63 on: February 24, 2016, 03:15:06 PM »
Here is what I have been saying about Trump's negatives.

January 30, 2016

Trump's Negative Image
by Frank Newport

Most political and media commentators have at this point installed Donald Trump as the GOP front-runner on the eve of the first actual voting set to begin on Monday in Iowa. But this narrative tends to obscure the fact that Trump is the most unpopular candidate of either party when the entire U.S. population is taken into account -- and that he has a higher unfavorable rating than any nominated candidate from either of the two major parties going back to the 1992 election when we began to track favorability using the current format.

At this point (two-week average through Jan. 27), 33% of Americans view Trump favorably and 60% unfavorably. It's that 60% unfavorable figure that I can focus on here.

Hillary Clinton currently has a 52% unfavorable rating among all Americans, while Jeb Bush is at 45%, Chris Christie 38%, Ted Cruz 37%, Marco Rubio 33%, Bernie Sanders 31% and Ben Carson 30%. Trump's 60% is clearly well above all of these. Putting his favorable and unfavorable ratings together yields a net favorable of -27 for Trump, far above the -10 for Clinton and for Bush, the next lowest among the major candidates.

I wanted to see how Trump's unfavorable played out in the context of previous elections, so I went back to look at the unfavorable ratings of the major-party candidates from 1992 through the current election. The bottom line is that Trump now has a higher unfavorable rating than any candidate at any time during all of these previous election cycles, and that conclusion takes into account the fact that unfavorable ratings tend to rise in the heat of a general election campaign as the barbs, negative ads and heightened partisanship are taken to their highest levels. Gallup routinely reports favorable ratings based on national adults, but some of the favorable ratings in the final months of an election year that I discuss below are based on registered voters.

Bill Clinton's highest unfavorable rating in the 1992 election was 49% (in April and July of that year). His opponent, George H.W. Bush, came closest to Trump's current unfavorable rating in October 1992, as Election Day approached and he received a 57% unfavorable rating in Gallup's tracking.

In 1996, Clinton's highest unfavorable was even lower, at 44%, while his opponent, Bob Dole, never rose above a 47% unfavorable.

The 2000 election, as now, was for an open seat, pitting the sitting Vice President Al Gore against Texas Gov. George W. Bush. Gore's highest unfavorable was 42% before the November voting, rising to one reading of 52% unfavorable in December 2000 as the disputed popular vote count in Florida continued. Bush was more popular; his unfavorable rating in 2000 never rose above 41% before the election, although, like Gore's, it edged up during the recount.

When Bush was running for re-election in 2004, his highest unfavorable was 47%, while John Kerry's highest was 45%. (Both men did receive higher unfavorable ratings later on; I'll return to Bush's story below.)

In 2008, Barack Obama maintained a very popular image, with an unfavorable rating maxing out at 37%, while John McCain also remained popular with a maximum unfavorable of 44%. And when running for re-election in 2012, Obama's unfavorable crept up to 48%, while his opponent, Mitt Romney, also maxed out at 48%.

Looking across all of these candidates' unfavorable ratings outside of election years yields this conclusion: Only one of them, George W. Bush, ever had an unfavorable rating of 60% or higher. For Bush, his unpopularity crested in his final lame-duck year in office, with an unfavorable rating that hit 66% in April 2008.

By comparison, Bill Clinton's highest unfavorable rating in Gallup's history of rating him has been 59% in March 2001 after he left office amid criticism of his pardons and issues relating to White House furniture. The highest unfavorable for his wife, Hillary, came in that same March 2001 poll -- at 53% -- a figure she has matched several times in the current campaign.

One candidate I haven't mentioned here is Ross Perot. The maverick third-party candidate's unfavorable rating did reach above 60% at points in both the 1992 and 1996 campaigns, no doubt because neither party had any loyalty toward him. Perot got 19% of the popular vote in 1992 and 8% in 1996.

http://www.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/188936/trump-negative-image.aspx

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #64 on: February 24, 2016, 03:18:01 PM »
Yeah it's all summed up with one word: Leverage.

