Can someone explain to me about universal healthcare?

[danielson]

Some jackass I work with said that under Obamas plan my co-pay would go from 5$ to 50$ to help pay for all the lazy underachieving pieces of shit who need health care. I don't believe him, but where does the money come from?

[Chico_Holiday]

It's not socialized healthcare like Canada and Europe have, basically people who already have health insurance will keep their coverage and still pay for it, people who don't have it and can't afford it will get it for free...........sad thing is their coverage will probably be better than ours!

[donrhummy]

This is a completely incorrect understanding of Obama's plan. He is NOT creating a goverment-run universal healthcare plan. Rather what he's doing is:

1. Forcing more medium/large companies offer healthcare coverage or pay a penalty

2. For individuals working for themselves, not working or working at small companies he wants to provide them the ability to purchase healthcare under the similar program that senators now get (which btw, is MUCH better and cheaper than what most people get through their companies). He says he'd be able to pay for this with repeal of tax cuts on the wealthy (people earning more than $250,000/yr) as well as penalties paid by medium/large companies refusing to offer healthcare.

Neither one is universal healthcare. And you are not required to leave your company's plan (although you can if the other one is better/cheaper).

As well, his plan offers one HUGE benefit over McCain's that no one's mentioning:

McCain wants to get people out of company health care plans and into individual plans. Currently, individual plans are very, very shady and corrupt. The reason? Because individuals do not have the money or buying power to make sure they're not screwed by the health care company. Right now, most health insurance companies run their individual plans like this: they offer bonuses to employees who can cancel plans and save them money (this is no joke). This has led to a number of individuals paying for healthcare for a long time and then when they get cancer, their plan is cancelled because the information on file had the address entered slightly incorrectly (or some other error that was likely put there by the health insurance employee for just such a case). This has already been proven and it's not by obscure health insurance companies but the big guys. Now here's the kicker: this is illegal in only ONE state: California. That's where 4 of these cases were successfully proven.

So if everyone moves to individual plans as McCain wants, they'll lose the power of numbers/size that a company offers. When a company has 1000 or more people getting health insurance together, that's a lot of revenue they can take away if they're unhappy. When you purchase it yourself, you're one powerless person they can afford to lose.


MORE INFO:
Court Awards $9M to Cancer Patient Over Cancelled Coverage
http://medheadlines.com/2008/02/23/court-awards-9m-to-cancer-patient-over-cancelled-coverage/

During arbitration, Health Net revealed a quota-based internal program that rewards employees with bonuses for meeting a quota of cancellations measured by the amount of money the cancellations save the company.

Blue Cross of CA settles plan-cancellation suits
http://www.fiercehealthcare.com/story/blue-cross-of-ca-settles-plan-cancellation-suits/2006-10-18

[Hereford]

It seems that a lot of heath insurace programs are borderline scams.

The one I have states that they will pay for eyeglass lenses, but not frames, or contacts. The deductible is sky-high, and they get to decide if things that I do (doctors visits) actually are applied to the deductible....

Even after the deductible is met, they only pay 60% or some damn thing.

[w8tlftr]

Yay class warfare.

I love how his tax plan doesn't take the regional cost of living index into consideration.

Way to to fuck working class families in high cost areas, Obama. 

[24KT]

Yay class warfare.

I love how his tax plan doesn't take the regional cost of living index into consideration.

Way to to fuck working class families in high cost areas, Obama. 

I would think McCain's plan is the one that does that.

Don't know how they will implement Obama's plan, ...but up here in Canada, Universal Health Care works on the principal of overall lowered costs through collective purchases.. ie: 10,000 people coming together will individually pay less than one person trying to acquire the same thing.

[El_Pajero]

but i need new rims holmes

[Buffgeek]

If you dont like the Guv'ment health plan you can keep yours! (while paying for everyone else at the same time)

[w8tlftr]

I would think McCain's plan is the one that does that.

