Evolution breaks two laws of science, disproving theory by science itself.....

[GET_BIGGER]

You're the one claiming evolution is false and God exists...Not me. You've yet to prove your claims or address my refutations.

Just so you know I haven't claimed anything......BECAUSE I don't know.  Nobody does, not even you Johnny boy.  On either side there is no theory that is 100% factual and non biased.  Science explains history, does not prove it and will never prove it because I don't think this world will ever have all the complete facts.

I have always been in favor of the underdog in anything I come across, which is why I play devils advocate to you.  I don't have a clue about what I am talking about, just seeing if I can get a rise out of you Johnny.      

Ya wanna no what I am concerned about Johnny boy, what I would like answered?  It is What is the purpose of life?  Why are we here?  What are we here for?  Where are we going?  What happens after this life?  What is our significance? 

To work, have a family, make money, have material possessions, contribute to our culture?  Then die and be satisfied?  What?  Do we even have a meaning or significance?  Are we just something that happened out of chance (a scientifically impossible chance from what I understand)?  Why?

I am guessing you know the answer to this Johnny?  So educate me.  You have had to come across this when you renounced your faith.  Going from being a unconditionally loved child of God or to something that is purposeless and that happened by chance.  What is your reasoning Johnny?  I don't have a clue.  I don't know.  Help me understand.  Give me purpose Johnny.  I am 28 and have achieved everyhing in life I have set out to.  I could retire tomorrow and masturbate the rest of my life.  Give me purpose.

[Johnny Apollo]

Just so you know I haven't claimed anything......BECAUSE I don't know.  Nobody does, not even you Johnny boy.  On either side there is no theory that is 100% factual and non biased.  Science explains history, does not prove it and will never prove it because I don't think this world will ever have all the complete facts.

You're not making sense. You're talking as if "intelligent design" is a scientific theory like evolution is. It isn't. It's not science at all. It's religion.

Evolution is 100% factual. It happens. Period.

Science explians history? What does that even mean?

I have always been in favor of the underdog in anything I come across, which is why I play devils advocate to you.  I don't have a clue about what I am talking about, just seeing if I can get a rise out of you Johnny.      

Ya wanna no what I am concerned about Johnny boy, what I would like answered?  It is What is the purpose of life?  Why are we here?  What are we here for?  Where are we going?  What happens after this life?  What is our significance? 

Purpose? No "divine purpose".

After we die? Most likely nothing.

Our significance? Little.

To work, have a family, make money, have material possessions, contribute to our culture?  Then die and be satisfied?  What?  Do we even have a meaning or significance?  Are we just something that happened out of chance (a scientifically impossible chance from what I understand)?  Why?

We evolved from miscroscopic single celled organisims.

You don't understanding anything about science so don't say so and so is "scientifically impossible".

I am guessing you know the answer to this Johnny?  So educate me.  You have had to come across this when you renounced your faith.  Going from being a unconditionally loved child of God or to something that is purposeless and that happened by chance.  What is your reasoning Johnny?  I don't have a clue.  I don't know.  Help me understand.  Give me purpose Johnny.  I am 28 and have achieved everyhing in life I have set out to.  I could retire tomorrow and masturbate the rest of my life.  Give me purpose.

I don't choose my beliefs based on what beliefs I think I would like best. I choose my beliefs based on the facts and evidence. That's all.

[snatch_clean]

I have been o w n e d burtally.....LMFAO!!!!  You need to get out of your lab, off your computer and out more, get laid (hell, I'll even pay for a prostitute for your uptight anal arse), get the stick out from up your a**, and get a sense of humor.  IT WAS A JOKE!!  Geez.....

And who the f**k is the one who masturbates here....LOL....

"Prove God poofed, wheres your evidence, show me data"......lmfao....ahhh sheeiiitt.

But serious Johnny boy, lighten up.  You might live longer.

First of I am not Johnny Apollo but to your inferior intelligence cannot fathom the difference between a genuine academic (me) and JA. But I will forgive you.

Secondly all I said was you got 0wned, and rightfully so. Of course deniers of science like you will deny this as well, but is of no concern to me.

