Author Topic: Universal Healthcare  (Read 2703 times)

Colossus_500

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Universal Healthcare
« on: July 08, 2008, 06:18:08 AM »

Health Care Horror Stories

Across the globe, citizens of nations with government-run health care systems experience long wait times, a lack of access to certain treatments and, in some instances, a diminished quality of medical care. Navigate the links below to learn more about patients’ health care horror stories.

“I wouldn’t like to see Americans make the same mistake Canadians have made… Patients in Canada are treated like Third World citizens. Our health-care system is like Cuba or North Korea.”
- Lindsay McCreith (Brain tumor patient, Canada)

“This country would be nowhere without its elderly population. We have always worked and paid our taxes. It seems most unfair that we’ve got nothing at the end of it.”
- Dawn Ford (Eye disease patient, UK)

“I’m a person who left school at 15 and I’ve worked all my life and I’ve paid into the system, and I’m not going to live long enough to get my old-age pension from this government.”
- Debbie Hirsts (Breast cancer patient, UK)

“Once you have had the diagnosis you want to have the thing done. The longer it is in your body, the more chance it has of spreading.”
- Linda Lucas (Breast cancer patient, UK)

“There should be somewhere closer. No one with breast cancer should have to go on such a long journey, particularly when we are not feeling too good anyway.”
- Muriel Buckley (Breast cancer patient, UK)
The United Kingdom
Alan Francis

Alan Francis, a 68-year-old leukaemia patient, was denied a life-saving bone marrow operation by the Health Commission Wales (HCW). The HCW would have refused to fund the operation, which would have entailed taking the marrow from the donor in Australia and flying it to the UK.

    * “Agency under review after transplant row” South Wales Evening Post (27 February 2008) http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=161389

Alan Peasnell

Alan Peasnell, 60, was told he needed keyhole surgery on his knee. He thought he would have to wait a few months for an operation, but the mechanical engineer from Peterborough ended up waiting for more than a year. “I went to see the consultant with a knee problem,” Mr. Peasnell said. “After MRI scans and X-rays they decided in early February last year that I required an operation. They sent me a letter saying that I’d have the operation within a few months. But from the time of a consultant saying I’d been put on the waiting list to getting the operation it was 13 months. While this was all going on some days I couldn’t walk at all. I was in pain and on anti-inflammatories. It harmed my quality of life. People who are in pain like I was shouldn’t be kept waiting.”

    * “Patient promised knee operation within months had to wait a year” The Times, By Patrick Foster (June 7, 2007) http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article1896222.ece

Allan Lloyd

Allan Lloyd, from Hereford, said he traveled 7,000 miles to take his wife to a hospital in Cheltenham to receive her cancer treatment. It took 210 hours and cost £750 in petrol.

    * “Cancer patient, 87, forced to travel 500 miles a week” The Guardian, By Steven Morris (April 4, 2006) http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/apr/04/health.healthandwellbeing

Andrew Lawson

Andrew Lawson, a 48 year-old NHS doctor, was diagnosed with pulmonary mesothelioma. He said, “treatments are available now, but in parts of the UK the drug that is used as a frontline treatment is not available on the NHS. This is because for each year of (quality-adjusted) life it brings it costs more than £30,000. [If you are] diagnosed with a mesothelioma in Scotland, Australia and many European countries, you will receive the drug – but not in England.”

    * “My surreal side: doctor to patient” The Sunday Times, By Dr. Andrew Lawson (May 27, 2007) http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/health/article1844501.ece

Andrew Melville

Andrew Melville, 50, was refused the drug Tarceva by the NHS, despite being told by doctors it could prolong his life. The father-of-one died on February 11. Now Mr Melville’s sister, Pat Myatt, wants all patients refused drugs on the NHS to form an action group. Her aim is to take on the Government over the issue.

