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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: tommywishbone on December 30, 2013, 05:51:05 PM
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Embarrassing. Pitiful. Shameful. Misha sold $10,000,000 in PPV buys alone and she was paid $28,000. Disgraceful.
Champ Chris Weidman: $400,000 (includes $200,000 win bonus)
def. Anderson Silva: $600,000
Champ Ronda Rousey: $100,000 (includes $50,000 win bonus)
def. Miesha Tate: $28,000
Travis Browne: $56,000 (includes $28,000 win bonus)
def. Josh Barnett: $170,000
Jim Miller: $92,000 (includes $46,000 win bonus)
def. Fabricio Camoes: $8,000
Dustin Poirier: $46,000 (includes $23,000 win bonus)
def. Diego Brandao: $20,000*
Uriah Hall: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus)
def. Chris Leben: $51,000
Michael Johnson: $36,000 (includes $18,000 win bonus)
def. Gleison Tibau: $39,000
Dennis Siver: $66,000 (includes $33,000 win bonus)
def. Manny Gamburyan: $25,000
John Howard: $32,000 (includes $16,000 win bonus)
def. Siyar Bahadurzada: $17,000
William Macario: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus)
def. Bobby Voelker: $12,000
Robert Peralta: $24,000 (includes $12,000 win bonus)
def. Estevan Payan: $10,000
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back to mowing lawns for estevan payan
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Weidman, Silva, and Rousey probably got a % of the PPV. Tate definitely got screwed out of cash though.
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The irony is 99% of UFC fighters would make more if they went g4p versus their UFC pay.
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I have ALWAYS said this. Since it was NHB. Life on the line for a few hundred dollars. :(
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Weidman, Silva, and Rousey probably got a % of the PPV. Tate definitely got screwed out of cash though.
Weidman & Silva probably received $2.00 for every PPV buy. Rousy & Tate perhaps $1.00 per PPV buy. Those numbers are close. Still pitiful.
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I have ALWAYS said this. Since it was NHB. Life on the line for a few hundred dollars. :(
And don't most of them have to pay trainers etc out of winnings?
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Take half away for taxes.
Then after there is half left... pay the people they owe money, pay their trainers, coaches, gym fees, equipment fees, ped fees, etc
left with shit
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Take half away for taxes.
Then after there is half left... pay the people they owe money, pay their trainers, coaches, gym fees, equipment fees, ped fees, etc
left with shit
No wonder so many of the TUF guys are living at gyms or at home. Chris was broke before the first Silva fight.
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Until they unionize and quit being company men and women it will always be this way. It's fucking pathetic. Dana and the Fertitta (sp?) brothers should have their asses kicked for this shit.
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Cue Debbie Downer. Evan Tanner posted another journal entry today about how he’s already lost all the money he earned from UFC 82, and is now completely broke.
Like, broke to the point of digging through dirty laundry and storage boxes, just to find enough change to buy a can of off-brand tuna, which is all he’s been consisting on for days.
Hungry, and without money to buy food. Like, homeless person broke. And why? Because he spent a week and a half in a casino, just trying to win enough cash to pay his bills, and other debts, and ended up losing what little he actually had.
And also? He’d do it all over again if he could.
The subtext here is that Evan Tanner has replaced the delusions and denials of an alcohol addiction for the delusions and denials of a gambling addiction, but I’m not sure if he’s made the connection yet.
I’m tempted to just copy+paste his entire heartbreaking/infuriating story, but here’s the meat of it:
For those of you who don’t know, when a fighter competes in the UFC, the purse is usually broken into two equal parts. There is a guaranteed purse the fighter receives just for showing up, and then there is the bonus purse, the other half, the fighter receives if he wins the fight. I knew that if I won the fight, I would be able to get everyone paid back, pay off the invoices I owed for the Team Tanner gear, pay my web designer, and have enough left over to get me to my next fight. Well, as we all know, the fight didn’t go as well as I had hoped. I only got the guaranteed purse, minus the medicals and other deductions. Considering the amount of money I owed, this didn’t really leave me much money to work with.
What was most important to me, more important than my own comfort, was paying back the people that had helped me out, and paying off my obligations. It is nothing more than a man should do.
But then it hit me, the thought that I could take what I had left down to the casino, and that maybe, just maybe I would get lucky, and make enough money to pay the last of my bills. That’s what I did. I took my money down to the casino……And I did get lucky, lucky enough to think I was going to get it done. I played hard. I don’t do anything halfway. I put my time in. I was so deep into it that I lost reference. I went at is for a week and a half, staying up all night, playing blackjack for 24 hours straight sometimes, forgetting to eat, not wanting to sleep…
In the end, I lost not only what I had won, but the little bit I had started out with as well. So I spent a week and a half gambling, staying up all night, not eating, dealing with all of the emotional ups and down of winning and losing, and I don’t have much to show for it, except that now I’m broke, I’m feeling really worn out, I’m a little depressed, and my sleep scedule is backwards.
Now you may ask if I regret it, if I would do it differently if I could, if I would take it back. NOT A CHANCE!!!!! … I went for it. I put it all on the line. I always will. I knew what the consequences would be if I failed, and I was willing to accept them. So any of you reading who might be feeling a twinge of sympathy, don’t. I made my decisions, and I accept the consequences. I’m no victim. And to those who are thinking about preaching at me, don’t bother. I won’t hear you. I haven’t accomplished anything in this life worth remembering by playing it safe. That’s boring to me anyway.
Great accomplishment only comes with great risk. I’ll accept the crippling, gut wrenching disappointment of risking all, and failing, but only by putting my whole heart and soul, my whole being into something, will I have the chance to walk among the stars. Those who risk nothing, those who live their lives in fear, will never have that chance. Failure is not a sin. It’s being too afraid to even try, that is a sin.
…which I guess is a noble attitude, if we were talking about anything other than gambling in Vegas. Failure, according to my definition, is putting up your tuna money against the turn of a card, and for an addict, success means avoiding risky behavior altogether. Evan will undoubtedly relapse unless he gets into a program, with a sponsor, somewhere far away from his current situation. We hope he realizes that those who are “preaching” at him only want to save his life.
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http://www.cagepotato.com/evan-tanner-is-dead-broke/
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Yes...but with PPV earnings and endorsements these athletes can't be doing that bad.
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I wonder who's footing the bill for Silva's broken leg?
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For those of you who don’t know, when a fighter competes in the UFC, the purse is usually broken into two equal parts.
There is a guaranteed purse the fighter receives just for showing up, and then there is the bonus purse, the other half, the fighter receives if he wins the fight.
I knew that if I won the fight, I would be able to get every one paid back, pay off the invoices I owed for the Team Tanner gear, pay my web designer, and have enough left over to get me to my next fight.
Well, as we all know, the fight didn’t go as well as I had hoped. I only got the guaranteed purse, minus the medicals, and other deductions.
Considering the amount of money I owed, this didn’t really leave me much money to work with.
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sponsor money can get them by
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Steve how come these guys don't unionize? Are they afraid?
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Rousey and Tate each got 75K for Fight of the Night bonus, and Rousey got an additional 75K for Submission of the Night bonus
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Rousey and Tate each got 75K for Fight of the Night bonus, and Rousey got an additional 75K for Submission of the Night bonus
True. Good point. That helps but those numbers are still humiliating.
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MMA is way more popular right now then boxing. Last major boxing event, how much did the main event guys get paid? A few million each??? And Silva, Weidman, Tate, Rousey get less than $1mill combined
BRUTAL...shameful
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Fighting has been and always will be a MUGS GAME.
And the guy who lasted a minute before being knocked into unconscious oblivion by a few well placed elbow smashes was the third highest earner on the card.
I am sure the $170,000 will help Josh get over the loss. I am sure he won't be able to demand such a figure next fight around.
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I'm assuming these fighters can't work normal jobs due to their training regimen.
So let's say the average American makes between $40000 - $60000 per year. They get this just for showing up.
How much does a trainer/gym cost?
Isn't there travel paid for by UFC, as well as accommodations?
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. Misha sold $10,000,000 in PPV buys alone and she was paid $28,000. Disgraceful.
Misha didn't sell shit ( she sucks), $28000 more than she deserves.
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Steve how come these guys don't unionize? Are they afraid?
They're just like IFBB pros. The top guys are selfish and they can't collectively agree to do shit as there's thousands of fighters in the wings waiting for their shot should the fighters try organise themselves... The best thing that can ever happen is that Bellator starts gaining momentum and the fighters then can choose/play the companies off each other for sweeter deals.
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how many people purchased the Mr O webcast?
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These athletes are by no means starving.
How much do you think these guys should be making and why?
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I guess they are scared of being on the black list.
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Yes...but with PPV earnings and endorsements these athletes can't be doing that bad.
Just like pro bodybuilders a lot of them just get supplements, clothing, a small monthly stipend, etc. Really not much at all.
It just seems like there's no money in MMA. It's blowing up quickly enough but no one wants to open their pocketbooks and pay these guys. :-\
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Ronda won fight of the night and submission of the night.
That's 75k for each of those.....
Dana Pays people to finish fights and be entertaining. The basic entry level UFC fight pay is 8k to fight and 8k for the win. Only the top guys are making any real money and can negotiate decent contracts.
The UFC has over 450 male athletes. The Ultimate Fighter Tv show has flooded the divisions with guys that shouldn't be there. Slim down the roster and increase the athlete pay. Cut down on the number of UFC events fill the cards with high level competition. Most of the UFC on Fuel, UFC on Fox and Fight Night shows are full of no names.....
One big problem for fighters in the last 2-3 years is that sponsers are no longer throwing around money like the early 2000's the chuck Lidell era.
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Until they unionize and quit being company men and women it will always be this way. It's fucking pathetic. Dana and the Fertitta (sp?) brothers should have their asses kicked for this shit.
I am not a fan of every union but you are so right in this instance - the fighters cannot demand the pay on their own because they have no alternative - Dana the Great on the other hand can find knuckleheads a plenty and sell his tickets.. I am all about capitalism and turning a profit but monopoly I am not.
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I just don't feel bad for these fighters. They've made this choice and they are probably doing better than 90% of the population.
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Another thing keeping their prize money down is that there's a decent card on every month..
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Nobody's forcing them to do this. They either unionize, or continue to take it up the ass.
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This is interesting. Commodities broker! :)
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1649483-john-cholish-explains-how-much-it-costs-to-be-a-ufc-fighter
The subject of fighter pay in the sport of mixed martial arts has been an ongoing debate for several years with no one coming to a consensus on whether the salaries are good, bad or otherwise.
Most recently, former UFC lightweight John Cholish, who retired following his last fight at UFC on FX 8, came out against what he perceived to be poor fighter pay structures, and it eventually led to his exit from the sport.
Cholish, who still works a full-time job as a commodities broker on Wall Street, says that he didn't even break even for his most recent fight where he traveled to Brazil to face Gleison Tibau on the undercard at UFC on FX 8.
He's spoken out quite a bit lately about the fighter pay issues since his fight on Saturday, but he doesn't expect many others to follow suit because of their need for the UFC paycheck.
"Zuffa is a private company so they don't have to disclose a lot of their information, and again this is my personal opinion, I'm not saying it's for anyone else but I've spoken to a vast array of fighters from top level guys to mid-tier guys to lower level guys and I feel at least the guys I've spoken with kind of have that same feeling of maybe they're not being fully compensated the way that they should be. But guys are scared," Cholish stated when speaking to MMA's Great Debate Radio.
"If you don't have a secondary source of income, if this is your primary source of income and your full-time job and Dana (White) has been very clear this past year they are going to be cutting a lot of guys from the roster. Top name guys like Jon Fitch that was a huge debate at the time when it happened when he got cut and moved to a different organization.
"I think people are scared and fear the repercussions. I'm in a position where I can kind of speak out and I don't need the fighter income."
Instead of just making a blanket statement about what he believes is poor pay for the fighters, Cholish broke down exactly what it costs (in his case at least) to train, travel and prepare for a fight in the UFC.
The money involved in Cholish's case are probably similar to other fighters, but he makes it clear that he can only speak towards what his contract and financial situation with the UFC was for his fighting career.
"Just to be clear I've not seen any other fighters' contracts. Maybe I'm this one guy that has this terrible contract," Cholis said. "Although I doubt it because it's probably a carbon copy, but this is just kind of my experience and what I've dealt with."
(It also must be noted these figures do not account for sponsorships that Cholish may have received—only the base pay he reported from the UFC.)
Training Camp Costs: $8,000 to $12,000
Before a fighter even steps foot in the Octagon, there is a long process of getting ready for the bout. Typically a fighter will receive six to eight weeks to prepare for a bout (although that timeline can be shorter or longer depending on the notice given for a fight), and that's how he structures a camp to get ready.
Cholish trains primarily out of the Renzo Gracie Academy in New York City under coaches like famed jiu-jitsu instructor John Danaher, and with other trainers like Phil Nurse, who works with several high-profile UFC fighters including welterweight champion Georges St-Pierre.
