"Spiritual but not religious"

[Dos Equis]

What does this mean?

[Butterbean]

I think it could mean that they do believe in a spirit world and maybe God as well but don't subscribe to any existing religion or belief system.

Maybe they believe in angel like entities and beings that are not seen....or maybe they consider believing in a good vs evil type thing is spiritual.

[Dos Equis]

I think it could mean that they do believe in a spirit world and maybe God as well but don't subscribe to any existing religion or belief system.

Maybe they believe in angel like entities and beings that are not seen....or maybe they consider believing in a good vs evil type thing is spiritual.

Could be.  I have trouble distinguishing a belief in spirits, etc. from a belief in a "religion."  Seems like the same thing. 

But maybe it's as you say a way to try and explain a non-belief in organized religion. 

[Deicide]

Spiritual but not religious=PC for I haven't really thought much about the issue at hand but is sure sounds cool when I say spiritual!

[MCWAY]

Spiritual but not religious=PC for I haven't really thought much about the issue at hand but is sure sounds cool when I say spiritual!

Pretty much!!

Or, "I believe in God; but I don't feel I have to actually uphold any standards or be accountable to anyone".

[loco]

Pretty much!!

Or, "I believe in God; but I don't feel I have to actually uphold any standards or be accountable to anyone".

Exactly!  Belief without accountability...very convenient!

[Deicide]

Exactly!  Belief without accountability...very convenient!

Not sure it has anything to do with that. Christians seem obsessed with accountability mostly likely because some of them would go around in a murderous rampage without their god (I have met people who said they would kill their neighbors if their god had not commanded them to do so). I have said it before and I will say it again, for me the tangible lack of evidence to support the existence of the Christian deity (or any other for that matter) is what makes me an atheist not so idea of accountability. Society holds me accountable, my own conscience holds me accountable as do the people in my life. I don't need a Canaanite storm deity to that for me.
'Spiritual' people are just people who haven't thought much about such things; it doesn't mean anything when they say the word.

[Agnostic007]

Not sure it has anything to do with that. Christians seem obsessed with accountability mostly likely because some of them would go around in a murderous rampage without their god (I have met people who said they would kill their neighbors if their god had not commanded them to do so). I have said it before and I will say it again, for me the tangible lack of evidence to support the existence of the Christian deity (or any other for that matter) is what makes me an atheist not so idea of accountability. Society holds me accountable, my own conscience holds me accountable as do the people in my life. I don't need a Canaanite storm deity to that for me.
'Spiritual' people are just people who haven't thought much about such things; it doesn't mean anything when they say the word.

I find Christians wishy washy on the accountability thingy...

On one hand they (some) say atheist just don't want to be accountable and do anything they want... on the other they (some) are the dirtiest, lyingest, most immoral people I have known and they fall back on "I'm not perfect, just forgiven" when caught.. go figure

[Agnostic007]

I've talked to a few who say they aren't religious but spiritual. I was left with the impression while they don't believe in the typical biblical type god, they believe there are spiritual forces at work in the universe, it may be nature itself. Or all humans are interconnected with other humans and nature through some type of vague bond. Mostly I find it means different things depending on who is speaking. 

[Deicide]

I find Christians wishy washy on the accountability thingy...

On one hand they (some) say atheist just don't want to be accountable and do anything they want... on the other they (some) are the dirtiest, lyingest, most immoral people I have known and they fall back on "I'm not perfect, just forgiven" when caught.. go figure

I actually made a video about this topic:

[MCWAY]

Not sure it has anything to do with that. Christians seem obsessed with accountability mostly likely because some of them would go around in a murderous rampage without their god (I have met people who said they would kill their neighbors if their god had not commanded them to do so). I have said it before and I will say it again, for me the tangible lack of evidence to support the existence of the Christian deity (or any other for that matter) is what makes me an atheist not so idea of accountability. Society holds me accountable, my own conscience holds me accountable as do the people in my life. I don't need a Canaanite storm deity to that for me.
'Spiritual' people are just people who haven't thought much about such things; it doesn't mean anything when they say the word.

I'd hardly call that "obsessed". As the saying goes, when the cat's away, the mice will play. We saw that, for example, when Moses left the Israelites for nearly a month and a half. They're barely out of Egypt, after praying for CENTURIES to be delivered; yet they revert right back to their heathen ways.

As for your claim of society holding you accountable, that comes, in no small part, because those in society will also be held accountable for their actions (or lack thereof).

As the risk of inaccurately speaking for Loco, he and I stated what we did, because the whole "spiritual not religious" routine is often just a talking PC point for nominally recognizing there's a God, provided they don't have to answer to Him or abide by any regulations that go contrary to their philosophical, political, emotional, or even physical inclinations (or, in Biblical laymen's terms, their flesh).

