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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Chick on November 13, 2007, 09:46:58 PM
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MINUTES Of the Annual Meeting of the IFBB Professional Committee
Thursday, September 27, 2007
Salon B, Orleans Hotel, Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
ITEM DESCRIPTION ACTION
I The meeting was called to order at 4:00pm by Jim Manion, Chairman, IFBB Professional League.
II The roll call was taken; the following members were present:
NAME COUNTRY POSITION
Jim Manion USA Chairman
Jim Rockell USA Men’s Representative
Sandy Williamson USA Women’s Representative
Rob Wilkins USA Athlete Liaison (the Americas)
Pawel Filleborn Poland Athlete Liaison (Europe)
Steve Weinberger USA Promoter Representative
Rick Collins USA Legal Advisor
Bob Cicherillo USA Athlete Representative
Betty Pariso USA Athlete Representative
Jen Hendershott USA Athlete Representative
Jenny Lynn USA Athlete Representative
III The previous minutes of September 27, 2006 were read into the record. ADOPTED
PROPOSALS
IV A proposal from Betty Pariso that there be three Ms. Olympia qualifying spots for smaller shows [two-category competitions].
[Explanatory note: Currently, for any one-category female bodybuilding competition except the Ms. Olympia and Ms. International, the top 3 finalists qualify for the next Ms. Olympia. Where there are two categories, the top finalist in each category qualifies.]
REJECTED
V. A proposal from Betty Pariso that the use of props in female bodybuilding competition be permitted.
[Explanatory note: Currently, the use of props in bodybuilding competition is prohibited.]
REJECTED
VI. A proposal from Betty Pariso that the “desired look” for female bodybuilding be formalized in writing as part of the IFBB Pro Rules.
[Explanatory note: After some discussion, the committee held the majority opinion that the judges were already shaping the look for female bodybuilding with the winners they choose and therefore, there was no need for additional criteria other than what is currently expressed in the Pro Rules.]
REJECTED
VII. A proposal from Jenny Lynn regarding the release of contact information of Athlete-Members to the Athlete Representatives.
[Explanatory note: The IFBB Pro League office will ensure that the Athlete Representatives are provided wth up-to-date contact information.]
ADOPTED
VIII. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that athletes be required to have a written contract, signed and approved, no later than 8 weeks prior to the date of the competition.
[Modification: Athletes will be required to have a written contract postmarked no later than 6 weeks prior to the date of the competition. Contracts received after the due date will be subject to a US $500 late fee to the promoter.]
ADOPTED with modification
IX. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that athletes with a signed contract 8 weeks from the date of competition will receive a US $1,000 fee on cancellation of the competition any time prior to the original date set.
[Modification: Athletes with a signed contract 6 weeks from the date of the competition will split the sanction money on deposit at the time of the cancellation upon the cancellation of the competition any time prior to original date set.]
ADOPTED with modification
X. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that the “Under 210-lb” class receive one Olympia qualifying spot.
REJECTED
XI. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that all IFBB Pro League cards will be renewed by annually by January 1st. Any card renewed after this deadline, and before February 1st, will have an additional US $100 fee attached. Renewals received after February 28th will be doubled, based on the original cost.
[Modification: All IFBB Pro League cards will be renewed (postmarked) annually by January 15th. Any card renewed after this date will cost the athlete US $400.]
ADOPTED with modification
XII. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo to reduce the “Under 210-lb” class to “Under 202 lbs”.
[Explanatory note: This is not a division into two categories of a men’s bodybuilding competition. The promoter, with the approval of the IFBB Pro League, may elect to open a separate competition for those competitors who are under 202 lbs.]
ADOPTED
OTHER BUSINESS
XIII. The following Other Business was briefly discussed:
1. Where possible, the individual judge’s scores should be listed in the contest results reported at www.IFBBPRO.com
2. The fine of US $1,000 for athletes who withdraw from a competition without a legitimate medical reason, as certified by a physician accepted by the IFBB Pro League, will be enforced.
3. In future, Athlete Meeting times will be approved by the IFBB Pro League and will be published at www.IFBBPRO.com for each event.
4. In future, the IFBB Pro League will publish at www.IFBBPRO.com comprehensive contest information, including an updated competitor list.
5. The members voted to reject the request for reinstatement from Lee Priest.
XIV. There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 5:00pm.
Minutes
Recorded by:
Jim Rockell Men’s Representative
Minutes Transcribed by:
Tony Blinn General Secretary
Minutes Approved by:
Jim Manion Chairman
Minutes Approved by:
Ben Weider, OC, CStJ, QC, PhD
President
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nice to see they shitted on all of betty pariso's ideas
I personally think that the props during the womens routines "add something"
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Where's Goatboy... (wait for it)
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What did Jen Hendershott wear to the meeting?
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nice to see they shitted on all of betty pariso's ideas
I personally think that the props during the womens routines "add something"
I was all for props being used for the women, just not the men.....they decided to keep it uniform with all BB.
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I was all for props being used for the women, just not the men.....they decided to keep it uniform with all BB.
Same here I like it with the women, plus they need all the added stuff that they can to get some crowds goin to their shows.
Hey Bob how about something with not giving out so many damn figure pro cards, its just getting rediculous. Tell Jenny Lynn about that one please
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Same here I like it with the women, plus they need all the added stuff that they can to get some crowds goin to their shows.
Hey Bob how about something with not giving out so many damn figure pro cards, its just getting rediculous. Tell Jenny Lynn about that one please
LOL....I hear ya.
