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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: 20inch calves on January 10, 2014, 01:17:04 PM
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Guys please share your t3 experience here
How long is to long? How much is to much?
I m thinking 30mcg a day bumping up 60mcg after 3 wks using for a total of 11wks
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There is no "too long" purely from a health standpoint as it has been shown that the thyroid will fully recover in a matter of weeks no matter what. Obviously there are other considerations e.g financial but that's highly individual
In terms of dose it really depends on your goals.
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I have 30lbs to lose in about 10wks I already have enough to run whatever
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100mcg max and about 8 weeks at that dose.
You can use 50mcg for months with no issues.
I'd limit it to 4 months to be safe. I've used 50mcg for 6 months with no problems and i had a strong rebound, my thyroid is fine.
8)
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To OP, on 100mcg, you'll have to use AAS. Without AAS, it would be catabolic on muscles. How much AAS, experts (overload and others) shall suggest.
And yes, you'd be hungry like a wolf on 100mcg. Atleast I get. It may vary individually. Just stating one of the effects.
Thanks.
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There is no "too long" purely from a health standpoint as it has been shown that the thyroid will fully recover in a matter of weeks no matter what. Obviously there are other considerations e.g financial but that's highly individual
In terms of dose it really depends on your goals.
eh, yes there is a 'too long'.
I'm speaking from experience, after ending up in the ER (and admitted for 3 days) with Thyro-toxic Periodic/partial Paralysis, in which the thyroid levels were so high for so long that my potassium was shit... low enough to where I couldn't lift myself out of bed.
believed I was taking t4, when I was being given t3.. took about 9 months till I ended up hospitalized, and lost 40+ pounds, if not 60. people were asking if I was 'sick'... was losing so much weight, I thought I had cancer or something.
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eh, yes there is a 'too long'.
I'm speaking from experience, after ending up in the ER (and admitted for 3 days) with Thyro-toxic Periodic/partial Paralysis, in which the thyroid levels were so high for so long that my potassium was shit... low enough to where I couldn't lift myself out of bed.
believed I was taking t4, when I was being given t3.. took about 9 months till I ended up hospitalized, and lost 40+ pounds, if not 60. people were asking if I was 'sick'... was losing so much weight, I thought I had cancer or something.
ESFitness, how much t3 were you taking accidently during those 9 months which led to the problems?
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ESFitness, how much t3 were you taking accidently during those 9 months which led to the problems?
probably 200mcg
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probably 200mcg
that's why. there IS NO "too long", but there is "too much". you abused the drug.
of course its gonna cause retarded lethargy and weakness at that dose for along time, and for more insane hunger
using proper dosage of 50mcg for most during prep and offseason it can be run all yr round and I do so myself
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that's why. there IS NO "too long", but there is "too much". you abused the drug.
of course its gonna cause retarded lethargy and weakness at that dose for along time, and for more insane hunger
using proper dosage of 50mcg for most during prep and offseason it can be run all yr round and I do so myself
yea, but how do you gauge the dose?? I've run 75-150mcg of t4 daily for many, many years, but with consistent bloodwork.
I wouldn't run t3 longer than 6-8wks, knowing what I know now. running t3 in the past is the reason for me needing t4 in the first place. if I was gonna run it longer (if I needed t3 longer, something is wrong with my diet #1... or I'd better have impaired t3 from gh #2)
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yea, but how do you gauge the dose?? I've run 75-150mcg of t4 daily for many, many years, but with consistent bloodwork.
I wouldn't run t3 longer than 6-8wks, knowing what I know now. running t3 in the past is the reason for me needing t4 in the first place. if I was gonna run it longer (if I needed t3 longer, something is wrong with my diet #1... or I'd better have impaired t3 from gh #2)
it noticeably aids in protein synthesis in case studies done on it, no long term damage from 50mcg per day.
the guidelines are based on what you weigh. a 250-270lb Olympia competitor can run 100mcg per day, a 200lb amateur should stick between 25-50mcg(25 is only replacement dose). The sides you describe are exactly what is supposed to happen with an overactive thyroid, its too much for you.
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yea, but how do you gauge the dose?? I've run 75-150mcg of t4 daily for many, many years, but with consistent bloodwork.
I wouldn't run t3 longer than 6-8wks, knowing what I know now. running t3 in the past is the reason for me needing t4 in the first place. if I was gonna run it longer (if I needed t3 longer, something is wrong with my diet #1... or I'd better have impaired t3 from gh #2)
i believe "Common Ssense" is the answer you are looking for, also, know your body and listen to it.
In your past experience with T3, did you lose 40+ pounds? i doubt it. So the fact that you lost 40+ lbs shouldve told you that something in your doseage was fucked up.
