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Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: a_ahmed on April 23, 2013, 06:11:57 PM
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Since the mod of the religion section doesn't like this being posted I will post it here. He started attacking Islam and Muslims who marry young and of course Muhammad (pbuh). So I thought I'd share some insight on Mary (peace be upon her) and the fact she was between 11-14 when she had Jesus (pbuh) and according to the bible she was betrothed before having Jesus (pbuh) which means how old was she clearly pretty young!
Most say a young teenager, but still there was never a penis in Mary.
Regardless, there are no penises allowed in small children.
Oh I see. And she was bethorted to Joseph according to Christian belief when?
This is how the birth of Jesus the Messiah came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. [Matthew 1:18]
So she was going to get married at that age.
This islamophobe garbage is a new phenomena, no historical islamophobe ever used this 'tactic' until this century really. Like I said it's a new phenomena of British sources. The age of consent was raised due to prostitution of children in Britain.
The average limit of consent was 10 years of age and 7 years of age in delaware in the late 1800s.. 1880 i believe? Oh well.
The above is not just marriage its 'sex'. I am talking about marriage, which means the obligation and responsibility to take care of a woman not just screw around or worse yet rape someone. Rape is rape period.
And to think that younger people cant think you're wrong.
http://www.mommyish.com/2013/04/02/fifth-grade-boys-arrested-for-rape-and-murder-plot/
In judaism (Jesus and Mary were Jews), you come of age and mature when you hit puberty. Just like in Islam. Hence Bar Mitzvahs to celebrate coming of manhood. You are expected to marry not screw around.
And stop deleting this post because it showcases Mary was to be married at this age to Joseph. It's really weak of you.
Oh and for anyone wondering why and how the age of sexual consent and marriage was instigated. It was due to the British having a problem of child prostitution, so they were forced to enact these laws in order to protect young women from being abused. The law spread around gradually although there are still places in south america, asia, etc... that allow younger marriages and sexual consent.
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Most say a young teenager, but still there was never a penis in Mary.
Regardless, there are no penises allowed in small children.
Oh I see. And she was bethorted to Joseph according to Christian belief when?
This is how the birth of Jesus the Messiah came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. [Matthew 1:18]
So she was going to get married at that age.
This islamophobe garbage is a new phenomena, no historical islamophobe ever used this 'tactic' until this century really. Like I said it's a new phenomena of British sources. The age of consent was raised due to prostitution of children in Britain.
The average limit of consent was 10 years of age and 7 years of age in delaware in the late 1800s.. 1880 i believe? Oh well.
The above is not just marriage its 'sex'. I am talking about marriage, which means the obligation and responsibility to take care of a woman not just screw around or worse yet rape someone. Rape is rape period.
And to think that younger people cant think you're wrong.
http://www.mommyish.com/2013/04/02/fifth-grade-boys-arrested-for-rape-and-murder-plot/
In judaism (Jesus and Mary were Jews), you come of age and mature when you hit puberty. Just like in Islam. Hence Bar Mitzvahs to celebrate coming of manhood. You are expected to marry not screw around.
And stop deleting this post because it showcases Mary was to be married at this age to Joseph. It's really weak of you.
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This post never should have been deleted.
I won't give my opinion but it was fine for the religious section in my opinion.
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It's because he went on an immature rampage with e-kul and started dissing Muhammad and Islam. Quite low for a mod. So when I posted something from the bible. He started deleting it.
The point is, people used to marry young all the time. People didn't focus on clubbing and partying and 'having fun' but on life and getting settled, established, making something out of themselves from the day they are born.
Hence in Jewish tradition, when a boy 'comes of age' hits puberty he has his bar mitzvah, thats like usually around 12? And mary here was to mary Joseph. So imagine how young they were.
The British law is which determined that no one should mary or have sex before 18 and such... I had news excerpts of 'plight of women' to endorse these laws (old old newspapers). What it had to do was with abuse of women and child prostitution. That's what it stemmed from.
It's a new phenomena as in the united states people had a really low average age of consent at 10, and delaware at 7.
These are historical facts, but it seems islamophobes want to attack something they don't want people to understand from the right perspective.
Around the world there are girls who by 12 they are fully capable of taking care of house hold, money, family, go to school, have fun, etc... it has nothing to do with being forced to mary or whatever. Rape is rape, forced marriage is forced marriage. However there are plenty of examples of young marriages where people are very happy.
