Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: 240 is Back on May 14, 2006, 09:52:07 AM
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I mean, I'm sure we all enjoyed the banter of Bob Chick's ad-libbing last night, but imagine a poor man's Chris Rock up there, making jokes about the obvious aspects of the show. Would the egos in attendance allow them to take things a little less serious?
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The emcee/radio duo of Dan & Bob were great at the show last night. Working in concert with the expeditors and production team, things flowed perfectly for most of the evening, which was good for the viewing audience.
The only real trouble spots they had were when they were expected to fill time while awaiting some results or something. That's not their area of expertise and even though dead time is something that happens at even the best-run events, it was not reasonable to expect them to be able to entertain the crowd for more than 60 seconds.
As we got near the end of the show, people just wanted to get the results so they could go home. They'd already been there for 4-1/2 hours and just wanted to see their hometown guy get his win and that big paycheck. During that lull in the action, Dan & Bob tried their best, but they had to have been tired, too, and to ask them to do something outside their talent set could not have given a good result, no matter how hard they tried.
All-in-all, for a first-time event, everything - including the judging - exceeded all expections.
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I'm thinking more of an additional draw, so people would actually look forward to the breaks. It would break up the monotony, make it more sellable (carrot top could have drawn more than 700 ppl last night).
IMO, ticket sales are a big problem. There HAS to be a few small things that can be added to get more butts in the seats so promoters stop taking a bath.
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When it comes to the marketing, your approach has to match the product offering, and the target audience. Check it:
If you're going to advertise to a mass audience (shotgun approach), you need a mass appeal offering. If you're going to be on the morning news, talk about something that they like. Add something to the show to make them want to visit. IE: "guest host" someone that housewives identify with, etc.
If you're going to advertise to a specific audience (rifle approach- my favorite!) you need to NOT spend time on the news, but spend time doing seminars at local gyms the 8 weekends before the colo pro, with athletes coming along to meet the patrons and giveaways, etc. THIS would have motivated ppl to come out. (IE: "I met darrem, nice dude. I'll be there!").
Shawn was just another guy selling something on the morning news. But in the gyms, he would have been THE man with THE SHOW OF THE YEAR!
Schedule 4 appearances a weekend- Q&A with Phil Heath and a few other guys, for the 8 weeks BEFORE the colo pro. Hit the 32 biggest gyms closest to Denver. That's 2 every sat, 2 every sunday. Meet thousands of real pro BBing fans in the denver area.
Anyway, that is my marketing advice. You never asked, but I'm sharing anyway. You went after the wrong cutomer group, Shawn. You did things right, but for the WRONG people, IMHO.
Rob
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Schedule 4 appearances a weekend- Q&A with Phil Heath and a few other guys, for the 8 weeks BEFORE the colo pro. Hit the 32 biggest gyms closest to Denver. That's 2 every sat, 2 every sunday. Meet thousands of real pro BBing fans in the denver area.
Rob
I think Shawn's partner did that tought
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I think Shawn's partner did that tought
I'm talking Shawn Ray and Phil Heath and another guy or two actually visiting the gyms, doing 30 min of Q&A, taking 30 min of pictures, and getting out of there. hand out some free vyo stuff too, why not.
THAT WORKS! Having Jeff Taylor or Lift hang up some signs and chat a bit with the gym owners DOES NOT.
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Thanks for your Expert Opinion, I'll take note.
Next time, try and be PRESENT to witness the event and offer a resourceful Opinion.
Out.
S. Ray
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Very True.
I am looking foward to the montreal pro show here in quebec. I think the promotor is doing a poor job.
not a frickin poster in the gyms, nothing. If I did read it myself on the internet, I wouldn't even know there was a montreal pro show this year.
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Thanks for your Expert Opinion, I'll take note.
Next time, try and be PRESENT to witness the event and offer a resourceful Opinion.
Out.
S. Ray
... not only did he sign it... but he turned off his radio...
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I would like to hear your opinion about your first experience as a promotor. Were you satisfied ? I would also like you to comment on the placing. Personnally, I think they were spot on but some guys here are calling bullshit.
speak on this Shawn !
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Thanks for your Expert Opinion, I'll take note.
Next time, try and be PRESENT to witness the event and offer a resourceful Opinion.
Out.
S. Ray
Shawn, traveling to Denver was not feasible for me. Hold it in Tampa and I'll be passing out flyers for you!
Seriously though, do you think that 8 weeks of seminars in local gyms- meeting and taking pics with BBing fans and talking with them about the upcoming show- is a BAD IDEA?
Holy crap... 32 gyms' worth of BBing fans who could meet you, learn about the show and the athletes, and really make an EMOTIONAL connection with the athletes involved.
Shawn, marketing isn't about numbers- it's about MOTIVATION! you have to motivate ppl to WANT to attend. Just telling them about the show isn't enough. If you met 6000 people at local gyms (200 per gym for 30 appearances), at least half of them would show up, and probably bring a friend or two! They'd all be local, all KNOW you in person instead of from magazines.
If I'm wrong, someone tell me. But IMO, next year, this will get your numbers up. Hit the ground, meet the people, and they'll vote by buying tickets and returning your thoughtful visit with one of their own- to your show!
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Plus, VYO would pick up some new friends too! Those free samples you hand out at the hour-long visits would result in those kids asking their gym owners to STOCK UP ON VYO products!
See how this just grows, shawn? You go with shawn and 1-2 other guys. Everyone loves you, asks how the diet is going, snap some pics, etc. Hell, SELL TICKETS WHILE YOU'RE THERE!!!
I am just grinning right now. I can't believe you don't believe grassroots handshaking with your EXACT target market would return results. Unreal :)
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It's going to be hard to get through, but Denver was a horrible choice for a venue. He did not think this one out. He made three (at the least) major mistakes. 1) putting the show on in Denver. 2) doing it on a holiday weekend. 3) doing it at a venue just to big for the size of the event.
I want to know did any of the people he went and did interviews with come to the show. Like the radio and tv people.
And what did it say in todays paper. ANyone?
I was wondering did Sean appear in the Vyotech booth.
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Did anyone else notice that Sean`s coat didn`t fit him at all.
A suit jacket should be tailored such that when you curl your hands with your arms in a straight position, the fabric should hit the palm nicely.
Also, It was pretty bad when you had to have random dudes come up there and tell shitty jokes during lulls. They could at least have cut to the screen and showed some highlights from Arnold posing back in the day or something. hahahah
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This is better then my Sunday comics. The same four cartoon characters in here commenting on the show, none of which were in attendance. Thanks for the laughs. ;D
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This is better then my Sunday comics. The same four cartoon characters in here commenting on the show, none of which were in attendance. Thanks for the laughs. ;D
I'm glad you can laugh at 700 tickets sold.
Lift, are you saying that holding quick meet & greets with shawn and a pro or two in Denver area gyms would be bad for attendance?
You can't sell a NEGATIVE number tickets. So it's a little strange to crap on my idea after your way got a whopping 700 in the door.
If you want to argue why you chose a mass market approach to advertise a NICHE product offering, I'm all ears. It didn't make good business sense.
I'm glad you're laughing though, Isaac!
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Dooooooooooooooooooo! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
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The DVD is coming soon...........Stay tuned to: www.coloradoproshow.com
I had a Blast! 8)
I'd like to thank the Academy, as well as the Sponsors and Athletes butmost of all I'd like to thanks the FANS!
All 3 of them! You guys are the reason I will be pulling out all the stops for the next 2 years as we signed on the dotted line last night! :o
1st Weekend of June 2007!
My review will be detailed in Flex Magazine, Muscular Development and on my web site: www.shawnray.com
Peace,
S. Ray
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AIDA. She is the woman all marketers love.
Attention, Interest, Desire, Action.
Shawn went on the news and got their attention. maybe even their interest. but it's hard to elicit desire, and especially action, from a TV set the week of the show.
Suppose shawn, phil, and another pro or two had spent time in teh gym, shaking hands and trading words with local fans. BBers. PLers. Old and young. Wide audience with BBing/weightlifting in common.
He's there, he has their ATTENTION. That's the A.
INTEREST? Hell yes. There's several pro Bbers in your gym, that's rare! Of course they'll be interested.
DESIRE- once they meet shawn and phil heath and other guys, they WANT to see this show that these two big guys are so excited about.
ACTION- hey, whattya know... Lift is at the gym selling tickets. Wow, free VYO supp giveaway when you buy a ticket. hell, I'll take two tickets. I'll find someone to bring along. Or, I'll buy 3 and take my roomates. We like the city.
See? Isaac, I know you like to shit on my marketing sense, but I can't see how my logic is flawed here. You guys would have sold a ton of tickets by going to gyms, doing 30 Q&A and 30 min of pictures. Seriously.
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This is better then my Sunday comics. The same four cartoon characters in here commenting on the show, none of which were in attendance. Thanks for the laughs. ;D
I saw it on Webcast. Isn't that why you put it up there. Isn't that the whole reason for dong a webscast is so people who can't make it can watch it and experince the excitement. Oh I did experince the exctiement it was awesome. I was on the edge of my seat. How could anyone hear there music it was so loud from everyone yelling. I swear you guys had the best security. I mean to hold all those people away from storming the stage. It was awesome. I was defintiely the best BB show I have ever seen on webcast (actually the only one). How did you guys pull off this monumentous show. DId Jim Lorimar call you to see if you are available to help with his show so he can get more people in. Is it true they had to close all downtown traffic because of how many people were outside wating to get into the show. And it is true you made Ali and former President Clinton wait in line outside.
Man, I missed a great show. Maybe next year? DOUBT IT!
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I'm glad you can laugh at 700 tickets sold.
Lift, are you saying that holding quick meet & greets with shawn and a pro or two in Denver area gyms would be bad for attendance?
You can't sell a NEGATIVE number tickets. So it's a little strange to crap on my idea after your way got a whopping 700 in the door.
If you want to argue why you ch ::)ose a mass market approach to advertise a NICHE product offering, I'm all ears. It didn't make good business sense.
I'm glad you're laughing though, Isaac!