And what OL said was there is no time limits on t3, but dont confuse that with dose limit. 200mg test e weekly for rest of your life is fine. 2000mg test e weekly for rest of your life is not fine
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hey mario, missed you no homo.
i think there is both too mch and too long.
id only ever run a dosage as low as possible to feel an effect.25mcg t3 will have feelable effect without the flatness.
the more t3,the more gear must be ran.its a viscous cycle.
it really helps, but always tendency of flatness and real musceloss
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hey mario, missed you no homo.
i think there is both too mch and too long.
id only ever run a dosage as low as possible to feel an effect.25mcg t3 will have feelable effect without the flatness.
the more t3,the more gear must be ran.its a viscous cycle.
it really helps, but always tendency of flatness and real musceloss
hey man how are you? was away for about a year now , very limited access to internet and whatnot, now im back. read yor othe rpost, sorry about your injury bro.
I feel t3 is best dosed anywhere between 25-50mcg. anything lower than that it might not be beneficial at all, anything more than that i think the benefit/side effect ratio is not worth it ( mostly feeling flat).
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What do you guys think about measuring body temperature first thing in the morning to gauge t3's effect on body?
If temperature is increased by 0.3 to 0.6 degree above basal, t3 is affecting. If not, up the dose by 25mcg.
What say?
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What do you guys think about measuring body temperature first thing in the morning to gauge t3's effect on body?
If temperature is increased by 0.3 to 0.6 degree above basal, t3 is affecting. If not, up the dose by 25mcg.
What say?
body temperature too volatile for that.
t3 will wont dont worry.its plenty strong.
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i believe "Common Ssense" is the answer you are looking for, also, know your body and listen to it.
In your past experience with T3, did you lose 40+ pounds? i doubt it. So the fact that you lost 40+ lbs shouldve told you that something in your doseage was fucked up.
And what OL said was there is no time limits on t3, but dont confuse that with dose limit. 200mg test e weekly for rest of your life is fine. 2000mg test e weekly for rest of your life is not fine
you doubt it?
who the fuck are you to "doubt me"? why don't you use the fucking 'search' feature.
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I guarantee he lost 40lbs on it. T3 is such a strong weightloss drug, and ive tried the 200mcg hes talking about and never again will I go above 50(I was at 50 my whole 8 week prep this yr), you lose fat and also flatten out like a pancake if ur really lean already. I've done it for a short time just to see, you shit constantly due the metabolic process being sped up, I got lines in my glutes eating cake and ice cream everyday, going to bed eating as much as I could and if I didn't eat enough I looked pathetically fat. The lethargy and tiredness ive never felt in my life.
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I guarantee he lost 40lbs on it. T3 is such a strong weightloss drug, and ive tried the 200mcg hes talking about and never again will I go above 50(I was at 50 my whole 8 week prep this yr), you lose fat and also flatten out like a pancake if ur really lean already. I've done it for a short time just to see, you shit constantly due the metabolic process being sped up, I got lines in my glutes eating cake and ice cream everyday, going to bed eating as much as I could and if I didn't eat enough I looked pathetically fat. The lethargy and tiredness ive never felt in my life.
By flat, do you mean no glycogen in the muscles?
When you come off the T3, the glycogen returns and you're "full" again?
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By flat, do you mean no glycogen in the muscles?
When you come off the T3, the glycogen returns and you're "full" again?
honestly its within a very short period of time. if I take 100mcg for a few days and eat 400-500g carbs each day ill flatten out. It's just very hard to out eat the T3. And even if you do, overnight when u don't eat for 8 hours you lose way more weight than you should.
I prepped on 50mcg t3 and 600g carbs per day, with only 2 days the final week at 200g carbs. All 8 weeks of prep.
The year prior I experimented with high dose T3 and it was a chore to not shrink and lose wayyy too much weight.
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honestly its within a very short period of time. if I take 100mcg for a few days and eat 400-500g carbs each day ill flatten out. It's just very hard to out eat the T3. And even if you do, overnight when u don't eat for 8 hours you lose way more weight than you should.
I prepped on 50mcg t3 and 600g carbs per day, with only 2 days the final week at 200g carbs. All 8 weeks of prep.
The year prior I experimented with high dose T3 and it was a chore to not shrink and lose wayyy too much weight.
So this isn't "real" muscle mass lost then, it's just the glycogen getting depleted really fast? Like a ketogenic diet would but a few days?
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So this isn't "real" muscle mass lost then, it's just the glycogen getting depleted really fast? Like a ketogenic diet would but a few days?
Im saying it'll eat ur muscle if ur not eating constantly uncomfortable amounts of food.
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you doubt it?
who the fuck are you to "doubt me"? why don't you use the fucking 'search' feature.
Calm down gloria, no need for the internet tough guy attitude around here..