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Is there a fine line between a prop and part of the posing outfit? For example, the robot suit that Kamali had, the Moses outfit of Ronnie's, the recent lion debacle of Kai Greene...are these considered outfits?
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Is there a fine line between a prop and part of the posing outfit? For example, the robot suit that Kamali had, the Moses outfit of Ronnie's, the recent lion debacle of Kai Greene...are these considered outfits?
AS long as your "outfit" consists of a pair of posing trunks...you're good to go.
Guestposing is up to the individual.....
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hey chic.................... ........what do you think of Kai posing as a lion? lollololol.............. .....gayest thing ive ever seen. wow
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Not my cup of tea, but to each their own...personally, I like the high energy guest posing routines much better.
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5. The members voted to reject the request for reinstatement from Lee Priest
:(
>:(
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gr8 job chick
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XII. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo to reduce the “Under 210-lb” class to “Under 202 lbs”.
[Explanatory note: This is not a division into two categories of a men’s bodybuilding competition. The promoter, with the approval of the IFBB Pro League, may elect to open a separate competition for those competitors who are under 202 lbs.]
ADOPTED
Bob, why not apply for the Under/Over 202 lbs as part of a single show (ala Olympia 1974-79) ? it would give the smaller/shorter guys more credit and gives the fans the entertainment of seeing the winners from each class go head to head at the end of the night for the overall title. i personally think this is what bbing needs, to shed more light where it should go and spread the glory/wealth around.
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I like the whole 202 lb class movement, too bad the Olympia invite didn't get adopted.
I don't like all the fines and contracts placed upon the athletes. Where's the fines/contracts for the promoters? Why aren't they fined for cancelling shows or failing to pay the winners.
The only thing that's going to come from the contract fees are hilarious photos of bodybuilders who completely fuck up their prep but can't afford the $1000 fee so they go on stage looking like shit.
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This says SO MUCH about the current state of problems with judging in the IFBB.
VI. A proposal from Betty Pariso that the “desired look” for female bodybuilding be formalized in writing as part of the IFBB Pro Rules.
REJECTED
The problem is the judging isn't consistent, so that's why they want it in writing. Also, without having it in writing, how can anyone ever prove that the judges didn't follow the rules? Of course they can't because there are no rules.
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Wow they should webcast this...looks like soo much fun there ::)
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I like the whole 202 lb class movement, too bad the Olympia invite didn't get adopted.
I don't like all the fines and contracts placed upon the athletes. Where's the fines/contracts for the promoters? Why aren't they fined for cancelling shows or failing to pay the winners.
The only thing that's going to come from the contract fees are hilarious photos of bodybuilders who completely fuck up their prep but can't afford the $1000 fee so they go on stage looking like shit.
Like this?
IX. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that athletes with a signed contract 8 weeks from the date of competition will receive a US $1,000 fee on cancellation of the competition any time prior to the original date set.
[Modification: Athletes with a signed contract 6 weeks from the date of the competition will split the sanction money on deposit at the time of the cancellation upon the cancellation of the competition any time prior to original date set.]
ADOPTED with modification
BTW,for those that didn't know...I got the "fine" reduced from $5,000 to $1,000.
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Bob, anything about JUDGING?
Proposal to judge with common sense and open eyes - REJECTED?
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Like this?
IX. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that athletes with a signed contract 8 weeks from the date of competition will receive a US $1,000 fee on cancellation of the competition any time prior to the original date set.
[Modification: Athletes with a signed contract 6 weeks from the date of the competition will split the sanction money on deposit at the time of the cancellation upon the cancellation of the competition any time prior to original date set.]
ADOPTED with modification
BTW,for those that didn't know...I got the "fine" reduced from $5,000 to $1,000.
My bad, I completely misread or missed that part. I just pulled an all nighter for an exam and I was in desperate need of caffeine when i logged into getbig. Nice done, suit. ;D
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Bob, anything about JUDGING?
Proposal to judge with common sense and open eyes - REJECTED?
bumped for direct clarity
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Bob, anything about JUDGING?
Proposal to judge with common sense and open eyes - REJECTED?
LOL...nope.
Let's see what unfolds for the I.M...........more comparisons than last year I'm guessing..!
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I don't like all the fines and contracts placed upon the athletes. Where's the fines/contracts for the promoters? Why aren't they fined for cancelling shows or failing to pay the winners.
The only thing that's going to come from the contract fees are hilarious photos of bodybuilders who completely fuck up their prep but can't afford the $1000 fee so they go on stage looking like shit.
So, are you saying that a potential side effect of Bob's new policies will be to decrease the value of the product that ends up onstage?
No, that can't be true, because that would hurt the sport.
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So, are you saying that a potential side effect of Bob's new policies will be to decrease the value of the product that ends up onstage?
No, that can't be true, because that would hurt the sport.
HUH?
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5. The members voted to reject the request for reinstatement from Lee Priest.
that just sucks >:(
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props on the cancellation fee chick. thats a good step forward. a very small step. but its something.
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What did Jen Hendershott wear to the meeting?
Her nun-bananna-bondage outfit...
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Ben Weider, OC, CStJ, QC, PhD
President
where's Raphael Santoja... ??? ???
Ben Retired...
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5. The members voted to reject the request for reinstatement from Lee Priest.
Let it go, already. Year suspension, my ass.
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IX. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that athletes with a signed contract 8 weeks from the date of competition will receive a US $1,000 fee on cancellation of the competition any time prior to the original date set.