Not laughing at your ideas, never discredited them and some of your ideas hold merit. I am laughing at the Sunday morning quarterbacking that is taking place here. Who'd a thunk? ::)
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Whats funny is all the shit Sean and Issac said about my show and me being a failure and for me to sit back and watch how its supposed to be done. It ended up EXACTLY like I said. IN fact worse. I had more people attend my show and I live on a fricking island. I bet I had more people fly in to see my show than yours too.
So, now that you are in my boat, I hand over the wheel and now you can continue to fuck things up more. Sean now you can only call me fat since we are both losing promoters in your eyes.
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suddenly a critique becomes sunday morning quaterbacking. it's called education, son.
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Not laughing at your ideas, never discredited them and some of your ideas hold merit. I laughing at the Sunday morning quarterbacking that is taking place here. Who'd a thunk? ::)
I respect you, Lift. I didn't want to piss in your cheerios, and I certainly didn't want to tell you how to do your marketing job. As some of my income comes from BBing field, and since I'm a fan, I want to see these shows do well.
The Sunday morning QB, that'll always happen. That's what getbig is, people throwng out ideas, and then saying good or bad things about those ideas.
For real tho- get with me next time, guys. Sure, I am a prick on the message boards, but in real life, I do get results. Continually being antagonistic and agenda-analyzing is bad for making friends online, but great for finding and capitalizing upon opportunities in real life. Good effort though guys, I did respect what you, jeff, and shawn did. you did work your asses off.
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suddenly a critique becomes sunday morning quaterbacking. it's called education, son.
Thanks bigdump, glad you contributed to helping me get my learn on.
Will we do everything exactly the same next year? Of course not. Is the gym idea good? Yes. I'm confident in my marketing abilities teamed up with Shawn, Jeff and Vyotech that it will continue to grow.
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240, your idea of having the Pros doing interviews and guest seminars on the weekends sounds good on paper, but what makes you think they'd do it? For peanuts, none the less?...these guys are prepping for a show, the LAST thing they wanna do is answer regular joe's questions about steroids and crap while they're busy dieting and training.
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IMO, it comes down to the mindset of the buyer. It is not easy to buy tickets, even online. If I happened to be at the gym and there were pro BBers there selling them, I'd be quite inclined to whip out my check card and buy a few (be sure to have wireless EFT capability that day also!)
It's hard to see the show on tv or on the radio while driving to work, then remember the website, look up info, order tickets, pick up tickets, then go to the show. BUT if all they have to do is shake hands with Phil Heath, then hand LIFT their credit card or cash while Phil talks with them about his diet, you will sell a hell of a lot of tickets.
AIDA, the right audience, and ease of buying. The 240 forumla ;)
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For a first time show, it was excellent. I think we can all agree it was better than the debacles of the Masters and Olympia :D
That was part of the marketing for next year. A decently run show attracts competitors, which attracts ticket buying fans. The NPC portion will have much greater numbers next year, as amateurs will want to compete in a well run show. Each amatuer brings a few ticket buying fans. I pretty much guarantee that the amateur numbers will be spiked significantly next year, especially the figure. I would also not be surprised to see more/'bigger' names in the pros as well.
The quality show also has the added plus that more 'general' people will plan to attend next year. I'm pretty sure I'll drag myself there. Like how on the opposite end of the spectrum, the last Olympia I attended was such a freakin mess that I have zero plans of going back.
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240, your idea of having the Pros doing interviews and guest seminars on the weekends sounds good on paper, but what makes you think they'd do it? For peanuts, none the less?...these guys are prepping for a show, the LAST thing they wanna do is answer regular joe's questions about steroids and crap while they're busy dieting and training.
Make it an invitational. In order to do the show, you have to do at least two guest appearances in the weeks before the show. use top NPC guys too! Shawn alone could draw decent numbers, but throw in a competitor or two, and it'd be packed. Drop the hummer and up the prize $. I don't care if only 8 guys end up doing the show. Eight good physiqes that the fans KNOW sure beats 30 guys, 25 of which we can't name. :(
Hell, why not have Phil heath do every appearance? He is the reigning champ. He has to re-sign with VYO this year. Shawn, write that into his contract! Two appearances a week, in the denver area, every saturday for those 8 weeks. It's take maybe 3-4 hours out of his day. And his own value would go up too.
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Hell, why not have Phil heath do every appearance? He is the reigning champ. He has to re-sign with VYO this year. Shawn, write that into his contract! Two appearances a week, in the denver area, every saturday for those 8 weeks. It's take maybe 3-4 hours out of his day. And his own value would go up too.
LOL! You are too funny bro. Phil isn't signed with any supplement company and hasn't signed a contract with Vyo-tech or any other supp. company.
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i won't give any advice here, i just know that gnc's (when i used to go to them) would have big posters of whatever that show was in chicago.
i think putting an ad up at a gnc/vitamin shoppe would be better than at a gym. because here you have a dude who knows a little more about bbing than your average guy on the stepper.
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i won't give any advice here, i just know that gnc's (when i used to go to them) would have big posters of whatever that show was in chicago.
i think putting an ad up at a gnc/vitamin shoppe would be better than at a gym. because here you have a dude who knows a little more about bbing than your average guy on the stepper.
There were posters in supplement stores all over Denver and surrounding areas - Vitamin Shoppe, GNC, etc.
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Here's an idea, have a show with some TOP GUYS signed on to do it!!! When the biggest name in the show is a guy who cant even crack the top 10 at the Mr O (Darrem), it doesnt really speak volumes for the quality of competition...
Let's not forget some of the other "big name" guys like Ahmed Haider pulled out at the last minute and a crap 3rd tier bodybuilder filled with synthol is able to crack the top 10 (Arntz) LOL...
I think 240's idea of marketing in the gym makes the MOST sense... I hate to break it to ya shawn, but no body outside of the hardcore gym crowd have any idea who you are!! You are not Arnold bro...
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Thanks. Shawn did well, but the mission plan was flawed. Surgery was a success, but the patient died.
When it comes to the marketing, your approach has to match the product offering, and the target audience. Check it:
If you're going to advertise to a mass audience (shotgun approach), you need a mass appeal offering. If you're going to be on the morning news, talk about something that they like. Add something to the show to make them want to visit. IE: "guest host" someone that housewives identify with, etc.
If you're going to advertise to a specific audience (rifle approach- my favorite!) you need to NOT spend time on the news, but spend time doing seminars at local gyms the 8 weekends before the colo pro, with athletes coming along to meet the patrons and giveaways, etc. THIS would have motivated ppl to come out. (IE: "I met darrem, nice dude. I'll be there!").
Shawn was just another guy selling something on the morning news. But in the gyms, he would have been THE man with THE SHOW OF THE YEAR!
Schedule 4 appearances a weekend- Q&A with Phil Heath and a few other guys, for the 8 weeks BEFORE the colo pro. Hit the 32 biggest gyms closest to Denver. That's 2 every sat, 2 every sunday. Meet thousands of real pro BBing fans in the denver area.
Anyway, that is my marketing advice. You never asked, but I'm sharing anyway. You went after the wrong cutomer group, Shawn. You did things right, but for the WRONG people, IMHO.
Rob
Wow, marketing advise from an MBA . . . 240 you have an MBA from Gulf Coast University, was it an attended study program, or did you go the online route?
Also, now that you have finished your MBA ( assuming you have ) you should update your site to reflect that.
Keep the great advise coming.
The Beef
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why not move it to mexico city. they have great restaurants, great shopping, the internet, the dollar is strong there, same timezones and they have 12,000,000 people
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It's going to be hard to get through Seans thick skull, but Denver was a horrible choice for a venue. He did not think this one out. He made three (at the least) major mistakes. 1) putting the show on in Denver. 2) doing it on a holiday weekend. 3) doing it at a venue just to big for the size of the event.
Denver is an *awesome* city and had the best weather of any show you will see all year in the IFBB.
Mother's Day weekend did present an obstacle or two, but didn't dramatically hurt attendance.
The venue is gorgeous and perfectly suitable for an event of this stature. We're talking about the #3 event on the pro league calendar (in terms of prize money) and one for which there is only upside.
When the GNC show bombed in 2002, everyone said, "Oh, it was really bad, but it was just their first year - they'll get better", but at the Colorado Pro, NO ONE WHO WAS PRESENT had a bad time. Those of us who paid to attend had a great time and I guarantee many of us will return to support this event in 2007.
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Awesome, maybe next year I'll fly to denver to see the show :)
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Wow, marketing advise from an MBA . . . 240 you have an MBA from Gulf Coast University, was it an attended study program, or did you go the online route?
Also, now that you have finished your MBA ( assuming you have ) you should update your site to reflect that.
Yeah, I need to remodel my own site. Every time I get a spare minute, I have an idea I want to grow. I usually have a week or two line to start websites, so I don't stress it too much.
I finished the MBA in dec from FGCU. It's an accredeted state university, http://www.fgcu.edu/cob/accreditation/
I took 3 of the classes online, and the other 15 in the classroom. Making money in the real world is WAY easier than finishing the MBA was. Those Finance and operations mgmt courses were tough. If you got 3 C's, you were withdrawn from the school automatically. Tough. A good 1/5 of the MBA's didn't finish thanks to this rule.
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The DVD is coming soon...........Stay tuned to: www.coloradoproshow.com
I had a Blast! 8)
I'd like to thank the Academy, as well as the Sponsors and Athletes butmost of all I'd like to thanks the FANS!
All 3 of them! You guys are the reason I will be pulling out all the stops for the next 2 years as we signed on the dotted line last night! :o
1st Weekend of June 2007!
My review will be detailed in Flex Magazine, Muscular Development and on my web site: www.shawnray.com
Peace,
S. Ray
I still don't get why so many people hate on you Shawn (namely onlyme and 240) I think you're doing an awesome thing, it's very classy that you're giving back to the bodybuilding community you came out of, without this show a lot of up and coming bodybuidlers would have been screwed since the IFBB cut back on shows recently, props.
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Shawn - I want a free ticket in the 2nd row for next year, bro.
The seat I paid for was too far back this time. ;D
Great event, bro - you and your team deserve all the props in the world. To put it in perspective, I'd rather pay the money to fly here for this show again than to drive 60 miles to Pasadena for the FitExpo and Ironman.