You said :
believed I was taking t4, when I was being given t3.. took about 9 months till I ended up hospitalized, and lost 40+ pounds, if not 60. people were asking if I was 'sick'... was losing so much weight, I thought I had cancer or something.
Im not doubting this. You ACCIDENTLY took high dosage of T3 because you THOUGHT you were taking T4. My question to you was that prior to this incident, did you have any experience with T3? if so, during your previous runs of T3, did you ALSO lose 40 lbs? Thats what i was saying i doubt... My point it, i dont think every cycle of T3 you had you lost 40 lbs, so the fact that during this cycle you were dropping weight like crazy, it shouldve told you "wait a minute, why is this time around so much more different than previous tries?"
See what happens when you have a nice friendly conversation instead of getting your panties in a bunch?
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Im saying it'll eat ur muscle if ur not eating constantly uncomfortable amounts of food.
Thanks
What is the best approach? To keep calories the same as when you were eating to gain weight for a few weeks?
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Thanks
What is the best approach? To keep calories the same as when you were eating to gain weight for a few weeks?
Yup, its a great safe tool and at 25-50 mcg u can use it all year long, I do myself. Honestly I did an 8 wk prep, dropped 15lbs total(I stay lean offseason) and kept calories at 3500 the entire time, only did a slight deplete to 200g carbs for 2 days and slight carb up. At 8 wks i just bumped tren, bumped ephedrine, added letro and halo at 3 wks out, had T3 in all offseason and dose didn't change.
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Yup, its a great safe tool and at 25-50 mcg u can use it all year long, I do myself. Honestly I did an 8 wk prep, dropped 15lbs total(I stay lean offseason) and kept calories at 3500 the entire time, only did a slight deplete to 200g carbs for 2 days and slight carb up. At 8 wks i just bumped tren, bumped ephedrine, added letro and halo at 3 wks out, had T3 in all offseason and dose didn't change.
When you experienced muscle loss at 100mcg, how much gear were you running?
Do you think this muscle loss could have been avoided on higher AAS dosages?
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When you experienced muscle loss at 100mcg, how much gear were you running?
Do you think this muscle loss could have been avoided on higher AAS dosages?
no, its a caloric deficit + t3 overdose.
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no, its a caloric deficit + t3 overdose.
So lets say one is running 1gm test E/week along with 100mcg t3/day.....do you think he'll still have some muscle loss? I think not.
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So lets say one is running 1gm test E/week along with 100mcg t3/day.....do you think he'll still have some muscle loss? I think not.
Dont make a big deal out of AAS. Its not that if you have AAS in your body you will absolutely never lose any muscle mass. If you take 1000Mg a week and starve yourself for 2 weeks, you will lose WEIGHT.
If you're on ASS, lets say only 20% of that WEIGHT loss is muscle, whereas if you're natural, 50% of that WEIGHT lost is muscle. I pulled those percentages out of my ass though, just using it as an example
So yes, you can lose MUSCLE while on AAS.
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So lets say one is running 1gm test E/week along with 100mcg t3/day.....do you think he'll still have some muscle loss? I think not.
No you'd just have to eat a lot more food, or else you would. And for me personally, yes I'd wake up flat and in a bigger deficit because ive ran that T3 with various test doses to experiment. For me personally im lean all year round but the look I have when I wake up on 100mcg is like I need to eat a few hundred grams of carbs immediately, veins not as prominent until I get a lot of food in, and the scale is much lighter because my body burns through food even if I eat right before bed. T3 is individual to the bodyweight, the more you weigh the more you can take. An obese female was telling me she's prescribed 200mcg per day and she's huge.
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so which to you guys find more effective T3 or T4?
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t3 is much much much stronger lol.
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t3 is much much much stronger lol.
One question in this regards:
T3 range ng/dl: 60 - 180
My normal t3 value: 67
Me @ 50mcg/day: 79
Me @ 100mcg/day: 150
In this situation, do you think I shall suffer muscle loss? On 1gm test/week?
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One question in this regards:
T3 range ng/dl: 60 - 180
My normal t3 value: 67
Me @ 50mcg/day: 79
Me @ 100mcg/day: 150
In this situation, do you think I shall suffer muscle loss? On 1gm test/week?
Your too strung up on the gear. Gear is only part of the solution. The other part of the solution is you calories in. 1G of test enable you to lose "minimal" muscle compared to a natty. if you keep your protein intake high, you will lose minimal muscle.
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t3 is much much much stronger lol.
It isn't necessarily just that it is stronger, but rather T4 is the precursor to T3 in the body. There is a conversion that takes place in specialized cells within the body which is why it doesn't make a lot of sense to not use the exogenous T3 hormone as you are saving the body from having to do this conversion.
I've seen folks argue that T4 becomes more important as you begin to get into higher levels of HGH usage however I have no direct HGH experience and cannot comment on this...