"This is just gym fees, travel expenses, making sure you're eating the right stuff, and not talking day-to-day stuff like breakfast, lunch and dinner. More like supplements, training gear, all that top to bottom. I'd say roughly between $4,000 to $6,000 a month when you look at it," Cholish revealed. "Again, I live in New York City so I understand costs may be a little bit higher than they are other places, but it's expensive to train at top places and with individuals."
Those numbers seem in line with what other fighters have stated in the past regarding a top-notch training camp.
UFC featherweight Chad Mendes, who was supposed to fight at UFC 157 before several opponents dropped out due to injury, had to postpone his training camp to prepare instead for a fight in late April at UFC on Fox 7. Speaking with MMAJunkie.com at the time, Mendes' numbers were very similar to those given by Cholish for what a professional training camp should cost.
I go through a camp, and I spend my own money. I'll go $6,000 or $7,000 or even $10,000 in, and then right before the fight it falls through. I don't get that money back, so that in itself is frustrating, let alone having to kill myself for nothing.
Pre-Fight Medicals
Before a fighter steps into the cage to compete in the UFC, he must first undergo a series of medical exams to gain clearance for a fight. Those tests can range from a typical physical to blood tests to a CAT scan or eye exam if necessary.
Cholish says after suffering an injury before his last scheduled fight in December 2012, he had all of his pre-fight medicals done, but some of the tests required by the commission expired before his next bout so he had to redo many of them again.
While he can't speak to the exact costs of medicals required because his own personal insurance (paid by his brokerage house employer) picked up the tab, he did happen to get a bill by accident for some of the bloodwork that was required before he traveled to Brazil.
"I actually had my medicals for the Yves Edwards fight, which expired by a very brief period of time and I had to get my medicals done again," Cholish explained. "Fortunately, I have insurance that is kind of able to cover it, but the bloodwork alone I got a bill that they misprocessed and didn't go to my insurance was almost $800. Just for the bloodwork."
Cholish says that while he did not incur the costs of the medicals because of his own insurance, his understanding is that fighters are responsible for the cost of those tests out of pocket.
"It's not cheap and it's not free. From my understanding (of medicals), yes it is (the fighter's responsibility)," Cholish said.
Travel Expenses: Estimated for Brazil Near $4,000
As part of his contract for a fight, Cholish explains that the UFC will pay for his flight and hotel for a fight (in this case, his trip to Brazil) along with one coach or corner person. In addition to those costs, the UFC will cover the expenses to pay for a visa to travel to Brazil for both the fighter and his coach ($500 a piece).
Cholish explains however that while the UFC does pay for him and a coach to make the trip, almost no fighter will go into a bout at that level without at least two other coaches or corner people to work the fight.
"For me how it was set up for Brazil, I have two flights covered so for me and for one coach and then you get one hotel room. The hotel we're actually staying at only had two single beds in it so there weren't any queen-sized beds, not that I would have four grown men sleep together in a bed.
"So, for example, when I had my fight in Toronto, you have to pay for two additional flights for two coaches. You have to pay for another hotel room, which they make you get there on Monday or Tuesday. So it's usually for four or five nights so that adds up," Cholish explained.
"I choose to take care of my coaches' meals while they are there. Again, I don't think they should have to pay out of pocket to be there. For Brazil as well there was a $500 visa fee, that was included for coaches.
"You also have to pay for your corner licensing, you have to pay for your medicals before the fight, so it might not seem like a lot but when you start adding it together. Especially a flight to Brazil costs $1,500 or $1,600 a piece and you're only making $8,000, it chips away pretty quickly.
International Taxes: $2,160
When the UFC travels internationally, the fighters that compete there must also pay additional taxes to the country where the card takes place. When a fight takes place in Canada, the competitors traveling there from the United States have to pay Canadian taxes before getting their money for the fights.
Fighting in Brazil, Cholish explains that the tax is 27 percent of the take home pay. In his case his contracted rate to fight was $8,000 (he would have won an additional $8000 with a win). Before he receives any pay from the UFC, Brazil taxes take $2,160 from his $8,000 paycheck.
"Brazil takes 27 percent before you even get the money. That comes right out," Cholish said. "Same thing as Canada, they take their money before you leave."
Joe Camporeale-USA TODAY Sports
On top of the taxes taken by each individual country, the fighters are still responsible for paying taxes in their home country of origin as well. So after paying the $2,160 to Brazil, Cholish still owes taxes to the United States government as well for income earned.
Final Analysis
While there are no hard numbers on what each individual fighter spends on a training camp, in Cholish's case based on the dollar amounts he gave, his bout at UFC on FX 8 would end up costing him more than $6,000 out of pocket ($8,000 show money - $2,160 for taxes = gross pay of $5,840. $8,000 for training camp + $4,000 for travel with coaches).
Those figures also don't reflect any additional money Cholish would have paid for his coaches to eat in Brazil or other expenditures, such as medical costs that in this case he did not have to pay for before the fight.
Cholish isn't sure there is a perfect answer to this problem either outside of the UFC paying their fighters a higher sum of money or possibly setting up to pay some sort of fees for training camps, travel costs, etc.
Many experts point to a fighter union that would run in similar fashion to those in other major sports like the NFL or Major League Baseball, but Cholish admits that at the heart of it all MMA is an individual sport, not a team sport, and that's going to make it harder to convince the fighters making the most to give up something for those making the least.
"I am in no means asking them to step down, you can't blame them," Cholish said about the UFC's top earners. "They worked really hard to get where they're at and they're finally getting paid. Why should they stick their neck out especially when if one or two of them does it, is it really going to be enough? So unfortunately I don't think a union is a base way to go."
Cholish believes that the fans are the real voice that will force the UFC to change the way they pay fighters. He's started a campaign on Twitter called #PayTheFighters hoping to bring this subject up more often to the higher ups at the UFC.
"I think the biggest impact will be fans and social media," Cholish stated. "UFC is a private company. They work for money, where do they get their money from? The fans."
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The UFC boasts about how it pays all it's athletes medical bills etc...Sure the top guys they do...
But if you're a low level 2 fight rookie, there have been countless stories of guys jumping through hoops to try to get The UFC to sign off on MRI's and X-Rays etc.....
MMA being a relatively new sport... Check out the Bitterness of guys that have retired.... Guys like Ken Shamrock, even Mayhem Miller, laying into Dana White about him using guys up and kicking them to the curb Vince Macmahon style...
In 20 years you'll have a lot of retired MMA fighters with average bank accounts, no transferable skills and a host of injury and fight related medical problems.....
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I just don't feel bad for these fighters. They've made this choice and they are probably doing better than 90% of the population.
I'll sleep easy tonight, but as a big MMA fan I do wish that the disparity in pay cheques would be balanced out. These guys have expensive fight camps and I'd like to see more competitive, well compensated fighters stepping into the octagon and cages. If they're not well taken care of, the fans will suffer too.
It's kind of embarrassing to watch guys throw on their sponsor's t-shirt as quickly as they can after a fight, or worse, throwing on a set of headphones and holding an empty can of Xyience...
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how many people purchased the Mr O webcast?
the what?
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lol at boxers making more money when no one cares about boxing anymore unless Mayweather is fighting somebody
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great post walter
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These athletes are by no means starving.
How much do you think these guys should be making and why?
They get pay what they deserve , they know it and Dana White knows it ,that's why they do it without complaining ,actually they beg to be part of the UFC .
95% of the UFC fighters are replaceable , there are some good talents but nothing extraordinaire ,I hope this helps .
UFC
Where a guy can become World Champion and being called ''the baddest man on the planet'' with only 2 pro fights (Lesnar )
Where a rookie with 9 pro fights can beat the greatest MMA fighter of all time no once but twice (Weidman ),maybe the greatest wasn't that great.
Where you can become a World Champion without even fighting for the title (Rousey )
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back to mowing lawns for estevan payan
LOL..... ;D ;D....he'll drink corona with his prize money first
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I'll sleep easy tonight, but as a big MMA fan I do wish that the disparity in pay cheques would be balanced out. These guys have expensive fight camps and I'd like to see more competitive, well compensated fighters stepping into the octagon and cages. If they're not well taken care of, the fans will suffer too.
It's kind of embarrassing to watch guys throw on their sponsor's t-shirt as quickly as they can after a fight, or worse, throwing on a set of headphones and holding an empty can of Xyience...
LMFAO
It's hilarious during the post fight interviews with Rogan, you can here a guy off camera screaming "Hold the can, hold the can" and then you see a hand passing the empty can of energy drink to the fighter to hold during the interview.
And what's with those ridiculous Headphones. Weidmans entire camp was wearing them! Matt Serra, Ray Longo, even Weidmans dad had a pair slung around his neck. Fucking Ronda Rousey was walking out to the ring with a pair on !
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Embarrassing. Pitiful. Shameful. Misha sold $10,000,000 in PPV buys alone and she was paid $28,000. Disgraceful.
Champ Chris Weidman: $400,000 (includes $200,000 win bonus)
def. Anderson Silva: $600,000
Champ Ronda Rousey: $100,000 (includes $50,000 win bonus)
def. Miesha Tate: $28,000
Travis Browne: $56,000 (includes $28,000 win bonus)
def. Josh Barnett: $170,000
Jim Miller: $92,000 (includes $46,000 win bonus)
def. Fabricio Camoes: $8,000
Dustin Poirier: $46,000 (includes $23,000 win bonus)
def. Diego Brandao: $20,000*
Uriah Hall: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus)
def. Chris Leben: $51,000
Michael Johnson: $36,000 (includes $18,000 win bonus)
def. Gleison Tibau: $39,000
Dennis Siver: $66,000 (includes $33,000 win bonus)
def. Manny Gamburyan: $25,000
John Howard: $32,000 (includes $16,000 win bonus)
def. Siyar Bahadurzada: $17,000
William Macario: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus)
def. Bobby Voelker: $12,000
Robert Peralta: $24,000 (includes $12,000 win bonus)
def. Estevan Payan: $10,000
How the fuck did misha tate sell 10 million buys? You think people ordered pay per view to see an average mma female fighter lose?
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Weidman, Silva, and Rousey probably got a % of the PPV. Tate definitely got screwed out of cash though.
How did tate get screwed? She's an average fighter who was coming into the fight after taking a beating from cat zingano. The fact that she was even allowed to face rhonda again is a travesty.
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How the fuck did misha tate sell 10 million buys? You think people ordered pay per view to see an average mma female fighter lose?
Exactly she ain't shit.
The only female fighter that can really fight is Cyborg but Dana White won't hire her because she's ugly as fuck.
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LMFAO
It's hilarious during the post fight interviews with Rogan, you can here a guy off camera screaming "Hold the can, hold the can" and then you see a hand passing the empty can of energy drink to the fighter to hold during the interview.
And what's with those ridiculous Headphones. Weidmans entire camp was wearing them! Matt Serra, Ray Longo, even Weidmans dad had a pair slung around his neck. Fucking Ronda Rousey was walking out to the ring with a pair on !
^
:D ;D
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great post walter
You know I love the financial stuff! :) :D
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;D
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;)
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So UFC sponser Monster energy drink have now started making Beats by Dre clones...
And all your favorite fighters are wearing them!
You can own a pair for.....wait for it.........
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So UFC sponser Monster energy drink have now started making Beats by Dre clones...
And all your favorite fighters are wearing them!
You can own a pair for.....wait for it.........
Not just the fighters, even the trainers and Weidmans dad... :D
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How did tate get screwed? She's an average fighter who was coming into the fight after taking a beating from cat zingano. The fact that she was even allowed to face rhonda again is a travesty.
not to mention she got an extra 75 gs for fight of the night
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How the fuck did misha tate sell 10 million buys? You think people ordered pay per view to see an average mma female fighter lose?
::) Reread the post Issac. Not 10,000,000 buys, $10,000,000 in PPV buys. At $59.99 per buy that's 166,666 PPV buys. Her feud with Ronda and PR on TUF sold well more than that number. She easily generated $10,000,000 in revenue for UFC for UFC 168. Easily.
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::) Reread the post Issac. Not 10,000,000 buys, $10,000,000 in PPV buys. At $59.99 per buy that's 166,666 PPV buys. Her feud with Ronda and PR on TUF sold well more than that number. She easily generated $10,000,000 in revenue for UFC for UFC 168. Easily.
I didn't see the fight, did she at least make Ronda work for the W?
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I didn't see the fight, did she at least make Ronda work for the W?
A little. 3rd round sub. Misha fought stupid. She fought Ronda's fight. She had lost the first two rounds.
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A little. 3rd round sub. Misha fought stupid. She fought Ronda's fight. She had lost the first two rounds.
I figured she'd win, just hoping it was a decent fight is all.
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Take half away for taxes.