    * “Family vow to step up drugs fight” The Sentinel (UK), By Richard Ault (26 February 2008) http://www.thesentinel.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=158338

Christine Preuth

Christine Preuth, 72, of Keywood Avenue, a Sunbury pensioner, was told she was too old to receive treatment for a head injury at Ashford 24 Hour Walk-In Centre. While making her daily trip to the shops on Beechwood Avenue she tripped and fell on the pavement. Bleeding from the head and concerned she may be suffering from concussion, she went to the centre for a check up. But the check up was cut short when another nurse said she was not able to received full treatment because she was over 65 and her complaint was a head injury.

    * “Woman, 72, ‘too old for treatment’” This is Local London, By Louise Hale (May 30, 2006) http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/news/topstories/display.var.774601.0.woman_72

David Swain

David Swain, a terminal cancer patient, was refused a drug by the NHS that could extend his life - despite offering to pay part of the cost himself. His offer to meet the monthly £2,000 cost of Erbitux was refused, he said, because the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (Nice) ruled it was too expensive.

    * “Cancer patient denied ‘too costly’ drug” The Yorkshire Post (UK) (4 March 2008) http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/Cancer-patient-denied-39too-costly39.3839326.jp

Dawn Ford

Dawn Ford, 67, had to pay out-of-pocket to receive Avastin, an as yet unlicensed, form of Lucentis. The Echo (UK publication) launched its “Save Our Sight” campaign last year in a bid to make Lucentis and Macugen - another vital drug - available on the NHS.

    * “Calls for guidance on treatment for cause of blindness” Express & Echo (UK) (19 February 2008) http://www.thisisexeter.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=137015
    * “Dawn Faces Up to Losing Her Sight” Express & Echo (UK) (24 March 2008) http://www.thisisexeter.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=136993
    * “Health Trust Reviews Eye Treatment Policy” Express & Echo (UK) By Nadia Stone (5 April 2008) http://www.thisisexeter.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=142328

Debbie Hirsts

Debbie Hirsts, 57, was denied access by the NHS to a drug that would have slowed the progression of her breast cancer. With her oncologist’s support, Debbie decided to raise the $120,000 for the medicine herself. The situation changed in December 2007, when Debbie’s doctor told her the NHS would no longer allow her to subsidize the medication. If Debbie decided to pay for the medicine out-of-pocket, she would then need pay for all of her cancer treatments, which she could not afford, and would no longer receive free health benefits from the NHS.

    * “Paying Patients Test British Health Care System” The New York Times, By Sarah Lyall (February 21, 2008) http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/21/world/europe/21britain.html

Deborah Sugg Ryan

Deborah Sugg Ryan, a breast cancer patient, was denied a £20 test for HER2, a protein which affects the growth of cancer cells, at Derriford Hospital back in October.

    * “Penryn cancer patient’s case ‘a scandal’ says MP” The West Briton, By Ginette Harris (28 February 2008) http://www.thisiscornwall.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=144143

Jacky Pickles

Jacky Pickles, 44, said that after 25 years working in the NHS, she will have to give the final years of her life to a Health Service that refuses to save her. Her condition improved when she went on a Velcade drug trial earlier this year, but has now been told that she will not get the drug again when her condition deteriorates. She said: “I am absolutely devastated by NICE’s decision. I believe that Patricia Hewitt has, through the back door of NICE, encouraged a new policy that saves the NHS money by condemning patients to an early death which means they are less of a financial burden both in the short term and the long term.

    * “Medical apartheid as English cancer patients are denied life-extending drug” The Daily Mail, By Tim Shipman (October 20, 2006) http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=411521

Jane Hewitt

Jane Hewitt, 58, who lives in Whitchurch, was diagnosed with breast cancer in 2004. She underwent a lumpectomy on January 6 and then a mastectomy on February 3, 2006. Her surgeon recommended a course of Herceptin but Bristol South and West PCT refused to pay for it. She appealed but was turned down because the PCT said there were no exceptional circumstances in her case. Mrs. Hewitt, took a lump sum from her pension and has so far paid out £9,500 for her three weekly injections.

    * “Cancer patient won’t have to pay for drugs” The Bristol Evening Post, By Julie Harding (July 3, 2006) (Subscription Required)

Linda Lucas

Linda Lucas, a 51-year-old teacher from Cupar, Fife, was diagnosed with breast cancer and given a surgery wait time of 8-9 weeks. She had medical insurance and chose “to go private,” resulting in a mastectomy three weeks later.

