Author Topic: Prayer and Religion in Public Life  (Read 634777 times)

Primemuscle

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #450 on: July 25, 2018, 04:24:26 PM »
Do you suffer emotional distress when you hear someone pray or see religious symbols on public property? 

You can't be serious. I have no issue with others praying or with religious symbols as long as we the people retain our rights and the First Amendment of U.S. Constitution isn't violated.

 "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"

By the way, there's nothing in it that states, except Muslims, Jews or Buddhists' etc.

Primemuscle

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #451 on: July 25, 2018, 04:25:33 PM »
I don't care how many times you or anyone else agrees with me.  I don't have a problem being a minority of one.  Nobody dictates what I say, think, or believe.  But I confess there are a handful of folks who help me ensure I'm on the right side of an issue.   :)

Birds of a feather....

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #452 on: July 25, 2018, 05:47:10 PM »
You can't be serious. I have no issue with others praying or with religious symbols as long as we the people retain our rights and the First Amendment of U.S. Constitution isn't violated.

 "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"

By the way, there's nothing in it that states, except Muslims, Jews or Buddhists' etc.

Good.  And yes I'm serious.  Go back a couple pages and read what I posted about atheists filing lawsuits claiming to have suffered emotional distress after seeing religious symbols on public property.  Here is one:

Ok.  Fine.  You're too lazy or bullheaded to do just a little homework.  School is in session.   :D

Here is one.  Lawsuit filed over the display of the Ten Commandments:

Plaintiff Sue Mercier is a resident of La Crosse, Wisconsin and a member of plaintiff Freedom from Religion Foundation. When visiting her lawyer's office, which is near the monument site, plaintiff Mercier must sometimes alter her route to avoid seeing the monument. She shops at the People's Food Coop and the farmers' market less often than she would if the monument were not in Cameron Park. When she has viewed the monument, it has "disturbed" her emotionally.

Plaintiff Elizabeth Ash is a resident of La Crosse. She does not attend meetings or events held in Cameron Park because she does not want to view the monument. She does not use banks near the monument. When driving downtown, she avoids streets that would take her past the monument. She has stopped going to Cameron Park to sit in it and read books. When she does see the monument, she feels marginalized and has experienced physical pain.

Plaintiff Angela Belcaster is a resident of La Crosse. She patronizes several businesses surrounding Cameron Park, including the People's Food Coop and U.S. Bank. She has changed her route when visiting these establishments so that she does not park in front of the monument. She no longer has lunch in the park because of the monument. However, Belcaster still passes Cameron Park when driving through the downtown. When she approaches the park, she begins thinking about the monument, which distracts her and causes her emotional distress. The monument's presence and defendant's support of it makes Belcaster feel like an outsider.

. . . .

https://ffrf.org/uploads/legal/LCDecision.html

I'll give you another opportunity to retract before I continue.   ;D

The Scott

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #453 on: July 25, 2018, 07:43:48 PM »
There are Atheists and there are atheists.  The former are nothing like the latter.  And the latter are better referred to (as I do them) as assholists.

They rarely (if ever, as I have never heard of them doing this) speak against any religion or faith except Christianity.  Nothing against Buddhists.  Nothing against Satanists.  Nothing against Latter Day Saints.  And while there are more out there, here is the most important religion assholists avoid - islime.  Or as those who are too pussifed to say that term, Islam.  Fuck islime/Islam and it's proponents.

It is against not only the Nazarene and Moses, but even more so against civilization.  And yet scumbag cucktards embrace islime as though it were a haven for all that is good.  You would think that cucktards would ostrasize islime as it loaths women and publicly despises and puts to death, homosexuals.  In private muslimes are the biggest proponents of man/man and even more so, man/boy sex.   The latter can be seen in Chai Boys and how the muslimes so enjoy this disgusting practice. 

Muslimes also bob and weave in pubic prayer daily.  Screaming aloud their devotion to their pedogod and his pedo-profit.   Cucktards scream (and rightly so) about Catholic priests being pedophiles and utter not a syllable against muslime pedos except when caught buggering local non-muslime kids, they are just said to be practicing their "culture".

Muslimes enjoy the practice of murdering family members (usually women) for offenses against the queeron.  They call them "honor killings".  Muslimes can beat their wives/women and not allow them to go out without proper male escort.  And worse.  And still cucktards just love muslimes.