Then after there is half left... pay the people they owe money, pay their trainers, coaches, gym fees, equipment fees, ped fees, etc
left with shit
Right there. Exactly.
Not to mention that Dana White requires sponsors to pay them a minimum fee for the right to sponsor any individual fighter.
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So UFC sponser Monster energy drink have now started making Beats by Dre clones...
And all your favorite fighters are wearing them!
You can own a pair for.....wait for it.........
Different company. Monster cables. They used to make Beats by Dre headphones.
Check out the story of how Beats by Dre had Monster cables sign the worst contract in business history. It's pretty awesome to be honest. For Dr. Dre anyway.
http://gizmodo.com/5981823/beat-by-dre-the-inside-story-of-how-monster-lost-the-world
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not to mention she got an extra 75 gs for fight of the night
really? link?
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Until they unionize and quit being company men and women it will always be this way. It's fucking pathetic. Dana and the Fertitta (sp?) brothers should have their asses kicked for this shit.
Very true, what's funny is big business is trying to brain was wage earners that unions are bad
"Right to work" = right to get screwed ;D
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::) Reread the post Issac. Not 10,000,000 buys, $10,000,000 in PPV buys. At $59.99 per buy that's 166,666 PPV buys. Her feud with Ronda and PR on TUF sold well more than that number. She easily generated $10,000,000 in revenue for UFC for UFC 168. Easily.
Right didn't now I had to pinpoint every detail for you. You said misha tate alone contributed to $10,000,000 in pay per view buys alone? Do you now take that retarted statement back or do you still stand by it? People bought the pay per view fight because of one fight only. That's the rematch with silva and weidman and if you can't see that then you're an idiot. I didn't even know who the hell misha tate was until this event and I'm more than a casual mma fan.
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great posts
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These athletes aren't underpaid at all.
All other professional sports are overpaid.
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Right didn't now I had to pinpoint every detail for you. You said misha tate alone contributed to $10,000,000 in pay per view buys alone? Do you now take that retarted statement back or do you still stand by it? People bought the pay per view fight because of one fight only. That's the rematch with silva and weidman and if you can't see that then you're an idiot. I didn't even know who the hell misha tate was until this event and I'm more than a casual mma fan.
Thanks for playing. You can pick up your free gift on the way out.
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A little. 3rd round sub. Misha fought stupid. She fought Ronda's fight. She had lost the first two rounds.
Exactly and it was perplexing that she was trying to take her down when it was obvious she needed to strike and move!
That was frustrating to watch!
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really? link?
Google "UFC 168 bonuses"
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damn, imagine having a business with revenues like this and the paltry overhead needed to pay. the profit margin must be like $.55-$.65 on every dollar!!
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damn, imagine having a business with revenues like this and the paltry overhead needed to pay. the profit margin must be like $.55-$.65 on every dollar!!
lol, my profit margin is like 20 cents on the dollar, lol i know I suck :'(
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lol, my profit margin is like 20 cents on the dollar, lol i know I suck :'(
hey, the profit margin on bic pens is a penny on a dollar, and they profit millions!!
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Exactly she ain't shit.
The only female fighter that can really fight is Cyborg but Dana White won't hire her because she's ugly as fuck.
she has big tits
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Lol @ the comments about the headphones ;D
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back to mowing lawns for estevan payan
lol.. sorry but was funny.
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Take half away for taxes.
Then after there is half left... pay the people they owe money, pay their trainers, coaches, gym fees, equipment fees, ped fees, etc
left with shit
Compared to "pro" bodybuilding UFC is okay.
The real money is as it has always been in boxing
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In kickboxing and K1 / Pride, judo, karate, muay thai, tea kwon do the pay is miserable. So not surprising that the same applies for UFC.
MMA guys bragg a lot but there not very smart: in boxing or entertaiment wrestling they could earn 100 times more....
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It ll get there, within 10 years the UFC HW champ will be a bigger name than Ali, Tyson or any of those other pillow fighters.
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In kickboxing and K1 / Pride, judo, karate, muay thai, tea kwon do the pay is miserable. So not surprising that the same applies for UFC.
MMA guys bragg a lot but there not very smart: in boxing or entertaiment wrestling they could earn 100 times more....
Yeah it's kinda same deal as UFC...you'll have a few name guys getting retirement type pay then there is a tremendous drop off in pay, and after awhile even those house names don't get jack.
if you aren't a main event (THE house name basically) and/or grandprix champ and/or gp runner up, you aint making shiznit
Ballpark i'd say.....
(keep in mind Grand prix are not just one fight, it's a series of fights, so this is a total not per fight)
HW GP i'd est about +400,000ish /runner up maybe +200,000ish
MW GP prolly about +200,000ish runner up maybe +100,000ish
In their heyday, guys like (Hoost, Semmy, Remy, Aerts ..etc) big house guys (I've heard) were bringing in like 1-3 mill per fight depending on the contract).
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"15,650 spectators filled the MGM Grand Garden Arena generating a gate totaling $6.2 million."
Ticket sales all by themselves generated over $6,000,000 in revenue for the UFC, making the fighter salaries even more humiliating.
UFC does not report PPV numbers but UFC 168 did a rock bottom 700,000 PPV buys at $59.99 per buy that's $42,000,000. So. . .
PPV buys (minimum).... $42,000,000
Ticket sales...................$6,000,000
That's a absolute minimum of $48,000,000 with just those two sources of revenue and total fighter salaries were under $1,900,000. Comedy.
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Shameful that these pros are paid so much less than NBA/NFL/MLB, etc. Most of our pro athletes are overpaid, MMA athletes way underpaid. Think of it...this is the pay for the top of the top and often in the last few years of their career when they have made it.
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The sport is young. It'll grow.
What most do not understand is that in order to have really good fighters, they have to grow up fighting this system. You don't have the grassroots yet. That's why you can take a hillbilly wrestler and make him champ after 2 dismal fights. No depth. Weidman is a friggin "wrestler". In boxing you see the real talent.
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The disparity is mind blowing from the highest paid to the lowest $600,000 to $10,000. The highest paid guy is getting 60 times more than the lowest paid. That's crazy. And how do the fighters negotiate? Do they have agents? And if we are to take womens MMA seriously, how can one of the co main event fighters (Miehsa Tate) only earn $28,000 and Josh Barnett an undercard fighter at this event earn over 6 times that at $170,000. And Chris leben $51,000, are you serious, the guys a can, he has lost 5 of his last 6 fights. I think there is a lot of brown nosing and favoritism shown my Dana. The whole pay system doesn't make sense.
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It ll get there, within 10 years the UFC HW champ will be a bigger name than Ali, Tyson or any of those other pillow fighters.
Ain't happening. They said that 10 years ago.
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I've spoken to many pro fighters that train out of or do their fight camp at Renzo's academy and I'd say that 95% of them say that they are treated very poorly (financially speaking) by the UFC.
From what I gather, the biggest draws for the UFC are/were: GSP & Anderson Silva. (With both potentially on leave at the moment, things will get a little sticky)
Surprisingly, I've heard the biggest Pay Per View draw was Brock Lesnar and I assume that can be contributed to the sheer amount of WWe fans that he brings with him to the UFC.
I think Dana knows that Brock coming back, after having spent some time in the WWe, will mean that he has once again amassed a large enough following that would translate to tons of money for the UFC via per pay views.
I do agree with Che in that these titles "greatest of all time, baddest guy on the planet" are way out there. Unless you drop the barriers to have cross-promotional fights and allow for your fighters to venture out into other combat arenas (Sambo, K1, Boxing, Muay Thai etc.) in order to prove their fight prowess amid all types of fighters, the idea that any one fighter is the baddest man on the planet is kind of ridiculous.
"1"
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Great post OMR!
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5'7 and 47 still dunking.
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back to mowing lawns for estevan payan
lol brutally true
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spud can still do that? that easy too? damn.
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5'7 and 47 still dunking.
Pay close attention to the 1:01-1:02 mark and you can hear the trampoline, not to mention see the camera move slightly off of Spudd, while his jump appears slightly off balance..
"1"
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Thanks OMR! I was saying, shit... spud still doing it that fucking easy at almost 50?! :D ;D
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Pay close attention to the 1:01-1:02 mark and you can hear the trampoline, not to mention see the camera move slightly off of Spudd, while his jump appears slightly off balance..
"1"
Good spot I missed that.
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Oh sweat this is a UFC thread.
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If fighters are so underpaid, why doesn't an astute businessman come along and exploit this disparity by stealing these fighters from the UFC and paying them what they're supposedly worth?
People, here, also say this about bodybuilding and how Weider underpaid everyone. The truth is that without Weider and Dana pro bbers and fighters would be just guys working out and training at a gym.
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Boxing is much more interesting. UFC is boring.
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If fighters are so underpaid, why doesn't an astute businessman come along and exploit this disparity by stealing these fighters from the UFC and paying them what they're supposedly worth?
People, here, also say this about bodybuilding and how Weider underpaid everyone. The truth is that without Weider and Dana pro bbers and fighters would be just guys working out and training at a gym.
The guy from Bellator is trying to do just that, but the problem is that the UFC is the most established promotion that has been around for over 2 decades now and has inadvertently become the authority when it comes to MMA. The presumption is that the very best MMA fighters fight for the UFC and that all other organizations have 2-3rd tier fighters on their roster. Pride was tied to the UFC and I'd even go as far as to say that many of their cards were much more exciting than what the UFC put out around the same time. Without PRIDE being around now, it's much harder to gauge how well the UFC would fend against another big money promotion.
It's like when Vince McMahon tried to start his own bodybuilding league and it failed miserably. Vince was paying IFBB pros that came over very well (Gary Strydom being one of them), but it soon flopped. I forget as to the reason why again.
Anyway, I've always felt that if Bellator were to acquire the likes of GSP, Anderson Silva and Jon Jones, the UFC would suffer a significant blow and a good amount of their fighters would also jump ship and follow the top headliners, not to mention the large purses.
"1"
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Ain't happening. They said that 10 years ago.
It is happeneing, More people know who Cain Valasquez is than who Wladmir Klitschko is
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Anyway, I've always felt that if Bellator were to acquire the likes of GSP, Anderson Silva and Jon Jones, the UFC would suffer a significant blow and a good amount of their fighters would also jump ship and follow the top headliners, not to mention the large purses.
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I don't know man , there's not a hype machine like the UFC hype machine, if they go somewhere else Dana would say they are washed up ,they can't cut it in the UFC anymore..........etc. they would hype the shit out of the new guys, and the sheeps would buy it.
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The disparity is mind blowing from the highest paid to the lowest $600,000 to $10,000. The highest paid guy is getting 60 times more than the lowest paid. That's crazy. And how do the fighters negotiate? Do they have agents? And if we are to take womens MMA seriously, how can one of the co main event fighters (Miehsa Tate) only earn $28,000 and Josh Barnett an undercard fighter at this event earn over 6 times that at $170,000. And Chris leben $51,000, are you serious, the guys a can, he has lost 5 of his last 6 fights. I think there is a lot of brown nosing and favoritism shown my Dana. The whole pay system doesn't make sense.
You have already answered your question.
Danan likes Chris Leben, he has been fighting for the company a long time, even though he doesn't have high skills, he likes to bang, and takes almost any fight. That's what Dana likes and pays him more than x.
It's they who decide what the specific fighter gets paid.
If superskilled fighter x that Dana doesn't like wants Anderson Silva-money, it's very hard for him to negotiate that contract
Favoritism is in every area and aspect in life.
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It's like when Vince McMahon tried to start his own bodybuilding league and it failed miserably. Vince was paying IFBB pros that came over very well (Gary Strydom being one of them), but it soon flopped. I forget as to the reason why again.
Anyway, I've always felt that if Bellator were to acquire the likes of GSP, Anderson Silva and Jon Jones, the UFC would suffer a significant blow and a good amount of their fighters would also jump ship and follow the top headliners, not to mention the large purses.
"1"
The WBA flopped because it couldn't sustain a revenue base because bodybuilders dont draw money neither do the overwhelming majority of MMA fighters. These sports are in the ticket selling business. No one is calling Brock Lesnar the greatest MMA fighter of all time, but he got paid because he put asses in the seats and in front of the tv.
The idea that a union would change things is false, as well. If you force Dana to pay fighters more, he'll just make the roster smaller. So, what one fighter gets comes at the expense of another. Econ 101.
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If dana white didn't pay fighters at all at the beginning they would still want to fight in the ufc, ie guys would fight for free in the ufc. The ufc has no true competition so dana white can pay them what he likes
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5'7 and 47 still dunking.
Holy shit... impressive.
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They get pay what they deserve , they know it and Dana White knows it ,that's why they do it without complaining ,actually they beg to be part of the UFC .
95% of the UFC fighters are replaceable , there are some good talents but nothing extraordinaire ,I hope this helps .
