A US soldier in Afghanistan has shot dead 15 civilians..Nine children.

[King Shizzo]

You guys realise that there are millions of peacefull Muslims that live happily in the U.S. right?  They dress how they want, they worship how they want etc.....  Imagine an American walking down the street in the middle east with an American flag shirt on.  How long do you think he would last? 

[A Professional]

You guys realise that there are millions of peacefull Muslims that live happily in the U.S. right?  They dress how they want, they worship how they want etc.....  Imagine an American walking down the street in the middle east with an American flag shirt on.  How long do you think he would last? 

That's our culture. It says on the Statue of Liberty: "Give us your tired, poor, and hungry".

We're a melting pot.

I don't necessarily agree with it though. I don't like immigrants.

[King Shizzo]

That's our culture. It says on the Statue of Liberty: "Give us your tired, poor, and hungry".

We're a melting pot.

I don't necessarily agree with it though. I don't like immigrants.

So you admit that we are the more giving/forgiving culture, but at the same time imply that we are just as, if not more savage then radical muslims.  We are civilized, they are not.  We are Rome, they are barbarians.  Even Rome had to be ruthless when pushed.

[A Professional]

So you admit that we are the more giving/forgiving culture, but at the same time imply that we are just as, if not more savage then radical muslims.  We are civilized, they are not.  We are Rome, they are barbarians.  Even Rome had to be ruthless when pushed.

If you want to elicit the benefits of imperialism (the average American citizen is not eliciting any benefit from us being over there; gas prices keep rising. Only the elite are benefiting through the awarding of contracts to rebuild the infrastructure),
then you have to accept that 'barbarians' are going to fight back and retaliate (terrorism) any way they have to, since we have all the technology.

Also, I don't believe in killing and bombing people whether they're considered barbarians or not--they're still human.

[headhuntersix]

The Taliban that the American goverment virtually created? Oh...

Back this statement up by fact. The Pakistani ISI created the Taliban as a hedge against the Western backed Northern Alliance.

This kid shot the people will be tried under the UCMJ and will spend the rest of his life in Leavenworth.

[Jaime]

So you admit that we are the more giving/forgiving culture, but at the same time imply that we are just as, if not more savage then radical muslims.  We are civilized, they are not.  We are Rome, they are barbarians.  Even Rome had to be ruthless when pushed.

Funny that you say that.

Rome pratically invented divide and conquer tactics. Rome was built on war and destruction.

Our society is more civilized if you are lucky enough to be born in a certain area on a map, not so much if you are not.

Our society is a consequence of great independant thinkers and a push away from religion, yet we are stillpawns for banks and industry, so it's illusion.

[Jaime]

Back this statement up by fact. The Pakistani ISI created the Taliban as a hedge against the Western backed Northern Alliance.

This kid shot the people will be tried under the UCMJ and will spend the rest of his life in Leavenworth.

What followed? The Clinton administration fully supported and financed the Taliban.

[A Professional]

Funny that you say that.

Rome pratically invented divide and conquer tactics. Rome was built on war and destruction.

Our society is more civilized if you are lucky enough to be born in a certain area on a map, not so much if you are not.

Our society is a consequence of great independant thinkers and a push away from religion, yet we are stillpawns for banks and industry, so it's illusion.

All true.

[King Shizzo]

Funny that you say that.

Rome pratically invented divide and conquer tactics. Rome was built on war and destruction.
Our society is more civilized if you are lucky enough to be born in a certain area on a map, not so much if you are not.

Our society is a consequence of great independant thinkers and a push away from religion, yet we are stillpawns for banks and industry, so it's illusion.

So was America.  We are not as far removed from that era of time as people think.  The fact, is that America does show restraint.  We could "conquer" anyone we wanted, but choose not to.  Whoever brought up Pearl Harbor had a good point.  Japan had the balls to fly into America and attack us on our own soil.  They got an atomic kiss for that gesture.  These terrorists attacked us on our own soil as well.  We have shown growth and restraint as a nation compared to the Pearl Harbor days.  We could have nuked Afghanistan as well.

[King Shizzo]

I enjoy debates such as this and I do value everyones opinion on the subject. 

[Jaime]

So was America.  We are not as far removed from that era of time as people think.  The fact, is that America does show restraint.  We could "conquer" anyone we wanted, but choose not to.  Whoever brought up Pearl Harbor had a good point.  Japan had the balls to fly into America and attack us on our own soil.  They got an atomic kiss for that gesture.  These terrorists attacked us on our own soil as well.  We have shown growth and restraint as a nation compared to the Pearl Harbor days.  We could have nuked Afghanistan as well.

Conquer? By what definition? Invade country's/prop up regime's, and futher your own business interests in that region. This isn't with a view to colonising land, those days are past. America shows zero restraint in pursuit of it's own interests.

The Roosevelt administration purposfully allowed Pearl Harbor, so as to enter the war and bring on board a very reluctant populace.

