Manion Says Disloyalty to the IFBB is Like Cheating on your Wife!!!

[Brutal_1]

LOL....that's pretty funny...."G4P"....

no such thing my friend...

?!?!?!?!?!?! 

So does this mean those photo shoots of JOJ, Silvio, Kai etc. etc. etc. were done for free???

[Chick]

?!?!?!?!?!?! 

So does this mean those photo shoots of JOJ, Silvio, Kai etc. etc. etc. were done for free???

Although not my style...those that chose to take pics like those do so by their own choice...who it markets to is irrelevant. I guess you could call Playgirl mag "gay" as well, even though it's supposed to cater to women.....

THat being said, all this G4P talk is ridiculous....you either engage in homosexual activity because you enjoy it, or you just don't do it.....if it's "for money", then I guess you would be a gay prostitute.....

[bigdumbbell]

Although not my style...those that chose to take pics like those do so by their own choice...who it markets to is irrelevant. I guess you could call Playgirl mag "gay" as well, even though it's supposed to cater to women.....

THat being said, all this G4P talk is ridiculous....you either engage in homosexual activity because you enjoy it, or you just don't do it.....if it's "for money", then I guess you would be a gay prostitute.....

yeah  man up  tell it like it is   

[dirk digler]

LOL....that's pretty funny...."G4P"....

no such thing my friend...

Not according to Klien, who spent seven years studying top level bodybuilding.

Sociologist/anthropologist Klein ( Sugarball: The American Game, The Dominican Dream ) spent seven years hanging out at four elite West Coast bodybuilding gyms, and his observations of this strange, hyper-masculine subculture, though sometimes shackled by academic jargon, are telling. He tracks bodybuilding's roots in Charles Atlas ads and the film Pumping Iron , then offers a taxonomy of gym characters, from onlookers to professional bodybuilders. He savvily analyzes "the political economy of bodybuilding," describing how a few entrepreneurs and promoters control the sport, and how competitors find jobs--as bouncers, bodyguards and the like--at which they can put their muscle to use. Klein finds much irony in the view that one's body is entirely in one's control, since genetics affect potential, and steroids destroy more than they add. Moreover, though bodybuilding is enshrined in the minds of its practitioners as heterosexual, large numbers of competitors survive by homosexual hustling. In contrast to male bodybuilders, female ones see the sport more as a means than as an end in itself; and many male bodybuilders, Klein suggests, find support for misogyny and homophobia in their barbell world.

[chaos]

How about the term "Caring Homosexual"?

You know Chaos, sometimes you can be quite the fag, remember when you sent this to me?

I don't remember that one

Although I had my expert PM forger look into this and he says this one is fake. Any idea how that happened

[bigdumbbell]

Not according to Klien, who spent seven years studying top level bodybuilding.

Sociologist/anthropologist Klein ( Sugarball: The American Game, The Dominican Dream ) spent seven years hanging out at four elite West Coast bodybuilding gyms, and his observations of this strange, hyper-masculine subculture, though sometimes shackled by academic jargon, are telling. He tracks bodybuilding's roots in Charles Atlas ads and the film Pumping Iron , then offers a taxonomy of gym characters, from onlookers to professional bodybuilders. He savvily analyzes "the political economy of bodybuilding," describing how a few entrepreneurs and promoters control the sport, and how competitors find jobs--as bouncers, bodyguards and the like--at which they can put their muscle to use. Klein finds much irony in the view that one's body is entirely in one's control, since genetics affect potential, and steroids destroy more than they add. Moreover, though bodybuilding is enshrined in the minds of its practitioners as heterosexual, large numbers of competitors survive by homosexual hustling. In contrast to male bodybuilders, female ones see the sport more as a means than as an end in itself; and many male bodybuilders, Klein suggests, find support for misogyny and homophobia in their barbell world.

i believe RMC not some bookworm

[andreisdaman]

LOL....that's pretty funny...."G4P"....

no such thing my friend...

Come on Bob..you absolutely KNOW that G4P exists...I know for sure you don't engage in it (because you've got that awesome wife of yours waiting back home) but I and many other BB fans believe it does exist...Dexter Jackson mentioned a few years ago that a famous rich guy in NY city gave him an all expenses paid trip to NY and once he got there the rich guy wanted some G4P...Dex says he turned it down but you can't tell me that all bodybuilders turn it down...Bob does make a point though that what bodybuilders do with their bodies is not a reflection on BB because there are many people in all aspects of life and in all professions that are homosexual and will do G4P...another thing Bob is that while most of your money comes from BB. com, you make money indirectly from the thousands of visitors to the site who purchase products..they visit that site due to their interest in BB being piqued by the various contests, magazines and IFBB BB personalities...BB.com could not make money on the average gym schmoe who does not follow BB and who do not purchase supplements because they don't read the magazines and therefore haven't been suckered into buying them..LOL..finally Bob lets stop talking about this stuff and talk about when you are going to put out a hot DVD of you and your hot wife having sex?...you could quit BB.com due to the income you'd make off of that!

[bigdumbbell]

dice clay said:  "either you iz or you ain't"

[absolutely]

We have had this analogy many times over. If you belong to one fraternity in college, and you go to another one, and while you are there, talk crap about your old fraternity, and then later on you decide you want to come back, you will find it very hard to do so.