UFC
Where a guy can become World Champion and being called ''the baddest man on the planet'' with only 2 pro fights (Lesnar )
Where a rookie with 9 pro fights can beat the greatest MMA fighter of all time no once but twice (Weidman ),maybe the greatest wasn't that great.
Where you can become a World Champion without even fighting for the title (Rousey )
exactly. a lot of people want to hate on white. these guys are lining up to fight for what is relatively peanuts. whos to blame?
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It is just the natural evolution of UFC and MMA .. it will take another 20-30 years to get to Boxing levels as far as payment.
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where does all the money go,someone is getting very rich on these fighters
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Boxing is much more interesting. UFC is boring.
No way.
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boxers grow up boxing and it shows .. in mma you have "world champs" with shitty boxing, shitty leg kicks, shitty wrestling or shitty ju jitsu .. when we'll see fighters who grew up practicing mma and good in all these aspects, then we'll have a high level of competition. Right now I don't see high level.
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exactly. a lot of people want to hate on white. these guys are lining up to fight for what is relatively peanuts. whos to blame?
lack of options, no education, the economy, previous trouble with the law, no marketable skills etc...... the list is endless
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lack of options, no education, the economy, previous trouble with the law, no marketable skills etc...... the list is endless
Desire to compete in MMA and UFC being the premier MMA organization.
People aren't competing in the UFC because they're convicts or dumbasses with no job prospects.
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On average, they estimated the UFC pays fighters roughly 10 percent of the revenue generated from its live eventsThe percentage of event-generated revenue that goes to a boxer could be as high as 85 percent, DiBella said.
"A 70/30 deal is completely common," DiBella said, meaning 70 percent of the revenue generated from the fight goes to the boxer, the remaining 30 percent to the promoter.
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They don't need more money. Fights are boring enough as it is.
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It is just the natural evolution of UFC and MMA .. it will take another 20-30 years to get to Boxing levels as far as payment.
Only the top guys and legends make a lot of money in boxing. The top ufc guys with their pay per view revenue make more than average boxers. St pierre probably made over 10 milion last year and then you include sponsors which most boxers don't have.
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Only the top guys and legends make a lot of money in boxing. The top ufc guys with their pay per view revenue make more than average boxers. St pierre probably made over 10 milion last year and then you include sponsors which most boxers don't have.
but if you compare apples to apples the top boxers make more money.mayweather made 80 million his last fight with pay per view
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but if you compare apples to apples the top boxers make more money.mayweather made 80 million his last fight with pay per view
obviously. The reason is because ufc is owned by a corporation and boxing is not and never will be. A corporation can choose to pay it's employees whatever it wants. In boxing, The fights are made between promoters and networks unlike the ufc. Also mayweather is an anomoly in boxing. Also, ufc fighters get 1-3 dollars per pay per view buy and have lots of sponsors. The top ufc fighters are not doing much worse than than the top boxers. Anderson silva and other top fighters have net worth of around 15-20 million. On top of all this the top ufc fighter will fight 4 times more often than your top boxer which will translate into more income at the end of the year. This whole thread is just ridiclous and implies that ufc fighters are broke which is nonsense.
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ufc fighters get 1-3 dollars per pay per view buy
Prove it.
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Prove it.
Google is your friend.
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Google is your friend.
No really, tell us where you got that.
I know a bunch of fighters that do their camps at Renzo's and they all say that 95% of the UFC fighters make pennies, except for the very top guys.
Do you have a link asbrus?
"1"
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Google is your friend.
That's what I thought . ::)
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No really, tell us where you got that.
I know a bunch of fighters that do their camps at Renzo's and they all say that 95% of the UFC fighters make pennies, except for the very top guys.
Do you have a link asbrus?
"1"
Happy New Year my friend.
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Happy New Year my friend.
Happy new year bro!
Espero que la pases bien querido amigo!
Che, have you heard of John Cholish? He is one of the many Pro MMA fighters from the UFC that train at Renzo's. He is probably one of the most blunt individuals you can speak to about the UFC's ridiculously low pay. He will tell you, as will most of them, unless they are on contract, that the UFC rapes them unless you're a top 3 guy in the different divisions.
"1"
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Happy new year bro!
Espero que la pases bien querido amigo!
Che, have you heard of John Cholish? He is one of the many Pro MMA fighters from the UFC that train at Renzo's. He is probably one of the most blunt individuals you can speak to about the UFC's ridiculously low pay. He will tell you, as will most of them, unless they are on contract, that the UFC rapes them unless you're a top 3 guy in the different divisions.
"1"
I've never heard of him , but I know 4 UFC fighters from here and what John Cholish is saying is absolutely true .
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I've never heard of him , but I know 4 UFC fighters from here and what John Cholish is saying is absolutely true.
The whole shit is run by a bunch of gangsters and corporate bullies.
Also, the right people in the industry have special influence and can get any fighter of their choice into the UFC.
Ask me via PM if curious as to what I'm talking about.
"1"
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Embarrassing. Pitiful. Shameful. Misha sold $10,000,000 in PPV buys alone and she was paid $28,000. Disgraceful.
Champ Chris Weidman: $400,000 (includes $200,000 win bonus)
def. Anderson Silva: $600,000
Champ Ronda Rousey: $100,000 (includes $50,000 win bonus)
def. Miesha Tate: $28,000
Travis Browne: $56,000 (includes $28,000 win bonus)
def. Josh Barnett: $170,000
Jim Miller: $92,000 (includes $46,000 win bonus)
def. Fabricio Camoes: $8,000
Dustin Poirier: $46,000 (includes $23,000 win bonus)
def. Diego Brandao: $20,000*
Uriah Hall: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus)
def. Chris Leben: $51,000
Michael Johnson: $36,000 (includes $18,000 win bonus)
def. Gleison Tibau: $39,000
Dennis Siver: $66,000 (includes $33,000 win bonus)
def. Manny Gamburyan: $25,000
John Howard: $32,000 (includes $16,000 win bonus)
def. Siyar Bahadurzada: $17,000
William Macario: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus)
def. Bobby Voelker: $12,000
Robert Peralta: $24,000 (includes $12,000 win bonus)
def. Estevan Payan: $10,000
still more than Mr O
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No really, tell us where you got that.
I know a bunch of fighters that do their camps at Renzo's and they all say that 95% of the UFC fighters make pennies, except for the very top guys.
Do you have a link asbrus?
"1"
http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/entertainment-articles/richest-mma-fighters-world-2013/
http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/entertainment-articles/georges-stpierre-5-million-ufc-fight/
http://www.tsmplug.com/richlist/highest-earning-ufc-fighters/ - mentions pay per view bonus structure
good link. There are tons out there mentioning that the fighters get $1-3 per pay per view buy. You can see mma fighters are not doing bad. Now if we compare the worst fighters then yes they are struggling just like the worst boxers make no money. Everyone loves to bring up maywaether but he is an anomoly.
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where does all the money go,someone is getting very rich on these fighters
The money goes to the owners and executives of the UFC. Some of these big UFC fights are generating the same amount of money as any boxing match. UFC sells out the venue all the time. There PPV is through the roof. It's really disturbing what they pay the fighters. Don't tell me GSP is a millionaire. Mayweather laughs at his money. I'm sure the top business men at the UFC laugh at GSP money. The UFC really is a monopoly. Sure there are other federations but they a nothing compared to UFC. If the fighters unionized they would just hype other fighters and continue the show.
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Also, the right people in the industry have special influence and can get any fighter of their choice into the UFC.
"1"
I know all about it bro , is not much different in boxing but boxing is a longer road and they usually get exposed before getting to the top
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http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/entertainment-articles/richest-mma-fighters-world-2013/
http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/entertainment-articles/georges-stpierre-5-million-ufc-fight/
http://www.tsmplug.com/richlist/highest-earning-ufc-fighters/ - mentions pay per view bonus structure
good link. There are tons out there mentioning that the fighters get $1-3 per pay per view buy. You can see mma fighters are not doing bad. Now if we compare the worst fighters then yes they are struggling just like the worst boxers make no money. Everyone loves to bring up maywaether but he is an anomoly.
Haha get the fuck out of here
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It ll get there, within 10 years the UFC HW champ will be a bigger name than Ali, Tyson or any of those other pillow fighters.
It's early but I nominate that post as the dumbest statement of 2014
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The money goes to the owners and executives of the UFC. Some of these big UFC fights are generating the same amount of money as any boxing match. UFC sells out the venue all the time. There PPV is through the roof. It's really disturbing what they pay the fighters. Don't tell me GSP is a millionaire. Mayweather laughs at his money. I'm sure the top business men at the UFC laugh at GSP money. The UFC really is a monopoly. Sure there are other federations but they a nothing compared to UFC. If the fighters unionized they would just hype other fighters and continue the show.
From Forbes Magazine Nov 2013:
GSP made roughly $9 million combined for his past two fights, according to multiple sources close to the fighter. His current annual income outside the octagon from endorsements, memorabilia and licensing adds another $3 million. St-Pierre’s total income of $12 million over the last 12 months makes him the top earner in MMA.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2013/11/16/how-georges-st-pierre-makes-12-million-a-year/ (http://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2013/11/16/how-georges-st-pierre-makes-12-million-a-year/)
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People have to understand the basic economic principle of supply and demand. The buyer always wants to pay the least amount possible and the seller always wants to get the most amount possible. The present financial situation of either party is irrelevant. If I pay someone $50 to cut my grass it doesn't matter whether I live in a mansion and I'm a billionaire and therefore can "afford" to pay more or live in a little shack and make 30 grand a year. I pay the market rate. If some offers to cut my grass for $40 instead of $50 am I a cheapskate for wanting to hire and give that other person a job? Are you a cheapskate because instead of paying $600 for that new clothes dryer and you found the exact same thing for $500 elsewhere?
What do professional Judo and Jiu-Jitsu competitors make from their respective organizations? They make nothing. In fact, if you want to compete in Judo and Jiu-Jitsu tournaments you have to pay the organization. With Jiu-Jitsu your talking a $60-$80 entrance fee. They do it because they love the sport. That's how all or most MMA fighters start out. They love to fight and be a fighter. If you're main goal in life is to make money there are better and safer ways to do it.
Of course UFC fighters want to make more money. We all want to make money. But how do I know they are not under paid or rather how do I know they don't think they are under paid? It's because they are clamoring and begging and killing themselves to fight in the UFC. It's what they want to do. All started fighting for free and would continue fighting for free just like Jiu-Jitsu competitors. All those who first started in the UFC did it because they love the sport. Just like in bodybuilding. I'm sure now because there is money to be made in the UFC many are doing it hoping to make it big and will quit when they realized they have no chance. But the fact is that if you are an MMA fighter you aspire to fight in the UFC regardless of what they pay. Just like Jiu-Jitsu and Grapplers aspire to compete in the Abu Dhabi even though there's no money to be made and the often huge expense they have to take on just to compete in that event.
In any transaction between a buyer and a seller, and as long as there is not a third party with no stake in the outcome meddling in the deal, if the transaction is competed and closed it's because both parties believe they have gotten the best deal that they can under the current conditions. They always want a better deal but in real life you take the best deal given your alternatives. A UFC fighter accepts his pay because he believe that he can't get a better deal elsewhere. If he could, he would. The UFC organization, as with all buyers of any goods or services, pays whatever they want and usually that's as little as they can get away with. It's business. If a fighter has proven himself valuable enough to the company, meaning that they can bring in the dollars, then they start having some clout and negotiate a better deal.
There is no exploitation because nobody is forced to do anything they don't want or agree to.
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where does all the money go,someone is getting very rich on these fighters
Isn't that the whole reason someone takes on the risk going into business. Dana White and Company took a big risk buying the rights to the UFC when it was losing money and going down hill fast. They did it because they thought they thought they could bet very rich on these fighters.
Just like this fifteen year old girl did when she came up with the ideal to sell fish Flip Flops. Fish Flops. Just like all business owners do.
http://www.examiner.com/article/15-year-old-girl-has-become-a-millionaire-by-selling-flip-flops
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People have to understand the basic economic principle of supply and demand. The buyer always wants to pay the least amount possible and the seller always wants to get the most amount possible. The present financial situation of either party is irrelevant. If I pay someone $50 to cut my grass it doesn't matter whether I live in a mansion and I'm a billionaire and therefore can "afford" to pay more or live in a little shack and make 30 grand a year. I pay the market rate. If some offers to cut my grass for $40 instead of $50 am I a cheapskate for wanting to hire and give that other person a job? Are you a cheapskate because instead of paying $600 for that new clothes dryer and you found the exact same thing for $500 elsewhere?
What do professional Judo and Jiu-Jitsu competitors make from their respective organizations? They make nothing. In fact, if you want to compete in Judo and Jiu-Jitsu tournaments you have to pay the organization. With Jiu-Jitsu your talking a $60-$80 entrance fee. They do it because they love the sport. That's how all or most MMA fighters start out. They love to fight and be a fighter. If you're main goal in life is to make money there are better and safer ways to do it.