[Modification: Athletes with a signed contract 6 weeks from the date of the competition will split the sanction money on deposit at the time of the cancellation upon the cancellation of the competition any time prior to original date set.]
ADOPTED with modification
Translation:
In future no IFBB Pro bodybuilder will be contracted to compete in a pro show any further out than 4 weeks from the show in order that promoters can still cancel shows without notice.
The Luke
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5. The members voted to reject the request for reinstatement from Lee Priest.
Did anyone vote for reinstating?
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the fines and penalties are still ridiculous and outrageous. I guess bodybuilding is only for the wealthy now. WHo can afford to loss 1000 dollars here 400 dollars there. Sounds like they are running a bank rather than an organization for hard working and financially strapped athletes.
When in doubt rip off the middle class.
ANd if Betty Periso had the forethought not to use the word "desired" she might have had a chance. You would think people in these positions would no the importance of symantecs and the benefit of running by your proposals with a public relations expert.
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the fines and penalties are still ridiculous and outrageous. I guess bodybuilding is only for the wealthy now. WHo can afford to loss 1000 dollars here 400 dollars there. Sounds like they are running a bank rather than an organization for hard working and financially strapped athletes.
When in doubt rip off the middle class.
ANd if Betty Periso had the forethought not to use the word "desired" she might have had a chance. You would think people in these positions would no the importance of symantecs and the benefit of running by your proposals with a public relations expert.
Who can afford it? Someone that can afford to get their paperwork in late...
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Who can afford it? Someone that can afford to get their paperwork in late...
It is still an outrageous penalty fee. I hope the IFBB never runs a bank.
step in line boy...respect my athouritah!!
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The IFBB needs to hire some better spin doctors - the current crop (Ron et al) is woefully out-gunned here.
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What did Jen Hendershott wear to the meeting?
I'll bet if Jenny Lynn had worn this, her idea wouldn't have been rejected.
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It's a damn shame not reinstate Lee Priest. The guy has paid his dues under that suspension. It's not coherent to reinstate WBFers and keep on punishing Priest.
IFBB is the crookest sports organization of them all. Probably even more corrupt than IOC. I mean, to have a guy like Paul Chua dealing the cards in a top position at the federation, at the same time all these accusations against him are floating on the air speaks volumes about how business is conducted amongst them. The minimum the IFBB council could do is to drop Chua temporarily from his position to investigate and clear the air about his wrongdoings accusations. It's a police case, authorities should handle the situation.
Until when are we going to keep watching the IFBB hammer being dropped over the heads of the likes of Milos, Priest and such, while not even the lightest accusation of contest fixing in Asia keeps non-checked??
Power, Corruption and Lies.........as always.
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5. The members voted to reject the request for reinstatement from Lee Priest.
Did anyone vote for reinstating?
I wonder how Bob Chick voted on this one? ::)
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It's a damn shame not reinstate Lee Priest. The guy has paid his dues under that suspension. It's not coherent to reinstate WBFers and keep on punishing Priest.
IFBB is the crookest sports organization of them all. Probably even more corrupt than IOC. I mean, to have a guy like Paul Chua dealing the cards in a top position at the federation, at the same time all these accusations against him are floating on the air speaks volumes about how business is conducted amongst them. The minimum the IFBB council could do is to drop Chua temporarily from his position to investigate and clear the air about his wrongdoings accusations. It's a police case, authorities should handle the situation.
Until when are we going to keep watching the IFBB hammer being dropped over the heads of the likes of Milos, Priest and such, while not even the lightest accusation of contest fixing in Asia keeps non-checked??
Power, Corruption and Lies.........as always.
It's a damn shame that Lee didn't take the reinstatment when it was offered to him...
"He who hesitates is lost"
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I wonder how Bob Chick voted on this one? ::)
I would have voted for reinstatment...unfortuna tely, it was already 10-0 by the time it got to me.
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It's a damn shame that Lee didn't take the reinstatment when it was offered to him...
"He who hesitates is lost"
It was offered to him knowing full well he had already signed a contract to compete in the NOC in September. I guess Bob only has a problem with Athletes breaking show contracts if they're IFBB shows, huh? ::)
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I would have voted for reinstatment...unfortuna tely, it was already 10-0 by the time it got to me.
So, you decided to add a "me too" vote? :D
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It was offered to him knowing full well he had already signed a contract to compete in the NOC in September. I guess Bob only has a problem with Athletes breaking show contracts if they're IFBB shows, huh? ::)
One of the dumbest things i've seen from you....
Why on Gods green earth would the IFBB give a shit about a contract he had with a RIVAL federation....the very one he's being suspended for being a part of in the first place?
Were they supposed to give consideration for this??
Quit while you're ahead...you're making a fool of yourself
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How did you vote, cich? inquiring minds would like to know.
Did you change your mind on the spot and vote for no reinstatement, or did you take a stand like a man and make it 10-1?
what did you do?
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One of the dumbest things i've seen from you....
Why on Gods green earth would the IFBB give a shit about a contract he had with a RIVAL federation....the very one he's being suspended for being a part of in the first place?
Were they supposed to give consideration for this??
Quit while you're ahead...you're making a fool of yourself
They knew Lee would want to honor the commitment he had made to Wayne to do the September show, so they purposely made the offer early knowing full well he couldn't take it at that time. He was suspended for 12 months. Why say to him, "come back at 10 months, or you can't come back in 12 months when your suspension is over"?
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why should the IFBB give a fuck about what Lee's commitments were, goatboy?
and since when did lee get a reputation for doing the honorable thing? doing the interesting thing, perhaps . . .
