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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: TRIX on March 27, 2018, 11:43:42 AM
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In an old Arnold classic video Arnold commented saying that to bring up weak calves do 25 sets per day
Just something I noticed :D
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dident he already had great calves from early years?
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dident he already had great calves from early years?
at 18 or 19 you be the judge
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at 18 or 19 you be the judge
???
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His calves were never weak. He didn't really change the size they just got a lot more ripped? Unless i'm missing something.
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Can you really bring up anything if it is a genetic weakness? I think in a 2004 issue of FLEX magazine [perhaps the one where he and Craig Titus were both being interviewed, but I can't remember], Lee Priest said that your weak points will always be your weak points - just bigger versions.
Although Phil Heath's legs and back both seemed to have come up, not just in size, but in terms of proportion to other areas.
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Can you really bring up anything if it is a genetic weakness? I think in a 2004 issue of FLEX magazine [perhaps the one where he and Craig Titus were both being interviewed, but I can't remember], Lee Priest said that your weak points will always be your weak points - just bigger versions.
Although Phil Heath's legs and back both seemed to have come up, not just in size, but in terms of proportion to other areas.
Phil besides his lack of width isn’t lacking any body parts, genetically he was blessed to have great shape and a wow factor in terms of arms, even his forearms are very developed
Cormier and Shawn are two others in modern times that really didn’t lack anything (you can argue size for Shawn)
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he had weak calves, but they blew up with the help of steroids and training extremely heavy (1000 lbs) his calves allegedly grew to be 20'' (that's huge)
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???
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judging by those pics, Arnold legit brought his 15'' calves to 20'' calves, then again no one ever trained harder than Arnold (at least that I know of)
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Arnold spent lots of minutes daily....doing a ton of static top portion isometric calf contractions.....while keeping on his tiptoes....trying to fuck his tall mexican housekeepers and nannies while they bent over standing up....over his washer-dryer.
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Arnold spent lots of minutes daily....doing a ton of static top portion isometric calf contractions.....while keeping on his tiptoes....trying to fuck his tall mexican housekeepers and nannies while they bent over standing up....over his washer-dryer.
you got me for a moment
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???
That top pic is not Arnold
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That top pic is not Arnold
Agree....I believe it is Grymko.....Pete Grymkowski.
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at 18 or 19 you be the judge
With arms like that fuck calves... :o
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In an old Arnold classic video Arnold commented saying that to bring up weak calves do 25 sets per day
Just something I noticed :D
Welcome to the bodybuilding encyclopedia circa 90's lol.
Supposed 1000lb baby cow raises with reg park...
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his book
2x your weight to make calves grow
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one leg calf raises with a dumbbell in the hand opposite of the calf doing the work. 6 sets x 15 reps twice a week in-between one-legged squats. Medium and heavy weight each once a week after this, doing the same. Cardio using a stepper or whatever the fuck it's called on your toes 45 minutes twice a week. Tren and test combo daily with lots of protein. They will grow!
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They’re implants.
HTH
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::)
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Agree....I believe it is Grymko.....Pete Grymkowski.
Absolutely correct sir. Our boss.
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I'm gonna guess he never bothered to train calves until someone pointed out that his were under-developed. Can't really explain the drastic improvements otherwise.
Lol at the suggestion that they're implants .. yeah sure, the world's best implants, the likes of which have never been seen since ::)
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Arnold's calves workout
https://www.flexonline.com/training/legs/calves/complete-arnold-calves
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I'm gonna guess he never bothered to train calves until someone pointed out that his were under-developed. Can't really explain the drastic improvements otherwise.
Lol at the suggestion that they're implants .. yeah sure, the world's best implants, the likes of which have never been seen since ::)
I knew a guy who actually had implants in the early 1990s. There was no way you could hide the
scars if you looked. They were blended in with the natural creases right behind the knee but there
was no hiding them. You could fool normal people who don't analyze someone's legs and they wouldn't
notice until you pointed them out.
You can be sure if there were even such a things as calf implants in the early 1970s it would be much
worse. Plus, you can see how Arnold's calves shrunk considerably between 1975-1979 when he
retired. He brought them right back up in 1980. I remember Joe Meeko insisted that Arnold also had
pec implants. Meeko was an exceptionally good guy but jealousy gets even the best of them.
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Jump rope.
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Phil besides his lack of width isn’t lacking any body parts, genetically he was blessed to have great shape and a wow factor in terms of arms, even his forearms are very developed
Cormier and Shawn are two others in modern times that really didn’t lack anything (you can argue size for Shawn)
Phil lacks clavicles.
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Rumour is he had implants. But they didnt really look like it. Found some guy on youtube carlito xxl. He has 24 inch calves and they look the best ever! Check him out. Damn!
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I'm gonna guess he never bothered to train calves until someone pointed out that his were under-developed. Can't really explain the drastic improvements otherwise.
Lol at the suggestion that they're implants .. yeah sure, the world's best implants, the likes of which have never been seen since ::)
This. Not to mention he happens to have the best genetics for spectacular calf development.
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Jump rope.
Been doing weighted jumps on the theory that they're type 1A explosive fibers, followed by single leg traditional toe raises to weeping (in case they're type 2B putt-putt fibres) but get the feeling I'm destined to have bushman of the kalahari calves.
Ugh, like most of my build guess they'll be better than if I didn't do anything.
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I knew a guy who actually had implants in the early 1990s. There was no way you could hide the
scars if you looked. They were blended in with the natural creases right behind the knee but there
was no hiding them. You could fool normal people who don't analyze someone's legs and they wouldn't
notice until you pointed them out.
You can be sure if there were even such a things as calf implants in the early 1970s it would be much
worse. Plus, you can see how Arnold's calves shrunk considerably between 1975-1979 when he
retired. He brought them right back up in 1980. I remember Joe Meeko insisted that Arnold also had
pec implants. Meeko was an exceptionally good guy but jealousy gets even the best of them.
Yes, exactly. Any calf implants that existed at the time would have been primitive & easily identified by the thousands of jealous naysayers
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Arnold possibly had the best calves ever
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Arnold spent lots of minutes daily....doing a ton of static top portion isometric calf contractions.....while keeping on his tiptoes....trying to fuck his tall mexican housekeepers and nannies while they bent over standing up....over his washer-dryer.
Mexican housekeepers/nannies are rarely tall.
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They’re implants.
HTH
Very wrong. They look 100% anatomically correct to me. +they shrank down as he retired.
Ferrigno is the one that used implants.
check here what implants looks like:
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=422378.0
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Rumour is he had implants. But they didnt really look like it. Found some guy on youtube carlito xxl. He has 24 inch calves and they look the best ever! Check him out. Damn!
that guy is a midget. His calves are no where near 24 inches LOL
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Worst calf implants ever!!!
This is one of two brothers that went to Costa Rica and got implants. I have no idea wtf they were expecting or thinking. The surgeon must (or should have) shown them photos of what he planned to do or how it would go. But whatever the case... they went along with it.
I don't have photos of the brother, but he is not as lean or vascular and while you can't see the actual shape of the implant looking like Princess Leia's side hair buns, it still is so close to the surface that there are red ovals on each side of his legs. Like a red burn mark.
I wish I could post photos of the rest of this guy because he absolutely NO traps at all. Wide shoulders, but no a single ounce of trap muscle anywhere. He looks like his neck and clavicle forms a 90 degree angle.
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.
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(https://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=644152.0;attach=1283752;image)
Outstanding muscle separation. :D
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Worst calf implants ever!!!
This is one of two brothers that went to Costa Rica and got implants. I have no idea wtf they were expecting or thinking. The surgeon must (or should have) shown them photos of what he planned to do or how it would go. But whatever the case... they went along with it.
I don't have photos of the brother, but he is not as lean or vascular and while you can't see the actual shape of the implant looking like Princess Leia's side hair buns, it still is so close to the surface that there are red ovals on each side of his legs. Like a red burn mark.
I wish I could post photos of the rest of this guy because he absolutely NO traps at all. Wide shoulders, but no a single ounce of trap muscle anywhere. He looks like his neck and clavicle forms a 90 degree angle.
The Stoltman Brothers would never do this.
Speaking of which...actual experts of people with knowledge would immediately know those calves look suspect.
As for Princess Leia, I've actually never watched any Star Wars movie except for the Revenge of the Sith one, in 2005.
It's funny how you astutely pointed out that his calves look like Princess Leia's hair...I would also add that they look like Carrie Fisher herself once she turned 30. Some women hit the wall earlier than others.
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It's funny how you astutely pointed out that his calves look like Princess Leia's hair...I would also add that they look like Carrie Fisher herself once she turned 30. Some women hit the wall earlier than others.
Drugs and alcohol ruined Carrie Fisher and eventually killed her. The coke, prescription meds and booze took it's toll. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrie_Fisher#Bipolar_disorder_and_drug_use (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrie_Fisher#Bipolar_disorder_and_drug_use)
She was 33 in the movie "The Burbs" and was still very fuckable.
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.laweekly.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2019%2F05%2Fburbs005.jpg&f=1&nofb=1)
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In 1975 a guy in my gym in LA who said he was an ex training partner of Arnold told me Arnold went to Mexico and got implants....
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Because Mexico leads the world in state of the art cosmetic implant surgery? lol Umm, not.
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I've heard that Schwarzenegger paid for Carrie Fisher's implants(before he transitioned to Greta Thunberg).
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Arnold's calves look like real muscle. How hard is it to believe the greatest bodybuilder on earth couldn't build calf muscle? If they were some kind of implant he got in the early 70's by the way they didn't exist then why did his calves go down along with the rest of his muscles when he got older?
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Can you really bring up anything if it is a genetic weakness? I think in a 2004 issue of FLEX magazine [perhaps the one where he and Craig Titus were both being interviewed, but I can't remember], Lee Priest said that your weak points will always be your weak points - just bigger versions.
Although Phil Heath's legs and back both seemed to have come up, not just in size, but in terms of proportion to other areas.
The biggest weakness for Titus was the muscle between the ears. It never got stronger.
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Arnold's calves look like real muscle. How hard is it to believe the greatest bodybuilder on earth couldn't build calf muscle? If they were some kind of implant he got in the early 70's by the way they didn't exist then why did his calves go down along with the rest of his muscles when he got older?
yeah I don't understand that either. I mean his arms and chest are also incredibly developed. Pure jealousy imo.
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Arnold went into the future and got calf implants done at Sarah-Connor Hospital.
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Arnold’s calves were never weak just small. Genetically he had awesome shape he just needed to work them. You can’t build what isn’t there.
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Back when Shawn Ray was accusing Flex of having implants, everyone was looking for the tell-tale scar behind his knee as proof. When it was not found there, they started the rumor about doctors going in through the bottom of his foot to place the implant.
Years later, we all figured it out was synthol.
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Outstanding muscle separation. :D
Legit lol’d
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Drugs and alcohol ruined Carrie Fisher and eventually killed her. The coke, prescription meds and booze took it's toll. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrie_Fisher#Bipolar_disorder_and_drug_use (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrie_Fisher#Bipolar_disorder_and_drug_use)
She was 33 in the movie "The Burbs" and was still very fuckable.