I know of a few examples of family friends and girls who were 16 and got married, heck my grandmother was 16 when she married and that was like what 50 some years ago? Just the fact that most girls and boys are too immature to handle married life does not mean it cant happen. I was 21 and now married 7 years, my wife is 4 years older than me as I didn't find the local girls mature around my age. These numbers are meaningless. Maturity is not determined by a number. There are 30+ some year olds who are immature as a brick.
If e-kul and his radical atheism and darwinist evolution approach were to be used? Guess what? Nature says if you hit puberty you want sex, you want a partner, you want to procreate. I am not saying go have sex or get married when you hit puberty, but the defacto facts is, the age of consent at 18 years of age is an artificial number set by Britishers who had a prostitution problem.
Remember the case of the teacher who was a slut and slept with the entire high school football team? She was charged because they were 'almost 18' but not 18. Imagine that. What difference does it make. She slept with them, while they probably got kudos from their bros and like most getbiggers on here brag about 'banging' whoever.
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nothing else will be deleted right now.
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This is not the olden days man. Society now is different, as opposed to back then where people matured mentally way quicker due to living condition, and societal norms.
Trying to marry off people in and around puberty now would be a major injustice to these kids.
...on a side note, i'm surprised you can keep at it for this long without getting bored. Religion is like an obsession with you.
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I DONT care what the average age of was in the past, but in this day and age, for an adult, it is 18. EIGHTEEN. EIGHT-TEEN. Get it.
It is pathetic when kids under 16 even think about it because they feel pressured. Enough.
Girls at the age of 12 is BULLSHIT! Get it! I have a daughter who is 9, I have lot's of friends of have 12 year old daughters.
They are capable of a lot of things, but their mind is not their yet. Simple as that.
We live in an age where we have been enlightened to understand that our kids can go to school, can learn to be anything they want, can take their time to enjoy life.
400 years ago people thought the earth was flat. They thought they needed to make sacrifices of people to earn the trust of gods.
150 years ago, they never thought they would be driving in cars, in planes.
50 years ago, what the hell was a computer
20 years ago, an Ipad.
So screw this crap, we are not going back to where freaking idiots ruined their kids because they thought it was the way it should be.
Don't we have enough of this around the world now?
Maybe in 20-30 years, they might be enlightened enough to get it soon too.
And this has NOTHING to do with religion, just ignorance.
So STOP WITH ANY FREAKING FORM of CHILD anything on this board.
It isnt the place, nor do I want it here. 18+ is what I like. End of story.
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wait, who deleted your posts while keeping E-kul's drivel intact? ???
It's happened to me in the past as well, where an apparently offensive post of mine (to christians) was modified. Meanwhile all kinds of vile disgusting posts about muslims are left undeleted.
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I DONT care what the average age of was in the past, but in this day and age, for an adult, it is 18. EIGHTEEN. EIGHT-TEEN. Get it.
It is pathetic when kids under 16 even think about it because they feel pressured. Enough.
Girls at the age of 12 is BULLSHIT! Get it! I have a daughter who is 9, I have lot's of friends of have 12 year old daughters.
They are capable of a lot of things, but their mind is not their yet. Simple as that.
We live in an age where we have been enlightened to understand that our kids can go to school, can learn to be anything they want, can take their time to enjoy life.
400 years ago people thought the earth was flat. They thought they needed to make sacrifices of people to earn the trust of gods.
150 years ago, they never thought they would be driving in cars, in planes.
50 years ago, what the hell was a computer
20 years ago, an Ipad.
So screw this crap, we are not going back to where freaking idiots ruined their kids because they thought it was the way it should be.
Don't we have enough of this around the world now?
Maybe in 20-30 years, they might be enlightened enough to get it soon too.
And this has NOTHING to do with religion, just ignorance.
So STOP WITH ANY FREAKING FORM of CHILD anything on this board.
It isnt the place, nor do I want it here. 18+ is what I like. End of story.
Thank you Ron! Well said! 8)
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18+ is what I like. End of story.
Exactly 18 is what I like. At 19 they start to get fat.
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I DONT care what the average age of was in the past, but in this day and age, for an adult, it is 18. EIGHTEEN. EIGHT-TEEN. Get it.
It is pathetic when kids under 16 even think about it because they feel pressured. Enough.
Girls at the age of 12 is BULLSHIT! Get it! I have a daughter who is 9, I have lot's of friends of have 12 year old daughters.