As for the IFBB, each individual decides if he wants to compete there or not. As long as they are in good standing with the organization. They choose to compete, they don't have to.

What are the solutions to all this bellyaching? 
1.  For the people who think the IFBB is a cult, screws with the athletes, a terrible org and is out for just money:
Why don't all of you get together, start a federation based on your opinions?  What, you don't have the money or time?  What about connections to supplement companies and major BB magazines?  How about money for venue locations and staff to coordinate these major events?  All of you make it sound like the IFBB has very little to do when organizing these events.  And that they shouldn't be paid!  How do you think the venue location and coordinating staff is paid for?  Oh, you THINK everyone should just volunteer their time?  What about the booths that other companies rent?  Do you think they rent them every year because they lose money?  Who pays for the hall for companies to come in?  The IFBB events are helping keep America employed!  I heard at the Classic 2007, one booth for $2,000 made a company over $70,000 that weekend!

For myself, I am thankful they are still around - with all that has occurred to a lot of pros, crime or otherwise, the IFBB still continues to serve the athletes who are still stage ready.  Most of you fail to see what it takes to have such an org for the such an event planned for really very few people onstage.  SO, you are saying that you can do a better job than the IFBB and put 4-6,000 people in the seats?

2.  For the people who have such brazen opinions about those who are employed by the IFBB?  Why don't you offer Chick and others a good paying job so they can feed their families?  What would your company do if you agreed to bash them too?  I believe that is loyalty which all companies require.  You all sound jealous of these people, maybe you should apply for IFBB or BB.com job too?  How would you be if you were hired?

3.  How many of you think you can run a federation which puts people (some with little or no education) on the map for all of us to enjoy and use as mentors?  Why don't you people who are so ready to condemn the IFBB come up with a solution - a different federation, giving the athletes free-reign to do whatever they think on how the new federation should be ran?  Stop being a nagging fan and find solutions!

Some of you fail to see the IFBB is a company which has been around for decades and who have brought bodybuilding into the limelight so we can have something special in our lives to talk about!  It brings to the public the sport of bodybuilding which all of us love.  Do you think you could do better?  We will never agree with any company's rules unless we write them ourselves!  Would you allow a stranger to come into your home and write the rules?  Yes, the IFBB is a home for these athletes when they really do not have many other places to go.

You must ask yourselves:  Would I be willing to put forth the energy, time, money and efforts to an already struggling sport who deals with athletes (some with little or no education) and make it professional somehow?  These athletes are referred to as pros because the IFBB gives that pro status without requiring formal education.  Who cares what the athletes do after hours, as long as they perform according the company's desire and the company has the right to deem what is important to them?  Not you.  Why didn't Lee get a job at a sports retail store part time?  Didn't he have a contract with a magazine and supplement company already?  Why does he need more money?  No, I think he competed with the PDI just for spite and was just playing the role that he does, a disrespectful and dishonest person.  There have been too many people who were destroyed in his wake as he speed boats through life, taking.  Ask him about his long-term friendships?

What Lee did is unforgivable in so many ways!  I was very surprised that Jim Manion called it a suspension.  But I guess he wanted to see what Lee would do and to offer another chance?  Lee has done nothing but create more animosity.  On his board and other means like the make-shift petition, now this movie clip with Rocky as if Sly won't pursue a piracy lawsuit against him.  Rocky has integrity; Lee is well, no clue.  Who are these people that think this is professional?  These people are trying to destroy Lee and now have taken away any thought of Lee being a professional anything.  Why is Lee so blind?  All the IFBB wanted him to do is develop a respect for the org and stop all the crap!

Maybe the wife and frat analogies were not quite real, but for some people here, they offered understanding.  How about this analogy?  You work for me.  I OWN THE COMPANY, I have my rules and since they are MINE, I get to ENFORCE, IMPLEMENT, CHANGE and APPLY them any way I choose.  Until you own this company:  Your Choices?  DO what I say or GET OUT, because I can find people who will CHOOSE to work for me!

As for his denying about voicing negative opinions about the IFBB on the internet and in magazines.  Remember Lee's recent article in MMI August issue:  "I'm just playing with people and I have no intentions of competing for the IFBB.  The PDI is for me from now on."  Why does he want to come back now?   Because the PDI ended.  Lee actually stole winnings from the other no-names who competed for the PDI, and Wayne allowed it.  Yes, Lee is a thief because he knew he was above that caliber; everyone knew.

Wayne was not a known angel while he was with the IFBB; all things in life come full circle; maybe that is what he is experiencing now.  Jim Manion has been great for pro bodybuilding; many athletes who did not care for the IFBB rules (but followed them anyway for the love of the sport and the fans), but found their lives to be more fulfilled because of the IFBB.  Even after retirement, these pros are still recognized and are still making a little money having competed for the IFBB, Tom Platz, Lee Haney, Lou Ferrigno, Lee Labrada, Frank Zane, Rich Gaspari to name a few.  Tell me again how the IFBB is no good?   Are we not having fun attending the events?

You know what, the sport would be dead right now and you all are trying your best not to see you are part of the murder!  When you are dealing with guys who just want to grow and have no real profound talent accept muscles and symmetry, you must have bosses like Jim and Wayne to make the world see them as professionals.  My God, you people who claim to love this sport, I just don't see where you are trying to make it better!