Of course UFC fighters want to make more money. We all want to make money. But how do I know they are not under paid or rather how do I know they don't think they are under paid? It's because they are clamoring and begging and killing themselves to fight in the UFC. It's what they want to do. All started fighting for free and would continue fighting for free just like Jiu-Jitsu competitors. All those who first started in the UFC did it because they love the sport. Just like in bodybuilding. I'm sure now because there is money to be made in the UFC many are doing it hoping to make it big and will quit when they realized they have no chance. But the fact is that if you are an MMA fighter you aspire to fight in the UFC regardless of what they pay. Just like Jiu-Jitsu and Grapplers aspire to compete in the Abu Dhabi even though there's no money to be made and the often huge expense they have to take on just to compete in that event.
In any transaction between a buyer and a seller, and as long as there is not a third party with no stake in the outcome meddling in the deal, if the transaction is competed and closed it's because both parties believe they have gotten the best deal that they can under the current conditions. They always want a better deal but in real life you take the best deal given your alternatives. A UFC fighter accepts his pay because he believe that he can't get a better deal elsewhere. If he could, he would. The UFC organization, as with all buyers of any goods or services, pays whatever they want and usually that's as little as they can get away with. It's business. If a fighter has proven himself valuable enough to the company, meaning that they can bring in the dollars, then they start having some clout and negotiate a better deal.
There is no exploitation because nobody is forced to do anything they don't want or agree to.
GOOD POST, qft!
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Isn't that the whole reason someone takes on the risk going into business. Dana White and Company took a big risk buying the rights to the UFC when it was losing money and going down hill fast. They did it because they thought they thought they could bet very rich on these fighters.
Just like this fifteen year old girl did when she came up with the ideal to sell fish Flip Flops. Fish Flops. Just like all business owners do.
http://www.examiner.com/article/15-year-old-girl-has-become-a-millionaire-by-selling-flip-flops
People consider profits and not losses. I'm pretty sure some pro bbing shows have lost money. Did the competitors give back their prize money?
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So UFC sponser Monster energy drink have now started making Beats by Dre clones...
And all your favorite fighters are wearing them!
You can own a pair for.....wait for it.........
its actually MONSTER CABLE/PRODUCTS that was originally making the beats by Dre, then they had a split so these are the current monster brand headphones that replaced the "beats"
monster energy drink is not a sponsor, not with xyience in the way...and they have nothing to do with headphones. If you wanna talk shit about something, at least get your facts straight
I agree its lame to see all these people walking to the ring with headphones around their necks without any wire attached to anything but hey, if Monster Cable is paying for the advertising and sponsorship fees, why not allow them to provide further income to the fighters
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People consider profits and not losses. I'm pretty sure some pro bbing shows have lost money. Did the competitors give back their prize money?
EXACTLY! Notice it's always the employers, the organzations, the companies, the "big business" that are always the bad guys and the exploiters. The very people who are actually creating these jobs and opportunities.
Jay Leno makes in excess of 20 million a year. Arod is paid nearly 30 million a year. Kobe makes in excess of 30 million a year. Surprisingly, Robert Downy Jr. made 75 million dollars in one year. Why aren't they accused of "exploiting" their employers? Nobody "needs" that kind of money and they certainly aren't working any harder than a Mexican immigrant picking oranges everyday.
Johnny Carson was once asked why he thinks he deserved that amount of money he gets doing his talk show. He answered, "Because I can get it." There's a difference between the cost and the value of a good or service.
You get what you can. And pay the least amount you can get away with. We all do that. It's called the free market.
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People have to understand the basic economic principle of supply and demand. The buyer always wants to pay the least amount possible and the seller always wants to get the most amount possible. The present financial situation of either party is irrelevant. If I pay someone $50 to cut my grass it doesn't matter whether I live in a mansion and I'm a billionaire and therefore can "afford" to pay more or live in a little shack and make 30 grand a year. I pay the market rate. If some offers to cut my grass for $40 instead of $50 am I a cheapskate for wanting to hire and give that other person a job? Are you a cheapskate because instead of paying $600 for that new clothes dryer and you found the exact same thing for $500 elsewhere?
What do professional Judo and Jiu-Jitsu competitors make from their respective organizations? They make nothing. In fact, if you want to compete in Judo and Jiu-Jitsu tournaments you have to pay the organization. With Jiu-Jitsu your talking a $60-$80 entrance fee. They do it because they love the sport. That's how all or most MMA fighters start out. They love to fight and be a fighter. If you're main goal in life is to make money there are better and safer ways to do it.
Of course UFC fighters want to make more money. We all want to make money. But how do I know they are not under paid or rather how do I know they don't think they are under paid? It's because they are clamoring and begging and killing themselves to fight in the UFC. It's what they want to do. All started fighting for free and would continue fighting for free just like Jiu-Jitsu competitors. All those who first started in the UFC did it because they love the sport. Just like in bodybuilding. I'm sure now because there is money to be made in the UFC many are doing it hoping to make it big and will quit when they realized they have no chance. But the fact is that if you are an MMA fighter you aspire to fight in the UFC regardless of what they pay. Just like Jiu-Jitsu and Grapplers aspire to compete in the Abu Dhabi even though there's no money to be made and the often huge expense they have to take on just to compete in that event.
In any transaction between a buyer and a seller, and as long as there is not a third party with no stake in the outcome meddling in the deal, if the transaction is competed and closed it's because both parties believe they have gotten the best deal that they can under the current conditions. They always want a better deal but in real life you take the best deal given your alternatives. A UFC fighter accepts his pay because he believe that he can't get a better deal elsewhere. If he could, he would. The UFC organization, as with all buyers of any goods or services, pays whatever they want and usually that's as little as they can get away with. It's business. If a fighter has proven himself valuable enough to the company, meaning that they can bring in the dollars, then they start having some clout and negotiate a better deal.
There is no exploitation because nobody is forced to do anything they don't want or agree to.
It's always exploitation. Do you think people would work for anyone else if they already had the resources they needed to make a living? The Elites have already gobbled up the majority of the resources that Nature provided to everyone leaving everyone else no choice but to sell their labour to obtain what was rightfully given to them by Nature but stolen by rich fat cats.
Give a man some fertile land and he could easily make a living and set his own terms, he could chop wood, build his own house, grow vegetables, farm livestock etc etc and set his own limits on how much he wants to labour. Yet, when the Elites make it so the only way for the lower class to get a property is to sell his labour for a lifetime, he is then nothing more than a slave.
No,I am not a communist, just think the current system sucks, and no I am not sure exactly how to make it better. I think current private property laws suck, they are a perversion of their original intent, and if their was a revolution to overthrow the Elites I would be there in a heartbeat.
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It's always exploitation. Do you think people would work for anyone else if they already had the resources they needed to make a living? The Elites have already gobbled up the majority of the resources that Nature provided to everyone leaving everyone else no choice but to sell their labour to obtain what was rightfully given to them by Nature but stolen by rich fat cats.
Give a man some fertile land and he could easily make a living and set his own terms, he could chop wood, build his own house, grow vegetables, farm livestock etc etc and set his own limits on how much he wants to labour. Yet, when the Elites make it so the only way for the lower class to get a property is to sell his labour for a lifetime, he is then nothing more than a slave.
No,I am not a communist, just think the current system sucks, and no I am not sure exactly how to make it better. I think current private property laws suck, they are a perversion of their original intent, and if their was a revolution to overthrow the Elites I would be there in a heartbeat.
No, you're wrong. Only when you are being forced, meaning coerced, into doing something you don't want to do is when you are exploited. Having limited choices and choosing the best alternative is not being exploited.
Life is about making the best choices given your alternatives. A person works at a certain job at a certain pay because he isn't able to find a better deal. That's how everything is. And this idea of just giving a person some fertile he could make a good living. You know how to build a house? You like indoor plumbing? You like watching the UFC? You like having a refrigerator? When I hear all this back to nature stuff I wonder how are you living? You take so much for granted. So much that makes your life comfortable and relatively easy. It doesn't matter what the weather is you'll always have meat, fruits and vegetables of all kinds.
You think people that work for others are exploited. Say people that work for McDonalds or Walmart. Would society be better off if we got rid of all fast food restaurant, say all restaurants, and all stores? Would we be better off? Again, how are you living? Why aren't you living on your own terms? I'll tell you why, because, again, given the alternatives what you are doing i is the best that you are willing to do. If you had better options you would take them. Your life style would take a huge dump if you had to try and make it on your own. Grow your own fruits and vegetables, hunt for your food, build and maintain your own house, protect yourself against intruders, make your own clothes and shoes... the list goes on.
Some people have better choices than others. Some have to buy a Toyota Corrolla not because it's their dream car but because they can't buy a Lambo. That's life. It's not being exploited or coerced into doing anything. You diminish the suffering of people who are truly exploited. Who are truly slaves. Who don't have a choice to just go somewhere else because they would get punished, maimed or killed.
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No, you're wrong. Only when you are being forced, meaning coerced, into doing something you don't want to do is when you are exploited. Having limited choices and choosing the best alternative is not being exploited.
Life is about making the best choices given your alternatives. A person works at a certain job at a certain pay because he isn't able to find a better deal. That's how everything is. And this idea of just giving a person some fertile he could make a good living. You know how to build a house? You like indoor plumbing? You like watching the UFC? You like having a refrigerator? When I hear all this back to nature stuff I wonder how are you living? You take so much for granted. So much that makes your life comfortable and relatively easy. It doesn't matter what the weather is you'll always have meat, fruits and vegetables of all kinds.
You think people that work for others are exploited. Say people that work for McDonalds or Walmart. Would society be better off if we got rid of all fast food restaurant, say all restaurants, and all stores? Would we be better off? Again, how are you living? Why aren't you living on your own terms? I'll tell you why, because, again, given the alternatives what you are doing i is the best that you are willing to do. If you had better options you would take them. Your life style would take a huge dump if you had to try and make it on your own. Grow your own fruits and vegetables, hunt for your food, build and maintain your own house, protect yourself against intruders, make your own clothes and shoes... the list goes on.
Some people have better choices than others. Some have to buy a Toyota Corrolla not because it's their dream car but because they can't buy a Lambo. That's life. It's not being exploited or coerced into doing anything. You diminish the suffering of people who are truly exploited. Who are truly slaves. Who don't have a choice to just go somewhere else because they would get punished, maimed or killed.
What a load of codswallop. I didn't say there weren't people being even more exploited than I, just that there are the exploiters and the exploited. And of course people are being coerced, you try dropping out of capitalist society, finding a piece of crown land and becoming self sufficient. Once the authorities find out they will lock you up, doing this is illegal. You either opt into the current system or you opt out and will be punished for it. Having to choose between a turd and a bowl of piss doesn't constitute real choice. The sad part is, people like you who are being just as exploited as the next man have come to normalize this overt exploitation and label it as 'That's life'. You are simply a contented slave.
Modern lifestyle may well be comfortable, well,I wouldn't even say comfortable, it's swings between being shitty the times you are doing the things you don't want to do (working for the man) to being comfortable, the short intervals between working for the man. But modern society certainly isn't good for you. Being given an opportunity to be self sufficient although harder work is far more rewarding and character building than working 8 hours in a shitty soulless job only to come home and comfort yourself with mod cons. The Amish do just fine, as do those in Alaska as do many societies that don't have access to mod cons. Being allowed to watch UFC, have access to modern plumbing etc etc isn't worth much if you have to suck the MAN'S COCK for a lifetime.
And I would be more than happy to get rid of Walmart and fast food as long as Individuals are granted some fertile property with some natural resources on it. Tress, water, grass etc. And it doesn't even have to be a back to nature scenario, just a more equitable distribution of resources. When the a tiny minority of elites control the majority of the worlds resources there is something seriously perverted about that. Like I said, I don't have all the answers, but the current paradigm is ridiculous. I think the genius of the Elites is getting those they exploit to promote their agenda. This is comparable to slaves promoting the Slave trade. Truly Fascinating !
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Payroll of Peace
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What a load of codswallop. I didn't say there weren't people being even more exploited than I, just that there are the exploiters and the exploited. And of course people are being coerced, you try dropping out of capitalist society, finding a piece of crown land and becoming self sufficient. Once the authorities find out they will lock you up, doing this is illegal. You either opt into the current system or you opt out and will be punished for it. Having to choose between a turd and a bowl of piss doesn't constitute real choice. The sad part is, people like you who are being just as exploited as the next man have come to normalize this overt exploitation and label it as 'That's life'. You are simply a contented slave.
Modern lifestyle may well be comfortable, well,I wouldn't even say comfortable, it's swings between being shitty the times you are doing the things you don't want to do (working for the man) to being comfortable, the short intervals between working for the man. But modern society certainly isn't good for you. Being given an opportunity to be self sufficient although harder work is far more rewarding and character building than working 8 hours in a shitty soulless job only to come home and comfort yourself with mod cons. The Amish do just fine, as do those in Alaska as do many societies that don't have access to mod cons. Being allowed to watch UFC, have access to modern plumbing etc etc isn't worth much if you have to suck the MAN'S COCK for a lifetime.
