Author Topic: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?  (Read 18946 times)

Radical Plato

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #175 on: May 21, 2013, 05:18:55 AM »
The mentally ill are everywhere.  One may be posting in this very thread.  Stay vigilant.
Are you OK Tapeworm, it sounds like you might be suffering from paranoid delusions again.  :o  ;D
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Mrdibbs

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #176 on: May 21, 2013, 05:54:16 AM »
Once again you are being very vague, to really address the issue you need to maybe cite a specific case.  And delusion doesn't seem to be grounds for Involuntary commitment.  Personally I find those who believe in a god and talk to him regularly are incredibly delusional.  Should those people be locked away, or because this delusion is so commonly shared, is this why it is considered OK.  And as for feelings of paranoia and being watched, their are legitimate concerns for this in our modern society that is now heavily littered with CCTV's, Internet activity being watched and illegal phone taps being regularly used.  Same with the water, it has been fluoridated for a long time, and depending on what research you want to believe, it may not be such a good thing for human health.  This types of issues when they become distressing speak volumes about the patients feeling of having little control over their environment and little to no choice in such matters.  These issues are of great importance in the scheme of existential questioning.   I am not saying those claiming they are being watched or spied on are correct or not delusional, but their thinking is based on some truth.  There are plenty of things that need to be explored deeply to get to the root of it, simply dismissing people as crazy because you don't understand what they are trying to communicate is a big part of the problem.  

And often those who are institutionalised do whatever it takes to get out, so they learn to play the game and tell the Psychiatrist what they want to hear.  If they commit a crime they should be afforded due process like anybody else.  To be locked away for talking nonsense to themselves is a crime.  Like I said, if talking nonsense to ones self was a mental illness, the majority of the worlds religious people would have to be locked up.  It never occurs to the powers that be that the so called mentally ill person is displaying a normal reaction to being overpowered with force, held and drugged against their will and not given due process in regards to their involuntary incarceration.  You attempt this type of display of power with any so called normal person and watch them meltdown dramatically.  Let me judge you mentally unwell and then force-you at gunpoint away from your home, deliver you handcuffed into a psyche ward, strap you to a restraint bed and then drug you up if you don't comply with my diagnosis and then hold you indefinitely.  I guarantee I could have you babbling bullshit to yourself by the end of the day.

Ok, let me clarify one thing; people will not be locked up against their will for simply having delusions or hallucinations. They HAVE to engage in either self harming behavior or be violent/dangerous to others in order to be locked up against there will. We have even send patients home untreated because they like the voices in their head (a guy heard five girls talk to him the whole day long for example which he found pleasant and didnt make him engage in behavior which is forbidden by the law).

Let me then describe you a case;
Paranoid schizofrenic woman has been admitted over 30+ times. Always the same story; the neighbours break in, she has poisoning delusions, smells gass everywhere. The woman has moved a gazillion amount of times yet these ''problems'' always come back. When things get so bad she usually try's to burn the neighbours house down or something like that and gets brought in by the cops.

The first few days she's completely out of it; cant differentiate night and day thinks everyone is telling lies when we say its 8am or something. She has smelling hallucinations; smells gas and dead bodies everywhere (let me assure you, there are no gas leaks and no dead bodies in the department). She doesn't trust anyone thinks people are going to poison her; food water etc (even though that hasnt happened the past 30 stays at the hospital). She has strange body sensations; thinks people can control her hands (haha try rationalizing that one).

Anyways the dangerous behavior continues and she gets forced medication (because she refuses pills). A good week later she doesnt have ANY of the above described symptomns anymore is super relaxed leaves the department during the day and comes back. Week later is fired from the hospital and continues life. This will go all good for a month or three untill she stops medication (she thinks they are not necessary) and the cycle starts over.

Ofcourse this is an extreme case of a chronic patient who will never have insight to her own sickness. There are people who have one psychotic episode and realise they will need the meds for life when they are better. Those live a happy life and will not be found in a clinique anymore.