[Deicide]

I'd hardly call that "obsessed". As the saying goes, when the cat's away, the mice will play. We saw that, for example, when Moses left the Israelites for nearly a month and a half. They're barely out of Egypt, after praying for CENTURIES to be delivered; yet they revert right back to their heathen ways.

As for your claim of society holding you accountable, that comes, in no small part, because those in society will also be held accountable for their actions (or lack thereof).

As the risk of inaccurately speaking for Loco, he and I stated what we did, because the whole "spiritual not religious" routine is often just a talking PC point for nominally recognizing there's a God, provided they don't have to answer to Him or abide by any regulations that go contrary to their philosophical, political, emotional, or even physical inclinations (or, in Biblical laymen's terms, their flesh).

I honestly have no idea what 'spiritual' is supposed to mean; I guess it is a very individual thing. It could mean anything. I am not spiritual at all.

[MCWAY]

I honestly have no idea what 'spiritual' is supposed to mean; I guess it is a very individual thing. It could mean anything. I am not spiritual at all.

I think that both your explaination and mine pretty much sum it up.

[Deicide]

I think that both your explaination and mine pretty much sum it up.

Yeah, wow, we agree!

[MCWAY]

I've talked to a few who say they aren't religious but spiritual. I was left with the impression while they don't believe in the typical biblical type god, they believe there are spiritual forces at work in the universe, it may be nature itself. Or all humans are interconnected with other humans and nature through some type of vague bond. Mostly I find it means different things depending on who is speaking. 

That goes back to what I said earlier. Those vague spiritual forces or "nature" won't tell them not to steal or lie, won't tell them pesky things like "Thou shalt not commit adultery". Certainly, it won't say that homosexuality is wrong or that you should actually care for the children you conceive (in and out of the womb).

As long as "the universe" doesn't clash with my flesh, everything's fine.

[MCWAY]

Yeah, wow, we agree!

Who said there are no such things are miracles!! 

[Agnostic007]

That goes back to what I said earlier. Those vague spiritual forces or "nature" won't tell them not to steal or lie, won't tell them pesky things like "Thou shalt not commit adultery". Certainly, it won't say that homosexuality is wrong or that you should actually care for the children you conceive (in and out of the womb).

As long as "the universe" doesn't clash with my flesh, everything's fine.

I think I wasn't clear..

I left the conversations not feeling at all like they were spiritual because it gave them the freedom to lie, cheat and steal without beholding to any eye in the sky. One particular person I can think of I recently interacted with was in fact by all observable accounts a pretty stellar pillar of the community and moral person.

As an agnostic, I've been accused of actually not believing in a god because it would hamper my desire to be as wild and wicked as I want to be. Sadly, I'm a pretty boring, law abiding citizen. What I suspect, is many have perhaps tried the beaten path of organized biblical religion, found it lacking, and created their own belief system or lack thereof.. well, pretty much like every organized religion has, and every sect of every organized religion has... The Under the Christian umbrella of churches you have splinter groups of Catholics, First baptist  and Southern Baptist, Pentecostal, Methodist, etc etc.. each disagreeing over some point or another with the original sect.  The "spiritualist" for a lack of a better term took a different path. I think it unfair and inaccurate to paint them as people who feel the way they do simply to avoid rules and regulation of the biblical or organized gods. 

[Hugo Chavez]

Could be.  I have trouble distinguishing a belief in spirits, etc. from a belief in a "religion."  Seems like the same thing. 

But maybe it's as you say a way to try and explain a non-belief in organized religion. 

It's not the same thing and it's NOT a way to try and explain non-belief in organized religion.  Example:  As a Christian, you're locked into what you believe right?  Well someone who "believes in the spiritual" but is not "religious" is not locked into that.  They can observe and attempt to understand and adjust.  They know there is something else but they're not being told what that is like Christians are and how they should behave.  They're not told there are eternal consequences for questioning.  They believe that if they live a good life and do right by others and always attempt to do the right thing, that this is all they can do as individuals in this mortal realm.  They are not bound by a set of rules written thousands of years ago and are not about to be herded into a weekly sermon telling them what they should feel, do and be.  This, contrary to popular Christian belief is a line of thought that goes back a long way in America.  There were many from the start that didn't have a very favorable view of "the church"

[MCWAY]

It's not the same thing and it's NOT a way to try and explain non-belief in organized religion.  Example:  As a Christian, you're locked into what you believe right?  Well someone who "believes in the spiritual" but is not "religious" is not locked into that.  They can observe and attempt to understand and adjust.  They know there is something else but they're not being told what that is like Christians are and how they should behave.  They're not told there are eternal consequences for questioning.  They believe that if they live a good life and do right by others and always attempt to do the right thing, that this is all they can do as individuals in this mortal realm.  They are not bound by a set of rules written thousands of years ago and are not about to be herded into a weekly sermon telling them what they should feel, do and be.  This, contrary to popular Christian belief is a line of thought that goes back a long way in America.  There were many from the start that didn't have a very favorable view of "the church"

Who's been told that there are eternal consequence for questioning? I've NEVER heard that, during my years in the Christian faith.