And I would be more than happy to get rid of Walmart and fast food as long as Individuals are granted some fertile property with some natural resources on it. Tress, water, grass etc. And it doesn't even have to be a back to nature scenario, just a more equitable distribution of resources. When the a tiny minority of elites control the majority of the worlds resources there is something seriously perverted about that. Like I said, I don't have all the answers, but the current paradigm is ridiculous. I think the genius of the Elites is getting those they exploit to promote their agenda. This is comparable to slaves promoting the Slave trade. Truly Fascinating !
You seem to be taking this personally. Why is that? I just want to have an honest debate and examine the alternatives and choose what is best. Have you ever tried to be self sufficient? Why not? It's b.s. to say you can't head out into the woods and live on your own. Some people do it. Goodrum is on that way though he still relies on the capitalist market for money. But he also makes a lot of personal sacrifices that others aren't willing to make. Remember Ted Kaczynski? He lived on his own. So do many homeless people.
If you were willing, and you won't, to give up the comforts created and provided by others, you could live on your own. It's just that your life style wouldn't be better than what you have now. It would be far worse. The problem is that you think you can heaven on earth. That you can, should and deserve to get everything you want the way you want it. But life is all about trade offs. A perpetual compromise between the ideal and the possible. So you blame others. You blame the "elite" that "control" your life. How did they get to be elites? How did Walmart and McDonalds own such a big market share? How did the UFC get to be so big and powerful? How come you can't do the same?
Look at how people live "in nature" without modern conveniences. Look at how they use to live. Their quality of life. Their life span. How much leisure time they had. Did they have the time and energy to lift weight and worry about how their body looks? Get in their 5-6 meals a day and meet their protein requirements for their muscles? Did they have the time and energy to train to be MMA fighters? Again, my friend, you take so much for granted. Compared to your grandparents you live a life of luxury in comparison. I know that just by the fact that you have a computer and the time to debate these issues. Now compare that to how they lived a century ago. Five centuries ago.
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People have to understand the basic economic principle of supply and demand. The buyer always wants to pay the least amount possible and the seller always wants to get the most amount possible. The present financial situation of either party is irrelevant. If I pay someone $50 to cut my grass it doesn't matter whether I live in a mansion and I'm a billionaire and therefore can "afford" to pay more or live in a little shack and make 30 grand a year. I pay the market rate. If some offers to cut my grass for $40 instead of $50 am I a cheapskate for wanting to hire and give that other person a job? Are you a cheapskate because instead of paying $600 for that new clothes dryer and you found the exact same thing for $500 elsewhere?
What do professional Judo and Jiu-Jitsu competitors make from their respective organizations? They make nothing. In fact, if you want to compete in Judo and Jiu-Jitsu tournaments you have to pay the organization. With Jiu-Jitsu your talking a $60-$80 entrance fee. They do it because they love the sport. That's how all or most MMA fighters start out. They love to fight and be a fighter. If you're main goal in life is to make money there are better and safer ways to do it.
Of course UFC fighters want to make more money. We all want to make money. But how do I know they are not under paid or rather how do I know they don't think they are under paid? It's because they are clamoring and begging and killing themselves to fight in the UFC. It's what they want to do. All started fighting for free and would continue fighting for free just like Jiu-Jitsu competitors. All those who first started in the UFC did it because they love the sport. Just like in bodybuilding. I'm sure now because there is money to be made in the UFC many are doing it hoping to make it big and will quit when they realized they have no chance. But the fact is that if you are an MMA fighter you aspire to fight in the UFC regardless of what they pay. Just like Jiu-Jitsu and Grapplers aspire to compete in the Abu Dhabi even though there's no money to be made and the often huge expense they have to take on just to compete in that event.
In any transaction between a buyer and a seller, and as long as there is not a third party with no stake in the outcome meddling in the deal, if the transaction is competed and closed it's because both parties believe they have gotten the best deal that they can under the current conditions. They always want a better deal but in real life you take the best deal given your alternatives. A UFC fighter accepts his pay because he believe that he can't get a better deal elsewhere. If he could, he would. The UFC organization, as with all buyers of any goods or services, pays whatever they want and usually that's as little as they can get away with. It's business. If a fighter has proven himself valuable enough to the company, meaning that they can bring in the dollars, then they start having some clout and negotiate a better deal.
There is no exploitation because nobody is forced to do anything they don't want or agree to.
This would work great if there was competition to UFC. But the way things stand, UFC makes millions per each ppv while the fighters barely make any %. Unless you are the top guy at your weight class then after taxes, the training costs, coaches, medical expenses and ofcourse housing and food the average fighter makes shit.
The average pro boxer makes way more then the average UFC fighter and boxers don't have to deal with nasty elbows or knees to the head.
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You seem to be taking this personally. Why is that? I just want to have an honest debate and examine the alternatives and choose what is best. Have you ever tried to be self sufficient? Why not? It's b.s. to say you can't head out into the woods and live on your own. Some people do it. Goodrum is on that way though he still relies on the capitalist market for money. But he also makes a lot of personal sacrifices that others aren't willing to make. Remember Ted Kaczynski? He lived on his own. So do many homeless people.
If you were willing, and you won't, to give up the comforts created and provided by others, you could live on your own. It's just that your life style wouldn't be better than what you have now. It would be far worse. The problem is that you think you can heaven on earth. That you can, should and deserve to get everything you want the way you want it. But life is all about trade offs. A perpetual compromise between the ideal and the possible. So you blame others. You blame the "elite" that "control" your life. How did they get to be elites? How did Walmart and McDonalds own such a big market share? How did the UFC get to be so big and powerful? How come you can't do the same?
Look at how people live "in nature" without modern conveniences. Look at how they use to live. Their quality of life. Their life span. How much leisure time they had. Did they have the time and energy to lift weight and worry about how their body looks? Get in their 5-6 meals a day and meet their protein requirements for their muscles? Did they have the time and energy to train to be MMA fighters? Again, my friend, you take so much for granted. Compared to your grandparents you live a life of luxury in comparison. I know that just by the fact that you have a computer and the time to debate these issues. Now compare that to how they lived a century ago. Five centuries ago.
Don't bother with E-kul. His judgment is severely compromised in some matters and that is putting it mildly.
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the average pro boxer makes way more then the average UFC fighter
boxers don't have to deal with nasty elbows or knees to the head.
Not true at all. Keep believing that rubbish. Tim bradley has a net worth of 3 million dollars. 6 times less than what the top 10 in the ufc are worth. He's ranked number 1 and is the champ. Andre ward #2 pound for pound was barely breaking half a million per fight until his last fight. There are only a select few boxers who are big draws and they are cotto,mayweather, canelo alvarez, and manny pacquio. Your average boxers barely break 200k per fight. Boxing exploits it's fighters way more than ufc and boxers have to pay managers, cutmen etc also and greedy promoters who rob them.
By the way boxing is way more dangerous due to brain damage because of repeated hits to the head over 12 rounds.
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You seem to be taking this personally. Why is that? I just want to have an honest debate and examine the alternatives and choose what is best. Have you ever tried to be self sufficient? Why not? It's b.s. to say you can't head out into the woods and live on your own. Some people do it. Goodrum is on that way though he still relies on the capitalist market for money. But he also makes a lot of personal sacrifices that others aren't willing to make. Remember Ted Kaczynski? He lived on his own. So do many homeless people.
If you were willing, and you won't, to give up the comforts created and provided by others, you could live on your own. It's just that your life style wouldn't be better than what you have now. It would be far worse. The problem is that you think you can heaven on earth. That you can, should and deserve to get everything you want the way you want it. But life is all about trade offs. A perpetual compromise between the ideal and the possible. So you blame others. You blame the "elite" that "control" your life. How did they get to be elites? How did Walmart and McDonalds own such a big market share? How did the UFC get to be so big and powerful? How come you can't do the same?
Look at how people live "in nature" without modern conveniences. Look at how they use to live. Their quality of life. Their life span. How much leisure time they had. Did they have the time and energy to lift weight and worry about how their body looks? Get in their 5-6 meals a day and meet their protein requirements for their muscles? Did they have the time and energy to train to be MMA fighters? Again, my friend, you take so much for granted. Compared to your grandparents you live a life of luxury in comparison. I know that just by the fact that you have a computer and the time to debate these issues. Now compare that to how they lived a century ago. Five centuries ago.
I don't take your point of view personally, I just disagree with it and find it a tad naive. You cannot just claim crown land as your own and build a house on it. It's called Crown land for a reason. It's OWNED by the Government. If the authorities do find out, they can jail you and destroy any dwellings you have built. And it makes little sense to live in such a way when no one else is, even if you succeeded and created your own little community eventually the Government will simply shut you down. This is my point, you either opt in to the current paradigm which is the equivalent of sucking a cock or you opt out which is also the equivalent of sucking a bowl of dicks.
And you obviously don't understand how the Elites became that way, they are born to the right family. And often they are quite incestous to keep their money in the family. Why do you think the Royal family never liked Princess Diana, she wasn't elite enough for the Royal Family. When I was growing up, the Country's richest man was Kerry Packer, who was an idiot, even his own Father thought so, yet he inherited his wealth and his powerful status. At least he was honest, he said the secret to success is being born to the right family. Even those who are fortunate to make a lot of money from humble beginnings are unlikely to penetrate the inner circle of the Elites. They are labelled NEW MONEY and still kept on the outer for the most part.
ANd it is a myth we live any better off than our grandparents, we are far worse off. A family used to be able to survive on a single wage, not so today. Their was more value placed on families, integrity and honesty. Not having access to modern technology doesn't equal misery. As long as people have their basic needs met, that is enough to be happy. And not only that, you are comparing generations of people who have also been oppressed by the Elites. The rich and powerful have always lived comfortably regardless of which era you point too. Ask yourself, who benefits from believing as you do? Don't you find it a coincidence that the Elites who control the flow of information and education and somehow you amazingly hold a point of view that corresponds to theirs, that is sympathetic to their cause. Could it be possible you believe as you do because those who control the system made sure that you think that way?
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I don't take your point of view personally, I just disagree with it and find it a tad naive. You cannot just claim crown land as your own and build a house on it. It's called Crown land for a reason. It's OWNED by the Government. If the authorities do find out, they can jail you and destroy any dwellings you have built. And it makes little sense to live in such a way when no one else is, even if you succeeded and created your own little community eventually the Government will simply shut you down. This is my point, you either opt in to the current paradigm which is the equivalent of sucking a cock or you opt out which is also the equivalent of sucking a bowl of dicks.
And you obviously don't understand how the Elites became that way, they are born to the right family. And often they are quite incestous to keep their money in the family. Why do you think the Royal family never liked Princess Diana, she wasn't elite enough for the Royal Family. When I was growing up, the Country's richest man was Kerry Packer, who was an idiot, even his own Father thought so, yet he inherited his wealth and his powerful status. At least he was honest, he said the secret to success is being born to the right family. Even those who are fortunate to make a lot of money from humble beginnings are unlikely to penetrate the inner circle of the Elites. They are labelled NEW MONEY and still kept on the outer for the most part.
ANd it is a myth we live any better off than our grandparents, we are far worse off. A family used to be able to survive on a single wage, not so today. Their was more value placed on families, integrity and honesty. Not having access to modern technology doesn't equal misery. As long as people have their basic needs met, that is enough to be happy. And not only that, you are comparing generations of people who have also been oppressed by the Elites. The rich and powerful have always lived comfortably regardless of which era you point too. Ask yourself, who benefits from believing as you do? Don't you find it a coincidence that the Elites who control the flow of information and education and somehow you amazingly hold a point of view that corresponds to theirs, that is sympathetic to their cause. Could it be possible you believe as you do because those who control the system made sure that you think that way?
Where do you live. I'm talking about America. This where the UFC was created and based. There is no Crown land. It is very common for people here to own their land. I have a friend in Montana that owns hundreds of acres.
Most millionaires in this country are first generation millionaires. They didn't inherit it. Bill Gates and Michael Dell didn't inherit anything.
Air conditioning, cell phones, computers, pizza delivery, Amazon, health care, life expectancy, better automobiles, cheaper airline travel, the list is endless. The quality of life is much better today that it was a generation ago. The quality of life is much today than when I was a kid. I had the same injury in both knees ten years apart. The difference and recovery between the first and second, as well as the pain, was incredible. Were talking about a difference in months versus weeks in recovery. You can now have 20-20 vision in less than a half and hour. Even compare the gyms of today to the gyms in the 1950s. Compare the houses. I don't think I am the naive one.
But you are determine to believe your life is screwed because of other people controlling it. Fair enough.