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.laweekly.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2019%2F05%2Fburbs005.jpg&f=1&nofb=1)
Since I never watched any of the Star Wars movies, I never had a crush on Carrie Fisher, and I just didn't see too many of her movies as a kid growing up [during her prime as an actress].
Years later, watching When Harry Met Sally, I thought she looked rather aged for 31 or 32 [the likely age she was during filming, given it's release date in 1989, within five months of The Burbs being released. I'm not giving the exact dates to correct you or anything - but just to say that she was definitely in her early thirties [as you said - even if she was 31 and not 33 - I still felt she looked older than her age, and much less attractive than she was in Star Wars, from pictures I saw.
As you said - I guess the drugs took their toll. It's sad, really. It just goes to show that you can have it all and still be sad or have issues depending on genetic characteristics or other things.
It almost makes me feel that being my friend's dog would be a better life than one that most people lead. Some people are happier just eating a bucket of chicken from KFC washed down with grape pop versus other people with millions of dollars - even billions.
After watching a video today of a Komodo dragon eat a deer alive, and pull its baby out of its womb and eat it alive too in a single gulp, it just made me realize that so many things are straight up just the luck of the draw.
In bodybuilding, calves seem to be the biggest one.
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She was smokin hot in The Empire Strikes Back.
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Arnold’s calves were never weak just small. Genetically he had awesome shape he just needed to work them. You can’t build what isn’t there.
Exactly - the muscle fiber density was absolutely there. It sort of reminds me of King Kamali's arms compared to Kevin Levrone's - it would have been impossible for Kamali to build arms like Levrone had. Kamali had the same gap between the end of his biceps and his elbow joint that I have, and there is nothing I can do to ever fix that, and that's just the way it is.
Speaking of Kamali, I was disgusted with how he looked after around 2002.
Just disgusted.
But he looked fantastic in 2007 at the Montreal Pro, and proved he still had it. Seeing how he got back to close to his former best almost out of the blue, it was obvious to me that whoever did his prep that year was a pure genius, a chemist, a magician, or all of the above.
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I'm gonna guess he never bothered to train calves until someone pointed out that his were under-developed. Can't really explain the drastic improvements otherwise.
Lol at the suggestion that they're implants .. yeah sure, the world's best implants, the likes of which have never been seen since ::)
And they had those perfect implants available 50 years ago.
I remember in the 90s when some were indeed getting implants you could still see the scar if you knew where to look which was in the back of the knee where it blended in with the natural skin creases in that area.
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Roger Callard was a top bodybuilder, Arnolds friend and training partner at the time and he said Arnold went to Mexico and got implants. Callard was respected and not known as a bullshitter. I'm sorry if I burst some peoples bubble but this sport is based on deceit and bullshit..(drugs)
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Roger Callard was a top bodybuilder, Arnolds friend and training partner at the time and he said Arnold went to Mexico and got implants. Callard was respected and not known as a bullshitter. I'm sorry if I burst some peoples bubble but this sport is based on deceit and bullshit..(drugs)
It was said Arnold had pec implants. Do you believe that too? Or even bicep implants?
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http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=633529.msg8825066#msg8825066
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Duchaine said it was actually small injections of silicone...
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Duchaine said it was actually small injections of silicone...
I remember reading that Arnold used to travel to Europe for a few weeks and come back looking 20 pounds bigger. Rumor was it was site injections of some kind.
Who knows, leave Arnold alone guys! ;D
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Duchaine said it was actually small injections of silicone...
wasn't Duchaine that guy that had a woman put in implants in her calves. Which was a butcher job so her legs had to be amputated from knee down
yeah I'd totally trust that guy ::) seems like a really credible nice person ::)
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Roger Callard was a top bodybuilder, Arnolds friend and training partner at the time and he said Arnold went to Mexico and got implants. Callard was respected and not known as a bullshitter. I'm sorry if I burst some peoples bubble but this sport is based on deceit and bullshit..(drugs)
That’s a load of BS, he got a cock implant
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Arnold's calves look like real muscle. How hard is it to believe the greatest bodybuilder on earth couldn't build calf muscle? If they were some kind of implant he got in the early 70's by the way they didn't exist then why did his calves go down along with the rest of his muscles when he got older?
Meltdown.
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wasn't Duchaine that guy that had a woman put in implants in her calves. Which was a butcher job so her legs had to be amputated from knee down
yeah I'd totally trust that guy ::) seems like a really credible nice person ::)
I knew a guy in Atlanta that had that happened to him. (It had already happened when I joined Main Event Fitness where he worked). But he said he got the implants and in the left leg it was located too close to a nerve. After a couple of years of having his lower leg feel like it was constantly falling asleep, he went to another doctor who told him the implant needed to come out ASAP. He had it removed but it had compressed the nerve to a state of irreparable damage. Despite everything they tried, his lower leg withered away and atrophied badly enough that he had to have it amputated.
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Roger Callard was a top bodybuilder, Arnolds friend and training partner at the time and he said Arnold went to Mexico and got implants. Callard was respected and not known as a bullshitter. I'm sorry if I burst some peoples bubble but this sport is based on deceit and bullshit..(drugs)
Roger Callard tried to suck Arnold's cock after a training session. He was so pissed at being rebuffed that he started this bullshit rumor you speak of.
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Roger Callard was a top bodybuilder, Arnolds friend and training partner at the time and he said Arnold went to Mexico and got implants. Callard was respected and not known as a bullshitter. I'm sorry if I burst some peoples bubble but this sport is based on deceit and bullshit..(drugs)
Why should we believe you? How do we know that you even knew Roger Callard let alone have him confide in you? Why would he confide in you or in anybody and then have them tell you their deep dark secrets? How come we have never seen pics of Arnold training with Callard? They trained in the same gym but what evidence that they were close buddies that Arnold would confide to? Why would Arnold tell Callard he got implants? Have you seen implants? They don't flex. They don't look anything like Arnold's calves which are ripped and flexes naturally. How did surgeons in Mexico do calf implants 50 years ago that are so much better than the implants of today? I know three people that have had calf implants. One had it done in the early 1990s and the other two in 2000. They look like implants to the trained eye. Since when is Mexico on the cutting edge of enhancement surgery to make an implant so flawless, without any visible scars, all done 50 years ago? Why did Arnold's calves shrink when he retired and then blew back up for 1980?
I know you have a very, very dim view of bbing even though you are here on a bbing board. I'm sorry if I burst your bubble but high-level bbing is one of the most demanding 24/7 sports in the world and requires a level of commitment and discipline few can manage. Only the bitter and deluded think that it's based all on deceit and bullshit. Maybe you should go back and watch some videos of Dorian or Coleman and tell me what they are doing day after day, year after year, all deceit and bullshit.
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It was said Arnold had pec implants. Do you believe that too? Or even bicep implants?
You're right. Even Joe Meeko claimed that Arnold had pec implants. And I guarantee you that if prime Arnold were around today people would insist that Arnold had oil in his biceps. In fact, in the Arnold thread when someone commented on how large Arnold's delts were in 1980 another claimed that he used synthol. Synthol didn't even exists in 1980.
BBing has gotten to the point that so many believe that you just can't build real muscle anymore. They project their failures onto others. I remember getting into a long and heated argument with someone who insists that Robert Conrad, from "Wild Wild West" was juicing. His proof was that he just "knows" because Conrad had that "look". And this is the picture that this expert posted as proof that Conrad was a juicer. Just wait for the rebuttal from oldgolds who knows all the deep dark secrets.
(https://www.tomfurman.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/ConradShirtless2.jpg)
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http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=633529.msg8825066#msg8825066
And this rebuttal crushes those two wannabes
two guys who made gay porn and have denied it ever since are trustworthy?
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I remember reading that Arnold used to travel to Europe for a few weeks and come back looking 20 pounds bigger. Rumor was it was site injections of some kind.
Who knows, leave Arnold alone guys! ;D
Remember how huge Arnold was at 19 year old? They were using site injections back in the 60s and 70s that caused his arms and pecs to get so huge?
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Roger Callard tried to suck Arnold's cock after a training session. He was so pissed at being rebuffed that he started this bullshit rumor you speak of.
Exactly.
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Arnold's calves look like real muscle. How hard is it to believe the greatest bodybuilder on earth couldn't build calf muscle? If they were some kind of implant he got in the early 70's by the way they didn't exist then why did his calves go down along with the rest of his muscles when he got older?
The phags today can't believe anybody can build real muscle anymore. Even a genetic marvel like Arnold that was driven to succeed at everything.
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Here's Patrick Arnold (of Balco fame) telling the Arnold Calf Implant Story on Misc.Fitness.Weights back in May 1996 -
"Arnold had no calves. Then he went to visit his friend Reg Park in South Africa (where a certain prominent cosmetic surgeon happened to have his residence also.) He stayed a couple of months. The only pictures of him there were of him in Reg's pool with calves underwater and such. Arnold comes back to America with huge calves. Coincidence? When questioned about his huge gains in the calf department, Arnold claims Reg taught him to train them heavy and that this was the 'secret'. Well, for the rest of us heavy calf training does not give anywhere near dramatic results. Am I making this up?
I was told this story by a certain renowned plastic surgeon who goes by the initials B.N., who, though he admitted there is only circumstantial evidence, certainly is qualified to spot such a thing. "
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It's the same version Duchaine told, except for Duchaine adding the "small silicone injections" part as how it could've been done. I'm guessing the "B N" is Bruce Nadler, who was a famous bodybuilding plastic surgeon years ago. He'd be involved in a murder - suicide with his wife in the early 2000's, so if there was more to the story, it's gone now.
To be fair to Duchaine, etc....., he usually never told it as fact, it was just one of those pieces of bodybuilding lore that floats around.
Have fun with it :).
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Edit - Duchaine and the silicone bit in 1996, discussing it vs Synthol (not in relation to Arnold, but how the technique works) -
"Why bother with an oil?
The same size needle would pass silicone and it would be safer and last forever. Small injections would allow the body to naturally encapsulate the silicone so it will stay put."
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No way did Arnold have calf injections or implants. You can see the muscle fibers moving when he flexed them. Oil and implants don't flex.
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arnold did know roger callard but only from being in the gym. they never hung out etc. in fact arnold himself mentions callard about back trainng. he told callard to include bent over rows tbar rows dumbell rows etc to build back "thickness" cuz all callard used to do was pulldowns etc. funny how these implant stories change. one said 'weider" hooked him up with a mexican doctoe in mexico. another south america. another with dick sucker nadler etc. in truth arnold was like everyone else. he trained calves last in his workout and alot of times he missed them completly. then he went to reg and reg explainded to him about what calves were designed to do ( dense muscle fiber and for everyday use. basically saying you can not over train them no matter what) so he then started everyday calf training more and more weight and training them first in his workouts. lots of sets and kept reps low( usually 10 or so) plus he trained them most of the time BAREFOOT. try it. you will see how much more you can feel your calves. also he cut off the bottoms of his sweats to expose them so he had to train them cuz people made comments. oh and duchaine liked to joke and say things for reactions etc. the female who did that actually had someone use silicone ( hardware store stuff) and thats what caused her problems. she didnt understand what he meant ( just like when duchaine said mike mentzer used to drink his own urine. he didnt he had to carry a jug around to piss in for the doctor to check his kidneys out) duchaine was always doing shit like that. a steroid and body genius but also a little warpped. lol
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Why should we believe you? How do we know that you even knew Roger Callard let alone have him confide in you? Why would he confide in you or in anybody and then have them tell you their deep dark secrets? How come we have never seen pics of Arnold training with Callard? They trained in the same gym but what evidence that they were close buddies that Arnold would confide to? Why would Arnold tell Callard he got implants? Have you seen implants? They don't flex. They don't look anything like Arnold's calves which are ripped and flexes naturally. How did surgeons in Mexico do calf implants 50 years ago that are so much better than the implants of today? I know three people that have had calf implants. One had it done in the early 1990s and the other two in 2000. They look like implants to the trained eye. Since when is Mexico on the cutting edge of enhancement surgery to make an implant so flawless, without any visible scars, all done 50 years ago? Why did Arnold's calves shrink when he retired and then blew back up for 1980?