Thirdly it seems you need to lighten up. I could *see* your blood pressure rise with every character you. It is so easy to rattle you religious guys while us tight assed scientific types do not feel the need for blasphemy. Science is not perfect. The Navier-Stokes equations for incompressible fluids  are based on the continuum assumption, in addition to assuming uniform viscosity and linear deformation rates. Is it perfect? No! Does it work in a lot of situation? Yes. What do we do when there are cases it does not work? Like flows with large knudsen numbers, eg. flow in micro-channels or rarefied gas flows? Use another set of more rigorous equations that relax those simplifying assumptions. At times statistics is used which in itself is not perfect but pretty darned accurate for engineering purposes. Reflection and refraction of light can be only explained by the wave theory; while the photoelectric effect, Compton Effect, and diffraction require the quantum (particle) theory of light. Do you see what science is? Science is a modeling of the Truth. There are good models and there are bad models. Intelligent Design is a very bad model not because scientists are God haters but because while creationism might explain very simply the origin of the universe it does have many predictions which are testable. Those that are testable have failed (age of the earth for instance).

Fourthly (wow did I digress) it seems my earlier conjecture that you were molested by your pastor is correct, why else would you assume that I need it up my ass? Again the religious ones are the first to discard their piety and humility they recommend everyone else follow.

Lastly, if anyone here is "masturbating" it is you with your false cut and paste knowledge which not only is patently incorrect but also not original.

[Johnny Apollo]

First of I am not Johnny Apollo but to your inferior intelligence cannot fathom the difference between a genuine academic (me) and JA. But I will forgive you.

 

[w8tlftr]

 

Nerd fight!!! 

[Johnny Apollo]

Snatch_Clean is a "genuine academic" as much as i'm a fundamentalist baptist christian.

[Colossus_500]

Snatch_Clean is a "genuine academic" as much as i'm a fundamentalist baptist christian.

hmmmm

this ought to be interesting.

[zillamonster]

 " Evolution breaks two laws of science, disproving theory by science itself..... "

   That is perhaps the dumbest thing I have ever read. Everything evolves, man, planets, galaxy and even the universe.

[Johnny Apollo]

" Evolution breaks two laws of science, disproving theory by science itself..... "

   That is perhaps the dumbest thing I have ever read. Everything evolves, man, planets, galaxy and even the universe.

Don't forget the one who posted this thread "Doesn't study evolution because he doesn't beleive in it." Yet he thinks he can argue against it with actuall scientists.

Everything evolves yes, But when scientists mention "Evolution" most of the time they're refering to Biological Evolution,Common ancestory.

[GET_BIGGER]

Don't forget the one who posted this thread "Doesn't study evolution because he doesn't beleive in it."

When did I say that?  I don't study it because I don't have time.  Just because I don't believe in something doesn't mean I don't study it.....

When you SEE a god, you will believe.  When I see life come from non-living goo I will believe.

[Johnny Apollo]

When did I say that?  I don't study it because I don't have time.  Just because I don't believe in something doesn't mean I don't study it.....

When you SEE a god, you will believe.  When I see life come from non-living goo I will believe.

Maybe it was someone else. But i'm pretty sure it was you.



I don't limit my belief to what I can "see". I limit my belief to what the EVIDENCE supports. I can't see radio waves but they can be measured and that's evidence they are there, Thus I believe they exist.

I can't directly see how life evolved from non-life but that doesn't mean we don't have evidence for it. Just like Forensic Science. You don't see the crime occuring directly but you can look at evidence left behind and determine exactly what happened.
This is what scientists do to determine how evolution occured. They look at the evidence left behind in the fossil record,In our own DNA,They look at the life on earth now and how it exists in various areas.

[Colossus_500]

Maybe it was someone else. But i'm pretty sure it was you.



I don't limit my belief to what I can "see". I limit my belief to what the EVIDENCE supports. I can't see radio waves but they can be measured and that's evidence they are there, Thus I believe they exist.

I can't directly see how life evolved from non-life but that doesn't mean we don't have evidence for it. Just like Forensic Science. You don't see the crime occuring directly but you can look at evidence left behind and determine exactly what happened.
This is what scientists do to determine how evolution occured. They look at the evidence left behind in the fossil record,In our own DNA,They look at the life on earth now and how it exists in various areas.

evidence is another way of "seeing", is it not?

[GET_BIGGER]

Maybe it was someone else. But i'm pretty sure it was you.

Nope, not me.  Actually I am pretty open minded and enjoy learning about everything I can.  I actually believe evolution is part of God's creation but not to the degree that we have been debating about.

Just like you believe in your scientific evidence, I see evidence all around me of God working in peoples lives......some miraculous, others in everyday life.   

[Johnny Apollo]

evidence is another way of "seeing", is it not?

Not directly. I can't directly see radio waves but I can see evidence of them.

The statement "I won't beleive evolution until it see it happening" thus makes no sense. Evidence exists proving it happened and is still happening despite not being able to directly observe it(like radio waves).
Even though speciation has directly been observed.