Really, Lee created this whole thing; he needs to move on and stop trying to be paid for hanging out and training; he needs to get a job and stop living off of people.  What?  He being onstage, do you really think he has talent?  Face it, he is just a big, short guy who is weird with tattoos; yeah, he might bring more people in, but who would want those kinds of fans in the audience?  I think the IFBB are making great decisions, and yeah they are probably losing some money, but I think they are wise enough to realize they would rather take their chances WITHOUT Lee.  Maybe he should try out for wrestling, maybe a little Hulk, but then he would have to change his persona and be a good guy.  Something I think Lee has no clue of what that means!

So now, let's hear it!  Are you starting a new federation where the athletes have all the say-so?  Oh, and yes, go ahead.  Bash the IFBB and destroy them!  But you better have a home for the pros - or is your goal to make them "homeless"?

[andreisdaman]

What are the solutions to all this bellyaching? 
1.  For the people who think the IFBB is a cult, screws with the athletes, a terrible org and is out for just money:
Why don't all of you get together, start a federation based on your opinions?  What, you don't have the money or time?  What about connections to supplement companies and major BB magazines?  How about money for venue locations and staff to coordinate these major events?  All of you make it sound like the IFBB has very little to do when organizing these events.  And that they shouldn't be paid!  How do you think the venue location and coordinating staff is paid for?  Oh, you THINK everyone should just volunteer their time?  What about the booths that other companies rent?  Do you think they rent them every year because they lose money?  Who pays for the hall for companies to come in?  The IFBB events are helping keep America employed!  I heard at the Classic 2007, one booth for $2,000 made a company over $70,000 that weekend!

For myself, I am thankful they are still around - with all that has occurred to a lot of pros, crime or otherwise, the IFBB still continues to serve the athletes who are still stage ready.  Most of you fail to see what it takes to have such an org for the such an event planned for really very few people onstage.  SO, you are saying that you can do a better job than the IFBB and put 4-6,000 people in the seats?

2.  For the people who have such brazen opinions about those who are employed by the IFBB?  Why don't you offer Chick and others a good paying job so they can feed their families?  What would your company do if you agreed to bash them too?  I believe that is loyalty which all companies require.  You all sound jealous of these people, maybe you should apply for IFBB or BB.com job too?  How would you be if you were hired?

3.  How many of you think you can run a federation which puts people (some with little or no education) on the map for all of us to enjoy and use as mentors?  Why don't you people who are so ready to condemn the IFBB come up with a solution - a different federation, giving the athletes free-reign to do whatever they think on how the new federation should be ran?  Stop being a nagging fan and find solutions!

Some of you fail to see the IFBB is a company which has been around for decades and who have brought bodybuilding into the limelight so we can have something special in our lives to talk about!  It brings to the public the sport of bodybuilding which all of us love.  Do you think you could do better?  We will never agree with any company's rules unless we write them ourselves!  Would you allow a stranger to come into your home and write the rules?  Yes, the IFBB is a home for these athletes when they really do not have many other places to go.

You must ask yourselves:  Would I be willing to put forth the energy, time, money and efforts to an already struggling sport who deals with athletes (some with little or no education) and make it professional somehow?  These athletes are referred to as pros because the IFBB gives that pro status without requiring formal education.  Who cares what the athletes do after hours, as long as they perform according the company's desire and the company has the right to deem what is important to them?  Not you.  Why didn't Lee get a job at a sports retail store part time?  Didn't he have a contract with a magazine and supplement company already?  Why does he need more money?  No, I think he competed with the PDI just for spite and was just playing the role that he does, a disrespectful and dishonest person.  There have been too many people who were destroyed in his wake as he speed boats through life, taking.  Ask him about his long-term friendships?

What Lee did is unforgivable in so many ways!  I was very surprised that Jim Manion called it a suspension.  But I guess he wanted to see what Lee would do and to offer another chance?  Lee has done nothing but create more animosity.  On his board and other means like the make-shift petition, now this movie clip with Rocky as if Sly won't pursue a piracy lawsuit against him.  Rocky has integrity; Lee is well, no clue.  Who are these people that think this is professional?  These people are trying to destroy Lee and now have taken away any thought of Lee being a professional anything.  Why is Lee so blind?  All the IFBB wanted him to do is develop a respect for the org and stop all the crap!

Maybe the wife and frat analogies were not quite real, but for some people here, they offered understanding.  How about this analogy?  You work for me.  I OWN THE COMPANY, I have my rules and since they are MINE, I get to ENFORCE, IMPLEMENT, CHANGE and APPLY them any way I choose.  Until you own this company:  Your Choices?  DO what I say or GET OUT, because I can find people who will CHOOSE to work for me!

As for his denying about voicing negative opinions about the IFBB on the internet and in magazines.  Remember Lee's recent article in MMI August issue:  "I'm just playing with people and I have no intentions of competing for the IFBB.  The PDI is for me from now on."  Why does he want to come back now?   Because the PDI ended.  Lee actually stole winnings from the other no-names who competed for the PDI, and Wayne allowed it.  Yes, Lee is a thief because he knew he was above that caliber; everyone knew.

Wayne was not a known angel while he was with the IFBB; all things in life come full circle; maybe that is what he is experiencing now.  Jim Manion has been great for pro bodybuilding; many athletes who did not care for the IFBB rules (but followed them anyway for the love of the sport and the fans), but found their lives to be more fulfilled because of the IFBB.  Even after retirement, these pros are still recognized and are still making a little money having competed for the IFBB, Tom Platz, Lee Haney, Lou Ferrigno, Lee Labrada, Frank Zane, Rich Gaspari to name a few.  Tell me again how the IFBB is no good?   Are we not having fun attending the events?