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People have to understand the basic economic principle of supply and demand. The buyer always wants to pay the least amount possible and the seller always wants to get the most amount possible. The present financial situation of either party is irrelevant. If I pay someone $50 to cut my grass it doesn't matter whether I live in a mansion and I'm a billionaire and therefore can "afford" to pay more or live in a little shack and make 30 grand a year. I pay the market rate. If some offers to cut my grass for $40 instead of $50 am I a cheapskate for wanting to hire and give that other person a job? Are you a cheapskate because instead of paying $600 for that new clothes dryer and you found the exact same thing for $500 elsewhere?
What do professional Judo and Jiu-Jitsu competitors make from their respective organizations? They make nothing. In fact, if you want to compete in Judo and Jiu-Jitsu tournaments you have to pay the organization. With Jiu-Jitsu your talking a $60-$80 entrance fee. They do it because they love the sport. That's how all or most MMA fighters start out. They love to fight and be a fighter. If you're main goal in life is to make money there are better and safer ways to do it.
Of course UFC fighters want to make more money. We all want to make money. But how do I know they are not under paid or rather how do I know they don't think they are under paid? It's because they are clamoring and begging and killing themselves to fight in the UFC. It's what they want to do. All started fighting for free and would continue fighting for free just like Jiu-Jitsu competitors. All those who first started in the UFC did it because they love the sport. Just like in bodybuilding. I'm sure now because there is money to be made in the UFC many are doing it hoping to make it big and will quit when they realized they have no chance. But the fact is that if you are an MMA fighter you aspire to fight in the UFC regardless of what they pay. Just like Jiu-Jitsu and Grapplers aspire to compete in the Abu Dhabi even though there's no money to be made and the often huge expense they have to take on just to compete in that event.
In any transaction between a buyer and a seller, and as long as there is not a third party with no stake in the outcome meddling in the deal, if the transaction is competed and closed it's because both parties believe they have gotten the best deal that they can under the current conditions. They always want a better deal but in real life you take the best deal given your alternatives. A UFC fighter accepts his pay because he believe that he can't get a better deal elsewhere. If he could, he would. The UFC organization, as with all buyers of any goods or services, pays whatever they want and usually that's as little as they can get away with. It's business. If a fighter has proven himself valuable enough to the company, meaning that they can bring in the dollars, then they start having some clout and negotiate a better deal.
There is no exploitation because nobody is forced to do anything they don't want or agree to.
Sounds like you took a class in economics 101. The truth is they fight for the UFC because they are the only game in town. In boxing different federations popped up when the boxers shopped for their best deal. Then they had to pay big money to get the fights the fans demanded to see.
UFC is a monopoly by any definition. The other organizations are a joke. These MMA guys have no other avenue and the UFC organization is exploiting the situation. They should unionize a strike forcing the UFC to find D list fighters and that would hurt their bottom line. They know they need marquee fighters to make money. An MMA fighter has a very limited self life. That's why unions exist. To stop people with your mentality if they will do it for a penny then I will pay a penny. When Randy Couture was refusing to fight unless they paid him what he wanted the UFC was beside them self putting him down. They knew at the time he was the top dog. They couldn't wait till his career was over.
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Take half away for taxes.
Then after there is half left... pay the people they owe money, pay their trainers, coaches, gym fees, equipment fees, ped fees, etc
left with shit
I don't believe this is accurate. In California maybe, the fights were held in Nevada. I believe Nevada does not have income tax?
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Sounds like you took a class in economics 101. The truth is they fight for the UFC because they are the only game in town. In boxing different federations popped up when the boxers shopped for their best deal. Then they had to pay big money to get the fights the fans demanded to see.
UFC is a monopoly by any definition. The other organizations are a joke. These MMA guys have no other avenue and the UFC organization is exploiting the situation. They should unionize a strike forcing the UFC to find D list fighters and that would hurt their bottom line. They know they need marquee fighters to make money. An MMA fighter has a very limited self life. That's why unions exist. To stop people with your mentality if they will do it for a penny then I will pay a penny. When Randy Couture was refusing to fight unless they paid him what he wanted the UFC was beside them self putting him down. They knew at the time he was the top dog. They couldn't wait till his career was over.
The UFC is the premier MMA organization. But there are others where fighters make a good living. A Japanese fighter, whose name escapes me, recently turned down a UFC contract to stay with his organization. Fedor never went to the UFC even when they desperately wanted him to. There is far more competition and people making a living in MMA than in bodybuilding. The Weider empire built a far stronger and lasting monopoly. But whose fault is that? Just because Weider and Dana White created an organization that everyone wants to be a part of does that make them vilains? The IFBB and the UFC didn't start over night. It took years to build and nothing was guaranteed. None of you would have been around if it went bust and they lost millions? And none of the those who aspired to be a martial artist would have had any hope of making a decent living out of it. Just like how it was prior to the mid 1990s before Pride and before White and Zuffa took over.
As i've said before, fighters dream of one day being able to fight in the UFC. They kill themselves hoping to one day be noticed by Dana White and Zuffa so that they can fight in the UFC for $6,000 or even $600 dollars. You think that's unfair. That's fine and that's your right. You may think they are getting a bad deal but the fighters, no matter what they say, do not. I know this because there is a long line waiting for the opportunity to get in that cage. So you may think it's a bad deal that's why you are not a fighter and have no aspirations to be one. But what do you want to do about what you perceive to be an injustice? Pass a law requiring Dana White to pay every fighter a certain minimum amount? Say a $100,000. Now that would be coercion. Requiring someone, under threat of force, to do something that they do not and would not want to do.
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Where do you live. I'm talking about America. This where the UFC was created and based. There is no Crown land. It is very common for people here to own their land. I have a friend in Montana that owns hundreds of acres.
Most millionaires in this country are first generation millionaires. They didn't inherit it. Bill Gates and Michael Dell didn't inherit anything.
Air conditioning, cell phones, computers, pizza delivery, Amazon, health care, life expectancy, better automobiles, cheaper airline travel, the list is endless. The quality of life is much better today that it was a generation ago. The quality of life is much today than when I was a kid. I had the same injury in both knees ten years apart. The difference and recovery between the first and second, as well as the pain, was incredible. Were talking about a difference in months versus weeks in recovery. You can now have 20-20 vision in less than a half and hour. Even compare the gyms of today to the gyms in the 1950s. Compare the houses. I don't think I am the naive one.
But you are determine to believe your life is screwed because of other people controlling it. Fair enough.
Who cares about Millionaires? Being a millionaire stopped being considered wealthy long ago. And land that isn't privately owned, your Government owns. And Bill Gates is a perfect example of someone who had a leg up. He was born into an extremely wealthy family that hobnobbed amongst other powerful families. His great-grandfather had been a state legislator and mayor, his grandfather was the vice president of a national bank, and his father was a prominent and very wealthy lawyer. Mary Gates, Bill Gates’ mother, was the chairperson for the United Way Charity. Then one of the most influential nonprofit positions in the world. Serving on the exec committee with her back in the early seventies were, among others, John Akers, who would later become the CEO and chairman of International Business Machines (IBM), and John Opel, who preceded Akers in both positions. Mary Gates mentioned her son’s new business to Opel, who by many accounts then relayed this information to other top IBM executives. It was his Mother's connections that got him in with IBM. You're kidding yourself if you think a Bill gates could have come from a working class background.
Bill then went onto turn his families fortunes into billions by creating a monopoly, which is illegal. His illegal activity eventually had his own Government come after him, his legal troubles went away after a change of Government helped financed by guess who.
And I think you are missing the point, the average persons quality of life may be better today,although such a thing is subjective and hard to qualify. The point is, the majority are still serfs, unwilling slaves in lifestyles they wouldn't choose if given real resources and real options. Like I said, you are like a contented slave telling everyone how Master is a good man and treats me well whenever anyone criticises slave ownership.
And what you call ownership of land is quite often ownership of a mortgage, often which takes the greater part of a mans working life to pay off. And where does a man borrow this money from to eventually own a piece of land by the time he is 50 or 60 years old. The Banks which are owned by the Elites. And those 100 of acres of land your friend owns, how much of that land is fertile and has resources of value on it.
I think you have little idea of how much power and wealth the Elites actually have. I also think your level of comfort has prevented you from seeing those underneath you who are being exploited even further. If you live in the USA and like most Western Countries buy cheap clothes and runners and mobile phones and electronics mostly made by slave labour in foreign countries, you are one of the lucky ones, a spoiled slave so to speak. But the fact is, none of this would happen unless it benefits those at the top. Class mobility is a dream of the past, we can all look forward to greater and greater disparities in inequality and a lifetime of involuntary indentured servitude. And although the average Westerners lifestyle is better, the Elites lifestyle is far greater and always will be. You may enjoy being fucked hard up the arse by 'THE MAN' because in the free time he gives you, you can watch UFC and eat ice cream. Me, I just prefer to not be fucked up the arse in the first place.
"When people wanted enough freedom that they couldn’t be enslaved or killed or repressed, new modes of control naturally developed to try to impose forms of mental slavery so they would accept a framework of indoctrination and wouldn’t raise any questions. If you can trap people into not noticing, let alone questioning, crucial doctrines, they’re enslaved. They’ll essentially follow orders as if there was a gun pointed at them."
Noam Chomsky
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The view that working for wages is akin to slavery was already present in the ancient world. At a time when self-sale contracts were one of the most direct ways to become a citizen in ancient Rome, Cicero wrote in his De Officiis that
"whoever gives his labor for money sells himself and puts himself in the rank of slaves."
In 1763, the French journalist Simon Linguet published a description of wage slavery:
The slave was precious to his master because of the money he had cost him . . . They were worth at least as much as they could be sold for in the market . . . It is the impossibility of living by any other means that compels our farm labourers to till the soil whose fruits they will not eat and our masons to construct buildings in which they will not live . . . It is want that compels them to go down on their knees to the rich man in order to get from him permission to enrich him . . . what effective gain [has] the suppression of slavery brought [him ?] He is free, you say. Ah! That is his misfortune . . . These men . . . [have] the most terrible, the most imperious of masters, that is, need. . . . They must therefore find someone to hire them, or die of hunger. Is that to be free?
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OK, so being a millionaire is not rich. Kobe makes 30 million a year but he's not rich. Jay Leno pulls in excess of 25 million a year but not rich. You have quite a high standard for what constitutes being financially wealthy. I'm going to guess then that you are not rich nor will you ever be.
Anybody that works for a living is a slave. The news anchor I'm watching right now on TV is a slave. A member of my church who has worked at Walmart for over 30 years starting as a bag boy but is now a district manager making $150,000 a year is not only not well off but a slave. My 24 year old neighbor who is a fireman and pulled in $75 grand is also a poor slave. The great Arnold who worked as an actor and then a politician is a non rich slave. Dana White and Anderson Silva all have to work to get a pay check and they are just poor slaves. I look at the all the people at the recent New Years neighborhood block party, all laughing and enjoying themselves with their children and families, all looking well fed and happy: a meat manager at a grocery store, a mailman, a school bus driver, a pharmacist, a cashier, truck driver, convenience store owner, a teacher, a web designer... all jobs that allow our society to function. And all slaves. All being, as you so eloquently put it, "Fucked hard up the arse." But not you. You have a leg up on the rest of us. Somehow you manage to provide a roof over your head, food on the table and clothes on your back... not to mention the computer now in front of you by being a free man. How one expects to get things but not work for them is something that Americans don't understand. We value work. We honor the working man.
But to you we are just too ignorant to realize how miserable we should be. Somehow, despite you ability to avoid a "hard arse fucking", you don't strike me as a particularly happy and content person. You sound very bitter, angry and resentful. Resentful of others who have done better in life than you have. And it's not because of any hard work, ambition, drive, intelligence, determination and courage to take risks. It's because they were born elites. Dana White was born into privilege and now can exploit others. He got all the breaks and you didn't. But your virginal arse is still intact. Well, good for you.
We slaves will slave on and you, well, you carry on as well living the dream with your unviolated arse. The rest of us will wallow in our ignorant state of bliss all the way to our grave. You're the true winner. You should be happy.
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The peaceful destruction of E Kul
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I guess they also get famous and then can charge tons of money to dumb rich people who want to train with them? arent they mostly training people once their pro career is finished? The exposure is worth it.
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OK, so being a millionaire is not rich. Kobe makes 30 million a year but he's not rich. Jay Leno pulls in excess of 25 million a year but not rich. You have quite a high standard for what constitutes being financially wealthy. I'm going to guess then that you are not rich nor will you ever be.
