Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: kyomu on October 03, 2009, 07:57:12 AM
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Today, I took my pic and as you see I grew quite big without any supps.
From November, I am thinking about starting preparation for spring.
Paco insist that I must take at least Tribulus Terrestris and GH releasers.
If I take these,still I am considered as natural?
I think so. But in case, I ask you guys.
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i know this is besides the point Taka but i think you should grow out your hair to look like Hiroshi Tanahashi
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Quit being lazy and train your calves ;D
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I've taken that shit before, you take it before bed, it's not bad, helps intensify workouts, makes you a half a #### too though :-\
Check with any competition organizations as to whether or not it's allowed.
If you mean in general, well it is sold over/counter, so....
The reason why i ask you is that i am planning to go to labs to do a test after those contests if i do really good.
Its very good to have some certificates showing that I am natural after beating some juicers.
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Quit being lazy and train your calves ;D
You are right. I am not worrying about my mass. But We(Paco and I) are worrying about the hardness.
But, I must keep on having the natural status.
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I would check with the lab then.
Thats true. I must do it.
Do you think The Tribulus is included as a pro-hormone?
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I've taken that shit before, you take it before bed, it's not bad, helps intensify workouts, makes you a half a c.u.n.t too though :-\
ELABORATE - MEAN IT MAKES U RAGE A BIT?
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Thats true. I must do it.
Do you think The Tribulus is included as a pro-hormone?
Tribulus is worthless. Does nothing as far as increasing testosterone.
There is no such thing as natural bodybuilding. And taking tribulus is much more "unnatural" than taking testosterone. Is tribulus something found naturally in the body? Is testosterone?
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Today, I took my pic and as you see I grew quite big without any supps.
From November, I am thinking about starting preparation for spring.
Paco insist that I must take at least Tribulus Terrestris and GH releasers.
If I take these,still I am considered as natural?
I think so. But in case, I ask you guys.
Gives me the ultimate boner :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
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Tribulus is worthless. Does nothing as far as increasing testosterone.
There is no such thing as natural bodybuilding. And taking tribulus is much more "unnatural" than taking testosterone. Is tribulus something found naturally in the body? Is testosterone?
Ok, For now I am natural except taking the chemical in those chicken breast.
No supps.
Just I am interested in the doping test.
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I disagree that it is worthless. I tried it and felt noticeably more intensity through my workouts while taking it, as well as more prickish in general.
When I tried creatine and andro back in the 90's, I felt nothing. I thought both were bunk.
Well, if it makes you more aggressive it's not because of increased testosterone. If it helps psychologically, and it's possible it does affect mood through various mechanisms, by all means take it.
Have you used creatine since the 90s? I remember the first time I used it, very expensive Twinlab Creatine Fuel, I noticed nothing. Nowadays I do notice it every time.
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Ok, For now I am natural except taking the chemical in those chicken breast.
No supps.
Just I am interested in the doping test.
Tribulus will not make you fail a doping test. It is not on any banned list either. But there are several legal and not banned supps that can help a little that I would use instead if I wanted to adhere to "drug free" rules. Like creatine, PH buffers, single aminos like acetyl-l-carnitine, antioxidants, vitamins like methylcobalamin, glycerol, etc.
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Tribulus will not make you fail a doping test. It is not on any banned list either. But there are several legal and not banned supps that can help a little that I would use instead if I wanted to adhere to "drug free" rules. Like creatine, PH buffers, single aminos like acetyl-l-carnitine, antioxidants, vitamins like methylcobalamin, glycerol, etc.
This is very important for me. Thanx.
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GH releasers are absolute bunk as well. Some of the test boosters on the market WILL kick up your libido and may provide a marginal increase in test. It's still close to worthless unless you're shut down to begin with. If you're shut down, the difference is like night and day. Test boosters these days are actually very good compared to the straight trib supplements of yesterday.
Only good for juicers who get shut down though. Sorry!
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GH releasers are absolute bunk as well. Some of the test boosters on the market WILL kick up your libido and may provide a marginal increase in test. It's still close to worthless unless you're shut down to begin with. If you're shut down, the difference is like night and day. Test boosters these days are actually very good compared to the straight trib supplements of yesterday.