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Your too strung up on the gear. Gear is only part of the solution. The other part of the solution is you calories in. 1G of test enable you to lose "minimal" muscle compared to a natty. if you keep your protein intake high, you will lose minimal muscle.
My point is that if one's t3 value is still within normal range @ 100mcg/day, would it still cause muscle loss?
If the value is over 180ng/dl, and one is clearly hyperthyroid, I can see muscle loss for sure.
May be I am missing something in the picture.
Another tangent, loss of strength and reduction in poundages during workouts can be an important indicator of muscle loss.
What if one can feel and look flat as all hell...but still his strength is intact and poundages are maintained?
This tells us that he is not suffering from muscle loss but only glycogen depletion and thus flat look.
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The "T3 causes catabolism" sentiment is one that is vastly exaggerated on AAS boards. To have this occur at any reasonable amount would require absurd levels of exogenous T3 and/or an absolutely horrendous dietary design...
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It isn't necessarily just that it is stronger, but rather T4 is the precursor to T3 in the body. There is a conversion that takes place in specialized cells within the body which is why it doesn't make a lot of sense to not use the exogenous T3 hormone as you are saving the body from having to do this conversion.
I've seen folks argue that T4 becomes more important as you begin to get into higher levels of HGH usage however I have no direct HGH experience and cannot comment on this...
T4 to T3 conversion is impaired during dieting especially low carb dieting. You may have heard/read about euthyroid sick syndrome.
In this situation, exogenous t3 can be proven beneficial as you wrote.
Either to up the t3 levels to the normal value which body is not producing anymore due to dieting....or to up it to above normal to get metabolic boost.
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http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0026049579902063#
To close the loop on the catabolism discussions, this study shows that even in non AAS users up to 60mcgs/day of exogenous T3 produced no statistically significant amount of catabolism as compared to those who were not using.
If you add AAS into the picture, then this will be even less of an issue since most of us use between 50-75mcgs/day.
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The "T3 causes catabolism" sentiment is one that is vastly exaggerated on AAS boards. To have this occur at any reasonable amount would require absurd levels of exogenous T3 and/or an absolutely horrendous dietary design...
I agree. And this is quite surprising really.
In this regards, there was a member Buselmo (apparently knowledgeable and acknowledged by few other experienced members) who used to post on getbig but stopped dont know why....his post is interesting.
{Buselmo wrote:
T3 eats up muscle? LOL!
when you lose 10 lbs of sub-q water, and 10 lbs of glycogen... and your neck looks thinner (which is what most people notice immediately and start telling you you lost a lot of weight) THAT DOES NOT MEAN YOU LOST MUSCLE!!!!
look... here's something you should do... get off the sauce... for a couple of muscle... look at how shitty you start looking... once you get skinny, pile on fat in the wrong places, and lose muscle... get on a ton of T3 and some juice... and look at what happens... then you can assess what it does!
NEVER JUDGE IF YOU LOST MUSCLE BY IF YOU LOST FUCKING WATER!
180 mcg T3, 240 mcg Clen, 90 mg ephedrine and i gained fucking muscle...
2 days after going off the T3, clen, and ephedrine and loading up on carbs... i gained a good fucking 16 lbs and was the biggest I ever was at this body fat.
the problem with assessing if T3 makes you loss muscle or not is that when you're a blowfish and are holding so much water your sock marks last for a month... you go on the thermos and especially T3 and lose a lot of water and start burning up Glycogen like a mother fucker... you look flatter, you lose fullness, but you lean out like fuck... when you're on T3 and you think you're losing muscle, don't you notice that your muscles turn into rocks when you flex them? instead just being "pumped and bloated"?
T3 doesn't make you lose muscle... i don't care what anyone says...
I used to think that, and i'd "see it" happen when i was on 50 mcg T3 and i start panicing... it was all bullshit... it's not muscle, it's glycogen and water. once i got that through my thick head and said "so fucking what if i look just a little thinner? i don't give a shit"... a couple of months later, I was as lean as fuck and i gained muscle. so don't give me that shit that T3 makes you lose muscle... and don't tell me the usual "ppl are different"... It's not a coincidence that i used to "lose muscle" when i listened to this shit and believed it, and fucking gained muscle when i said "fuck it... it's bullshit"
}
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T4 to T3 conversion is impaired during dieting especially low carb dieting. You may have heard/read about euthyroid sick syndrome.
In this situation, exogenous t3 can be proven beneficial as you wrote.
Either to up the t3 levels to the normal value which body is not producing anymore due to dieting....or to up it to above normal to get metabolic boost.
Oddly enough, I've found that physicians regularly prescribe exogenous T4 as opposed to T3 in situations when patients show signs of hypothyroidism. They prescribe a dose just large enough to get TSH into range and consider it good as long as all thyroid panels are "in range".