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I still don't get why so many people hate on you Shawn (namely onlyme and 240)
Damn, equo... I toss around ideas and engage in discussions... but I respect Lift, Jeff, and especially Shawn for working their asses off for this show. Seriously. I am not blindly criticizing. I am tossing out ideas for how it can improve next time. I have (albeit a rocky one!) a relationship with Lift and Shawn that could presumably open door some day, who knows. I could have a booth at the expo next year, who knows... I want them to succeed, and any ideas I toss out there for discussion are only to make next year's recipe for success a better one.
I don't worry about tact and being buddy buddy- there are a million people out there who specialize in that! Results are what matter.
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Who did you have in mind exactly?
Larry the Cable Guy?
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u cold get sarcasm onstage with some monster triceps gags, followed by the rest of the
fags squad
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Yes great show Sean ;) You are the best ::) As you and Issac posted sometime ago, hopefully all promoters will model themselves after you ::) ::) ::) If they did the PDI will be successful that much faster. Anyway, just because you booked the show for the next two years does NOT guarantee youare doing the show. Don't start pulling everyones chain already for next years show. You are sounding like Kamali fans do before every show on how great he looks then comes in looking like crap. The Charolette Pro too was booked for the next 2 or 3 years. And look at where it is. And Mike used his own money for most of it. The thing you can at least be proud of is that you did the show. You said you were going to do it and you did it. Of course what you told people was allot different than what actually happened but at least you did something. So now you can wallow in all the glory that you finally did a show.
Also, how can you say you sold more tickets than an established show in LA, New York or San Fan can. Anyway, hope you are doing good you are the best and a living IFBB legend. You Da Man! ::) ::) ::)
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Yes great show Sean ;) You are the best ::) As you and Issac posted sometime ago, hopefully all promoters will model themselves after you ::) ::) ::) If they did the PDI will be successful that much faster. Anyway, just because you booked the show for the next two years does NOT guarantee youare doing the show. Don't start pulling everyones chain already for next years show. You are sounding like Kamali fans do before every show on how great he looks then comes in looking like crap. The Charolette Pro too was booked for the next 2 or 3 years. And look at where it is. And Mike used his own money for most of it. The thing you can at least be proud of is that you did the show. You said you were going to do it and you did it. Of course what you told people was allot different than what actually happened but at least you did something. So now you can wallow in all the glory that you finally did a show.
Also, how can you say you sold more tickets than an established show in LA, New York or San Fan can. Anyway, hope you are doing good you are the best and a living IFBB legend. You Da Man! ::) ::) ::)
your life must be really shit ::)
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::)
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I bet that would lighten things up, would end those awkward pauses, and would increase attendance.
I mean, I'm sure we all enjoyed the uncomfortable banter of Bob Chick's ad-libbing last night, but imagine a poor man's Chris Rock up there, making jokes about the obvious aspects of the show. Would the egos in attendance allow them to take things a little less serious?
Why don't you wait until you've gone to some shows before spouting off. Nobody want to sit for that long. Between shows its time to give your ass a rest I don't care if Seinfeld sp? is there. My ass is out of the seat. If you don't know, just STFU already...
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240 gotta go against you on this. I was thinkning about having a semi-top name comedian come in and be my entertainment for my show. The cheapest I found was Carlos Mencia at $10,000 plus expenses. Howie Mandel is over $20,000. The Amazing Jonathan was $15,000. The Regurgetator was $10,000. I wanted to bring in those two brothers from Vegas who do the balancing act and are really built. They are very expensive too, $10,000 apiece. Plus expenses for all. You need to find the most popular local person who the local audience just loves and have them be the emcee. It may cost a few grand but you save in travel expenses. He can emcee and during any down time entertain. Quick witted and fast talking guys are the best.
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240 gotta go against you on this. I was thinkning about having a semi-top name comedian come in and be my entertainment for my show. The cheapest I found was Carlos Mencia at $10,000 plus expenses. Howie Mandel is over $20,000. The Amazing Jonathan was $15,000. The Regurgetator was $10,000. I wanted to bring in those two brothers from Vegas who do the balancing act and are really built. They are very expensive too, $10,000 apiece. Plus expenses for all. You need to find the most popular local person who the local audience just loves and have them be the emcee. It may cost a few grand but you save in travel expenses. He can emcee and during any down time entertain. Quick witted and fast talking guys are the best.
barter barter barter!! You make it worth somebody's while in terms of free advertising and other things that $ just can't buy ;)
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barter barter barter!! You make it worth somebody's while in terms of free advertising and other things that $ just can't buy ;)
240 wrong again. Dude you are making me do this when I like supporting you. No one but no one knows how to barter better than me. You do not barter with these guys. Money is what talks. These guys get publicity everywhere. They EXPECT it and at times get it without wanting it. What can you give to someone like Chris Rock, Howie Mandel, etc that they don't have already. You are talking about a BB show. Something none of these people would ever think twice about going to in the first place and especially be a part of. Bartering works allot of times. But when you tlking to people who have just about eveyrthing, unless they are in a charity mood it won't happen. Trust me I know. I knwo allot of people and called alot of them. And as much as they wished me good luck and hope I kick ass I couldn't get them here.
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i thought women's bodybuilding was the comic relief at these shows?
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ok before we bring on the challenge round, i want to say i saw less oil being mined by exxon then was just onstage...ha ha ha ....really folks can you say synthol...ha ha ha..don't forget to tip your waiters and waiteress, try the veal i will be here all night.
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YOu knwo what is cool to do is what I did at my second show and show Ronnie Coleman tapes on the big screens. I had two 11' video screens on the sides of the stage. During intermission or whenever we played Coleman tapes. Everyone just sat there sand stared at the screen. You could see peoples eyes popping out and mouths drop when they saw Ronnie 11' tall
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240, you seem to not realize the utter homosexuality of a bodybuilding show.
700,1200, 2000 whatever the turnout was is amazing for that type of show.
i think it's some kind of a mental issue if you want to go see an oiled up man on stage.
i think the reason the arnold's a success is:
a. brand name (arnold schwarzenegger vs. shawn ray...hmmm, no offense to shawn)
b. sponsors, giveaways, booths, hot chicks (hell, i'd go for the chicks)
c. longevity (everyone knows when/where it is, and i'm sure it gets bigger every year because they have an mma, strongman, arm wrestling, etc. contest, not solely oiled up men)
shawn's not retarded. he sees where he made mistakes (if any that he could've controlled), and im' sure the quality of the show's gonna improve with each year. he has 2 more chances to make it work.
johnny cash once said:
"have you ever heard a man say
if i had his money
i'd do things my way".
the point is shawn put together a show that got people from other countries to compete in, and he got someone else to pay for it all.
could you say you could pull of the same? see how many supp companies you call and ask for 30k for a weekend , and actually get it.
oh, and just to prove this isn't an ass lick fest.
shawn has sex with trannies.
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First off, I sure wouldn't try to fill an auditorium. I'd go for the personality, matchups, and action the fans would like to see. No more details though... if it happens, it'll be interesting...
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I think if you could get the audiances participation between setions such as egg the fool it would be more interesting. 240 I vote you as the first to go onstage.
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You could hear Bob and Dan discussing certain things away from the mic. Not able to make it out, lot of mumbling, but you could hear it and it was annoying. A comedian is in desperate need at bodybuilding shows. Maybe a Bernie Mac or Steve Harvey, or anyone. He would need a co-host or someone that knows much about the sport. Hell there are a lot of comedians out there!
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I'm thinking of something with a lot less overhead and far more fan involvement via web. I'm not trying to put some union guys' kids thru college.
remember there are only two ways to increase profit
1) reduce costs, or
2) increase output.
I think promoters should find ways to do both. I have a few ideas for something, I don't know if it's something I'll do or something I'll sell for someone else to do... but I have something in mind...
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Denver is an *awesome* city and had the best weather of any show you will see all year in the IFBB.
Mother's Day weekend did present an obstacle or two, but didn't dramatically hurt attendance.
The venue is gorgeous and perfectly suitable for an event of this stature. We're talking about the #3 event on the pro league calendar (in terms of prize money) and one for which there is only upside.
When the GNC show bombed in 2002, everyone said, "Oh, it was really bad, but it was just their first year - they'll get better", but at the Colorado Pro, NO ONE WHO WAS PRESENT had a bad time. Those of us who paid to attend had a great time and I guarantee many of us will return to support this event in 2007.
I'm sorry Tre but it will be hard to convince me and other major sponsors that Denver is a good location. There is nothing around it. As much promo, advertising and marketing you did around Denver and outside of it the show was visited by 80% less people than it would take to make it attractive enough to be a big show. Sorry but Denver is a bad place to do a BB show. Like I said it might be the 5th fittest city in the country but I think that played against you. Cause the fittest people are the ones who care about there bodies and exercise regualry. They do not go to a gym and throw barbells around and they are certainly 100% against steroids.
The city of Denver has almost 4 times the number of residents as all of Hawaii combined and 5 times that of Oahu, yet I had more people at my show. Sure Denver has big time sports but that might also be a bad mark against doing a show there. I mean who did the Business Plan for this show or was there one done. I mean did anyone do any type of research on this. The demographics or anything. Hawaii has 160 health clubs, gyms, and spas. How many does Denver have. Hawaii has NO professional sports here. Having a show in an area that has so many professional sports and other activitis can work against you. There may be just to much to do there and BB is not that appealing to go to. It might have been bigger if he put on a Dart tournament.
In any case, Denver will never be a major BB location. Travel expenses alone for most major companies who support BB is just too much to add to their plate of BB shows to support. And a big thing is that Sean doesn't even live in Denver. He has to spend sponsorship money to get there. I don't knwo why any sponsor would give him money to travel back and forth. How can you secure any kind of major local sponsor and not live there.
You want some advice. YOU NEED TO GET LOCAL MAJOR SPONSORSHIPS. Not vitamin companies but banks, car dealerships, real estate companies, untiltiy companies, a drink distributor. As much as Sean tried to convince everyone he knows how to promote, he was way off. Putting on a show and hiring people to do it in one thing, but raising the money and getting local involvement is the thing that will make or break your show. Local involvement is and should be your #1 concern. Sorry but this show will be short lived without it.
