Author Topic: Obama goes there - ’People Committed Terrible Deeds In The Name of Christ’  (Read 13282 times)

Straw Man

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youre kidding me right? 

People like Bum have decided that people who commit horrible acts of violence which are either inspired or justified by their christian beliefs are not actually christians therefore are not christian extremists  i.e. christian extremist don't actually exist (in spite of the dead bodies).  It's the exact same stupid argument that the Obama administration makes for not using the term muslim extremist

Guys like HH will tell you that christian extremist don't exist because muslim extremist commit so much more violence (I guess they simply round down to zero the christian extremists when compared to muslim extremists or something like that)




Agnostic007

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Friend of mine posted the article on his facebook and stated "Obama defends ISIS" So I read the article and couldn't find anywhere that he defended ISIS and cut and pasted the portion where he condemns their actions.... my friend, being the avid conservative O'Reilly type, totally ignores the facts and rants off on a rabbit trail....

Soul Crusher

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Friend of mine posted the article on his facebook and stated "Obama defends ISIS" So I read the article and couldn't find anywhere that he defended ISIS and cut and pasted the portion where he condemns their actions.... my friend, being the avid conservative O'Reilly type, totally ignores the facts and rants off on a rabbit trail....

Its not defending ISIS as much as it is diminishing their acts of barbarism and diverting attention away from the evil that these asshole sand rats are committing in the name of Islam. 

Funny too how Obama never mentioned 9/11 being done in the name of Islam either. 

Dos Equis

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Its not defending ISIS as much as it is diminishing their acts of barbarism and diverting attention away from the evil that these asshole sand rats are committing in the name of Islam. 

Funny too how Obama never mentioned 9/11 being done in the name of Islam either. 

Exactly. 

2Thick

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You American leftists who actually defend what Isis and similar groups are doing today as ok - because Obama said it's ok, since "Christians" killed people 1000 years ago and whites bought black slaves from other blacks in Africa and brought them here 400 years ago (eventually giving their descendants better lives than they'd ever dream of in Africa BTW) - are unreal.
A

Agnostic007

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Haven't seen anyone here defending ISIS or condoning their actions..

Straw Man

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You American leftists who actually defend what Isis and similar groups are doing today as ok - because Obama said it's ok, since "Christians" killed people 1000 years ago and whites bought black slaves from other blacks in Africa and brought them here 400 years ago (eventually giving their descendants better lives than they'd ever dream of in Africa BTW) - are unreal.

Christians have killed people in this country in the name of their christian beliefs within the last 6 years and I haven't seen anyone (left, right or center) defending ISIS nor have I seen Obama saying what ISIS is doing is OK "since "Christians" killed people 1000 years ago"

Dos Equis

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Haven't seen anyone here defending ISIS or condoning their actions..

Then why even mention the Inquisition?  

Soul Crusher

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Haven't seen anyone here defending ISIS or condoning their actions..


Then why bring up Christians of 800 years ago other than to either diminish, deflect, or divert attention away from ISIS as Obama is doing?  

Soul Crusher

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Christians have killed people in this country in the name of their christian beliefs within the last 6 years and I haven't seen anyone (left, right or center) defending ISIS nor have I seen Obama saying what ISIS is doing is OK "since "Christians" killed people 1000 years ago"


Oh FNG please - more blacks kill other blacks WEEKLY!!!!  and not a peep from you leftists

240 is Back

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Haven't seen anyone here defending ISIS or condoning their actions..

nonsense, the president is a member and libs wear ISIS t-shirts to work, if they had jobs.

Soul Crusher

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Obama's "high horse" remarks are incredibly stupid and show his fundamental failure to comprehend what is unfolding in the world we inhabit 2015.

What would he say if some European leader suggested he get off his high horse about Jim Crow and American Slavery? The Arab slave trade was established in the 8th and 9th Centuries in AFRICA.

In fact - Boko Haram and Isis ARE TAKING SLAVES RIGHT FUCKING NOW!!!!

2Thick

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Christians have killed people in this country in the name of their christian beliefs within the last 6 years and I haven't seen anyone (left, right or center) defending ISIS nor have I seen Obama saying what ISIS is doing is OK "since "Christians" killed people 1000 years ago"


You're all rationalizing and downplaying their savagery and comparing it in a positive light to other barbaric behavior by other idiots (basically defending them) instead of condemning them and wanting to do what it takes to stop them.

If it's somebody here in America blowing up abortion clinics or government buildings for whatever reasons, I say try them and execute them. How about you?
 
You'll of course next say it's all Bush's fault and all because of the west that Isis doing these things in the first place.
A

2Thick

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Haven't seen anyone here defending ISIS or condoning their actions..

I guess that's a matter of opinion.

You guys bringing up things that happened 1000 years ago to try to make some sort of moral equivalence argument sound like the heartbroken parents of a son on death row who are making excuses for his savagery and blaming others for it and begging for his life.
A

Straw Man

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You're all rationalizing and downplaying their savagery and comparing it in a positive light to other barbaric behavior by other idiots (basically defending them) instead of condemning them and wanting to do what it takes to stop them.