I know you have a very, very dim view of bbing even though you are here on a bbing board. I'm sorry if I burst your bubble but high-level bbing is one of the most demanding 24/7 sports in the world and requires a level of commitment and discipline few can manage. Only the bitter and deluded think that it's based all on deceit and bullshit. Maybe you should go back and watch some videos of Dorian or Coleman and tell me what they are doing day after day, year after year, all deceit and bullshit.
I didn't know Callard, my source was another guy who trained at Olympic Health club in LA in 1975....
Clean weight-training and bodybuilding is a great pastime but competitive bodybuilding is cesspool of narcissistic, drug addicted phonies standing on a stage in their underwear screaming to the World "look at this beautiful body I've created by injecting dangerous, unhealthy drugs"
You seem like a smart guy, I'm surprised you are so invested in this phony charade.
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His calves and pecs were built with hard work........something that seems to be forgotten about in this sport these days.
How can anyone with any knowledge of bodybuilding or anatomy look at his pecs and calves and believe he had implants?
Fucking ridiculous !!
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Arnold went into the future and got calf implants done at Sarah-Connor Hospital.
Bro...
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Here's Patrick Arnold (of Balco fame) telling the Arnold Calf Implant Story on Misc.Fitness.Weights back in May 1996 -
"Arnold had no calves.
Patrick Arnold is no dummy but saying he had "no calves" is idiotic, and it's been repeated thousands of times all over. It's plain idiocy as can be seen in pics in this thread. He had calves the same shape from the start and you can see that he had the fibers to work with, nice full bellies. Definitely didn't look like they came up more than the rest of him, looks to me like he just got bigger overall.
And I don't believe he trained them in some inhuman fashion never seen before or since, like is always repeated. What dod they say, 1,500lbs standing calf raises every day or some such shit? Anyone would damage their feet and tendons doing this every day. The footage I've seen of Arnold training looks pretty low stress, more high volume sweating as opposed to extremely intense high (http://high) density grinding training. No one goes twice a day high volume and trains real hard, as in extreme intensity every set.
Now is it impossible he had some experimental injections put in his calves? Maybe not, who knows.
But he didn't look like he had done any site injections in any of his muscles. The look of oil injections is unmistakable, but it's amazing how even long term fans can't spot site injections in cases that are obvious to me. There's a pretty current thread on professionalmuscle about Dusty Hanshaw where I'm arguing with people on this subject and many just can't spot SEO.
But Arnold didn't have that look.
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Patrick Arnold is no dummy but saying he had "no calves" is idiotic, and it's been repeated thousands of times all over. It's plain idiocy as can be seen in pics in this thread. He had calves the same shape from the start and you can see that he had the fibers to work with, nice full bellies. Definitely didn't look like they came up more than the rest of him, looks to me like he just got bigger overall.
And I don't believe he trained them in some inhuman fashion never seen before or since, like is always repeated. What dod they say, 1,500lbs standing calf raises every day or some such shit? Anyone would damage their feet and tendons doing this every day. The footage I've seen of Arnold training looks pretty low stress, more high volume sweating as opposed to extremely intense high (http://high) density grinding training. No one goes twice a day high volume and trains real hard, as in extreme intensity every set.
Now is it impossible he had some experimental injections put in his calves? Maybe not, who knows.
But he didn't look like he had done any site injections in any of his muscles. The look of oil injections is unmistakable, but it's amazing how even long term fans can't spot site injections in cases that are obvious to me. There's a pretty current thread on professionalmuscle about Dusty Hanshaw where I'm arguing with people on this subject and many just can't spot SEO.
But Arnold didn't have that look.
well put ..guys used escecline sp?all over back then if needed to temporarily swell parts .
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Patrick Arnold is no dummy but saying he had "no calves" is idiotic, and it's been repeated thousands of times all over. It's plain idiocy as can be seen in pics in this thread. He had calves the same shape from the start and you can see that he had the fibers to work with, nice full bellies. Definitely didn't look like they came up more than the rest of him, looks to me like he just got bigger overall.
And I don't believe he trained them in some inhuman fashion never seen before or since, like is always repeated. What dod they say, 1,500lbs standing calf raises every day or some such shit? Anyone would damage their feet and tendons doing this every day. The footage I've seen of Arnold training looks pretty low stress, more high volume sweating as opposed to extremely intense high (http://high) density grinding training. No one goes twice a day high volume and trains real hard, as in extreme intensity every set.
Now is it impossible he had some experimental injections put in his calves? Maybe not, who knows.
But he didn't look like he had done any site injections in any of his muscles. The look of oil injections is unmistakable, but it's amazing how even long term fans can't spot site injections in cases that are obvious to me. There's a pretty current thread on professionalmuscle about Dusty Hanshaw where I'm arguing with people on this subject and many just can't spot SEO.
But Arnold didn't have that look.
Patrick Arnold is one smart guy- I read lots of his articles over the years and he is a pretty good organic chemist. Not genius level but still a great technician.
But that being said- he spread gossip as good as any one else- and he probably was trolling people with his stories.
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Patrick Arnold is one smart guy- I read lots of his articles over the years and he is a pretty good organic chemist. Not genius level but still a great technician.
But that being said- he spread gossip as good as any one else- and he probably was trolling people with his stories.
Patrick is great at finding new drugs, both PEDs and recreational, most we've probably not even heard of. Probably worked with many athletes who never got caught. Kind of reckless, taking risks with his freedom and maybe peoples health too, just the way I like my gurus :D
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Odd piece of gossip found in the MFW files - Duchaine had Nadler give him a facelift in 1996.
If anyone is bored, and wants to read old gossip, the Google search feature changed and is working really well for Misc.Fitness.Weights, which was the premier bodybuilding forum/newsgroup in the mid 90's.
https://groups.google.com/g/misc.fitness.weights .
Search by topic at the top.
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His calves and pecs were built with hard work........something that seems to be forgotten about in this sport these days.
How can anyone with any knowledge of bodybuilding or anatomy look at his pecs and calves and believe he had implants?
Fucking ridiculous !!
And those implants would have been performed in the '60's. Pec and calf implants today look like shit, just imagine them 5 decades earlier.
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Here's Patrick Arnold (of Balco fame) telling the Arnold Calf Implant Story on Misc.Fitness.Weights back in May 1996 -
"Arnold had no calves. Then he went to visit his friend Reg Park in South Africa (where a certain prominent cosmetic surgeon happened to have his residence also.) He stayed a couple of months. The only pictures of him there were of him in Reg's pool with calves underwater and such. Arnold comes back to America with huge calves. Coincidence? When questioned about his huge gains in the calf department, Arnold claims Reg taught him to train them heavy and that this was the 'secret'. Well, for the rest of us heavy calf training does not give anywhere near dramatic results. Am I making this up?
I was told this story by a certain renowned plastic surgeon who goes by the initials B.N., who, though he admitted there is only circumstantial evidence, certainly is qualified to spot such a thing. "
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It's the same version Duchaine told, except for Duchaine adding the "small silicone injections" part as how it could've been done. I'm guessing the "B N" is Bruce Nadler, who was a famous bodybuilding plastic surgeon years ago. He'd be involved in a murder - suicide with his wife in the early 2000's, so if there was more to the story, it's gone now.
To be fair to Duchaine, etc....., he usually never told it as fact, it was just one of those pieces of bodybuilding lore that floats around.
Have fun with it :).
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Edit - Duchaine and the silicone bit in 1996, discussing it vs Synthol (not in relation to Arnold, but how the technique works) -
"Why bother with an oil?
The same size needle would pass silicone and it would be safer and last forever. Small injections would allow the body to naturally encapsulate the silicone so it will stay put."
Well, it did not last forever. It went down when he stopped training, there are pictures everywhere when he was still young but much smaller. They were smaller when he retired and came back when he competed in 1980.
Who would have thought they would have state of the art plastic surgery for calves fifty years ago in South Africa that surpasses anything that we see today and when breast implants were in the beginning stages. I thought it was in Mexico. After all, his close and intimate friend, Roger Callard said so.
Why didn't Reg Park get these implants that he recommended to Arnold? And, yes, you can get dramatic results from training if you can handle the pain. I did.
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arnold did know roger callard but only from being in the gym. they never hung out etc. in fact arnold himself mentions callard about back trainng. he told callard to include bent over rows tbar rows dumbell rows etc to build back "thickness" cuz all callard used to do was pulldowns etc. funny how these implant stories change. one said 'weider" hooked him up with a mexican doctoe in mexico. another south america. another with dick sucker nadler etc. in truth arnold was like everyone else. he trained calves last in his workout and alot of times he missed them completly. then he went to reg and reg explainded to him about what calves were designed to do ( dense muscle fiber and for everyday use. basically saying you can not over train them no matter what) so he then started everyday calf training more and more weight and training them first in his workouts. lots of sets and kept reps low( usually 10 or so) plus he trained them most of the time BAREFOOT. try it. you will see how much more you can feel your calves. also he cut off the bottoms of his sweats to expose them so he had to train them cuz people made comments. oh and duchaine liked to joke and say things for reactions etc. the female who did that actually had someone use silicone ( hardware store stuff) and thats what caused her problems. she didnt understand what he meant ( just like when duchaine said mike mentzer used to drink his own urine. he didnt he had to carry a jug around to piss in for the doctor to check his kidneys out) duchaine was always doing shit like that. a steroid and body genius but also a little warpped. lol
"BAREFOOT" I can say that made a difference with me. You get a much better contraction doing them barefoot.
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Well, it did not last forever. It went down when he stopped training, there are pictures everywhere when he was still young but much smaller. They were smaller when he retired and came back when he competed in 1980.
Who would have thought they would have state of the art plastic surgery for calves fifty years ago in South Africa that surpasses anything that we see today and when breast implants were in the beginning stages. I thought it was in Mexico. After all, his close and intimate friend, Roger Callard said so.
Why didn't Reg Park get these implants that he recommended to Arnold? And, yes, you can get dramatic results from training if you can handle the pain. I did.
Pellius, I would like to thank you. I actually take the time to read your diatribes. Usually insightful, mildly creepy, but it comes from the heart.
Or asshole.
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I didn't know Callard, my source was another guy who trained at Olympic Health club in LA in 1975....
Clean weight-training and bodybuilding is a great pastime but competitive bodybuilding is cesspool of narcissistic, drug addicted phonies standing on a stage in their underwear screaming to the World "look at this beautiful body I've created by injecting dangerous, unhealthy drugs"
You seem like a smart guy, I'm surprised you are so invested in this phony charade.
