Police State - Official Thread

[illuminati]

It's September and after a nice, long vacation, school's back in session. Let's learn together!

First, let's get a couple of things straight: The Fifth Amendment extends to everyone under its jurisdiction; that is, it extends to citizens and non-citizens alike. You likely meant to say "civilian" (a dreadful reminder of how militarized your profession has become), but even that would be wrong: the Fifth Amendment does not make exceptions for cops. The Fifth Amendment begins with "No person shall" and it doesn't include an exception for Cops.

If accurate statements are what's important and we know that people are unable to give accurate statements in the immediate aftermath of an incident—which does seem at least reasonable—should we not afford every the same courtesy of a cooldown and reflection period to everyone? Because, surely this inability to provide an accurate statement isn't something that only affects cops, right?


I could also say that time appears to be of the essence in every other investigation, except when cops are involved. I could also say that it's better to have as much information collected as soon after the incident as practicable, and allow for follow-up interviews, as necessary.


And do you blame the public? Not a day goes by when cops are caught in blatant lies; check out for one particularly egregious example.

It's one thing to be mistaken about which unit you put the perp in; after all, all cop cars look alike. It's also something that's largely inconsequential (thought I'm sure an attorney would relish the opportunity to grill you over it in front of the jury to gain some points).

 
Yes, cops have to write reports about incidents they are involved in in their official capacity as cops. Airline pilots have to write reports if they declare an emergency, or they dip into their reserve fuel. University instructors have to write reports when a student complains about a grade. Doctors have to write reports after they finish giving your prostate a thorough tickling.

But they can't be compelled to testify against themselves. The Constitution is the supreme law of the land and it firmly establishes our right to not answer any questions. This means that a cop could opt to invoke his Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination to not write the report and not answer questions. He'd lose his job, probably—and that's how it should be—but he could not be "compelled to cooperate and give statements and answer all the questions" anymore than any other person can be.

Some Great points Avxo.
Though I did trim some of them.

Yet again cops caught ( by pure chance - thankfully) conspiring to falsely charge someone
Clearly it’s not their 1st time - We’ll never know the full extent of how often this happens
A Fair Guess is Very Frequently.

AGNOSTIC
please take the Rose tinted cop specs off & Pull your head out of the All things Cops Arse (yes a bit harsh)
And See Things as a Citizen/ member of the public Ohh & also FTN about Keeping Her Job  
An innocent man mainding his own business in his own home shot dead & Your on about her
Trying to Keep her Fucking Job.... You really are Totally off on This One.

If it was your son / brother shot I’m sure you’d be caring about her right to protect her job.
Really- !!

And No I’m Not Just Bashing Cops For The Sake Of.
If They Are Wrong They Are Wrong Same as Anyone Else.
Fuck Special Privilege’s — That’s just Ridiculous.
How does that invoke Fairness & Trust in The General Public.
It Doesn’t.

[avxo]

again... you would have the right to not answer questions, the officer, if they wished to maintain their jobs, would not.

Notice how you’ve shifted.

Originally, it was “well, in the aftermath it’s hard to give accurate statements, so the extra time helps make sure what they say is right.” No explanation for why only cops benefit from that period of quiet reflection.

When challenged, you moved to the “well cops are compelled to answer but citizens aren’t” which is, of course not true. Cops can plead the Fifth at any time.

And when that was pointed out you pivoted to “Oh, they can’t be compelled but if they want to keep their jobs they must answer.”

I’m not sympathetic. We all have things our jobs require us to do, and if we fail to do them are in jeopardy of being terminated. If a cop did something that he can’t truthfully describe in a report that his job requires him to file because that would lead to his prosecution then, to be blunt, he should lose his job.

Now, you’re like “oh well, she was arrested! The system works.” Yeah, maybe. The outrage and publlicity basically forced the hands of the Police in this instance. Shit, the few facts we know make this such an egregious case that if she weren’t arrested and charged, then we might as well codify that cops are above the law and call it a day.

[Agnostic007]

Notice how you’ve shifted.

Originally, it was “well, in the aftermath it’s hard to give accurate statements, so the extra time helps make sure what they say is right.” No explanation for why only cops benefit from that period of quiet reflection.

When challenged, you moved to the “well cops are compelled to answer but citizens aren’t” which is, of course not true. Cops can plead the Fifth at any time.

And when that was pointed out you pivoted to “Oh, they can’t be compelled but if they want to keep their jobs they must answer.”