I'm working with someone now who had this very thing happen to them but we are theorizing that their conversion to T3 is not working well (even though serum numbers are "in range yet low") and will be starting T3 soon to see if this alleviates some of the "issues" they have...
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http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0026049579902063#
To close the loop on the catabolism discussions, this study shows that even in non AAS users up to 60mcgs/day of exogenous T3 produced no statistically significant amount of catabolism as compared to those who were not using.
If you add AAS into the picture, then this will be even less of an issue since most of us use between 50-75mcgs/day.
Sorry mate...but this study concluded:
These observations suggest that: (1) skeletal muscle catabolism decreases during fasting; and (2) pathophysiologic doses of T3 (60 μg/day or more), but not reverse T3, enhance muscle catabolism during fasting.
Have I misinterpreted something?
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Note that it took doses of 60mcgs/day or more to produce statistically significant amounts of muscle catabolism in non-trained, non AAS users...
Since most of us are bodybuilders using AAS, I think it is a safe bet that if we are using less than 60mcgs/day of T3 then there would be little to no chance of muscle catabolism since it didn't occur in these study subjects who are our polar opposite...
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Note that it took doses of 60mcgs/day or more to produce statistically significant amounts of muscle catabolism in non-trained, non AAS users...
Since most of us are bodybuilders using AAS, I think it is a safe bet that if we are using less than 60mcgs/day of T3 then there would be little to no chance of muscle catabolism since it didn't occur in these study subjects who are our polar opposite...
That makes sense. Thanks.
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Oddly enough, I've found that physicians regularly prescribe exogenous T4 as opposed to T3 in situations when patients show signs of hypothyroidism. They prescribe a dose just large enough to get TSH into range and consider it good as long as all thyroid panels are "in range".
I'm working with someone now who had this very thing happen to them but we are theorizing that their conversion to T3 is not working well (even though serum numbers are "in range yet low") and will be starting T3 soon to see if this alleviates some of the "issues" they have...
Yes...t4 prescriptions are universal. No physician prescribes t3. Atleast I've not heard/read of any who does.
But lets not forget that those patients are usually non bodybuilders and not dieting. And thus t4 to t3 conversion may not necessarily impaired in their case. Thus supplementing them with just t4 would solve problem in most cases.
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The "T3 causes catabolism" sentiment is one that is vastly exaggerated on AAS boards. To have this occur at any reasonable amount would require absurd levels of exogenous T3 and/or an absolutely horrendous dietary design...
if youre dieting, you can easy lose muscle on t3, its not exagerated.
esp when already lean.
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if youre dieting, you can easy lose muscle on t3, its not exagerated.
esp when already lean.
x2..
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Yes...t4 prescriptions are universal. No physician prescribes t3. Atleast I've not heard/read of any who does.
But lets not forget that those patients are usually non bodybuilders and not dieting. And thus t4 to t3 conversion may not necessarily impaired in their case. Thus supplementing them with just t4 would solve problem in most cases.
So you're saying that some fat dude that is 30% + BF would be better off with T4 than T3?
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That's why I was also a little surprised to learn that physicians prescribe T4.
It just seems they are making the body perform one additional step which could be avoided if exogenous T3 were used instead. Plus, if the person has a conversion problem then T4 wouldn't be the ideal solution?!?
But what do I know...
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So you're saying that some fat dude that is 30% + BF would be better off with T4 than T3?
Physicians prescribe t4 to those who are generally hypothyroid. ESS is not the problem. Thus appropriate dosage of t4 takes care of low thyroid level. Body itself converts t4 to t3 as per its requirement. No more no less. Raising metabolism above normal isnt the purpose behind prescribing t4. Hope this makes sense.
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Hi chetanbarokar, hopefully I'm not mistaken here but I believe the spirit of SamoanIrishman's question was not whether or not T4 would help but rather wouldn't T3 administration work better (since the body doesn't have to do any conversion and the built in physiological feedback loops exist to adjust TRH/TSH as needed)...thoughts?
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Hi chetanbarokar, hopefully I'm not mistaken here but I believe the spirit of SamoanIrishman's question was not whether or not T4 would help but rather wouldn't T3 administration work better (since the body doesn't have to do any conversion and the built in physiological feedback loops exist to adjust TRH/TSH as needed)...thoughts?
Logically speaking, that does make perfect sense to me. And honestly I dont know why they dont prescribe t3 instead of t4 in the context you are speaking of. But I've not seen human grade t3 atleast in India. And all the hypothyroid people I've met, all have been prescribed t4. May be availability could be one of the reasons.
But there should be some concrete reason behind this. Only if some experts on the subject chime in....
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That would be cool if someone had a solid answer. My cousin is trying to get in shape and he can't run or do real cardio cause he is too heavy. I think like 330lbs. He has already lost about 20 and still losing as his diet and ECA morning stack are main contributors but he isn't losing fast enough in his opinion.