You've been around bbing forever and very experienced. I am shocked and surprised that you could be so naive to believe this bull shit.
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I thought I could have read that Eduardo Kawak felt that Len Archambault might have heard that Franco Columbu routinely flew to Budweiser headquarters in St. Louis, Missouri to ride Clydesdale horses in an effort to become even more bowlegged, which Franco thought gave him a competitive edge against the inferior straight-legged competitors, who Columbu despised.
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I thought I could have read that Eduardo Kawak felt that Len Archambault might have heard that Franco Columbu routinely flew to Budweiser headquarters in St. Louis, Missouri to ride Clydesdale horses in an effort to become even more bowlegged, which Franco thought gave him a competitive edge against the inferior straight-legged competitors, who Columbu despised.
Truth.
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No way did Arnold have calf injections or implants. You can see the muscle fibers moving when he flexed them. Oil and implants don't flex.
That's right^
They're not implants, anyone who thinks they were is clueless..
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How hard is it to understand arnold had real calves and real pecs, he trained them hard, ate, took peds, end of story
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And those implants would have been performed in the '60's. Pec and calf implants today look like shit, just imagine them 5 decades earlier.
I hear ya` !!
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Anyone have an educated, realistic guess as to when Arnold first used anabolic steroids? I read somewhere that Arnold's old coach in Austria, forget the name, claimed Arnold took Dianabol, I think it was, at 13 years old. I think it came from that unauthorized biography of Arnold. Now that may sound like just a crazy rumor, 13 years old, a child! But these drugs were in fact given to kids and it has been documented. There was East Germany. Later even American docs gave them to kids like The Coach here on getbig.
But could Arnold have taken them at 13? I mean he did take them as a teen but 13 years old would be real early. I always thought early use could affect your "genetics" and your ultimate muscular potential.
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Well known he used escaline to bring up the calfs.
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Well known he used escaline to bring up the calfs.
I wouldn't say "well known". I doubt it was even in production during Arnold's time. Moreover, it doesn't bring up anything, it's just an inflammatory agent with very temporary effects, as in just hours.
It's just a locally irritating anabolic steroid, not a site enhancing product as some seem to think. Kind of like Test Prop, only "worse".
What's amazing is why no one, to my knowledge, ordered this to be manufactured in China.
Anyone here play with hyaluronic acid site injections or seen people do it? Opinion on it? Someone on another forum claimed Luke Sandoe was doing 50-100ml of the stuff a day before he passed.
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Anyone have an educated, realistic guess as to when Arnold first used anabolic steroids? I read somewhere that Arnold's old coach in Austria, forget the name, claimed Arnold took Dianabol, I think it was, at 13 years old. I think it came from that unauthorized biography of Arnold. Now that may sound like just a crazy rumor, 13 years old, a child! But these drugs were in fact given to kids and it has been documented. There was East Germany. Later even American docs gave them to kids like The Coach here on getbig.
But could Arnold have taken them at 13? I mean he did take them as a teen but 13 years old would be real early. I always thought early use could affect your "genetics" and your ultimate muscular potential.
Not 13!
In education of a bodybuilder he says he started first lifting weights for soccer at around 13-14 these were his first ever weightlifting experiences...
If you read the info in that book in particular and then look at his pics progression I think he certainly started dbol around 16 years years old... 16 would Imo be a very good guess.
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Anyone have an educated, realistic guess as to when Arnold first used anabolic steroids? I read somewhere that Arnold's old coach in Austria, forget the name, claimed Arnold took Dianabol, I think it was, at 13 years old. I think it came from that unauthorized biography of Arnold. Now that may sound like just a crazy rumor, 13 years old, a child! But these drugs were in fact given to kids and it has been documented. There was East Germany. Later even American docs gave them to kids like The Coach here on getbig.
But could Arnold have taken them at 13? I mean he did take them as a teen but 13 years old would be real early. I always thought early use could affect your "genetics" and your ultimate muscular potential.
I'm surprised you haven't read his original autobiography (which he wrote when he was 30 years old -- lol). He stated that he started lifting weights at 15 years old. There were some older fellows that took him under their wing so I would imagine it wasn't too long before they introduced him to dbol. I would guess 16-17 years old. Not sure if a year or two of natural training constitutes a sufficient "base" to insure that he developed "real" muscle.
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Well known he used escaline to bring up the calfs.
No, it's not. I never understand why people just make these things up. First off, Escaline is a psychedelic rec drug, it's Esiclene you mean. So much for common knowledge. In fact, most bbers even today have never even heard of Esiclene that was so well known in the 60s-70s. Why is it "well known" and mentioned repeated throughout the decades that Arnold use Primo, Deca, dbol but no mention, never ever of Esiclene? Do you even know when Esciline was invented? Why no mention of it during the 70s and 80s yet it was "well known" that Arnold used it. By who? You have all these guys claiming he got implants but no one, not a single person, ever mentions Escilene. Why? Because nobody used it? Nobody were even aware of it. It's a weak steroid that caused a lot of inflammation. More so than Suspension or Prop. Bill Phillips wrote an article about Escilene as being useful for bbing because that inflammation will last for a few days and some started experimenting with it. Inflammation was a side effect of the compound but not the original purpose.
Arnold never heard of Escilene and never used it let alone that it was well known that he did. Stop making claims you have no way of knowing. Doesn't anyone find it odd that it was only Arnold who had access to all these state of the art compounds and procedures that only became well know and popular beginning in the 1990s? It was "well-known" that he had implants, used cadaver gh, used Escilene, use Synthol (as claimed in another thread) but nobody else. Not Oliva, Louie, Zane, Serge, Grant, Tinnerino... they all knew what he was doing but didn't do it themselves. They just accepted defeat. And think about it, think for just a minute, one of Arnold's flaws which he was aware of but never admitted it but you can see it by how he posed to minimize the flaw was that he had somewhat wide hips and sloping shoulders. Why use Escilene only in his calves, which were already the best in the world, and not add a few drops into his shoulders to enhance the waist to shoulders ratio? Just use some common sense for chrissakes!
It really a sign of the times when so many believe that you simply can't accomplish anything in life without some kind of deep dark secret. His peers could have done exactly what Arnold did in regard to drugs, training, and diet and they still wouldn't have beaten Arnold. Arnold used what everybody else used. Ate what everybody else ate. He exceeded because of genetics and being so insanely driven and had a personality that captivated the public.
Why is it so hard to believe that Arnold was Arnold simply because he was Arnold?
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Not 13!
In education of a bodybuilder he says he started first lifting weights for soccer at around 13-14 these were his first ever weightlifting experiences...
If you read the info in that book in particular and then look at his pics progression I think he certainly started dbol around 16 years years old... 16 would Imo be a very good guess.
Yes, the way it is written and how he got in so quickly and seamlessly with the "in" crowd that took him to parties and introduce him to girls and really took him under their wing I would guess 16 years old as well.
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Let us examine the photos of Arnold's calves. There is something weird about his calves. Strange lumps.
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I'm surprised you haven't read his original autobiography (which he wrote when he was 30 years old -- lol). He stated that he started lifting weights at 15 years old. There were some older fellows that took him under their wing so I would imagine it wasn't too long before they introduced him to dbol. I would guess 16-17 years old. Not sure if a year or two of natural training constitutes a sufficient "base" to insure that he developed "real" muscle.
I did a google search and supposedly Rick Wayne also claimed Arnold told him he started at 13. Not saying it's true though :D
From the book Muscle, Smoke and mirrors:
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Let us examine the photos of Arnold's calves. There is something weird about his calves. Strange lumps.
Yes, extreme conditioning and definition that you are not going to get with a shot or implant. Compare that with Ferrigno's calves during his come back or Dexter's calves when he used synthol. A whole different phony look.
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I did a google search and supposedly Rick Wayne also claimed Arnold told him he started at 13. Not saying it's true though :D
From the book Muscle, Smoke and mirrors:
Well, I don't know why Arnold would lie in his autobiography. The earlier he could claim he started would show how focused he was a such a young age.
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Arnold's first contests were in April of 1964, when he was 16 years old. That's not a physique from 3 years of steroid use, if from any at all.
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Anyone have an educated, realistic guess as to when Arnold first used anabolic steroids? I read somewhere that Arnold's old coach in Austria, forget the name, claimed Arnold took Dianabol, I think it was, at 13 years old. I think it came from that unauthorized biography of Arnold. Now that may sound like just a crazy rumor, 13 years old, a child! But these drugs were in fact given to kids and it has been documented. There was East Germany. Later even American docs gave them to kids like The Coach here on getbig.
But could Arnold have taken them at 13? I mean he did take them as a teen but 13 years old would be real early. I always thought early use could affect your "genetics" and your ultimate muscular potential.
Kurt Marnul. He was an ex bodybuilder and gym owner, who got to know Arnold and his brother. Apparently he liked the older brother's physique more, but Arnold was the one that kept coming back. As to when he first started, somewhere between 13 - 15 is the rumor by Wendy Leigh, who wrote the unauthorized biography that Arnold hated, and another biographer. She also stated that Rick Wayne was told by Arnold, that Arnold started at 13.
Laurence Leamer, the other Arnold biographer, states that a Dr. Karl Gerstl was involved later, as he was a student of Marnul, and friends with Arnold around the time he was 15.
A long history of Arnold's supposed drug history is cataloged in the book "Muscle, Smoke and Mirrors" by Randy Roach. It's a scholarly tome, that was well received in many circles -
https://www.google.com/books/edition/Muscle_Smoke_and_Mirrors/lOrf_dHX-RgC?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=kurt+marnul+steroids&pg=PA28&printsec=frontcover .
It should link to the Marnul part, then read down, also maybe read up, as there is lots of gossip in the preceding pages. Anyway, play with it a bit, as Google Books can be funny, as I'm sure you know.
(edit, I see you found it :)! )
(edit 2 - Most of the book seems to be free to view, the really good Arnold gossip starts in Chapter 2 / page 25).
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Ian Halperin, a noted celebrity biographer, states he asked Marnul about steroids, and Arnold, and Marnul admitted being Arnold's supplier. From Halperin's "The Governator" book, page 43 -
https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Governator_LP/1vV82HcdMAcC?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=kurt+marnul+steroids&pg=PA43&printsec=frontcover .
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Marnul a few years ago - (https://kulturistika.ronnie.cz/img/data/clanky/galerie_2011/20063_3_1.jpg).
Marnul kinda young - (https://www.muscle-fitness.cz/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/GRAZ01-MARNULZIEGNER.jpg).
Marnul and Arnold, circa 1965 - (https://www.muscle-fitness.cz/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/GRAZ03-MARNUL-ARNOLDZIEGNER.jpg)
More Arnold progression pics from that era -
http://www.gmv.com.au/default.asp?pageid=home&template=content&sid=283 .
https://www.muscle-fitness.cz/galerie-borcu-z-athletik-union-graz/ .
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Marnul and Arnold, circa 1965 - (https://www.muscle-fitness.cz/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/GRAZ03-MARNUL-ARNOLDZIEGNER.jpg)
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This is worst Arnold pic I've ever seen haha :D
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This is worst Arnold pic I've ever seen haha :D
It reminds me of the Frogtech meme from years ago -
(https://i.redd.it/o4z143y5n4631.jpg).
