Estimate Trey Brewer's current bodyfat

[Thealmightyronald]

personally, when I got fat (223 at absolute highest), I looked like shit, but I was very strong.

At 176, I look much better, have more muscle, and am growing better, but I'm weak as shit in comparison.

I'd like to know what works better.  Bulking up was way more fun.

Bulking up is fun, but so is cutting. I like cutting because I looks bigger in the end and maintain my strength pretty well.  But yeah, im interested in what works better too.

[240 is Back]

Bulking up is fun, but so is cutting. I like cutting because I looks bigger in the end and maintain my strength pretty well.  But yeah, im interested in what works better too.

I've only seen this discussion once, in Troponin's book:
http://www.troponinnutrition.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=26&Itemid=51

Justin writes that 10-12% is best, and gives a host of reasons that make a lot of sense.  The book is in the bathroom, I'll dig it up later.

When I see these Trey pics at 25% bodyfat, it goes against what you see in most top NPC/pro pics - visible veins and goo shape - and it goes against that 12% range, way over that.

Trey's getting criticized on a few of the boards for going so heavy, so I know it's not just me scratching my head on the topic.

[Thealmightyronald]

I've only seen this discussion once, in Troponin's book:
http://www.troponinnutrition.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=26&Itemid=51

Justin writes that 10-12% is best, and gives a host of reasons that make a lot of sense.  The book is in the bathroom, I'll dig it up later.

When I see these Trey pics at 25% bodyfat, it goes against what you see in most top NPC/pro pics - visible veins and goo shape - and it goes against that 12% range, way over that.

Trey's getting criticized on a few of the boards for going so heavy, so I know it's not just me scratching my head on the topic.

Thanks for the link.

I was on MD today and they were talking pretty bad about him over there too.

[240 is Back]

Trey is a monster, and he'll probably turn pro.  not the prettiest lines, but in 2 years he'll outmass everyone.

The optimal body fat % (for both users and naturals) to gain muscle is a topic that is rarely discussed, and pretty damn important.

[240 is Back]

Thanks for the link.

http://www.troponinnutrition.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=26&Itemid=51

The book is great.  He said in radio interview that it's actually designed to be read in the bathroom - one or two Q & A per page, divided into section (general, offseason, dieting, etc).

Some things are basics, some are advanced.  Lots of common sense nutrition stuff.   Justin Harris and Layne Norton are, IMO, the two best nutrition minds that we're lucky enough to be able to find on the forums.

[gh15]

he is not as fat looking as he truly is since he carry lots of muscle on him,,in reality this is too fat,,this is not the way to grow,,yes you gain fat offseason you should gain fat offseason but always always make sure you can see your abs in some form even if outline only,,the reason is if you dont then you will have a lot of work and a lot of weight to lose and rely on duretics and ephedrine  too much and the end result will be flat ,,now his physiqe is nothing to write home about when it comes to arms ,,that even makes him look more fat,,

you can see dnp written all over this guy ,,he is very young ,,have strong chunky build but simply destroying his shape by the month because you are seeing infront of your eyes the beggining of valentinos and bad versions of mike queen,,you see infront of your eyes someone who really wanna be big but doesnt have the muscle shape to make it as a top professional

his bodyfat is 22-25% according to the gym picture presented and he has a lot of muscle that is far far far from fully developed,,,lots of drug here friends,,the problem is the muscles that really count are not there,,,a guy at 300lb shoudl have chest screaming out of him no matter 20% or not,,his arms should be seperated well if it was truly muscle but its not,,,big shoulders...legs are very good but this type of guy would have big legs no matter what its american irish they all have big legs they dont need to weork them

[columbusdude82]

gh15, why do you hate so much?

[Meltdown]

It's not hate just a little truth.

[gh15]

gh15, why do you hate so much?

i dotn ,,he has good physiqe for a gym rat and um placing 15-16 in national stage,,this is common to many guys in america,,,they are usually cops and work good shifts,,they always 280lb with gut from here to china ,,,they always build blocky,,they never win professional cards ,,they are very good at coming to gym and look big and impressive with t shirt on but in reality you put 220lb bodybuilder next to them and in most cases 190lb bodybuilder next to them and they dissapear into the darkness,,

i stoped counting the times i have seen 195lb bodybuilders that can wash the floor with this fella,,hell take matt t for example he at 173 pounds? wash the floor with this fella,,,itas just that bodybuilding became a joke and the sad result is demonstrated by this lifter

[Red Hook]

I'm not ripping on Trey... I'm a huge fan.  The offseason training pieces he does in MD are my favorite part of the magazine, definitely more real than the "oiled up wearing workboots the day after the show cheering each other on" pics that look so contrived.

I'm just curious about his methods, and looking to see what others think.  Many bodybuilders believe you make the best gains at the 10-12% bodyfat area, for hormonal reasons - I think the very wise troponin's book cites 10-12% at the ideal area, that estrogen and other factors are problems when you bulk at 20%.

