Author Topic: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting  (Read 216270 times)

Dos Equis

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #475 on: June 24, 2013, 03:53:42 PM »


They both most likely feared for their lives, due to the gun, so I'm still not sure what you mean by this.

Zero evidence Martin feared for his life.  He was too busy beating the crap out of Zimmerman. 

Plenty of evidence Zimmerman feared for his life or safety, including repeatedly yelling for help.

The prosecution has to prove that Zimmerman didn't act in self-defense.  Not sure how else to say that. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #476 on: June 24, 2013, 04:10:30 PM »
100% Female and 0% Black seems a bit off, no doubt about it.

Sounds fine to me.  Who cares about the racial makeup of the jury, except for race hustlers and the media?  (Same thing.)  Could care less if it's all female, or all male, or all gay, etc.  The facts are the facts.   

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #477 on: June 24, 2013, 05:06:49 PM »
Sounds fine to me.  Who cares about the racial makeup of the jury, except for race hustlers and the media?  (Same thing.)  Could care less if it's all female, or all male, or all gay, etc.  The facts are the facts.   

So you don't agree with the article that you posted?

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #478 on: June 24, 2013, 05:14:13 PM »
Zero evidence Martin feared for his life.  He was too busy beating the crap out of Zimmerman.

The gun provides very convincing evidence that Martin would have reason to fear for his life.  Would you disagree?

Plenty of evidence Zimmerman feared for his life or safety, including repeatedly yelling for help.

The prosecution has to prove that Zimmerman didn't act in self-defense.  Not sure how else to say that. 

Doesn't make sense, as it was a fight over a gun.  You know that.

The prosecution needs to show that Zimmerman created a dangerous situation, while revealing a failure to show moral regard for life during the creation of the situation; and they need to convince the jury that Martin died while rightfully trying to save himself from serious bodily injury or death.

Dos Equis

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #479 on: June 24, 2013, 05:38:06 PM »
So you don't agree with the article that you posted?

Which article?  I've posted a number of them. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #480 on: June 24, 2013, 05:40:27 PM »
The gun provides very convincing evidence that Martin would have reason to fear for his life.  Would you disagree?

Doesn't make sense, as it was a fight over a gun.  You know that.

The prosecution needs to show that Zimmerman created a dangerous situation, while revealing a failure to show moral regard for life during the creation of the situation; and they need to convince the jury that Martin died while rightfully trying to save himself from serious bodily injury or death.


I disagree.  As I've said, and won't repeat again, there is zero evidence that Martin was afraid of anything. 

The evidence shows Zimmerman was trying not to get the crap beat out of him.  And failing. 

The prosecution has to prove second degree murder.  They also have to prove Zimmerman did not act in self defense.  But I'm done repeating myself.   :)

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #481 on: June 24, 2013, 05:50:34 PM »
Which article?  I've posted a number of them. 

???

The article that refers to the very same subject in question, Beach Bum.

Dos Equis

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #482 on: June 24, 2013, 05:56:42 PM »
???

The article that refers to the very same subject in question, Beach Bum.

If you're talking about the article by Tamara Holder, no I don't agree with her opinion that they need a more racially and gender diverse jury to satisfy people in the community who will complain about the verdict. 

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #483 on: June 24, 2013, 05:57:00 PM »
Yes, Beach Bum, guns have been known to cause extreme fear.  That is fact.

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #484 on: June 24, 2013, 07:30:02 PM »
Yes, Beach Bum, guns have been known to cause extreme fear.  That is fact.
And how in the hell would he have been aware in advance that Zimmerman was carrying a firearm?

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #485 on: June 24, 2013, 07:34:17 PM »
Prosecution was completely inept today.  telling knock knock jokes.  acting confused, doing that "slow mo repeating the question back to the judge" thing.  Objecting to the older 911 calls AFTER they've been played for jury, because they didn't know what was on them - and objecting due to relevance!  They HAD a chance to reject and approved it.

Then he wanted the jury to disregard it, AFTER HE OK'D IT!!!!

prosecutors did a decent job - nothing spectacular but solid... that lead defense lawyer just looked baffled - he objected to one thing then had ZERO case to back why he was objecting - he had a year to prepare for this shit... come on...

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #486 on: June 24, 2013, 09:18:53 PM »
And how in the hell would he have been aware in advance that Zimmerman was carrying a firearm?

In advance of what, exactly, Shockwave?

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #487 on: June 25, 2013, 06:37:21 AM »
Day 2 is showing the defense lawyer arguing with himself once again.

He okay'd the intro of evidence yesterday, of th eold 911 calls.  He said no objection when asked.

THEN, after the jury heard zimmerman saying some things which showed he had a history of distaste with a certain appearance of individual (well, pretty much profiling) -

THEN the defense attorney suddenly wanted to argue the jury shouldn't hear it.  But they okay'd it.