If only Frogtech boy met Marnul :(.
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Well, I don't know why Arnold would lie in his autobiography. The earlier he could claim he started would show how focused he was a such a young age.
Arnold lied about many things, particularly after he entered politics.
For example, he said he only used small amounts right before a contest.
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at 18 or 19 you be the judge
that had to be photoshopped
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never believe anything rick wayne writes or says. he is a racist lying jealous human being. hes only happy when he praises blacks. he was really never an anybody in bodybuilding ( he thought he was though). he competed and did well but always blamed racism when he or any other black lost. just like every black. if they win its perfect if they lose its racist. go back and read some of his stuff if you dont believe what i say. he was a decent bodybuilder but very very jealous of arnold. he trys to act like he was "in the know" with everything. weider fired his ass and then he had no where to go except back to his old country and write for a newspaper ( he tried to start his own but that failed of course just like mentzers magazine too) i think he married mae mollicka or teagan or something. she was a stripper /bodybuilder.. i do not know arnold but its a guess he started dball at 15. i started at 16 from a doctor and if i had known at 15 i would of then too. thise was way before anyone knew about side effects etc. now i tell people the same things. build a base first reach your natural potential ( maybe 1-2 years of good training and eating etc) then use small amounts
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1968 Mr. Germany
These are not the calves of someone with poor calf genetics.
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Kurt Marnul. He was an ex bodybuilder and gym owner, who got to know Arnold and his brother. Apparently he liked the older brother's physique more, but Arnold was the one that kept coming back. As to when he first started, somewhere between 13 - 15 is the rumor by Wendy Leigh, who wrote the unauthorized biography that Arnold hated, and another biographer. She also stated that Rick Wayne was told by Arnold, that Arnold started at 13.
Laurence Leamer, the other Arnold biographer, states that a Dr. Karl Gerstal was involved later, as he was a student of Marnul, and friends with Arnold around the time he was 15.
A long history of Arnold's supposed drug history is cataloged in the book "Muscle, Smoke and Mirrors" by Randy Roach. It's a scholarly tome, that was well received in many circles -
https://www.google.com/books/edition/Muscle_Smoke_and_Mirrors/lOrf_dHX-RgC?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=kurt+marnul+steroids&pg=PA28&printsec=frontcover .
It should link to the Marnul part, then read down, also maybe read up, as there is lots of gossip in the preceding pages. Anyway, play with it a bit, as Google Books can be funny, as I'm sure you know.
(edit, I see you found it :)! )
(edit 2 - Most of the book seems to be free to view, the really good Arnold gossip starts in Chapter 2 / page 25).
I don't think it is credible that he would start steroids before he started bbing. Also, steroids aren't free. I don't think he had a lot of disposal income when his family didn't have running water and an indoor bathroom up until he was 14.
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I don't think it is credible that he would start steroids before he started bbing. Also, steroids aren't free. I don't think he had a lot of disposal income when his family didn't have running water and an indoor bathroom up until he was 14.
He probably didn't start at 13 though money is not an issue when it comes to gear. My brother had a weekly allowance of half a dollar and managed to score some dbol at 13 lol :D It's curious how some people have a need to invent these stories, even guys who provably knew Arnold. I remember an interview with Rick Wayne when I was starting out and I wasn't sure if he was building Arnold up or tearing him down. He said when not training Arnold was depressing to look at, he had this almost inverted chest but when he was on he was amazing :D
But why make up this stuff about Arnold? Same with Marnul.
I wonder if Robbie's stories were true, how Arnold chanted "down with blacks!" :D
What about the story of Arnold saying he looked up to Hitler? :D
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Arnold lied about many things, particularly after he entered politics.
For example, he said he only used small amounts right before a contest.
That seems to implied that because he lies about somethings he lies about everything. It's easy to see why he would lie about steroids. Why would he lie back in 1978 about when he started bbing. I would think his incentive would to say he started younger that 15 years old though even then it would be trivial.
And often people accuse others of lying when they don't even know what a lie is. A lie is not saying something that is not true. A lie is saying something that YOU KNOW is not true. Big difference.
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that had to be photoshopped
In 1967?
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1968 Mr. Germany
These are not the calves of someone with poor calf genetics.
I think, at least back in the 70s when I started training, when someone starts out bbing they don't do calves. I never thought about calves for many years. Like Arnold, it was all about arms and chest. I don't think Arnold put much effort into calves. Rising on your toes like a ballerina didn't have the same appeal as bench or curls. Remember, a sizable majority neglect their legs entirely when they first start out. I think he made it priority when it was pointed out to him. Reg Park inspired him to train calves hard. Remember in this first autobiography he mentioned how Dennis Tinnerino told Arnold to train his calves and then flexed his own to Arnold. Arnold commented on Tinnerino's diamond shaped calves.
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I don't think it is credible that he would start steroids before he started bbing. Also, steroids aren't free. I don't think he had a lot of disposal income when his family didn't have running water and an indoor bathroom up until he was 14.
I don't believe the the implants story, that just seems like a game of telephone at this point.
I can totally believe steroids at 15, but not 13. Steroids were cheap, etc...., and we had kids recently that spent about the same on bottles of Superdrol, etc..... Also Marnul is 17 years older than Arnold, and his buddy Dr. Gerstl was 5 years older, and a medical student, so who knows if they were hooking him up a bit.
Also the bit about Arnold looking at natural at 15/16 is neither here, nor there. 99% of the guys from the 60's roided or natural looked like nothing compared to even teenagers today.
Here he is at 16 -
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/0f/4a/d0/0f4ad05ff0530fa3e85ae0acb9a18d2e.jpg).
For that era, you can't say he is natural or not.
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Also, another thing about Marnul is that Schwarzenegger still hangs out with him even after the steroid talk. He sees him when he's in Europe, he's had Marnul out to California. Arnold doesn't seem the type to forgive people, so he might not see Marnul talking about it as a big deal.
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In 1967?
facetious
[fəˈsēSHəs]
ADJECTIVE
treating serious issues with deliberately inappropriate humor; flippant.
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hey guys i have a great idea instead of making good use of our time today lets ponder the probabilities of whether Arnold was juicing at 13 or did he start at 15 I HAVE TO KNOW!
LETS GET A TEAM ASSEMBLED IMMEDIATELY
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I don't believe the the implants story, that just seems like a game of telephone at this point.
I can totally believe steroids at 15, but not 13. Steroids were cheap, etc...., and we had kids recently that spent about the same on bottles Superdrol, etc..... Also Marnul is 17 years older than Arnold, and his buddy Dr. Gerstl was 5 years older, and a medical student, so who knows if they were hooking him up a bit.
Also the bit about Arnold looking at natural at 15/16 is neither here, nor there. 99% of the guys from the 60's roided or natural looked like nothing compared to even teenagers today.
Here he is at 16 -
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/0f/4a/d0/0f4ad05ff0530fa3e85ae0acb9a18d2e.jpg).
For that era, you can't say he is natural or not.
looks natural tbh.
at 17-18 he looked enhanced
18 here:
(http://historyloversclub.com/wp-content/uploads/content/74/747124996447756293.jpg)
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1973 When we saw these photos in a magazine we were both amazed and surprised. He had really good thickness from the side but that calf sure looked weird. I don't think I have seen a similar structure in any other bodybuilder.
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Those Nazis always had the best drugs.
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Why should we believe you? How do we know that you even knew Roger Callard let alone have him confide in you? Why would he confide in you or in anybody and then have them tell you their deep dark secrets? How come we have never seen pics of Arnold training with Callard? They trained in the same gym but what evidence that they were close buddies that Arnold would confide to? Why would Arnold tell Callard he got implants? Have you seen implants? They don't flex. They don't look anything like Arnold's calves which are ripped and flexes naturally. How did surgeons in Mexico do calf implants 50 years ago that are so much better than the implants of today? I know three people that have had calf implants. One had it done in the early 1990s and the other two in 2000. They look like implants to the trained eye. Since when is Mexico on the cutting edge of enhancement surgery to make an implant so flawless, without any visible scars, all done 50 years ago? Why did Arnold's calves shrink when he retired and then blew back up for 1980?
I know you have a very, very dim view of bbing even though you are here on a bbing board. I'm sorry if I burst your bubble but high-level bbing is one of the most demanding 24/7 sports in the world and requires a level of commitment and discipline few can manage. Only the bitter and deluded think that it's based all on deceit and bullshit. Maybe you should go back and watch some videos of Dorian or Coleman and tell me what they are doing day after day, year after year, all deceit and bullshit.
I know Rodger Callard and have since the late 70s. Arnold and Roger trained together but anything negative said about Roger is pure BS. Including the calf implant story.
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The inner head shows what could be evidence of site injection, due to the denseness of the calves the scar tissue can sometimes be kept under wraps better than other body parts, I'm not saying he did it, but the lumps are consistent with others i have seen, this isn't escicline it isn't synthol, most likely knowing what era it was it was primo depot. The benefits to this injection and result are the increased blood flow from the injection trauma, the mind muscle connection is so much better after going through this for individuals. I learned about this type of practice from Robby when in venice early 90s who's also from that era. Im not saying thats what he did, I'm just saying thats what he might have done, thees no way they are implants, and the method of stimulating calve growth from site injections works in some people, especially people with small knees and ankles as its more illusion than anything. The secret is not to over do it, which was lost on many black guys last decade or two, but its been around for decades and its no secret in venice and others mentioned in this thread have done it as well. Its not that easy to spot when guys haven't overdone it like nasser or flex did.
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In an old Arnold classic video Arnold commented saying that to bring up weak calves do 25 sets per day
Just something I noticed :D
In other words, stop being a pussy when attacking lagging body parts. Weak genetics is no excuse. All thing being equal, hard work trumps laziness 100% of the time..
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He probably didn't start at 13 though money is not an issue when it comes to gear. My brother had a weekly allowance of half a dollar and managed to score some dbol at 13 lol :D It's curious how some people have a need to invent these stories, even guys who provably knew Arnold. I remember an interview with Rick Wayne when I was starting out and I wasn't sure if he was building Arnold up or tearing him down. He said when not training Arnold was depressing to look at, he had this almost inverted chest but when he was on he was amazing :D
But why make up this stuff about Arnold? Same with Marnul.
I wonder if Robbie's stories were true, how Arnold chanted "down with blacks!" :D
What about the story of Arnold saying he looked up to Hitler? :D
Money certainly was an issue with me and I wasn't poor. Forget about when I was a teenager when things were much more tight. I use to shoplift cans of Ravioli and powdered milk because I couldn't get enough to eat coming from a family of nine and I was always hungry and skinny as a rake. I use to hide my canned food in my closet and eat it in my room and made sure to throw out the trash outside in my neighbors bin so my parents wouldn't get suspicious. And I'm sure I was nowhere as poor as Arnold. So even if I had access to gear there was no way I could afford it. A bottle of Ciba dbol, 5mg/tab 100 tabs was $25 but Deca was $20 for a vial of Organon 200mg/vial. I was working entry-level jobs while putting myself through school and could barely support myself. I could occasionally afford Adrol as the Syntex brand at one tab a day really had an effect on me as no other compound. It cost $100 but it would last for 4-5 months if you cycle for 6 weeks and take 3-4 weeks off.
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I don't believe the the implants story, that just seems like a game of telephone at this point.