They are capable of a lot of things, but their mind is not their yet. Simple as that.
We live in an age where we have been enlightened to understand that our kids can go to school, can learn to be anything they want, can take their time to enjoy life.
400 years ago people thought the earth was flat. They thought they needed to make sacrifices of people to earn the trust of gods.
150 years ago, they never thought they would be driving in cars, in planes.
50 years ago, what the hell was a computer
20 years ago, an Ipad.
So screw this crap, we are not going back to where freaking idiots ruined their kids because they thought it was the way it should be.
Don't we have enough of this around the world now?
Maybe in 20-30 years, they might be enlightened enough to get it soon too.
And this has NOTHING to do with religion, just ignorance.
So STOP WITH ANY FREAKING FORM of CHILD anything on this board.
It isnt the place, nor do I want it here. 18+ is what I like. End of story.
Your rant doesn't even belong in this thread Ron. And the reason the mods were deleting had NOTHING to do with what you are ranting about and you know it.
Everything Ahmed was talking about was directly from a religious book.....nothing about what occurs today or what is legal.
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wait, who deleted your posts while keeping E-kul's drivel intact? ???
It's happened to me in the past as well, where an apparently offensive post of mine (to christians) was modified. Meanwhile all kinds of vile disgusting posts about muslims are left undeleted.
I have noticed this also.
There are always excuses.
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Exactly 18 is what I like. At 19 they start to get fat.
;D
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This is not the olden days man. Society now is different, as opposed to back then where people matured mentally way quicker due to living condition, and societal norms.
Trying to marry off people in and around puberty now would be a major injustice to these kids.
...on a side note, i'm surprised you can keep at it for this long without getting bored. Religion is like an obsession with you.
I know this thread is about the bible but!!
Psychopath just destroyed the critics of the prophet Muhammads marriage(peace be upon him)!
some foolish people make stupid claims, and call Muhammad(peace be upon him) diffrent bad names, But what they fail to understand, is Diffrent times, Diffrent customs
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I wonder when the christians were raping and killing women were asking them if they were 9 years old.
More Murder Rape and Pillage (Deuteronomy 20:10-14)
As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.
Murder, rape, and pillage at Jabesh-gilead (Judges 21:10-24 NLT)
So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan.
Rape of Female Captives (Deuteronomy 21:10-14 NAB)
"When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails and lay aside her captive's garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife. However, if later on you lose your liking for her, you shall give her her freedom, if she wishes it; but you shall not sell her or enslave her, since she was married to you under compulsion."
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Catholic tradition (they have better historical knowledge of their faith than most other christian groups) says Mary was approx 15 at time of conception. Young but not pedophilia age. And in addition to that of course the faith says she was a virgin.
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Catholic tradition (they have better historical knowledge of their faith than most other christian groups) says Mary was approx 15 at time of conception. Young but not pedophilia age. And in addition to that of course the faith says she was a virgin.
Which would mean she did not have sexual relations until at least 16 years of age, good point. I am Pentecostal as a Christian and we also have reason to believe Mary was 16 years old and theologians also believe this age as well.
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:o
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=475672.0;attach=515530;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=475672.0;attach=515531;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=475672.0;attach=515532;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=475672.0;attach=515534;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=475672.0;attach=515535;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=475672.0;attach=515536;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=475672.0;attach=515537;image)
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Same old justification for evil. Since someone else did something bad some other time in history...
It's ok for a Muslim to cut off an infidels head. It's actually become so predictable it's like a parody.
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Your rant doesn't even belong in this thread Ron. And the reason the mods were deleting had NOTHING to do with what you are ranting about and you know it.
Everything Ahmed was talking about was directly from a religious book.....nothing about what occurs today or what is legal.
Unfortunately in this instance you are simply incorrect, but that isn't your fault either. You just lack the context of the situation. All you see is ahmed being upset because MOS deleted his post about something in the bible and it appears "grossly unfair and biased". I also don't expect you to understand every facet of every thread either, but what is presented here and what is reality are two different things. I stepped away from the board last night so I wouldn't say something inappropriate to ahmed....I simply collected myself. See, I don't delete posts or threads "willy nilly" because I disagree with them; although, I have catered to the Muslims of the religion board and protected their posts and threads above virtually all others when I didn't have to (and I've taken a little heat because of it). I've deleted so many threads and posts about Islam they didn't even know existed (but certainly would've found offensive) and I didn't have to either. I have addressed every "report to moderator" request that has been submitted and done my level best to treat everyone with respect and kindness.