Radical Plato

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #177 on: May 21, 2013, 06:47:16 AM »
Ok, let me clarify one thing; people will not be locked up against their will for simply having delusions or hallucinations. They HAVE to engage in either self harming behavior or be violent/dangerous to others in order to be locked up against there will. We have even send patients home untreated because they like the voices in their head (a guy heard five girls talk to him the whole day long for example which he found pleasant and didnt make him engage in behavior which is forbidden by the law).

Let me then describe you a case;
Paranoid schizofrenic woman has been admitted over 30+ times. Always the same story; the neighbours break in, she has poisoning delusions, smells gass everywhere. The woman has moved a gazillion amount of times yet these ''problems'' always come back. When things get so bad she usually try's to burn the neighbours house down or something like that and gets brought in by the cops.

The first few days she's completely out of it; cant differentiate night and day thinks everyone is telling lies when we say its 8am or something. She has smelling hallucinations; smells gas and dead bodies everywhere (let me assure you, there are no gas leaks and no dead bodies in the department). She doesn't trust anyone thinks people are going to poison her; food water etc (even though that hasnt happened the past 30 stays at the hospital). She has strange body sensations; thinks people can control her hands (haha try rationalizing that one).

Anyways the dangerous behavior continues and she gets forced medication (because she refuses pills). A good week later she doesnt have ANY of the above described symptomns anymore is super relaxed leaves the department during the day and comes back. Week later is fired from the hospital and continues life. This will go all good for a month or three untill she stops medication (she thinks they are not necessary) and the cycle starts over.

Ofcourse this is an extreme case of a chronic patient who will never have insight to her own sickness. There are people who have one psychotic episode and realise they will need the meds for life when they are better. Those live a happy life and will not be found in a clinique anymore.
I have been involuntarily admitted for simply arguing with the police when they were called over a neighbourhood dispute. I verbally gave them a hard time, but I believe it was warranted (long story).  Of course I was released the next day with the psychiatrist shaking his head and obviously sick and tired of the police abusing their powers.  My partners sister is a psychiatric nurse, and she often complains that involuntary admission is regularly abused by the Police.  She claims a large percentage of people committed have done nothing more than piss off the police and they had little to charge them with so they involuntarily committed them.  Of course I live in Australia and the system is more than likely different were you are.  But after my experience of being restrained to a restraint bed and drugged I no longer have any faith in the system.  

Of course the cops tried to load me up with some charges (I have a history with the police) that they had to drop them because they were simply made up.  Over here the police try and intimidate the fuck out of you if you show them any attitude (stand up to them), hoping you will just roll over and plead guilty to whatever charges they throw at you.  I refuse to be intimidated and stood up to them every step of the way.  They try and break you and get you and plead guilty, they think they are teaching some type of school-yard bully lesson.  In the end it was a stalemate, I told them to go fuck themselves, charges were dropped and they didn't break me.  

I have met some of the hopeless cases you are talking about, and in some cases the current way of dealing with them will have to do.  My objection is using involuntary commitment as a tool to deal with political dissent or when police misuse there power to so called teach people a lesson.  After I was interviewed by a psychiatrist and I told him what had happened (it's an ongoing issue I have with local government and certain laws not being enforced for political reasons), the psychiatrist was appalled by the police's actions and 100% took my side in the matter.  of course this pissed the Police off and that's when they decided to trump up some charges which they never followed through with when they realised I would fight them tooth and nail.  