[Johnny Apollo]

I've got a feeling you deleted where you stated you don't study evolution becuase you don't believe in it...

Nope, not me.  Actually I am pretty open minded and enjoy learning about everything I can.  I actually believe evolution is part of God's creation but not to the degree that we have been debating about.

Common decent occured. Common ancestory. All life on earth today evolved from common ancestors about 3 billion years ago. These common ancestors were microbial organisims. Microscopic.

Gradually they evolved and evolved and what we see today are the outmost branches of the life on earth.

Go back in time and the modern recient branches didn't exist. Go back 1,000,000 years and the modern species today didn't exist. Weren't alive. Other species now existinct were alive.

Just like you believe in your scientific evidence, I see evidence all around me of God working in peoples lives......some miraculous, others in everyday life.   

What you see is nature which formed naturally. You INTERPRET it as evidence of a "God" but you can't prove it's evidence of a God.
You INTERPRET random things occuring as "miracles" but you can't prove they are miracles.

Going with occams razor(Look it up) the best explanation of the same event is the one that doesn't appeal to supernatural events. You see someone is diagnosed with cancer one day and then prays and then a week later doesn't have cancer. You can interpret this is a "Miracle" or as a "faulty diagnosis".
Going with occams razor the best explanation is the one that requires the least questions. If you say a "miracle" caused it then you now have to explain WHY and HOW and the mechanics of miracles and prove miracles exist..ect..ect. Going with the natural "faulty diagnosis" explanation all you have to do is prove faulty diagnoses occur(which they do) and that's it.

[GET_BIGGER]

I've got a feeling you deleted where you stated you don't study evolution becuase you don't believe in it...

LOL, you give yourself too much credit Johnny boy.  If I said it I would admit it. 

Common decent occured. Common ancestory. All life on earth today evolved from common ancestors about 3 billion years ago. These common ancestors were microbial organisims. Microscopic.

Gradually they evolved and evolved and what we see today are the outmost branches of the life on earth.

Go back in time and the modern recient branches didn't exist. Go back 1,000,000 years and the modern species today didn't exist. Weren't alive. Other species now existinct were alive.

Microbial organisms to homosapians.  See, to me this is more far fetched than believing in a God as a creator.  There isn't even a link between us and apes, let alone us and microwhatever.  Not to mention how did these microbial organisms become living?  To me that is not logical as much as me believing in a God is logical to you.

What you see is nature which formed naturally. You INTERPRET it as evidence of a "God" but you can't prove it's evidence of a God.
You INTERPRET random things occuring as "miracles" but you can't prove they are miracles.

And that is called faith my friend.  Thats why I have no grounds for debate.

Going with occams razor(Look it up) the best explanation of the same event is the one that doesn't appeal to supernatural events. You see someone is diagnosed with cancer one day and then prays and then a week later doesn't have cancer. You can interpret this is a "Miracle" or as a "faulty diagnosis".
Going with occams razor the best explanation is the one that requires the least questions. If you say a "miracle" caused it then you now have to explain WHY and HOW and the mechanics of miracles and prove miracles exist..ect..ect. Going with the natural "faulty diagnosis" explanation all you have to do is prove faulty diagnoses occur(which they do) and that's it.

I would agree that God would be an "unnecessary hypothesis" if indeed he didn't exist and we would have no supernatural being to pray too.

[Colossus_500]

Nope, not me.  Actually I am pretty open minded and enjoy learning about everything I can.  I actually believe evolution is part of God's creation but not to the degree that we have been debating about.

Just like you believe in your scientific evidence, I see evidence all around me of God working in peoples lives......some miraculous, others in everyday life.   

Well stated, GB!   

[War-Horse]

Ohh I'll read it, just give me some time.....

[Duane Gish, a retired official of the Institute for Creation Research in San Diego, said, "This alleged transitional fish will have to be evaluated carefully." But he added that he still found evolution "questionable because paleontologists have yet to discover any transitional fossils between complex invertebrates and fish, and this destroys the whole evolutionary story." ]

http://science.enotes.com/science-news/fossil-find-could-link-sea-land-animals

And they never will find transitional fossils because the flood happened in a short amount of time.  And get over the theory of million year old this or that from carbon dating.       The earths matter could have existed for a billion years before God formed it into earth.    If I suddenly buried you in dirt that was a million years old, theyd think you were the same age.  Yes its true.......very simple and true.