    * “Scots cancer victims face deadly delays in treatment” The Scotsman, By Eddie Barnes and Richard Gray (June 25, 2006) http://news.scotsman.com/bowelcancer/Scots-cancer-victims-face-deadly.2786941.jp
    * “The Sufferer: ‘No treatment – but cells multiplying’” The Scotsman (November 29, 2006)

Lynda Coghill

Lynda Coghill, was diagnosed with ovarian cancer at 39. At an appointment after surgery and radiation, she told her oncologist she was still bleeding. He did a quick exam, announced she had a new tumor, and said bluntly: “Your chances are slim to none.” He told her to wait a few weeks for the results of a biopsy, then left to treat a patient down the hall. “I looked at the nurse in sheer disbelief,” Ms. Coghill says. “The doctor had proceeded to tell me, in less than 30 seconds, that I was going to die.” She cried for days, unable to eat or sleep. She and her husband planned her funeral. At last, she contacted the sympathetic nurse from the doctor’s office and persuaded her to call for an “unofficial” biopsy report. The tumor was benign. Eight years later, Ms. Coghill remains angry about having been treated “like a numbered object on an assembly line.”

    * “I made noise, and things moved,” The Globe and Mail, By Erin Anderssen (December 9, 2006) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20061209.wxcancer-front09/BNStory/cancer/

Margaret Coates

Margaret Coates, 65, has been diagnosed with age-related Macular Degeneration (AMD). Despite the availability of sight-saving drugs, Coates was told by Bromley Primary Care Trust (PCT) that she does not qualify for NHS-funded treatment.

    * “Pensioner denied funding for ’sight-saving’ drugs” News Shopper (UK), By Robert Fisk (11 March 2008) http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/mostpopular.var.2110483.mostviewed.pensioner_denied
    * “Pensioner refused sight treatment” Channel 4 News (Belfast) (11 March 2008) http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/society/health/pensioner+refused+sight+treatment/1755862

Nurse Marie Robjohn

Nurse Marie Robjohn, 60, was billed for £10,000 for Herceptin. She then received a letter from North Somerset PCT saying it would wait until the final NICE guidelines were published and then write to her oncologist to ask if he considers her a priority. She said, “what infuriates me is that my oncologist has already written to the PCT - they know his opinion. The trust is procrastinating.” Mrs. Robjohn, who needs eight more injections, said a delay could cost her and other patients thousands.”

    * “Cancer patient won’t have to pay for drugs” The Bristol Evening Post, By Julie Harding (July, 3 2006) (Subscription Required)

Mark Cannon

Mark Cannon, 30, died eight and a half weeks after being admitted to the hospital with a broken leg. He was clearly distressed and in pain, but he had to wait three days to see the pain team. His father Allan, from Barton Turf, has been campaigning with Mencap to raise awareness of the ingrained discrimination he claims to have encountered from NHS staff towards his son, who had severe learning difficulties and could manage very little speech.

    * “I welcome inquiry into my son’s death” Evening News (Norwich) (June 4, 2007) http://new.eveningnews24.co.uk/content/News/story.aspx?brand=ENOnline
    * To find out more about Mencap’s campaign for equal heath care treatment for people with a learning disability, visit www.mencap.org.uk/deathbyindifference

Martyn Sumner

Martyn Sumner, a kidney cancer patient, has been denied a life-prolonging ‘wonder drug’ by Oxfordshire NHS officials because he is not considered an “exceptional case”. Sumner has been given ten months to live.

    * “New row over cancer drug denial” The Oxford Times, By Victoria Owen (26 January 2008) http://www.theoxfordtimes.net/search/display.var.1996633.0.new_row_over_cancer_drug_denial.php


Colossus_500

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2008, 06:18:41 AM »
Need more....