Plus, like most people here, I'm here to learn how to gain muscle.  Will trey gain more or less muscle at 25+% bodyfat than he would at 12%?

this just means that he will have to diet longer and harder, look at Heath's offseason pics...he was pretty lean and he made tremendous gains

Rob, does this mean that you will be a serious contender for mr.getbig this year?

[240 is Back]

Rob, does this mean that you will be a serious contender for mr.getbig this year?

I'm not going to commit, of course.  I've never been good at staying consistent. 

[HTexan]

Lots of bodybuilders and powerlifters get them when making huge mass gains in a short period of time.

im starting to get some in the some place Im going to buy some vitamin E lotion tomorrow....... 

[Da Freak]

So whats the big deal about this dude? He looks shitty, has no arms and will prolly never make the top 3 of any major contest. Just hype? 

[DVSGOD]

he is not as fat looking as he truly is since he carry lots of muscle on him,,in reality this is too fat,,this is not the way to grow,,yes you gain fat offseason you should gain fat offseason but always always make sure you can see your abs in some form even if outline only,,the reason is if you dont then you will have a lot of work and a lot of weight to lose and rely on duretics and ephedrine  too much and the end result will be flat ,,now his physiqe is nothing to write home about when it comes to arms ,,that even makes him look more fat,,

you can see dnp written all over this guy ,,he is very young ,,have strong chunky build but simply destroying his shape by the month because you are seeing infront of your eyes the beggining of valentinos and bad versions of mike queen,,you see infront of your eyes someone who really wanna be big but doesnt have the muscle shape to make it as a top professional

his bodyfat is 22-25% according to the gym picture presented and he has a lot of muscle that is far far far from fully developed,,,lots of drug here friends,,the problem is the muscles that really count are not there,,,a guy at 300lb shoudl have chest screaming out of him no matter 20% or not,,his arms should be seperated well if it was truly muscle but its not,,,big shoulders...legs are very good but this type of guy would have big legs no matter what its american irish they all have big legs they dont need to weork them

HAHAHA "Mike Queen"   

[KillerMonk]

Can someone explain Bulking to Kevin Levrone.

Also a natural bulking is going to get a big letdown.

[cht868]

i dotn ,,he has good physiqe for a gym rat and um placing 15-16 in national stage,,this is common to many guys in america,,,they are usually cops and work good shifts,,they always 280lb with gut from here to china ,,,they always build blocky,,they never win professional cards ,,they are very good at coming to gym and look big and impressive with t shirt on but in reality you put 220lb bodybuilder next to them and in most cases 190lb bodybuilder next to them and they dissapear into the darkness,,

i stoped counting the times i have seen 195lb bodybuilders that can wash the floor with this fella,,hell take matt t for example he at 173 pounds? wash the floor with this fella,,,itas just that bodybuilding became a joke and the sad result is demonstrated by this lifter

gh15=matt t!!!

[Red Hook]

Quincy Taylor..............(remember Shawn Ray's offseason pics?!?!?!)

you "bulk up" ........hence you can handle heavier weights (heavier weights = more muscle!)

it's a time proven method (trying to stay lean year after year show after show = you look the same/never make gains)

every single pro does it! (some like Gaspari wouldn't let his photo be taken )

is that your secret for your massive legs development?

[Red Hook]

Trey is a young guy................he needs to do this

for someone like Jay cutler..............he is not going to get much bigger (it's all about refinement)

but make no mistake to get really huge/big you gotta eat big/lift big and sleep big in the "offseason"

it would take you 3 times as long/if ever trying to stay lean/ripped and just add quality muscle.........
aint gunna happen!!!

phil is young also and his offseason pics look like he is 8 weeks out

[Red Hook]

I've seen a few guys in person, and I've spent enough time on getbig to see a million guest posing pics.

The guys are big as houses, definitely.  But you can still see a lot of muscle.  Not ripping on Trey- I really hope he wins his pro card - but his muscles don't have the shape you see in top tier NPC guys and pros.  most pros don't get that fat.

I just want to know at what % the human body makes the most muscle gains -

10 to 12%

OR

25 to 30%

I always go back to this article

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1268956

"To gain size you have to eat, right? I think we can all agree with that. If you're a natural trainee you won't be able to add a significant amount of muscle mass unless you're consuming enough calories and nutrients to support muscle growth. If you're not ingesting enough nutrients, your body won't be in an optimal muscle-building state. In fact, if you don't eat enough, chances are you might even lose muscle mass despite training hard.

So on the surface it looks like the good ol' advice about following the ''see food diet'' to grow bigger seems logical. The more you eat the more you grow, right?

 

Not so fast!