How did you vote, cich? inquiring minds would like to know.
Did you change your mind on the spot and vote for no reinstatement, or did you take a stand like a man and make it 10-1?
what did you do?
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why should the IFBB give a fuck about what Lee's commitments were, goatboy?
and since when did lee get a reputation for doing the honorable thing? doing the interesting thing, perhaps . . .
I'm saying, their timing was on purpose to paint him into a corner. He was suspended for 12 months. Why ask him to come back early or don't come back at all? The issue should not have come up until the 12 months had run, unless there were ulterior motives.
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I'm saying, their timing was on purpose to paint him into a corner. He was suspended for 12 months. Why ask him to come back early or don't come back at all? The issue should not have come up until the 12 months had run, unless there were ulterior motives.
of course there were ulterior motives . . . are you turning into a flower child suddenly? why would they not try to steal the PDI's main attraction? it's the sensible thing to do.
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1. Where possible, the individual judge’s scores should be listed in the contest results reported at www.IFBBPRO.com
Great idea
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They knew Lee would want to honor the commitment he had made to Wayne to do the September show, so they purposely made the offer early knowing full well he couldn't take it at that time. He was suspended for 12 months. Why say to him, "come back at 10 months, or you can't come back in 12 months when your suspension is over"?
THe offer was made because LEE (alledgedly) wanted to come back....HE was the one who made overtures to come back knowing full well he had commitments to the other fed.....then turned it down.
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of course there were ulterior motives . . . are you turning into a flower child suddenly? why would they not try to steal the PDI's main attraction? it's the sensible thing to do.
Lee Priest has made his reputation through the IFBB. HE DECIDED TO LEAVE and during that time forcefully pointed to the IFBB problems. His arrogance, impulsive decision making and lack of professionalism were obvious. He must accept the consequences of his own actions. He knew well of the risks involved and decided to take it.
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Lee Priest has made his reputation through the IFBB. HE DECIDED TO LEAVE and during that time forcefully pointed to the IFBB problems. His arrogance, impulsive decision making and lack of professionalism were obvious. He must accept the consequences of his own actions. He knew well of the risks involved and decided to take it.
the bottom line is it's fuckin stupid for a federation that's struggling to put asses in seats to kick out one of it's bigger draws for personal reasons. they should have penalized him financially, and let him compete.
see the NFL for a primer on how to run a business where a lot of your stars are socio/psychopaths.
to borrow a flowerism.
IFBB = st00pid.
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the bottom line is it's fuckin stupid for a federation that's struggling to put asses in seats to kick out one of it's bigger draws for personal reasons. they should have penalized him financially, and let him compete.
see the NFL for a primer on how to run a business where a lot of your stars are socio/psychopaths.
to borrow a flowerism.
IFBB = st00pid.
The Bottom line is ....Lee Priest forgot rule number one of Business...EVERONE IS REPLACEBLE .... yep..even Lee Priest....
Lee is a Great competitor and a Legend ....but definitely will not be remember for his decision making....And I am not even talking about that face tattoo ;)
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XI. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that all IFBB Pro League cards will be renewed by annually by January 1st. Any card renewed after this deadline, and before February 1st, will have an additional US $100 fee attached. Renewals received after February 28th will be doubled, based on the original cost.
[Modification: All IFBB Pro League cards will be renewed (postmarked) annually by January 15th. Any card renewed after this date will cost the athlete US $400.]
ADOPTED with modification
Why did you propose to fine your athletes if they are late with their fees?
I understand the IFBB tries to organise their structure but why did you propose this as this is not exactly in favor of the athletes you're representing or is it? What is the bigger picture I'm missing?
You answered:
In reference to paying your dues as of Jan 15th....it's the PRO league...you're either in or your not. We had shows where we don't even know if a particular athlete has paid for his card, is current, etc....this aint the NPC where you can sign up on the spot. Without a line-up, we don't even know who to send info to...it's called being a PRO, being RESPONSIBLE as a professional, like every other aspect in life....you renew you drivers license whenever you want? How about your property taxes? Tell them you'll pay in July....
I understand this and you're making a good point, but why did you propose for those fees being that high?
Are these minutes being mailed to all I(nternational) F(ederation) BB pros in 2 or 3 different/other languages, so ALL of the international athletes understand that there is a high late fee attached to this now?
$400 in poor Russia/Serbia can be a different story for the involved athlete then $400 in the US.
I hope these athletes understand what is written here in english or at least they get the message in time.
How will they be notified of these minutes?
Do they know these minutes are posted on the ifbb website?
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The Bottom line is ....Lee Priest forgot rule number one of Business...EVERONE IS REPLACEBLE ....
But the IFBB isn't a business... it's a non-profit federation that exists to promote and grow the sport of bodybuilding.
(or so they tell the IRS. ;))
::)
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They are fucking hypocrites, that's what they are.
Monster bending, twisting and contorting the rules to be interpreted by their convenience.
After hearing a lot of crooked shit going on over the years, one has to wonder where is all the love for the sport and the athletes that motivated the IFBB founding fathers to start the organization? Did it ever exist, to begin with?
Or let's say, one day young uncle Joe fell outta bed and was struck by a ray of cleverness and inspiration and thought: "Hey, why not create a sport where I could start a professional organization that, at the same time, I could use as a network to spread my magazines and worthless powder supplements? All the while giving my brother a top position job running the show so I don't get accused to run the game 'cause it's my ball, afterall. In the meantime, I offer an oportunity for these lazy bums that will be called bodybuilders a chance to make some dime in what would possibly be a poor existance, eventhough they will risk their necks using drugs?? In the end I still can profit on them, as well, and also end up getting all my fantasies satisfied by them.
