Workout/Routine advice from the GetBig community

[Hulkotron]

Hulkotron is 40 years old now and mostly goes for the health look (no homo).

Heavy full-body 5x a week seems a bit much but I say whatever works for you, keep it up.

People worry too much about injuries I think.  Injuries are how you find your limits and find what works for you.  You don't want to tear your pec from the bone like that bonehead in Larry Wheels video but I think bbers worry too much about minor injuries.

[Primemuscle]

That dip machine and the nautilus pull over are examples of perfection regarding an exercise machine. I only tried that dip machine on vacation and I was so impressed with it. I love the way the back is angled forward to keep you in the seat.

Me too. The first time I sat in it, it was a bit weird but once I got used to it....wow!

[Soul Crusher]

Hulkotron is 40 years old now and mostly goes for the health look (no homo).

Heavy full-body 5x a week seems a bit much but I say whatever works for you, keep it up.

People worry too much about injuries I think.  Injuries are how you find your limits and find what works for you.  You don't want to tear your pec from the bone like that bonehead in Larry Wheels video but I think bbers worry too much about minor injuries.

Injuries happen when idiots are pushing 1-3 rep max into their 40s.   So fng dumb.

[OneMoreRep]

Injuries happen when idiots are pushing 1-3 rep max into their 40s.   So fng dumb.

Agreed.

See even when I work as often as I do, I'm able to get no less than 8-10 reps on each set.

"1"

[Van_Bilderass]

EMG is  an objective measurement to quantify a phenomenon, taking it out of the realm of subjective feeling and into the realm of data you can replicate. How else would you begin to form a scientific study of muscular action? Magnetic resonance imaging has been used but is very time consuming.


If I do pullovers with the dumbbell far below my head, back arched,  I feel it all across my pectorals for about half the movement. As I wrote earlier, you have to be very careful with that movement though because you can easily shift the focus away from the chest or lats and into the shoulder girdle, causing injury.  I no longer do them because I find dips hit my chest perfectly and arched back chins hit my lats perfectly - all pain free.


The pecs do a lot more than just pull your arm across the body:


https://www.knowyourbody.net/pectoralis-major.html

I may have missed something about anatomy but pullovers never seemed a pec movement to me, not 30 years ago when I started nor now  It's quite possible I missed something. I've asked some fellas in the gym to explain to me how pullovers are a chest exercise but these guys are no biomechanics experts and they have no answers 

I know there have been some critiques about EMG data by Lyle McDonald, how there are some big limitations with it. I know some muscle activation work is being done by one Kassem Hanson. However, I've been too uninterested and lazy to delve deeper into it 
Do you know about these EMG data critiques where you could explain them?

[Soul Crusher]

Agreed.

See even when I work as often as I do, I'm able to get no less than 8-10 reps on each set.

"1"

At our age the name of the game is volume w medium weights.    Too heavy is stupid.    And too light does nothing.   You want to find that happy middle sweet spot that you can do reps and still work the muscles.     No one gives a f at all of you deadlift 495 or 315.     Do sets of 315 or 225 on the hex bar for reps.   You will feel great.   The muscles are worked and no injuries or strains.   You won’t lose an ounce of muscle.

[OneMoreRep]

At our age the name of the game is volume w medium weights.    Too heavy is stupid.    And too light does nothing.   You want to find that happy middle sweet spot that you can do reps and still work the muscles.     No one gives a f at all of you deadlift 495 or 315.     Do sets of 315 or 225 on the hex bar for reps.   You will feel great.   The muscles are worked and no injuries or strains.   You won’t lose an ounce of muscle.

100% agreed my brother.

"1"

[Van_Bilderass]

Injuries happen when idiots are pushing 1-3 rep max into their 40s.   So fng dumb.

I wrote earlier about safety not just having to do with load and rep ranges but also a lot to do with volume and execution and exercise selection. For example, there may be a lot of injuries in high rep Olympic lifts and sloppy form with kipping dips and chins in Crossfit versus extremely precise low rep/high load squats and deads. A ballistic single on a bench for an old geezer is idiotic but a precise 5 rep set on a machine press might be smart training even when old.

There are healthy seniors doing good even in powerlifting but Ronnie Coleman is not doing well even though he did high rep bodybuilding.