In this instance you're seeing a post which represents backlash from a related thread you don't see. In this case I made the simple claim that it wasn't cool for the Islamic prophet Muhammad to marry 6 year old Aisha and then have sex with her at age 9. Grown men having sex with children is simply not appropriate, but I gave board Muslims a simple out in this instance and basically said, "let's chalk this up to mistake on behalf of Muhammad and use it as an example of what not to do." They didn't take the out and instead chose to defend Muhammad having sex with a 9 year old girl. Again, I attempted to use some humor to cushion the moment and gave a second option for them to step away gracefully and basically said, "we all have wins and losses in life let's consider this incident an 'L' for Muhammad". Again, ahmed refused to relent and continued to defend the sex with a child.
It's at this point he invents a parallel between Muhammad having sex with 9-yr old Aisha and Mary and Jospeh (the parents of Jesus) having sex with each other as young kids. A couple of quick googles will find others claiming Mary was 12 years old when pregnant with Jesus, but none of that is biblical...it's plucked out of the air. We don't know Mary's age. ahmed was reaching to invent a unbiblical parallel with Mary's age in order to justify Muhammad having sex with a 9 year old.....that's it. I made it clear to ahmed I was not going to entertain this disgusting topic any further and in typical ahmed fashion he attempts to bring focus off the subject of Muhammad and Aisha through distraction and subversioin via the use of his invented parallel. He also googled every quick reference he could indicating instances of small children being married to older adults as further justification. In this instance he again shifted the focus to the "act of marriage with children" in order to distract from the "the act of sex with children" (as if it's somehow better). I deleted a number of these offbase posts and threads including the copy here on the General board, but all content is interrelated. He last immediate reposting of this same thread I let stand on the religion board as ahmed indicated that no matter what I did he would repost it when I'm not around. This begs the question: why is ahmed logging his posts offline? This isn't the first time one of his offensive posts have been deleted only to be instantly reposted. He knows exactly what he's doing and how offensive the content is.
I stand by what I did and what I said and I'd rather be demodded and my Getbig account banned then retract a word of it. There are fews things that make my blood boil, but defending something like this is one of them. Had they simply agreed that it wasn't the best choice for a man to have sex with a small child we could have moved forward and I would've respected them for it. I even indicated that the act is completely forgivable, but nope they choose to defend to the end.....so be it.
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I posted this on the General board and I'll post it here. It's a response to bikinislut so she could have the all important context of the situation:
Unfortunately in this instance you are simply incorrect, but that isn't your fault either. You just lack the context of the situation. All you see is ahmed being upset because MOS deleted his post about something in the bible and it appears "grossly unfair and biased". I also don't expect you to understand every facet of every thread either, but what is presented here and what is reality are two different things. I stepped away from the board last night so I wouldn't say something inappropriate to ahmed....I simply collected myself. See, I don't delete posts or threads "willy nilly" because I disagree with them; although, I have catered to the Muslims of the religion board and protected their posts and threads above virtually all others when I didn't have to (and I've taken a little heat because of it). I've deleted so many threads and posts about Islam they didn't even know existed (but certainly would've found offensive) and I didn't have to either. I have addressed every "report to moderator" request that has been submitted and done my level best to treat everyone with respect and kindness.
In this instance you're seeing a post which represents backlash from a related thread you don't see. In this case I made the simple claim that it wasn't cool for the Islamic prophet Muhammad to marry 6 year old Aisha and then have sex with her at age 9. Grown men having sex with children is simply not appropriate, but I gave board Muslims a simple out in this instance and basically said, "let's chalk this up to mistake on behalf of Muhammad and use it as an example of what not to do." They didn't take the out and instead chose to defend Muhammad having sex with a 9 year old girl. Again, I attempted to use some humor to cushion the moment and gave a second option for them to step away gracefully and basically said, "we all have wins and losses in life let's consider this incident an 'L' for Muhammad". Again, ahmed refused to relent and continued to defend the sex with a child.