Only good for juicers who get shut down though. Sorry!
MMmm Thanx for info.
Do you have any recommendation of those test boosters?
Name, company..etc.
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if you want to be a natural bodybuilder, how come your interested in things to increase results past what you would get on yoru own with food+training only?
sounds like your looking for a drug to induce results that you didnt earn on your own.
whether it is on a banned drug list or not, it still doesnt correlate for a "natural" to use anythign but weights and food.
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MMmm Thanx for info.
Do you have any recommendation of those test boosters?
Name, company..etc.
Unless you're feeling shut down I can't recommend any. I don't think you'll see any benefits in term of muscle gains or fat loss. :(
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if you want to be a natural bodybuilder, how come your interested in things to increase results past what you would get on yoru own with food+training only?
sounds like your looking for a drug to induce results that you didnt earn on your own.
whether it is on a banned drug list or not, it still doesnt correlate for a "natural" to use anythign but weights and food.
Thanx. Its your opinion.
If everything goes good, I am thinking about marcketing myself to the fitness industry.
Thats why i need to win a juicers show with the natural status(General).
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Unless you're feeling shut down I can't recommend any. I don't think you'll see any benefits in term of muscle gains or fat loss. :(
As I said, I am not interested in muscle gain at all.
I am interested in making my muscle looking hard.
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Thanx. Its your opinion.
If everything goes good, I am thinking about marcketing myself to the fitness industry.
Thats why i need to win a juicers show with the natural status(General).
the problem with that is that ANYONE can claim they are natural and that they beat a bunch of juicers. in bodybuilding nobody cares what you took, how you trained,or what you ate to look the way you do...all that matters is how do you look. if you want fitness contract you probably need to get on some steroids to get the "bodybuilder" look.
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Thanx. Its your opinion.
If everything goes good, I am thinking about marcketing myself to the fitness industry.Thats why i need to win a juicers show with the natural status(General).
good luck. ::) BTW your head is looking larger then it usually does.
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Trib is an herb, that increases LH, thereby increasing Test, I have used it and have blood work done before and after proving it works.
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the problem with that is that ANYONE can claim they are natural and that they beat a bunch of juicers. in bodybuilding nobody cares what you took, how you trained,or what you ate to look the way you do...all that matters is how do you look. if you want fitness contract you probably need to get on some steroids to get the "bodybuilder" look.
Sorry, Before, I didnt have this idea. But since I receive many consults from natural trainees in the internet and real world, I begin to think about it. Now a day, Nobody will trust a pro or top ama. I think a good natural bbers are way more respected now a day.
Ok, not like a ifbb pro but It means that I am already look like a bodybuilder. ;)
I know I will improve vastly in this spring since my weight is 87.5kg and look this good.
So when I am in shape, I know I am gonna give a good damege and it will be a new thing.
I will take advantage of this.
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good luck. ::) BTW your head is looking larger then it usually does.
Of course, with this physique, not. But, in next spring, YES.
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Trib is an herb, that increases LH, thereby increasing Test, I have used it and have blood work done before and after proving it works.
What do you mean?
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What do you mean?
He means that he had "blood work" performed - this is when they draw your blood and send it to a lab for analysis. He's saying that his blood work confirmed a rise in LH and test.
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What do you mean?
I have had my test levels checked from the lab before and after I used Trib for 2-3 months and the free and total test was higher after I used Trib.
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I have had my test levels checked from the lab before and after I used Trib for 2-3 months and the free and total test was higher after I used Trib.
He means that he had "blood work" performed - this is when they draw your blood and send it to a lab for analysis. He's saying that his blood work confirmed a rise in LH and test.
Aha, Thanx!
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Trib is an herb, that increases LH, thereby increasing Test, I have used it and have blood work done before and after proving it works.
I have had my test levels checked from the lab before and after I used Trib for 2-3 months and the free and total test was higher after I used Trib.
How much higher?