You know what, the sport would be dead right now and you all are trying your best not to see you are part of the murder!  When you are dealing with guys who just want to grow and have no real profound talent accept muscles and symmetry, you must have bosses like Jim and Wayne to make the world see them as professionals.  My God, you people who claim to love this sport, I just don't see where you are trying to make it better!

Really, Lee created this whole thing; he needs to move on and stop trying to be paid for hanging out and training; he needs to get a job and stop living off of people.  What?  He being onstage, do you really think he has talent?  Face it, he is just a big, short guy who is weird with tattoos; yeah, he might bring more people in, but who would want those kinds of fans in the audience?  I think the IFBB are making great decisions, and yeah they are probably losing some money, but I think they are wise enough to realize they would rather take their chances WITHOUT Lee.  Maybe he should try out for wrestling, maybe a little Hulk, but then he would have to change his persona and be a good guy.  Something I think Lee has no clue of what that means!

So now, let's hear it!  Are you starting a new federation where the athletes have all the say-so?  Oh, and yes, go ahead.  Bash the IFBB and destroy them!  But you better have a home for the pros - or is your goal to make them "homeless"?

first of all before I disagree with you, I must say your argument was very well thought out and presented nicely...I agree with everything you say,mostly..but you are missing the point...this is about the athletes being able to compete where they want when they want to...they are independent contractors NOT IFBB employees...that's like me being an independent house building contractor, building you a house, you paying me for the house, then telling me "oh by the way, you can never build a house for anyone else but me"...huh?... I am not an employee of yours....I make money based on my reputation and how good I am and bodybuilders do the same thing...The IFBB says that they are providng the athletes with exposure so that they can market themselves, but that "exposure" is paid for by the athlete in terms of his not being paid for photo shoots and not being reimbursed for other things...and competing at their own expense in terms of food, gear, plane and hotel...Yes the IFBB is a wonderful organization that has done well for itself and in promoting bodybuilding in general, but not all of their practices are fair or sound...Lee spoke up about this....nothing wrong with that...

how about in baseball when Curt Flood challenged the reserve clause system where owners owned their players and the players could do nothing about it?..players were paid lousy wages (oftentimes $9,000 to $20,000 a year)and could be bought , sold, traded and blackballed from the game without their consent...baseball did business like that for 75 years before the courts struck it down.... when bodybuilders left the IFBB for the WBF and came back why were they penalized so heavily and blackballed if they are "independent contractors"?...because the IFBB is a monopoly and could get away with it...Joe Weider will go to businessman's heaven for being such a brilliant businessman, god bless him, but his ownership of the major BB mags and running the IFBB was an incestrous relationship where he could blackball bodybuilders from his mags if they didn't toe the line...ewven independent magazines such as Musclemag and others, seldom criticize the IFBB and do little investigative reporting of them... they will let a guy like Lee voice his grievances but notice they never offer any editorials or opinions critcal of the IFBB...what does that say?

[Busted]

first of all before I disagree with you, I must say your argument was very well thought out and presented nicely...I agree with everything you say,mostly..but you are missing the point...this is about the athletes being able to compete where they want when they want to...they are independent contractors NOT IFBB employees...that's like me being an independent house building contractor, building you a house, you paying me for the house, then telling me "oh by the way, you can never build a house for anyone else but me"...huh?... I am not an employee of yours....I make money based on my reputation and how good I am and bodybuilders do the same thing...The IFBB says that they are providng the athletes with exposure so that they can market themselves, but that "exposure" is paid for by the athlete in terms of his not being paid for photo shoots and not being reimbursed for other things...and competing at their own expense in terms of food, gear, plane and hotel...Yes the IFBB is a wonderful organization that has done well for itself and in promoting bodybuilding in general, but not all of their practices are fair or sound...Lee spoke up about this....nothing wrong with that...

how about in baseball when Curt Flood challenged the reserve clause system where owners owned their players and the players could do nothing about it?..players were paid lousy wages (oftentimes $9,000 to $20,000 a year)and could be bought , sold, traded and blackballed from the game without their consent...baseball did business like that for 75 years before the courts struck it down.... when bodybuilders left the IFBB for the WBF and came back why were they penalized so heavily and blackballed if they are "independent contractors"?...because the IFBB is a monopoly and could get away with it...Joe Weider will go to businessman's heaven for being such a brilliant businessman, god bless him, but his ownership of the major BB mags and running the IFBB was an incestrous relationship where he could blackball bodybuilders from his mags if they didn't toe the line...ewven independent magazines such as Musclemag and others, seldom criticize the IFBB and do little investigative reporting of them... they will let a guy like Lee voice his grievances but notice they never offer any editorials or opinions critcal of the IFBB...what does that say?

I think the IFBB has failed promoting the bodybuilders.  Why was Cutler not on Leno? ESPN? talk shows? IN mainstream mags? 

Casue the IFBB doesn't promote anything, they just get their sanction fees.