Long story short he wants to use T3 to help get him below 300 quickly so he can do more cardio without the knee and shin pain. Maybe even use it long term to get down to 250.
I don't know what to tell him since I've never been that heavy
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To be honest, if someone is over 300 pounds (not lean mass judging by the context of your post) then I think focusing on the fundamentals is more important than just throwing exogenous compounds at the problem.
Exogenous substances shouldn't be used as a crutch. Help your cousin lean how to structure a proper diet and training regimen and then focus on exogenous substances once the fundamentals are mastered...
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Yeah I've done the lecture..he's just impatient. Got him a George Foreman grill and veggie steamer and he is on the right path..averaging about 3-5lbs a week but I think he wants to speed it up a bit.
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That would be cool if someone had a solid answer. My cousin is trying to get in shape and he can't run or do real cardio cause he is too heavy. I think like 330lbs. He has already lost about 20 and still losing as his diet and ECA morning stack are main contributors but he isn't losing fast enough in his opinion.
Long story short he wants to use T3 to help get him below 300 quickly so he can do more cardio without the knee and shin pain. Maybe even use it long term to get down to 250.
I don't know what to tell him since I've never been that heavy
He shouldn't look for excuses. If he can't run he can walk. If he can't walk he can cycle. If he can't cycle he can swim. Whatever gets his heart rate up, and looking at a deli menu doesn't count.
Every minute he is exercizing is one minute less sitting on his ass, thinking about and being near food.
And T3 didn't do shit for me, so on that point I'd also recommend against it.
FYI: I was 315 and fat, so I do know what it is like.
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He shouldn't look for excuses. If he can't run he can walk. If he can't walk he can cycle. If he can't cycle he can swim. Whatever gets his heart rate up, and looking at a deli menu doesn't count.
Every minute he is exercizing is one minute less sitting on his ass, thinking about and being near food.
And T3 didn't do shit for me, so on that point I'd also recommend against it.
FYI: I was 315 and fat, so I do know what it is like.
yeah that's the speech I gave him but again he is just impatient..I'm going to show him your post. Being a former big dude should add credibility and help him get that it takes time to fix YEARS of self abuse via bad food decisions and habits. He is hard headed :)
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That would be cool if someone had a solid answer. My cousin is trying to get in shape and he can't run or do real cardio cause he is too heavy. I think like 330lbs. He has already lost about 20 and still losing as his diet and ECA morning stack are main contributors but he isn't losing fast enough in his opinion.
Long story short he wants to use T3 to help get him below 300 quickly so he can do more cardio without the knee and shin pain. Maybe even use it long term to get down to 250.
I don't know what to tell him since I've never been that heavy
hes full of bullshit.what he cant run.
im helping a bit a guy whos 400lbs to lose weight, and he does cardio daily.he can do pinfree cardio for 20 minutes a day,if not,then a 1 hr walk.this will help much more than any t3.
i know walking can be painfull the traps get a pump from just walking,but he has to do it.he has to.period.
bro,hes risking a heart failure with using fatburners.
he must get the mindset of eating much muchless.
the muscle he has under that fat,the whole body doesnt work properly until he starts to eat clean.and little.
it will be hell and the t3 wont make a difference.
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Yeah I told him and don't get me wrong his wife is making sure he is ACCURATELY recording his food intake (we agreed she'd keep him honest) and he does walk and swim he just wants to speed up the process.
The fact that he is so big I told him 3-5lbs (typically more toward the 5lbs end) a week is good fat loss. I think I should maybe motivate him with a little FUD (Fear Uncertainty and Doubt). Your point on blowing out his heart and maybe tell him that I know his family can't afford plastic surgery so if he loses too much fat to quick that he'll be an ugly wrinkled bag of hanging skin since his skin doesn't have time to tight up
I'm not sourcing him so if he does it ...its all him.
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Lost6 lbs eating whatever I want..I'm flat as a pancake but I m sticking with the plan
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He shouldn't look for excuses. If he can't run he can walk. If he can't walk he can cycle. If he can't cycle he can swim. Whatever gets his heart rate up, and looking at a deli menu doesn't count.
Every minute he is exercizing is one minute less sitting on his ass, thinking about and being near food.
And T3 didn't do shit for me, so on that point I'd also recommend against it.
FYI: I was 315 and fat, so I do know what it is like.
:o
how much you weigh now bro?
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:o
how much you weigh now bro?
not trying to start shit of he says he was fat I trust him. Why lie? Respect. he admitted it and is working to improve. It helps others that are big and want to BB but don't know how to start or feels like its not possible. I appreciate his comment for what its worth. A bit harsh but at least he can say he lived the reality vs. He read that shit in a magazine.