It's possible some herbs have an effect on adrenal steroid production. Trib doesn't increase LH - no reliable data showing this.
Which product did you use?
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More evidence (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19781624) that TT won't work, and to make interpretation less complicated, some graphs based on 7 groups of rats who got 11, 42 and 110 mg/kg(2.2 lbs) TT, 5 mg/kg DHEA, 0.25 mg/kg of Testosterone Propionate, 0,1 mg/kg ethinylestradiol or were a controll group for 28 days (source (http://www.ergogenics.org/supplement178.html#1) is in Dutch, sorry).
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest.gif)
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest3.gif)
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest2.gif)
Conclusion of researchers: "Tribulus terrestris is not able to stimulate endocrine sensitive tissues such as the prostate, seminal vesicle, uterus and vagina in Wistar rats, indicating lack of androgenic and estrogenic activity in vivo. We also showed an unchanged levels of circulating androgens."
Tongkat Ali (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19703544) could be interesting.
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Trib is an herb, that increases LH, thereby increasing Test, I have used it and have blood work done before and after proving it works.
I've done blood work before and after that showed it didn't do shit.
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Great thread.
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Tribulus is natural, but by itself its doesnt do much.I would stack it with DHEA, which I beleive is still natural.Then try to find some Longfolia, but make sure its a 200 to 1, or atleast a 100 to 1 ratio, this way its really strong.Other good herbs for increasing testosterone is MACA, Muira Puama, Horny Goat Weed, Velvet Deer Antler and Even Yohimbe.There all work well, you could even stack them together.
Are they are strong as steroids hell no, but atleast you will still be natural, but you will increase your natural testosterone levels.The stack below will be considered natural but would riase your test level very significantly
DHEA 200mg
Tribulus 1000mg
Longfolia 1000mg
Yohimbe Hcl 10-15mg
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Tribulus is natural, but by itself its doesnt do much.I would stack it with DHEA, which I beleive is still natural.Then try to find some Longfolia, but make sure its a 200 to 1, or atleast a 100 to 1 ratio, this way its really strong.Other good herbs for increasing testosterone is MACA, Muira Puama, Horny Goat Weed, Velvet Deer Antler and Even Yohimbe.There all work well, you could even stack them together.
Are they are strong as steroids hell no, but atleast you will still be natural, but you will increase your natural testosterone levels.The stack below will be considered natural but would riase your test level very significantly
DHEA 200mg
Tribulus 1000mg
Longfolia 1000mg
Yohimbe Hcl 10-15mg
Hopefuly,I can get hardness this time...
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Hopefuly,I can get hardness this time...
Not possible without insulin.
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Not possible without insulin.
No. GH creats hardness.
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To get harder, you can you Chrysin, which is an exellent estrogen blocker, and is from passion flower.I would say 100mg a day of Chrysin will get you dryer and harder.Plus best of alll its alll natural.
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To get harder, you can you Chrysin, which is an exellent estrogen blocker, and is from passion flower.I would say 100mg a day of Chrysin will get you dryer and harder.Plus best of alll its alll natural.
Never heard of it.
Interesting.
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Chrysin was big right around the year 2000.Then it kind of faded away, because its pretty inexpensive to make.But beleive it or not, I will bet anybody a $1000 that Chrysin is a better estrogen blocker, then Gaspari's Novedex.A bottle of Chrysin only costs, $3 a bottle to make, but its works great.People even passion flower,what Chrysin is made from to help then sleep better.
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To get harder, you can you Chrysin, which is an exellent estrogen blocker, and is from passion flower.I would say 100mg a day of Chrysin will get you dryer and harder.Plus best of alll its alll natural.
Wiki doesnt say anything positive about this...
What can you say?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysin
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No. GH creats hardness.
OK, thanks.
To get harder, you can you Chrysin, which is an exellent estrogen blocker,
Bullshit. Cite references please. Chrysin has basically no bioavailability so don't post any in-vitro data.