Muriel Buckby

Muriel Buckby, an 87-year-old woman with breast cancer, must travel more than 500 miles a week for treatment because of a lack of local services. She has to make three 175-mile round trips every week from her home in mid-Wales to a radiotherapy unit in Cheltenham, Gloucestershire. Each journey takes her more than four hours by car. “There should be somewhere closer. No one with breast cancer should have to go on such a long journey, particularly when we are not feeling too good anyway.” Health campaigners said Mrs. Buckby’s case highlights the problem of specialized cancer centers serving large catchment areas. Patients in rural areas have to travel considerable distances several times a week, and sometimes daily, to get the treatment they need.

    * “Cancer patient, 87, forced to travel 500 miles a week” The Guardian, By Steven Morris (April 4, 2006) http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/apr/04/health.healthandwellbeing

Rose Harrison

Rose Harrison, 59, of Barlby, was diagnosed with terminal kidney cancer in April 2007. According to Harrison’s doctors, the drug Sunitinib, also known as Sutent, could extend her life by up to five years. But Harrison was refused funding by North Yorkshire and York Primary Care Trust (PCT), despite patients in neighboring County Durham and Teesside being approved for treatment. Harrison and her husband, Ronald, 60, spent their life savings on the treatment.

    * “A Terminally-ill woman denied cancer drug,” The Yorkshire Post, By Julie Hemmings (30 August 2007) http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/ATerminallyill-woman-denied-cancer-drug.3161513.jp

Sarah Perez

Sarah Perez, from Enfield, has undergone repeated courses of chemotherapy since she first developed bowel cancer six years ago. Her oncologist says the only drug that could help is Cetuximab, but Enfield Primary Care Trust will not pay for it, saying it has to balance the drug’s chances of success over NHS resources.

    * “Cancer patient told new drug is too costly” The Evening Standard (February 12, 2008) http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23437056-details/Cancer+patient+told

Canada
Beverly Green

Beverly Green, 45, was diagnosed with breast cancer in 2001. Initial tests indicated she would not benefit from hormonal drug treatment, but retesting at Mount Sinai Hospital in 2005 found that her initial test results were incorrect. Green testified at a public inquiry in March 2008.

    * “Angry patients testify at breast cancer test inquiry” CTV.ca News (March 19, 2008) http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080319/breast_cancer

Branislav Djukic

Branislav Djukic, an Ontario cab driver, faced a difficult choice: Wait more than 14 weeks for cancer surgery, or travel outside of Canada and purchase the lifesaving operation. Ultimately, Djukic returned to the country he fled in 1995, the former Yugoslavia. In Belgrade, he underwent surgery to remove a portion of his left kidney at a cost of $5,000.

    * “Long wait forces cancer patient to buy operation in land he fled; Patient’s choice: Wait 14 weeks or pay $5,000,” The Globe and Mail, By Lisa Priest (January 31, 2007) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/Page/document/v5/content/subscribe… (Subscription Required)
    * “Londoner Travels to Yugoslavia For Cancer Treatment,” A-Channel News http://www.achannel.ca/london/news_40168.aspx

David Malleau

David Malleau, a 44 year-old truck driver suffered a devastating car accident in 2004 that forced doctors at Hamilton General Hospital to remove a fist-sized piece of bone from his skull to relieve pressure on his brain. Once the swelling subsided and he was ready for surgery in March 2005, Malleau was sent home and placed on a waiting list. Three months passed. Then six. He waited at home, a prisoner unable to leave the house for fear something would hit the exposed side of his brain - for him a potentially fatal incident. In the end, it took nearly a year before he could get skull replacement surgery.