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Yeah I told him and don't get me wrong his wife is making sure he is ACCURATELY recording his food intake (we agreed she'd keep him honest) and he does walk and swim he just wants to speed up the process.
The fact that he is so big I told him 3-5lbs (typically more toward the 5lbs end) a week is good fat loss. I think I should maybe motivate him with a little FUD (Fear Uncertainty and Doubt). Your point on blowing out his heart and maybe tell him that I know his family can't afford plastic surgery so if he loses too much fat to quick that he'll be an ugly wrinkled bag of hanging skin since his skin doesn't have time to tight up
I'm not sourcing him so if he does it ...its all him.
tell him that doing cardio and moving around will be much more helpful than any fatburners.thatll accelerate things best.
he better gets used to doing it, if the mindset is "lazy mode" this wont give good results.
i know how it is, helping a similiar guy,but this one is truly motivated.
one good thing, ppl with so much fat have fast metabolism, bodyfat is an metalicaly active substance too, just 4 times less than muscle is.
but it add up, if the guy is moving around in any way,hes using a hsitton of energy, can realy lose weight fast.
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Full (and painful) disclosure:
At 315 Lbs (5'11") :-X
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2hi9w74.jpg)
At 195 Lbs about two years later. No roids, no clen, a bit of ECA (briefly, didn't like it), just biking and not eating like I was just released from Auschwitz. And just saying "no". Who gives a shit if it is someone's, or even your own, birthday? I'm not eating a piece of cake.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/r2oyhk.jpg)
Yes, still looks like shit. About 20 Lbs heavier now, most of it muscle. Not all of it, I'm no longer as delusional as I was back in the day. The excess skin with stretch marks will be with me for life, I'm afraid. Fun factoid: It's very hard to inject subcutaneous in my belly fat, because of the immense scarring of the stretch marks. ::)
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Dude let people talk trash but props man for taking back your life. You literally added years to your life man. I'll show him your pictures for motivation and that you have little loose skin but if he tried to lose too fast he would have way more which would require surgery.
Keep us posted man, id be interested in your progress ever 6 months or so
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Full (and painful) disclosure:
At 315 Lbs (5'11") :-X
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2hi9w74.jpg)
At 195 Lbs about two years later. No roids, no clen, a bit of ECA (briefly, didn't like it), just biking and not eating like I was just released from Auschwitz. And just saying "no". Who gives a shit if it is someone's, or even your own, birthday? I'm not eating a piece of cake.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/r2oyhk.jpg)
Yes, still looks like shit. About 20 Lbs heavier now, most of it muscle. Not all of it, I'm no longer as delusional as I was back in the day. The excess skin with stretch marks will be with me for life, I'm afraid. Fun factoid: It's very hard to inject subcutaneous in my belly fat, because of the immense scarring of the stretch marks. ::)
you DO NOT LOOK LIKE SHIT at all bro, that is a hell of a good job, wow, keep the results coming bro. Great Hustle right there.
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wow, phreak, this is an incredible tv worthy transformation brother.
you went from ugly fat swine with fat pouring from cheeks and uncountable chins to real handsome man with sqaure jaw,no homo, and you have lost about 2 stomachs, this is extremly impressive.
fucking hell in the before pics even your fingers were bloated ;D ;D
also, good muscle thickness, this is now a state where you know how they say "now were talkign"
brutal respect.
almost nobody in the world manages such a comeback,this is inspirational even to me.
you got yourself a new life.
i read some bs essays how lost fat comes back blabla, ofc itll come back if old habbits come back, but your trasnformation is proving the opposite.
keep always doing bit cardio bro, cardio keeps one from getting fat better than anything,in some ways.
and never ever fall into a bulking pattern, not even for muscle gains.
im not finding enough words for compliments.
8)
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btw, nate, not sure if youre still here or back on the other boarding ;D
but i wanted to point out, from what i remember when i ran t3 for too long(didnt use it in 10 years+), my thyroids would sweel and neck would hurt trerribly so bad that i had to go off and then it got better.
btw agree, the recovery after going off is easy,recovers fast and wuick and you feel better anyway with the flatness gone after going off
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you went from 315lbs of disgusting fatso slob to a good looking mofo...slight homo
good job mate in all honesty u saved your own life something not many obese people have the will poewer to do
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but i wanted to point out, from what i remember when i ran t3 for too long(didnt use it in 10 years+), my thyroids would sweel and neck would hurt trerribly so bad that i had to go off and then it got better.
btw agree, the recovery after going off is easy,recovers fast and wuick and you feel better anyway with the flatness gone after going off
Was this actually human grade thyroid medication that caused these symptoms?