Of course the best example of why not to allow a National religion is shown by Iran and it's muslime bullshit government run by imams.  FTN.

So to those that profess Atheism, I say pick on muslimes before you ever throw an insult at a genuine follower of the Nazarene.  If that is, you're an Atheist. 

If not, you're a fucking pussy assholist.

Skeletor

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #454 on: July 26, 2018, 01:28:02 PM »
If true, these allegations are horrifying.

Ex-city firefghter's lawsuit allowed to proceed

A federal judge has allowed a former Bowling Green firefighter’s lawsuit against the city to go forward.

Jeffrey Queen worked for the Bowling Green Fire Department from 2011 to 2016, during which time he claims his colleagues disparaged his religious beliefs and made racist, sexist and homophobic remarks.

https://www.bgdailynews.com/news/ex-city-firefghter-s-lawsuit-allowed-to-proceed/article_5d44d04d-dabe-584c-b3b0-52c39f71b962.html


Some examples from the complaint:

Quote
During training, Queen was repeatedly asked by other firefighters and his superior officers to identify his church membership.

In early 2012, a firefighter interrogated Queen regarding his religious practices and demanded to know if he had been “saved.” Captain Colson, Sergeant Brad Akins, Sergeant Dale Willis and Captain Steven Daniels were present during and participated in this questioning.

Captain Colson advised Queen that he needed to join a church.

Captain Paul Campbell advised Queen that he needed to get right with Jesus on several occasions in late 2012 and early 2013.

In 2013, Captain Todd Barnard stated publicly that atheists “deserve to burn.” During this same conversation, Chief Frye stated “I’ll be damned if I work with them” and another member of the Fire Department said he was “sure as hell glad none of those fuckers work here.”

In a conversation including Chief Napier, Captain Mike Alexander, and two firefighters, they referred to Muslims as towelheads and said “we need to ship them all back to where they came from” and “let the bombs torch them, they are going to hell anyway.” They continued, stating, “at least they [Muslims] believe in God though, not like those fucking atheists you hear about;…there’s more hope for a towelhead than them,” and “now those are some sons-a-bitches that deserve to burn” and “you know atheist is the anti-Christ.”

While employed at the Airport Station in 2014, Queen was forced to endure bible study sessions during station dinners. These study sessions included assignments to read specified verses and then discuss those verses during dinner.

Queen’s fear that his co-workers would not support him in an emergency situation that required cooperative effort to ensure the team’s safety was increased as a result of this open hostility toward non-Christians.

Queen’s fear was not misplaced. When Queen publicly acknowledged that he was an atheist in early 2016, Captain Smith and a firefighter stated they would “burn his house down.”

On at least one occasion, members of Queen’s crew declined to offer medical care to a man experiencing severe chest pain after determining that he was gay.


The full text of the complaint is available here and contains more allegations:

https://craighenrylaw.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/complaint.pdf

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #455 on: July 26, 2018, 02:41:29 PM »
If true, these allegations are horrifying.

Ex-city firefghter's lawsuit allowed to proceed

A federal judge has allowed a former Bowling Green firefighter’s lawsuit against the city to go forward.

Jeffrey Queen worked for the Bowling Green Fire Department from 2011 to 2016, during which time he claims his colleagues disparaged his religious beliefs and made racist, sexist and homophobic remarks.

https://www.bgdailynews.com/news/ex-city-firefghter-s-lawsuit-allowed-to-proceed/article_5d44d04d-dabe-584c-b3b0-52c39f71b962.html


Some examples from the complaint:


The full text of the complaint is available here and contains more allegations:

https://craighenrylaw.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/complaint.pdf


I wouldn't call them "horrifying," but if true everyone involved should be fired. 

Skeletor

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #456 on: July 26, 2018, 02:52:08 PM »
I wouldn't call them "horrifying," but if true everyone involved should be fired.  

Not surprised. But I think denying medical care to someone because of whatever bias they have is horrifying, particularly if you consider this might have happened in other cases too and might have cost lives. If these allegations are true, just firing these people is not enough.

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #457 on: July 26, 2018, 10:00:49 PM »
Not surprised. But I think denying medical care to someone because of whatever bias they have is horrifying, particularly if you consider this might have happened in other cases too and might have cost lives. If these allegations are true, just firing these people is not enough.