    * “You can’t fight the hospital; Man forced to wait a year for skull surgery had no official advocate,” The Toronto Star, By Tanya Talaga and Robert Cribb (May 22, 2007) http://www.thestar.com/article/216280

Diane Nesenbrink

Diane Nesenbrink, was goofing around as a teen when her jaw locked open. That incident, 27 years ago, marked the beginning of the Stratford, Ontario, woman’s lifelong ordeal with jaw joint problems. Ms. Nesenbrink jaw joint needed to be surgically replaced. But patients who need a new hip or knee have been deemed a political priority and are guaranteed joint replacements within nine months – the “medically acceptable” wait for consultation is no more than three months and the subsequent wait for surgery no more than six months. Ms. Nesenbrink’s doctor, Dr. Baker said, “The jaw joint is an important joint as well, but we’ve been forgotten.” In fact, his patients wait an average of more than two years for surgery. Even critical cases – where patients suffer excruciating pain and are unable to move their mouths – wait at least three months. “We see patients who are in dire straits: Talking, eating, chewing, smiling are all difficult, if not impossible,” Dr. Baker said.

    * “A jaw-dropping wait time for surgery; While people who need new hips or knees get action within nine months, jaw joint patients can wait more than two years,” The Globe and Mail, By Andre Picard, (May 22, 2007) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070522.wxljaw22/BNStory/special

Jeff Clarke

Jeff Clarke, 34, was in a chronic state of pain for three years. The Kitchener man could stand for only 10 minutes at a time, sit for about 20 and then lie down again. The back pain, diagnosed as degenerative disc disease, travelled through his legs and often he buckled over as he tried to stand. He used two canes and a walker to get around. Then one night last November as he was watching TV, he saw a commercial about a Canadian company offering surgery in India. Clarke called the Vancouver-based business and within two days was sending his folder of medical information to the surgeon in Chennai, India. “All of a sudden there was hope, valid hope I could grasp,” he said. On Jan. 28, Clark had two titanium rods placed in his lower back, two reconstructed discs made of high-density plastic inserted, as well as screws to hold the discs together, all thanks to an Indian doctor.

    * “Kitchener man walks again after back surgery in India; ‘Still in a state of shock,’” The Kitchener-Waterloo Record, By Liz Monteiro (April 19, 2007) (Subscription Required)

Jordan Johanson

Jordan Johanson, 18, died at Rockyview Hospital in late March. He died following a 12-hour wait for surgery on his appendix. Darcy Johanson, the boy’s father, said “Young kids shouldn’t be dying like this. If something can be done to fix it, they should get on with it.”

    * “Families upset city health-care inquiry delayed; Five appendicitis deaths in 10 years at city hospitals,” The Calgary Herald, By Sean Myers (May 2, 2007) (Subscription Required)
    * “Teen dies after appendix ruptures,” The Edmonton Sun, By Bill Kaufman (April 19, 2007) http://www.edmontonsun.com/News/Alberta/2007/04/19/4078502.html

Lindsay McCreith

Lindsay McCreith, 66, was told he had a brain tumor but that he would have to wait four and a half months to obtain an MRI to rule out the possibility that it was cancerous. Unwilling to risk the progression of what might be cancer, Mr. McCreith obtained an MRI in Buffalo, which revealed the tumor was malignant. Even with this diagnosis in hand, the Ontario system still refused to provide timely treatment, so Mr. McCreith had surgery in Buffalo to remove the cancerous brain tumor in March, 2006. In Ontario, Mr. McCreith would have waited eight months for surgery, according to his family doctor. Eight months is enough time for a cancer to worsen, spread and progress to an irreversible stage. Had Mr. McCreith not paid $26,600 for immediate care, he might be dead today.

    * “Ontario man featured in U.S. health-care debate,” The Toronto Star, By Tim Harper (February 22, 2008) http://www.thestar.com/Article/305918
    * “Taking Ontario’s health monopoly to court,” The National Post, By John Carpay (May 3, 2007) http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=282c225e-cf2a-4c9d-a34d-35f03f0afa66
    * “Patients suing province over wait times,” The Toronto Star, By Tanya Talaga (September 6, 2007) http://www.thestar.com/News/article/253664

Manon Lemoignan

Manon Lemoignan, 46, a cancer patient and the mother of two girls, was denied access to a life-prolonging drug. Lemoignan’s oncologist at the Royal Victoria Hospital recommended the best therapy available, Avastin. The drug, however, had not yet been approved for use in Canada.

