Author Topic: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.  (Read 34770 times)

LurkerNoMore

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Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« on: August 31, 2015, 05:42:46 PM »
http://news.yahoo.com/reckoning-nears-clerk-resisting-same-sex-marriage-ruling-202230268.html#

MOREHEAD, Ky. (AP) — The Supreme Court on Monday ruled against the Kentucky county clerk who has refused to issue same-sex marriage licenses, and the clerk will arrive at work Tuesday morning to face her moment of truth.

Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis will have to choose whether to issue marriage licenses, defying her Christian conviction, or continue to refuse them, defying a federal judge who could pummel her with fines or order that she be hauled off to jail.

"She's going to have to think and pray about her decision overnight. She certainly understands the consequences either way," Mat Staver, founder of the law firm representing Davis, said on Monday, hours before a court-ordered delay in the case expired. "She'll report to work tomorrow, and face whatever she has to face."

A line of couples, turned away by her office again and again in the two months since the U.S. Supreme Court legalized gay marriage across the nation, plan to meet her at the courthouse door.

Davis stopped issuing all marriage licenses in the days after the landmark decision. Two gay couples and two straight couples sued her, arguing that she must fulfill her duties as an elected official despite her personal religious faith. A federal judge ordered her to issue the licenses, and an appeals court upheld that decision. Her lawyers with the Liberty Counsel filed a last-ditch appeal to the Supreme Court on Friday, asking that they grant her "asylum for her conscience."

Justice Elena Kagan, who oversees the 6th district, referred Davis' request to the full court, which denied the stay without comment. Kagan joined the majority in June when the court legalized gay marriage across the nation.

Meanwhile, a couple that had been turned away went to Rowan County Attorney Cecil Watkins to ask that she be charged with official misconduct, a misdemeanor defined by state law as a public official who "refrains from performing a duty imposed upon him by law or clearly inherent in the nature of his office." The crime is punishable by up to a year in jail.

Watkins cited a conflict of interest and forwarded the complaint to Kentucky Attorney General Jack Conway, whose office will decide whether to appoint a special prosecutor, generally a county attorney from a surrounding jurisdiction, who would decide whether to file charges.

As the clock wound down for Davis on Monday, the tension intensified between dueling groups of protesters outside her office window on the courthouse lawn.

Hexie Mefford has stood on the lawn waving a flag nearly every day for more than two months. The flag is fashioned after Old Glory, but with a rainbow instead of the red and white bars.

Mike Reynolds, a Christian protesting in Davis' defense, shouted at her that he found the flag offensive: He is an Army veteran, he complained, and they had desecrated the American flag. The two groups roared at each other. The Christians called on the activists to repent; the activists countered that their God loves all.

It was a marked difference from the cordial protests that unfolded there every day since Davis declared she would issue no licenses.

Rachelle Bombe has sat there every day, wearing rainbow colors and carrying signs that demand marriage equality. One particularly hot day, Davis, the woman she was there to protest against, worried Bombe would get overheated and offered her a cold drink. In turn, Bombe said she's checked in on Davis, whose lawyer says she's received death threats and hate mail, to make sure she's holding up despite the difficult circumstances.

"She's a very nice lady, I like her a lot," Bombe said of Davis. "We're on the opposite sides of this, but it's not personal."

On Monday, the Christians stood on the grass and sang "I am a Child of God."

The marriage equality activists chimed in after each refrain: "So are we."

-----

When she loses her job, she can pray for her bills to be paid.

Straw Man

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2015, 06:26:47 PM »
http://news.yahoo.com/reckoning-nears-clerk-resisting-same-sex-marriage-ruling-202230268.html#

MOREHEAD, Ky. (AP) — The Supreme Court on Monday ruled against the Kentucky county clerk who has refused to issue same-sex marriage licenses, and the clerk will arrive at work Tuesday morning to face her moment of truth.

Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis will have to choose whether to issue marriage licenses, defying her Christian conviction, or continue to refuse them, defying a federal judge who could pummel her with fines or order that she be hauled off to jail.

"She's going to have to think and pray about her decision overnight. She certainly understands the consequences either way," Mat Staver, founder of the law firm representing Davis, said on Monday, hours before a court-ordered delay in the case expired. "She'll report to work tomorrow, and face whatever she has to face."

A line of couples, turned away by her office again and again in the two months since the U.S. Supreme Court legalized gay marriage across the nation, plan to meet her at the courthouse door.