It's at this point he invents a parallel between Muhammad having sex with 9-yr old Aisha and Mary and Jospeh (the parents of Jesus) having sex with each other as young kids. A couple of quick googles will find others claiming Mary was 12 years old when pregnant with Jesus, but none of that is biblical...it's plucked out of the air. We don't know Mary's age. ahmed was reaching to invent a unbiblical parallel with Mary's age in order to justify Muhammad having sex with a 9 year old.....that's it. I made it clear to ahmed I was not going to entertain this disgusting topic any further and in typical ahmed fashion he attempts to bring focus off the subject of Muhammad and Aisha through distraction and subversioin via the use of his invented parallel. He also googled every quick reference he could indicating instances of small children being married to older adults as further justification. In this instance he again shifted the focus to the "act of marriage with children" in order to distract from the "the act of sex with children" (as if it's somehow better). I deleted a number of these offbase posts and threads including the copy here on the General board, but all content is interrelated. He last immediate reposting of this same thread I let stand on the religion board as ahmed indicated that no matter what I did he would repost it when I'm not around. This begs the question: why is ahmed logging his posts offline? This isn't the first time one of his offensive posts have been deleted only to be instantly reposted. He knows exactly what he's doing and how offensive the content is.
I stand by what I did and what I said and I'd rather be demodded and my Getbig account banned then retract a word of it. There are fews things that make my blood boil, but defending something like this is one of them. Had they simply agreed that it wasn't the best choice for a man to have sex with a small child we could have moved forward and I would've respected them for it. I even indicated that the act is completely forgivable, but nope they choose to defend to the end.....so be it.
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I wonder when the christians were raping and killing women were asking them if they were 9 years old.
More Murder Rape and Pillage (Deuteronomy 20:10-14)
As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.
Murder, rape, and pillage at Jabesh-gilead (Judges 21:10-24 NLT)
So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan.
Rape of Female Captives (Deuteronomy 21:10-14 NAB)
"When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails and lay aside her captive's garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife. However, if later on you lose your liking for her, you shall give her her freedom, if she wishes it; but you shall not sell her or enslave her, since she was married to you under compulsion."
I'll be happy to discuss OT verses a little bit later....right now I'm a bit fried so you'll have to forgive me.
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Jesus is God. God impregnated a young, teenage girl (according to this information). Therefore, Jesus impregnated a young, teenage girl.
Are you Mormon, syntax? I've read that Mormons believe that God had physical sex with Mary. The bible doesn't indicate that. The Holy Spirit does not have a physical body.
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I DONT care what the average age of was in the past, but in this day and age, for an adult, it is 18. EIGHTEEN. EIGHT-TEEN. Get it.
It is pathetic when kids under 16 even think about it because they feel pressured. Enough.
Girls at the age of 12 is BULLSHIT! Get it! I have a daughter who is 9, I have lot's of friends of have 12 year old daughters.
They are capable of a lot of things, but their mind is not their yet. Simple as that.
We live in an age where we have been enlightened to understand that our kids can go to school, can learn to be anything they want, can take their time to enjoy life.
400 years ago people thought the earth was flat. They thought they needed to make sacrifices of people to earn the trust of gods.
150 years ago, they never thought they would be driving in cars, in planes.
50 years ago, what the hell was a computer
20 years ago, an Ipad.
So screw this crap, we are not going back to where freaking idiots ruined their kids because they thought it was the way it should be.
Don't we have enough of this around the world now?
Maybe in 20-30 years, they might be enlightened enough to get it soon too.
And this has NOTHING to do with religion, just ignorance.
So STOP WITH ANY FREAKING FORM of CHILD anything on this board.
It isnt the place, nor do I want it here. 18+ is what I like. End of story.
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time to find another arugment to use against islam. the typical "9 years old" nonsense wont, work anymore.
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Islam against dogs and orders muslims to kill them? - nope. another myth BUSTED.
this should be a MYTH BUSTED thread.
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Why does God like to play hide and seek? Maybe he should burst out through the clouds and set things straight for once.
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time to find another arugment to use against islam. the typical "9 years old" nonsense wont, work anymore.
Two days ago the ages of 6 and 9 were defended.....that still happened remember. ahmed even invented an unbiblical parallel with Mary and Joseph to somehow back himself up......that also happened. He threw every 10 second google he could at the argument to justify sex with a small child.