Wow, I'm the fucking mannnn.......Hey, Beeeeeeeeeeeennnnnn...co me up here....I'm thinking on something....."
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But the IFBB isn't a business... it's a non-profit federation that exists to promote and grow the sport of bodybuilding.
(or so they tell the IRS. ;))
::)
Hey... I wonder if the American Red Cross blackballs their volunteers for disloyalty if they occasionally volunteer at the Salvation Army as well? :D
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Hey... I wonder if the American Red Cross blackballs their volunteers for disloyalty if they occasionally volunteer at the Salvation Army as well? :D
LOL!!
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Hey, I have an idea.... I'm going to buy a hotel, and hire 30 maids to clean the rooms. But I'm not going to pay them. Instead of a wage, what I'll do is hold a daily contest to determine the cleanest rooms. The maid who did the 1st place cleanest room will get $200, second place will get $150, third will get $100, 4th will get $75, fifth will get $25, sixth will get $10, and the other 24 maids will be "out of the money" that day.
In addition, if any of the maids who don't do well enough to make a living through my generously giving them "the opportunity to win money" decide to clean rooms somewhere else on their day off to supplement their incomes, they're fired! >:(
Nothing wrong with that, right? :D
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If the maids know these rules in advance and still are willing to sign the contract when you hire them taking the chance on winning some or nothing, then there is nothing wrong with firing them indeed if they break that rule which they sign for when they are hired.
Good going, boss! :D
Can I judge?
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If the maids know these rules in advance and still are willing to sign the contract when you hire them taking the chance on winning some or nothing, then there is nothing wrong with firing them indeed if they break that rule which they sign for when they are hired.
Good going, boss! :D
Can I judge?
Okay, let's say I currently own all the hotels in the world, and I use this tactic in order to maintain my monopoly position and stifle competition. Would I not be in violation of anti-trust laws?
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Hey, I have an idea.... I'm going to buy a hotel, and hire 30 maids to clean the rooms. But I'm not going to pay them. Instead of a wage, what I'll do is hold a daily contest to determine the cleanest rooms. The maid who did the 1st place cleanest room will get $200, second place will get $150, third will get $100, 4th will get $75, fifth will get $25, sixth will get $10, and the other 24 maids will be "out of the money" that day.
In addition, if any of the maids who don't do well enough to make a living through my generously giving them "the opportunity to win money" decide to clean rooms somewhere else on their day off to supplement their incomes, they're fired! >:(
Nothing wrong with that, right? :D
Pro Bodybuilding is like Freelance modeling. You get paid only if you look the way your employer wants you to look and if you don't look the part, you get nothing and lose the fare you paid to get to the audition...
Sadly, since 97% of these so-called pros aren't really too good at arguing (Besides Milos or Lee), none of them will make it a point to refute this recent rule that has been added about paying that damn late fee.
I don't know Robert Michael, this might not go down too well with your fellow pros...
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Okay, let's say I currently own all the hotels in the world, and I use this tactic in order to maintain my monopoly position and stifle competition. Would I not be in violation of anti-trust laws?
maybe if you're old man bought ya j i joes as a kid instead of barbie dolls you would'nt give a shit about what naked men are doing on stage or worrying about how they're gettin treated financially ?
;D
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Pro Bodybuilding is like Freelance modeling. You get paid only if you look the way your employer wants you to look and if you don't look the part, you get nothing and lose the fare you paid to get to the audition...
Freelance models can work for whomever they want, and don't get blackballed for working for "unapproved" designers. There's no monopoly power in modeling. The same can't be said for bodybuilding.
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maybe if you're old man bought ya j i joes as a kid instead of barbie dolls you would'nt give a shit about what naked men are doing on stage or worrying about how they're gettin treated financially ?
;D
I don't give a shit. I just like arguing... you know that. ::)
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Okay, let's say I currently own all the hotels in the world, and I use this tactic in order to maintain my monopoly position and stifle competition. Would I not be in violation of anti-trust laws?
Nothing stops the competition to lure the maids from your hotel.
Up to them to make it as attractive as possible for the best maids that wanted to sign the contract at your hotels.
But here is where I agree with you: why not let the maids come back once they found out that the grass is not greener on the other side? Why keep punishing them for leaving your hotel, talking smack about it etc?
They, wanting to come back obviously regret talking smack and leaving you otherwise they wouldn't want to come back.
You telling them to stay away for a year is punishment, then after the year telling them not to come back at all is a bit harsh.
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What would you have to talk about in the peanut gallery if there wasn't the IFBB? Daddywaddy's photos and True Adonis Principles. ::)
The IFBB and NPC provide a platform for people to compete. No one is forcing anyone to participate or follow it. If you don't like it go over the the WABBA DABBA DOODA orgs.
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In case anyone was wondering...
Geo washes cars for a living! :o
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Why did you propose to fine your athletes if they are late with their fees?
I understand the IFBB tries to organise their structure but why did you propose this as this is not exactly in favor of the athletes you're representing or is it? What is the bigger picture I'm missing?
You answered:
In reference to paying your dues as of Jan 15th....it's the PRO league...you're either in or your not. We had shows where we don't even know if a particular athlete has paid for his card, is current, etc....this aint the NPC where you can sign up on the spot. Without a line-up, we don't even know who to send info to...it's called being a PRO, being RESPONSIBLE as a professional, like every other aspect in life....you renew you drivers license whenever you want? How about your property taxes? Tell them you'll pay in July....
