Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Training Q&A => Topic started by: Donny on November 20, 2013, 10:39:06 AM
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anyone tried These? ;D
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anyone tried These? ;D
I would probably do it on smith machine...
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That exercise is an old standby for Olympic lifters (believe Russian or Eastern European lifters started that trend). Can also do it with an extra wide grip (snatch grip). The traps, as a short range muscle group, are very powerful. As most short range muscle groups are.
Sets up portions of the traps/upper back that is not usually hit well and can improve overhead balance. Might suggest using a stripped bar while learning this movement. ANd for higher reps to start.
Hise Shrugs are another excellent trap exercise. These including heavy selective deep breathing, done in higher reps (12-20+). Working into this exercise, can usually take the same weight (or more) as your squatting with. Really thickens the whole shoulder girdle, as well as the traps/neck. Another exceptional forgotten exercise. Hise Shrugs work well with the standing calf machine, where the padding on the shoulder yoke it make it easier on the shoulders. Hise Shrug's are an excellent growth exercise. Good Luck.
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totally useless imo
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Trains the serratus muscles
Good if you have a shitty overhead lockout
For serratus may as well just overhead press though
It's time that could be spent doing other shit
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Don't know if overhead shrugs would be a BB'ers first choice in trap exercises, or the benefits gained from it. Though anything is worth a try by most BB'ers. May be one persons great exercise, another persons failure..just have to experiment for yourself. It's a movement that has been around, over the years. Can't really say that nothing is useless until finding the affect it may have of you. Might surprise yourself.
Overhead press require help from the trap muscle group. Just holding a BB overhead and doing short lockouts/breaks (3 to 4 inches) improves the shoulder girdle (including traps) greatly. Doing a few reps of contracting the traps may be all the better for this exercise. Seen a few Olympic lifters doing this.
Even hanging from a horizontal bar and contracting the traps also has been done. Though limited in range, focus on squeezing the traps (not just the upper portion, but the middle to the lower ) together.
Personal view: best trap exercises are power cleans/Hi- pulls within a PR/boxes/platforms, etc.. DL's from a bit above knee height. While coming up, start a shrug/contraction of the traps. At the standing position the shoulder should be in a shrug position. Or at least a semi shrug position. BB'ers don't have to do DL's from the floor, unless they plan on entering PL'ing contest. Good Luck.
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Don't know if overhead shrugs would be a BB'ers first choice in trap exercises, or the benefits gained from it. Though anything is worth a try by most BB'ers. May be one persons great exercise, another persons failure..just have to experiment for yourself. It's a movement that has been around, over the years. Can't really say that nothing is useless until finding the affect it may have of you. Might surprise yourself.
Overhead press require help from the trap muscle group. Just holding a BB overhead and doing short lockouts/breaks (3 to 4 inches) improves the shoulder girdle (including traps) greatly. Doing a few reps of contracting the traps may be all the better for this exercise. Seen a few Olympic lifters doing this.
Even hanging from a horizontal bar and contracting the traps also has been done. Though limited in range, focus on squeezing the traps (not just the upper portion, but the middle to the lower ) together.
Personal view: best trap exercises are power cleans/Hi- pulls within a PR/boxes/platforms, etc.. DL's from a bit above knee height. While coming up, start a shrug/contraction of the traps. At the standing position the shoulder should be in a shrug position. Or at least a semi shrug position. BB'ers don't have to do DL's from the floor, unless they plan on entering PL'ing contest. Good Luck.
thoughts on slightly dynamic shrugging? i find a little knee bounce goes a long way
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Dynamic Shrugging....meaning very quick and full muscle contraction, at the top position, for the traps? Which would include knee/hip action. If so, than absolutely.
Power cleans would come under that heading, the higher the pull the better for trap involvement (better contraction). Even regular shrugs, done quickly and hard. A trap/shrug bar will allow a more natural hand grip (thumbs forward) and a more body straight up and in line position when doing the exercises. A regular BB can tend to pull the body (small of the back) forward, which may cause unneeded low back strain. When I have used a DB for shrugs, I alternate each arm one at a time. Find less drag/rub on my legs that way. If into doing only strict two handed DB shrugs, try sitting on a bench or even do the exercise on the knees. Does away with a lot of body English, if that bothers you.
The diamond shaped traps are like an brace (or ) anchor for the upper back and whole shoulder girdle. Even helping in BP'ing. Also when doing heavy squats; regular or front. Good Luck.
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yeah i agree jpm, shrugs are a rare movement where i prefer some body english all the time... i find that i get a heck of a lot more out of it than slow squeezing
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yeah i agree jpm, shrugs are a rare movement where i prefer some body english all the time... i find that i get a heck of a lot more out of it than slow squeezing
I use 9 plates a side for my shrugs
I just think about jumping as high as I can like I am trying to do a power clean. I go for sets of 2-3 reps and lots of them.
I am basically all traps, lats and shoulders
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I use 9 plates a side for my shrugs
I just think about jumping as high as I can like I am trying to do a power clean. I go for sets of 2-3 reps and lots of them.