I can totally believe steroids at 15, but not 13. Steroids were cheap, etc...., and we had kids recently that spent about the same on bottles of Superdrol, etc..... Also Marnul is 17 years older than Arnold, and his buddy Dr. Gerstl was 5 years older, and a medical student, so who knows if they were hooking him up a bit.
Also the bit about Arnold looking at natural at 15/16 is neither here, nor there. 99% of the guys from the 60's roided or natural looked like nothing compared to even teenagers today.
Here he is at 16 -
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/0f/4a/d0/0f4ad05ff0530fa3e85ae0acb9a18d2e.jpg).
For that era, you can't say he is natural or not.
Agree with everything you wrote. Also, consider all the guys in the gyms today that use gear but don't even look like they train. You're right in that you really can tell one way or another in these pics and I'm sure his buddies hooked him up.
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facetious
[fəˈsēSHəs]
ADJECTIVE
treating serious issues with deliberately inappropriate humor; flippant.
You're attempts at humor really doesn't come across well in most of your posts.
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The inner head shows what could be evidence of site injection, due to the denseness of the calves the scar tissue can sometimes be kept under wraps better than other body parts, I'm not saying he did it, but the lumps are consistent with others i have seen, this isn't escicline it isn't synthol, most likely knowing what era it was it was primo depot. The benefits to this injection and result are the increased blood flow from the injection trauma, the mind muscle connection is so much better after going through this for individuals. I learned about this type of practice from Robby when in venice early 90s who's also from that era. Im not saying thats what he did, I'm just saying thats what he might have done, thees no way they are implants, and the method of stimulating calve growth from site injections works in some people, especially people with small knees and ankles as its more illusion than anything. The secret is not to over do it, which was lost on many black guys last decade or two, but its been around for decades and its no secret in venice and others mentioned in this thread have done it as well. Its not that easy to spot when guys haven't overdone it like nasser or flex did.
How come Robby didn't do site injects? His calves were worse than Arnold's when Arnold was 19 years old. As I mentioned before, it seems odd that only Arnold use all these techniques and procedures that only became well known in the 1990s and everybody else from his era were clueless.
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Those weird lumps that Arnold had were there in the early days too. I put it down to normal physiology as opposed to any injects.
Here you can see that the calves came up about as much as the arms. Maybe others disagree but I think he just got bigger overall, the idea of him torturing his calves because they used to be nonexistent is just a myth.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=644152.0;attach=758605;image)
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The inner head shows what could be evidence of site injection, due to the denseness of the calves the scar tissue can sometimes be kept under wraps better than other body parts, I'm not saying he did it, but the lumps are consistent with others i have seen, this isn't escicline it isn't synthol, most likely knowing what era it was it was primo depot. The benefits to this injection and result are the increased blood flow from the injection trauma, the mind muscle connection is so much better after going through this for individuals. I learned about this type of practice from Robby when in venice early 90s who's also from that era. Im not saying thats what he did, I'm just saying thats what he might have done, thees no way they are implants, and the method of stimulating calve growth from site injections works in some people, especially people with small knees and ankles as its more illusion than anything. The secret is not to over do it, which was lost on many black guys last decade or two, but its been around for decades and its no secret in venice and others mentioned in this thread have done it as well. Its not that easy to spot when guys haven't overdone it like nasser or flex did.
They had site injections in the 60's and 70's? I never heard of that until the 90's.
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Those weird lumps that Arnold had were there in the early days too. I put it down to normal physiology as opposed to any injects.
Here you can see that the calves came up about as much as the arms. Maybe others disagree but I think he just got bigger overall, the idea of him torturing his calves because they used to be nonexistent is just a myth.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=644152.0;attach=758605;image)
alot of people with developed calves have that
Mentzer did aswell
(https://www.builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/calf-bump-012.jpg)
(https://www.builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/mike-mentzer-085.jpg)
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They had site injections in the 60's and 70's? I never heard of that until the 90's.
Only Arnold had access and knowledge to 1990s techniques and protocols. When people say that he was ahead of his time they were kidding.
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Only Arnold had access and knowledge to 1990s techniques and protocols. When people say that he was ahead of his time they were kidding.
Yeah, Arnold must have truly been cutting edge. ;D
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Robby did use the site injections, he just didn't have the cell base or the reaction that others got, I'm not saying arnold did to me he looked like a guy who had genetics and just didn't train them enough in his earlier days. But i have seen calves with with a lot of lower muscle belly inconsistency thats from site injections. I agree with you guys site injections started in the 90s to the best of my knowledge, my conversation with Robby was early 90s. But theres no doubt when not overdone they helped a lot of guys, before they all went overboard, Flex, Dexter, Ronnie. If i HAD to say Arnolds calves had help in the late 60s 70s i would lean towards site injects over any type of implant, my personal opinion that the guys a genetic freak and smart trainer who spent the majority of his training time working on his weak points over his genetics strength's
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alot of people with developed calves have that
Mentzer did aswell
(https://www.builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/calf-bump-012.jpg)
(https://www.builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/mike-mentzer-085.jpg)
so does goodrum
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You're attempts at humor really doesn't come across well in most of your posts. :-X
the comment was tongue in cheek but i really do find the pic hard to believe. ahead of his time
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In other words, stop being a pussy when attacking lagging body parts. Weak genetics is no excuse. All thing being equal, hard work trumps laziness 100% of the time..
hard work but poor genetics beats hard work none of the time
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Crazy genetics
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If Arnold had good genetics for big calves it would have been obvious from an early age 15-16...It wasn't.
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If Arnold had good genetics for big calves it would have been obvious from an early age 15-16...It wasn't.
Absolute retard argument.
Tom Platz legs looked like nothing at that age. Yet he produced the best legs in the world, ever.
(https://external-preview.redd.it/HuDoAPTzdBa0yqWiq_2PNqYXIgVlN4spoF3l7Gt5Jkg.jpg?auto=webp&s=63aa82c0d7f57906a158a227fa74ce5d9a783be3)
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Absolute retard argument.
Tom Platz legs looked like nothing at that age. Yet he produced the best legs in the world, ever.
(https://external-preview.redd.it/HuDoAPTzdBa0yqWiq_2PNqYXIgVlN4spoF3l7Gt5Jkg.jpg?auto=webp&s=63aa82c0d7f57906a158a227fa74ce5d9a783be3)
^THIS^
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Arnold had the best calves, chest and biceps ever. Proof me wrong.
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If Arnold had good genetics for big calves it would have been obvious from an early age 15-16...It wasn't.
Look at him at 16 above, does the rest look like "good genetics"? I'm not saying it looks like "bad genetics", not at all, but I was saying everything grew pretty evenly in my opinion.
Bad calf genetics is when the belly is real short, there's absolutely nothing you can do in that case, but his were not real short.
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If Arnold had good genetics for big calves it would have been obvious from an early age 15-16...It wasn't.
Just so demonstrably wrong. Real world examples abound.
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Just so demonstrably wrong. Real world examples abound.
You`d think a guy like him would know better than that.
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If Arnold had good genetics for big calves it would have been obvious from an early age 15-16...It wasn't.
For a guy that’s been around bbing as long as you have, you are a moron
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Arnold had the best calves
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not only did arnold have the best genetics he also had the best mind and determination to achieve his goals. he was never handed anything in life . he worked hard ( something alot of americans know nothing about) and fulfilled his dreams. he said way back in 1976 what he was gonna do in life and he did it. every single thing!! i really believe he has such determination that if he was born without an arm he would of forced his body to grow one. all this talk about arnold against yates against haney against modern guys etc . i will tell you what. arnold would destroy them all in every era IF he was actually in his prime age during that era . he would of done whatever it took to achieve his goals and he would of been far ahead of them just as he was during his prime time. comparing a 1970s arnold to a 2000 coleman or whatever is meaningless. besides even a 1970s arnold destroys them all anyways due to the fact they are all bloated pieces of shit.
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(https://i.etsystatic.com/22613420/r/il/89ba5a/2397856802/il_794xN.2397856802_cfg3.jpg)
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not only did arnold have the best genetics he also had the best mind and determination to achieve his goals. he was never handed anything in life . he worked hard ( something alot of americans know nothing about) and fulfilled his dreams. he said way back in 1976 what he was gonna do in life and he did it. every single thing!! i really believe he has such determination that if he was born without an arm he would of forced his body to grow one. all this talk about arnold against yates against haney against modern guys etc . i will tell you what. arnold would destroy them all in every era IF he was actually in his prime age during that era . he would of done whatever it took to achieve his goals and he would of been far ahead of them just as he was during his prime time. comparing a 1970s arnold to a 2000 coleman or whatever is meaningless. besides even a 1970s arnold destroys them all anyways due to the fact they are all bloated pieces of shit.
problem with "doing whatever it takes" is you might die before even achieving those goals.
See Mcgarver and Luke Wood.
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those 2 relied on drugs and only drugs to get to look like a bag of smashed assholes. arnold relied on extremely hard training eating sleeping relaxing having a fun life and drugs. now days they use drugs to cover up for laziness. so once again arnold would win . period. let me explain something to those that dont understand. when you have superior genetics and an amazing work ethic and the will and desire to be the best you achieve it with alot less drugs. its these ass clowns who think "well im not growing so i better take more drugs" that are dying. NOTHING and i mean NOTHING makes up for genetics and hard work. so yes arnold used drugs. he would use drugs to win today. BUT his body would respond so much better he wouldnt have to use the amount these fucktards are using. arnold only cared about looking the best he could on the day of the show. like he said he wasnt a "beach" bodybuilder. so if he lost size after a show etc he didnt care. he only cared about the day of the show. he had other businesses to make money and applied himself to that too. these clowns nowdays never come off. use more than they should dont train or eat or relax properly and think they are gonna be the next big thing. not gonna happen
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those 2 relied on drugs and only drugs to get to look like a bag of smashed assholes. arnold relied on extremely hard training eating sleeping relaxing having a fun life and drugs. now days they use drugs to cover up for laziness. so once again arnold would win . period. let me explain something to those that dont understand. when you have superior genetics and an amazing work ethic and the will and desire to be the best you achieve it with alot less drugs. its these ass clowns who think "well im not growing so i better take more drugs" that are dying. NOTHING and i mean NOTHING makes up for genetics and hard work. so yes arnold used drugs. he would use drugs to win today. BUT his body would respond so much better he wouldnt have to use the amount these fucktards are using. arnold only cared about looking the best he could on the day of the show. like he said he wasnt a "beach" bodybuilder. so if he lost size after a show etc he didnt care. he only cared about the day of the show. he had other businesses to make money and applied himself to that too. these clowns nowdays never come off. use more than they should dont train or eat or relax properly and think they are gonna be the next big thing. not gonna happen
In the Pumping Iron outtakes, there is a scene when Arnold is posing, and someone says "No one will look at the legs." So it was known that Arnold's legs were not incredible, even for his era. As for Arnold winning today, with today's drugs, I don't think that would happen because Arnold was 6'1.5", making him at least a couple of inches too tall to win in this era. It would just be impossible for him to put on enough size to out-compete the sub-six foot guys.
As for Arnold in his past form competing today - he could make it to Nationals, but I'd be surprised [actually, shocked] if he could win Nationals as he did at his best. It's possible, I guess, depending on how weak the lineup is.