I understand this and you're making a good point, but why did you propose for those fees being that high?
Are these minutes being mailed to all I(nternational) F(ederation) BB pros in 2 or 3 different/other languages, so ALL of the international athletes understand that there is a high late fee attached to this now?
$400 in poor Russia/Serbia can be a different story for the involved athlete then $400 in the US.
I hope these athletes understand what is written here in english or at least they get the message in time.
How will they be notified of these minutes?
Do they know these minutes are posted on the ifbb website?
The minutes are posted on the official site for the IFBB, IFBBPRO.com
All pro's are encouraged to keep themselves up to date on the changes in THEIR sport...
No, we don't offer it in other languages, if they wish, they can get it translated themselves...
Yes, they know that all info on IFBB matters is listed on the official IFBB website
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Why did you propose for those fees being that high?
$400 in poor Russia/Serbia can be a different story for the involved athlete then $400 in the US.
And why did this proposal come from you?
I understand if it came from JM but from you?
JM must have been happy to hear that the Athl rep is proposing this, thinking that the athletes asked you to ask him this for them, since you're repping them?
How would this benefit the athletes you're representing?
I can't see that one of the pros would ask you to propose this for them and for that amount?
For example paying an NPC membership fee as a late fee would be more reasonable and add to that for each month that they are late.
Don't know if Jenny H is posting/reading on here (I think she is) but do you have any idea why she didn't propose anything for fitness?
Suggesting better surfaces for their skills to be showcased so better/safer landings are guaranteed for example? I thought this was an issue for them for years?
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Don't know if Jenny H is posting/reading on here (I think she is) but do you have any idea why she didn't propose anything for fitness?
Suggesting better surfaces for their skills to be showcased so better/safer landings are guaranteed for example? I thought this was an issue for them for years?
This a good point, especially after the stage in West Palm Beach. That was way too small and one competitor flipped off the back. It is ultimately up to the promoter though.
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It is ultimately up to the promoter though.
Not if the Pro League demands from the promoter to protect their athletes, I think?
It's mandatory in gymnastics at the Olympic games and on any level (even high school level) to let the competitors show their routines on a cushioned surface, providing more safety for their competitors.
I don't see why this can't be demanded by the Pro League to a promoter for their fitness athletes of which some are 30+ (more injury prone).
Or maybe the Pro League can even sponsor (or find a sponsor) to provide the cushioning?
I know for a fact that in martial arts competitions/demonstrations/seminars for example mats are provided for the competitors/participants. When it's over the provider/sponsor of the mats (mostly a well known brand, but now not relevant to this topic) sells the newly used mats for wholesale price to anybody who is interested, so it's a win-win situation.
I'm sure there would be a gymnastics club in the town of competition who would love to buy an almost new mat (used for what? 3-4 hours max?) from a fitness competition and pay much less then buying it brand new! Maybe even donate it to a charity if they show good will? (Children's hospital who can use cushioned floor/areas for some diseases or playgrounds in those areas)
Sponsor of the mats happy, competitors happy, promoter happy that he could offer a safe surface, IFBB happy they could protect their athletes a little more and see them compete again next competition instead of sliding away to figure competition because of injuries...
Anybody see something wrong with this?
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And why did this proposal come from you?
I understand if it came from JM but from you?
JM must have been happy to hear that the Athl rep is proposing this, thinking that the athletes asked you to ask him this for them, since you're repping them?
How would this benefit the athletes you're representing?
I can't see that one of the pros would ask you to propose this for them and for that amount?
For example paying an NPC membership fee as a late fee would be more reasonable and add to that for each month that they are late.
Don't know if Jenny H is posting/reading on here (I think she is) but do you have any idea why she didn't propose anything for fitness?
Suggesting better surfaces for their skills to be showcased so better/safer landings are guaranteed for example? I thought this was an issue for them for years?
The idea to have a set date was from me, the fine wasn't...we do discuss these things in advance.
Without a fine, or some other recourse...what would be the point in establishing any guidelines?
Life is full of them...look around.
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But you couldn't discuss the $400 being a bit too steep in some countries keeping standard of living in mind all over the world and come up with a more reasonable amount?
$400 in some countries could be 2 months salary.
So pay on time you would say.
True.
But it's not always that easy to get moeny from outside the US into the hands of the IFBB.
Fedex, Western Union, Bank wiring can be expensive in some countries.
I'm all for a late fee and that indeed applies to almost everything in life, but $400?
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Not if the Pro League demands from the promoter to protect their athletes, I think?
It's mandatory in gymanstics at the Olympic games and on any level (even high school level) to let the competitors show their routines on a cushioned surface, providing more safety for their competitors.
I don't see why this can't be demanded by the Pro League to a promoter for their fitness athletes of which some are 30+ (more injury prone).
Or maybe the Pro League can even sponsor (or find a sponsor) to provide the cushioning?
I know for a fact that in martial arts competitions/demonstrations/seminars for example mats are provided for the competitors/participants. When it's over the provider/sponsor of the mats (mostly a well known brand, but now not relevant to this topic) sells the newly used mats for wholesale price to anybody who is interested, so it's a win-win situation.
I'm sure there would be a gymnastics club in the town of competition who would love to buy an almost new mat (used for what? 3-4 hours max?) from a fitness competition and pay much less then buying it brand new! Maybe even donate it to a charity if they show good will? (Children's hospital who can use cushioned floor/areas for some diseases or playgrounds in those areas)
Sponsor of the mats happy, competitors happy, promoter happy that he could offer a safe surface, IFBB happy they could protect their athletes a little more and see them compete again next competition instead of sliding away to figure competition because of injuries...
