Author Topic: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.  (Read 17212 times)

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #175 on: March 29, 2011, 07:24:50 PM »
Yeah, we only have all the major news outlets, tv, The View, a potential POTUS candidate , all discussing it. 

I see. 

911 CTs had tons of media coverage.  Do they belong here?

OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #176 on: March 29, 2011, 07:26:20 PM »
Keep rolling your eyes, the last thing you want with me on this is a real discussion on the details of this. 




We've had one and you concluded with me that there's no facts to prove Bama wasn't born here.  which makes you a CT loon.

And you are keeping up with you spamming of cut and paste.


So.....
 ::)


OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #177 on: March 29, 2011, 07:29:11 PM »
Birthers  haven't had that much media coverage and any how who is leading the birther charge?


You Birthers  have NOTHING but speculation and ignorant 9/11 style arguments.

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #178 on: March 29, 2011, 07:29:45 PM »
Not true - its a complicated, matter, but he could be listed as a British national due to laws that existed at the time.  

Additionally, when they moved to indonesia many think his family renounced Barry's citizenship to get him registered for school over there, and then forgot or never legalized him when they came back.   Lolo Soetoro - Bama's mother other husband was Barry's stepfather and it unclear whether there was a formal adoption or not, but Obama used the name Barry Soetoro to register for school and other things.

The entire thing is very shady.  

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #179 on: March 29, 2011, 07:32:07 PM »

We've had one and you concluded with me that there's no facts to prove Bama wasn't born here.  which makes you a CT loon.

And you are keeping up with you spamming of cut and paste.


So.....
 ::)



I said his concealing his BC might because of a foreign birth, but that is not the only reason.   

Ozmo - no disrespect - but you are fucking clueless on Obama's past.  I have read on a ton on this and you have no idea how much shady shit went on with bama's parents, the step parents, thew communist mentors, the phoney SS numbers, the absent passports for barry's pakisatan travels, etc. 

tu_holmes

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #180 on: March 29, 2011, 07:32:53 PM »
Not true - its a complicated, matter, but he could be listed as a British national due to laws that existed at the time.  

Additionally, when they moved to indonesia many think his family renounced Barry's citizenship to get him registered for school over there, and then forgot or never legalized him when they came back.   Lolo Soetoro - Bama's mother other husband was Barry's stepfather and it unclear whether there was a formal adoption or not, but Obama used the name Barry Soetoro to register for school and other things.

The entire thing is very shady.  

So how does his birth certificate rectify any of those things? You're talking about him have his citizenship renounced... Does the birth certificate say something about that? No.

You think his Birth Certificate would say he was listed as a British National? Even though his mother was an American which automatically makes him one too because of OUR laws right? So he'd still be a Natural Born Citizen of the US.


OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #181 on: March 29, 2011, 07:38:43 PM »
I said his concealing his BC might because of a foreign birth, but that is not the only reason.  

Ozmo - no disrespect - but you are fucking clueless on Obama's past.  I have read on a ton on this and you have no idea how much shady shit went on with bama's parents, the step parents, thew communist mentors, the phoney SS numbers, the absent passports for barry's pakisatan travels, etc.  

No worries,333333.

I am willing to bet that most of what you read is unsubstanciial spun garbage.  If it's the way you paint it out to be they would have him up on charges already.

See the problem is 333333, you have allowed yourself to be brainwashed to the point hat you have lost all your objectivity and cannot tell fact from fiction and or are not able to effectively analyze what you read.  That's why arguing with 911 truthers is the way it is.


andreisdaman

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #182 on: March 29, 2011, 07:51:46 PM »
No worries,333333.

I am willing to bet that most of what you read is unsubstanciial spun garbage.  If it's the way you paint it out to be they would have him up on charges already.

See the problem is 333333, you have allowed yourself to be brainwashed to the point hat you have lost all your objectivity and cannot tell fact from fiction and or are not able to effectively analyze what you read.  That's why arguing with 911 truthers is the way it is.