If it's somebody here in America blowing up abortion clinics or government buildings for whatever reasons, I say try them and execute them. How about you?
 
You'll of course next say it's all Bush's fault and all because of the west that Isis doing these things in the first place.

I'm not defending or condoning "them"

I'm pointing out that  your statement is false as in factually incorrect

Agnostic007

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nonsense, the president is a member and libs wear ISIS t-shirts to work, if they had jobs.

I'm not sure you realize this but you lose credibility when you post things of this nature. It really makes it hard to put any weight to your comments. 

Agnostic007

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Obama's "high horse" remarks are incredibly stupid and show his fundamental failure to comprehend what is unfolding in the world we inhabit 2015.

What would he say if some European leader suggested he get off his high horse about Jim Crow and American Slavery? The Arab slave trade was established in the 8th and 9th Centuries in AFRICA.

In fact - Boko Haram and Isis ARE TAKING SLAVES RIGHT FUCKING NOW!!!!


Let me try and put some context to it for you....... I think I'm spinning wheels but here goes...


There are a great many people who are ready to condemn the entire religion of Islam for what some extremists are doing in the name of that religion. Hatred continues to build that ultimately if left unchecked, could boil over into a multitude of problems in the near future. Your average bubba thinks all Muslims want to see him beheaded. Obama is trying to add some perspective and say "before you condemn all of Islam for what ISIS is doing, don't forget we had our own extremists do horrible things in the name of Christianity. It doesn't mean we were all like that.

Hence the high horse comment which i think was poorly thought out.. but I get what he was saying because I am not clouded by a rage   

Soul Crusher

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Let me try and put some context to it for you....... I think I'm spinning wheels but here goes...


There are a great many people who are ready to condemn the entire religion of Islam for what some extremists are doing in the name of that religion. Hatred continues to build that ultimately if left unchecked, could boil over into a multitude of problems in the near future. Your average bubba thinks all Muslims want to see him beheaded. Obama is trying to add some perspective and say "before you condemn all of Islam for what ISIS is doing, don't forget we had our own extremists do horrible things in the name of Christianity. It doesn't mean we were all like that.

Hence the high horse comment which i think was poorly thought out.. but I get what he was saying because I am not clouded by a rage   

Who are all these people Obama is talking about the represent such a problem labeling all muslims ?   More straw Man bullshit from Obama in order to deflect from his arab brothers and sisters acting like animals. 

Soul Crusher

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“‘Lest we get on our high horse’ is a comic piece of rhetorical construction, as it actually signals the speaker is getting on his high horse,” writes John Podhoretz.


Yesterday, President Obama used the phrase during his speech at the National Prayer Breakfast, an interfaith gathering of political leaders. He said people of all faiths have been willing to “hijack religion for their own murderous ends… And lest we get on our high horse and think this is unique to some other place, remember that during the Crusades and the Inquisition, people committed terrible deeds in the name of Christ.”

 




It’s unclear precisely why President Obama is intent on bringing up the events of nearly 1000 years ago to downplay the brutal acts of the (totally not Islamic, why would you think they’re Islamic? That’s weird of you) Islamic State or (nothing whatsoever to do with Islam, it’s pretty racist of you to suggest it, actually) Boko Haram and (what gave you the idea that the Charlie Hebdo assassins were motivated by religion? You must watch Fox News) al Qaeda in Yemen. Some critics of war worry, I think incorrectly, that we can’t detail ISIS’ atrocities or freely discuss the threat of Islamist jihadism without it leading to unbridled involvement in foreign lands.


Still, the Crusades aren’t a great example of high-horse Christian aggression for a few different reasons. For one, the wars were defensive wars, a centrally important fact left out of most stoned sophomores’ discussion upon first learning any history prior to 1983. To quote the great historian of Islam Bernard Lewis:


The Crusades could more accurately be described as a limited, belated and, in the last analysis, ineffectual response to the jihad -- a failed attempt to recover by a Christian holy war what had been lost to a Muslim holy war...

Mohammed himself led the first jihad, in the wars of the Muslims against the pagans in Arabia. The jihad continued under his successors, with a series of wars that brought the Middle East, including the Holy Land, under Arab Muslim rule and then continued eastward into Asia, westward into Africa, and three times into Europe -- the Moors in Spain, the Tatars in Russia, the Turks in the Balkans. The Crusade was part of the European counterattack. The Christian re-conquest succeeded in Spain, Russia and eventually the Balkans; it failed to recover the Holy Land of Christendom.








That was my rhetorical question yesterday, to which I received wide-ranging responses, such as “the new iPhone” and, closer, “Muslims were taking a stroll through Europe, minding their own business, when Charles Martel attacked them for no reason!”


The idea that you’d use Crusades as a means to tell a story about all religions being the same shows a shocking lack of regard for the historical reason for said crusades.


And, sure, if some significant minority of Christianity, much less any contingent, were not just crusading at this moment in time but actually arguing that the worst atrocities committed during the Crusades should have been approved by the church and were the correct interpretation of Christianity, that might call for a much-needed slap-down. But that is not the real world we live in today.