[Frank D. Law]

first of all before I disagree with you, I must say your argument was very well thought out and presented nicely...I agree with everything you say,mostly..but you are missing the point...this is about the athletes being able to compete where they want when they want to...they are independent contractors NOT IFBB employees...that's like me being an independent house building contractor, building you a house, you paying me for the house, then telling me "oh by the way, you can never build a house for anyone else but me"...huh?... I am not an employee of yours....I make money based on my reputation and how good I am and bodybuilders do the same thing...The IFBB says that they are providng the athletes with exposure so that they can market themselves, but that "exposure" is paid for by the athlete in terms of his not being paid for photo shoots and not being reimbursed for other things...and competing at their own expense in terms of food, gear, plane and hotel...Yes the IFBB is a wonderful organization that has done well for itself and in promoting bodybuilding in general, but not all of their practices are fair or sound...Lee spoke up about this....nothing wrong with that...

how about in baseball when Curt Flood challenged the reserve clause system where owners owned their players and the players could do nothing about it?..players were paid lousy wages (oftentimes $9,000 to $20,000 a year)and could be bought , sold, traded and blackballed from the game without their consent...baseball did business like that for 75 years before the courts struck it down.... when bodybuilders left the IFBB for the WBF and came back why were they penalized so heavily and blackballed if they are "independent contractors"?...because the IFBB is a monopoly and could get away with it...Joe Weider will go to businessman's heaven for being such a brilliant businessman, god bless him, but his ownership of the major BB mags and running the IFBB was an incestrous relationship where he could blackball bodybuilders from his mags if they didn't toe the line...ewven independent magazines such as Musclemag and others, seldom criticize the IFBB and do little investigative reporting of them... they will let a guy like Lee voice his grievances but notice they never offer any editorials or opinions critcal of the IFBB...what does that say?

Brilliantly said. Succinctly put. You hit the nail on the head!  All this employer-employee analogy is just a smokescreen - to cloud the issue and conceal the fact that the IFBB IS A MONOPOLY.

Like all monopolies, the IFBB would exploit and if they could, screw the BBers and the fans if they could get away with it! 

Start another org?  That's what Wayne deMelia tried to do, starting the PDI.  The IFBB's response?  Blackball and screw the BBers who dared to compete in the PDI!  How true to form.

Only with the intervention of the AG, can this vile monopoly be put where it belongs - in the scrapheap of history!  The Curt Flood case has shown the way.  I trust that some brave BBer will summon the strength to file a complaint with the AG. And hey, there's aboslutely NO LEGAL COSTS involved!  Only the IFBB will incur legal costs if the AG hauls them to court. 

We'll see then how tough the IFBB really is and see if this bully-boy would continue to throw his weight around.

[G o a t b o y]

Some of you fail to see the IFBB is a company which has been around for decades and who have brought bodybuilding into the limelight so we can have something special in our lives to talk about!  It brings to the public the sport of bodybuilding which all of us love.  Do you think you could do better?  We will never agree with any company's rules unless we write them ourselves!  Would you allow a stranger to come into your home and write the rules?  Yes, the IFBB is a home for these athletes when they really do not have many other places to go.

Strange that you call the IFBB a "company".  They're a non-profit federation.  (at least that's what they tell the tax-man  ).  Since they are not a company that actually employs these guys or pays them a salary, what right do they have to impose "rules" on them that apply to anything other than IFBB events?

[Van_Bilderass]

The Sex Cult of Venice Beach
by Jason Caruso

Preface

The story that you're about to read falls under the classification of truth being far stranger than fiction. It involves several of the men glorified as heroes in the pages of physique magazines like Flex and Muscle and Fitness — pro bodybuilders who are the icons and inspirations to the current crop of budding young weight trainers in much the same fashion that Steve Reeves, Arnold, and Lee Haney were for generations past. Their names have been omitted, for if the details of this interview were linked directly to them, I have no doubt that the bodybuilding careers of these men would almost certainly be destroyed.

It isn't so much for them that I conceal their identities, but rather for their fans. Bodybuilding has always been a sport with a revered pantheon of role models to emulate. I wouldn't want the guilt of knowing that my writings were responsible for a part of that pantheon being forever associated with depravity and perversion.

I've known these men on a very casual basis for several years, yet never suspected the secret lives that they were leading behind the gym and the posing stage. I'll never be able to see so much as a picture of them now without feeling utter, vile revulsion.

Because I couldn't bear the thought that they knew that I've discovered their filthy secret, I opted to write this under an assumed name. To those of you who choose to label me a coward hiding behind a pen name, I must counter that, in this case, the stakes are definitely too high to risk disclosing my identity. It isn't so impossible to speculate that I could also be put in significant danger, as well, should I be identified as the one to break the silence of their clandestine forays into the darkest sins of the flesh.

My source was an actual witness to all of this who regularly sees some of the players in this twisted scenario. He insisted that the identities of all parties be protected and, in fact, wasn't willing to talk until I'd given him my word that this request would be honored. Descriptions of people and locations are intentionally kept vague.

All that you need to know about my source is that he's a bodybuilder, and the players felt as if he was someone that they could safely involve in their game as a willing participant. As it turned out, they were wrong.

This is the story of the most disturbing night of this man's life. Be forewarned, all descriptions are quite graphic. If you're easily offended by sexually explicit discussion, you may want to skip this interview altogether.


T: How did this night begin for you?

Secret Source: We'd all just gone to a big show where I knew a few of the competitors, including the winner. Afterward, a few of my friends and I were invited to a party for the winner. He arrived in a limo with a bunch of people.

