Religious Nutcases Pt. 2

[Griffith]

There's no meaning to anything, complete random chaos.

We're just animals like any other with the sole purpose of reproducing and complete insignificant specks in this universe of trillions of stars.

[King Shizzo]

There's no meaning to anything, complete random chaos.

We're just animals like any other with the sole purpose of reproducing and complete insignificant specks in this universe of trillions of stars.

Simple and to the point.  Can't argue.

[garebear]

Why would Jesus have suffered more than the others crucified during the same historical period?

[Radical Plato]

Why would Jesus have suffered more than the others crucified during the same historical period?

Because he was Jesus, God Damn it! 

[OTHstrong]

Why would Jesus have suffered more than the others crucified during the same historical period?

I just explained it to you, 2 reasons why, cause he never submitted and didn't yield during his torture so they inflicted more on him then they would have had he yielded and submitted and begged for mercy and reason number 2 was he was mentally ahead of everyone so he survived the torture that would have killed anyone else. Fear raises your heart rate and causes you to die quicker so someone as fearless as Jesus would have survived longer and his lack of anger and humbleness would have kept him calm again another reason he would have endured more. We know this cause even after all the inflicted pain, he said "forgive them for they know not what they do"

So even if there was another equal to him in strength and mental fortitude they would have to be in the right place at the right time, they would have had to be just as calm, just as humble, just as fearless. Ask a medical DR. how much faster one dies when being angry, when having fear, or when someone panics. Such a human would not go unnoticed.

[OTHstrong]

Actor Woody Harrelson did a 40 day fast among many other humans. I believe many Monks went further than 40 days. Although 40 days if very impressive, its really not that big of deal if that's all Jesus did. However I have read that after 40 days, the body starts to attack the organs. So maybe that's why Jesus had the 40 day number in his mind. But since many other humans have done the 40 day fast that Jesus has done, maybe there's many humans that could also take the beaten that Jesus took.

No argument there, but the question is how many have done that, I guarantee there are less then 100 people alive that can do this, very few can, it was mere 3 weeks that people in eastern Europe turned to cannibalism. Imagine taking one of those monks and beaten them to death, would be no easy feat, they probably wouldn't even make a peep.

Now some like this would have to be in the right situation where the ones torturing would have thought out the most painful way possible of dying such as the Romans did. This puts Jesus in very good position to be the candidate for the most pain endured before dying. I admit no one can claim for sure but at the very least very few would be in this position.

[BIG ACH]

This is difficult to understand if you are not a Christian. The Bible says for wages of sin is death and Jesus never sinned but he paid the wages of sin. So he paid for our sins by dying cause he never had any of his own. Had he sinned then died on the cross our sins would not have been paid for cause his death would have only covered his sins, you get it?

Thank you onetimehard For that explanation ...


I have openly admitted on the forum that I am generally a nonbeliever, even though I was raised in a Muslim household, but I do genuinely enjoy the historical aspects and the teachings of many religions.  I Attended catholic church Sunday mass for 6 straight weeks, and don't everybody jump on me, but I saw that there are many Similarities between Christianity and Islam.... and not to sound cliche, but I watched The Passion of the Christ to learn more about the history (regardless of how accurate or inaccurate it may be)

So OK, I get what you are saying....  Jesus never sinned and as a result had no debt in the eyes of god, but he suffered or paid the Debt for humanities sinning.  So does that mean everyones sins after Jesus are just wiped clean since the debt is already paid?  Or are people still held accountable for their sins?  I assume that they are still held accountable regardless, but then how exactly is this debt paid??  Like if Jesus paid the debt, why are people still then held accountable?

[OTHstrong]

Thank you onetimehard For that explanation ...


I have openly admitted on the forum that I am generally a nonbeliever, even though I was raised in a Muslim household, but I do genuinely enjoy the historical aspects and the teachings of many religions.  I Attended catholic church Sunday mass for 6 straight weeks, and don't everybody jump on me, but I saw that there are many Similarities between Christianity and Islam.... and not to sound cliche, but I watched The Passion of the Christ to learn more about the history (regardless of how accurate or inaccurate it may be)

So OK, I get what you are saying....  Jesus never sinned and as a result had no debt in the eyes of god, but he suffered or paid the Debt for humanities sinning.  So does that mean everyones sins after Jesus are just wiped clean since the debt is already paid?  Or are people still held accountable for their sins?  I assume that they are still held accountable regardless, but then how exactly is this debt paid??  Like if Jesus paid the debt, why are people still then held accountable?