Another interesting debate is the debate about jefferson deadlifts. It's a deadlift done with a rounded back. Some say this should never be done period, whereas even some physical therapists say it might be good, since in daily activity you realistically don't lift objects off the floor with bent legs and straight back. Besides, tissues adapt to any type of movements. What do you guys think?

This fella is parodying these schools of thought:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CKjrFU4BTyZ/?igshid=mtt2hdbbaha7

[Hulkotron]

I wrote earlier about safety not just having to do with load and rep ranges but also a lot to do with volume and execution and exercise selection. For example, there may be a lot of injuries in high rep Olympic lifts and sloppy form with kipping dips and chins in Crossfit versus extremely precise low rep/high load squats and deads. A ballistic single on a bench for an old geezer is idiotic but a precise 5 rep set on a machine press might be smart training even when old.

There are healthy seniors doing good even in powerlifting but Ronnie Coleman is not doing well even though he did high rep bodybuilding.

Another interesting debate is the debate about jefferson deadlifts. It's a deadlift done with a rounded back. Some say this should never be done period, whereas even some physical therapists say it might be good, since in daily activity you realistically don't lift objects off the floor with bent legs and straight back. Besides, tissues adapt to any type of movements. What do you guys think?

This fella is parodying these schools of thought:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CKjrFU4BTyZ/?igshid=mtt2hdbbaha7

The pendulum has swung a bit recently on "lifting with a rounded back" being the Great Satan, for example https://www.jospt.org/doi/abs/10.2519/jospt.2020.9218

[Marty Champions]

Past 40 you count even non weighted squats as reps. Im extremely lucky knowing what to eat. Whole milk, eggs, almonds, lettuce, acv, lemonjuice

[IroNat]

Jefferson lift.

Back should not be rounded.  Many people lack the flexibility to do it correctly and they bend way over from the waist instead of correctly doing it from a deeper squat position.

[IroNat]

The problem with lifting high reps is you lose max strength in your big compound moves.

So, you get weaker in those moves if you always do higher reps.

Higher reps are good for some exercises, particularly isolation type exercises.

People have problems when they lifts weights too heavy for their connective tissues.  Steroid lifters often get pec tears and bicep tears for this reason.  The strength of their muscles quickly outpaces the strength of their tendons.

People who do high volume with bodyparts often get tendonitis.

Avoid extremes.

[oldtimer1]

The problem with low reps is you lose muscular endurance to do a high rep routine. Many guys that switch for a change to high reps find they run out of gas quickly doing multiple sets of 12 reps and more. If getting strong (represented by a one rep max)  was the magic bullet of muscle gains then we would all warm up and do something like 4 sets of one rep for our exercises.

[IroNat]

The problem with low reps is you lose muscular endurance to do a high rep routine. Many guys that switch for a change to high reps find they run out of gas quickly doing multiple sets of 12 reps and more. If getting strong (represented by a one rep max)  was the magic bullet of muscle gains then we would all warm up and do something like 4 sets of one rep for our exercises.

That's how you should warm up.  You do 10 reps with just the bar.  Then add a bit do 3 reps.
Add more...do 1 rep...repeat until you're at your work weight.

This is how I warm up.

Doing lots of reps in your warmups just wears you out for your work sets.

If you want high rep endurance you can do high reps.  If you want strength and power do 5 or less reps.

If you want cardio do cardio.

[Van_Bilderass]

Jefferson lift.

Back should not be rounded.  Many people lack the flexibility to do it correctly and they bend way over from the waist instead of correctly doing it from a deeper squat position.

Ah, my mistake. It was the Jefferson Curl.

Some load this movement. Not heavy, but some load.

[Thin Lizzy]

Is the Jefferson Deadlift nicknamed  the Ball Crusher?

[Thin Lizzy]

As an aside, I always hear the word muscular endurance but what exactly is the adaptation? With strength training you know the adaptation is that the fibers get bigger and stronger but with endurance training do they actually get tougher, more callused? I’m not talking about aerobic adaptations which is increased mitochondria and capillarization. I’m talking about actual toughness of the muscle fibers.

I’ve tried  to find research on this on the inter-web but have been left wanting.