Chrysin was big right around the year 2000.Then it kind of faded away, because its pretty inexpensive to make.But beleive it or not, I will bet anybody a $1000 that Chrysin is a better estrogen blocker, then Gaspari's Novedex.A bottle of Chrysin only costs, $3 a bottle to make, but its works great.People even passion flower,what Chrysin is made from to help then sleep better.
Gaspari has a study showing it actually does something. Please show your evidence in favor of Chrysin.
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OK, thanks.
I dont know. According to the people around me..
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I dont know. According to the people around me..
I was just kidding, since you used to say insulin helps make you hard.
You can get hard without any drugs but you will need to lose another 20lbs or so.
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Van, I am not going to argue with you.......it will only lower my IQ
Kyomou The reason why Chrysin didnt get much hype is because its cheap to make.But trust me I know alot of bodybuilders who have had problems with estrogen, and within 2-3 days, the nipple sensitivty was gone.
Chrysin is cheap and its works, for blocking estrogen.Plus its helps people sleep.
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If a guy is on no drugs why would he need estrogen blockers?
Answer that please.
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I was just kidding, since you used to say insulin helps make you hard.
You can get hard without any drugs but you will need to lose another 20lbs or so.
Yeah This time I will do it and I am extremely confident(No matter how Paco says that its impossible to get hard like Drug users...).
In this pic, I am 87.5kg.
In January, I will squeeze my body until 72kg!!!!!!(Paco says no need to... Anyway, i will be dry and i dont care about my size on this stage).
Then I will recuperate gradualy until 15 of March until 77kg around(Same weight as last year).
Lets see it!
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Van, I am not going to argue with you.......it will only lower my IQ
Kyomou The reason why Chrysin didnt get much hype is because its cheap to make.But trust me I know alot of bodybuilders who have had problems with estrogen, and within 2-3 days, the nipple sensitivty was gone.
Chrysin is cheap and its works, for blocking estrogen.Plus its helps people sleep.
didnt know you go lower than zero, stop the snake oil salesman BS ::)
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Van, I am not going to argue with you.......it will only lower my IQ
Kyomou The reason why Chrysin didnt get much hype is because its cheap to make.But trust me I know alot of bodybuilders who have had problems with estrogen, and within 2-3 days, the nipple sensitivty was gone.
Chrysin is cheap and its works, for blocking estrogen.Plus its helps people sleep.
Mmmm Intersting..
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it's only natural if you want it to be
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Mmmm Intersting..
Are your nipples sensitive Kyomu? Perhaps have Paco squeeze them to see? :D
Also, squeezing the testicles will increase testosterone (serious).
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Are your nipples sensitive Kyomu? Perhaps have Paco squeeze them to see? :D
Also, squeezing the testicles will increase testosterone (serious).
NO WAY.
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like tdongz said, just because something isn't banned and you take it, it doesn't mean you're still "natural".
a true natural would just eat and train.
hell, as van bilderass said, i think taking test is natural. possibly gh even, but i have no experience with it or any knowledge to share.
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like tdongz said, just because something isn't banned and you take it, it doesn't mean you're still "natural".
a true natural would just eat and train.
hell, as van bilderass said, i think taking test is natural. possibly gh even, but i have no experience with it or any knowledge to share.
Agreed.
But, the goal is beating juicers without using banned substances.
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Agreed.
But, the goal is beating juicers without using banned substances.
Good luck with that.
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Good luck with that.
Thanx.
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Thanx.
From my own experience, when I've taken high dose fadogia supplements in conjunction with tyrosine, or anything that can increase norepinephrine (much bigger effect when taken with buproprion), I noted an appreciable loss of body fat. There aren't too many fadogia supplements on the market though. I also noted a more aggressive demeanor as well. Not that that's bad, as I liked it, frankly.
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More evidence (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19781624) that TT won't work, and to make interpretation less complicated, some graphs based on 7 groups of rats who got 11, 42 and 110 mg/kg(2.2 lbs) TT, 5 mg/kg DHEA, 0.25 mg/kg of Testosterone Propionate, 0,1 mg/kg ethinylestradiol or were a controll group for 28 days (source (http://www.ergogenics.org/supplement178.html#1) is in Dutch, sorry).