I'm glad you don't find wiping out civilian city's as a result of military action against military targets too disagreeable Shiz

[King Shizzo]

Conquer? By what definition? Invade country's/prop up regime's, and futher your own business interests in that region. This isn't with a view to colonising land, those days are past. America shows zero restraint in pursuit of it's own interests.

The Roosevelt administration purposfully allowed Pearl Harbor, so as to enter the war and bring on board a very reluctant populace.
I'm glad you don't find wiping out civilian city's as a result of military action against military targets too disagreeable Shiz

It's interesting you say that, because that is some people's theory when it comes to Bush supposedly letting 911 happen to fuel his own agenda.  I also never said that the atomic bomb was the right move.  I used that example to show why I think America has grown since that time.  We "could" have nuked Afghanistan, but we didn't (wisely)  I wish no innocent civilians would ever be killed during war, but long gone are the days where two opposing armies would line up on a battlefield far away from the normal populace.

[reppingfor20]

No...

Notice you hardly ever heard about Islamic terrorism in the 20s, 30s--before we started meddling in their affairs.

That's because (and I've heard this from the Islamics themselves) it's more about politics than religion.

Terrorist are politically motivated, because we are violating their sovereignty. Propagandist want you to believe it's all foaming mindless animals.

good post

[reppingfor20]

So was America.  We are not as far removed from that era of time as people think.  The fact, is that America does show restraint.  We could "conquer" anyone we wanted, but choose not to.  Whoever brought up Pearl Harbor had a good point.  Japan had the balls to fly into America and attack us on our own soil.  They got an atomic kiss for that gesture.  These terrorists attacked us on our own soil as well.  We have shown growth and restraint as a nation compared to the Pearl Harbor days.  We could have nuked Afghanistan as well.

lol yeah like all there power plants, telephone grids and core infrastructure    Really where do you plan on dropping a nuke and not kill innocent civilians there?  The Taliban and Al Qaeda were spread out throughout the country side so to use a nuke there is hurting the environment and the US's wallet.

[Jaime]

It's interesting you say that, because that is some people's theory when it comes to Bush supposedly letting 911 happen to fuel his own agenda.  I also never said that the atomic bomb was the right move.  I used that example to show why I think America has grown since that time.  We "could" have nuked Afghanistan, but we didn't (wisely)  I wish no innocent civilians would ever be killed during war, but long gone are the days where two opposing armies would line up on a battlefield far away from the normal populace.

Ok that's cool.

Nuking Afghanistan had zero viability, that's why Afghanistan didn't get nuked. The infrastructure of the country and the Taliban isn't set up in that way.

[King Shizzo]

lol yeah like all there power plants, telephone grids and core infrastructure    Really where do you plan on dropping a nuke and not kill innocent civilians there?  The Taliban and Al Qaeda were spread out throughout the country side so to use a nuke there is hurting the environment and the US's wallet.

What I meant was that we showed good restraint by not nuking them.  Most Americans( right or wrong) were wondering if that should be an option right after 911 happened.

[Jaime]

What I meant was that we showed good restraint by not nuking them.  Most Americans( right or wrong) were wondering if that should be an option right after 911 happened.

  That's the point. What would you be nuking?

[King Shizzo]

Ok that's cool.

Nuking Afghanistan had zero viability, that's why Afghanistan didn't get nuked. The infrastructure of the country and the Taliban isn't set up in that way.

Just think of how far war has come since WW2 even.  Back then, they just used to have air raids (bombs) dropped all over the city.  They didn't care who/what was down there.  War is always horrible.

[King Shizzo]

That's the point. What would you be nuking?

A bunch of rocks......  Maybe thats why they didn't  

[headhuntersix]

What followed? The Clinton administration fully supported and financed the Taliban.

I must have missed that........as we were financing the Northern alliance at the same time.

[Jaime]

I must have missed that........as we were financing the Northern alliance at the same time.

Divide......Conquer.

Not sure how you missed that to be honest, it's very common knowledge.

[devilsmile]

all u.s military prescribed amphetamine, cocaine and lsd

[headhuntersix]

Divide......Conquer.

Not sure how you missed that to be honest, it's very common knowledge.

Oh is it......and your a foreign policy expert because...what. The Clinton admin wanted to begin talks with them but stopped because of their human rights record. We backed the Northern Alliance and would gain nothing "dividing and conquering"....in that part of the world. I guess you've never been.

[Jaime]

Oh is it......and your a foreign policy expert because...what. The Clinton admin wanted to begin talks with them but stopped because of their human rights record. We backed the Northern Alliance and would gain nothing "dividing and conquering"....in that part of the world. I guess you've never been.

I just call it how it is. Which would happen to correspond with all of the available information.

You sound invested in this and willfully ignorant.

[dr.chimps]

I'm always surprised how many Getbiggers are Field Officers. One tends to forget.