So like I said, it isn't always being used as some therapeutic tool, put a punitive measure when the authorities have no legal reason to detain you.  Many years ago I researched the police culture here in Australia and am well aware of some of the more controversial shootings and deep in-bedded corruption and they didn't take to kindly to me reminding them of some of their own sins.
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Raymondo

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #178 on: May 21, 2013, 06:58:40 AM »
I have been involuntarily admitted for simply arguing with the police when they were called over a neighbourhood dispute. I verbally gave them a hard time, but I believe it was warranted (long story).  Of course I was released the next day with the psychiatrist shaking his head and obviously sick and tired of the police abusing their powers.  My partners sister is a psychiatric nurse, and she often complains that involuntary admission is regularly abused by the Police.  She claims a large percentage of people committed have done nothing more than piss off the police and they had little to charge them with so they involuntarily committed them.  Of course I live in Australia and the system is more than likely different were you are.  But after my experience of being restrained to a restraint bed and drugged I no longer have any faith in the system.  

Of course the cops tried to load me up with some charges (I have a history with the police) that they had to drop them because they were simply made up.  Over here the police try and intimidate the fuck out of you if you show them any attitude (stand up to them), hoping you will just roll over and plead guilty to whatever charges they throw at you.  I refuse to be intimidated and stood up to them every step of the way.  They try and break you and get you and plead guilty, they think they are teaching some type of school-yard bully lesson.  In the end it was a stalemate, I told them to go fuck themselves, charges were dropped and they didn't break me.  

I have met some of the hopeless cases you are talking about, and in some cases the current way of dealing with them will have to do.  My objection is using involuntary commitment as a tool to deal with political dissent or when police misuse there power to so called teach people a lesson.  After I was interviewed by a psychiatrist and I told him what had happened (it's an ongoing issue I have with local government and certain laws not being enforced for political reasons), the psychiatrist was appalled by the police's actions and 100% took my side in the matter.  of course this pissed the Police off and that's when they decided to trump up some charges which they never followed through with when they realised I would fight them tooth and nail.  

So like I said, it isn't always being used as some therapeutic tool, put a punitive measure when the authorities have no legal reason to detain you.  Many years ago I researched the police culture here in Australia and am well aware of some of the more controversial shootings and deep in-bedded corruption and they didn't take to kindly to me reminding them of some of their own sins.


They should have never let you out of the loony bin.

Evidently.

Radical Plato

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #179 on: May 21, 2013, 07:09:47 AM »

They should have never let you out of the loony bin.

Evidently.
If the police had their way they wouldn't.  Not my finest moment, but I don't believe I am crazy in the traditional sense.  As yet I have never been given some label that defines how society views my particular brand of disapproving anti social behaviour.  You can rest assured if they did I would be asking for proof, no different than if a doctor diagnosed me with cancer.
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Parker

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #180 on: May 21, 2013, 07:10:39 AM »
Yes, I do believe that bipolar is serious. And those cases need to be taken seriously

I also believe that people can be "conveniently" diagnosed as that...
For instance, a lot of attorneys in court will tell the judge that their client is bipolar. To the point where some judges wonder sarcastically, that everybody who commits a crime is bipolar.
I also believe that many of these people use being bipolar as a excuse for their actions when they assault people, specifically their signif others or family members. Never mind the fact that they have had a history of domestic violence abuse, or assaults or thefts (like stealing people's cars because you feel like it).

I have seen it where people have been diagnosed as bipolar, but have declared that the judge is wrong---and then have gone off into a world of delusion where major recording artists want to deal with "their" production studio, which exists only in their heads. Is this more than bipolar activity?

coltrane

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #181 on: May 21, 2013, 07:23:00 AM »
Bipolar people often times cheat on spouses as well.  During mania, many experience hypersexuality. 

RUN.

Mrdibbs

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #182 on: May 21, 2013, 11:21:32 AM »
I have been involuntarily admitted for simply arguing with the police when they were called over a neighbourhood dispute. I verbally gave them a hard time, but I believe it was warranted (long story).  Of course I was released the next day with the psychiatrist shaking his head and obviously sick and tired of the police abusing their powers.  My partners sister is a psychiatric nurse, and she often complains that involuntary admission is regularly abused by the Police.  She claims a large percentage of people committed have done nothing more than piss off the police and they had little to charge them with so they involuntarily committed them.  Of course I live in Australia and the system is more than likely different were you are.  But after my experience of being restrained to a restraint bed and drugged I no longer have any faith in the system.  

