Author Topic: Aiki Budo (Read 960856 times)

Donny · « **Reply #400 on:** June 26, 2024, 05:56:51 AM »

Tenjin Shinyo Ryu Jujutsu also another big influence in Judo

Donny · « **Reply #401 on:** June 26, 2024, 06:28:38 AM »

When you actually look into the system of Judo & it´s origins then you realise how Jigaro kano was such an educator & Master.
The system he developed beat traditional ju justsu school in fights.
Brilliant

IroNat · « **Reply #402 on:** June 26, 2024, 11:50:59 AM »

The early black & white video is from what year?

Donny · « **Reply #403 on:** June 29, 2024, 03:09:24 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on June 26, 2024, 11:50:59 AM

The early black & white video is from what year?

not sure but Jigaro Kano met with representatives of the leading Ju jutsu schools (Ryus) of Japan on the 24 July 1905 at the Butokukai institute in Kyoto.

They agreed on the Kata´s to be preserved in Judo.

I would think the Video is from around or between 1871-1882 ( formation of Kodokan Judo).

From a technical point of view in Judo the Atemi Waza (striking) & Katame-waza (Grappling) are from the Tenjin-shinyo school
& the nage-waza ( throwing)from the Kito School

IroNat · « **Reply #404 on:** June 29, 2024, 03:40:58 AM »

Quote from: Donny on June 29, 2024, 03:09:24 AM

not sure but Jigaro Kano met with representatives of the leading Ju jutsu schools (Ryus) of Japan on the 24 July 1905 at the Butokukai institute in Kyoto.

They agreed on the Kata´s to be preserved in Judo.

I would think the Video is from around or between 1871-1882 ( formation of Kodokan Judo).

From a technical point of view in Judo the Atemi Waza (striking) & Katame-waza (Grappling) are from the Tenjin-shinyo school
& the nage-waza ( throwing)from the Kito School

Must be a bit later than that. I don't think film was invented at that time.

Very cool video.

Donny · « **Reply #405 on:** June 29, 2024, 04:44:10 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on June 29, 2024, 03:40:58 AM

Must be a bit later than that. I don't think film was invented at that time.

Very cool video.

yes true probably early 1900´s as this video is 1912

IroNat · « **Reply #406 on:** June 30, 2024, 06:00:54 AM »

^Nothing new under the sun.

The same techniques still being taught today in bjj.

Modern contest Judo is silly compared to what is shown in that video.

The Olympic versions of martial arts (TKD, Judo, wrestling) have been watered down and reduced.

Thanks for posting.

Donny · « **Reply #407 on:** June 30, 2024, 06:18:41 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on June 30, 2024, 06:00:54 AM

^Nothing new under the sun.

The same techniques still being taught today in bjj.

Modern contest Judo is silly compared to what is https://www.getbig.com/boards/Themes/default/images/bbc/bold.gifshown in that video.

The Olympic versions of martial arts (TKD, Judo, wrestling) have been watered down and reduced.

Thanks for posting.

BJJ has as you know it´s roots in Judo , although some BJJ people still dispute this.
No Judo..no BJJ .. although i think they modified it with their own ideas, this then is advancement.
As mentioned before in the thread Kosen Judo is probably a closer cousin of BJJ.

IroNat · « **Reply #408 on:** June 30, 2024, 08:31:37 AM »

Quote from: Donny on June 30, 2024, 06:18:41 AM

BJJ has as you know it´s roots in Judo , although some BJJ people still dispute this.
No Judo..no BJJ .. although i think they modified it with their own ideas, this then is advancement.
As mentioned before in the thread Kosen Judo is probably a closer cousin of BJJ.

Judo has its roots in Jiu-Jitsu. Anytime you see "do" it is a watered down style. If you see "Jitsu" it is the killing combat version.

Aiki-do vs. Aiki-jitsu

Ju-do vs. Jiu- jitsu

Kano watered down Jiu-Jitsu into Judo like Shotokan karate was watered down Okinanwan karate by Funakoshi to make it marketable to mainland Japan.
The story is that a Japanese Jiu-Jitsu expert came over to Brazil and taught the elder Gracie.