Today, after a bit of googlin and youtubin the age is magically 19 and the 6 and 9 (although previously defended) is now debunked....fantastic!!! Please note that the video author simply manipulates the date range to make his argument work. Plus he prefaces the argument with the notion that "he's refuting the lie that stupid Christians make because they don't understand Islam". LOL, the argument comes straight from Islamic material....there's no intervention on part of anyone else in the world....this is all Islam! This guy is disingenuous from moment one.
Here's another gentleman whose vids have been repeatedly posted.....here's his take:
Essentially for the first 2 minutes Dr. Naik discusses the theory of "19" with the invented concept of the missing ashara (magically adds 10 to 9 making 19....I checked the math) in the hadiths (according to the theories of modern Islamic scholars) and then he quickly comments that the hadiths in the Sahih Bukhari might not be authentic. Yet quickly closes this discussion by aluding to the fact that this notion isn't verifiable either, but that he believes the hadiths are authentic as are the ages of 6 and 9. In a nutshell we refer to this situation as "wishful thinking" on part of Islamic theologians. ahmed has often mentioned how inventive and creative Muslims are....he's right, they invent stuff all the time.
The remaining 3.5 minutes are then dedicated to justifying the "act of marriage" based upon ages of puberty and menstruation in young girls and how climate and other environmental factors influence puberty in girls worldwide. As if achieving puberty and "having Aunt Flo visit" somehow logically justifies the appropriateness of engaging in marriage? He even mentions that in the state of Texas the legal age to marry is 14. Guess what? I live in Texas and the legal age is 18. What he refers to is an instance in which young teens act irresponsibly and get pregnant at 14 and can then marry for the sake of the unborn child provided parental consent is given (none of that is mentioned though)....it isn't the standard it's a one-off disguised as the standard based on audience ignorance....classy.
That said, both videos focus (conveniently) on the "act of marriage at 9", but she was married at 6 and had sex at 9. It's the "act of sex with a child" that isn't mentioned. Fine, the first video author and Dr. Naik indicates marriage at 6 and consummation at 9 once; still, Dr. Naik completely redirects the focus to marriage at puberty. The attempt is to first justify marriage based on early ages of puberty via menstruation and thereby justify sex with the child .....nonsense....logical fallacy...most likely a nonsequitor.
And why bother with the soft, clinical term “consummated”? He had sex with a small girl…..he put his penis in a small child!! In my house that activity earns the perpetrator a quick, forced exit through a wall (a la Willie Coyote on an ACME rocket). Oh sure, physically a female child may hit puberty at 11, but that isn't a golden ticket to have sex with her because her body is “capable” (a completely subjective notion by the way). Children aren't emotionally prepared for such an act and those that claim they are often learn later in life (typically in the care of psychologist) that they weren't prepared. I can recall girls in the 3rd and 4th grade that had early menstruation and they were terrified by that situation in and of itself, but nevermind all that emotional maturity business, right? Aisha was light years beyond her age in maturity....yeah right. Plus it's the prophet Muhammad (pb&j) that engaged in the act so all is good because he's without fault and the perfect, righteous example for all to follow.....nonsense. He made a mistake so own it, learn from it, definitely don’t repeat it and that’s that.
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(http://i595.photobucket.com/albums/tt31/Doctor_Funkenstein/ChrisHansen.jpg)
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And what we can learn from them...found this book
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/47941.Bad_Girls_of_the_Bible (http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/47941.Bad_Girls_of_the_Bible)
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why is there so much incest, adultery, drunkness basically all rated R type things in the Bible? the Word of God wouldnt have such dirty and disgusting things. Bible isnt the true word of God anymore, it was at once, but not anymore. Humans tainted it.
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why is there so much incest, adultery, drunkness basically all rated R type things in the Bible? the Word of God wouldnt have such dirty and disgusting things. Bible isnt the true word of God anymore, it was at once, but not anymore. Humans tainted it.
The bible tells the story of God working through the lives of people to deliver them from their sinful ways. Why are disgusting acts such as murder, rape, slavery, incest, adultery, drunkness, etc...included in the bible? Because it directly addresses the reality and history of the sin of people and culminates with how all can be forever delivered from that sin through the Son of God Jesus Christ.
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What is the point of including verses such as a woman lusting after men's penises that are the size of donkeys? Godly language? There is nothing educational from that, except porn. Imagine children being enlightened reading about donkey size penises in the bible
But more importantly, the verse about Mary being betrothed to Joseph before even being married to Jesus. That's the verse you hate being shown the most. Because bible scholars conclude she was in the 11-14 age when she gave birth to Jesus. Most people will try to push for the older number which is 14. Those that claim 17, 19, 20+ lol... are revisionists who try to conform to the British established age of consent.
