Author Topic: Obama's illegal war  (Read 67751 times)

Fury

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #825 on: July 21, 2011, 04:50:12 PM »
Honestly, if I was a terrorist I would've been in Libya months ago. It's "Toys 'R Us" for mass-murdering douche bags.

70+ brand-new surface-to-air, shoulder-fired missiles vanished three weeks ago.  ::)

tu_holmes

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #826 on: July 21, 2011, 05:19:25 PM »
Honestly, if I was a terrorist I would've been in Libya months ago. It's "Toys 'R Us" for mass-murdering douche bags.

70+ brand-new surface-to-air, shoulder-fired missiles vanished three weeks ago.  ::)

Wanna make a trip and become international arms dealers?

I hear there's good money in that shit.

 8)

Fury

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #827 on: July 21, 2011, 05:24:22 PM »
Wanna make a trip and become international arms dealers?

I hear there's good money in that shit.

 8)

;D

Lord of War is an awesome movie. Great beginning.

tu_holmes

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #828 on: July 21, 2011, 05:26:54 PM »
;D

Lord of War is an awesome movie. Great beginning.

You know I thoroughly enjoyed it. :)

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #829 on: July 21, 2011, 08:21:35 PM »
Wanna make a trip and become international arms dealers?

I hear there's good money in that shit.

 8)

Obama and holder have some tips. 

tu_holmes

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #830 on: July 21, 2011, 08:51:47 PM »
Obama and holder have some tips. 

They have an entire department and multiple agencies to get it done... I just have Nick!

;D

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #831 on: July 22, 2011, 04:14:49 AM »
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Libya Rebels Get Formal Backing, and $30 Billion
NYT ^ | Published: July 15, 2011 | By SEBNEM ARSU and STEVEN ERLANGER
Posted on July 15, 2011 10:18:25 PM EDT by Borough Park

ISTANBUL — The United States formally recognized the rebel leadership in Libya as the country’s legitimate government on Friday, allowing the rebel government access to $30 billion in Libyan assets held in the United States. It is not yet clear how and when the money would be released. Enlarge This Image

Osman Orsal/Reuters Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton attended the meeting on Libya in Istanbul on Friday. Multimedia

TimesCast | Libyan Rebels Recognized Readers’ Comments Share your thoughts. Post a Comment » Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton said at an international gathering held to discuss the Libyan conflict that Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi’s government no longer had any legitimacy, and that the United States would join more than 30 countries in extending diplomatic recognition to the main opposition group, known as the Transitional National Council.

“We will help the T.N.C. sustain its commitment to the sovereignty, independence, territorial integrity and national unity of Libya,” Mrs. Clinton said, “and we will look to it to remain steadfast in its commitment to human rights and fundamental freedoms.”

The decision by Washington not only increased diplomatic pressure on Colonel Qaddafi to step down, but also held the prospect of funneling money to rebels to propel an offensive that has proceeded in fits and starts.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #832 on: July 24, 2011, 06:22:46 AM »
Obama and NATO Turn Libya, and a $30B Check, Over to Jihadists
Human Events ^ | JUly 24, 2011 | Tara Servatius
Posted on July 24, 2011 9:25:38 AM EDT by libstripper

How would Americans feel if they knew the Obama administration just agreed to hand people affiliated with a designated terrorist group a $30 billion dollar check and recognize them as the legitimate rulers of Libya?

Things weren’t looking so good for the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group back in 2004 when they were designated a foreign terrorist group by the State Department. In chilling testimony, then-CIA Director George Tenet warned the Senate Intelligence Committee in 2004 that even if Osama bin Laden's al-Qaeda was completely destroyed, “a global network of Islamic extremists bent on killing Americans had emerged.” Tenet listed the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG) as one of those groups.

(Excerpt) Read more at humanevents.com ...