T: What was the first thing to tip you off that this wasn't a typical party?

SS: When I arrived, there was no alcohol and I didn't smell any pot, but everyone was walking around like they were drunk or loaded. Guys had their shirts off and wore these funny-looking crosses on chains. Some had snakes wrapped around their necks, too.

As soon as I walked in, guys were introducing me and others to their girlfriends and wives. The girls would start checking you out, looking you up and down. Then they'd look at their man and nod or say, "Yeah, okay." A few minutes later, you'd see different guys fondling these other guys' wives. Or it would be women all over them. My buddy elbows me and says:

      "Look, this guy's over there on the floor about to jump that girl's bones!"

I look over, and it was no girl. It was another guy. There was probably close to 500 pounds of naked muscle rolling around on the floor kissing.

T: By now, you knew that this was a very different kind of party?

SS: Definitely. Then, four attractive young ladies walked in the door. The first thing they said was, "It hasn't started yet?" One was African-American, two were Caucasian, and one was Asian. One of the white girls was walking around with a long-necked beer bottle, practicing her blowjob technique on it.

As soon as they figured out that "it" hadn't started yet, one of the white girls and the black girl went into a bathroom. They didn't come out for half an hour and were laughing like crazy. The black girl went up to my girlfriend, got right up in her face, and said, "Hi." She winked and licked her lips at her.

T: A friendly gesture, I'd say.

SS: My girl figured out what was happening right away. Then, this famous pornstar comes down the stairs. She's known for being the world's greatest gangbanger (note, there are at least three women in adult film who currently claim this distinction). She approached another girl, a total stranger to her, and tried to take her upstairs to get it on. The girl didn't want to go.

Then my girl wandered into the next room. On a chair was a famous pro bodybuilder with his shirt off, a big guy whom you all know. About eight or ten people, men and women, were sitting on the floor around him, like little kids waiting to hear a story. He was explaining to them how the "game" was going to start off. It was a game like spin the bottle. Whoever the bottle pointed to had to blow him. The winner was the one who could make him cum. He said that everyone needed to participate. This was so that nobody would tell anyone about it.

Another big guy with no shirt was now trying to push me and my friends into the room to be part of the game. Either that, or he wanted us to leave. It was very obvious that you had to get involved or leave. At this point, once they saw that we weren't going to join in the game, they separated my group. They took me and my guy friend into a room with those four girls from before and wanted us to party with them.

Meanwhile, the pornstar was now trying to get my girl to go upstairs. At the same time, one of the guys with no shirt and a funny cross tried to get her to take a hit of Ecstasy. She wouldn't. We seemed to be the only ones who weren't on it.

T: What on earth was this pornstar doing there in the middle of all of these bodybuilders?

SS: She was a friend of a group of foreign guys who really run this thing. They're not bodybuilders, but they're good friends of the contest winner and always seem to be at the major events and gyms. They could be tied into the porn business somehow, but I'm just guessing.

T: Did you do anything with the four wild girls?

SS: I thought about it, but then I thought about what I had to lose. I love my girlfriend and have too much respect for her to do something so meaningless and cheap right in front of her.

On top of that, I got the feeling that after we did anything with the girls, the big guys would try to get us for themselves. It was like if we'd done the girls, it would have been anything goes. No way did I want to have a 250-pound guy trying to force himself on me. There were quite a few of them, too.

T: Out of curiosity, was it an equal ratio of men to women?

SS: No. There were maybe two girls for every guy, and most of them were either really pretty or outright beautiful. But about half of them seemed much more interested in each other than in the men. I think that they were all bisexual.

T: We've established that some of the men were top bodybuilders whom we all know. Were any of the women recognizable bodybuilders or fitness women?

SS: Yes, there were both, and all names that you know.

T: Were these women who we'd suspect would be involved in something like this, or would we all think of them as sweet, innocent Pollyannas?

SS: Pollyannas all the way — nice, wholesome girls ready to fuck anything around that wasn't moving. You'd never guess the ones who were there.

T: Unbelievable. Okay, let's back up a bit. You were invited to this party, even though they didn't know whether or not you'd be accepting of these types of activities? Doesn't that seem strange, even stupid, on their part?

SS: As far as we knew ahead of time, it was just a party. I don't know why they thought that we'd get involved in all of the weird sex. Maybe they just wanted to have sex with us and were willing to take a chance. I found out that the party used to be at a different house. It's been going on for two or three years.

T: What happened next?

SS: I heard a noise in the bathroom. A big guy was screaming, "Give it to me hard, I like it hard!" I recognized his voice. It was someone that I knew. Everyone knows him from the magazines. I never even suspected that he was gay, or bisexual, or whatever he is. But there he was, getting fucked in the ass. A bunch of people were watching.

When those guys finished, another big guy came in, pushed the "pitcher" up against the wall, and started kissing him. Then he went down on him. Now I was really ready to get out of there. They were trying to keep us there. It was one of those very uncomfortable situations where someone is trying to pretend that they're still friendly, but there was an edge of hostility. They were blocking our exit, saying, "Hey, you don't have to go." I didn't know whether they'd try to physically restrain or attack us, but we left, and nothing happened.

T: I have to ask, in the age of AIDS, were these guys using condoms throughout all of this?