Of course the cops tried to load me up with some charges (I have a history with the police) that they had to drop them because they were simply made up.  Over here the police try and intimidate the fuck out of you if you show them any attitude (stand up to them), hoping you will just roll over and plead guilty to whatever charges they throw at you.  I refuse to be intimidated and stood up to them every step of the way.  They try and break you and get you and plead guilty, they think they are teaching some type of school-yard bully lesson.  In the end it was a stalemate, I told them to go fuck themselves, charges were dropped and they didn't break me.  

I have met some of the hopeless cases you are talking about, and in some cases the current way of dealing with them will have to do.  My objection is using involuntary commitment as a tool to deal with political dissent or when police misuse there power to so called teach people a lesson.  After I was interviewed by a psychiatrist and I told him what had happened (it's an ongoing issue I have with local government and certain laws not being enforced for political reasons), the psychiatrist was appalled by the police's actions and 100% took my side in the matter.  of course this pissed the Police off and that's when they decided to trump up some charges which they never followed through with when they realised I would fight them tooth and nail.  

So like I said, it isn't always being used as some therapeutic tool, put a punitive measure when the authorities have no legal reason to detain you.  Many years ago I researched the police culture here in Australia and am well aware of some of the more controversial shootings and deep in-bedded corruption and they didn't take to kindly to me reminding them of some of their own sins.

In this post you definitely sing a different song and i can only agree with it.

I find it very sad that the police in your country abuse their powers in such an extreme way. If they are against you there is basically no way of fighting back (physical or in court), you'll always lose. Very sad.

In my country police won't arrest you with such false accusations. However they are abusive in their own way.

Many times i've seen patients who have physical damage from an arrest which seem sketchy. But a police officer can justify many injuries with ''he slipped on a puddle''. When they are brought in on a stretcher handcuffed and all we always immediately say you can make them lose and well see what happens. 9 out of 10 times they are very calm and tell their side of the story.

Im glad you agree that for the truely sick (not police victims) psych is not that bad.

no one

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #183 on: May 21, 2013, 12:13:43 PM »

thread recap- ekul is crazy and passive/ aggressive.
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NordicNerd

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #184 on: May 21, 2013, 12:55:56 PM »

I wonder what GetBiggers including Sir Sean Connery think about this "growing illness" in the US.

It is legit, but frequently misdiagnosed. The girls you describe are more similar to emotional unstable personality disorder (borderline personality disorder). True bipolars can be stable for months or years, at least on mood stabilizers. Borderlines may be purely reactive, especially to rejection.

NN

Radical Plato

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #185 on: May 21, 2013, 02:06:55 PM »
thread recap- ekul is crazy and passive/ aggressive.
I wouldn't describe myself as passive aggressive, I am pretty overt with my aggression.  As for crazy, I don't know that there is a way of actually determining such a thing.  The maverick psychiatrist RD Laing once described insanity as "a perfectly rational response to an insane world".

There is also a famous a study known as the Rosenhan experiment - Rosenhan's study was done in two parts. The first part involved the use of healthy associates or "pseudopatients" (three women and five men) who briefly simulated auditory hallucinations in an attempt to gain admission to 12 different psychiatric hospitals in five different States in various locations in the United States. All were admitted and diagnosed with psychiatric disorders. After admission, the pseudopatients acted normally and told staff that they felt fine and had not experienced any more hallucinations. All were forced to admit to having a mental illness and agree to take antipsychotic drugs as a condition of their release. The average time that the patients spent in the hospital was 19 days. All but one were diagnosed with schizophrenia "in remission" before their release.

The second part of his study involved an offended hospital challenging Rosenhan to send pseudopatients to its facility, whom its staff would then detect. Rosenhan agreed and in the following weeks out of 193 new patients the staff identified 41 as potential pseudopatients, with 19 of these receiving suspicion from at least 1 psychiatrist and 1 other staff member. In fact Rosenhan had sent no one to the hospital.