I’m not sympathetic. We all have things our jobs require us to do, and if we fail to do them are in jeopardy of being terminated. If a cop did something that he can’t truthfully describe in a report that his job requires him to file because that would lead to his prosecution then, to be blunt, he should lose his job.

Now, you’re like “oh well, she was arrested! The system works.” Yeah, maybe. The outrage and publlicity basically forced the hands of the Police in this instance. Shit, the few facts we know make this such an egregious case that if she weren’t arrested and charged, then we might as well codify that cops are above the law and call it a day.

You raised a good point. In the vast majority of these cases, cops don't resign right off and will go through the process. I haven't known any that haven't. I was focused on what happens in almost all of the cases. But you are right, if the cop figures they screwed the pooch with no chance of surviving it, they could refuse to cooperate. 

[Agnostic007]

I wasn’t asking you to clarify the fact cops are given 72hrs.
In all realism she cannot have any defence other than it Being Manslaughter.

I’m asking YOU if you Believe in the double standards
And a Privilege system for some People over Others

It is A Simple Yes / No Answer.

no

[illuminati]

no

Ahhh Thank you
It wasn’t to difficult.

Faith restored.
 

[Skeletor]

Great posts by avxo and illuminati. However, on the issue of the 5th Amendment, I think that police, courts and prosecutors have abused and limited its scope and power significantly by limiting its use only when someone is in custody (regardless of how clear or unclear this distinction is to a person or whether or not actual custody makes any difference) or requiring an explicit invocation of the 5th amendment or even using someone's silence as evidence of guilt: just look at the disgraceful Salinas decision. A SCOTUS Justice even wrote in his dissent for another 5th Amendment case: "If I ask my son whether he saw a movie I had forbidden him to watch, and he remains silent, the import of his silence is clear."  
So for "ordinary plebs" it's pretty much "damned if you do, damned if you don't". At any rate though, the aforementioned "ordinary plebs" are not given the privileged treatment that cops get like for example the 72 hours that they remain anonymous and free so they can "collect themselves" and make up their story. It is only a matter of time before we hear the usual BS excuses from police when they try to justify murder or assault like the person inside his home was "intoxicated", "combative", "refused to comply with commands" or was "resisting" while providing cover for the cop's "mistake".

[Soul Crusher]

Dallas Officer Who Killed Man in His Own Home Says He Ignored Her Commands
The New York Times ^ | 10 September 2018 | Sarah Mervosh and Matthew Haag
Posted on 9/10/2018, 10:38:00 PM by Theoria

A Dallas police officer who fatally shot her neighbor in his apartment, claiming she mistook the unit for her own, told the authorities that the door was already ajar when she entered and that she shot him after he ignored verbal commands, according to court records released on Monday.

The officer, Amber R. Guyger, 30, who has been charged with manslaughter, could face additional charges in a case that has led to accusations that the officer received preferential treatment and debate about whether race may have played a role in the deadly encounter between a white police officer and a black man in his home.

On Monday, the Dallas County district attorney, Faith Johnson, insisted that the investigation into the death of the neighbor, Botham Shem Jean, 26, had not ended and that her office could seek charges “including anything from murder to manslaughter.”

“We’ll present a thorough case to the grand jury so that a right decision can be made,” Ms. Johnson said at a news conference.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...

[avxo]

Dallas Officer Who Killed Man in His Own Home Says He Ignored Her Commands

Let the victim-blaming begin!

Yeah, why wouldn’t the victim, probably startled to have someone entering his apartment, immediately comply with the “commands” that were almost certainly yelled at him? If only he’d been compliant, then he’d be alive!

[Agnostic007]

Manslaughter should be easy to make. Ignoring commands vs shooting someone dead because you walked into his apartment by accident.. pretty obvious what the bigger concern is

[avxo]

Text has a pretty firm castle doctrine and hold your ground. Do you believe the homeowner would be justified in shooting this cop, Agnostic? And do you believe that if he had, he’d have been arrested on the spot?

[chaos]

Text has a pretty firm castle doctrine and hold your ground. Do you believe the homeowner would be justified in shooting this cop, Agnostic? And do you believe that if he had, he’d have been arrested on the spot?

Lmao!! Of course he would have been arrested and charged within 24 hours. Face plastered all over tv, labeled a cop killer and we would have to hear about how she was coming home after a long, hard day on the job and accidentally walked into an ambush.
She smokes an innocent dude in his own house and has an entire department doing public damage control for her.

