Natural ROB RICHES gets the BITCHES!

[wes]

Guy looks great..result of all 3,genetics,hard training/cardio,and a spot-on diet.

The diet+cardio is the hardest part for those who bitch about others results.

[Deicide]

If "quantifying it is simple" then why have you failed to do so with this pamphlet you just composed?  You are simply making general statements comparing real achievers to imaginary non-achievers.  Comparing real apples to plastic oranges.  Go cry yourself to sleep.  Again.

Righttttt...so Nobel Prize winning physicists become that just because they work hard and anyone can do it if they put their mind to it...? That is delusional...

[2ND COMING]

HT/ WT?

im guessing 5'6'' 160, judging from the dexter interview

[Andy Griffin]

Righttttt...so Nobel Prize winning physicists become that just because they work hard and anyone can do it if they put their mind to it...? That is delusional...

How did they become Nobel Prize winning physicists?  I guess you believe 99% of the result is directly attributable to genetics.    

[The Master]

Righttttt...so Nobel Prize winning physicists become that just because they work hard and anyone can do it if they put their mind to it...? That is delusional...

Take a look at Debusseys post above. It's all about what goals you are aspiring to achieve, and the "genetical threshold" needed to have a chance in the first place. Once you are at least "good enough", you can get into the field and get results, the the "better" you are, the more output you can get from your efforts.

At the same time, studies have shown that when you have a bunch of people that are "good enough", the amount of work they put in becomes the most important determining factor. The best in almost any field have put in an enormous amount of work.

[Deicide]

Debussey thinks the 99% thing is a bit of an overstatement for the most part.

Debussey thinks that as in most areas, there is a "threshold" of "genetics/talent" needed to be had in order to have a chance to succeed in the first place. If you're a freaking moron, mongoloid or whatnot, you will not be able to master areas like advanced physics or mathematics, no matter how much you try. But if you are above the "threshold", you can succeed (the further above the threshold you are, the easier it might be to succeed).
If you are one of those unlucky bastards that does not have enough talent to succeed in BB for example, then genetics = 100%, because no amount of work will help you.. But VERY FEW people are so "genetically impaired" that they can't improve their body.
Of course, when you get to the upper-echelon of competitive bodybuilding, the "genetical threshold" becomes higher and higher, and very few people can compete in those upper levels regardless of what they do (thus, genetics = everything for them), but if you take an average of all people BB'ing out there, the "genetical threshold/cutoff/whatever" = not that high (most people don't aspire to be Ronnie..), and a big% of people are "good enough" to have a chance to meet their goals.

If you are "good enough", remember that attaining a muscular and defined body requires getting the body into a certain state of body composition, and except for a chosen few, it does take effort. Muscles and burnt fat won't come by itself. A few % might be super-talented and able to get by without doing shit, but many more can get that nice body if they put in the work.
Again, genetics will still be an important determining factor for the output (results) of the input (work), but to say that it is "99%", given that one is above that "threshold" = an overstatement. Very few % of the people capable of getting into good shape out there get into that shape without the work..

Haha, just like most things in life, the bell curve strikes again

Basically my point.

[io856]

Basically my point.

You failed at putting that message across.

Debussey has better genetics than you. 

[Andy Griffin]

Basically my point.

No, your point was that almost all achievement (99%) is directly attributable to genetics.  

[Deicide]

No, your point was that almost all achievement (99%) is directly attributable to genetics.  

Real achievement is. Neither you nor I will ever will the Nobel Prize in physics even if we spend the rest of our lives studying physics. That is a genetic limitation.

[The True Adonis]

im guessing 5'6'' 160, judging from the dexter interview

5`11 175lbs.


Height: 5'11"
Weight contest: 175lbs
Weight non-contest: 185lbs
Residence: Los Angeles
Birthplace: London, UK
Nationality: British
Years training: 10 Years

[The Master]

Basically my point.

In a way, but you failed to communicate that different aspirations and fields have different "cutoff's/thresholds". If you're good enough to be competitive, genes won't be 100%. The cutoff for getting in good shape really ain't that high, so for most people, especially those who frequent BB sites, the "genetics = 99%" comment = a bit inaccurate.

[arce1988]

PED

[Deicide]

In a way, but you failed to communicate that different aspirations and fields have different "cutoff's/thresholds". If you're good enough to be competitive, genes won't be 100%. The cutoff for getting in good shape really ain't that high, so for most people, especially those who frequent BB sites, the "genetics = 99%" comment = a bit inaccurate.