Denying medical care to someone they believe is gay is horrifying.  Was not talking about that part. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #458 on: July 31, 2018, 01:22:29 PM »
Trump and Jeff Sessions prioritize religious liberty with new Justice Department task force
by Jenna Ellis
July 30, 2018

The Trump administration has continued to prioritize religious freedom and emphasize its importance globally. Last week, Vice President Mike Pence made remarks to the contingent of foreign ministers at the State Department’s ministerial on religious freedom, saying that America must continue to be the world’s leader on this issue by ensuring domestic religious liberty first. “No one follows a hypocrite,” he said.

Continuing this promise to protect our central freedom enshrined in the First Amendment, the Department of Justice on Monday held a Religious Liberty Summit, and Attorney General Jeff Sessions announced a new religious liberty task force.

“Freedom of religion has been a core American principle from the very beginning of our country — indeed, it is our ‘first freedom.’ President Trump promised that he would make preserving and protecting our religious liberty the first priority of his administration. The Department of Justice is committed to assisting with that effort,” Sessions said. He remarked that in order to “institutionalize this process” and identify new opportunities to engage this important issue of religious freedom, the DOJ has established a religious liberty task force.

According to the memo obtained by Washington Examiner, the task force will “continue the department’s ongoing work to protect and promote religious liberty.” It will also consider new initiatives, including engaging in outreach to the public, religious liberty communities, and religious liberty organizations, and developing new strategies involving litigation, policy, and legislation, all with the goal of ensuring protection of this key, fundamental right.

Sessions will serve as chair of the task force. The summit at the DOJ on Monday includes a panel of legal and policy experts and a discussion titled “The Promise and Challenge of Religious Liberty.” Jack Phillips of Masterpiece Cakeshop, who was involved in an important religious freedom case just decided by the Supreme Court last month, is scheduled for the panel.

In contrast to the previous administration, which did not value religious liberty either at home or abroad, the Trump administration’s action should encourage all people of faith and belief systems. This particular emphasis and open commitment shows that religious freedom is a priority to the president. Everyone should appreciate that Trump and key Cabinet leaders are taking action to protect religious freedom.

As Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said at the religious freedom ministerial last week, “The United States advances religious freedom in our foreign policy because it is not exclusively an American right. It is a God-given universal right bestowed on all of mankind.”

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/trump-and-jeff-sessions-prioritize-religious-liberty-with-new-justice-department-task-force

Agnostic007

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #459 on: July 31, 2018, 08:50:13 PM »
I'm a fan of Freedom of Religion. I think everyone should be free to participate in any religion they choose. I am a bigger fan of Freedom From Religion where people should be free to not be involved in religious rituals or have their laws influenced by religion.

IroNat

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #460 on: August 01, 2018, 03:48:41 AM »
The influx of Muslims will make the separation of religion and state even more important.

Agnostic007

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #461 on: August 01, 2018, 09:17:30 AM »
The influx of Muslims will make the separation of religion and state even more important.

Probably... Christians generally want religion mixed in with Government but only if it is their religion

IroNat

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #462 on: August 01, 2018, 10:00:42 AM »
Probably... Christians generally want religion mixed in with Government but only if it is their religion

Very true.

This is not a good idea but they don't seem to get it. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #463 on: August 01, 2018, 11:32:24 AM »
I'm a fan of Freedom of Religion. I think everyone should be free to participate in any religion they choose. I am a bigger fan of Freedom From Religion where people should be free to not be involved in religious rituals or have their laws influenced by religion.

And again, thank goodness the Constitution and the rest of society disagrees with your extremist viewpoint. 

Agnostic007

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #464 on: August 01, 2018, 07:51:10 PM »
And again, thank goodness the Constitution and the rest of society disagrees with your extremist viewpoint. 

So, in your opinion, the constitution is ok with mixing Christianity's rules and regulations with our Government? And as far as numbers... the majority isn't always right, otherwise we'd still slavery

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #465 on: August 01, 2018, 09:24:20 PM »
So, in your opinion, the constitution is ok with mixing Christianity's rules and regulations with our Government? And as far as numbers... the majority isn't always right, otherwise we'd still slavery

In my opinion, which is supported by the Constitution, the government is prohibited from establishing a religion or prohibiting the free exercise of religion.  The Constitution says absolutely nothing about "mixing Christianity's rules and regulations with our Government" (whatever the heck that means).  To the extent communities and legislatures are influenced by their faith when pursing legislation, good for them.  To the extent paranoid hypersensitive people are offended when someone talks about faith, I honestly don't care.   