Thank you!!!!!!..I am the only one who has been saying this.,.,I am glad someone with some common sense has recognized this as well..keep up the good work Ozmo

Also that wasn't Donald Trump's real birth certificate.....it was a hospital certificate..it wasn't given to him by NY state

Soul Crusher

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #183 on: March 29, 2011, 07:59:26 PM »
Idiot - he released the NYC on today in full and a copy is posted in this thread.   Now, where is Bamas?

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #184 on: March 29, 2011, 08:48:23 PM »
Donald Trump calls for Abercrombie investigation
khon2.com ^ | March 28 2011 | khon2



"You know what I get a kick out of the governor of Hawaii says, 'Oh I remember when he was born 50 years ago.' I doubt it. I think this guy should be investigated. I doubt he remembers when Obama was born give me a break."

Governor Abercrombie had no comment on Trump's statement.


(Excerpt) Read more at khon2.com ...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Soul Crusher

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #185 on: March 29, 2011, 08:52:12 PM »
“State Attorney General David Louie told the governor he can’t disclose an individual’s birth documentation without a person’s consent, Abercrombie spokeswoman Donalyn Dela Cruz said.”


Trump needs to ask why Abercrombie can’t simply get Obama’s consent. If Obama’s jpg was legit, then there should be no problem releasing the original birth records. Plus, Abs says he was there when Obama was born and is an old family friend.




OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #186 on: March 29, 2011, 09:27:15 PM »
 ::)

tu_holmes

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #187 on: March 29, 2011, 09:33:21 PM »
What would a Birth Certificate from 1961 have to do with Social Security Numbers? They aren't listed on Birth Certificates, so I don't get that... Are you saying a pseudonym? They wouldn't have vetted that?

Who cares if his father was different... either way, if he's born in the US, then he's legally allowed to be President (which is what this whole thing is about right?)

Is there Religion on a Birth Certificate? Mine doesn't have one... It just shows where and my name... that's it. It doesn't have some religious denotion on it. Is Hawaii different than Virginia?

Who cares what color it lists him as? Color doesn't have anything to do with him legally being allowed to be President.

Isn't this ENTIRE thing about whether or not he's LEGALLY allowed to be President of the United States?

In absolutely NO scenario you just listed is he not LEGALLY allowed to be President unless he wasn't born on US soil, which as everyone in Hawaii's Vital Statistics office says he was, so what is it you're really worried about?

The dude can be President in all but 1 scenario you just listed (and everyone has said that scenario doesn't exist) and the rest of the scenarios are just ridiculous... So what are you getting at?
Not true - its a complicated, matter, but he could be listed as a British national due to laws that existed at the time.   

Additionally, when they moved to indonesia many think his family renounced Barry's citizenship to get him registered for school over there, and then forgot or never legalized him when they came back.   Lolo Soetoro - Bama's mother other husband was Barry's stepfather and it unclear whether there was a formal adoption or not, but Obama used the name Barry Soetoro to register for school and other things.

The entire thing is very shady. 
So how does his birth certificate rectify any of those things? You're talking about him have his citizenship renounced... Does the birth certificate say something about that? No.

You think his Birth Certificate would say he was listed as a British National? Even though his mother was an American which automatically makes him one too because of OUR laws right? So he'd still be a Natural Born Citizen of the US.



Bumpdiggity Bump Bump.

OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #188 on: March 29, 2011, 09:42:34 PM »
Ba bump bump

Option D

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #189 on: March 29, 2011, 10:54:29 PM »
Thank you!!!!!!..I am the only one who has been saying this.,.,I am glad someone with some common sense has recognized this as well..keep up the good work Ozmo

Also that wasn't Donald Trump's real birth certificate.....it was a hospital certificate..it wasn't given to him by NY state

i have been saying that for a year,.ask 3333


tell him 3333, i told you that you were full of shit since 09...remember when i told you that facts mean very little to you and you would blame a bad hand in poker on Obama

Dos Equis

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #190 on: March 29, 2011, 10:57:23 PM »

You think his Birth Certificate would say he was listed as a British National? Even though his mother was an American which automatically makes him one too because of OUR laws right? So he'd still be a Natural Born Citizen of the US.