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #833 on: July 25, 2011, 12:39:00 PM »
Top US officer sees Kadhafi end (Mullen: "We are, generally, in a stalemate")

AFP/Google ^ | 7/25/11





Top US officer Admiral Michael Mullen on Monday acknowledged NATO was in a "stalemate" in its Libya campaign but still voiced optimism the strategy would lead to the departure of Moamer Kadhafi.
Insurgents have been fighting to oust Kadhafi since mid-February, and NATO has been pounding away with air raids, as the Libyan leader continues to hang on. His complex was slammed by NATO warplanes Saturday, when the alliance confirmed seven strikes and said they hit a military command node.

"We are, generally, in a stalemate," Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Mullen told a press briefing in Washington billed as his last before retirement.


(Excerpt) Read more at google.com ...


Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #834 on: July 27, 2011, 08:59:53 AM »

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #835 on: July 27, 2011, 09:52:13 AM »
Obama's Libya Missteps Imperil NATO's Future
Human Events ^ | 7/27/11 | John R. Bolton




While the outcome of NATO’s intervention in Libya is still uncertain, the ongoing drift toward a negotiated solution is fraught with potentially debilitating problems for the Western alliance. Ousting Qaddafi remains a possibility, and could have been achieved much earlier with swift and decisive action, but the prospects for a clear NATO victory are now quite uncertain.

The collapse of NATO’s resolve came in several stages, with the seeds planted right at the outset of the military action. First, President Obama signaled hesitancy and weakness by waiting until Qaddafi’s forces had nearly taken Benghazi , the rebels’ key stronghold, and then held NATO hostage to approval from the Arab League and the UN Security Council.

Second, after very robust U.S. participation in the opening days of the attack, Obama, demonstrating his penchant to “lead from behind,” ordered U.S. strike activity diminished almost to zero. While American forces assigned to NATO continued to provide vital command, control, intelligence and logistical support, the bulk of the strike mission fell to Britain , France and smaller NATO members, on which the strain began to show relatively quickly. America ’s hesitancy and Europe’s inadequacies have significance well beyond the constraints they imposed on the action in Libya , foreshadowing both future failures in U.S. leadership and a far broader hollowing out of Europe ’s contributions to NATO.

NATO’s credibility, in the region and globally, is already deeply wounded because this minor military operation, for ostensibly humanitarian purposes, has lasted so long with the outcome still uncertain (and Ramadan fast approaching). If NATO cannot rapidly depose a rogue like Qaddafi, why should other rogues fear the prospect of NATO intervention?


(Excerpt) Read more at humanevents.com ...


tu_holmes

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #836 on: July 27, 2011, 11:14:49 AM »
So we're saying that this could bring down NATO?

Damn... Obama will have done something right accidentally.

Can the UN be next?

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #837 on: July 27, 2011, 11:16:21 AM »
So we're saying that this could bring down NATO?

Damn... Obama will have done something right accidentally.

Can the UN be next?

When its out of weakness, that is not good. 

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #838 on: July 29, 2011, 04:26:56 AM »
Bosonic (272 posts)           Thu Jul-28-11 04:33 PM
Original message
Libyan rebel commander Abdel Fattah Younes 'killed'
   

 
Edited on Thu Jul-28-11 04:50 PM by Bosonic
Source: BBC

The military commander of the Libyan rebels fighting to topple Col Muammar Gaddafi has been killed, according to the rebel Transitional National Council.

TNC head Mustafa Abdul-Jalil said Abdel Fattah Younes had been killed by pro-Gaddafi loyalists.

The exact circumstances of his death were not immediately clear, though reports said he had earlier been summoned for questioning over suspected ties to pro-Gaddafi forces.

Read more: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-14336122


General Abdel Fatah Younes, the chief of staff of the rebel forces in Libya, has been killed says the National Transition Council.

The NTC announced the death of Younes on Thursday hours after he was arrested by the rebels for questioning about suspicions his family still had ties to Moammar Gaddafi's regime.

Council head Mustafa Abdul-Jalil did not explain the circumstances of his death.