Anybody that works for a living is a slave. The news anchor I'm watching right now on TV is a slave. A member of my church who has worked at Walmart for over 30 years starting as a bag boy but is now a district manager making $150,000 a year is not only not well off but a slave. My 24 year old neighbor who is a fireman and pulled in $75 grand is also a poor slave. The great Arnold who worked as an actor and then a politician is a non rich slave. Dana White and Anderson Silva all have to work to get a pay check and they are just poor slaves. I look at the all the people at the recent New Years neighborhood block party, all laughing and enjoying themselves with their children and families, all looking well fed and happy: a meat manager at a grocery store, a mailman, a school bus driver, a pharmacist, a cashier, truck driver, convenience store owner, a teacher, a web designer... all jobs that allow our society to function. And all slaves. All being, as you so eloquently put it, "Fucked hard up the arse." But not you. You have a leg up on the rest of us. Somehow you manage to provide a roof over your head, food on the table and clothes on your back... not to mention the computer now in front of you by being a free man. How one expects to get things but not work for them is something that Americans don't understand. We value work. We honor the working man.
But to you we are just too ignorant to realize how miserable we should be. Somehow, despite you ability to avoid a "hard arse fucking", you don't strike me as a particularly happy and content person. You sound very bitter, angry and resentful. Resentful of others who have done better in life than you have. And it's not because of any hard work, ambition, drive, intelligence, determination and courage to take risks. It's because they were born elites. Dana White was born into privilege and now can exploit others. He got all the breaks and you didn't. But your virginal arse is still intact. Well, good for you.
We slaves will slave on and you, well, you carry on as well living the dream with your unviolated arse. The rest of us will wallow in our ignorant state of bliss all the way to our grave. You're the true winner. You should be happy.
you honor the man who got rid of the competition... the dude who started as a bag boy and ended district manager stepped on many heads to get there, he was the smartest, strongest, fittest, that's all. All humans do admire the strongests, while wishing to see them fail at the same time. Most people stay alive just to see someone else, often a close relative, family member, to fail. That's "human" nature. We are animals.
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we all have that spot we have to clean to put food on the table.
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you honor the man who got rid of the competition... the dude who started as a bag boy and ended district manager stepped on many heads to get there, he was the smartest, strongest, fittest, that's all. All humans do admire the strongests, while wishing to see them fail at the same time. Most people stay alive just to see someone else, often a close relative, family member, to fail. That's "human" nature. We are animals.
I don't entirely agree with this. Of course when you succeed, get a particular position in life, be it a District Manager or a part in a movie or sitcom, that means that someone else didn't get it. But it doesn't necessarily mean that you stepped on heads. That implies, at least as I read it, that you did something malicious to your competition to get that position. It could be that the hiring party simply evaluated the candidates and chose whom he thought was the best. If three people are being interviewed for a job and one is chosen, it's not because he stepped on his competition's head or did anything to undermine their success. Chances are he doesn't even know or even met the other candidates. And though this may apply to you, I don't, nor do I think most other people, wish others to fail. I think most Americans want everybody to succeed and do well. Just because you don't get a certain job or a certain position you wanted doesn't mean you failed in life. At least in this country, opportunities abound if you are willing to hustle a little. That's why a lot of immigrants, with little education and not even knowing the language, can succeed and be successful. They know what it's really like to come from an oppressive and corrupt country where you have very little or no hope to improve your circumstances.
We may be animals but not all of us are just animals. Unlike animals we have a moral sense and I believe a soul and often will do things and sacrifice things, even our own survival, for a perceived higher moral good. My grandfather who was only 16 years old lied about his age so that he could join the Army and fight for his country.
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Good judgement on luvvsunot's part. Yes, we are all slaves.
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OK, so being a millionaire is not rich. Kobe makes 30 million a year but he's not rich. Jay Leno pulls in excess of 25 million a year but not rich. You have quite a high standard for what constitutes being financially wealthy. I'm going to guess then that you are not rich nor will you ever be.
Anybody that works for a living is a slave. The news anchor I'm watching right now on TV is a slave. A member of my church who has worked at Walmart for over 30 years starting as a bag boy but is now a district manager making $150,000 a year is not only not well off but a slave. My 24 year old neighbor who is a fireman and pulled in $75 grand is also a poor slave. The great Arnold who worked as an actor and then a politician is a non rich slave. Dana White and Anderson Silva all have to work to get a pay check and they are just poor slaves. I look at the all the people at the recent New Years neighborhood block party, all laughing and enjoying themselves with their children and families, all looking well fed and happy: a meat manager at a grocery store, a mailman, a school bus driver, a pharmacist, a cashier, truck driver, convenience store owner, a teacher, a web designer... all jobs that allow our society to function. And all slaves. All being, as you so eloquently put it, "Fucked hard up the arse." But not you. You have a leg up on the rest of us. Somehow you manage to provide a roof over your head, food on the table and clothes on your back... not to mention the computer now in front of you by being a free man. How one expects to get things but not work for them is something that Americans don't understand. We value work. We honor the working man.
But to you we are just too ignorant to realize how miserable we should be. Somehow, despite you ability to avoid a "hard arse fucking", you don't strike me as a particularly happy and content person. You sound very bitter, angry and resentful. Resentful of others who have done better in life than you have. And it's not because of any hard work, ambition, drive, intelligence, determination and courage to take risks. It's because they were born elites. Dana White was born into privilege and now can exploit others. He got all the breaks and you didn't. But your virginal arse is still intact. Well, good for you.
We slaves will slave on and you, well, you carry on as well living the dream with your unviolated arse. The rest of us will wallow in our ignorant state of bliss all the way to our grave. You're the true winner. You should be happy.
I have done very well in life. I also value work, that work that benefits me and not enriches an already rich individual. It is you who sound miserable and bitter. I am happy because I worked hard to have access to the MOST VALUABLE resource in the world. MY OWN TIME. All those people doing jobs they wouldn't be doing if they didn't have a choice and think that is somehow freedom are merely brainwashed. You really have no idea how indoctrinated you are do you. You have just literally served up the exact same view of the Elites who enslave, yes most everyone. Ever heard of Cultural Hegemony which describes the domination of a culturally diverse society by the ruling class, who manipulate the culture of the society — the beliefs, explanations, perceptions, values, and mores — so that their ruling-class worldview becomes the worldview that is imposed and accepted as the cultural norm; as the universally valid dominant ideology that justifies the social, political, and economic status quo as natural, inevitable, perpetual and beneficial for everyone, rather than as artificial social constructs that benefit only the ruling class. That's the beauty and genius of the system, the enslaved have no idea that they are in fact enslaved. The problem is people are told what to think rather than how to think. Those who have learned how to think will escape this indoctrination and be able to see outside of their limited worldview.
The irony is, it was the Slave Owners who first suggested that wage slavery was even more oppressive than Chattel Slavery. They were right, they merely replaced the fear of force with propaganda. The only FREE man is those that have found a way to REALLY CHOOSE what they do with their time. If their only choice is to work or starve, this isn't true freedom. And you fail to see the scale of oppression and exploitation. America could be considered the more well off slaves, living of the more exploited third world Countries. The thing that strikes me is you have no idea how you betray your own class and promote the agenda of the ruling class. It's as if you are completely oblivious to the brainwashing you have endured. If you are a happy contented slave, carry on then. If you are happy to sacrifice the one thing that is truly yours, your time, to further enrich already obscenely rich men then carry on comrade. I am sure they appreciate you sacrificing what could have been the best years of your life to do so. Like I said, the genius of the ruling classes is how they have gotten those they exploit to promote their agenda.
Well, I think that what used to be called, centuries ago, "wage slavery" is intolerable. And I don't think people ought to be forced to rent themselves in order to survive. I think that the economic institutions ought to be run democratically, by their participants, by the communities in which they exist, and so on; and I think basically through various kinds of free association.- Noam Chomsky
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OK, so being a millionaire is not rich. Kobe makes 30 million a year but he's not rich. Jay Leno pulls in excess of 25 million a year but not rich. You have quite a high standard for what constitutes being financially wealthy. I'm going to guess then that you are not rich nor will you ever be.
Anybody that works for a living is a slave. The news anchor I'm watching right now on TV is a slave. A member of my church who has worked at Walmart for over 30 years starting as a bag boy but is now a district manager making $150,000 a year is not only not well off but a slave. My 24 year old neighbor who is a fireman and pulled in $75 grand is also a poor slave. The great Arnold who worked as an actor and then a politician is a non rich slave. Dana White and Anderson Silva all have to work to get a pay check and they are just poor slaves. I look at the all the people at the recent New Years neighborhood block party, all laughing and enjoying themselves with their children and families, all looking well fed and happy: a meat manager at a grocery store, a mailman, a school bus driver, a pharmacist, a cashier, truck driver, convenience store owner, a teacher, a web designer... all jobs that allow our society to function. And all slaves. All being, as you so eloquently put it, "Fucked hard up the arse." But not you. You have a leg up on the rest of us. Somehow you manage to provide a roof over your head, food on the table and clothes on your back... not to mention the computer now in front of you by being a free man. How one expects to get things but not work for them is something that Americans don't understand. We value work. We honor the working man.
But to you we are just too ignorant to realize how miserable we should be. Somehow, despite you ability to avoid a "hard arse fucking", you don't strike me as a particularly happy and content person. You sound very bitter, angry and resentful. Resentful of others who have done better in life than you have. And it's not because of any hard work, ambition, drive, intelligence, determination and courage to take risks. It's because they were born elites. Dana White was born into privilege and now can exploit others. He got all the breaks and you didn't. But your virginal arse is still intact. Well, good for you.
We slaves will slave on and you, well, you carry on as well living the dream with your unviolated arse. The rest of us will wallow in our ignorant state of bliss all the way to our grave. You're the true winner. You should be happy.
This parable sums up the difference in our point of views:
An American tourist was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked.
Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The tourist complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them.
The Mexican replied, "Only a little while."
The tourist then asked, "Why didn't you stay out longer and catch more fish?"
The Mexican said, "With this I have more than enough to support my family's needs."
The tourist then asked, "But what do you do with the rest of your time?"
The Mexican fisherman said, "I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play guitar with my amigos, I have a full and busy life."
The tourist scoffed, " I can help you. You should spend more time fishing; and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat: With the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats. Eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor; eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution. You could leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then Los Angeles and eventually New York where you could run your ever-expanding enterprise."
The Mexican fisherman asked, "But, how long will this all take?"
The tourist replied, "15 to 20 years."
"But what then?" asked the Mexican.
The tourist laughed and said, "That's the best part. When the time is right you would sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions."
"Millions?...Then what?"
The American said, "Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos."
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I have done very well in life. I also value work, that work that benefits me and not enriches an already rich individual. It is you who sound miserable and bitter. I am happy because I worked hard to have access to the MOST VALUABLE resource in the world. MY OWN TIME. All those people doing jobs they wouldn't be doing if they didn't have a choice and think that is somehow freedom are merely brainwashed. You really have no idea how indoctrinated you are do you. You have just literally served up the exact same view of the Elites who enslave, yes most everyone. Ever heard of Cultural Hegemony which describes the domination of a culturally diverse society by the ruling class, who manipulate the culture of the society — the beliefs, explanations, perceptions, values, and mores — so that their ruling-class worldview becomes the worldview that is imposed and accepted as the cultural norm; as the universally valid dominant ideology that justifies the social, political, and economic status quo as natural, inevitable, perpetual and beneficial for everyone, rather than as artificial social constructs that benefit only the ruling class. That's the beauty and genius of the system, the enslaved have no idea that they are in fact enslaved. The problem is people are told what to think rather than how to think. Those who have learned how to think will escape this indoctrination and be able to see outside of their limited worldview.
The irony is, it was the Slave Owners who first suggested that wage slavery was even more oppressive than Chattel Slavery. They were right, they merely replaced the fear of force with propaganda. The only FREE man is those that have found a way to REALLY CHOOSE what they do with their time. If their only choice is to work or starve, this isn't true freedom. And you fail to see the scale of oppression and exploitation. America could be considered the more well off slaves, living of the more exploited third world Countries. The thing that strikes me is you have no idea how you betray your own class and promote the agenda of the ruling class. It's as if you are completely oblivious to the brainwashing you have endured. If you are a happy contented slave, carry on then. If you are happy to sacrifice the one thing that is truly yours, your time, to further enrich already obscenely rich men then carry on comrade. I am sure they appreciate you sacrificing what could have been the best years of your life to do so. Like I said, the genius of the ruling classes is how they have gotten those they exploit to promote their agenda.
Well, I think that what used to be called, centuries ago, "wage slavery" is intolerable. And I don't think people ought to be forced to rent themselves in order to survive. I think that the economic institutions ought to be run democratically, by their participants, by the communities in which they exist, and so on; and I think basically through various kinds of free association.- Noam Chomsky
So what do you do for a living?
And give me an example of me sounding miserable and bitter? I am grateful for my life and being born and living in the USA and gave examples of that. How I believe our lives are much, much better than previous generations.
You are the one constantly moaning about everybody who works for a living is enslaved and we're all controlled by the "elites". You believe our lives are much worse than our grandparents and beyond. You don't sound grateful at all for the relatively cushy life you live. Without gratitude happiness is impossible.