    * “Cancer drug has OK - it just isn’t available,” The Montreal Gazette, By Charlie Fidelman (March 27, 2006) http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/story.html?id=c5d9271c-d0be-42cd-8e0a

Rally Levy

Rally Levy, a breast cancer patient in Montreal, was denied eligibility for the drug Herceptin. Where she lives, the drug is only available to women with advanced breast cancer that has spread to other parts of the body. “If I started my chemo a month ago, I would have been on the trial group that was eligible,” said Rally Levy. “They have realized it is a good pill. Why can’t I get it?”

    * “Speed up cancer drug availability, critics urge,” CBC News (June 21, 2005) http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2005/06/21/Herceptin-050621.html

Sheila Nunn

Sheila Nunn, a Kitchener woman suffering seizures, was told by her doctor that she urgently needed an MRI scan. She was also told she would have to wait three months to have it done locally. Nunn, who had been suffering blackouts, memory loss, confusion and seizures for two months, decided to take action: She paid $1,100 to have the MRI scan done in Michigan.

    * “Seizure patients face long MRI waits, group says,” The Kitchener-Waterloo Record, By Anne Kelly (June 15, 2007) (Subscription Required)
    * “Wait for MRI tests too long in region,” The Kitchener-Waterloo Record (June 9, 2007) (Subscription Required)
    * “‘Totally Unacceptable,’” The Kitchener-Waterloo Record, By Anne Kelly (June 7, 2007) (Subscription Required)

Sheryl Smolkin

Sheryl Smolkin had been undergoing several months of assorted treatments for pain in her right knee, but the pain was still putting a crimp in her quality of life. So, she decided to go to Buffalo, New York in late December for an MRI. She had an appointment at 1:30 a.m. on Feb. 21 at a Toronto hospital, but simply didn’t want to put it off any longer. With the assistance of Richard Baker at Vancouver-based Timely Medical Alternatives, she arranged to have the procedure done at a convenient time five days later for $465 (CDN). The only waiting she had to do was the two hours in traffic it took to cross the Queenston-Lewiston Bridge into the United States. Based on the MRI, her knee problem has been diagnosed, but that’s only the first step. A February appointment with a specialist will determine if she’ll need to go on another wait list for surgery.

    * “Shuffling off to Buffalo for an MRI,” Employee Benefit News Canada, By Sheryl Smolkin (February 1, 2007) (Subscription Required)

Vince Motta

Vince Motta, 23, died of a severe asthma attack after he was airlifted to Rockyview Hospital following appendix surgery at High River hospital. Motta and his mother had waited at both Rockyview and Foothills Hospital, but eventually left due to the long waits.

    * “Deaths deserve a public inquiry,” The Calgary Herald, Editorial By Maureen L. Prowse (June 17, 2007) (Subscription Required)
    * “CHR review clears hospital in death of Calgary teenager; Parents of boy ‘disappointed’ with finding,” The Calgary Herald, (June 13, 2007) (Subscription Required)
    * “Families upset city health care inquiry delayed; Five appendicitis deaths in 10 years at city hospitals,” The Calgary Herald, By Sean Myers, (May 2, 2007) (Subscription Required)

Virginia Yule

Virginia Yule, 49, met her surgeon only twice, for a total of 45 minutes, to learn she needed a biopsy after a mammogram found a shadow on her breast, and then to be told she had cancer. So she wrote her doctor a letter. “I really wanted her to know who I was,” she says now, cancer-free for seven years. Ms. Yule’s desire to be seen as a person is a common complaint among cancer patients caught in a system that seems overwhelmed by waiting lists and swamped by test results, where phone calls tunnel through to voice mail and a busy doctor may have mere minutes to explain the most complicated, heart-stopping medical information.

    * “I made noise, and things moved,” The Globe and Mail, By Erin Anderssen (December 9, 2006) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20061209.wxcancer-front09/BNStory/cancer/

Australia
Gerald Carroll

Gerald Carroll, 46, of Kalgoorlie had chemotherapy for tumors in his jaw and behind his eye. After that treatment, he had a three-month wait for radiotherapy. “But in the three months it took to get the stereotactic radiotherapy I needed, the tumor had grown too large to treat,” Mr. Carroll said. “The radiotherapist referred me back to my oncologist. I’ve been on chemo since February and now’s it’s reduced the tumor to a point where I can have the radiation. I’m on the waiting list for stereotactic radiosurgery at this time.”

