Roger Clemens has an era of 5.07

[body88]

Against teams like the pirates, rockies and the giants. Rodge has yet to go deeper then six innings. This is when he is "fresh" right? What will he look like when the fatigue of his 4 week season starts to take its toll?

[ieffinhatecardio]

I thought it was amazing that Torre used him for middle relief the other night. His middle relievers must be brimming with confidence after he did that.

[Grape Ape]

Clemens offered to do it before the game started, since the bullpen had been used heavily in the 13 inning game.

[ieffinhatecardio]

Yes, I heard that on the radio. Still an interesting decision. Torre has always taken chances with his staff and used them in unconventional ways, I always liked that about him. Francona on the other hand is the opposite, he's a little too slow in pulling pitchers that have lost it. Last night was a perfect example, hence the nickname Francoma.

[Grape Ape]

They both have their pluses and minuses.   Torre's sometimes too quick with the hook, and his choice of relievers this year has been piss poor.

I saw Matsusaka pitch a game recently where he gave up 5 in one inning, but remained in the game.  That's all he ended up giving up.  It saved unecessary strain on the bullpen.  Torre would've pulled him and used 3-4 guys.

[ieffinhatecardio]

Good point, although Dice-K is a strange case study. He's used to throwing far more pitches than the typical MLB pitcher and his stuff is so strange that it can come and go over the course of an inning.

He has innings where he looks like a Cy Young Winner and no one can touch him then the next inning he'll walk 4. He's somewhat of a freak and not always in a good way.

What's the deal with Farnsworth, do he and Torre really not get along?

[Hedgehog]

Why the fcuk are they hiring an over the hill pitcher for the insane money they're paying Clemens?

It's not like he was pitching allstar class on another team.

Of course, he's good. But I'd like to think that for the kind of money they puts out for Clemens, even though he brings in merchandise sales, they could've gotten something else?

So my question for the experts here on the board: What would you have done with the millions the Yankees spent on Clemens? What player would you have gone after?

-Hedge

[blinky]

so far its ended up being a total waste of money. the team has come around on its own without any real help from clemens.

[Rearden Metal]

Why the fcuk are they hiring an over the hill pitcher for the insane money they're paying Clemens?

It's not like he was pitching allstar class on another team.

Of course, he's good. But I'd like to think that for the kind of money they puts out for Clemens, even though he brings in merchandise sales, they could've gotten something else?

So my question for the experts here on the board: What would you have done with the millions the Yankees spent on Clemens? What player would you have gone after?

-Hedge

That's the Yankee's M.O. They go out and get the highest priced guy regardless of any other factors.

IMO they would have done well to wait till midseason and pick up Buerlhe and some bullpen help. Shit they could even have Griffey, put Melky in Center and DH Matsui or Abreu, play Damon at first etc....

[Grape Ape]

Why the fcuk are they hiring an over the hill pitcher for the insane money they're paying Clemens?

It's not like he was pitching allstar class on another team.

Of course, he's good. But I'd like to think that for the kind of money they puts out for Clemens, even though he brings in merchandise sales, they could've gotten something else?

So my question for the experts here on the board: What would you have done with the millions the Yankees spent on Clemens? What player would you have gone after?

-Hedge

You have to look at it at a different level.

He was the best AVAILABLE option at the time, and the commitment is only a half year.  He doesn't block the development of any of their young arms, and he doesn't cost the team anything in terms of prospects - just money.    They're out of this after a half year, suffering no long term commitments.

It's not like the Yankees could acquire anybody they wanted.  Clemens was the best option out there.

If he ends up being 4-5 wins better than anyone else they could throw out there, the money is well worth it.

He's pitched very well considering he had three minor league starts.   We'll see if he gets better.

[Grape Ape]

That's the Yankee's M.O. They go out and get the highest priced guy regardless of any other factors.

IMO they would have done well to wait till midseason and pick up Buerlhe and some bullpen help. Shit they could even have Griffey, put Melky in Center and DH Matsui or Abreu, play Damon at first etc....

Please cite an example where they acquired the highest priced guy regardless of any other factors.

As for Griffery, acquring another older, injury prone veteran to replace, your aging veteran makes little sense.  They need to upgrade firstbase, acquire another BP arm, and ride it out.  They have the talent to win, they just need to do it.

[Rearden Metal]

Please cite an example where they acquired the highest priced guy regardless of any other factors.

As for Griffery, acquring another older, injury prone veteran to replace, your aging veteran makes little sense.  They need to upgrade firstbase, acquire another BP arm, and ride it out.  They have the talent to win, they just need to do it.

Kevin Brown, Carl Pavano, Randy Johnson just to name the most recent.

[body88]

I predicted a 6 inning (at best) pitcher with an era over 4 That is part of the reason I wanted no part of Roger in Boston. We have that in Tavarez for what Roger makes in 15 min. Tavarez also has a rubber arm and is much younger. When Lester comes back tavarez will be a valuable guy in the pen with the ability to start in a pinch.

I don't agree with saying the Yankees made the move to get Clemens regardless of other options. At the time they didn't have any other options. The Yankees don't give a shit about cash. The move made sense for them. It was the delusions that Clemens would be better then a five - six inning pitcher with a high era that can be criticized.