[Skeletor]

Dallas Officer Who Killed Man in His Own Home Says He Ignored Her Commands
The New York Times ^ | 10 September 2018 | Sarah Mervosh and Matthew Haag
Posted on 9/10/2018, 10:38:00 PM by Theoria

A Dallas police officer who fatally shot her neighbor in his apartment, claiming she mistook the unit for her own, told the authorities that the door was already ajar when she entered and that she shot him after he ignored verbal commands, according to court records released on Monday.

The officer, Amber R. Guyger, 30, who has been charged with manslaughter, could face additional charges in a case that has led to accusations that the officer received preferential treatment and debate about whether race may have played a role in the deadly encounter between a white police officer and a black man in his home.

On Monday, the Dallas County district attorney, Faith Johnson, insisted that the investigation into the death of the neighbor, Botham Shem Jean, 26, had not ended and that her office could seek charges “including anything from murder to manslaughter.”

“We’ll present a thorough case to the grand jury so that a right decision can be made,” Ms. Johnson said at a news conference.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...

And there we go...

Lowly plebs, next time intruders break in to your house you better "obey their commands" or you will be killed. And if your killer happens to have a badge, he/she will get the benefit of doubt, remain anonymous and free for 72 hours because they are too important to be treated like everyone else and moreover they will have all the usual cop BS excuses and attempts to present her as some sort of misunderstood hero: "she was tired after a hard day of risking her life to push pencils protect people", "it was a mistake", "it was an accident" etc... I wonder if she will end up in prison and for how many years. At least this case has received some publicity which might help put the killer in prison but there are similar cases that don't receive publicity and are swept under the rug or ignored.

[illuminati]

This case & the police actions has highlighted quite a few issues
That could really do with being addressed & sorted out regarding
How police act & are treated with Special Privileges.

Now the Bitch Killer is claiming the innocent man in His Own Home
Didn’t comply with her Commands !! Who The Fuck She Think She Is.
And Really why would he bitch - It’s You that’s Totally & utterly in the wrong.

Stop Trying to Blame The Innocent Dead Man.

[Moontrane]

She was, and the outrage probably had a lot to do with it. I’ll ask you point blank: if I walked into the wrong apartment and shot someone, would I have gotten the same courtesy as she did because of her employment status?

One witness reported hearing a woman yelling, “Let me in! Let me in!” before the gunshots and a man’s voice saying, “Oh my God. Why did you do that?” after them.

"If Jean had mistakenly gone to Guyger’s apartment and then gunned her down in cold blood after demanding that she follow his commands, would he face a manslaughter charge?"

https://www.guy-botham-jean-shooting-police-must-face-impartial-justice/

[Skeletor]

“Get a warrant”—Florida appeals court admonishes cops in two murder cases

A Florida state appellate court has made two recent pro-privacy rulings that take into account a landmark Supreme Court case from earlier this year.
In Florida v. Sylvestre, the District Court of Appeal of the State of Florida, Fourth District, affirmed a lower court’s granting of a motion to suppress evidence. In doing so, the court found that the warrantless use of a stingray is unconstitutional.

In the second case, Ferrari v. Florida, the Fourth District reversed a lower court ruling that denied the suppression of cell-site location information (CSLI). This data was specifically at issue in the June 2018 Supreme Court decision, Carpenter v. United States.

Carpenter involved a suspect, Timothy Carpenter, who was accused of leading an armed robbery gang that hit Radio Shack and other cell phone stores in Michigan and Ohio in 2010 and 2011. The government was able to warrantlessly obtain 127 days worth of his CSLI from his mobile provider, which detailed precisely where Carpenter had been during that time.The Supreme Court ultimately ruled that when the government seeks to obtain such a large volume of intimate information, it needs to get a warrant first in most cases.

Taken together, these two cases shed light on how some state appellate courts are starting to think about the ramifications of Carpenter.

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/09/get-a-warrant-florida-appeals-court-admonishes-cops-in-two-murder-cases/

[Agnostic007]

Text has a pretty firm castle doctrine and hold your ground. Do you believe the homeowner would be justified in shooting this cop, Agnostic? And do you believe that if he had, he’d have been arrested on the spot?

Man I don't know. I believe the homeowner would be justified in shooting the cop. I just don't know if the homeowner would be arrested on the spot. I'd like to think they wouldn't but man I just don't know for sure.