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It's not hard to find ways to entertain the crowds. I just don't think there are enough promoters who really think about it that much. They are satisfied with the way things are because they have always been that way. Having musicians play would be hardly as entertaining as a decent comedian who will keep people awake and in there seats. The Oscars, the Golden Globes, the Grammy's, these shows all would be flops if comedians weren't there as hosts.
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Thanks. Shawn did well, but the mission plan was flawed. Surgery was a success, but the patient died.
When it comes to the marketing, your approach has to match the product offering, and the target audience. Check it:
If you're going to advertise to a mass audience (shotgun approach), you need a mass appeal offering. If you're going to be on the morning news, talk about something that they like. Add something to the show to make them want to visit. IE: "guest host" someone that housewives identify with, etc.
If you're going to advertise to a specific audience (rifle approach- my favorite!) you need to NOT spend time on the news, but spend time doing seminars at local gyms the 8 weekends before the colo pro, with athletes coming along to meet the patrons and giveaways, etc. THIS would have motivated ppl to come out. (IE: "I met darrem, nice dude. I'll be there!").
Shawn was just another guy selling something on the morning news. But in the gyms, he would have been THE man with THE SHOW OF THE YEAR!
Schedule 4 appearances a weekend- Q&A with Phil Heath and a few other guys, for the 8 weeks BEFORE the colo pro. Hit the 32 biggest gyms closest to Denver. That's 2 every sat, 2 every sunday. Meet thousands of real pro BBing fans in the denver area.
Anyway, that is my marketing advice. You never asked, but I'm sharing anyway. You went after the wrong cutomer group, Shawn. You did things right, but for the WRONG people, IMHO.
Rob
Though I like your thinking and very much agree with it, the costs of these things are gonna fall on who? The promoter. The promoter would have to gamble too big and most promoters won't do that.
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Though I like your thinking and very much agree with it, the costs of these things are gonna fall on who? The promoter. The promoter would have to gamble too big and most promoters won't do that.
VYO would shell out the supplements. Give the athletes a stipend for showing up. I am sure $200 a day would suffice for Phil Heath to do 2-3 appearances for an hour shaking hands. Put it all under marketing costs. The fact is, with a niche product like this (tickets to a BBing show), blind mailings and another ad in a sea of ads just don't work.
You have to put some boots in the dirt. Travel to gyms. Talk to people. Ask them on the stop if they'll be attending the show, then offer to sell them a ticket and get some free supps with it. Who isn't going to be inspired by meeting Phil heath/similar pro in person?
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VYO would shell out the supplements. Give the athletes a stipend for showing up. I am sure $200 a day would suffice for Phil Heath to do 2-3 appearances for an hour shaking hands. Put it all under marketing costs. The fact is, with a niche product like this (tickets to a BBing show), blind mailings and another ad in a sea of ads just don't work.
You have to put some boots in the dirt. Travel to gyms. Talk to people. Ask them on the stop if they'll be attending the show, then offer to sell them a ticket and get some free supps with it. Who isn't going to be inspired by meeting Phil heath/similar pro in person?
You sure you have a degree in business?
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You sure you have a degree in business?
I'm about as sure of that, as I am for the fact you have a major hard-on for me.
Please tell us weedy, what would you do to increase attendance?
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I'm about as sure of that, as I am for the fact you have a major hard-on for me.
Please tell us weedy, what would you do to increase attendance?
Here's your first business tip, don't give your assets away (this includes information). I can't believe you let out a secret like 'putting boots to the dirt'. Somebody make sure Microsoft isn't watching this board. 240 might have just made them another billion. Seriosuly though, when do you 'put your boots to the dirt'? You sit at a computer all day (and probably eat Tostino's cereal all day long, and I would guess that you don't shower every day), when do you leave your room?
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Denver is an *awesome* city and had the best weather of any show you will see all year in the IFBB.
Mother's Day weekend did present an obstacle or two, but didn't dramatically hurt attendance.
The venue is gorgeous and perfectly suitable for an event of this stature. We're talking about the #3 event on the pro league calendar (in terms of prize money) and one for which there is only upside.
When the GNC show bombed in 2002, everyone said, "Oh, it was really bad, but it was just their first year - they'll get better", but at the Colorado Pro, NO ONE WHO WAS PRESENT had a bad time. Those of us who paid to attend had a great time and I guarantee many of us will return to support this event in 2007.
Let's be real people are experiencing soem real Schadenfraude right now because they were happy to see Shawn "fail".
I'm no Shawn fan myself...not in the least. But at least he's trying to do something unlike most of the people on the board who are such know it alls about what he should have done...and have probably never promoted a show in their life.
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Here's your first business tip, don't give your assets away (this includes information). I can't believe you let out a secret like 'putting boots to the dirt'. Somebody make sure Microsoft isn't watching this board. 240 might have just made them another billion. Seriosuly though, when do you 'put your boots to the dirt'? You sit at a computer all day (and probably eat Tostino's cereal all day long, and I would guess that you don't shower every day), when do you leave your room?
I can't leave my room. I'll be arrested for welfare fraud, silly.
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I can't leave my room. I'll be arrested for welfare fraud, silly.
Answer the question McFly: When do you put your boots to the dirt?
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Answer the question McFly: When do you put your boots to the dirt?
LOL @ Mcfly...
Dude, once a week I travel to local businesses, dropping off brochures and talking to local business owners in different segments of town. I might sell them a website, I might find a barter deal, I might just keep on kicking rocks.
Also twice a week I do my contract work, where I stop in to make sure staff and facilities at my *other* position are still running things smoothly.
Rest of the time, I work from home. Is that really so bad? ;)
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LOL @ Mcfly...
Dude, once a week I travel to local businesses, dropping off brochures and talking to local business owners in different segments of town. I might sell them a website, I might find a barter deal, I might just keep on kicking rocks.
Also twice a week I do my contract work, where I stop in to make sure staff and facilities at my *other* position are still running things smoothly.
Rest of the time, I work from home. Is that really so bad? ;)
Explain (all of it).
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Explain (all of it).
Why?
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Why?
You market yourself once a week to complete strangers, but you can't type up what you do right now?
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Comedian is a pure waste of money.
People come to a bodybuilding show to see bodybuilders. You can't increase attendance if everyone is already there at the show to watch. Not only that, generally comedians eventually end up making bodybuilding jokes and ends up making the show cheesy.
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You market yourself once a week to complete strangers, but you can't type up what you do right now?
Well, some are referrals but many are just walk-ins. Often I'm out doing errands and I strike up conversations with local business owners about trends, competitors, and websites/marketing materials. Most of these companies pay outrageous prices for ad or graphic work. I somethimes throw that in, or give them a good discount, to produce branded ads, cards, flyers, etc to match the branded look of their website.
It's not like I put on a tie and go cold-sell. I talk about the day, then business, then leave a flyer. Easily 1/4 will talk shop then, and at least 1/3 will eventually purchase my services. Some will put me on the spot and ask me to look at their site immediately, and I will throw some ideas at them. We might set up lunch (IHOP is my favorite- wide menu, fairly cheap, and big tables, good for the laptop). It's fun, and just about everyone is looking for an advantage. In person, I exhibit the same knowledge and quickness that I do here, without the whole '240 is a prick' thing :)
I manage the network needs, website, and user training for a local firm also. I stop in 2ce a week and just run thru things, restart a server or load some software if needed, and just make sure things are good. I also pick up a check ;) They have nothing to worry about on the network, ever, and I just make sure they're able to do what they need to do, to stay online and efficient!
And, the rest of the week, I'm in this recliner working on sites. I post and read a bit, I work for a bit. Make a few calls. Hang out with my woman for a few hours every day also- one of the great things about working from home. I also take a break to hit the gym most days, and I take naps when I'm sleep, eat when I'm hungry, and play with my kittens when I get bored with the computer. That's about it. Now tell us about you, weed.
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Well, some are referrals but many are just walk-ins. Often I'm out doing errands and I strike up conversations with local business owners about trends, competitors, and websites/marketing materials. Most of these companies pay outrageous prices for ad or graphic work. I somethimes throw that in, or give them a good discount, to produce branded ads, cards, flyers, etc to match the branded look of their website.
It's not like I put on a tie and go cold-sell. I talk about the day, then business, then leave a flyer. Easily 1/4 will talk shop then, and at least 1/3 will eventually purchase my services. Some will put me on the spot and ask me to look at their site immediately, and I will throw some ideas at them. We might set up lunch (IHOP is my favorite- wide menu, fairly cheap, and big tables, good for the laptop). It's fun, and just about everyone is looking for an advantage. In person, I exhibit the same knowledge and quickness that I do here, without the whole '240 is a prick' thing :)
I manage the network needs, website, and user training for a local firm also. I stop in 2ce a week and just run thru things, restart a server or load some software if needed, and just make sure things are good. I also pick up a check ;) They have nothing to worry about on the network, ever, and I just make sure they're able to do what they need to do, to stay online and efficient!
And, the rest of the week, I'm in this recliner working on sites. I post and read a bit, I work for a bit. Make a few calls. Hang out with my woman for a few hours every day also- one of the great things about working from home. I also take a break to hit the gym most days, and I take naps when I'm sleep, eat when I'm hungry, and play with my kittens when I get bored with the computer. That's about it. Now tell us about you, weed.
If you told the truth, I'd probably say what I do................but... ........................ ................you're online statistics at getbig seem to tell a different story from your post.
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I hear Mickey Rooney is looking for work.
On a serious note-
It's pretty simple. The general public gets interested in
sporting events that involve athletic feats acted out. Standing around
posing or flexing is only going to interest a certain subculture.
Bodybuilding fans can appreciate the preparation and training that go
into preparing for shows, but a lot of the general population feel
repulsed by serious bodybuilders. To attract more people you've got
to provide better entertainment. This is why people will tune into
poker and not bodybuilding. They feel the players control the cards
so to speak. Who wants to watch a show that is going to be dictated
by politics, personal favs, and buttkissing?
Why not combine serious bodybuilding shows with something like the UFC.
Move the figure, fitness, and God knows what else out of Pro bodybuilding and
let them sponsor their own contests to people truly interested. Most pro bodybuilding
fans don't want to sit thru 5 hours of ballerina jumping to get to the main event.