Anybody see something wrong with this?
What makes you think they want "cushioning"..? As far as I know, they don't ...it makes it worse. What we've asked for is a secure flooring...one that doesn't move, or have any deviations in it.
You're obviuosly arguing for the sake of just arguing...
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But you couldn't discuss the $400 being a bit too steep in some countries keeping standard of living in mind all over the world and come up with a more reasonable amount?
$400 in some countries could be 2 months salary.
Guess they better get their application in on time then, right?
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MINUTES Of the Annual Meeting of the IFBB Professional Committee
Thursday, September 27, 2007
Salon B, Orleans Hotel, Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
ITEM DESCRIPTION ACTION
I The meeting was called to order at 4:00pm by Jim Manion, Chairman, IFBB Professional League.
II The roll call was taken; the following members were present:
NAME COUNTRY POSITION
Jim Manion USA Chairman
Jim Rockell USA Men’s Representative
Sandy Williamson USA Women’s Representative
Rob Wilkins USA Athlete Liaison (the Americas)
Pawel Filleborn Poland Athlete Liaison (Europe)
Steve Weinberger USA Promoter Representative
Rick Collins USA Legal Advisor
Bob Cicherillo USA Athlete Representative
Betty Pariso USA Athlete Representative
Jen Hendershott USA Athlete Representative
Jenny Lynn USA Athlete Representative
III The previous minutes of September 27, 2006 were read into the record. ADOPTED
PROPOSALS
IV A proposal from Betty Pariso that there be three Ms. Olympia qualifying spots for smaller shows [two-category competitions].
[Explanatory note: Currently, for any one-category female bodybuilding competition except the Ms. Olympia and Ms. International, the top 3 finalists qualify for the next Ms. Olympia. Where there are two categories, the top finalist in each category qualifies.]
REJECTED
V. A proposal from Betty Pariso that the use of props in female bodybuilding competition be permitted.
[Explanatory note: Currently, the use of props in bodybuilding competition is prohibited.]
REJECTED
VI. A proposal from Betty Pariso that the “desired look” for female bodybuilding be formalized in writing as part of the IFBB Pro Rules.
[Explanatory note: After some discussion, the committee held the majority opinion that the judges were already shaping the look for female bodybuilding with the winners they choose and therefore, there was no need for additional criteria other than what is currently expressed in the Pro Rules.]
REJECTED
VII. A proposal from Jenny Lynn regarding the release of contact information of Athlete-Members to the Athlete Representatives.
[Explanatory note: The IFBB Pro League office will ensure that the Athlete Representatives are provided wth up-to-date contact information.]
ADOPTED
VIII. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that athletes be required to have a written contract, signed and approved, no later than 8 weeks prior to the date of the competition.
[Modification: Athletes will be required to have a written contract postmarked no later than 6 weeks prior to the date of the competition. Contracts received after the due date will be subject to a US $500 late fee to the promoter.] Intersting that the Athletes Rep let this pass without argument. Was their any kind of debate about this late fee. Or did the athletes already vote to pass the amount of the fine.
ADOPTED with modification
IX. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that athletes with a signed contract 8 weeks from the date of competition will receive a US $1,000 fee on cancellation of the competition any time prior to the original date set.
[Modification: Athletes with a signed contract 6 weeks from the date of the competition will split the sanction money on deposit at the time of the cancellation upon the cancellation of the competition any time prior to original date set.] So, if there is nothing on deposit with the IFBB then the athletes get nothing. The sanction fee is what $10,000. SO if there are more than 10 athletes then they will get less money. Did the athletes agree on this too. Could you not have this passed on and re-submitted at the next meeting.
ADOPTED with modification
X. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that the “Under 210-lb” class receive one Olympia qualifying spot.
REJECTED
XI. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo that all IFBB Pro League cards will be renewed by annually by January 1st. Any card renewed after this deadline, and before February 1st, will have an additional US $100 fee attached. Renewals received after February 28th will be doubled, based on the original cost. And the athlete you represent suggested this fine.
[Modification: All IFBB Pro League cards will be renewed (postmarked) annually by January 15th. Any card renewed after this date will cost the athlete US $400.] And you let the IFBB increase what you proposed and went with it. And the athletes all told you to do this. Jeez Chic if you are going to help the athletes you rep like this then I'm sure they are all happy with the job you are doing. ::)
ADOPTED with modification
XII. A proposal from Bob Cicherillo to reduce the “Under 210-lb” class to “Under 202 lbs”.
[Explanatory note: This is not a division into two categories of a men’s bodybuilding competition. The promoter, with the approval of the IFBB Pro League, may elect to open a separate competition for those competitors who are under 202 lbs.]
ADOPTED
OTHER BUSINESS
XIII. The following Other Business was briefly discussed:
1. Where possible, the individual judge’s scores should be listed in the contest results reported at www.IFBBPRO.com
2. The fine of US $1,000 for athletes who withdraw from a competition without a legitimate medical reason, as certified by a physician accepted by the IFBB Pro League, will be enforced.
3. In future, Athlete Meeting times will be approved by the IFBB Pro League and will be published at www.IFBBPRO.com for each event.
4. In future, the IFBB Pro League will publish at www.IFBBPRO.com comprehensive contest information, including an updated competitor list.