No one made the infantile argument that the majority is always right.  And slavery?   ::)  Hard to have a serious discussion when you throw out crap like that. 

In any event, we don't discount the majority's view and their faith-based traditions that go back to the origins of our country just so we don't cause emotional distress to someone who gets offended when they see or hear about something they don't believe exists.  If you folks want a society that removes all references to God or faith from any public property, then get enough of you together and go pass a Constitutionally acceptable law.  That's how our democracy works.  That's how it should work.   

So while I believe in the Constitution and the separation of church and state, that separation doesn't include the extremist viewpoint you keep expressing. 

Agnostic007

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #466 on: August 01, 2018, 10:32:10 PM »
In my opinion, which is supported by the Constitution, the government is prohibited from establishing a religion or prohibiting the free exercise of religion.  The Constitution says absolutely nothing about "mixing Christianity's rules and regulations with our Government" (whatever the heck that means).  To the extent communities and legislatures are influenced by their faith when pursing legislation, good for them.  To the extent paranoid hypersensitive people are offended when someone talks about faith, I honestly don't care.   

No one made the infantile argument that the majority is always right.  And slavery?   ::)  Hard to have a serious discussion when you throw out crap like that. 

In any event, we don't discount the majority's view and their faith-based traditions that go back to the origins of our country just so we don't cause emotional distress to someone who gets offended when they see or hear about something they don't believe exists.  If you folks want a society that removes all references to God or faith from any public property, then get enough of you together and go pass a Constitutionally acceptable law.  That's how our democracy works.  That's how it should work.   

So while I believe in the Constitution and the separation of church and state, that separation doesn't include the extremist viewpoint you keep expressing. 

Meltdown

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #467 on: August 01, 2018, 10:41:45 PM »
Meltdown

So you ask for my opinion.  I give it to you.  And you respond with your juvenile analytical ability.  Not surprised. 

Agnostic007

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #468 on: August 02, 2018, 12:25:18 PM »
So you ask for my opinion.  I give it to you.  And you respond with your juvenile analytical ability.  Not surprised. 

It was appropriate given the response you gave. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #469 on: August 02, 2018, 01:09:39 PM »
It was appropriate given the response you gave. 

Troll.   ::)

Agnostic007

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #470 on: August 02, 2018, 02:17:50 PM »

Dos Equis

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #471 on: August 02, 2018, 02:37:35 PM »
Drama queen

You can be a real immature punk sometimes.  But it's ok.  This website attracts all kinds of people and all are welcome.   :)

Agnostic007

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #472 on: August 02, 2018, 09:00:39 PM »
You can be a real immature punk sometimes.  But it's ok.  This website attracts all kinds of people and all are welcome.   :)

I try and deal with people at their level. I could give an efforted answer and you would simply spew garbage about the Constitution supports mixing religion and Government which a 1st year college student should know is not true. You'd also throw out an irrelevant opinion that the majority agree with your wrong opinion. So I ask you, whats the point?

Las Vegas

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #473 on: August 03, 2018, 06:56:22 AM »
In my opinion, which is supported by the Constitution, the government is prohibited from establishing a religion or prohibiting the free exercise of religion.  The Constitution says absolutely nothing about "mixing Christianity's rules and regulations with our Government" (whatever the heck that means).  To the extent communities and legislatures are influenced by their faith when pursing legislation, good for them.  To the extent paranoid hypersensitive people are offended when someone talks about faith, I honestly don't care.   

No one made the infantile argument that the majority is always right.  And slavery?   ::)  Hard to have a serious discussion when you throw out crap like that. 

In any event, we don't discount the majority's view and their faith-based traditions that go back to the origins of our country just so we don't cause emotional distress to someone who gets offended when they see or hear about something they don't believe exists.  If you folks want a society that removes all references to God or faith from any public property, then get enough of you together and go pass a Constitutionally acceptable law.  That's how our democracy works.  That's how it should work.   

So while I believe in the Constitution and the separation of church and state, that separation doesn't include the extremist viewpoint you keep expressing. 

Good post.

Las Vegas

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Re: Prayer and Religion in Public Life
« Reply #474 on: August 03, 2018, 07:01:08 AM »
Oh yeah?  How come our currency says "In God We Trust".  Huh?

To be fair, this didn't appear until much later. (1950s? or so I think)