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If you told the truth, I'd probably say what I do...but.......you're online statistics at getbig seem to tell a different story from your post.
Sure, I'm on getbig a lot. There are a lot of opportunities here! And it's interesting conversation. I learn a lot about not only the BBing industry, but also diverse views of many. Seriously, if you're not just goofing off, you can learn a ton about people here. It's interesting- almost like a little colony of people that are remarkably different yet loosely held together by their love of the sport and/or getting in shape. It's an interesting place.
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and it doesn't take very long to hit a few local businesses while I'm doing chores and talk to a few ppl. I might stop for groceries and drop off my suit at the dry cleaners and maybe check out the pet shop or cookie store or travel agency in the plaza. Walk in, see what they sell, and see if anything comes up. It's easy to make a living if you are bright, ambitious, and willing to work long hours. Plus I am now typing at about 100 WPM, so it doesn't take long to check in and post a few times on getbig during the day when i'm bored.
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i heard mencia in there. let me do mencia's entire fucking act for you. "where are all the beaners? we know beaners are all the ones in jail lifting weights, and where do you think all of those steroids come from? guy guy bo guy. DEE DEE DEE!!!"
there you go.
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Again, as I have stated before, I don't you can just put a bodybuilding show on in any big city. I think the United States has certain areas where a great interest of bodybuilding exists.
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Damn, equo... I toss around ideas and engage in discussions... but I respect Lift, Jeff, and especially Shawn for working their asses off for this show. Seriously. I am not blindly criticizing. I am tossing out ideas for how it can improve next time. I have (albeit a rocky one!) a relationship with Lift and Shawn that could presumably open door some day, who knows. I could have a booth at the expo next year, who knows... I want them to succeed, and any ideas I toss out there for discussion are only to make next year's recipe for success a better one.
I don't worry about tact and being buddy buddy- there are a million people out there who specialize in that! Results are what matter.
That's cool, in all honesty you should take a booth for next year and promote your $300 website, I'm sure you could sign up at least 40-50 competitors (bodybuilding and especially fitness) for websites. Most competitors know nothing about the websites, php, scripting, perl, flash, etc. and probably end up getting suckered in by some big corporate web firm to have site done for $5-10k, I honestly think you would make a killing at a place like a bodybuilding show, consider it ;)
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your life must be really shit ::)
Why do you say that. What an I saying that is wrong. I promoted shows and bigger than this one. SO I basically know what I am talking about. What is the name of the show you promoted. There is not one thing that Sean wnet through that I didn't except handing out money. And I didn't hire anyone to help me, I did everything single thing needed to be done myself. Other than any setting up of stage or booths I did everythign else. So basically unless you or anyone else on here has actually promoted a show then you really are going on nothing but speculation and heresay. I go on the exact facts. I said from day one what would happen and it did exactly like I said. Not one surprise to me.
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That's cool, in all honesty you should take a booth for next year and promote your $300 website, I'm sure you could sign up at least 40-50 competitors (bodybuilding and especially fitness) for websites. Most competitors know nothing about the websites, php, scripting, perl, flash, etc. and probably end up getting suckered in by some big corporate web firm to have site done for $5-10k, I honestly think you would make a killing at a place like a bodybuilding show, consider it ;)
Thinking about it.
I wonder if I could make twice as much $ by also letting people punch me for $20. Maybe a 320combo.com?
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Thinking about it.
I wonder if I could make twice as much $ by also letting people punch me for $20. Maybe a 320combo.com?
LOL, I seriously doubt anyone would actually come up to you and wanna start shit, most of these computer cowboys are 150lbs. soaking wet. I'm sure a few pro's might spread shit about you but then again that would just interest people to come talk to you and see what all the fuss is about, you know the old adage; there's no such thing as bad publicity
;)
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Onlyme, making his 100 th Sean Ray Comparision!
Anyone starting to see the weirdness is his O B S E S S I O N with me or am I simply trippin............ ???
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Shawn, you wanna trade for weedouttheweek?
I like Keith. However the weedouttheweek kid is all over my ass 24/7.
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No thanks, Keith makes it worth my time here, dude is Melting Down faster than Anna Nicole Smith! ;D
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Onlyme why are you so negative ALL THE TIMES? U obviously hold grudges against Shawn. Man we're tired of you.
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He still has nice lines and makes me laugh ;D
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Onlyme why are you so negative ALL THE TIMES? U obviously hold grudges against Shawn. Man we're tired of you.
Listen to your mommy then and go to bed.
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He still has nice lines and makes me laugh ;D
Seanie, just think your show sucked more than mine. And from the way you look in the pictures, on TV, on stage and in those ghetto sweatsuits you are just as fat as me just allot shorter. When is that seminar you are giving on BB Show Promotion. That should be funnier than all hell. You should do a DVD on it. The title can be How to Waste Spend Sponsor Money Not Your Own and Not Come Close to Filling the House
By the way, the best way to hide your pain is to laugh. So at least you are doing one thing right. Great show by the way ::)
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If you met 6000 people at local gyms (200 per gym for 30 appearances), at least half of them would show up, and probably bring a friend or two!
What do you base this statement on?
Seems like all those people teaching marketing and sale ratios actually have no clue.
A 50% turnout. Wow.
YIP
Zack
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But Keith, here's the thing - every person who attended the show says they had a good time. I felt it was a great value for my money and I'll be there again in 2007, perhaps even as a sponsor.
The only people hatin' on the event are the ones who weren't even there. No one is denying that they've got some areas to improve upon for next year, but they're SUPPOSED to have things to work on...every event does.
I just don't believe you guys who were not present can give honest, well-founded critiques. You're so caught up in your 'I told you so' business that you're totally missing the point...that the fans enjoyed themselves and the athletes are all getting paid within a reasonable time period.
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Onlyme, I've read some of your past posts and thought, "this guy seems really cool and has had a very interesting life." However, your constant bashing of Shawn Ray is getting old and it makes you look bad. Be the bigger man (no pun intended) and move on. Just my 2 cents.
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He still has nice lines and makes me laugh ;D
Nothing like being short!!
(http://home.avvanta.com/~wayule/graphics/coleman_mary.jpg)
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He still has nice lines and makes me laugh ;D
Whatever they'll tell ya about your photoshop skills down at the Max Muscle Store...
Don't quit your day job mate. :-*
YIP
Zack
PS
Try get that Craig DVD online for us will ya?
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Onlyme why are you so negative ALL THE TIMES? U obviously hold grudges against Shawn. Man we're tired of you.
I do not know what started it exactly...but Shawn has not exactly been Mr. Niceguy toward Onlyme either.
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Time to stop talking shit and start doing it onlyme. Its pretty bogus to have to see you pushing this issue over and over again. Having done shows does not atall entitle you to a lifetime pass to play the role of bitter has been criticising anybody giving things a go.
Hate to be harsh but I don't see anybody saying it like it is and it really doesn't matter what your motives are, right now you're a shit talker who's not doing shit. You are better than that buddy. Rise up.
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Onlyme, I've read some of your past posts and thought, "this guy seems really cool and has had a very interesting life." However, your constant bashing of Shawn Ray is getting old and it makes you look bad. Be the bigger man (no pun intended) and move on. Just my 2 cents.
Well said. Onlyme you used to be very interesting with your stories, and extremely witty as well. You are cool as hell, but you've made hundreds of posts all negative about Shawn/Colorado Pro for months now. You are just coming across like a bitter person. Like others have said, rise above it :)
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From the voracity that Keith has come with against shawn, I seriously believe that Shawn did skip out on that hotel bill. It fits his character, and no way would Keith put that kinda venom out there unless it's true.
But the sad thing is, ppl are not held accountable for their actions. bob Chick made horrible racist claims, was proven dead wrong, and just decided to "drop it". Shawn prob did skip out on that hotel bill and his unwillingness to walk onstage to hand out a check at your show was a dick move too. Pride or whatever on his part didn't seem to stop him from walking onstage this weekend.
So yeah, I think Keith is right about Shawn. The best revenge would be to get a PDI show in HI and show em how it's done!
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From the voracity that Keith has come with against shawn, I seriously believe that Shawn did skip out on that hotel bill. It fits his character, and no way would Keith put that kinda venom out there unless it's true.
But the sad thing is, ppl are not held accountable for their actions. bob Chick made horrible racist claims, was proven dead wrong, and just decided to "drop it". Shawn prob did skip out on that hotel bill and his unwillingness to walk onstage to hand out a check at your show was a dick move too. Pride or whatever on his part didn't seem to stop him from walking onstage this weekend.
So yeah, I think Keith is right about Shawn. The best revenge would be to get a PDI show in HI and show em how it's done!
You think people should be held accountable?
YIP
Zack
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240 gotta go against you on this. I was thinkning about having a semi-top name comedian come in and be my entertainment for my show. The cheapest I found was Carlos Mencia at $10,000 plus expenses. Howie Mandel is over $20,000. The Amazing Jonathan was $15,000. The Regurgetator was $10,000. I wanted to bring in those two brothers from Vegas who do the balancing act and are really built. They are very expensive too, $10,000 apiece. Plus expenses for all. You need to find the most popular local person who the local audience just loves and have them be the emcee. It may cost a few grand but you save in travel expenses. He can emcee and during any down time entertain. Quick witted and fast talking guys are the best.
I'm sure Mencia's price will be going up soon........his show is getting more and more popular. One of the funniest things on right now....
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But Keith, here's the thing - every person who attended the show says they had a good time. I felt it was a great value for my money and I'll be there again in 2007, perhaps even as a sponsor.
The only people hatin' on the event are the ones who weren't even there. No one is denying that they've got some areas to improve upon for next year, but they're SUPPOSED to have things to work on...every event does.
I just don't believe you guys who were not present can give honest, well-founded critiques. You're so caught up in your 'I told you so' business that you're totally missing the point...that the fans enjoyed themselves and the athletes are all getting paid within a reasonable time period.