Also, are any pro bodybuilders really "lazy" at that level? The way you talk about it, it's as if pros work super hard on moderate drugs, or are lazy and take a lot of drugs. In reality, I have no doubt there are pros who work super hard and take a lot of drugs. On the other end of the spectrum, I doubt there are many pros who are lazy and take little in the way of drugs, because those bodybuilders wouldn't get very far. But I don't see how taking a lot of drugs precludes a pro from being very hard-working in the gym. Dallas McCarver took a lot of drugs and looked like he trained very hard, based on the videos he posted.
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As for Arnold in his past form competing today - he could make it to Nationals, but I'd be surprised [actually, shocked] if he could win Nationals as he did at his best. It's possible, I guess, depending on how weak the lineup is.
Olympia Classic Physique Class. Arnold would clean up in it, even with his 70's build. Lot easier to shave to shave #5-10lbs off him, than have him gain #50-#75 lbs to be a current Olympia hopeful.
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it was ken waller who said "they wont notice the legs". only he didnt mean that arnold didnt have legs. he just meant that he was so huge everywhere they would only see the chest etc. remember back then alot of judges still only looked at chest and arms ( especially overseas) also remember arnold had a bad leg injury he had to come back from in 74 i believe. a posing dias collapsed. also these clowns are heavier nowdays. SO WHAT? that doesnt mean they are better. again thats people thinking weight and size is what bodybuilding is about. and of course your still comparing a 1970s arnold with todays guys. if arnold was 26 years old TODAY he would beat everyone cuz he would have whatever kind of build the judges were looking for. lets do a role reversal. put a modern bloated big gutted no symmetry guy from today who weighs 300lbs on stage with the guys from the 70s and see what would happen. people would laugh judges wouldnt know wtf they are and they would get last place IF they could even make thru the contest without passing out. smh. think about this. womens bodybuilding when new had that freak roided out bev francis in the 80s. way to muscular. down right fugly. now look. thats what they all look like even worse!! so an arnold today at 26 would still be superior to anyone else because he has the genetics the drive and determination. ( he wouldnt look like arnold of the 70s)
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it was ken waller who said "they wont notice the legs". only he didnt mean that arnold didnt have legs. he just meant that he was so huge everywhere they would only see the chest etc. remember back then alot of judges still only looked at chest and arms ( especially overseas) also remember arnold had a bad leg injury he had to come back from in 74 i believe. a posing dias collapsed. also these clowns are heavier nowdays. SO WHAT? that doesnt mean they are better. again thats people thinking weight and size is what bodybuilding is about. and of course your still comparing a 1970s arnold with todays guys. if arnold was 26 years old TODAY he would beat everyone cuz he would have whatever kind of build the judges were looking for. lets do a role reversal. put a modern bloated big gutted no symmetry guy from today who weighs 300lbs on stage with the guys from the 70s and see what would happen. people would laugh judges wouldnt know wtf they are and they would get last place IF they could even make thru the contest without passing out. smh. think about this. womens bodybuilding when new had that freak roided out bev francis in the 80s. way to muscular. down right fugly. now look. thats what they all look like even worse!! so an arnold today at 26 would still be superior to anyone else because he has the genetics the drive and determination. ( he wouldnt look like arnold of the 70s)
Good post,and I couldn`t agree more.
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Olympia Classic Physique Class. Arnold would clean up in it, even with his 70's build. Lot easier to shave to shave #5-10lbs off him, than have him gain #50-#75 lbs to be a current Olympia hopeful.
Absolutely - Arnold has the definitive physique for the new Classic Physique Division. And it would be a lot easier for Arnold to win in that class than to put on the 50- to 75-lb that he would need to win the Olympia today, as you mentioned. Meaning that Arnold would need to be 285- to 310-lb to win a Mr. Olympia today, and I agree with that. Gunter Schlierkamp was the same height as Arnold, and came in at 300-lb in 2002, and at 295-lb in 2005. Those who his two best Olympia performances, and he did not win either one.
I can't fathom Arnold looking better than Gunter, although I would say that Arnold had a structure that was more round, and I suppose "prettier", from an aesthetic point of view. NOT that Gunter is lacking genetic in any way, but in certain poses, I think Arnold's structural superiorities come out - such as in the front double biceps pose where Gunter's lats sort of just jut out towards the middle of his torso, rather than have the sweeping tapered look that Arnold's had.
That's just one area though...oh, and in terms of waist thickness, Gunter had a thicker waist...BUT, but that's outweighing Arnold by 60-lb at the same height, so...I have a hard time believing that Arnold would be anything more than a modern-day Gunter. Arnold's smallish waist for his size [he was no Frank McGrath, but definitely had a pretty small waist] would have grown if Arnold had to take modern drugs and put on the size necessary for modern competition.
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it was ken waller who said "they wont notice the legs". only he didnt mean that arnold didnt have legs. he just meant that he was so huge everywhere they would only see the chest etc. remember back then alot of judges still only looked at chest and arms ( especially overseas) also remember arnold had a bad leg injury he had to come back from in 74 i believe. a posing dias collapsed. also these clowns are heavier nowdays. SO WHAT? that doesnt mean they are better. again thats people thinking weight and size is what bodybuilding is about. and of course your still comparing a 1970s arnold with todays guys. if arnold was 26 years old TODAY he would beat everyone cuz he would have whatever kind of build the judges were looking for. lets do a role reversal. put a modern bloated big gutted no symmetry guy from today who weighs 300lbs on stage with the guys from the 70s and see what would happen. people would laugh judges wouldnt know wtf they are and they would get last place IF they could even make thru the contest without passing out. smh. think about this. womens bodybuilding when new had that freak roided out bev francis in the 80s. way to muscular. down right fugly. now look. thats what they all look like even worse!! so an arnold today at 26 would still be superior to anyone else because he has the genetics the drive and determination. ( he wouldnt look like arnold of the 70s)
I'm seriously flabbergasted at the extent to which people will take actual evidence of something contrary to their view and try to twist it so that it is somehow consistent with their beliefs.
So let me see if I understand this correctly:
You think that Ken Waller commenting to Arnold "No one will notice the legs", and everyone LAUGHING on the mountaintop of where ever they were posing, was somehow Ken's way of complimenting Arnold on his chest and other muscle development, as opposed to mocking him for his legs, HENCE EVERYONE LAUGHING AFTER THE COMMENT WAS MADE.
Seriously?
So Ken Waller making a comment about Arnold's legs followed by a bunch of guys laughing at the comment was Waller's way of complimenting Arnold's chest? And when Arnold made the comment about the side chest pose to Franco "If you don't have it, don't hit it", was that Arnold's way of complimenting Franco's legs?
bigbychoices - you seriously believe that Ken Waller wasn't making fun of Arnold's legs while he made a comment about Arnold's legs followed by everyone laughing, but rather, he was bringing attention to Arnold's other strong areas?
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No - I don't even think you believe that. I am absolutely bewildered at the extent to which people will take facts and twist them to be in line with what they believe. But I want you to know something, bigbychoices - no one believes you. Not only do the people you are debating not believe you, but you don't believe yourself when you make that comment.
Think about what you are saying - you are saying that Ken Waller making a comment followed by a bunch of Arnold's friends and fellow bodybuilders laughing like hyenas is actually Waller's way of complimenting Arnold.
Do you realize what comments like that do to your credibility? Often, people don't have the debating tools nor the confidence to call someone out - even online - for making a comment like yours, but that doesn't mean they aren't thinking it. I'm lucky, being a "right wing racist" or whatever, that everyone is confident enough to call me out, as we live in a society that empowers people to attack any thinking White man out there, so I am actually sort of lucky to live in a society where people will call out the slightest error in anything that I say - it helps me to raise my debating game.
Unfortunately, there are so many Arnold nut-huggers, that I think people who defend Arnold in ways that border on the absurd don't get to develop the refinement in debate ability that one would when their views are being called out nonstop.
Anyway, Arnold wouldn't even win Nationals the way he looked in the 1970's. If he were to take the drugs of today, he would probably just look like a more aesthetic version of Gunter, if that. That assumes a lot - including that Arnold had the genetic constitution to eat the calories and take the drugs necessary to put on the size necessary to be competitive today.
Furthermore, the natural evolution of bodybuilding was to get bigger and bigger and bigger...that included the legs, which simply were not looked at in the 1970's as they were in the eras that followed.
Arnold, no matter what he would have done to adapt to modern-day bodybuilding, would not somehow become short enough to be Mr. Olympia in today's bodybuilding era.
Do you know what the average height of Mr. Olympia winners is among the 36 champions from 1984 through to 2019? 5'9.9".
Do you know how many bodybuilders 6'0" or taller have won the Mr. Olympia during that time period? Zero.
So no, Arnold wouldn't somehow be able to develop the proportions of a man with a 5'10" frame at his height of just under 6'2". I have no doubt Arnold would do everything he could have done to become champion today, but to suggest that a man of his height would win the Olympia in an era where hardly any men his height even make the Olympia to begin with is simply a stretch in logic that you're making, using absolutely no evidence to make a stretch. You're just a fan of Arnold's.
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it was ken waller who said "they wont notice the legs". only he didnt mean that arnold didnt have legs. he just meant that he was so huge everywhere they would only see the chest etc. remember back then alot of judges still only looked at chest and arms ( especially overseas) also remember arnold had a bad leg injury he had to come back from in 74 i believe. a posing dias collapsed. also these clowns are heavier nowdays. SO WHAT? that doesnt mean they are better. again thats people thinking weight and size is what bodybuilding is about. and of course your still comparing a 1970s arnold with todays guys. if arnold was 26 years old TODAY he would beat everyone cuz he would have whatever kind of build the judges were looking for. lets do a role reversal. put a modern bloated big gutted no symmetry guy from today who weighs 300lbs on stage with the guys from the 70s and see what would happen. people would laugh judges wouldnt know wtf they are and they would get last place IF they could even make thru the contest without passing out. smh. think about this. womens bodybuilding when new had that freak roided out bev francis in the 80s. way to muscular. down right fugly. now look. thats what they all look like even worse!! so an arnold today at 26 would still be superior to anyone else because he has the genetics the drive and determination. ( he wouldnt look like arnold of the 70s)
My previous post was tl;dr.
But in any case, the part of your post above that I bolded is why I wish this board had a block feature. The mere fact that you would take a situation like that and spin it to be consistent with your point of view reminds me of the groupthink on the MuscleMayhem board. It absolutely blew my mind the level of people brainwashing one another into believing that how they felt on bodybuilding was factually correct. That was such a pro nut-hugging board, and you literally could not even insult a pro bodybuilder without being trashed.
It was so annoying, as a thinking person, to read that board. But hey, that's why that board didn't maintain its popularity - the censoring of anyone who had an even remotely anti-pro or anti-competitive bodybuilding view caused it to die.
Take wes, who commented on your post above in agreement. At one point, he made a comment that Gerry Blais' synthol arms looked hideous, then in a thread about the 2005 New England Championships, he banned anyone who made fun of his arms, LMAO!!! I even quoted the old post where wes himself made fun of Gerry's arms, and then wes banned me.
It was so annoying. Would wes admit to how moronic the optics of such a moderation move look, even today? I doubt it.