Looking like that guy=genetically gifted

[The Master]

Real achievement is. Neither you nor I will ever will the Nobel Prize in physics even if we spend the rest of our lives studying physics. That is a genetic limitation.

You'd be suprised at the cutoff vs. amount of work for several fields. Mozart was redicolusly talented in music, no doubt about it. At the same time, he'd recieved over 3500 hours of musical training from his father before turning 7, and he hit his high point after 15+ years of composing/training.
Bobby Fisher was a genius, yet it took him almost 10 years to get to the top, even though he played chess for 15+ hours/day many days.

There are really no to very few die-hard "naturals" out there (people who almost did no work and still became the absolute best). For people above the "threshold" rate in a given field, the amount of work = the biggest determining factor. Of course, the "cutoff" for some fields = stupifyingly high. The Mr.Olympia for example.

[Andy Griffin]

Real achievement is. Neither you nor I will ever will the Nobel Prize in physics even if we spend the rest of our lives studying physics. That is a genetic limitation.

You are absolutely wrong.  I don't know if you ever studied physics, and you don't know if I ever did.  Furthermore, you don't know my DNA code any more than I know yours.  Your self-imposed fatalism may have robbed the world of another Nobel Prize winning physicist.  Maybe you had the right genes for it all along...

Blaming genetics for all you have not just failed to achieve, but apparently not even attempted to achieve...you should become a motivational speaker, assuming you have the right genetics for it.

[MAXX]

Looking like that guy=genetically gifted

such a naive comment. you don't even know how hard this guy has worked for 10 years to achieve this.

[The Master]

Looking like that guy=genetically gifted

Of course, Debussey never regretted that. But make no mistake, the "cutoff" for where he is = very high.

The thing is that your statement made it look like most BB achievement was 99% genetics, but that = inaccurate since the "genetical cutoff" for getting into real good shape = pretty low, so a lot of people can achieve it, and since it seemed like your statement was directed towards the normal BB-forum guy with a goal of getting muscular w/good abs or something, it = inaccurate.

[2ND COMING]

5`11 175lbs.


Height: 5'11"
Weight contest: 175lbs
Weight non-contest: 185lbs
Residence: Los Angeles
Birthplace: London, UK
Nationality: British
Years training: 10 Years

dexter is 5'8'' in jordans...It seems unlikely that this guy is 5'11''

[240 is Back]

he's gifted in terms of a great frame and good muscle insertions.

Also he's incredibly lucky to have the metabolism to carry that sort of conditioning year round, but he is only 175 pounds in contest shape at 5'11", so it's possible.  If he was 5'11" and 220 with that sort of year-round conditioning, we'd be guessing what his cycle was.  At a buck seventy-five, it's possible.

has he competed?  he looks great in pics, but I'm guessing he'd look very lean onstage at that height and weight.

[Deicide]

You'd be suprised at the cutoff vs. amount of work for several fields. Mozart was redicolusly talented in music, no doubt about it. At the same time, he'd recieved over 3500 hours of musical training from his father before turning 7, and he hit his high point after 15+ years of composing/training.
Bobby Fisher was a genius, yet it took him almost 10 years to get to the top, even though he played chess for 15+ hours/day many days.

There are really no to very few die-hard "naturals" out there (people who almost did no work and still became the absolute best). For people above the "threshold" rate in a given field, the amount of work = the biggest determining factor. Of course, the "cutoff" for some fields = stupifyingly high. The Mr.Olympia for example.

I will never be Noam Chomsky.

[Nordic Beast]

Funny how achievers focus on hard work and discipline, whereas non-achievers focus on genetics, luck, conspiracies, etc. 

so true!!!!

[The Master]

I will never be Noam Chomsky.

That might be so (pretty high "genetical threshold" to be competitive with him), but can still become a great cunniLINGUIST.  

[burn2live]

he's gifted in terms of a great frame and good muscle insertions.

Also he's incredibly lucky to have the metabolism to carry that sort of conditioning year round, but he is only 175 pounds in contest shape at 5'11", so it's possible.  If he was 5'11" and 220 with that sort of year-round conditioning, we'd be guessing what his cycle was.  At a buck seventy-five, it's possible.

has he competed?  he looks great in pics, but I'm guessing he'd look very lean onstage at that height and weight.

[Deicide]

That might be so (pretty high "genetical threshold" to be competitive with him), but can still become a great cunniLINGUIST.  

I am not bad at that. I think that is more of a practise issue.

[arce1988]

PED