Dumbell shoulder press

[The True Adonis]

neither, go until your triceps rests against your lat

This. 

[Shockwave]

The fatso can probably do 100s for sets of 15 easily and yet has nothing to show for it.


Using the chair with the back is really pointless if you want to work shoulders.  They should toss them out of all gyms.

i dropped the backrest last shoulder workout after reading this thread, sat upright on a flat bench, and dropped the weight from the 80s i usually use to 60s.

I tried them both to parallel and below. (My parallel is actually about an inch below parallel, my elbows just barely drop below my shoulder,  and my bicep/forearm angle is just barely less than 90*). Below was bringing the weight down to just above my clavicles.

I found that dropping the backrest DID make a sig improvement isolating the delt, i felt it much more.

However, going down below did absolutley nothing but cause me pain. I actually felt like it worked the delt LESS in my case than bringing it further down towards my shoulders

[The True Adonis]

i dropped the backrest last shoulder workout after reading this thread, sat upright on a flat bench, and dropped the weight from the 80s i usually use to 60s.

I tried them both to parallel and below. (My parallel is actually about an inch below parallel, my elbows just barely drop below my shoulder,  and my bicep/forearm angle is just barely less than 90*). Below was bringing the weight down to just above my clavicles.

I found that dropping the backrest DID make a sig improvement isolating the delt, i felt it much more.

However, going down below did absolutley nothing but cause me pain. I actually felt like it worked the delt LESS in my case than bringing it further down towards my shoulders

Very good!  That back rest is nothing but a crutch, an ego booster. 

[shiftedShapes]

Very good!  That back rest is nothing but a crutch, an ego booster. 

I generally keep the back totally flush and straight against the back rest, no arching.  However, I'll give a try just sitting on a bench (that's what you're recommending right, not standing?) and report back.  It might be a while because I just did shoulders yesterday.  I hope you guys can bear the suspense.  Maybe you can start a 5 day countdown building up to it.

[The True Adonis]

I generally keep the back totally flush and straight against the back rest, no arching.  However, I'll give a try just sitting on a bench (that's what you're recommending right, not standing?) and report back.  It might be a while because I just did shoulders yesterday.  I hope you guys can bear the suspense.  Maybe you can start a 5 day countdown building up to it.

Yes!  Can`t wait.

[_aj_]

I gave up the seat for the flat bench on overhead work about a year ago. It did severely cut down on my weights.

[shiftedShapes]

Yes!  Can`t wait.

I confirm that no-back support is superior, both for the standard press where the upper arms are in line with the clavicles and the anterior delt focused variant where they are at 90 degrees to the clavicles.

Thanks for the tip!

[The True Adonis]

I confirm that no-back support is superior, both for the standard press where the upper arms are in line with the clavicles and the anterior delt focused variant where they are at 90 degrees to the clavicles.

Thanks for the tip!

No problem!  I think its about time people stop the nonsense chair backed "shoulder" press.  It really is a joke of a movement when done in that chair.

[TheGrinch]

No problem!  I think its about time people stop the nonsense chair backed "shoulder" press.  It really is a joke of a movement when done in that chair.

unless you need the backrest for support because you have a bad lower back...!!

the backrest prevents the severe arch and extreme load on the lower back!!

[The True Adonis]

unless you need the backrest for support because you have a bad lower back...!!

the backrest prevents the severe arch and extreme load on the lower back!!

I think the backrest does the opposite.  It creates the severe arch and puts loads on the lower back because of the false amount of weight that can lifted with the "shoulder" (and lower back, upper chest).

[thebrink]

Do them standing like a real man.

[liberty]

I agree with Adonis here ...sitting on  a flat bench with no backing is a totally different game .
I put one foot forward and one behind me for balance.
Pre-exhaust all three heads say 3 sets of 12 for each head and then dumb presses on a flat bench ...4 working sets.Finish with a wide upright row with a low pulley or a barbell.

[orion]

i dropped the backrest last shoulder workout after reading this thread, sat upright on a flat bench, and dropped the weight from the 80s i usually use to 60s.

I tried them both to parallel and below. (My parallel is actually about an inch below parallel, my elbows just barely drop below my shoulder,  and my bicep/forearm angle is just barely less than 90*). Below was bringing the weight down to just above my clavicles.

I found that dropping the backrest DID make a sig improvement isolating the delt, i felt it much more.

However, going down below did absolutley nothing but cause me pain. I actually felt like it worked the delt LESS in my case than bringing it further down towards my shoulders

So if you were doing say 3 set of ten with the 80's you were moving 2400 lbs.  Now you are using 60's so you are moving 1800 lbs.  Yes it's harder without the back rest but the reason why is mostly you are fighting for balance.  Remember what Platz said?  If you are lifting something heavy every muscle in your body should be tense, even your nose, having the back rest allows you to push your self into and become tense, allowing you to lift more.  It's like when you bench heavy you tighten your middle back by squeezing your shoulders together.  The time it takes to do presses with 80's or 60's is about the same, time under tension, but the heavier weight should be giving more stimulus, as long as form is good.  Once your locked into position your lower back and legs are not actually lifting the weight, how could they be, they are not moving.

If something causes pain you should avoid it always.