I am basically all traps, lats and shoulders
that's a lot of weight bro... can be tough on the elbows... i assume that's on a trap machine? if you are putting 9 plates per side on a straight bar and you shrug with over 1mm of ROM then you are the world's strongest man
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So that's 855, if using a bar, for shrugs...Impressive. If a trap machine, also impressive, though the leverage can be a bit different. You using a trap bar by any chance? What rep range?
Know that some Olympic lifters (and strongmen lifters in general) have above 1000+. These are full shrugs. Seen a 900lbs shrug by a 181lb lifter once, in fairly good style. The bigger class guys', much more.
On most any contest Olympic lifter the whole chain of back muscles (lower to top) are unreal with regardes to thickness and depth of muscle. Getting that kick start, within reason, is just a part of the lift, if wanting to get the full potential of the shrug. Good Luck.
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that's a lot of weight bro... can be tough on the elbows... i assume that's on a trap machine? if you are putting 9 plates per side on a straight bar and you shrug with over 1mm of ROM then you are the world's strongest man
Nah regular bar
shrugs are difficult at first but your strength will rapidly increase. most people should be able to shrug their deadlift + 50% for sets of 10. Obviously there is some cheat but that's the whole point, you're developing all the muscles with this exercise from hip extension to lats, erectors and traps. Strict shrugs do nothing for me. I can do 20x180kg very strict but it does nothing for my traps or my deadlift. Shrugs need to be done heavy imo plus they are fun as hell
Check out Jamie Lewis' videos. +1000lb shrugs lol. Huge traps
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superset DB shrugs and Close grip BB upright rows... the Overhead shrug is a bit awkward for me.
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Nah regular bar
shrugs are difficult at first but your strength will rapidly increase. most people should be able to shrug their deadlift + 50% for sets of 10. Obviously there is some cheat but that's the whole point, you're developing all the muscles with this exercise from hip extension to lats, erectors and traps. Strict shrugs do nothing for me. I can do 20x180kg very strict but it does nothing for my traps or my deadlift. Shrugs need to be done heavy imo plus they are fun as hell
Check out Jamie Lewis' videos. +1000lb shrugs lol. Huge traps
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what do those 18 plates weigh? you are talking about shrugging 910 right?
910 is a shitload for full rom shrugs
not saying it didnt happen
but video would lend some credibility
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what do those 18 plates weigh? you are talking about shrugging 910 right?
910 is a shitload for full rom shrugs
not saying it didnt happen
but video would lend some credibility
lot of strong men on getbig... ;D ;)
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lot of strong men on getbig... ;D ;)
strong in print & scent for sure
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what do those 18 plates weigh? you are talking about shrugging 910 right?
910 is a shitload for full rom shrugs
not saying it didnt happen
but video would lend some credibility
They are 20kg plates and bar, so 380kg or 835lb
I don't really film my shrugs lol, would be weird. I actually broke my straps in my last shrugging session so have more on order. Then I have a meet on 13th of December and after that I am working on getting more shredded. I'll try and get some sort of video of heavy ass shrugs in for you but I doubt I'll be hitting 9 plates again for a few months. But I'll post some videos up for sure!
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They are 20kg plates and bar, so 380kg or 835lb
I don't really film my shrugs lol, would be weird. I actually broke my straps in my last shrugging session so have more on order. Then I have a meet on 13th of December and after that I am working on getting more shredded. I'll try and get some sort of video of heavy ass shrugs in for you but I doubt I'll be hitting 9 plates again for a few months. But I'll post some videos up for sure!
835 is heavy... when i used to compete i never used straps (can't use them in a meet).... when i shrugged i used to use an alternate grip and switch hands every few reps
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Sounds like a great way to tear a biceps lol
I've torn both mine shrugging previously, couldn't imagine doing them mixed. They are a great exercise, easily my favourite after the BTN push press
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Sounds like a great way to tear a biceps lol
I've torn both mine shrugging previously, couldn't imagine doing them mixed. They are a great exercise, easily my favourite after the BTN push press
i don't use straps... IMO the use of assists like straps, wraps, belts, shirts and pants (anything that grips the weight or compresses your body) puts you at a far greater risk of injury because you joints, tendons and ligaments never really adapt to the weight...
of course these days i typically do not shrug over 225... i do marathon sets though finishing with a few explosive sets... have had issues with elbows and biceps tendons in the past (inflammation) but currently i am healthy as a horse
i only do shrugs once per week... what i do is unorthodox but it works for me... i do one giant set with a rest timer... i start with 1 rep, 30s rest, then 2, 30s rest, then 3, etc.... never more than 30s rest until i fail... when i fail to increase the reps by 1 i rest for about 3 minutes and finish with burnout sets at 225 and then 135....
my traps are pretty sick but more to the point my upper back and shoulders are functionally very strong... this aligns with my current goals
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Wooo is doing the the old Rest-Pause system, which I highly endorse (for whatever value that may have..do what you wish). The usually pause between reps is 10 to 12 seconds, sometimes 15 seconds but never more. Written about my use (and others) of R-P for quite a while now.