I am not saying the show was bad. I got so many emails and letters from people telling me how great my show was too. My website was packed with all positive feedback. I have said I liked the webcast allot. It even changed my whole outlook on it. The show went fairly smooth. The expo was small but theother stuff seemed good from what Ihave read. The show itself was a success. I admit that 100% and have said nothing to the contrary. What I saying is it was a financial nightmare and failure. Just like mine. No matter how great the show is if it keeps losing money or you lose too much it won't go on. The fans don't see this. I got so much shit when I had to cancel my show you won't believe. I still stick by what I say about Denver being a wrong place to have it at. I think for now the convention center is not the place to have it at. Guaranteed if he does this next year and it is a financila flop like this year, there won't be a year 3. You can only lose so much money until you have to throw in the towel.
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In addition, I sound a little bitter about Sean yes but he started it. Bashing me cause of a weight gain that I had receievd after an accident is pretty cool uh. I couldn't attack his physical appearance cause his body is so nice. But not anymore! So I use what I had to defend myself. I understand that Sean is a god to most of you but I have worked and became friends with many people who make Sean look like, well like Sean.
You guys make it sound like I am bashing him for putting on this show, yet you didn't know I set him up with the military connection for his show that allowed him promote he is supporting the military. Of course he won't mention that. All my comments tohim as harsh as they sound are from exepreicne had with my show, which is very similar to what he did. I know how a convention center works and I know the costs and hidden costs. I know how to promote and produce a show exactly like his. I did it. So my suggestions were real and were truly there to help him realize he needs to change if its going to make money. I defintiely learn from every mistake I make. It might take me 2 or 3 times but I do learn. And I always listen to people who have gone through the same thing. Anyway, the show is over he is still alive and hopefully he'll listen to people and make it a financial success next year.
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The DVD is coming soon...........Stay tuned to: www.coloradoproshow.com
I had a Blast! 8)
I'd like to thank the Academy, as well as the Sponsors and Athletes butmost of all I'd like to thanks the FANS!
All 3 of them! You guys are the reason I will be pulling out all the stops for the next 2 years as we signed on the dotted line last night! :o
1st Weekend of June 2007!
My review will be detailed in Flex Magazine, Muscular Development and on my web site: www.shawnray.com
Peace,
S. Ray
Shawn...you forgot to thank God, Allah and the almighty James T Kirk for making this all possible. ;D
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In addition, I sound a little bitter about Sean yes but he started it. Bashing me cause of a weight gain that I had receievd after an accident is pretty cool uh. I couldn't attack his physical appearance cause his body is so nice. But not anymore! So I use what I had to defend myself. I understand that Sean is a god to most of you but I have worked and became friends with many people who make Sean look like, well like Sean.
You guys make it sound like I am bashing him for putting on this show, yet you didn't know I set him up with the military connection for his show that allowed him promote he is supporting the military. Of course he won't mention that. All my comments tohim as harsh as they sound are from exepreicne had with my show, which is very similar to what he did. I know how a convention center works and I know the costs and hidden costs. I know how to promote and produce a show exactly like his. I did it. So my suggestions were real and were truly there to help him realize he needs to change if its going to make money. I defintiely learn from every mistake I make. It might take me 2 or 3 times but I do learn. And I always listen to people who have gone through the same thing. Anyway, the show is over he is still alive and hopefully he'll listen to people and make it a financial success next year.
Remember, he's short.
That's always funny.
You can never be funny, since you're tall.
When Shawn gets fat, he also per definition becomes jolly.
A tall and big guy is always up against tough odds. Look at Frodo and Boromir, David and Goliath.
The Smurfs vs Garfunkel.
Bridget the Midget vs any of her male co-stars.
You get the idea.
YIP
Zack
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In addition, I sound a little bitter about Sean yes but he started it. Bashing me cause of a weight gain that I had receievd after an accident is pretty cool uh. I couldn't attack his physical appearance cause his body is so nice. But not anymore! So I use what I had to defend myself. I understand that Sean is a god to most of you but I have worked and became friends with many people who make Sean look like, well like Sean.
You guys make it sound like I am bashing him for putting on this show, yet you didn't know I set him up with the military connection for his show that allowed him promote he is supporting the military. Of course he won't mention that. All my comments tohim as harsh as they sound are from exepreicne had with my show, which is very similar to what he did. I know how a convention center works and I know the costs and hidden costs. I know how to promote and produce a show exactly like his. I did it. So my suggestions were real and were truly there to help him realize he needs to change if its going to make money. I defintiely learn from every mistake I make. It might take me 2 or 3 times but I do learn. And I always listen to people who have gone through the same thing. Anyway, the show is over he is still alive and hopefully he'll listen to people and make it a financial success next year.
Listen I think what people are trying say Keith is that you've led an interesting life so far and its a drag to see you wasting your time with petty differences on getbig. We know you've had a setback and a lot like arvilla everybody wants to see you back in shape. We'd rather not see you wallowing in the mediocrity that is sniping at each other here. If you were kicking ass and taking names you wouldn't be caught dead arguing over this with Shawn, you'd be too busy skullcrushing.
So suck it up princess and get back to doing interesting stuff :)
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Seanie, just think your show sucked more than mine. And from the way you look in the pictures, on TV, on stage and in those ghetto sweatsuits you are just as fat as me just allot shorter. When is that seminar you are giving on BB Show Promotion. That should be funnier than all hell. You should do a DVD on it. The title can be How to Waste Spend Sponsor Money Not Your Own and Not Come Close to Filling the House
By the way, the best way to hide your pain is to laugh. So at least you are doing one thing right. Great show by the way ::)
Onlyme, you only run an NPC show and the overhead is absolutely nothing compared to an actual pro show. Not only that, you've been running it for a while if I'm not mistaken. I can't believe you are actually comparing the latter of the two. Its a lot less expensive to run an NPC show than a IFBB pro show
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The funny thing is, I honestly think 240 has some pretty good ideas for Shawn... I do not agree with all that he is saying, but he does make a lot of good points and i think Shawn could benefit from listening to him, or at least considering some of his advice... But Shawn is just your typical guy with an over-inflated ego who always thinks he is right, so i am sure he won't even think for a second that a "nobody" like 240 might actually help him make more $$$...
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Listen I think what people are trying say Keith is that you've led an interesting life so far and its a drag to see you wasting your time with petty differences on getbig. We know you've had a setback and a lot like arvilla everybody wants to see you back in shape. We'd rather not see you wallowing in the mediocrity that is sniping at each other here. If you were kicking ass and taking names you wouldn't be caught dead arguing over this with Shawn, you'd be too busy skullcrushing.
So suck it up princess and get back to doing interesting stuff :)
Well put!
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the comedian was a big mistake stick to the sport and not to cheap gimmicks
give the people what they came to see.
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Onlyme, you only run an NPC show and the overhead is absolutely nothing compared to an actual pro show. Not only that, you've been running it for a while if I'm not mistaken. I can't believe you are actually comparing the latter of the two. Its a lot less expensive to run an NPC show than a IFBB pro show
Vince I will you a lesson since you have absolutely not one idea what you are talking about. You are right in only one point, but forgot the most important part. Most NPC shows are not big dollar shows. Probably around $40,000 or so if that. But, since you don't read yet or good or just don't comprehend what you read, let me enlighten you. My show was a mini-ASC. I rented the Hawaii COnvention Center for $48,000 for three days (that is rent ONLY). So just to rent my location alone cost more than any NPC show has ever cost in Hawaii and more than probably almost any other NPC show out there except for a few. I gave away a total of $40,000+ in CASH for various events at my show including $18,000 in CASH for my Bikini Contest and $14,000 for the Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Tournament. Booths, decorations and carpet cost another $35,000. Sound, stages (4 of them), lighting and video cost another $22,000. I paid for 16 VIP's and their wives to come to the show plus hotel rooms (some for a week), rental cars and cell phones were provided. Not sure the total cost but it was around $20,000. Plus appearance fees for all these guys that ranged from $2,000 to $3,500.
So before you open you dumb sounding mouth think before you type or at least read cause I have posted this several times. The following year I downsided and spent probably around $75,000. Sean's show is based allot like mine. In fact he even said on here somewhere I inspired him to do a show. Now that was probably a jab at me but whateever.
SO when I talk about his show I know exactly to the tee what he is going through. I have promoted several other shows (BB) here in Hawaii but nowhere else. Other than the prize money he gave for the BB (which n reality is only $32,000 more than I did) and the Hummer, our costs are very close. But if you add the cost of me bringing in so many pros and VIP's then that brings it closer.
So thank you for your insight but again you are wrong.
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Listen I think what people are trying say Keith is that you've led an interesting life so far and its a drag to see you wasting your time with petty differences on getbig. We know you've had a setback and a lot like arvilla everybody wants to see you back in shape. We'd rather not see you wallowing in the mediocrity that is sniping at each other here. If you were kicking ass and taking names you wouldn't be caught dead arguing over this with Shawn, you'd be too busy skullcrushing.
So suck it up princess and get back to doing interesting stuff :)
Yes I know what you are saying. I am gettng PM's and emails telling me why I am doing this. First off all along even when I was competing or after and ding appearance or whatever I never ever once thought I was better than anyone. The thing everyone seemed to like about me was how easy it was to talk to me and approach me. I would always get the "man you are easy to talk to" or something like that.
Well now I am a nobody and I really don't feel like anythng special at all. And even if I did I would never act like I "all that". I enjoy talking and I enjoy typing. I may have a size 14 ring finger but I can type very fast. So coming on here and going through all this with Sean or whatever doesn't bother at all as it probably doesn;t bother him. I do think he respects my posts no matter how bad they are against him cause I am not a internet troll like some people on here who have never done anything in their lives (yet). At least at one point I did something. So I think that is why he pays more attention to me. All along I have said he HAD one of the best bodies ever. I would take his body look over Coleman, Cutler, Ruhls or anyone like that in a heartbeat except for the height. I don't think I could like being that short. But other than that he WAS great at one time. He needs to realize he is not that same guy anymore. I know it took me some time but I am living with it. He maes fun of how I look now and actually I am looking a whole lot better now than I did when I last saw him. Come Olympia I will be a whole lot better.
But sorry for the people who thnk I am lowering myself. I am just being real. I have had 435+ PM's. People asking me how to train to how is was to meet Ali. And I answer everyone of them. And I get back from allot of them a big thank you for taking the time out to respond. That is what I like to do. Sorry but can't change that about me.