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest.gif)
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest3.gif)
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest2.gif)
Conclusion of researchers:
Tongkat Ali (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19703544) could be interesting.
animal experiments are bunk anyway. THis means nothing in humans.
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As I said, I am not interested in muscle gain at all.
I am interested in making my muscle looking hard.
whats your diet look like?
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No. GH creats hardness.
ugly cockumu gay asian short.
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it's only natural if you want it to be
nice one haha.
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animal experiments are bunk anyway. THis means nothing in humans.
Not for 100%, but certainly much more than 50%. Rats have bones, muscles, organs, etc too which, in general terms, work the same as humans.
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MMmm Thanx for info.
Do you have any recommendation of those test boosters?
Name, company..etc.
I think maybe the best ones are the PCT (Anabolic Xtreme), the Axis-HT (BSN) and the Vitrix (Nutrex)...
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I think maybe the best ones are the PCT (Anabolic Xtreme), the Axis-HT (BSN) and the Vitrix (Nutrex)...
All the ones that work have illegal ingredients (illegal as far as in passing a doping test) in them. Ingredients like ATD or bromoandrostenedione or 6-OXO.
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whats your diet look like?
Mostly, Chicken breast, Tuna(Flesh),Potatos.Onion.
I dont eat egg white.
Occasionaly add rice.
Still I eat cheat meal twice a week.
I will stop it from next week.
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I think maybe the best ones are the PCT (Anabolic Xtreme), the Axis-HT (BSN) and the Vitrix (Nutrex)...
Thanx for Info. Steve.
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All the ones that work have illegal ingredients (illegal as far as in passing a doping test) in them. Ingredients like ATD or bromoandrostenedione or 6-OXO.
Wew!!!!
Dangerous!!!! >:(
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If you take either of these you are NOT natural. You may aswell use the real shit.
Naturals can get in good hard condition Kyomu, you never dieted hard enough. You have less muscle than you think under there
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If you take either of these you are NOT natural. You may aswell use the real shit.
Naturals can get in good hard condition Kyomu, you never dieted hard enough. You have less muscle than you think under there
he is better than you will ever be
you will take gear as soon as you can get it
classic case of no contacts due to twink status
no money due to living with mommy
so hate on everything ::)
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If you take either of these you are NOT natural. You may aswell use the real shit.
Naturals can get in good hard condition Kyomu, you never dieted hard enough. You have less muscle than you think under there
Hey newbie. I will teach you a thing.
Dryness and hardness are two different thing.Dont judge with the pic of me of 1st page of this thread.
Thats way far from my contest condition.
I have huge confidence to get dry to the bone this time unlike last time.
But, Hardness is normaly created by the super muscle fullness caused by drugs.
And I dont have that much confidence about it.
Its difficult to get super dry and full at the same time.
You can be small and hard. But big and hard is difficult.
Here is the last times pic.
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Powerzone make the strongest Tribulus product in the world
http://www.powerzonenutrition.net/testresults.htm
These guys go hard on the protodioscin - this is the key....syntex, asn...its all shit in comparison
yes, I believe Trib works, but at least take the stuff that isnt snakeoil rubbish
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all OTC supplements are 100% complete and utter bullshit except the roids that sometimes slip the system
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all OTC supplements are 100% complete and utter bullshit except the roids that sometimes slip the system
I just started taking methylcobalamin and I'll be damned if it doesn't increase appetite like crazy. Some supplements are useful.
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all OTC supplements are 100% complete and utter bullshit except the roids that sometimes slip the system
That's a ridiculous statement. Indeed, there are many misleading products that fail to deliver substantive results; however, there are a variety of products that have benefit. The problem is with the ideology of people like yourself that see fit to compare OTC products with steroids as a means of gauging benefit. Of course supplements will not compare to actual drugs, but their role is only to supplement a training and nutritional program, as the name implies. No different than people that bash the use of any type of protein powder. For someone that is on the go, such products can be very useful. They won't turn one into Mr. Olympia, but that is not the intent.
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I'm always only talking about benefits for body composition. Maybe creatine is an exception since it seems to have a small benefit. Of course supplements which are really just food replacements are also excluded, since they are just that: food.