That said he has only had four starts. But they have been against bad teams. We shall see.

[Grape Ape]

Kevin Brown, Carl Pavano, Randy Johnson just to name the most recent.

You imply that they acquired these guys because they cost a lot, not because of their talent levels.

In '03, the Yankees had just lost Clemens and Pettitte.  Brown had just posted a 2.39 ERA with 185k in 32 games started.

In '05 the Yankees acquired Randy Johnson after he had posted a 2.60 ERA with 290K and 44 BB

Carl Pavano was the most highly coveted pitcher of his FA class, had many clubs make him offers, and actually took less money than the Red Sox offered him to pitch for the Yankees.

So it's not their M.O. to acquire the highest priced talent, but the best, which generally costs more.

[headhuntersix]

I love it.....the lower they sink the better. The yanks had a great opportunity to make up some ground with the Sox dropping two to the friggen Mariners but nope 11 games. Friggen Gabbard...hopefully he'll be ok. Manny's hitting..JD's sort hitting along with Crisp. But Lugo must go.

[body88]

I love it.....the lower they sink the better. The yanks had a great opportunity to make up some ground with the Sox dropping two to the friggen Mariners but nope 11 games. Friggen Gabbard...hopefully he'll be ok. Manny's hitting..JD's sort hitting along with Crisp. But Lugo must go.

Crisp is coming around. Good thing to, because he is a beast in the outfield. Great instincts and tracks down balls you would never think he can get to. He has made some awesome lpays this season.  Manny is at 300. Jd is getting hot again. I think when he smashed into the wall at fenway it dinged him up worse then people gave him credit for.

LUGO IS A BUST. BUST BUST B - U - S- T.

[headhuntersix]

Whats up Body...why can't we find a Short Stop and stay with him. Loretta was fine. Lugo can't field, which we knew..well now he can't hit either. Can't steal a base if u never get on. What a mess. I'm sure we're stuck with him. Nobody will take him, maybe a trade package..kinda like the Lowell deal? Its like having the picher hit.automatic out. I love when we have a few guys on base and no outs and he hits into a double play...Awsome

[Grape Ape]

The thing is, Lugo never COULD hit, so I have no idea why anyone thought he could.

Check out his #'s    http://www.baseball-reference.com/l/lugoju01.shtml

He had a decent half year his last year in TB, but that's about it.  Suprising move by Epstein.

[headhuntersix]

Thanks..but all those numbers are a hell of alot better then .191   Plus he can't field. Of course we let this guy go.

Mark Lorretta
2007 35 HOU NL  60  195   24   63  14  1   1   24   1  1  24  20  .323  .400  .421  118   82   1   0   0   1   5

[ieffinhatecardio]

Loretta is a second baseman, I'd much rather have Gonzalez and his other worldly defense and decent offense. Hell, I never understood getting rid of Cabrera especially when we could have locked him up for short money.

Theo clearly has some kind of issue with shortstops. His fascination with both Lugo and Drew is hard to understand, especially considering how much they cost.

[Grape Ape]

Cabrerra seemed like he like being on the team.  I don't understand why they didn't sign him.

[headhuntersix]

Loretta is a second baseman, I'd much rather have Gonzalez and his other worldly defense and decent offense. Hell, I never understood getting rid of Cabrera especially when we could have locked him up for short money.

Theo clearly has some kind of issue with shortstops. His fascination with both Lugo and Drew is hard to understand, especially considering how much they cost.

Loretta moves around and is a better deal then Lugo..but I agree.

[UPINTHEMGUTS]

Just came after a night out in Baltimore at the Orioles game. We destroyed the rocket. Aubrey Huff hit a 3 tun homer in the 6th to seal the deal, 4-0.

The Yankees bullpen is so shitty now that Mariano Rivera came in during the top of the 8th inning facing a 4 run deficit. They must be desperate putting their ace close earlier than usual with those kind of circumstances.

Nothing like a hot summer night at a baseball game with a ice cold beer.

Right, Body88?

[bmacsys]

Just came after a night out in Baltimore at the Orioles game. We destroyed the rocket. Aubrey Huff hit a 3 tun homer in the 6th to seal the deal, 4-0.

The Yankees bullpen is so shitty now that Mariano Rivera came in during the top of the 8th inning facing a 4 run deficit. They must be desperate putting their ace close earlier than usual with those kind of circumstances.

Nothing like a hot summer night at a baseball game with a ice cold beer.

Right, Body88?

They brought him in the game to get some work. He hadn't pitched in days. I think you had too many ice cold beers.

[body88]

Just came after a night out in Baltimore at the Orioles game. We destroyed the rocket. Aubrey Huff hit a 3 tun homer in the 6th to seal the deal, 4-0.

The Yankees bullpen is so shitty now that Mariano Rivera came in during the top of the 8th inning facing a 4 run deficit. They must be desperate putting their ace close earlier than usual with those kind of circumstances.

Nothing like a hot summer night at a baseball game with a ice cold beer.

Right, Body88?

Nothing like it. Heading to fenway next week to drink a few. Nothing like a warm summer night and a ball game at a place like Fenway or Camden. That is baseball.