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Vince I will you a lesson since you have absolutely not one idea what you are talking about. You are right in only one point, but forgot the most important part. Most NPC shows are not big dollar shows. Probably around $40,000 or so if that. But, since you don't read yet or good or just don't comprehend what you read, let me enlighten you. My show was a mini-ASC. I rented the Hawaii COnvention Center for $48,000 for three days (that is rent ONLY). So just to rent my location alone cost more than any NPC show has ever cost in Hawaii and more than probably almost any other NPC show out there except for a few. I gave away a total of $40,000+ in CASH for various events at my show including $18,000 in CASH for my Bikini Contest and $14,000 for the Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Tournament. Booths, decorations and carpet cost another $35,000. Sound, stages (4 of them), lighting and video cost another $22,000. I paid for 16 VIP's and their wives to come to the show plus hotel rooms (some for a week), rental cars and cell phones were provided. Not sure the total cost but it was around $20,000. Plus appearance fees for all these guys that ranged from $2,000 to $3,500.
So before you open you dumb sounding mouth think before you type or at least read cause I have posted this several times. The following year I downsided and spent probably around $75,000. Sean's show is based allot like mine. In fact he even said on here somewhere I inspired him to do a show. Now that was probably a jab at me but whateever.
SO when I talk about his show I know exactly to the tee what he is going through. I have promoted several other shows (BB) here in Hawaii but nowhere else. Other than the prize money he gave for the BB (which n reality is only $32,000 more than I did) and the Hummer, our costs are very close. But if you add the cost of me bringing in so many pros and VIP's then that brings it closer.
So thank you for your insight but again you are wrong.
Did you really think you'd break even or profit? I'm not taking a jab at you. I dont see the money exchanging hands like that other than the ASC and O.
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I do not know what started it exactly...but Shawn has not exactly been Mr. Niceguy toward Onlyme either.
because Sasha dumped Shawn for onlyme?
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Did you really think you'd break even or profit? I'm not taking a jab at you. I dont see the money exchanging hands like that other than the ASC and O.
Actually yes. Shows here do very good cause the locals are attracted to celebrities here usually. We are on an island and isolated from allot of stuff. I went to the ASC and saw what they had. I tried to model the show after that with many different things going on so that we hit a wider market. I had originally had the Hawaii State Gymnastics champinships scheduled but at the last moment it changed to a local show. That hurt a little. On top of that the parents of the kids came to the show and threatened not to let their kids do the show unless they got in free like at other shows they do. The Gracie event was going to be their State championships all the way up to just a couple weeks before the show but they decided they wanted to make it bigger so they invited everyone. Well the guys who mostly showed up were from Brazil. The local guys just didn't have the experience so the backed out. We still had 140 competitors.
I also went to the local car show. I have been to several car shows on the mainland like Miami, LA and San Diego but the Honolulu car show sucks. It is so small. It literally took us 20 minutes to see the whole show. Well for the weekend they drew 30,000 people. The health expo here in Oct. draws 50,000+ for 4 days.
So I thought absolutely no problem drawing around 30,000 people especiall since I have so much going on. And different things. I sceduled it for Memorial Day weekend. Thinking because of my militay conections and the promotions I do with the military I could draw a good number of military. I even had 16 teams to goup against Dragan for his challenge he does. I was offering $1,000 for the military team that does the most reps even if they don't beat Dragan. I had 4 bikini models handing out flyers on Pearl Harbor and Kaneohe Marine Base. The response from them was unreal. I had sevral seminars done on bases too. But, that weekend was Rimpac (a military exercise) and on Memorial Day they give tours of the bases and most personel is not allowed to leave the base. So, I basically had NO military there. Just a few voluteers that helped allot. So, instead of 30,000 we ended up with aruond 6,000 paid tickets to the expo. That doesn't included mostof the first day everyone got in free cause the security ad door people provided me by the center did not take tickets and let everyone in free.
So basically I lost big time. It was defintiely worth taking the chance. I truly believe the biggest reason was the date. Never on a holiday especially in Hawaii. They are so regimented here.
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Vince I will you a lesson since you have absolutely not one idea what you are talking about. You are right in only one point, but forgot the most important part. Most NPC shows are not big dollar shows. Probably around $40,000 or so if that. But, since you don't read yet or good or just don't comprehend what you read, let me enlighten you. My show was a mini-ASC. I rented the Hawaii COnvention Center for $48,000 for three days (that is rent ONLY). So just to rent my location alone cost more than any NPC show has ever cost in Hawaii and more than probably almost any other NPC show out there except for a few. I gave away a total of $40,000+ in CASH for various events at my show including $18,000 in CASH for my Bikini Contest and $14,000 for the Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Tournament. Booths, decorations and carpet cost another $35,000. Sound, stages (4 of them), lighting and video cost another $22,000. I paid for 16 VIP's and their wives to come to the show plus hotel rooms (some for a week), rental cars and cell phones were provided. Not sure the total cost but it was around $20,000. Plus appearance fees for all these guys that ranged from $2,000 to $3,500.
So before you open you dumb sounding mouth think before you type or at least read cause I have posted this several times. The following year I downsided and spent probably around $75,000. Sean's show is based allot like mine. In fact he even said on here somewhere I inspired him to do a show. Now that was probably a jab at me but whateever.
SO when I talk about his show I know exactly to the tee what he is going through. I have promoted several other shows (BB) here in Hawaii but nowhere else. Other than the prize money he gave for the BB (which n reality is only $32,000 more than I did) and the Hummer, our costs are very close. But if you add the cost of me bringing in so many pros and VIP's then that brings it closer.
So thank you for your insight but again you are wrong.
Ok, I'll give you points on that because I haven't track of your shows as of late and your show has pretty much expanded a great deal. I was going by the "general NPC events and you know exactly what I'm referring too.
But seriously, your show couldn't have cost more than Shawn's. There may have been more people but give me a break.
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Ok, I'll give you points on that because I haven't track of your shows as of late and your show has pretty much expanded a great deal. I was going by the "general NPC events and you know exactly what I'm referring too.
But seriously, your show couldn't have cost more than Shawn's. There may have been more people but give me a break.
I don't think I said it cost more than Seans but it did cost allot. Seans had allot of prize money and the hummer. right there is $102,000.
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If you met 6000 people at local gyms (200 per gym for 30 appearances), at least half of them would show up, and probably bring a friend or two!
Bumping this question:
What do you base this statement on?
Seems like all those people teaching marketing and sale ratios actually have no clue.
A 50% turnout. Wow.
YIP
Zack
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ok, my math was skewed and i type and think way too fast sometimes-
I think 5000 to 6000 could have been a realistic number for the Colo Pro if a long term grassroots gym campaign was launched. Not 50%, that is too high an estimate. But 5-6000 could be grabbed with 1) tix sales in gyms on commission 2) tix sales on SRay appearance 3) some print ads, specialized.
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ok, my math was skewed and i type and think way too fast sometimes-
I think 5000 to 6000 could have been a realistic number for the Colo Pro if a long term grassroots gym campaign was launched. Not 50%, that is too high an estimate. But 5-6000 could be grabbed with 1) tix sales in gyms on commission 2) tix sales on SRay appearance 3) some print ads, specialized.
Look man.
There is probably a lot of things that could've been done better with the promotion and marketing for the CO competition. It's a learning experience.
But there is one truth that almost always holds for all businesses, and I think it does here too:
THERE ARE NO QUICK FIXES.
Most of the time, it's gonna be hard ass labour and wise decisions that will bring prospective future.
And forgive me if I say so, the suggestions of comedian and appearances with the 50% turnout expectancy, it smells a bit too much wishful thinking -hoping of quick fixes.
As long as there is a solid evaluation, the CO Pro has every chance of improving.
People are whining about Shawn Ray not taking any personal economical loss? Are you kidding? This to me indicates that he is a guy that should be in charge of promoting these events. He will look to get business involved.
YIP
Zack
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It seems like a lot of numbers are being thrown around... so I'm assuming this comment was based on the comparsion between radio and general pop advertising vs meeting the fitness people at gyms.
Denver doesnt have any Gold's gyms or the smaller hardcore locations but has about 7-9 Ball's, 24hr Fit and Better bod locations with 20 miles of downtown Denver with very, very large membership bases.
Again... they are composed of people more interested in general fitness than bbing on the pro-level. Maybe the IFBB needs to pick up on sponsors and advertisers that cover the weight watcher type market and so forth. Stilll believe the fit/fig girls are the key to the marketing problems with bbing. Maybe in the end they become the headliners over men's bbing if the IFBB sits down with marketing companies and figures out a formula.
But that might bring in competition and I'm not sure the few that have their hands in the pie are looking for that. Plus some of the fossils have to go... so new ideas can be brought forth.
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I'm not going to go into depth and detail on this but there are MANY MANY factors involved that you guys have no clue on.
Example... You think it's as easy as just going to 24 hour fitness and putting on a seminar? 24 hour fitness as more coporate rules and regulations then imaginable. Basically, if it isn't the Olympics or Lance Armstrong it won't happen in their clubs. Jeff wasn't allowed to hang posters in any 24 hour fitness gym because of their rules. Passing out flyers and information had to be done outside of the gym and not allowed in the gym.
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Just putting ideas out there! It's up to the fossils that run the industry to find a new formula that works. Maybe the fit/fig girls should be moved to the front of the line. Promote them first than bbers including the men. Avg person can relate to Monica, Dina, Bethany, DJ and so forth more than Ronnie, Jay and Phil. Take a weight watchers approach to the whole thing than hardcore bbing. Just ideas. The companies have the dough. That's what god made marketing companies for! Maybe the fossils dont wont real competition coming in.
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Atendance? Ticket sales? NPC div entrants, expo traffic, etc?
If a smart guy that is a legend in the sport can't make a go of this the sport is doomed.
I hope it went well, but due a death in my wife's family I did not go or follow the show.
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Just putting ideas out there! It's up to the fossils that run the industry to find a new formula that works. Maybe the fit/fig girls should be moved to the front of the line. Promote them first than bbers including the men. Avg person can relate to Monica, Dina, Bethany, DJ and so forth more than Ronnie, Jay and Phil. Take a weight watchers approach to the whole thing than hardcore bbing. Just ideas. The companies have the dough. That's what god made marketing companies for! Maybe the fossils dont wont real competition coming in.