[Tapeworm]

I'd speculate glycolytic adaptation. I don't know for sure. It just sounded like a smart thing to say.

And I always regarded pullovers as a lat movement just like a front lever in gymnastics, despite Arnold's weird bullshit about 'expanding the ribcage.' Also agree with whoever said it dislocated his shoulder. Never happened to me but I know that feeling of stress on the joint. Didn't like it. I don't do them.

When I used to whitewater kayak there was lots of talk about dislocations during a 'dufect' which involves one arm up high with your forearm across your forehead. Apparently it was such a common injury that we were all instructed on how to hang weight from the elbow of a dislocated arm to fatigue the muscles before trying to pop it back into place.

[Thin Lizzy]

I'd speculate glycolytic adaptation. I don't know for sure. It just sounded like a smart thing to say.

And I always regarded pullovers as a lat movement just like a front lever in gymnastics, despite Arnold's weird bullshit about 'expanding the ribcage.' Also agree with whoever said it dislocated his shoulder. Never happened to me but I know that feeling of stress on the joint. Didn't like it. I don't do them.

When I used to whitewater kayak there was lots of talk about dislocations during a 'dufect' which involves one arm up high with your forearm across your forehead. Apparently it was such a common injury that we were all instructed on how to hang weight from the elbow of a dislocated arm to fatigue the muscles before trying to pop it back into place.

That’s more of an energy system thing. You get better at buffering lactate as a result of high intensity exercise bouts.

I’m talking about the muscle adaptations that say a plumber would get from turning a wrench all day on a regular basis.

[Tapeworm]

Ah, thought you were talking 10-30 reps kind of thing.

Total speculation once again, I'd guess lactic acid clearance and aerobic replinishment. I used to have a chug-along zone in the pool. Even after an hour or more the fatigue level was unchanged and I could maintain the same decent pace. At the start of the season tho there was all kinds of burn and a decline in maintainable pace.

Everyone has that, I guess. Just exert yourself minimally so that the rate of recovery isn't outpaced. But the plumber's arm is recovery adapted so he can maintain a wrench turning pace that I can't even if I could max out more force?

As I type, I know I'm starting the obvious. What the cellular or systemic adaptations are I couldn't say.

It's mindblowing how adaptable a person is tho. To be able to invest effort and improve. It's still amazing to me.

[Darren Avey]

It depends when one started lifting.  If you re in you're 40s and have been lifting since your early 20s then yeh, you can't be maxing out anymore.
But if you started late,  say in your early 30s then you should be able to lift to the max still.
Its not the age of the iron warrior.  It's how long hes been in battle for.

[Primemuscle]

It depends when one started lifting.  If you re in you're 40s and have been lifting since your early 20s then yeh, you can't be maxing out anymore.
But if you started late,  say in your early 30s then you should be able to lift to the max still.
Its not the age of the iron warrior.  It's how long hes been in battle for.

Maybe a personal max. I suspect the older you are when you start lifting the lower that max is going to be. What you are essentially saying is that weight training for strength is counterproductive. This is illogical.

[IroNat]

I still max and I'm 62.

[Soul Crusher]

Maybe a personal max. I suspect the older you are when you start lifting the lower that max is going to be. What you are essentially saying is that weight training for strength is counterproductive. This is illogical.

I used to be able to bang out reps on the bench w 315 when I was in my thirties.  Now, I rarely go over 225 , if I bench at all.   For some reason, I feel a strain in the shoulder and know if I try to get back up to 315 for reps, I'll likely rip or tear something.   Not worth it just to get a big number up there any more.   

See what I'm saying?  I'm not going to gain anything trying to max out bench but would likely get a tear or injury and not be able to train.  Just not worth it. 

I train my fng balls off almost daily, just smarter.  No crossfit bs w the kipping and oly lifts w a barbell, etc.  No dumbass movements you see all over the place.     

[Thin Lizzy]

Maybe a personal max. I suspect the older you are when you start lifting the lower that max is going to be. What you are essentially saying is that weight training for strength is counterproductive. This is illogical.

In running you have your time and then your  age-graded time. I get a minute and ten seconds per mile compared to a 30 year old.

I don’t know how it would work in lifting but I’m about 2/3 as strong as I was during peak years (25-35)