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Thanks for the positive words everyone. :)
My weight loss is a three-phase program:
1. Lose a shit ton of weight (didn't care about muscle loss). This was finished successfully.
2. Gain back some amount of muscle, but not get heavier than 220 Lbs. Just finished this.
3. Lose fat, and only fat, down to 200 Lbs and stay there forever. This phase was started two days ago. Full-on galeniko diet, no T3. ;D
SamoanIrishman: get your protege to understand that 5 Lbs of weight loss per week is great. In fact looking back I would say that it is probably too fast, not too slow. My excess skin problems started at the initial rapid drop in weight (315 -> 265), but didn't get worse from 265 to 200.
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Was this actually human grade thyroid medication that caused these symptoms?
yes, some spanish company i think, was branded "triacana"
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That would be cool if someone had a solid answer. My cousin is trying to get in shape and he can't run or do real cardio cause he is too heavy. I think like 330lbs. He has already lost about 20 and still losing as his diet and ECA morning stack are main contributors but he isn't losing fast enough in his opinion.
Long story short he wants to use T3 to help get him below 300 quickly so he can do more cardio without the knee and shin pain. Maybe even use it long term to get down to 250.
I don't know what to tell him since I've never been that heavy
Patience is a virtue. He did not gain all that weight over night, nor will he lose it over night. Like husband phreak I lost a lot of weight. Despite having rheumatoid arthritis and despite a few prednison shots. I went from 97,5 kg (215 lbs) to 63,5 kg (140 lbs). So together we lost a complete adult in weight. ;D
It takes time, and it takes willpower. You can ALWAYS come up with an excuse not to exercise. Truth is, you can ALWAYS do some form of exercise, no matter how 'insignificant' it seems. Take the stairs instead of the elevator, walk or cycle instead of taking the car or the bus. Take baby steps if you need to, literally if that's what it takes!
Before I gained all this fat, I was diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis. Not exercising and emo binge eating made me whalish. Due to the arthritis I could not run, I could not cycle or walk very far, I could hardly climb a stair or even lift a pack of sugar. But I could walk little distances, I could swim a few laps. And every time I pushed myself to go a little further. I can now hike with a backpack for kilometers without effort, swim 80 laps in an hour without much effort and leg press more than the 'tough' guys in the gym. 8)
So don't come up with the bullshit that if you can't do a 'proper' cardio/training then it's not worth it!
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At 195 Lbs about two years later. No roids, no clen, a bit of ECA (briefly, didn't like it), just biking and not eating like I was just released from Auschwitz. And just saying "no". Who gives a shit if it is someone's, or even your own, birthday? I'm not eating a piece of cake.
A tip for big eaters: replace your dinner plate for a breakfast plate, and your breakfast plate for a dessert plate, or even smaller plates. Your meal looks bigger, tricking your mind you had a big fullfilling meal. Works for phreak (and me)... :D
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lol, did you read the book too, phreaks wife? ;D
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Thanks for the positive words everyone. :)
My weight loss is a three-phase program:
1. Lose a shit ton of weight (didn't care about muscle loss). This was finished successfully.
2. Gain back some amount of muscle, but not get heavier than 220 Lbs. Just finished this.
3. Lose fat, and only fat, down to 200 Lbs and stay there forever. This phase was started two days ago. Full-on galeniko diet, no T3. ;D
SamoanIrishman: get your protege to understand that 5 Lbs of weight loss per week is great. In fact looking back I would say that it is probably too fast, not too slow. My excess skin problems started at the initial rapid drop in weight (315 -> 265), but didn't get worse from 265 to 200.
Good looking out man ill let him know
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Keep a close watch on your blood pressure and heart rates.
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A tip for big eaters: replace your dinner plate for a breakfast plate, and your breakfast plate for a dessert plate, or even smaller plates. Your meal looks bigger, tricking your mind you had a big fullfilling meal. Works for phreak (and me)... :D
not a bad idea. ;)
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lol, did you read the book too, phreaks wife? ;D
Not yet, still on my reading list. But phreak gave me a summary and some excerpts.
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Great transformation phreak.
Good work!
8)
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Staying @ 50mcg a day lost 2 more pounds for a total of 7lbs
-
Full (and painful) disclosure:
At 315 Lbs (5'11") :-X
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2hi9w74.jpg)
At 195 Lbs about two years later. No roids, no clen, a bit of ECA (briefly, didn't like it), just biking and not eating like I was just released from Auschwitz. And just saying "no". Who gives a shit if it is someone's, or even your own, birthday? I'm not eating a piece of cake.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/r2oyhk.jpg)
Yes, still looks like shit. About 20 Lbs heavier now, most of it muscle. Not all of it, I'm no longer as delusional as I was back in the day. The excess skin with stretch marks will be with me for life, I'm afraid. Fun factoid: It's very hard to inject subcutaneous in my belly fat, because of the immense scarring of the stretch marks. ::)
Good stuff brother. Congrats.
And btw - you look like your av. 8)