SS: Believe it or not, no. Chalk it up to the drugs, or maybe they're just plain stupid. Maybe they don't care whether they live or die. You think that you know people, and then some bizarre shit like this shows you that you have no idea what some people are really up to. Secret lives, man, secret lives.

T: It must've been the weirdest night of your life.

SS: Yes. I was curious, of course, with all of the beautiful women so horny and everything, but it just got too scary. All of the sex stuff happened in the last half-hour that we were there. It felt like that scene in the movie "From Dusk 'Til Dawn" when suddenly everybody except the good guys in the bar turns into vampires. I was like, fuck! Biggest shock of my life.

T: You had no idea before that any of this was going on?

SS: Yeah, but I never saw it. You hear so much bullshit and rumors out here that turns out to be untrue. I recall when there was a big fight inside the Firehouse [a restaurant in Venice that's a big bodybuilder hangout] over it. One of the guys was jealous or something. This bodybuilder was mad at the other one and started calling contest promoters and judges to tell them what was going on.

I also remember now that the two guys in the bathroom had been seen making out at a bar in front of at least 15 or 20 people, supposedly at the request of one of their wives. Come to think of it, I was at one of their parties had once, and two big bodybuilder chicks started wrestling nude on the floor. One of them had the biggest clit I've ever seen. They started getting it on, then he [the host] and his wife jumped in and joined them.

Maybe that should've tipped me off about him. But who'd imagine that you'd go to a party and all of these people would be into this stuff? It just goes beyond what we're willing to accept can really happen. And these guys, I always thought that they were manly men — big, macho dudes. Never in my wildest dreams would I have thought that they were into each other, as well as girls.

T: I'm curious to know what happened the next day and since. Have you run into any of them, and how have you handled it?

SS: The limo driver who drove to the party got into trouble with the contest winner the next day for telling about what had happened on the ride over there. He saw them all slamming Ecstasy and shooting Nubain. There were empty cartons of Nubain everywhere. Can you imagine how fucked up they must've been? Not that it excuses what they did, but that's quite a combination. It's basically like taking acid and shooting heroin at the same time.

The worst thing, I heard that the limo driver also reported that one of the other pros had started yelling, "I told you what I was gonna' do if you won, I told you!" before going down and sucking the winner's dick right then and there in the back of the limo. It turns out that the trainer of the contest winner had instructed the limo driver to report back to him everything he saw. I guess that he had his suspicions about what his client was up to, hanging around with those shady little foreign guys all of the time. He's been going around the gym, pissed off, telling a lot of people about it. I don't know if he'll ever get that guy ready for another show now.

I actually saw a few of the big guys who'd been at the party the next day at the gym. They didn't realize that I was right next to them. One of them complained about his asshole being sore. They joked that he must have been with "Mushroom Dick." He said:

      "Hell, no! Did you see the size of that thing? It was as big around as a water glass."

My girl overheard that part and couldn't contain herself. She laughed out loud. That's when the guy saw that we were right there. He hung his head and walked away. He was ashamed. How embarrassing for him.

T: You never mentioned anything about Mushroom Dick before.

SS: I must've blocked it out. That was really fucked up. The night of the party, this foreign guy was telling everyone that his dick head looked like a giant mushroom. He was telling this to me and my girl, total strangers that he'd seen maybe a couple of times in the gym.

He'd injected Esiclene right into his dick to see how big it would swell up. For a while, he was Dirk fucking Diggler. His wife loved the big new dick and was demanding sex with him constantly, he said, but it hurt him. It was also supposedly drawing too much blood and making him lightheaded. A girl at the party had tried to give him head, but he had to stop her after a minute. I later found out that he had to ice it to get it to go down to normal, and then he couldn't get a hard-on for three weeks. I've heard a lot of people do stupid things in this sport, but that takes the cake. What's next, Synthol?

T: Are you worried that these people might figure out that you gave this interview?

SS: Of course I am.

T: What do you think that they'd do?

SS: The bodybuilders would probably just get mad and never talk to me again. But there's also that group of foreign guys involved in all of this, some very shady characters who are into who knows what. They aren't really bodybuilders, yet you always see them hanging around the gym and at all of the big shows. They're all loaded with money and drive very expensive cars and trucks, yet they don't seem to work. I'm more concerned about them. I've heard that they're crazy.

T: Do you think that, on a whole, they're afraid of being exposed?

SS: I'd have to say that I don't think that they care very much. They were too open, and there were just too many people at the party. The way that they were all talking, it seemed like this goes on just about every weekend.

T: Don't some of these people have a lot to lose if all of this came to light?

SS: Definitely.

T: Do you think that it was wise for them to invite you and your friends, not knowing how receptive you'd be?

SS: No, I think that they were pretty stupid. But these aren't logical people. Lust and drugs cloud over their minds or something.

T: What would the fans of these pros think if they knew about this?

SS: Compare it to someone seeing Mark McGuire sucking a dick. You'd have a lot of shell-shocked baseball fans, wouldn't you? It kind of put a bad taste in my mouth for the whole sport of bodybuilding. These guys aren't who I thought they were.

T: Hasn't there always been a big gay element associated with bodybuilding, particularly the Venice Beach scene?

SS: Well, there's one particular wealthy old guy in the gym industry who's infamous. He's put up more top amateur and pro bodybuilders in his house than the Marina Pacific Hotel. Most times, he'd help by giving them a place to stay while they looked for an apartment.