Younis was reportedly on his way, according to Jalil, to discuss military matters with the council and was reportedly shot by assailants.

Sources claimed Younes may have been in contact with the other side all along and his arrest was ordered by the Council in Benghazi earlier on Thursday.

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/africa/2011/07/201172...

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #839 on: July 30, 2011, 03:51:42 AM »
Libya’s rebels were in disarray on Friday after the mysterious killing of their leading military commander triggered fears that opposition fighters battling to oust Col Muammar Gaddafi could instead turn their weapons on each other.

Head of the rebel forces Abdel Fattah Younes Photo: REUTERS
By Adrian Blomfield, Middle East Correspondent11:16AM BST 29 Jul 2011
Units loyal to Gen Abdel Fattah Younes, who was shot dead on Thursday, reportedly abandoned the rebel front line near the oil town of Brega and poured into the opposition capital of Benghazi to avenge their commander’s death.
The opposition’s provisional government, the Transitional National Council (TNC), attempted to blame the death of Gen Younes on agents loyal to Col Gaddafi operating under cover in Libya’s rebel-held east.
Mustafa Abdul Jalil, the head of the provisional government, appealed for calm, warning that the killing of Gen Younes was orchestrated by the Gaddafi regime to create divisions among the rebels.
"I ask you to refrain from paying attention to the rumours that Gaddafi’s forces are trying to spread within our ranks,” he said.
But the explanation received short shrift among the general’s supporters, who appeared convinced that he had either been tortured to death or executed on the orders of his rivals within the rebel leadership.
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Dozens of gunmen from Gen Younes’s Obeidi tribe, the largest in eastern Libya, opened fire on a hotel in Benghazi where Mr Abdul-Jalil, the head of the provisional government, had earlier held a press conference to announce the commander’s death.
After shattering windows, they broke through a security cordon and sprayed the hall where the announcement was made with rifle fire. Mr Abdul-Jalil had already left the building.
There are now fears that unless the anger of Obeidi tribesmen loyal to Gen Younes is assuaged, a fratricidal war within rebel ranks could break out.
Hours before he was shot dead, along with two of his aides, Gen Younes was summoned for questioning by four rebel judges who were apparently investigating illicit contacts he may have had with the Gaddafi regime. It is unclear whether the commander was in custody when he was killed.
Gen Younes, who served as Col Gaddafi’s defence and interior minister, defected to the regime at the outset of the uprising in February, but he never gained the trust of many rebels who saw him as one of the enforcers of the Libyan leader’s brutal rule.
Suspicions grew further after Col Gaddafi’s daughter Aisha hinted in April that the regime was involved in secret negotiations with the general. A senior official in Tripoli told the Daily Telegraph earlier this month that Gen Younes was the regime’s main point of contact with the rebels.
Gen Younes was also engaged in a very public feud with the rebels’ most celebrated battlefield commander, Khalifa Hifter.
Gen Hifter is considered to have impeccable revolutionary credentials after publicly splitting with Col Gaddafi after Libya lost its disastrous war with Chad in the 1980s.
The rift between Gen Younes and Gen Hifter was seen as an important factor in the pervasive chaos along the front line as the two frequently countermanded one another’s orders.

With Gen Younes, now out of the picture, it is possible that the rebels may find greater cohesion.
Support from Gen Younes among the Obeidi is also far from universal. In the eastern city of Tobruk, many Obeidi pledged fealty to Gen Suleiman Mahmoud who was said to distrust Gen Younes, even though they were kinsmen.

But the commander still had significant support within his tribe, as well as within the units he led, and a backlash seems inevitable. If it is limited in scope and can be dealt with quickly, the death of Gen Younes may prove to be little more than an unwelcome distraction in the campaign to unseat Col Gaddafi.
But the fear is that anything of a greater magnitude could be far more damaging, potentially even undermining the ability of the rebels to win the war itself.


Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #841 on: July 31, 2011, 08:16:33 PM »
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Dissension threatens to implode Libya’s rebel movement
Toronto Star ^
Posted on July 31, 2011 11:22:12 PM EDT by Borough Park

The person least trustworthy is the former enemy turned ally. Loyalties will always be suspect.

In Libya, daggers drawn among mutually distrusting factions now threatento rip apart the rebel movement attempting to topple Col. Moammar Gadhafi’s regime, just as the West faces a self-imposed deadline on NATO’s four-month bombing campaign.

Either NATO stays in, extending for a second time the United Nations resolution that authorized military intervention in March, or NATO backs out, abandoning Libya to the chaos of bitter tribal rivalries and the near-certainty of a full-blown civil war.

The former would all but require a deeper involvement in the insurrectionist struggle, either by widening bombardments — with all the attendant risks to civilian lives — or directly arming the rebels, which the UN Security Council resolution expressly forbids. The latter would essentially hand victory to Gadhafi, his pro-regime forces far superior to the opposition in fighting prowess. It would also expose NATO as an incompetent military alliance, incapable of handling the task in Libya just as it failed in Afghanistan, thus further undermining its very raison d’être.

An aggressive NATO strike over the weekend that targeted Libyan state television, knocking out three transmission dishes and reportedly killing three civilian employees, suggests the alliance command — Canada’s Gen. Charles Bouchard heads the Libya mission — is ratcheting up attacks ahead of the UN resolution’s formal expiry in September.

(Excerpt) Read more at thestar.com ...

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #842 on: August 01, 2011, 05:51:49 AM »
Libya’s rebels were in disarray on Friday after the mysterious killing of their leading military commander triggered fears that opposition fighters battling to oust Col Muammar Gaddafi could instead turn their weapons on each other.

This has been my belief all along- the US benefits from chaos in Libya.  Lots of armed bad guys, many with affil to gadaffi or al-q, are capping one another.

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #843 on: August 01, 2011, 05:55:21 AM »
This has been my belief all along- the US benefits from chaos in Libya.  Lots of armed bad guys, many with affil to gadaffi or al-q, are capping one another.


So obamas goal was to blow billions of dollars, allow his father to make us look like fools, lose international repuation, collapse NATO, etc? 

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #844 on: August 01, 2011, 06:02:52 AM »
So obamas goal was to blow billions of dollars, allow his father to make us look like fools, lose international repuation, collapse NATO, etc? 

undermining NATO ain't a bad thing lol...
Obama fed money to the military machine, that keeps people happy.
"Make us look like fools" as Kadaffi hid in a basement shitting his pants for 4 months while we blew up his country's infrastructure and put our spies anywhere we wanted?
"Lose int'l reputation" - We have 10 times the # of military bases of the rest of the world combined.  What they say about us doesn't matter shit when we can pinkmist any nation on the earth in an hour.


So yes, Obama served his money masters by feeding the military war machine, he didn't lose any US lives, he got our Euro allies better price position and control on oil from Libya, and he facilitated the killng a shitload of armed pricks in Libya - all while weakening Kadaffi - a guy who killed Americans.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #845 on: August 02, 2011, 03:58:25 AM »
Gaddafi is stronger than ever in Libya
The Guardian ^ | Friday 29 July 2011 | Richard Seymour





Supporters of Muammar Gaddafi participate in a demonstration in Tripoli, Libya, 28 July 2011.

War on Libya has not gone well. Kim Sengupta's report on Wednesday detailed this starkly:

"Fresh diplomatic efforts are under way to try to end Libya's bloody civil war, with the UN special envoy flying to Tripoli to hold talks after Britain followed France in accepting that Muammar Gaddafi cannot be bombed into exile.

The change of stance by the two most active countries in the international coalition is an acceptance of realities on the ground. Despite more than four months of sustained air strikes by Nato, the rebels have failed to secure any military advantage. Colonel Gaddafi has survived what observers perceive as attempts to eliminate him and, despite the defection of a number of senior commanders, there is no sign that he will be dethroned in a palace coup.