Don't know how they will implement Obama's plan, ...but up here in Canada, Universal Health Care works on the principal of overall lowered costs through collective purchases.. ie: 10,000 people coming together will individually pay less than one person trying to acquire the same thing.

How so, Judi? Obama said it himself, "Those making less than $250,000 will not see their taxes go up."

That tells me he's drawing a line. Now, I think we can all agree that 250k is a lot of money in low cost of living states. However, in metropolitan areas like Los Angeles, New York City, Washington DC area you're still a working schmuck like everyone else. You have to pay bills, save for retirement, send kids to college, etc. like everyone else.

Now back to healthcare. Obama said things I liked... but so did McCain. This isn't an easy solution and politicians are going to have to work with Insurance companies to make this work so that people still have a choice and those choices are affordable. Of course that will mean the the "two party" system will have to check their egos at the door and work together. I'm not going to hold my breath for that one.

[donrhummy]

How so, Judi? Obama said it himself, "Those making less than $250,000 will not see their taxes go up."

That tells me he's drawing a line. Now, I think we can all agree that 250k is a lot of money in low cost of living states. However, in metropolitan areas like Los Angeles, New York City, Washington DC area you're still a working schmuck like everyone else. You have to pay bills, save for retirement, send kids to college, etc. like everyone else.

Incorrect. Have you ever lived in NYC? If you were earning $250K you'd be rich. The cost of living is high but NOT that high. Certainly not as rich as if you lived in middle america, but then you wouldn't be earning $250K doing that job in middle america.

[Busted]

Some jackass I work with said that under Obamas plan my co-pay would go from 5$ to 50$ to help pay for all the lazy underachieving pieces of shit who need health care. I don't believe him, but where does the money come from?

Tell him to stop watching the Republican News Network, AKA, Republican Smear network AKA Fixed News, AKA, Fox Noise, AKA Fox News

[Soul Crusher]

If you dont like the Guv'ment health plan you can keep yours! (while paying for everyone else at the same time)

What is amazing to me about liberals is that they think the same govt that screwed up Katrina and Iraq are some how going to get health care right.

Fools.  The govt screws up everything in touches and if it tries health care, it will screw that up too.

[w8tlftr]

Incorrect. Have you ever lived in NYC? If you were earning $250K you'd be rich. The cost of living is high but NOT that high. Certainly not as rich as if you lived in middle america, but then you wouldn't be earning $250K doing that job in middle america.

No. I've never lived in NYC just visited - nice city. I live in Columbia, Maryland which is between Baltimore and Washington, DC. Here a combined income of 250k makes you upper middle class - NOT rich.

But this is what I'm talking about. My wife and I wouldn't make the salaries we get here in, say, South Carolina because the cost of living is significantly less.

Obama doesn't take that into consideration. So when he says 95 percent of "working" families he isn't including those of us that live and "work" here.

[donrhummy]

No. I've never lived in NYC just visited - nice city. I live in Columbia, Maryland which is between Baltimore and Washington, DC. Here a combined income of 250k makes you upper middle class - NOT rich.

But this is what I'm talking about. My wife and I wouldn't make the salaries we get here in, say, South Carolina because the cost of living is significantly less.

Obama doesn't take that into consideration. So when he says 95 percent of "working" families he isn't including those of us that live and "work" here.

Actually, he is. Look at the US Census (go to the government website). Only 5% of the country earns that much each year. Seriously. That's it.

[Soul Crusher]

Actually, he is. Look at the US Census (go to the government website). Only 5% of the country earns that much each year. Seriously. That's it.

The fact of the matter is that 250K, after income tax, fica, SS, and all the other taxes is not rich.  That is a very good income, but not rich by any sane persons' definition.

Rich is someone with 5 - 10 million in the bank plus 500k in income at least a year.

Nobama is waging class warfare and refuses to understand that poor people do not create jobs, people with money do. 

Poor people dont have moniey to hire people, rich people do.

Poor people dont have money to start up new companies, wealthy people do.