That plus this guy is an obvious competitive maniac who isn't going to sit back and take it in the a*s after he wins 40 states.

Literally EVERYBODY but Rubio would have to drop out today, and then Marco would have to start racking up first place finishes head to head all the way to the convention.

You have a scenario where that happens AND Rubio comes in with more delegates and then Trump would probably accept his loss.

Some backhanded fuckery by the RNC? Forget about it....Trump is a 70 year old billionaire with a great lifestyle, a great business and a great family. Absolutely zero to lose with his actions. He would put a knife through the heart of the RNC in a second if they choose to go down that road.

I think Trump would do his absolute best to be a good, effective president.  I'd be willing to give it shot, against the reality of this field.  Let's face it, Ms. Hil is going to be the opposition, and that should make the choice very clear.

polychronopolous

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #65 on: February 24, 2016, 03:18:15 PM »
That's not what I'm seeing.  In looking at Nate Silver's polling/projections, this is what he currently shows:

Georgia:  dead heat between Trump and Rubio
Mass:  big lead by Trump, but still under 50 percent, with Rubio second
Okla:  Trump in first by first by small margin over Cruz
Texas:  Cruz in first, Rubio and Trump essentially tied for second
VA:  Rubio first, Trump, then Cruz

That's just the 1 March "SEC" primary.  


Maybe Rubio takes VA...I'll grant you that one because I don't know much about that scenario.

Trump finishing THIRD in Texas? That's a tough one to see.

I'm pretty plugged in down here with the political scene and I'd say it's about 50% Cruz 35% Trump and the occasional Rubio fan.

polychronopolous

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #66 on: February 24, 2016, 03:19:21 PM »
Politics are almost like a soap opera or murder mystery at times haha  :D

All these different scenarios...


Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #67 on: February 24, 2016, 03:23:36 PM »
Maybe Rubio takes VA...I'll grant you that one because I don't know much about that scenario.

Trump finishing THIRD in Texas? That's a tough one to see.

I'm pretty plugged in down here with the political scene and I'd say it's about 50% Cruz 35% Trump and the occasional Rubio fan.

Well I cannot argue with what you are seeing first hand.  I will say, however, that Nate Silver is the man.  Very accurate.  That's who I'm following during the election season. 

Also, I cannot put my finger on it right now, but I've seen polls that show Rubio or Cruz beating the crap out of Trump in a two-person race, which makes sense when you see the votes from the first four states. 

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #68 on: February 24, 2016, 03:25:43 PM »
I think Trump would do his absolute best to be a good, effective president.  I'd be willing to give it shot, against the reality of this field.  Let's face it, Ms. Hil is going to be the opposition, and that should make the choice very clear.

With the death of Justice Scalia this became a Supreme Court Election.

A Liberal Supreme Court would irreparably change this country.

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #69 on: February 24, 2016, 03:29:32 PM »
With the death of Justice Scalia this became a Supreme Court Election.

A Liberal Supreme Court would irreparably change this country.

Not sure what you could count on in that regard with Trump, though.  But I don't know.  Have you followed his comments on it?

polychronopolous

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #70 on: February 24, 2016, 03:33:00 PM »
Well I cannot argue with what you are seeing first hand.  I will say, however, that Nate Silver is the man.  Very accurate.  That's who I'm following during the election season. 

Also, I cannot put my finger on it right now, but I've seen polls that show Rubio or Cruz beating the crap out of Trump in a two-person race, which makes sense when you see the votes from the first four states. 

I don't know that much about him. I know he has had a very solid reputation in the past but as a pretty regular follower of Morning Joe(yeah I know it's terrible, I just enjoy the contrast of Mika and Joe for some bizarre reason) I know that Scarborough has been pretty harsh on him lately concerning his predictions. If I spoke any further on this I would look like a fool because I simply don't know that much more about Nate but Joe seems to believe that his predictions haven't been that on point here lately?