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Would prolonged us of Tribulus cause you to go more bald, if you are already doing so (genetically)?
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Would prolonged us of Tribulus cause you to go more bald, if you are already doing so (genetically)?
I have to be honest in finding the entire topic of tribulus somewhat amusing. Tribulus was the next big thing over 10 years ago, and in terms of bodybuilding applications, was a total flop. The main reason some were so quick to conclude it to have a positive impact on testosterone, was due to its propensity to increase libido and erections in some users. By whatever mechanism this occurs, I would suggest it is independent of any impact on hormone production.
The concentrations of various tribulus products may vary widely, but Tribulus is still a dud, for the most part. Even if one of the products on the market were to impact testosterone positively, it would be highly unlikely to be substantive enough to have a notable impact on body composition.
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kyomu here is 100% natural with good condition
(http://www.biolayne.com/Bio%20Layne%20Web%20Gallery/Albums/Album1/Source/sc3.jpg)
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kyomu here is 100% natural with good condition
(http://www.biolayne.com/Bio%20Layne%20Web%20Gallery/Albums/Album1/Source/sc3.jpg)
Hopefuly, He is natural.
Cus i cant beat those juicers if i am not in this kind of condition in next spring.
Why you try to impress yourself? Thats why I hate young kids. :-\
I built this thread for reaching this condition without using banned substance.Its obvious.
And i didnt say or bragging about my current physique or my contest condition of last time.
and this is my plan which i post page3,And you didnt read it hah? :-\
Yeah This time I will do it and I am extremely confident(No matter how Paco says that its impossible to get hard like Drug users...).
In this pic, I am 87.5kg.
In January, I will squeeze my body until 72kg!!!!!!(Paco says no need to... Anyway, i will be dry and i dont care about my size on this stage).
Then I will recuperate gradualy until 15 of March until 77kg around(Same weight as last year).
Lets see it!
So you are posting something inutil. If you try to impress yourself with your knowledge or somthing,please dont come here and talk to me again.
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kyomu here is 100% natural with good condition
(http://www.biolayne.com/Bio%20Layne%20Web%20Gallery/Albums/Album1/Source/sc3.jpg)
sure he is.
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sure he is.
Telling the truth. I believe it too. Thats why i try.
The interesting thing is, why many people think Jeff is juiced and he is not?
Same kind of condition there.
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Muscles for nothing, trophies for free.
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Muscles for nothing, trophies for free.
Cant sing. :-\
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Mostly, Chicken breast, Tuna(Flesh),Potatos.Onion.
I dont eat egg white.
Occasionaly add rice.
Still I eat cheat meal twice a week.
I will stop it from next week.
switch to tilapia (or any white fish) instead of chicken, it is more easily digested, (and zero carbs). my body responds to that very quickly...i look much softer when eating chicken all the time, i cannot diet for a show on that. ..oh & cut out the rice.
have some complex carbs in the morning, but for the rest of the day eat raw green vegetables & fish.
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switch to tilapia (or any white fish) instead of chicken, it is more easily digested, (and zero carbs). my body responds to that very quickly...i look much softer when eating chicken all the time, i cannot diet for a show on that. ..oh & cut out the rice.
have some complex carbs in the morning, but for the rest of the day eat raw green vegetables & fish.
Thanx.
Yes.I will do it about 2 month later. The first show is around 15th of March.
I just eat rice occasionaly now when i see flat.
But, from next month, no.
Not eating carbs from afternoon makes me deplated a lot. I had tryed that before and the result was really bad.
So I will spread it to all day
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switch to tilapia (or any white fish) instead of chicken, it is more easily digested, (and zero carbs). my body responds to that very quickly...i look much softer when eating chicken all the time, i cannot diet for a show on that. ..oh & cut out the rice.
have some complex carbs in the morning, but for the rest of the day eat raw green vegetables & fish.
I cant function with just some morning carbs, i used to spread them Throughout the day, when i dieted for a contest.