While it's true that if you aren't consuming enough nutrients your muscle growth will be impaired, it doesn't necessarily mean that the more you eat the more you grow. Actually, it is true: the more you eat the bigger you'll get. However, this doesn't mean that you'll become more muscular!

This brings me to one of my biggest pet peeves and what I believe to be one of the biggest mistakes a person can make when training to build an aesthetic and muscular physique: eating way too much junk to grow bigger and accepting a large body fat gain in hope of stimulating more muscle growth.

You see, when you're a natural trainee your body has a limited capacity to build muscle. The amount of muscle you can build is dependent on your body's capacity to synthesize new muscle tissue from the ingested protein. Your body's protein synthesis capacities are dependent on your natural Testosterone levels, your Testosterone to cortisol ratio, your insulin sensitivity, and your muscle fiber makeup, among other things.

You can eat any amount of food you want; you simply can't change your protein synthesis limit naturally. Eating more food than your body can use to build muscle will simply lead to more body fat being gained.
"

[Red Hook]

i dotn ,,he has good physiqe for a gym rat and um placing 15-16 in national stage,,this is common to many guys in america,,,they are usually cops and work good shifts,,they always 280lb with gut from here to china ,,,they always build blocky,,they never win professional cards ,,they are very good at coming to gym and look big and impressive with t shirt on but in reality you put 220lb bodybuilder next to them and in most cases 190lb bodybuilder next to them and they dissapear into the darkness,,

i stoped counting the times i have seen 195lb bodybuilders that can wash the floor with this fella,,hell take matt t for example he at 173 pounds? wash the floor with this fella,,,itas just that bodybuilding became a joke and the sad result is demonstrated by this lifter

GH, what do you recommend for MattC..how can we get him to MattT's level?

[noodrin]

Team BSN nutritionist is Hany Rambod, isnt it?

then no problem, he take pro card @USA

[240 is Back]

I remember that t-nation article also... it matches what Troponin says... getting 20+% isn't conductive for muscle growth.

I'm really surprised more hasn't been written on the topic.

[michael arvilla]

lol!....................ever yones/bodies are different (what works for Dexter Jackson prolly won't work for Trey Brewer)
Justin (Troponin) is incredibly knowledgeable about nutrition............tha t being said find out what works for YOUR body (experiment with different things/methods)

sitting on the crapper reading Justins book like it's the Bible ain't gunna help
i agree with GH in that you probably shouldn't let your abs dissapear (that's a good guideline to follow to tell your getting too fat)

Rob (240) you over-analyze things.................t hrow some heavy iron around,eat every 3- 4 hours (good food!/shakes)....sleep 8-10 hours per night

you will grow!

[240 is Back]

everyones/bodies are different (what works for Dexter Jackson prolly won't work for Trey Brewer)

While there are variances - Dex has a faster metabolism - would the body's chemistry be all that different?

Scientifically, why would Dexter make better gains at 12% than at 30%, and why would brewer make better gains at 12% than 30%?

This is just for the sake of debate... if Trey is flat at the Jr nats, then we'll see maybe overdieting to compensate for over bodyfat isn't the way to go.  if he has a new inch or two on his arms and chest, then yes, Trey laughs last, and he knew what he was doing all along.

Scientifically though - I'd like to know what is the most effective bodyfat range for gaining muscle:
10 to 12%
or
25 to 30%
or
doesn't matter
or
"depends", which will require an explanation.

[michael arvilla]

While there are variances - Dex has a faster metabolism - would the body's chemistry be all that different?

Scientifically, why would Dexter make better gains at 12% than at 30%, and why would brewer make better gains at 12% than 30%?

This is just for the sake of debate... if Trey is flat at the Jr nats, then we'll see maybe overdieting to compensate for over bodyfat isn't the way to go.  if he has a new inch or two on his arms and chest, then yes, Trey laughs last, and he knew what he was doing all along.

Scientifically though - I'd like to know what is the most effective bodyfat range for gaining muscle:
10 to 12%
or
25 to 30%
or
doesn't matter
or
"depends", which will require an explanation.

There is no "most effective range" (so many variables/anabolics/age/weight/metabolism etc)..............to gain muscle you must cause trauma to the muscle tissue (in effect breaking the tissue down and forcing it to build it self up just a little bit bigger/stronger to adapt/get ready in case it faces this new found stress ie: weight training again)
you must overload the body with protien (and yes carbs) ...........think of putting a glass out in a rain shower
the glass doesn't find the one or two drops of rain ..............it's overloaded with rain (protien) so the glass get's filled!
you cannot stay lean (ripped) and make major gains (bulk up keeping your abs visible) use heavier weights which in turn gives you bigger muscles!,it's not rocket science (altho some supplement companies would like you to think so)
we as bodybuilders are never satisfied/content.we always strive to get bigger/better (it's an ongoing process)
when you are satisfied that's when your gains will stop!
"Eat Big,Lift Big,Sleep Big"