Today it's just been 45 minutes so far of the defense lawyer arguing with judge about yesterday's mistake.

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #488 on: June 25, 2013, 06:58:06 AM »
#2 prosecutor dick mantei is now disassembling the defense ramblings of earlier.

will be considered a qualty getbig level owning IF the defense spends an hour ranting about the 911 tapes, then the prosecution points out the tapes had nothing to do with the things defense was saying.

I wonder which way the judge will rule.

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #489 on: June 25, 2013, 09:04:05 AM »
In advance of what, exactly, Shockwave?
In advance of Zimmerman pulling out the fucking gun and shooting the kid. How in the he do you suppose he knew about the gun before zimmerman pulled it out and dropped him?

Answer - you have no idea, there is no evidence showing that Martin knew of the firearm prior to taking a round to the chest. (and if he did know , that makes him twice as stupid).

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #490 on: June 25, 2013, 09:47:32 AM »
In advance of Zimmerman pulling out the fucking gun and shooting the kid. How in the he do you suppose he knew about the gun before zimmerman pulled it out and dropped him?

Answer - you have no idea, there is no evidence showing that Martin knew of the firearm prior to taking a round to the chest. (and if he did know , that makes him twice as stupid).

Yes, Shockwave, Martin was aware of the gun before Zimmerman shot him.  Haven't you been following the case?

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #491 on: June 25, 2013, 10:20:50 AM »
So far the defense seems to be doing of the prosecution's work for them.

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #492 on: June 25, 2013, 10:50:32 AM »
So far the defense seems to be doing of the prosecution's work for them.

well, they're desperate.  zimmerman said a lot of things which just aren't true.

"He punched he in the nose then knocked me down, then held his hand over my mouth and nose" -
See the lack of DNA or blood or skin on trayvon's hands, arm, sleeve, etc kinda make that impossible.

A lot of little lies like these really crap on his credibility.  NOt much they can do but try to make things as blurry as possible and wear out the jurors so they're just ready to go home.

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #493 on: June 25, 2013, 11:07:06 AM »
Yes, Shockwave, Martin was aware of the gun before Zimmerman shot him.  Haven't you been following the case?
really? Is like to see your proof that Martin knew Zimmerman had a sidearm prior to the fisticuffs.

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #494 on: June 25, 2013, 11:08:53 AM »
According to the defense, Martin was armed as well.

With the sidewalk.   ::)

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #495 on: June 25, 2013, 11:11:19 AM »
really? Is like to see your proof that Martin knew Zimmerman had a sidearm prior to the fisticuffs.

You're getting shifty, Shockwave:


Answer - there is no evidence showing that Martin knew of the firearm prior to taking a round to the chest.

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #496 on: June 25, 2013, 11:17:04 AM »
You're getting shifty, Shockwave:

Not at all. If the fight was already underway its totally irrelevant if he saw the firearm, which I instantly figured out was your ridiculous and completely illogical point.

If Martin had seen the firearm prior to getting into the fight, you could argue he feared for his life. After he had engaged the guy? Totally irrelevant.

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #497 on: June 25, 2013, 11:18:10 AM »
To the guys that really want to believe Zimmerman, let me ask:

How do you process the fact that he is known liar, and furthermore that he would have such tremendous incentive to lie about this encounter?

Just a little aside, that's made me wonder.  I'd appreciate an honest answer from as many of you as possible.

Jack T. Cross

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #498 on: June 25, 2013, 11:20:29 AM »
Not at all. If the fight was already underway its totally irrelevant if he saw the firearm, which I instantly figured out was your ridiculous and completely illogical point.

If Martin had seen the firearm prior to getting into the fight, you could argue he feared for his life. After he had engaged the guy? Totally irrelevant.

So it wasn't a matter of you scrambling for facts that you'd been unaware of?

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Re: Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting
« Reply #499 on: June 25, 2013, 11:30:15 AM »
So it wasn't a matter of you scrambling for facts that you'd been unaware of?
No. I wad aware that Zinmermad had stated in one of his multiple, conflicting statements that Trayvon had gone for the gun DURING the fight. As I said, that is irrelevant, as the conflict had already begun and both men were probably fearing for their lives.

I don't know why you're trying so hard to convict Zimmerman, you loom for every convoluted, illogical argument you can possibly find. The man is a shitbag and a liar, yes, but that doesn't mean a spade isn't a spade.

Two men got into a fight,  both men were trying to do what was necessary to continue living. One man succeeded, on man failed. End of story. Everything else is people trying to find an answer using their own experiences, bias' and feelings as the evidence to justify whatever outcome they feel is right on the inside.

I don't particularly care at this point, but the reality is on man was on his back herring his head smashed into the concrete and he did what was necessary to keep living.

 Could he have avoided the conflict? Yes.

Could Trayvpn have avoided the conflict? Yes.

Both men chose go into that situation. One men lived, one died.