Other guys would go there a month or two before a show so that they could train in Venice. That's a big deal to someone from another country or places like Ohio or Boston. The ones that he really liked, he'd give them two thousand bucks a month for expenses. If you go through all of the guys from magazine covers over the past ten years, a ton of them have stayed at this guy's house at one time or another.

T: What did the bodybuilders have to do in return?

SS: From what I've heard from some of the guys, the main thing is that he likes for them to walk around with no shirt on, just shorts or underwear. He really likes having them around before contests when they're in great shape. Other times, he'd want them to let him watch while they banged a girl. I never heard about any of the guys having to do anything with him but, then again, I doubt that it's the type of thing that you'd tell everyone about.

T: Back to the party that you attended. The strange crosses, the snakes — it sounds like some kind of cult or religion. What was that all about?

SS: I don't know. To be honest, it scared the shit out of me. I really don't want to know. I believe in God, and this seemed evil to me. Some kind of cult, yeah. Satanic or something, maybe, maybe not. I didn't see any pentagrams or sacrifices, if that's what you mean. Maybe they just thought that it looked cool or hip.

T: How do you deal with seeing some of these people at the gym all of the time now?

SS: It's totally awkward. I just say to myself that it's their lifestyle. I don't agree with it, but who am I to say what's right or wrong?

T: Have you had any nightmares about that night?

SS: No, but it sure would make an interesting video.

T: Suppose that there was a video or pictures, and it ended up on the Internet. What do you think would happen to the pro bodybuilders who were there?

SS: They'd lose a lot of respect, and especially money. Those contracts that they have, the endorsements, all of it would be gone in a second. I think that they'd care more about the money. If they really cared about being respected, they wouldn't be doing all of this shit.

T: Do you think that these guys will ever get caught or exposed?

SS: I think that it's only a matter of time. Like I said, there were a lot of people at the party, and we all know that bodybuilders aren't always the most emotionally mature people on the planet. I think that someone will get mad at someone else and start blabbing to the media to really ruin them.

T: Would magazines print this, or would it be too outrageous?

SS: Certain ones would, and others wouldn't. Some would lose money, like those that promote these guys and use them to sell products. It's a fucked-up sport. This really isn't so shocking when you stop and consider that the same company promotes the shows, has the guys under contract, and runs the biggest magazines.

T: If you'd been invited and had known what was planned to transpire, would you have gone?

SS: No. It was scary, and I wouldn't want to be in that situation again.

T: What did you find most offensive?

SS: That they were trying to push people into doing things that they clearly didn't want to do. It was very uncomfortable. I still feel sick to my stomach thinking back about it.

T: Was it the gay sex in particular that bothered you?

SS: That was bad enough. I'd never in my life seen two men together, and I never wanted to, either. What they do behind closed doors is none of my business, but this was literally right in front of me. I felt dirty.

Another thing that still haunts me is the lack of respect between husbands and wives. These guys didn't care whether their wives started fucking some big meathead she just met right in front of them. I value marriage a lot more than that.

T: Had there been no homosexual activity whatsoever, would you still have been shocked?

SS: No. A lot of bodybuilders are exhibitionists and sex addicts. I've seen guys hook up with female groupies at shows a hundred times.

T: Would you have participated, in that case?

SS: Yeah, I'll be honest. If I hadn't had my girl with me and I knew for sure that she wouldn't have found out? Hell, yeah, I would've gotten down. I never claimed to be an angel. I'm just saying that the things I saw that night blew my mind and scared the hell out of me.


Epilogue

Since this interview was conducted, it seems that a gossip columnist for one of the top physique magazines has heard about the "cult" and is actively pursuing the story. Apparently, she's already printed a vague remark about a pro bodybuilder's wife partying with some of the contestants following a certain event. The truth, according to my source, is that the very famous pro bodybuilder and his girlfriend did, indeed, attend the party, but they were just as uncomfortable as him and his friends and never participated in any of the illicit activities.

This female journalist has been probing around the Venice gyms looking for information and has already approached at least two of the partygoers in her search. Unfortunately for her, they feigned ignorance and have spread the word that she's out to ruin the reputations of all involved. Everyone has been asked not to speak to her should she come to them. It's highly unlikely that she'll get her story.

However, as our source postulated, due to the lack of discretion that's employed by those who indulge in these bisexual orgies of muscular flesh and the sheer number of people involved, it's only a matter of time before this whole sordid story is exposed. At that point, the reaction will be similar to that of a rock being lifted to reveal the squirming worms, beetles, and larvae below. It will truly be a dark and humiliating day for the sport of bodybuilding and, surely, several of the men and women implicated in this scandal will be forever ostracized from the sport that once revered them.

When that day does come, don't take pity on them — they won't feel remorse for their actions. They reveled in each and every bit of flesh that they were able to suck, stroke, lick, penetrate, or be penetrated by. Like the players in all of our modern scandals, their only regret will be that they were caught. Don't be overly shocked when it all comes raining down. After all, our heroes are only flesh and blood, and the flesh is weak.

This article was deleted on Mayhem by Tom Prince because it was a "bullshit made up story" and "it talks about a friend of mine". If it's BS and made up why is it talking about a friend of his and how did he recognize him in the story? 

[bigdumbbell]

what's new in this story everybody knows who the sponsor is, why wreck it for people?