Dos Equis

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #71 on: February 24, 2016, 03:36:44 PM »
I don't know that much about him. I know he has had a very solid reputation in the past but as a pretty regular follower of Morning Joe(yeah I know it's terrible, I just enjoy the contrast of Mika and Joe for some bizarre reason) I know that Scarborough has been pretty harsh on him lately concerning his predictions. If I spoke any further on this I would look like a fool because I simply don't know that much more about Nate but Joe seems to believe that his predictions haven't been that on point here lately?

I've been posting his predictions and the results.  He has been right pretty much across the board. 

Check out his site.  You can look at each state's predictions and poll numbers if they're available.  He made a believer out of me years ago.  http://fivethirtyeight.com/politics/

polychronopolous

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #72 on: February 24, 2016, 03:48:47 PM »
Not sure what you could count on in that regard with Trump, though.  But I don't know.  Have you followed his comments on it?

I'll take ANY of the top 20 or 30 GOP Candidates over Hillary when it comes down to naming the next Supreme Court Justice. Whether I like them for their political views or not. The Supreme Court means THAT MUCH.

Here lately I've been watching this guy Erick Ericson over at redstate basically saying he is going to stay home if it comes down to a Trump vs. Hillary election.

And I just use him for an example. Hell, Glen Beck is the same way. By these guys staying at home because of their butthurt feelings it makes it that much easier for Hillary to step in and appoint Liberal justices.

I think that is where we are seeing alot of backlash. People who lean right don't necessarily worship the tradition forms of "conservatism". It's almost like this checklist of beliefs you have to subscribe to in order to be "legit".

And sadly, these same people are talking about staying home because Trump doesn't check all those boxes. The GOP is an absolute mess right now.

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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #73 on: February 24, 2016, 11:10:42 PM »
Trump loses Iowa and probably loses Texas.

Florida is a potential coin flip.

Kasich is a wounded animal and Trump likely takes Ohio.

That being said we could very well see a scenario where Trump wins 46 states.

I live in the South where there are a ton of Cruz supporters...guess who their second choice is? Trump.

So we have a situation where Trump collects a ton of first place finishes while Cruz and Rubio battle for second AND if Cruz does drop out, many of those supporters will go to Trump because Rubio SUCKS on immigration and immigration is the 800 pound gorilla issue in this primary. THE MOST important issue.

Trump also benefits more from a Carson withdrawal than Rubio does.

Even if it was Rubio vs. Trump mano a mano I would put my money on Trump.

And I know alot of really good people who hate Trump but they are absolutely delusional if they think he will not be the nominee.

Disagree with most of this.   Cruz up 8 in TX and it's sliding.  He loses that, it's a sweep.   Kasich gets 2nd in OH.  Rubio gets a good 2nd in FL, but that's it.

Trump is VERY popular in FL... everyone I know loves his ignorant ass.  I'm ready to cuss out one relative, a sleazebag cheating pothead drunk driver, saying Trump will make america great... fuccksticks like YOU are what makes this country shit, you drunk driving prick... sorry,. I dislike the guy lol.


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Re: Brokered Convention
« Reply #74 on: February 25, 2016, 08:39:49 AM »
Disagree with most of this.   Cruz up 8 in TX and it's sliding.  He loses that, it's a sweep.   Kasich gets 2nd in OH.  Rubio gets a good 2nd in FL, but that's it.

Trump is VERY popular in FL... everyone I know loves his ignorant ass.  I'm ready to cuss out one relative, a sleazebag cheating pothead drunk driver, saying Trump will make america great... fuccksticks like YOU are what makes this country shit, you drunk driving prick... sorry,. I dislike the guy lol.



Hillary has a potential enthusiasm/voter turnout problem. The handful of democrat friends I know just aren't excited about her this year. In 08 they were crawling over broken glass to vote for Obama and still showed up in '12. From what I hear they probably won't even bother to vote this year.

Oh course a voting booth is simply a snapshot in time but when I went in for early voting yesterday I seen 3 old timers wearing Trump shirts so that could mean something. Still think Cruz edges Texas out because Texans adore him but it will be in the single digits for sure. Aside from your occasional rogue Ben Carson or Marco Rubio fan, Trump is generally the second choice behind Ted or Ted just behind Trump.

You are right though, if Trump edges out Texas then stick a fork in this race.