For the average trainee; if using 225 for shrugs, say for 10 reps for regular sets, with the Rest-Pause system one could be using around 250+ for those 10 reps. Allowing that 10 to 12 second pause between each rep. Tend to gain strength very fast with this method. The next shrug workout might find the reps going up to 14 to 15 easily. This method works well with benches, DL's, etc.. BB curls adapt well with this system.
Straps will allow that extra demand on the muscles being worked. If doing DL's, shrugs, rows, etc and the grip gives out at 5 reps without straps,and you know your good for another 2 to 3 reps, this is where straps become the most useful, allowing the full potential of getting the most from a set. Works well with weighted chins also. Don't want to depend on straps all the time, the grip needs heavier resistance, but for the last set(s) where the poundage is the greatest..by all means.And the grip tends to catch up to the heavier weight. I prefer the nylon ones (told the basic same material as seat/airline belts. Cotton ones (like martial arts belt material) tend to snap/tear when you need them the most.
Straps also work well when doing the overload principle, with regards to any type of pulls.. Where the ligaments and tendons can be strengthen through heavier work. Even standing, while holding a heavier load than what the body is accustomed to, increases the ligament/tendon and muscle strength. If doing 500 for a one rep DL ,try adding a 100 lbs, taking it from a PR and just holding for 10 seconds. Shrugs should also go up with this method. As do 3 to 4 inch lockouts when doing benches and other pushing movements.
Some guys will alternate the over/under grip when doing shrug, though mostly for DL's. Over/unders insure a better grip and rolling out of the bar without straps. If doing the Jefferson lift (another great overlooked exercise) than a alternate grip is required each set or
workout.
The above is for BB'ing purposes. Serious PL'ers and Olympic lifters training methods may be different. Good Luck.
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i do similar rest/increasing reps with bench/pull ups/KB swings and a few other movements... different rest intervals for each movement based on experience
i use this method because it allows me to get far more total reps than i would otherwise so i consider it akin to an overload training method without risk to my joints
as an example i failed at 18 reps on bench at 225 this week... so that means i did 1-2-3-4-5-6....17-18 reps... total was something like 170 reps.... failed on the 171st.... but realistically 225 is not heavy so while i was burned i felt pretty good...
i vary movement orders by week so sometimes i stronger or not as strong but it's really irrelevant because i am getting to failure...
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I use them for shrugs, simply because it's impossible to hold the weight without them. I enjoy them!
You still need to hold onto the bar and hold the wraps tight
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I use them for shrugs, simply because it's impossible to hold the weight without them. I enjoy them!
You still need to hold onto the bar and hold the wraps tight
bro... i have pulled more without than with after years of not using
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So?
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So?
so
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shrugs are not a grip contest lol, no-one cares if you shrugged 500lb for 20 reps and tore all your calluses off (although you'll just use a paper towel and continue anyway)
nothing wrong with straps at all imo
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I was never a huge fan of shrugs. My traps grow from heavy deadlifts and rowing. BUT... this does not mean I never do them. My main problem is ROM and how blurred it becomes as you go up in weight. You warm up and by the time you get to your work sets the ROM is cut in half and you hardly noticed it as you were warming up.
I have gotten results from shrugs from using straps and doing one heavy set of 8-12 reps with 405-455lbs, I have also gotten results from them doing 3 sets of 10 with 335lbs double overhand grip no straps. When I ditch the straps I can't go nearly as heavy but my ROM is better, when I put the straps on and use more weight I still feel the exercise in my traps despite the shorter ROM.
Next time I put shrugs into my routine I am going to experiment doing one heavy set of 6-10 reps without straps, then with the same weight on the bar do another set with straps for as many reps as possible. This way I don't go too heavy and use less ROM, and still get the benefit of not worrying about my grip and just going for max reps with straps on the second set.
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Might also consider Wave training/Wave loading as an option if wanting to go light (higher reps) and heavy (lowing reps) using the same movement, in the same group of sets. Wave loading has been around for a good amount of years, though mostly for strength training., but also functional for BB'ing.
basic example:
Bench press...taking the average weight of 220 for 8 good reps. Never going to failure. Feel free to apply this same idea to traps or any other exercises. Works very well with squats & DL's.
220....1 X 8
250....1 X 5
220....1 X 8...this will feel much lighter from the first set, but stay with the original 220.
250....1 X 5..may feel a bit taxing
220....1 X 8 or as many reps above 8 that you can....without approaching failure.
May take a couple of workouts to select you starting weights. Everyone is not going to respond the same way. Remembering these are just example weights.
For power....bench again. Never going to failure.
260...1 X 3
285...1 X 1
260...1 X 3
285...1 X 1
260...1 X 3
Some guy's will add weight from set to sets (usually 5lbs, or so), some will stay at the original weights throughout.
Quite a few different approaches to Wave loading, might want to do a search if interested.
Good Luck.