    * “Cancer queues longer” Sunday Times (Perth), By Catherine Madden, (August 28, 2005) http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,16407578-2761,00.html


shootfighter1

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2008, 06:44:25 AM »
There's no doubt wait times are an issue, particularly with what some may define as non-medical emergencies.  Orthopaedic (musculoskeletal) injuries from sports, lifting, etc would be defined as non-medical and have longer wait times.

However, something has to be done about runaway insurance costs.  Our government needs to step in and have some oversight of the system IMO.  Not controlling medicine, but regulating insurance companies like they do utilities.

As co-pays & deductibles are raised, more & more people are avoiding primary care because of the out of pocket cost.  This is a significant issue.

We also need to curb excessive end of life spending for medical care that doesn't prolong life more than a few months and figure out a checks & balances system to prevent frivilous lawsuits which drive up all insurance costs and are passed along to the consumers.

OzmO

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2008, 08:26:06 AM »
That's all good.

While, I'm sure you can drum up all kinds of statements from people who don't like UHC,  there are plenty that do.

A couple weeks ago, both Canadian and British citizens called there system adequate.  Not perfect, but adequate.

For the right price, our system is good.  Without money it sucks ass.   

Nordic Superman

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2008, 08:38:28 AM »
A couple weeks ago, both Canadian and British citizens called there system adequate.  Not perfect, but adequate. 

Who says this? An authoritative source or a couple of clowns on GetBig?

The British NHS and pensions scheme is a joke. Honest hard paying citizens have been ROBBED.

The only way to get money from the British government is to be a scum bag scrounger not working or an immigrant that also doesn't work. Hell, why not be muslim and polygamous and get welfare for MORE THAN ONE WIFE?

Honestly OzmO, you're not very well versed on this topic, especially the British side of things.
الاسلام هو شيطانية

OzmO

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2008, 09:00:30 AM »
Who says this? An authoritative source or a couple of clowns on GetBig?

I talked to this guy and his wife  in person.  He's about 50+ owns a BMW.  (we talked about gas too)

Quote
The British NHS and pensions scheme is a joke. Honest hard paying citizens have been ROBBED.
The only way to get money from the British government is to be a scum bag scrounger not working or an immigrant that also doesn't work. Hell, why not be muslim and polygamous and get welfare for MORE THAN ONE WIFE?

Honestly OzmO, you're not very well versed on this topic, especially the British side of things.

I agree with your POV in regards to those leeching off your system.  But this is about care, not who gets it.

Also, i'm not saying i'm well versed.  Just relating my experience with this conversation i had with them.


Nordic Superman

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2008, 09:26:22 AM »
I talked to this guy and his wife  in person.  He's about 50+ owns a BMW.  (we talked about gas too)

I agree with your POV in regards to those leeching off your system.  But this is about care, not who gets it.

Also, i'm not saying i'm well versed.  Just relating my experience with this conversation i had with them.

Right, source you point of view comes from 2 people? The point about being 50, and having a BMW? Am I to assume they are a wealthy couple or are you just adding frivolous details? Does he have private healthcare?

Care, and who gets it. Not everyone gets "care" in Britain. Most people end up going to private dentists for example, because NHS dentists won't take on PAYING citizens with every RIGHT for dental service (simply because THEY are funding it).
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Deedee

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2008, 09:31:06 AM »

The only way to get money from the British government is to be a scum bag scrounger not working or an immigrant that also doesn't work. Hell, why not be muslim and polygamous and get welfare for MORE THAN ONE WIFE?



Anyone can say that about their respective country.  People always abuse the system.

The US ALSO has polygamous mormons and muslims claiming welfare benefits for more than one wife. They get around the laws by having the extra spouses claim separately.