[Skeletor]

As it has been mentioned many times before, we are dealing with criminal gangs here.

NYPD officers arrested in prostitution, gambling probe

Seven New York City police officers were arrested Wednesday as part of a wide-ranging gambling and prostitution inquiry, multiple media outlets reported.

According to the New York Post, the investigation centered on a retired vice detective who operated multiple brothels in Brooklyn and Queens with his prostitute wife.

WABC-TV reported that the arrested officers — three sergeants, two detectives and two officers — are suspected of providing protection for the ring.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/09/12/nypd-officers-arrested-in-prostitution-gambling-probe.html

[Soul Crusher]

https://abc7ny.com/7-nypd-officers-arrested-in-connection-with-prostitution-ring/4224928/?sf197539173=1


Crazy

As it has been mentioned many times before, we are dealing with criminal gangs here.

NYPD officers arrested in prostitution, gambling probe

Seven New York City police officers were arrested Wednesday as part of a wide-ranging gambling and prostitution inquiry, multiple media outlets reported.

According to the New York Post, the investigation centered on a retired vice detective who operated multiple brothels in Brooklyn and Queens with his prostitute wife.

WABC-TV reported that the arrested officers — three sergeants, two detectives and two officers — are suspected of providing protection for the ring.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/09/12/nypd-officers-arrested-in-prostitution-gambling-probe.html

[Skeletor]

"Reasonable" and "justified" as always...

‘You Killed My Son!’ Cop Kills Unarmed Boy in Courtroom In Front of His Mom—No Charges

Franklin County, OH — As TFTP reported at the beginning of the year, in juvenile court, a 16-year-old boy intervened after a police officer allegedly pushed his mother against the wall—so the police officer shot and killed him. Now, it’s just been announced that the officer who killed the unarmed boy was justified in doing so.

A Franklin County Grand Jury ruled that Deputy Richard Scarborough, who shot and killed the unarmed boy, was justified and his use of deadly force “reasonable under the law.”

The boy who was killed in January for allegedly intervening to help his mother fend off a cop was Joseph Haynes and he was unarmed.

As ABC 6 reports, Karen Haynes says as they were leaving the courtroom, she blocked the deputy with her arm and he pinned her to the wall. She says her son was coming to her defense when he grabbed the deputy by the shoulders. That’s when Haynes says Scarborough grabbed Joseph, flipping him on to the ground, and was on top of him when the shot was fired.

https://thefreethoughtproject.com/watch-you-killed-my-son-cop-kills-unarmed-boy-in-courtroom-in-front-of-his-mom-no-charges/

[Soul Crusher]

Horrible.

"Reasonable" and "justified" as always...

‘You Killed My Son!’ Cop Kills Unarmed Boy in Courtroom In Front of His Mom—No Charges

Franklin County, OH — As TFTP reported at the beginning of the year, in juvenile court, a 16-year-old boy intervened after a police officer allegedly pushed his mother against the wall—so the police officer shot and killed him. Now, it’s just been announced that the officer who killed the unarmed boy was justified in doing so.

A Franklin County Grand Jury ruled that Deputy Richard Scarborough, who shot and killed the unarmed boy, was justified and his use of deadly force “reasonable under the law.”

The boy who was killed in January for allegedly intervening to help his mother fend off a cop was Joseph Haynes and he was unarmed.

As ABC 6 reports, Karen Haynes says as they were leaving the courtroom, she blocked the deputy with her arm and he pinned her to the wall. She says her son was coming to her defense when he grabbed the deputy by the shoulders. That’s when Haynes says Scarborough grabbed Joseph, flipping him on to the ground, and was on top of him when the shot was fired.

https://thefreethoughtproject.com/watch-you-killed-my-son-cop-kills-unarmed-boy-in-courtroom-in-front-of-his-mom-no-charges/

[Skeletor]

And another one...

Ex-cop sentenced to 43 years in prison for raping women while on duty

A former Phillipsburg cop convicted of raping four women while on duty was sentenced to 43 years in prison. Sanderson was found guilty of 19 counts, including kidnapping and rape.

https://www.whio.com/news/crime--law/cop-called-predator-sentenced-today-for-raping-women-while-duty

[avxo]

And the victim blaming has begun: “We did a search and found marijuana!” The guy could have been running the biggest illegal dispensary in the world and he’d still be the victim here.

http://www.fox4news.com/news/search-warrant-marijuana-found-in-botham-jeans-apartment-after-deadly-shooting

[avxo]

"Reasonable" and "justified" as always...