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I cant function with just some morning carbs, i used to spread them Throughout the day, when i dieted for a contest.
I cant function much either, but it got me in the best shape of my life for contest! I was miserable for a time, I had to write down every thought or it would escape me within seconds. My memory was shot.
If you want to acheive hardness naturally, you really gotta train hard & suffer, using diet to your best advantage.
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Thanx.
Yes.I will do it about 2 month later. The first show is around 15th of March.
I just eat rice occasionaly now when i see flat.
But, from next month, no.
Not eating carbs from afternoon makes me deplated a lot. I had tryed that before and the result was really bad.
So I will spread it to all day
Im sorry.. when I asked about your diet I meant specifically your contest prep.. not what your doing now. Shouldve been more clear.
Either way, the fish is much better than chicken, IMO. Just by changing that, the difference I see within a week is quite dramatic.
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Im sorry.. when I asked about your diet I meant specifically your contest prep.. not what your doing now. Shouldve been more clear.
Either way, the fish is much better than chicken, IMO. Just by changing that, the difference I see within a week is quite dramatic.
Yeah, highly agreed. Here in spain, more than tilapia, we use merluza. Same kind of fish.
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I disagree that it is worthless. I tried it and felt noticeably more intensity through my workouts while taking it, as well as more prickish in general.
When I tried creatine and andro back in the 90's, I felt nothing. I thought both were bunk.
Agreed on BOTH points. I felt nothing from creatine but have always gotten a nice boost from Trib.
I've tried dozens of supps over the years so it's no placebo effect. I can immediately tell what works for me and what doesn't.
Thumbs up(and other things) for Tribulus ;D
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TT dont work, http://www.ergogenics.org/tribulus3.html read it
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Tribulus is garbage and a waste of time, IMO. Never done it, but know guys who have. Either do the real stuff or nothing at all--and in the latter case, hope you've got the "mountain man" genetics. ;D
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"mountain man" genetics. ;D
???
(http://www.redearthbears.org/About/whatsabear/files/page4_1.jpg)
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???
(http://www.redearthbears.org/About/whatsabear/files/page4_1.jpg)
Actually I was thinking more along these lines ;D
(http://tinabc.files.wordpress.com/2007/04/tina-mcinerney-mountain-man.jpg)
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More evidence (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19781624) that TT won't work, and to make interpretation less complicated, some graphs based on 7 groups of rats who got 11, 42 and 110 mg/kg(2.2 lbs) TT, 5 mg/kg DHEA, 0.25 mg/kg of Testosterone Propionate, 0,1 mg/kg ethinylestradiol or were a controll group for 28 days (source (http://www.ergogenics.org/supplement178.html#1) is in Dutch, sorry).
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest.gif)
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest3.gif)
(http://www.ergogenics.org/2005/tribtest2.gif)
Conclusion of researchers:
Tongkat Ali (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19703544) could be interesting.
As if you need a scientific study to tell you that Tribulus won’t do you that much good, if you have your NUTS cut off (notwithstanding the fact that this was done on RATS).
AIM OF THE STUDY: Investigate the possible effects of Tribulus terrestris (TT) on endocrine sensitive organs in intact and castrated male rats as well as in a post-menopausal rat model using ovariectomized females....
Plus, there's the matter of dosage. The last study I saw, claiming that Trib didn't work in humans, the "large" amount of Trib being used by the adult males (with their nads intact) was 1.5mg/lb of bodyweight.
In essence, that's 300 mg of Trib for a 200-lb guy. That's nowhere near enough to do anything. Most of the people who use Trib and report decent results ingest a BARE MINIMUM of 1000 mg per day (when I've used it, it usually 1500). A couple of guys here have used as much as 3000 mg.
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If you want to acheive hardness naturally, you really gotta train hard & suffer, using diet to your best advantage.
For a natural, this is a motto you should live by. Any OTC supplements won't make up the difference of plain old hard work.
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If you're looking for an inexpensive form of Trib, Ultimate Nutriton makes a good product.
Also, look into Python by Vitamin Shoppe, which also contains Avena Sativa and Urtica Diocia (sp?).