[Johnny Apollo]

LOL, you give yourself too much credit Johnny boy.  If I said it I would admit it. 


Microbial organisms to homosapians.  See, to me this is more far fetched than believing in a God as a creator.  There isn't even a link between us and apes, let alone us and microwhatever.  Not to mention how did these microbial organisms become living?  To me that is not logical as much as me believing in a God is logical to you.

Why are you still making these obviously false claims? I've explained this over and over to you but you just don't even read my posts.

1.We didn't evolve from "Apes" We ARE apes.

2.There are thousands of intermediate fossils.

3.How microbial organisms became living? They're ORGANISIMS they ARE living.

I've explained this already to you, I won't do it over and over just so you can ignore it and then argue the same nonsense.

And that is called faith my friend.  Thats why I have no grounds for debate.

So you ignore the actuall evidence and make up your own? Seems unreasonable.

I would agree that God would be an "unnecessary hypothesis" if indeed he didn't exist and we would have no supernatural being to pray too.

No one knows if a "God" exists or not. An unnecessary hypothesis means that "God" is an explanation to something and then another explanation is "nature". Nature is much more likely than a "God" and requires less explanations. Thus "God" is an inferior explanation of ANYTHING.

[Johnny Apollo]

And they never will find transitional fossils because the flood happened in a short amount of time.  And get over the theory of million year old this or that from carbon dating.       The earths matter could have existed for a billion years before God formed it into earth.    If I suddenly buried you in dirt that was a million years old, theyd think you were the same age.  Yes its true.......very simple and true.

1.Absolutely ZERO evidence of a global flood.

2.The earth is over 4 BILLION years old. "Carbon dating"? You moron..Carbon dating isn't used to determine the age of the earth. It's only used on carbon based life forms and only works up to 50,000 years. Other forms of radiometric dating are used to determine the age of the earth.

3.The earths matter could of existed before "God formed it"? Really? Explain why we find that the deeper we go the general age of the layers is older?
Explain why fossils are ordered in LAYERS from oldest(deepest) to newest(nearest). Explain why,If there was some massive flood did the fossils form into layers relative to the age they lifed on earth? 

4.Suddenly burrying me in dirt a million years old would not make anyone believe I was 1 million years old. Many things happen to dislodge fossils from their resting place and put them deeper in the strata. This however is irrelevant and scientists can determine when this happens.

5.Will never find transitional fossils?

Here is a short list of transitionals from reptiles to mammals.

Paleothyris
Protoclepsydrops haplous
Clepsydrops
Archaeothyris
Varanops
Haptodus
Dimetrodon
Sphenacodon
Procynosuchus
Dvinia also Permocynodon
Cynognathus
Probelesodon
Probainognathus
Exaeretodon

No Transitionals? Scientists just reciently found a missing link that was all over the news. It's a link between fish and mammals called "Tiktaaluk".

Just reciently also scientits found Australopithecus fossils in Ethopia. These are human ancestors which aren't human.

[snatch_clean]

I think War-Horse just got a major ass kicking. Its amazing how people who don't know the S in Science try to find loopholes in science and technology, exposing their ignorance.

[Dos Equis]

Address all of my points or don't post arguments you can't refute.

Why would anyone bother?  Have you ever admitted being wrong on this board?  Sometimes you make sense, sometimes you don't.  The genuinely smart people I know admit when they're wrong.   

I'm glad I "discovered" this section of getbig.  It provides great comic relief.   

[Johnny Apollo]

Why would anyone bother?  Have you ever admitted being wrong on this board?  Sometimes you make sense, sometimes you don't.  The genuinely smart people I know admit when they're wrong.   

I'm glad I "discovered" this section of getbig.  It provides great comic relief.   

When i'm wrong I admit it. Though that's rarely the case.

Prove me wrong and i'll admit I'm wrong. Critiquing me for not admiting i'm wrong when I'm not wrong makes no sense.

[Dos Equis]

When i'm wrong I admit it. Though that's rarely the case.

Prove me wrong and i'll admit I'm wrong. Critiquing me for not admiting i'm wrong when I'm not wrong makes no sense.

Impossible.  No one can prove you wrong if you refuse to admit when you're wrong.  Now THAT makes no sense. 

But maybe I'm wrong.  When have you admitted on this board that you were wrong and someone else was right? 

[Colossus_500]

Impossible.  No one can prove you wrong if you refuse to admit when you're wrong.  Now THAT makes no sense. 

But maybe I'm wrong.  When have you admitted on this board that you were wrong and someone else was right? 

I thought Johnny was done posting on the Religion board?