Makes sense to me.  Wasn't his mom born in Kansas?  That makes him an American citizen regardless of where he was born, no?

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #191 on: March 29, 2011, 10:58:27 PM »
Bumpdiggity Bump Bump.

nice one tu.....

OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #192 on: March 29, 2011, 11:26:05 PM »
Makes sense to me.  Wasn't his mom born in Kansas?  That makes him an American citizen regardless of where he was born, no?

Wouldn't it come down to how " natural born citizen" is defined?

http://federalistblog.us/2008/11/natural-born_citizen_defined.html


Natural-Born Citizen Defined

One universal point most all early publicists agreed on was natural-born citizen must mean one who is a citizen by no act of law. If a person owes their citizenship to some act of law (naturalization for example), they cannot be considered a natural-born citizen. This leads us to defining natural-born citizen under the laws of nature - laws the founders recognized and embraced.

Under the laws of nature, every child born requires no act of law to establish the fact the child inherits through nature his/her father’s citizenship as well as his name (or even his property) through birth. This law of nature is also recognized by law of nations. Sen. Howard said the citizenship clause under the Fourteenth Amendment was by virtue of “natural law and national law.”

The advantages of Natural Law is competing allegiances between nations are not claimed, or at least with those nations whose custom is to not make citizens of other countries citizens without their consent. Any alternations or conflicts due to a child’s natural citizenship are strictly a creature of local municipal law. In the year 1866, the United States for the first time adopted a local municipal law under Sec. 1992 of U.S. Revised Statutes that read: “All persons born in the United States and not subject to any foreign power, excluding Indians not taxed, are declared to be citizens of the United States.”

Rep. John A. Bingham commenting on Section 1992 said it means “every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen.” (Cong. Globe, 39th, 1st Sess., 1291 (1866))

OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #193 on: March 29, 2011, 11:29:06 PM »
Rep. John A. Bingham commenting on Section 1992 said it means “every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen.” (Cong. Globe, 39th, 1st Sess., 1291 (1866))

Bingham had asserted the same thing in 1862 as well:

Does the gentleman mean that any person, born within the limits of the Republic, and who has offended against no law, can rightfully be exiled from any State or from any rood of the Republic? Does the gentleman undertake to say that here, in the face of the provision in the Constitution, that persons born within the limits of the Republic, of parents who are not the subjects of any other sovereignty, are native-born citizens, whether they be black or white? There is not a textbook referred to in any court which does not recognise the principle that I assert. (Cong. Globe, 37th, 2nd Sess., 407 (1862))

Bingham subscribed to the same view as most everyone in Congress at the time that in order to be born a citizen of the United States one must be born within the allegiance of the Nation. Bingham had explained years earlier that to be born within the allegiance of the United States the parents, or more precisely, the father, must not owe allegiance to some other foreign sovereignty (remember the U.S. abandoned England’s “natural allegiance” doctrine). This of course, explains why emphasis of not owing allegiance to anyone else was the affect of being subject to the jurisdiction of the United States.

It should be noted this allegiance due under England’s common law and American law are of two different species. Under the common law one owed a personal allegiance to the King as an individual upon birth. Under the American system there was no individual ruler to owe a personal allegiance to.

The constitutional requirement for the President of the United States to be a natural-born citizen had one purpose according to St. George Tucker:

That provision in the constitution which requires that the president shall be a native-born citizen (unless he were a citizen of the United States when the constitution was adopted,) is a happy means of security against foreign influence, which, wherever it is capable of being exerted, is to he dreaded more than the plague. The admission of foreigners into our councils, consequently, cannot be too much guarded against; their total exclusion from a station to which foreign nations have been accustomed to, attach ideas of sovereign power, sacredness of character, and hereditary right, is a measure of the most consummate policy and wisdom. …The title of king, prince, emperor, or czar, without the smallest addition to his powers, would have rendered him a member of the fraternity of crowned heads: their common cause has more than once threatened the desolation of Europe. To have added a member to this sacred family in America, would have invited and perpetuated among us all the evils of Pandora’s Box.
Charles Pinckney in 1800 said the presidential eligibility clause was designed “to insure … attachment to the country.” President Washington warned a “passionate attachment of one nation for another, produces a variety of evils,” and goes on to say:

Sympathy for the favorite nation, facilitating the illusion of an imaginary common interest, in cases where no real common interest exists, and infusing into one the enmities of the other, betrays the former into a participation in the quarrels and wars of the latter, without adequate inducement or justification. It leads also to concessions to the favorite nation, of privileges denied to others, which is apt doubly to injure the nation making the concessions; by unnecessarily parting with what ought to have been retained; and by exciting jealousy, ill- will, and a disposition to retaliate, in the parties from whom equal privileges are withheld.

And it gives to ambitious, corrupted, or deluded citizens, (who devote themselves to the favorite nation,) facility to betray or sacrifice the interests of their own country, without odium, sometimes even with popularity; gilding, with the appearance of a virtuous sense of obligation, a commendable deference for public opinion, or a laudable zeal for public good, the base or foolish compliances of ambition, corruption, or infatuation.

What better way to insure attachment to the country then to require the President to have inherited his American citizenship through his American father and not through a foreign father. Any child can be born anywhere in the country and removed by their father to be raised in his native country. The risks would be for the child to return in later life to reside in this country bringing with him foreign influences and intrigues, and thus, making such a citizen indistinguishable from a naturalized citizen.

Conclusion

Extending citizenship to non-citizens through birth based solely upon locality is nothing more than mere municipal law that has no extra-territorial effect as proven from the English practice of it. On the other hand, citizenship by descent through the father is natural law and is recognized by all nations (what nation doesn’t recognize citizenship of children born to their own citizens?). Thus, a natural-born citizen is one whose citizenship is recognized by law of nations rather than mere local recognition.

Chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, James F. Wilson of Iowa, confirmed this in 1866: “We must depend on the general law relating to subjects and citizens recognized by all nations for a definition, and that must lead us to the conclusion that every person born in the United States is a natural-born citizen of such States, except that of children born on our soil to temporary sojourners or representatives of foreign Governments.”

When a child inherits the citizenship of their father they become a natural-born citizen of the nation their father belongs regardless of where they might be born. It should be pointed out that citizenship through descent of the father was recognized by U.S. Naturalization law whereby children became citizens themselves as soon as their father had become a naturalized citizen.

In a nation that has abandoned the English tradition of “perpetual allegiance” to the King upon birth for the principal of expatriation, the requirement of preexisting allegiance of the father can be the only method for a child to be born into the allegiance of the nation, and thus, a natural-born citizen.

andreisdaman

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #194 on: March 30, 2011, 05:26:22 AM »
i have been saying that for a year,.ask 3333


tell him 3333, i told you that you were full of shit since 09...remember when i told you that facts mean very little to you and you would blame a bad hand in poker on Obama

You're right Option D..I forgot about you...my apologies :o

Soul Crusher

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #195 on: March 30, 2011, 05:47:21 AM »
Yeah, a few bad threads out of hundreds.  My accuracy rate is still 99 percent. 


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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #196 on: March 30, 2011, 06:05:42 AM »
Yeah, a few bad threads out of hundreds.  My accuracy rate is still 99 percent. 


dude.. you just cut and paste other conservatives...big whoop

Soul Crusher

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #197 on: March 30, 2011, 06:09:27 AM »
Why are you clowns so sensitive on this topic?   Remember bushs national guard record?   That seemed fair play. 

Why not this? 

OzmO

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #198 on: March 30, 2011, 07:48:49 AM »
Why are you clowns so sensitive on this topic?   Remember bushs national guard record?   That seemed fair play.  

Why not this?  



So now it's BUSH's FAULT?

Soul Crusher

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Re: Donald J. Trump Birth Certificate released.
« Reply #199 on: March 30, 2011, 07:53:36 AM »
Just pointing out the double standards used to defend the messiah.