No worries - ideas are appreciated but the handful of people who think they have the answers don't know all the ins and outs of why things can or can't be done. It's not by lack of trying or creativity on anyone's part.
Hate to break it to ya bro but the average person can not relate to the women you mentioned and more then they can relate to a Jay or Ronnie. To the average joe Monica's physique is never obtainable. I work with a number of women in the industry and sadly their following isn't even close to the men. Look at how much attention they get in the magazines, next to none. We promoted the women as much as we did the men on the web site, ads and local televison stations.
Again not discrediting any ideas, just laying out what was done and what you're up against in "the real world".
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No worries - ideas are appreciated but the handful of people who think they have the answers don't know all the ins and outs of why things can or can't be done.
Quit bitching mang.
Buy yourself a lottery ticket for the raffle on the 240 or Bust Classic No-Tap Fight.
YIP
Zack
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Having promoted a sports event or two in my past, and built up a company from scratch, I will never criticize somebody for taking the time to make things happen in this world.
Its all about risk and reward. It takes guts and will power to create something out of nothing. Kudos Shawn for putting the Colorado Pro together.
Like Woody Allen said, 99 percent of success in life is about showing up.
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Having promoted a sports event or two in my past, and built up a company from scratch, I will never criticize somebody for taking the time to make things happen in this world.
Its all about risk and reward. It takes guts and will power to create something out of nothing. Kudos Shawn for putting the Colorado Pro together.
Like Woody Allen said, 99 percent of success in life is about showing up.
I wouldn`t even guest pose at a show unless they had at least 10,000 in the audience.
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I wouldn`t even guest pose at a show unless they had at least 10,000 in the audience.
LMAO...
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Dude, you are such a little milkmaid.
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are you saying this is not a decent dude?
I couldn't help but notice you enjoy to partake in the sharing of pics of nude men. Matt P, you clearly like the cock.
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ok, my math was skewed and i type and think way too fast sometimes-
I think 5000 to 6000 could have been a realistic number for the Colo Pro if a long term grassroots gym campaign was launched. Not 50%, that is too high an estimate. But 5-6000 could be grabbed with 1) tix sales in gyms on commission 2) tix sales on SRay appearance 3) some print ads, specialized.
Sorry no way in hell. Well yes there is. First off 5000 people would make it the highest live audience of any BB show of the year. The ASC had 2800+. No way in the world can you say a show like the ASC or the Olympia will be oudone by a show in Denver with not one big name.
Here is the scoop. Sean is an IFBB Living Legend as he was called at the show. You would think with all this pretisge and power he would have been able to get some kind of support from all the friends he has. And as much as itpains me to say this, Sean would get that many people if he advertised and brought in Arnold to emcee his show or play a major part in it. Sorry but the Srnold name sells sells sells and sells more. That is a fact. Even bringing in Louie and promoting he will be at the expo to sign autographs for free would bring in allot of people. No matter what people like to see Louie. He was an icon at one time and people do remember that. Sean would have to pay him on the side so that he would not be able to sell his autogrpah or pictures for more than $5. Other than that or bring in a major movie star, athlete(s) there is no way this show will get really big while in Denver. With all the promotion Sean did I would think most people in the Denver area knew about the show. That is taking into account Sean did a great job of prmoting it and got it in the avenues to hit most everybody. Now if they all knew and only this many people came, how many more can you expect to come next time. What will be different to convince someone who doesn't like BB enough to come to the first show to come to the next one. The expo is really the only part of the show that can grow and make this show a huge success. More events, more things to do and targeting a wider market. Targeting just BB lovers and people in the gym will NOT make this show bigger or a success.
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what is funny is that except for the two gettbig members who went there, there s no one who s been there to testify.
shows you how "many" people went tot he "event"...
bbing is a joke,and you all clowns are a joke too.
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No worries - ideas are appreciated but the handful of people who think they have the answers don't know all the ins and outs of why things can or can't be done. It's not by lack of trying or creativity on anyone's part.
Hate to break it to ya bro but the average person can not relate to the women you mentioned and more then they can relate to a Jay or Ronnie. To the average joe Monica's physique is never obtainable. I work with a number of women in the industry and sadly their following isn't even close to the men. Look at how much attention they get in the magazines, next to none. We promoted the women as much as we did the men on the web site, ads and local televison stations.
Again not discrediting any ideas, just laying out what was done and what you're up against in "the real world".
Well... what's the next avenue? You guys are in the industry. I (We) are just putting out ideas. Gymnastics and Ms America do very well, and I'd say that Figure and Fitness are their second cousins... so with the right ideas out there they can have good success also. I'd bet Dina has reached a bigger audience with her site. I could be wrong. It's easier for a man or woman to get a similar physique to a fitness athlete or figure than Ronnie, Jay or MsO. Let us be real! More young woman want to be like Bethany Howlett than young man want to be Ronnie Coleman. Her selling points are not just fitness but a woman business owner, highly educated and so forth. This kind of stuff can be packaged. That makes her an asset! You dont need to focus on the muscle shots with these woman. Push their lifestyles and other stuff. Hybrid the mags... so you get a fusion of training with a litte Vogue and Teen Miss. Does the IFBB use marketing firms to assist in this process... or did they go dinosaur after the WWE failed and kept their little market shares under wrap?
Anyway... all the credit in the world goes to Shawn. The key is to learn from the mistakes that happen. Live and you learn.
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Gymnastics is HUGE. And costs are very low to do them. My friend in Honolulu wanted me to do a National Championships in Honolulu. In Dallas they packed the stadium with 40,000 people. Each kid pays around $190 to enter. They get a certificate, and a windbreaker. So figure out the profit on that. And sponsors come begging to get involved. It's teenage girls for gods sake. Denver has allot fo thing going . Find out what is the most popular sports and activites and build. Plus Sean cannot live in LA and do a show in Denver and expect to put in 100%. Just not possible. You have to live where you put on a show or the costs of going back and forth add up plus living there will give him more pull when he finds local sponsors. But what do I know.
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yes, teen cheerleading championships across the south draw thousands of pedophiles
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Gymnastics is HUGE. And costs are very low to do them. My friend in Honolulu wanted me to do a National Championships in Honolulu. In Dallas they packed the stadium with 40,000 people. Each kid pays around $190 to enter. They get a certificate, and a windbreaker. So figure out the profit on that. And sponsors come begging to get involved. It's teenage girls for gods sake. Denver has allot fo thing going . Find out what is the most popular sports and activites and build. Plus Sean cannot live in LA and do a show in Denver and expect to put in 100%. Just not possible. You have to live where you put on a show or the costs of going back and forth add up plus living there will give him more pull when he finds local sponsors. But what do I know.
He can get rid of the Vegas condo and get one in Denver. That should cover that! If fitness has some of the characteristics of cheerleading and gymnastics, then you have a building block to better promote. Then find away to attract young females. Tanji is doing a lot of promotion. Maybe... she should hit a high school or two. Maybe... they can add Jr Fitness 13-17 and Petite Fitness 8-12yrs of age. The powers set and hire the right people and companies to set the ground work. It can work. Something like that might oopen up the industry... but the few players that are making money bbing, fit and fig might turn a head on that one b/c it would bring in corporate competition.
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yes, teen cheerleading championships across the south draw thousands of pedophiles
Never thought about that. Cna you imagine all the pedophiles and gays together in one place. Oh my!
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Sorry no way in hell. Well yes there is. First off 5000 people would make it the highest live audience of any BB show of the year. The ASC had 2800+. No way in the world can you say a show like the ASC or the Olympia will be oudone by a show in Denver with not one big name.
Here is the scoop. Sean is an IFBB Living Legend as he was called at the show. You would think with all this pretisge and power he would have been able to get some kind of support from all the friends he has. And as much as itpains me to say this, Sean would get that many people if he advertised and brought in Arnold to emcee his show or play a major part in it. Sorry but the Srnold name sells sells sells and sells more. That is a fact. Even bringing in Louie and promoting he will be at the expo to sign autographs for free would bring in allot of people. No matter what people like to see Louie. He was an icon at one time and people do remember that. Sean would have to pay him on the side so that he would not be able to sell his autogrpah or pictures for more than $5. Other than that or bring in a major movie star, athlete(s) there is no way this show will get really big while in Denver. With all the promotion Sean did I would think most people in the Denver area knew about the show. That is taking into account Sean did a great job of prmoting it and got it in the avenues to hit most everybody. Now if they all knew and only this many people came, how many more can you expect to come next time. What will be different to convince someone who doesn't like BB enough to come to the first show to come to the next one. The expo is really the only part of the show that can grow and make this show a huge success. More events, more things to do and targeting a wider market. Targeting just BB lovers and people in the gym will NOT make this show bigger or a success.
I agree. Part of the problem is the product. Pro shows used to be able to attract a crowd back in the day, because the bodies were something to aspire to and it had a certain degree of professionalism and not just disorganized madness.
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Never thought about that. Cna you imagine all the pedophiles and gays together in one place. Oh my!
yeah 15 dollars each and everybody plays pocket pool
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Speaking from athletes perspective I thought the show was run great. Everyone I spoke to was very happy with the show in general, the venue, staff, and overall organization. I see this show growing every year!
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Onlyme, making his 100 th Sean Ray Comparision!
Anyone starting to see the weirdness is his O B S E S S I O N with me or am I simply trippin............ ???
Huh? OBSESSION? I think your the one that would know the most about the word obsession. One word: Kamali.
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Sure, I'm on getbig a lot. There are a lot of opportunities here! And it's interesting conversation. I learn a lot about not only the BBing industry, but also diverse views of many. Seriously, if you're not just goofing off, you can learn a ton about people here. It's interesting- almost like a little colony of people that are remarkably different yet loosely held together by their love of the sport and/or getting in shape. It's an interesting place.
Seems like Denial is not only a river in Egypt.
Snap out of it,
or get consumed.
YIP
Zack
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Wow, what a freakin butthead. How do you sleep at night 240? There has got to be times you regret some of the complete BS that you type :-X