You ignorant fools blaming "rich" people dont understand that they are the ones who create jobs that you people are begging for,

 

[w8tlftr]

Actually, he is. Look at the US Census (go to the government website). Only 5% of the country earns that much each year. Seriously. That's it.

Oh... sorry. I didn't know I was rich. 

[donrhummy]

Oh... sorry. I didn't know I was rich. 

No one is saying you're rich by your definition just that if you earn $250,000, you earn more than 95% of Americans. And actually, I had it wrong. If you earn $250,000 or more, you earn more than 98% of American HOUSEHOLDS!

http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032008/hhinc/new06_000.htm

Total Households: 116,783,000
Households Earning $250,000 and Above: 2,245,000

[Soul Crusher]

No one is saying you're rich by your definition just that if you earn $250,000, you earn more than 95% of Americans. And actually, I had it wrong. If you earn $250,000 or more, you earn more than 98% of American HOUSEHOLDS!

http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032008/hhinc/new06_000.htm

If you live in NYC, LC, Chicago, Miami, 250k per year after - income tax, fica, ss, medicare, nediacade, real estate taxes, sales taxes, energy taxes, communication taxes, is not that much money.

[w8tlftr]

No one is saying you're rich by your definition just that if you earn $250,000, you earn more than 95% of Americans. And actually, I had it wrong. If you earn $250,000 or more, you earn more than 98% of American HOUSEHOLDS!

http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032008/hhinc/new06_000.htm

While the numbers do support your argument that married couples in high cost areas (like the Baltimore/Washington DC) that earn 250k are in the 95 percentile of income earners they are NOT rich. Upper middle class but NOT rich. Obama's tax plans takes money away from me and my family. Money I will need to pay bills, put my kids though college, and try to save (if that's even possible anymore) for my retirement.

[24KT]

While the numbers do support your argument that married couples in high cost areas (like the Baltimore/Washington DC) that earn 250k are in the 95 percentile of income earners they are NOT rich. Upper middle class but NOT rich. Obama's tax plans takes money away from me and my family. Money I will need to pay bills, put my kids though college, and try to save (if that's even possible anymore) for my retirement.

   Is this going to affect our weekend jaunt down to the Virgin Islands?

[w8tlftr]

  Is this going to affect our weekend jaunt down to the Virgin Islands?

Probably. 

[24KT]

Probably. 

hmmm, ...well, ...you know, we don't have to include your wife, ...it could simply be just the two of us   

[w8tlftr]

hmmm, ...well, ...you know, we don't have to include your wife, ...it could simply be just the two of us   

Whut?

But you ladies need me to hold the camcorder!

[24KT]

Whut?

But you ladies need me to hold the camcorder!

Isn't that what the tripod is for? ooops, silly me, I forgot. You ARE the tripod.
Hmmm, ...you could always divorce your wife, ...then your taxes won't increase?

Hey, ...dju suppose maybe that's what Coach has been doing all these years?
And all this time I thought he was just crappy at marriage, ...turns out he's just been a good tax planner. 

Looks like you're just going to have to be like everyone else and simply cheat on your taxes.
A worldwide fiscal crisis is NOT sufficient enough reason for my weekend jaunts to be delayed, post-poned, or otherwise interfered with.

[w8tlftr]

Isn't that what the tripod is for? ooops, silly me, I forgot. You ARE the tripod.
Hmmm, ...you could always divorce your wife, ...then your taxes won't increase?

Hey, ...dju suppose maybe that's what Coach has been doing all these years?
And all this time I thought he was just crappy at marriage, ...turns out he's just been a good tax planner. 

Looks like you're just going to have to be like everyone else and simply cheat on your taxes.
A worldwide fiscal crisis is NOT sufficient enough reason for my weekend jaunts to be delayed, post-poned, or otherwise interfered with.

LOL

Despite my intense hatred of the progressive tax system I try my damnest to be an honorable man.

But you do bring up a sad point.... I've read about numerous cases were couples have divorced because they couldn't afford their taxes when married.

Yay marriage penalty!