5. The members voted to reject the request for reinstatement from Lee Priest.
XIV. There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 5:00pm.
Minutes
Recorded by:
Jim Rockell Men’s Representative
Minutes Transcribed by:
Tony Blinn General Secretary
Minutes Approved by:
Jim Manion Chairman
Minutes Approved by:
Ben Weider, OC, CStJ, QC, PhD
President
Chic was wondering, if you proposed anything "good" for the athletes you represent.
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Guess they better get their application in on time then, right?
Bob reminds me of the high school hall monitor, secretly gloating when others get dinged for chickenshit stuff.
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What makes you think they want "cushioning"..? As far as I know, they don't ...it makes it worse. What we've asked for is a secure flooring...one that doesn't move, or have any deviations in it.
What makes me think that? ::) I've heard this personally from several ms Fitness Olympia participants!!
So you think that these girls prefer to land on wooden floors then on cushioning just like in gymnastics, performing almost the same moves?
Thick cushioning makes it worse yes if you wear shoes.
Thin cushioning gives more stability and security for a softer landing in case of...
You're obviuosly arguing for the sake of just arguing...
Yeah nobody would be happy with this.
Fitness competition started with simple moves in '97 or '98 and got more complicated and more gymnastic like as the years went by.
I think it would be reasonable to flow/adjust with the time demands of the flips being performed.
But if Jenny didn't propose anything then I guess that request indeed died over the years OR nobody asked Jenny to propose this. Oh well...
Long live fitness :-[
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Chic was wondering, if you proposed anything "good" for the athletes you represent.
Yeah...everything on the list.
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I edited that post before you posted this, knowing the smartass you are, you would say that.
Guess they better get their application in on time then, right?
But you couldn't discuss the $400 being a bit too steep in some countries keeping standard of living in mind all over the world and come up with a more reasonable amount?
$400 in some countries could be 2 months salary.
So pay on time you would say.
True.
But it's not always that easy to get moeny from outside the US into the hands of the IFBB.
Fedex, Western Union, Bank wiring can be expensive in some countries.
I'm all for a late fee and that indeed applies to almost everything in life, but $400?
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Bob should stick to stuff he's good at like emceeing and interviewing, where he can't do any damage.
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LOL...nope.
Let's see what unfolds for the I.M...........more comparisons than last year I'm guessing..!
Bob,
well...can I tell you first: I love you bro...so don't ever get offended...
I do think you are doing hell of the job but I also think that WE - IFBB PROS should get few things - after all these years...
First thing being: EXPLANATION how IFBB judges actually judge the show?
I think that in every other sport IF media ask judges WHY they judged certain way - judges would elaborate in greatest detail HOW THEY JUDGED...However - in bodybuilding asking judges is a 'no-no"...?!
WHY?
If I put Jay ahead of Victor...or Jocelyn Politier (for that matter) - as official IFBB judge - I should be able to say WHY I made such a decision...
What's more I would start with First round and explain why I think Jay deserved to beat Jocelyn or Victor - and even take each and every pose (front, side and rear relax pose) and give my honest assessment...
Than I would do the same in next round...etc...
If I ask any judge from Olympia how and why they think Jay was the best bodybuilder on that stage - they should be able to justify their decision...but when you get - "don't ask" answer...you have to wonder what is going on?
Like I said before if IFBB judges proclaim Rossane Bar sexier and/or more beautiful than Angelina Joly - nobody in this world would accept that decision - except the IFBB fans...and competitors...
It is sad to know that when I train someone to win IFBB pro show and I try to get the athlete believing in himself - I can't overcome their serious concern - POLITICS...or the most important "NAME ROUND"...
I was asked so many times: "Cammon Milos - you really think they (IFBB judges) would let me stand next to that guy...or place me ahead?"
And when I try to encourage them and stay positive and pump them up with: "Off course I think they will..." I get: "OK...you want to bet?"
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Bob,
well...can I tell you first: I love you bro...so don't ever get offended...
I do think you are doing hell of the job but I also think that WE - IFBB PROS should get few things - after all these years...
First thing being: EXPLANATION how IFBB judges actually judge the show?
I think that in every other sport IF media ask judges WHY they judged certain way - judges would elaborate in greatest detail HOW THEY JUDGED...However - in bodybuilding asking judges is a 'no-no"...?!
WHY?
If I put Jay ahead of Victor...or Jocelyn Politier (for that matter) - as official IFBB judge - I should be able to say WHY I made such a decision...
What's more I would start with First round and explain why I think Jay deserved to beat Jocelyn or Victor - and even take each and every pose (front, side and rear relax pose) and give my honest assessment...
Than I would do the same in next round...etc...
If I ask any judge from Olympia how and why they think Jay was the best bodybuilder on that stage - they should be able to justify their decision...but when you get - "don't ask" answer...you have to wonder what is going on?
Like I said before if IFBB judges proclaim Rossane Bar sexier and/or more beautiful than Angelina Joly - nobody in this world would accept that decision - except the IFBB fans...and competitors...
It is sad to know that when I train someone to win IFBB pro show and I try to get the athlete believing in himself - I can't overcome their serious concern - POLITICS...or the most important "NAME ROUND"...
I was asked so many times: "Cammon Milos - you really think they (IFBB judges) would let me stand next to that guy...or place me ahead?"
And when I try to encourage them and stay positive and pump them up with: "Off course I think they will..." I get: "OK...you want to bet?"
I think if one more person get fired then the rest will get the message, and wee know how is that person.
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Well...nice talking to you... ::)
We (IFBB PROS and bodybuilding fans) need to insist that judging criteria IS EXPLAINED before the next show...