‘You Killed My Son!’ Cop Kills Unarmed Boy in Courtroom In Front of His Mom—No Charges

Franklin County, OH — As TFTP reported at the beginning of the year, in juvenile court, a 16-year-old boy intervened after a police officer allegedly pushed his mother against the wall—so the police officer shot and killed him. Now, it’s just been announced that the officer who killed the unarmed boy was justified in doing so.

A Franklin County Grand Jury ruled that Deputy Richard Scarborough, who shot and killed the unarmed boy, was justified and his use of deadly force “reasonable under the law.”

The boy who was killed in January for allegedly intervening to help his mother fend off a cop was Joseph Haynes and he was unarmed.

As ABC 6 reports, Karen Haynes says as they were leaving the courtroom, she blocked the deputy with her arm and he pinned her to the wall. She says her son was coming to her defense when he grabbed the deputy by the shoulders. That’s when Haynes says Scarborough grabbed Joseph, flipping him on to the ground, and was on top of him when the shot was fired.

https://thefreethoughtproject.com/watch-you-killed-my-son-cop-kills-unarmed-boy-in-courtroom-in-front-of-his-mom-no-charges/

That’s just crazy! The cops are basically out of control at this point.

[illuminati]

Man I don't know. I believe the homeowner would be justified in shooting the cop. I just don't know if the homeowner would be arrested on the spot. I'd like to think they wouldn't but man I just don't know for sure.

That's honest of you
The awful behaviour of members of this gang is becoming hard to ignore
And defend - just look at the other posts on just this page and more of
the same type of behaviour is seen - let alone all that gets covered up
these bits are just the tip of the ice berg.

we've said it many many times on here there is something very wrong
with cops & policing in general.

No Doubt there are some very Good & Decent Cops Its Time for the
Good & decent ones to take a Stand & identify & speak out,
Otherwise they are condoning the Behaviour of the bad ones.

Just Like The Good Black folk not speak out against the huge number
of Black on Black shootings & Dindu Behaviour - The majority remain
silent.
BLM swing into action when a white person kills a Black..

[Skeletor]

And the victim blaming has begun: “We did a search and found marijuana!” The guy could have been running the biggest illegal dispensary in the world and he’d still be the victim here.

http://www.fox4news.com/news/search-warrant-marijuana-found-in-botham-jeans-apartment-after-deadly-shooting

Exactly. Of primary importance to the police is whether one of their own is involved in the crime. The "us" (the sentinels of order and arbiters of law) and "them" (lowly scum who plot against us and must be scoured) mentality is very much alive (unlike so many of their victims).

Notice this:

There have been several warrants signed by judges and executed in this case aside from the arrest warrant for Guyger and the search warrant signed September 7 that were returned to the court on Thursday. The others are still sealed and not accessible.

I wonder if the killer's home was also searched and the search was part of the still sealed warrants.

The inventory return yielded:
2 fired cartridge casings
1 laptop computer
1 black backpack with police equipment and paperwork
1 insulated lunch box
1 black ballistic vest with "police" markings
10.4 grams of marijuana in ziplock bags
1 metal marijuana grinder
2 RFID keys
2 used packages of medical aid

The document does not say where any of the items were located in the apartment or who the items belong to.

So at this point the marijuana could have belonged to the cop or someone else or it might have even been planted by the cops. But as it often happens in these cases there is an attempt to divert the spotlight from the fact that a uniformed thug broke in to an apartment and then shot and killed the occupant and also that the killer was given 72 hours to make up her story while remaining anonymous and free (a privilege granted only to thugs with a badge).
Whether the occupant of the apartment possessed marijuana is irrelevant in this case. As mentioned, the victimy could have been running the biggest illegal dispensary in the world and it would not matter in this context. A person has every right to be in his apartment or residence. An intruder does not. "Issuing verbal commands" (gotta use cop language to appear "authoritative") does not matter in this case. If anything it should be working against the killer. The police will usually decline to comment when it comes to the cops involved in crimes citing "pending investigations" but they don't seem to have an issue with revealing (or leaking) information when that can be used to discredit the victim or support the cops' story. If the killer ends up in prison it will probably be because of the publicity that this story has received. Several other anonymous people whose cases haven't received publicity have been killed, attacked and abused by cops and usually nothing happens to the attackers.