The way it works is that the option of having your sins forgiven is there for everyone but only the ones that have accepted Jesus in their heart will be given the gift of salvation. So if you accept Jesus, you then accept he died for our sins. Your sins are not wiped out per se, you will still be judged for them, however the punishment or your sentence has already been served. So for the one that do not accept Jesus, by doing so you are rejecting his offer of `him dying for your sins`so him dying for our sins is not automatic, You either accept the offer or reject it.

 Now there is a feeling associated with accepting Jesus as your saviour and any Christian can tell you about this feeling, but of course most people will tell you that this feeling is baloney and blah blah blah. The feeling is distinct feeling, like jealousy, or like infatuating. But it is a real feeling and this feeling comes up everytime you are mean to someone or every time you do something wrong and it is something that causes you discomfort when you doing the wrong thing and it is not guilt but a strong feeling that was not there before I accepted Jesus as saviour.

So people say ``so you can accept Jesus and the kill people and your saved anyway`` it does not work that way. You won`t feel like killing someone.

[Primemuscle]

I have a question: How can you justify a god letting those kids get massacred in Connecticut? I don't want to hear the tried and true bullshit reply: It was gods will/plan!  So.... his plan, was to let 5 and 6 year olds to get shot in the face at point blank range?  Not my god.

God has nothing to do with these horrors, IMO. It is wrong to either blame God for people's failings or to suggest that it was god's will. "My" God wants only good. It is people who fuck things up.

[BIG ACH]

The way it works is that the option of having your sins forgiven is there for everyone but only the ones that have accepted Jesus in their heart will be given the gift of salvation. So if you accept Jesus, you then accept he died for our sins. Your sins are not wiped out per se, you will still be judged for them, however the punishment or your sentence has already been served. So for the one that do not accept Jesus, by doing so you are rejecting his offer of `him dying for your sins`so him dying for our sins is not automatic, You either accept the offer or reject it.

 Now there is a feeling associated with accepting Jesus as your saviour and any Christian can tell you about this feeling, but of course most people will tell you that this feeling is baloney and blah blah blah. The feeling is distinct feeling, like jealousy, or like infatuating. But it is a real feeling and this feeling comes up everytime you are mean to someone or every time you do something wrong and it is something that causes you discomfort when you doing the wrong thing and it is not guilt but a strong feeling that was not there before I accepted Jesus as saviour.

So people say ``so you can accept Jesus and the kill people and your saved anyway`` it does not work that way. You won`t feel like killing someone.

In The christian faith Is Jesus dying for your sins, directly correlated to 'confession'?


Thank you for answering my questions.

[Primemuscle]

Yet every priest in the world likes you to pray to god.  If he doesn't intervene then why pray to him asking him for things?

Perhaps this explains why I don't pray.

[tbombz]

I do genuinely enjoy the historical aspects and the teachings of many religions. 

you would find it interesting to know that the stories in the old testament about the kings of judah were written by the scribes employed by the kings who were created the scriptures as a way to legitemate the rule of the king in the eyes of the people and in the eyes of other kings in neighboring regions. the scribes would rewrite the history of how the king came to power, saying it was god's will and the king was commanded by the lord to act in the way he did on his path to power. they were written in such a manner as to appease the spiritual longings of the poor, they had to be wise enough in order to garner belief in their validity so the scribes worked very hard to produce literature that would speak truth to peoples hearts while educating them about the "legitemacy" of the kings rule, how it is god's will, etc.

[Primemuscle]

Then why would he (supposedly) judge us at all?  So he will sit back on the sidelines, and watch all the atrocities of the world?  Then, one day, he will decide that he will come down and judge us all?  The bible version of god/jesus does not exist.  I would believe of a superior race of beings in space, before that.  Remember, it is mathematically impossible for there not to be other life in space. That makes the whole Jesus/bible thing null and void.  I think god exists, it's just not who all of you think he/they are.

Some religions teach their practitioners that God judges and a few don't. I believe God does not judge.