Davis stopped issuing all marriage licenses in the days after the landmark decision. Two gay couples and two straight couples sued her, arguing that she must fulfill her duties as an elected official despite her personal religious faith. A federal judge ordered her to issue the licenses, and an appeals court upheld that decision. Her lawyers with the Liberty Counsel filed a last-ditch appeal to the Supreme Court on Friday, asking that they grant her "asylum for her conscience."

Justice Elena Kagan, who oversees the 6th district, referred Davis' request to the full court, which denied the stay without comment. Kagan joined the majority in June when the court legalized gay marriage across the nation.

Meanwhile, a couple that had been turned away went to Rowan County Attorney Cecil Watkins to ask that she be charged with official misconduct, a misdemeanor defined by state law as a public official who "refrains from performing a duty imposed upon him by law or clearly inherent in the nature of his office." The crime is punishable by up to a year in jail.

Watkins cited a conflict of interest and forwarded the complaint to Kentucky Attorney General Jack Conway, whose office will decide whether to appoint a special prosecutor, generally a county attorney from a surrounding jurisdiction, who would decide whether to file charges.

As the clock wound down for Davis on Monday, the tension intensified between dueling groups of protesters outside her office window on the courthouse lawn.

Hexie Mefford has stood on the lawn waving a flag nearly every day for more than two months. The flag is fashioned after Old Glory, but with a rainbow instead of the red and white bars.

Mike Reynolds, a Christian protesting in Davis' defense, shouted at her that he found the flag offensive: He is an Army veteran, he complained, and they had desecrated the American flag. The two groups roared at each other. The Christians called on the activists to repent; the activists countered that their God loves all.

It was a marked difference from the cordial protests that unfolded there every day since Davis declared she would issue no licenses.

Rachelle Bombe has sat there every day, wearing rainbow colors and carrying signs that demand marriage equality. One particularly hot day, Davis, the woman she was there to protest against, worried Bombe would get overheated and offered her a cold drink. In turn, Bombe said she's checked in on Davis, whose lawyer says she's received death threats and hate mail, to make sure she's holding up despite the difficult circumstances.

"She's a very nice lady, I like her a lot," Bombe said of Davis. "We're on the opposite sides of this, but it's not personal."

On Monday, the Christians stood on the grass and sang "I am a Child of God."

The marriage equality activists chimed in after each refrain: "So are we."

-----

When she loses her job, she can pray for her bills to be paid.


She's an elected official and apparently can't be fired.  

This is so typical of fundies who think that their personal religious beliefs somehow trump the civil rights of everyone else

If she is unwilling or incapable of doing the job then she should do the honorable thing and just resign

That would also be consistent with her religious beliefs which would make her an honorable person

I suspect she will see herself as a martyr or some kind of warrior for jesus and she will continue to deny law abiding citizens their civil rights.

I'd rather see her hauled off to jail than fined.

Irongrip400

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2015, 06:49:02 PM »
Let me preface this with saying this, I think gay people should be able to be married. That said, and I didn't read the article so forgive me if it answers my question, but is she the only person at the courthouse who can issue the marriage license? Can't just go to the next "window" and pick one up?

TuHolmes

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2015, 06:50:39 PM »
Let me preface this with saying this, I think gay people should be able to be married. That said, and I didn't read the article so forgive me if it answers my question, but is she the only person at the courthouse who can issue the marriage license? Can't just go to the next "window" and pick one up?

Morehead, KY. Total Population is less than 7000.

She's probably the only one.

Small places don't have a lot of options.

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2015, 07:00:43 AM »
She's an elected official and apparently can't be fired.  

This is so typical of fundies who think that their personal religious beliefs somehow trump the civil rights of everyone else

If she is unwilling or incapable of doing the job then she should do the honorable thing and just resign

That would also be consistent with her religious beliefs which would make her an honorable person

I suspect she will see herself as a martyr or some kind of warrior for jesus and she will continue to deny law abiding citizens their civil rights.

I'd rather see her hauled off to jail than fined.

I was being sarcastic.   


headhuntersix

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2015, 07:37:31 AM »
Good for her....
L

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2015, 08:49:37 AM »
Good for her....

Your bitterness is showing.

headhuntersix

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2015, 09:17:28 AM »
read...I don't give a shit.
L

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2015, 09:23:38 AM »
read...I don't give a shit.

read...  but you approve of her little act of bitterness too.

Dos Equis

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2015, 09:56:20 AM »
Apparently, she understands licenses must be issued, but just doesn't want her name on the licenses.  She is asking for a reasonable accommodation of her religious beliefs and practices.  Sounds like an easy fix.  At least that's the way someone explained it to me. 