Although... muslims are supposedly only entitled to extra wives if they can afford them, not use their hareems to get money out of taxpayers, but guess that's just a minor detail.  :P

Deedee

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2008, 09:34:34 AM »
There are horror stories on both sides.

Having lived under both systems, there are benefits and downsides to both.  In Canada, care is adequate, but there are wait times, not always, they're there. If however, you're temporarily out of work, have a terrible car accident and live in a wheelchair for a year, you don't have to mortgage the house.

In the US, people benefit from the best technology, no wait times, and doctors call you at home to see how you're doing.  But you may have to mortgage the house if you are unlucky.

Don't think the Universal system would work in the US just because the population is so huge, and abuses would be rampant.

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2008, 09:36:48 AM »
Right, source you point of view comes from 2 people? The point about being 50, and having a BMW? Am I to assume they are a wealthy couple or are you just adding frivolous details? Does he have private healthcare?

No not that wealthy.  I don't think he was making over 42,000 pounds a year.  He certainly wasn't making 100,000+ pounds per year.  The BMW part was to show he wasn't some old bum.  No, he uses the NHC.

And yes, it comes from 2 people.  2 people i talked to in person.  common folk  ;D.  Not selected quotes from people I've never met. 

Also, years ago, when i was visiting Suffolk, my daughter got sick.  We walked into a hospital and got treated right away.  No questions asked, virtually no waiting.

Quote
Care, and who gets it. Not everyone gets "care" in Britain. Most people end up going to private dentists for example, because NHS dentists won't take on PAYING citizens with every RIGHT for dental service (simply because THEY are funding it).

Too bad.  You pay ungodly taxes, can't get free dental care, and millions are leaching off your system.

When you moving here?

Oh wait, the beer must be worth it.   ;D

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2008, 09:59:19 AM »
No not that wealthy.  I don't think he was making over 42,000 pounds a year.  He certainly wasn't making 100,000+ pounds per year.  The BMW part was to show he wasn't some old bum.  No, he uses the NHC.

And yes, it comes from 2 people.  2 people i talked to in person.  common folk  ;D.  Not selected quotes from people I've never met. 

Also, years ago, when i was visiting Suffolk, my daughter got sick.  We walked into a hospital and got treated right away.  No questions asked, virtually no waiting.

Too bad.  You pay ungodly taxes, can't get free dental care, and millions are leaching off your system.

When you moving here?

Oh wait, the beer must be worth it.   ;D

Still, pretty frivolous opinion I'm afraid.

How long ago did you need care in Suffolk? Did you have health insurance? Was any of this noted? Why should I have to pay for you daughters health care? Glad she got help, but this highlights a fault in the system when non-citizen are getting free healthcare on a system that should require citizenship.

I live in the US, CA and Seattle quite a lot of the time of the year. Health care is paid for me by the corporation.

My personal opinion is to have an hybrid system.
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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2008, 10:04:21 AM »
Always looking to Canada and the UK.

How about France and Scandinavia? Not too many complaints there...
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Nordic Superman

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2008, 10:09:06 AM »
Always looking to Canada and the UK.

How about France and Scandinavia? Not too many complaints there...

The French is in a poor condition too:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3423159.stm

Scandinavia is the exception, wonder if it has anything to do with their lack of immigration of undesirables?
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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2008, 10:09:58 AM »
Speaking on abuse, my island was paying for that Gastric operation for fat people to lose weight. I must say that annoyed me, fat people getting free trips abroad, gimme a break ::)

Nordic Superman

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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2008, 10:12:48 AM »
Speaking on abuse, my island was paying for that Gastric operation for fat people to lose weight. I must say that annoyed me, fat people getting free trips abroad, gimme a break ::)

Nice.
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Re: Universal Healthcare
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2008, 10:19:16 AM »
Still, pretty frivolous opinion I'm afraid.

I think you are jumping to conclusions as to my position on the whole matter.

I say it again:

Quote
Also, i'm not saying i'm well versed.  Just relating my experience with this conversation i had with them.

Quote
My personal opinion is to have an hybrid system.

I agree with this as this seems to be the best way.