And, as I've asked when similar topics have come up, when you talk about "live a good life" and "do right by others" and "attempt to do the right thing", exactly WHO IS making the rules as to what is right vs. what is wrong? Per Proverbs 14:12, There is a way which seems right to a man, But its end is the way of death.

What's the standard, here?

[loco]

It's not the same thing and it's NOT a way to try and explain non-belief in organized religion.  Example:  As a Christian, you're locked into what you believe right?  Well someone who "believes in the spiritual" but is not "religious" is not locked into that.  They can observe and attempt to understand and adjust.  They know there is something else but they're not being told what that is like Christians are and how they should behave.  They're not told there are eternal consequences for questioning.  They believe that if they live a good life and do right by others and always attempt to do the right thing, that this is all they can do as individuals in this mortal realm.  They are not bound by a set of rules written thousands of years ago and are not about to be herded into a weekly sermon telling them what they should feel, do and be.  This, contrary to popular Christian belief is a line of thought that goes back a long way in America.  There were many from the start that didn't have a very favorable view of "the church"

And who told these "spiritual" people that "if they live a good life and do right by others and always attempt to do the right thing, that this is all they can do as individuals in this mortal realm"?  Looks like a set of rules to me.  And what is "good" and "moral"?  Who determines that?

[Butterbean]

Who's been told that there are eternal consequence for questioning? I've NEVER heard that, during my years in the Christian faith.

x2

  

Hugo, I think God welcomes questioning...  Questioning has lead many to accept Jesus as real and true.  

And as for those of us that already believe, God wants us to come to Him w/our questions as well.   Many people questioned God in the bible and were not punished for doing so.

[MCWAY]

x2

  

Hugo, I think God welcomes questioning...  Questioning has lead many to accept Jesus as real and true.  

And as for those of us that already believe, God wants us to come to Him w/our questions as well.   Many people questioned God in the bible and were not punished for doing so.

My guess is that Hugo is (or was) Catholic. It appears that a lot of folks with a bone to pick with religion, particularly from foreign countries, comes from Catholic backgrounds. That would make sense as (according to a poll I saw a few years ago) claimed that 67% of all professed Christians are Catholic internationally; but only 33% or so were such, in the United States.

[Deicide]

Who's been told that there are eternal consequence for questioning? I've NEVER heard that, during my years in the Christian faith.


And, as I've asked when similar topics have come up, when you talk about "live a good life" and "do right by others" and "attempt to do the right thing", exactly WHO IS making the rules as to what is right vs. what is wrong? Per Proverbs 14:12, There is a way which seems right to a man, But its end is the way of death.

What's the standard, here?

The standard is the golden rule (which we know was not original to your Jesus). Christians are obsessed with authority but you don't need a cosmic tyrant to tell you what is right and wrong. It is rational and logical to not want have pain inflicted on you and hence it follows that it not be inflicted on others by you either. Pretty simple.

[Dos Equis]

It's not the same thing and it's NOT a way to try and explain non-belief in organized religion.  Example:  As a Christian, you're locked into what you believe right?  Well someone who "believes in the spiritual" but is not "religious" is not locked into that.  They can observe and attempt to understand and adjust.  They know there is something else but they're not being told what that is like Christians are and how they should behave.  They're not told there are eternal consequences for questioning.  They believe that if they live a good life and do right by others and always attempt to do the right thing, that this is all they can do as individuals in this mortal realm.  They are not bound by a set of rules written thousands of years ago and are not about to be herded into a weekly sermon telling them what they should feel, do and be.  This, contrary to popular Christian belief is a line of thought that goes back a long way in America.  There were many from the start that didn't have a very favorable view of "the church"

I think you have some misconceptions about mainstream Christianity.  I'm locked into certain beliefs, just like everyone else, and not locked into others.  No one tells me how to behave.  There is an expectation that you behave in a certain way when you join most organized Christian churches, but it's no different than any other organization (job, school, etc.) that has the same expectation.     

And what you've described is pretty much what I theorized about:  an attempt to distance oneself from organized religion. 

[Arnold jr]

Some good points made in this thread...my own 2 cents.

I call myself a Christian but I wouldn't call myself religious. For some people, myself included, religious is a term that is impossible to live up to, regardless of the religion at hand...most all religions call for perfection, which is humanly impossible. When we look at Christianity and Jesus' actions in the bible, those who were "Religious" Jesus had no time for them, in-fact he could not stand the way they acted, the pharisees being the prime example. Jesus called for men to be good, to love their neighbors and to seek the heart of God through him...he didn't call for people to join a certain sect of the Christian religion.

I do believe a lot of people say they're "Spiritual" because as said in this thread, they're unsure but don't won't to call themselves atheist. But there are many who call themselves "Spiritual" who are Christians yet do not take on the title of "Religious."