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I love how you can start bashing Islam, Muslims, Muhammad (pbuh), etc... alongside an atheist that equally hates you but is two faced in order to attack Islam with you and you play along but then go into denial and start deleting my thread and posts relating to the age of Mary (pbuh).
All I was stating are the facts, such as the age of boys with bar mitzvah, meaning of it, the age of girls being married all up until the last two centuries, and the real reason for the age of consent being etsablish. Historical and cultural comparison around the world and the differences in maturity and other factors.
According to standard Jewish custom of the time of Jesus, girls were betrothed around the age of twelve or twelve and a half.[7] During the betrothal period, which lasted about a year, the marriage was not consummated and the bride remained in her parent's house.[8] Betrothal was formalised by a contract regulating such matters as the transfer of property and provision for the wife and children should the husband die; voiding the contract required a divorce document freeing the girl to remarry.[9]
^ Deiss 2010, p. 25.
^ Lachs 1987, p. 6.
^ Saldarini 2003, p. 1007.
It was indeed common for people to marry young. The fact that Britishers had child prostitution and abuse problems does not change the fact that in the rest of the world people married young. Rape, abuse and prostitution are one thing, but marriage is another. Whether you like it or disagree with it. Personally no I would never marry someone younger than me and a teen, in fact I married someone 4 years older than me as I found them mature. Age is but a number.
It is unrealistic in today's western society for someone the age of 12 to marry as they are totally immature mentally compared to girls or boys from the rest of the world and from the past. A 15 year old can't do squat now a days and is spoiled, hell most 20 year olds are. That does not however mean that every 15, 20, whatever year old is immature in the rest of the world or even in the west just because the majority are.
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What is the point of including verses such as a woman lusting after men's penises that are the size of donkeys? Godly language? There is nothing educational from that, except porn. Imagine children being enlightened reading about donkey size penises in the bible
"But more importantly, the verse about Mary being betrothed to Joseph before even being married to Jesus. That's the verse you hate being shown the most." Because bible scholars conclude she was in the 11-14 age when she gave birth to Jesus. Most people will try to push for the older number which is 14. Those that claim 17, 19, 20+ lol... are revisionists who try to conform to the British established age of consent.
"What is the point of including verses such as a woman lusting after men's penises that are the size of donkeys? Godly language? There is nothing educational from that, except porn. Imagine children being enlightened reading about donkey size penises in the bible"
Here's end of chapter 23 that addresses their despicable acts and God's treatment of such things:
37 for they have committed adultery and blood is on their hands. They committed adultery with their idols; they even sacrificed their children, whom they bore to me, as food for them. 38 They have also done this to me: At that same time they defiled my sanctuary and desecrated my Sabbaths. 39 On the very day they sacrificed their children to their idols, they entered my sanctuary and desecrated it. That is what they did in my house.
46 “This is what the Sovereign Lord says: Bring a mob against them and give them over to terror and plunder. 47 The mob will stone them and cut them down with their swords; they will kill their sons and daughters and burn down their houses.
48 “So I will put an end to lewdness in the land, that all women may take warning and not imitate you. 49 You will suffer the penalty for your lewdness and bear the consequences of your sins of idolatry. Then you will know that I am the Sovereign Lord.”
The reason is pretty straightforward and included right there in the same chapter.
"But more importantly, the verse about Mary being betrothed to Joseph before even being married to Jesus. That's the verse you hate being shown the most."
There is no such verse. Mary didn't marry Jesus.
"Because bible scholars conclude she was in the 11-14 age when she gave birth to Jesus. Most people will try to push for the older number which is 14. Those that claim 17, 19, 20+ lol... are revisionists who try to conform to the British established age of consent."
We don't know Mary's age and I already knew what scholars have said. I've posted about it in the past.
I love how you can start bashing Islam, Muslims, Muhammad (pbuh), etc...
I honestly stopped reading here because I haven't bashed Islam or Muslims, but make no mistake I completely disagree with what Muhammad did to Aisha....I find it disgusting. And I'm offended by attempts to justify it by continually inventing justfications.
Now, since Ron has asked that topics of marriage to and sex with small children not be defended or publicized on his site this thread will join the already locked thread. If Ron chooses to delete it we will let him do that.