But just because he won't admit it, doesn't mean he doesn't know I'm right. OF COURSE he knows I'm right. Everyone knows. Including you, with respect to the comment I made about you. But JUST to be clear:
You think Ken Waller saying to Arnold "Don't worry - no one will look at the legs", followed by Arnold's friends [fellow bodybuilders] LAUGHING was Ken's way of COMPLIMENTING Arnold in other areas?
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Right? This is what you think? I just want to make sure I understood you correctly, bigbychoices. Say it here so everyone can see it - you think Ken Waller's comment about Arnold's legs, resulting in everyone LAUGHING was a compliment to Arnold's chest and other areas, and not a way of making fun of Arnold's legs. Am I summarizing that accurately?
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matt your an idiot. hope this helps . you have probably never lifted . you come on here calling out people for whom you have no understanding.. do you or did you ever follow real bodybuilding? do you have any idea just how big arnolds legs actually were? they were incredible. when he was in his prime but his huge upper body got the attention. waller did in fact mean that they wouldnt notice his legs cuz he was so huge in the upper body. do you remember waller even once said "arnolds chest was so huge you could stand under it when raining and not get wet". but instead you come on here write a book practically trying to prove your point which of course is wrong. i have never seen so many people want to argue when they are wrong in my life. im thinking you must be a democrat? anyways continue bashing me im done responding to your little call outs. im right your wrong plain and simple.
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Big,
For what it's worth, you've got Matt wrong. He has his eccentricities :) But a Democrat? LOL. No. And yes, he lifts and is quite strong for his weight. I think he benched close to 350 at a bodyweight of 170ish -- something I couldn't do until I was 200+.
He's also not stupid.
All that said, and with respect to you because I like you :) , I do think Waller was teasing Arnold about lacking his previous level of leg development. Remember, when that scene was filmed, he was coming back from a slimmed-down weight...at that stage, he was still very much building himself back to top form. Like he told Lou in South Africa, both of them would have been bigger had the contest taken place a month later.
Alright, enough of that :) Peace, bros.
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thank you titus for the info. and to matt my apologies on some of the things i said.
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those 2 relied on drugs and only drugs to get to look like a bag of smashed assholes. arnold relied on extremely hard training eating sleeping relaxing having a fun life and drugs. now days they use drugs to cover up for laziness. so once again arnold would win . period. let me explain something to those that dont understand. when you have superior genetics and an amazing work ethic and the will and desire to be the best you achieve it with alot less drugs. its these ass clowns who think "well im not growing so i better take more drugs" that are dying. NOTHING and i mean NOTHING makes up for genetics and hard work. so yes arnold used drugs. he would use drugs to win today. BUT his body would respond so much better he wouldnt have to use the amount these fucktards are using. arnold only cared about looking the best he could on the day of the show. like he said he wasnt a "beach" bodybuilder. so if he lost size after a show etc he didnt care. he only cared about the day of the show. he had other businesses to make money and applied himself to that too. these clowns nowdays never come off. use more than they should dont train or eat or relax properly and think they are gonna be the next big thing. not gonna happen
Arnold would not have the mass the guys have today unless he did what the guys do today. Very very simple. There is nothing anyone could do with training to compensate for the lack of drugs.
And today's guys are lazy? That's idiotic. Taking all those drugs is actually hard work and takes a toll mentally. Eating on the clock year round is hard work and mind numbingly boring. And there are a lot of guys who do train hard. Do you think Arnold could've handled Ronnie's routine? He would've been a cripple a couple of weeks in.
Arnold was driven but he obviously didn't go hard year round.
Matt is right, Arnold at his best would not win nationals today. He wouldn't even place top 10. The board shorts guys have better legs.
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(https://i.etsystatic.com/22613420/r/il/89ba5a/2397856802/il_794xN.2397856802_cfg3.jpg)
If someone said that is the greatest FDB of all time, I'd have a difficult time coming up with a strong argument.
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I must object to the last page or two of this thread because of run-on sentences and the lack of paragraphs.
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A guy once told me (and this guy knows people) that Tom Platz started titty-fucking Arnolds calves in the offseason. He would rub his semen into Arnolds calves like a dmso concoction. I guess the theory was Platz' legs dna would get absorbed and Arnolds calves would grow. Seems like it worked. In hindsight, Tom should have had Arnold armpit fuck him. Then maybe Toms arms would have grown.
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A guy once told me (and this guy knows people) that Tom Platz started titty-fucking Arnolds calves in the offseason. He would rub his semen into Arnolds calves like a dmso concoction. I guess the theory was Platz' legs dna would get absorbed and Arnolds calves would grow. Seems like it worked. In hindsight, Tom should have had Arnold armpit fuck him. Then maybe Toms arms would have grown.
;D
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A guy once told me (and this guy knows people) that Tom Platz started titty-fucking Arnolds calves in the offseason. He would rub his semen into Arnolds calves like a dmso concoction. I guess the theory was Platz' legs dna would get absorbed and Arnolds calves would grow. Seems like it worked. In hindsight, Tom should have had Arnold armpit fuck him. Then maybe Toms arms would have grown.
You fucking Nut LOL :D
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You fucking Nut LOL :D
I amused even myself with this idiotic post.
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(https://i.etsystatic.com/22613420/r/il/89ba5a/2397856802/il_794xN.2397856802_cfg3.jpg)
Perfect physique.
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Nice thing about calves is that when you stop training, they are the last to go......
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some of you just still keep comparing arnold of the 1970s to todays guys. smh. thats not the issue. the issue is would arnold still be the greatest bodybuilder ever IF he was competing today at age 26 . the answer is yes. would he look like he did in 1970s NO. he would develop for todays standards, so yes he would be unbeatable . what dont people understand. its not how would arnold of yesteryear do against guys today its IF arnold was 26 and competing in modern times would he beat everyone and the answer is yes. so please stop saying 1970s arnold. yes we know guys nowdays are 50 lbs heavier and 5 inches shorter with a 50 inch stomach. would arnold also have that huge gut? maybe because judges are not looking for what they were in his day. so he would do whatever he needed to do to get the win.
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some of you just still keep comparing arnold of the 1970s to todays guys. smh. thats not the issue. the issue is would arnold still be the greatest bodybuilder ever IF he was competing today at age 26 . the answer is yes. would he look like he did in 1970s NO. he would develop for todays standards, so yes he would be unbeatable . what dont people understand. its not how would arnold of yesteryear do against guys today its IF arnold was 26 and competing in modern times would he beat everyone and the answer is yes. so please stop saying 1970s arnold. yes we know guys nowdays are 50 lbs heavier and 5 inches shorter with a 50 inch stomach. would arnold also have that huge gut? maybe because judges are not looking for what they were in his day. so he would do whatever he needed to do to get the win.
If Arnold were young today he probably would have found something else to excel in besides bodybuilding that would get him to Hollywood.
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some of you just still keep comparing arnold of the 1970s to todays guys. smh. thats not the issue. the issue is would arnold still be the greatest bodybuilder ever IF he was competing today at age 26 . the answer is yes. would he look like he did in 1970s NO. he would develop for todays standards, so yes he would be unbeatable . what dont people understand. its not how would arnold of yesteryear do against guys today its IF arnold was 26 and competing in modern times would he beat everyone and the answer is yes. so please stop saying 1970s arnold. yes we know guys nowdays are 50 lbs heavier and 5 inches shorter with a 50 inch stomach. would arnold also have that huge gut? maybe because judges are not looking for what they were in his day. so he would do whatever he needed to do to get the win.
Its all good Big, in my version of bodybuilding Arnolds genetics and overall classic shape still reign supreme over everyone, but modern drugs, his height and the judging criteria would have stopped him winning in modern bodybuilding, that is also the reason the sport has little to no recognition, modern sports a bunch of weirdos with no personality over consuming food and drugs, total shite look and belongs in the lower class of sports along with marbles.
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If Arnold were young today he probably would have found something else to excel in besides bodybuilding that would get him to Hollywood.
white straight male, hollywood wants nothing to do with
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some of you just still keep comparing arnold of the 1970s to todays guys. smh. thats not the issue. the issue is would arnold still be the greatest bodybuilder ever IF he was competing today at age 26 . the answer is yes. would he look like he did in 1970s NO. he would develop for todays standards, so yes he would be unbeatable . what dont people understand. its not how would arnold of yesteryear do against guys today its IF arnold was 26 and competing in modern times would he beat everyone and the answer is yes. so please stop saying 1970s arnold. yes we know guys nowdays are 50 lbs heavier and 5 inches shorter with a 50 inch stomach. would arnold also have that huge gut? maybe because judges are not looking for what they were in his day. so he would do whatever he needed to do to get the win.
Please use capital letters after punctuation. I get a headache... Or atleast break a row every once in a while.
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thank you titus for the info. and to matt my apologies on some of the things i said.
Psh, think nothing of it, my brother. You're old school and Getbig is lucky to have you, bro.
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In an old Arnold classic video Arnold commented saying that to bring up weak calves do 25 sets per day
Just something I noticed :D
Calves do respond very well to a combination of heavy weight and volume. Look at fat people's calves.
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white straight male, hollywood wants nothing to do with
He can do gay. Aren't there rumors of Arnold and Uncle Joe?
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He can do gay. Aren't there rumors of Arnold and Uncle Joe?
Tom Minichiello in the Jun 1992 edition of Spy Magazine mentioned that Arnold was connected to Paco Arce, and Arce had pictures of him that Arnold posed for privately - (https://books.google.com/books?id=K4N6CoFaMwQC&pg=PA8&dq=Tom+Minichiello+arnold+gay+spy&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjRyLPK7Z3tAhWrQzABHWtjAXEQ6AEwAHoECAAQAg#v=onepage&q=Tom%20Minichiello%20arnold%20gay%20spy&f=false) .
Arce was a millionaire from Spain that was flamingly gay. He'd take briefcases of money around to all the big contests, and try and get bodybuilders to hang out. One of the photos he had of Arnold supposedly has him lounging around in his underwear reading Playgirl magazine - https://books.google.com/books?id=Xa7j5ofHW0EC&pg=PA63&dq=Paco+Arce+bodybuilding&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwioyIqa753tAhWeRzABHUENAj8Q6AEwAXoECAIQAg#v=onepage&q=Paco%20Arce%20bodybuilding&f=false .
Paco is the guy in the red trunks seen in this famous schmoe shot -
(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/e9/ee/2a/e9ee2af8181d958ebb00606ba491cffe.jpg).
Tom Minichiello was the owner of the famous Mid City Gym in NY, and friendly with lots of 70's - 90's bodybuilders. He'd later write a thinly veiled tell all book called "Bodybuilders, Drugs and Sex" that has a gay sex scene in it that was supposedly based on one he saw Arnold and George Bulter (Pumping Iron) in years ago.
Bob Bonham (of the famous Strong and Shapely gym) mentions it here too - http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=306303.0 .
Minichiello's book came and went, rumor was that he got told it was a bad idea ;).
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Here's the start of that Spy article -
https://books.google.com/books?id=Xa7j5ofHW0EC&pg=PA60#v=onepage&q&f=false .
I read it years ago, and it's still a good read given all the Arnold talk lately.
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I'm pretty sure Arnold would do absolutely anything to succeed. Stab people in the back, G4P, marry a Kennedy, yada yada yada.