LurkerNoMore

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« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2015, 12:07:11 PM »
Apparently, she understands licenses must be issued, but just doesn't want her name on the licenses.  She is asking for a reasonable accommodation of her religious beliefs and practices.  Sounds like an easy fix.  At least that's the way someone explained it to me. 

Her religion won't let her do the job she is supposed to do.  Easy fix?  She can quit and find something that her religion allows.  That's pretty reasonable for everyone involved.  There is a separation of church and state for a reason. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2015, 12:27:19 PM »
Her religion won't let her do the job she is supposed to do.  Easy fix?  She can quit and find something that her religion allows.  That's pretty reasonable for everyone involved.  There is a separation of church and state for a reason. 

This has nothing to do with separation of church and state.  It's actually about the free exercise of religion.  They have to try and reasonably accommodate her.  If they cannot, then she gets fired.  Doesn't seem like a big deal to me.  I don't know their system, but I would imagine they can delegate signing same sex marriage licenses to someone else. 

LurkerNoMore

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« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2015, 12:45:02 PM »
Seeing how marriage licenses are issued by the state, there is a clear distinction between civil duties and religious beliefs.

If you take a job involving civil duties and following state laws, it doesn't matter what your religious beliefs are.  If they are in conflict then that is YOUR problem, not anyone else's.  You make a choice to forego your beliefs or job.

They shouldn't have to fire her.  She should have the integrity to step down and remove herself. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2015, 12:51:37 PM »
Seeing how marriage licenses are issued by the state, there is a clear distinction between civil duties and religious beliefs.

If you take a job involving civil duties and following state laws, it doesn't matter what your religious beliefs are.  If they are in conflict then that is YOUR problem, not anyone else's.  You make a choice to forego your beliefs or job.

They shouldn't have to fire her.  She should have the integrity to step down and remove herself. 

Good thing that's now how the law works.  They have an obligation to try and reasonably accommodate her religious beliefs and practices.  She has apparently been doing this job for 30 years.  The law recently changed.  The right thing to do is to try and work around her beliefs, while giving people the licenses to which they are entitled. 

LurkerNoMore

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« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2015, 01:54:20 PM »
Good thing that's now how the law works.  They have an obligation to try and reasonably accommodate her religious beliefs and practices.  She has apparently been doing this job for 30 years.  The law recently changed.  The right thing to do is to try and work around her beliefs, while giving people the licenses to which they are entitled. 

Obviously that won't be happening.

Dos Equis

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2015, 02:00:13 PM »
Obviously that won't be happening.

I don't know if that is obvious or not.  Neither do you, unless you read something about her getting fired? 

Straw Man

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2015, 02:35:29 PM »
I hope they throw her in jail.


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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2015, 02:35:32 PM »
problem is that she is in a government job.  she'll never resign.  

but yeah she should quit.  

Irongrip400

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2015, 04:16:15 PM »
Her religion won't let her do the job she is supposed to do.  Easy fix?  She can quit and find something that her religion allows.  That's pretty reasonable for everyone involved.  There is a separation of church and state for a reason. 

How would you feel about a Moslem lunch lady who said she wouldn't serve pork?

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2015, 06:20:01 PM »
How would you feel about a Moslem lunch lady who said she wouldn't serve pork?

She needs to be fired for not doing the job she was hired to do.

Irongrip400

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2015, 06:34:54 PM »
She needs to be fired for not doing the job she was hired to do.

Aight

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Straw Man

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« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2015, 07:05:30 PM »
Hey fundies, I think I see a solution here.
Doesn't Jesus forgive your sins.
Issue the license and then ask to be forgiven.
Biingo Bango you're on your way back to heaven.

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2015, 07:24:22 PM »
Hey fundies, I think I see a solution here.
Doesn't Jesus forgive your sins.
Issue the license and then ask to be forgiven.
Biingo Bango you're on your way back to heaven.

Or she can just take a pay cut of 50% for doing half a job and issuing hetero only licenses.   Surely Jeebus will be so proud of her for her service that he will help pay her electric bill and whatever else the other half of her paycheck was going for.

Straw Man

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Re: Marriage Minded Gays 1. Fundie Christian Court Clerks 0.
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2015, 07:38:25 PM »
I assume she is doing virginity tests on all brides and also making sure neither person has ever committed adultery

She wouldn't want to go to hell by putting her sacred signature on one of those marraige licenses.

If she really has been married 4 times there's probably a damn good chance she committed adultery in her past

BTW - how has this woman been married 4 times.  Is the primary industry in that town a school for the blind?