Gracie made it into a defensive style that was good for one-on-one sport type fighting.

Donny · « **Reply #409 on:** June 30, 2024, 08:40:30 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on June 30, 2024, 08:31:37 AM

Judo has its roots in Jiu-Jitsu.

Judo is watered down Jiu-Jitsu.

Yes as i explained in two main schools of Ju Jutsu, not "BJJ"

Judo is indeed "watered down" in competition Judo & as you know it is an Olympic sport.
truly a high achievement for the founder Jigaro Kano who was an educator.

On the subject of being "watered down" Judo actually beat the other Ju Jutsu styles

IroNat · « **Reply #410 on:** June 30, 2024, 08:47:51 AM »

Quote from: Donny on June 30, 2024, 08:40:30 AM

Yes as i explained in two main schools of Ju Jutsu, not "BJJ"

Judo is indeed "watered down" in competition Judo & as you know it is an Olympic sport.
truly a high achievement for the founder Jigaro Kano who was an educator.

On the subject of being "watered down" Judo actually beat the other Ju Jutsu styles

No, the Judo guys either used jitsu techniques or there were rules preventing Jiu-jitsu techniques.

Like MMA and BJJ sport does not allow some of the dangerous techniques.

IroNat · « **Reply #411 on:** June 30, 2024, 08:51:48 AM »

These early contests were often political and full of bullshit.

Mas Oyama's Kyokushin matches between his guys and Chinese and Muay Thai fighters were total bullshit and setup to guarantee Japanese victories.

Donny · « **Reply #412 on:** June 30, 2024, 08:53:32 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on June 30, 2024, 08:47:51 AM

No, the Judo guys either used jitsu techniques or there were rules preventing Jiu-jitsu techniques.

Like MMA and BJJ sport does not allow some of the dangerous techniques.

even if they did use as you wrote "Ju Jutsu" techniques which is the roots of Judo, is that then not a fair fight?

don´t understand your logic here

Donny · « **Reply #413 on:** June 30, 2024, 08:55:05 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on June 30, 2024, 08:51:48 AM

These early contests were often political and full of bullshit.

Mas Oyama's Kyokushin matches between his guys and Chinese and Muay Thai fighters were total bullshit and setup to guarantee Japanese victories.

we are talking about Judo & Ju Jutsu here & the roots.

IroNat · « **Reply #414 on:** June 30, 2024, 10:17:45 AM »

Quote from: Donny on June 30, 2024, 08:53:32 AM

even if they did use as you wrote "Ju Jutsu" techniques which is the roots of Judo, is that then not a fair fight?

don´t understand your logic here

If they used Jiu-jitsu then it wasn't Judo, it was Jiu-jitsu.

Donny · « **Reply #415 on:** July 01, 2024, 03:55:34 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on June 30, 2024, 10:17:45 AM

If they used Jiu-jitsu then it wasn't Judo, it was Jiu-jitsu.

The whole point of the contest was to prove that Kano´s system of Judo was superior, which it was as the results showed this.

His techniques were modern & different to traditional Ju Jutsu so therefor it was Judo.

Judo Vs Ju Jutsu

IroNat · « **Reply #416 on:** July 01, 2024, 04:42:58 AM »

Quote from: Donny on July 01, 2024, 03:55:34 AM

The whole point of the contest was to prove that Kano´s system of Judo was superior, which it was as the results showed this.

His techniques were modern & different to traditional Ju Jutsu so therefor it was Judo.

Judo Vs Ju Jutsu

Politics. Just like Oyama's fixed contests.

Donny · « **Reply #417 on:** July 01, 2024, 04:53:23 AM »

Quote from: IroNat on July 01, 2024, 04:42:58 AM

Politics. Just like Oyama's fixed contests.

well none of us were there to really know but all i can say is Judo reached Olympic status & has the highest following around the world of any martial art.

Kano was an educator & had different goals than the Ju Jutsu schools.
also most of these traditional schools died out.
Most "Jui Jitsu" we see nowadays were created much later on.