In the real world that we currently occupy, the one where President Obama is the current president, we have unspeakable atrocities committed by Muslim jihadists with alarming frequency. Some of these have been against Americans and they promise that more are to come. These guys don’t take their religious cues from Obama or anyone else in the administration or anyone in the media, so they could give a rat’s patootie whether those entities question their religious views.


To take just one example, you saw various elites say that the burning in a cage of the Jordanian pilot wasn’t Islamic. Here’s Fareed Zakaria of CNN:


Look, ISIS is not really about Islam or religion. This is a very... I mean, this is a barbarous thing to do and a violation of any kind of humanity, but it's also very un-Islamic. It doesn't follow any precepts of Islam. And so they claim to be Islamic. No! They're a band of thugs.





Fareed Zakaria also claimed:






The only problem with this is that it’s asserted but not substantiated. It’s one thing to say that some Muslims disagree with ISIS’ interpretation of Islam, entirely another to say they’re not making the case that they’re Islamic. This Washington Post story goes through ISIS’ defense of its most recent actions. Not all Muslim scholars agree (which should surprise no one even slightly familiar with Islam) but ISIS made its case and its clerics supported burning a prisoner in a cage on the grounds of qisas:


That Quranic verse (16:126) forms part of the basis for “qisas,” a broad concept in Islamic law that calls for equal retribution for crimes – in essence, an eye for an eye. As Shiraz Maher, a senior fellow at the International Center for the Study of Radicalisation at King’s College London, writes, it’s usually used in cases of murder or mutilation. At points, jihadist groups have used it to justify jihadists’ attacks before: Al-Qaeda later used the concept to justify a 1995 strike on the Egyptian Embassy in Islamabad, for example.





From here on out, any media or Obama administration official issuing an edict of heterodoxy against ISIS should be asked to back their doctrinal claims up. They should tell us how they came to understand Sharia and what books or texts they’re using and precisely how they’re judging ISIS to be non-compliant. Or, perhaps far better, they should stop issuing doctrinal declarations of who is a good Muslim and who is a bad Muslim as if the U.S. was the world’s most under-qualified Sharia Court! It’s true that most Muslims in the world do not support ISIS or other jihadist theology. It’s also true that a pretty significant minority does support violence. Here is a recent subtitled video purporting to show the Jordanian head of the Muslim Brotherhood declining to call ISIS a terrorist group, for what it’s worth.


Listen, I don’t trust the media or politicians to know jack about my Lutheranism. I certainly don’t go to them for expertise on the finer contours of jihadist theology. But it’s about 20 years past time to drop the unbelievably inadequate armchair theologizing and wake up to the reality that whether our presidents view ISIS and similar organizations as heterodox or not, ISIS is making claims about Islam that they are backing up and selling to others.


Condescending to Americans by reiterating that not all Christians are or have been perfect throughout history — in an environment where people are losing their heads on camera, are being burned in cages, and are being gunned down in their offices, markets and cafes by Islamic jihadists — is weird and unbecoming.


It’s also self-defeating. A man telling his girlfriend or wife to “calm down” is a horrible way to resolve conflict. President Obama reacts to things such as the burning of the Jordanian pilot in the cage by telling Americans to calm down. It has precisely the opposite effect. It makes those alarmed by such human rights violations and the threat they represent to American interests think that they are in an even more desperate situation. Following up the demand to “calm down” by bringing up past grievances (that are literally hundreds of years old and told dangerously out of context) is just another bad relationship cliche. Enough.


http://thefederalist.com/2015/02/06/lets-face-isis-reality-and-drop-the-sophomoric-armchair-theologizing/

240 is Back

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I'm not sure you realize this but you lose credibility when you post things of this nature. It really makes it hard to put any weight to your comments. 

I could use the [sarcasm] tag.

But we're in a world where a handful of getbiggers TRULY believe our president supports/member of ISIS.  You see that, right?

Jack T. Cross

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No, it isn't good for a "leader" to say stuff like that in this way. Everywhere you look, there are opportunities given to allow the operation and expansion of whatever "isis" enemy in fact exists. It cannot be denied. For the president to say what he did, it goes a long way toward contributing to that. Of course it does.

Guys like Obama are showing there's some incentive to allow the problem to expand and get worse, which means there must have been the exact same incentive to help create it in the first place, to the point of ridiculousness since 911. Can anyone say otherwise?

polychronopolous

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Haven't seen anyone here defending ISIS or condoning their actions..

That's not what anybody is saying.

People are being lit on fire. Little children are being raped, tortured and killed.

You don't think the president's statement seemed a bit out of place?

Jack T. Cross

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Just like the FBI scrounging up these "dangerous criminals" that wouldn't have been able to stumble out for a beer successfully, let alone do the things they're charged with trying to do.

The "good guys" are creating crime, and they are burdening Americans and others with their bullshit. It's a dangerous game that won't end well for us.

Agnostic007

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I could use the [sarcasm] tag.

But we're in a world where a handful of getbiggers TRULY believe our president supports/member of ISIS.  You see that, right?

aaahhh.... I see

Soul Crusher

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