[BIG ACH]

you would find it interesting to know that the stories in the old testament about the kings of judah were written by the scribes employed by the kings who were created the scriptures as a way to legitemate the rule of the king in the eyes of the people and in the eyes of other kings in neighboring regions. the scribes would rewrite the history of how the king came to power, saying it was god's will and the king was commanded by the lord to act in the way he did on his path to power. they were written in such a manner as to appease the spiritual longings of the poor, they had to be wise enough in order to garner belief in their validity so the scribes worked very hard to produce literature that would speak truth to peoples hearts while educating them about the "legitemacy" of the kings rule, how it is god's will, etc.

Tbombz, I imagine a lot or historical writings are done in a similar fashion.  Just goes with the trade I guess?

[tbombz]

Tbombz, I imagine a lot or historical writings are done in a similar fashion.  Just goes with the trade I guess?

yeah. as the old saying goes "history is written by the winners"

[Primemuscle]

This is difficult to understand if you are not a Christian.

I find comments like this to be a total cop out. What you really mean to say is that this is difficult to understand if you do not believe as I do. It has nothing to do with being a Christian.

[Primemuscle]

There's no meaning to anything, complete random chaos.

We're just animals like any other with the sole purpose of reproducing and complete insignificant specks in this universe of trillions of stars.

Some of us "animals" believe we are slightly more intelligent then the rest of the animals, which means we are not exactly like any other animal or that our sole purpose is to reproduce.

[OTHstrong]

I find comments like this to be a total cop out. What you really mean to say is that this is difficult to understand if you do not believe as I do. It has nothing to do with being a Christian.

Well then you did not understand what I said, read again and don`t jump the gun with a false stupid statement. Difficult to understand if you don't know the story line is what I meant by saying that. not diffcult to understand cause you don`t believe what I believe, where did you come up with that brainiac.

[Primemuscle]

Well then you did not understand what I said, read again and don`t jump the gun with a false stupid statement. Difficult to understand if you don't know the story line is what I meant by saying that. not diffcult to understand cause you don`t believe what I believe, where did you come up with that brainiac.

If you wish to be understood, try making sense....which is something you've failed to do in this post.

[OTHstrong]

If you wish to be understood, try making sense....which is something you've failed to do in this post.

Are you done nitpicking

[Griffith]

Some of us "animals" believe we are slightly more intelligent then the rest of the animals, which means we are not exactly like any other animal or that our sole purpose is to reproduce.

At our core, that is our instinct, but because of intelligence we can use contraception to still have sex and carry on with our natural instincts, just like any other animal.

We're 'intelligent' because we developed speech, which allowed a different type of thinking process and also allowed for better transfer of information and thus faster brain development.

[Primemuscle]

Are you done nitpicking

Just looking for some clarity.

In reference to your original post. I don't believe Jesus died for my sins. It's not that I haven't sinned, because I have. I just did it a very long time after Jesus was crucified. 

[OTHstrong]

Just looking for some clarity.

In reference to your original post. I don't believe Jesus died for my sins. It's not that I haven't sinned, because I have. I just did it a very long time after Jesus was crucified. 

Hey, I am not breathing this down people`s throats, I was asked a question and I answered from A Christians perspective, to each their own, I ain`t judging you or saying I am right, you are wrong, non of that just answering the question as my duty to do so as a Christian.

[Primemuscle]

Hey, I am not breathing this down people`s throats, I was asked a question and I answered from A Christians perspective, to each their own, I ain`t judging you or saying I am right, you are wrong, non of that just answering the question as my duty to do so as a Christian.

I apologize if I suggested you were forcing your beliefs on me or anyone else. I may have mistakenly lumped you in with some "Christians" I know who often preach that their way is the only way. I have no problem with you answering questions from a Christian perspective. There is room in this life for many beliefs, IMO.

[OTHstrong]

I apologize if I suggested you were forcing your beliefs on me or anyone else. I may have mistakenly lumped you in with some "Christians" I know who often preach that their way is the only way. I have no problem with you answering questions from a Christian perspective. There is room in this life for many beliefs, IMO.

Well those Christians are stupid, that kind of behavior makes people hate Christianity even more. No one can tell anyone what to believe, it is up to them to find what they feel is the right path. I am often embarrassed on how some Christians behave.