The regime controls around 20% more territory than it did in the immediate aftermath of the uprising on 17 February."

If the Gaddafi regime is now more in control of Libya, then this completely undermines the simplistic view put about by the supporters of war – and by some elements of the resistance – that the situation was simply one of a hated tyrant hanging on through mercenary violence. Of course, he uses whatever resources he has at his disposal, but a) it would seem that the involvement of imperialism has driven some Libyans back into the Gaddafi camp, as it's unlikely he would maintain control without some degree of support, and b) we know that rebellious sectors started to go back to Gaddafi within mere weeks of the revolt taking off, meaning in part that his resources of legitimising his regime were not exhausted even before the US-led intervention.


(Excerpt) Read more at guardian.co.uk ...



________________________ ________________________ ___

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Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #846 on: August 02, 2011, 04:06:42 AM »
U.S. warns Libyan rebels to get their act together
CNN ^ | August 1, 2011 | Elise Labott and Jill Dougherty






Libyan rebels carry the coffin of assassinated Army Chief Abdel Fatah Younis on July 29 in Benghazi, Libya.

Even as it prepares to hand over the Libyan embassy in Washington to the rebel government, the State Department is warning the Transitional National Council to get its act together.

An administration official told CNN the United States has warned the TNC that this is a "do-or-die moment" for the organization to carry out a credible and thorough investigation of the killing of its military commander, Abdel Fatah Younis. Last week's mysterious assassination has raised concerns that it might have been carried out by feuding groups within the rebels themselves.

"We do welcome the Transitional National Council's move to set up an impartial committee that will investigate the incident and we look forward to hearing the results," deputy spokesman Mark Toner told reporters Monday. "It's important that, given the fluidness of the situation on the ground, that the Transitional National Council work to ensure that it takes the right kinds of actions, such as an investigation into the death, and sends a clear and transparent message that they speak on behalf of the Libyan opposition and the Libyan people and that they are diligently carrying out their mandate."

The TNC has been rocked by internal divisions, with rival rebel groups battling each other. The divisions create a dilemma for the Obama administration, which recognized the rebel movement based in Benghazi as Libya's rightful government on July 15 at an international meeting on Libya in Istanbul. The move, done in coordination with the international community, paves the way for the United States to reopen the embassy, accredit diplomats and unfreeze billions of dollars in frozen assets.


(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #847 on: August 03, 2011, 07:15:50 PM »
Source: The New York Times

TRIPOLI—After six months battling a rebellion his family portrayed as an Islamist conspiracy, Colonel Muammar el-Qaddafi’s son and one-time heir apparent said Wednesday that he was reversing course to forge a secret alliance with radical Islamist elements among the Libyan rebels to drive out their more liberal-minded confederates.

“The liberals will escape or be killed,” the son, Seif el-Islam el-Qaddafi, vowed in an hour-long interview that stretched past midnight. “We will do it together,” he added, wearing a newly grown beard and fingering Islamic prayer beads as he reclined on a love seat in a spare office tucked in a nearly deserted downtown hotel. “Libya will look like Saudi Arabia, like Iran. So what?”

The leading Islamist Mr. Qaddafi identified as his main counterpart in the talks, Ali Sallabi, acknowledged their conversations but dismissed any suggestion of an alliance. He said the Libyan Islamists supported the rebel leaders’ calls for a pluralistic democracy without the Qaddafis.

But the interview nonetheless offered a rare glimpse into the defiant, some say delusional, mindset of the Qaddafi family at a time when they have all but completely retreated from public view under the threat of a NATO bombing campaign now five months old and a six-month-old rebellion.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/04/world/africa/04seif.h...





Lmao.

Fury

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #848 on: August 03, 2011, 07:19:35 PM »
180 six months ago: Gadhafi will be gone in days.

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Re: Obama's illegal war
« Reply #849 on: August 03, 2011, 07:23:56 PM »
180 six months ago: Gadhafi will be gone in days.


It's amazing this disgrace is not getting more coverage.