The study concluded "it is clear that we cannot distinguish the sane from the insane in psychiatric hospitals" and also illustrated the dangers of dehumanization and labeling in psychiatric institutions.

More on that study here: quite interesting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosenhan_experiment
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Jovo

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #186 on: May 21, 2013, 04:46:12 PM »
yes, a guy in hs had it.

Out of no where he started talking shit and calling me racist terms ( we where talking about what we where doing after HS )

Basically just ceat the shit ouf of him then and there and avoided him forever. Still see him now and then ,but avoid being around him for too long.

deadpan

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #187 on: May 21, 2013, 04:54:08 PM »
i dated a bipolar chick once, nice girl, very smart but short-tempered. it was manageable though, she didn't need meds for it or anything. she had social anxiety though so maybe that's a part of it. i think there are varying degrees of it. my mom on the other hand, i'm pretty sure she'd be diagnosed as bipolar if she every went to a doctor, you say the wrong thing to her and she'll flip her shit.

Primemuscle

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #188 on: May 21, 2013, 05:35:23 PM »
They just need to start lifting and it will be ok.

Good point....I know it completely cured me. That's actually a joke since I am still crazy as a loon.

Primemuscle

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #189 on: May 21, 2013, 05:43:48 PM »
Ok, let me clarify one thing; people will not be locked up against their will for simply having delusions or hallucinations. They HAVE to engage in either self harming behavior or be violent/dangerous to others in order to be locked up against there will. We have even send patients home untreated because they like the voices in their head (a guy heard five girls talk to him the whole day long for example which he found pleasant and didnt make him engage in behavior which is forbidden by the law).

Let me then describe you a case;
Paranoid schizofrenic woman has been admitted over 30+ times. Always the same story; the neighbours break in, she has poisoning delusions, smells gass everywhere. The woman has moved a gazillion amount of times yet these ''problems'' always come back. When things get so bad she usually try's to burn the neighbours house down or something like that and gets brought in by the cops.

The first few days she's completely out of it; cant differentiate night and day thinks everyone is telling lies when we say its 8am or something. She has smelling hallucinations; smells gas and dead bodies everywhere (let me assure you, there are no gas leaks and no dead bodies in the department). She doesn't trust anyone thinks people are going to poison her; food water etc (even though that hasnt happened the past 30 stays at the hospital). She has strange body sensations; thinks people can control her hands (haha try rationalizing that one).

Anyways the dangerous behavior continues and she gets forced medication (because she refuses pills). A good week later she doesnt have ANY of the above described symptomns anymore is super relaxed leaves the department during the day and comes back. Week later is fired from the hospital and continues life. This will go all good for a month or three untill she stops medication (she thinks they are not necessary) and the cycle starts over.

Ofcourse this is an extreme case of a chronic patient who will never have insight to her own sickness. There are people who have one psychotic episode and realise they will need the meds for life when they are better. Those live a happy life and will not be found in a clinique anymore.




One little correction, there are sometimes unpleasant side effect to the meds given to calm schizophrenia. I think this also has a lot to do with why so many schizophrenic folks stop taking them once they are back out on their own and not in the hospital. My aunt had a lot of good energy except when she was medicated and then she was like a zombie. Unless a person is actually dangerous to others, they should be allowed to make their own decisions about meds. Also, I have problems with locking people up who are suicidal or otherwise might do harm to themselves. If I want to kill myself, it is my business and not the government's....in my opinion. There should not be laws against suicide.

Primemuscle

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #190 on: May 21, 2013, 05:50:02 PM »
If the police had their way they wouldn't.  Not my finest moment, but I don't believe I am crazy in the traditional sense.  As yet I have never been given some label that defines how society views my particular brand of disapproving anti social behaviour.  You can rest assured if they did I would be asking for proof, no different than if a doctor diagnosed me with cancer.

I assume you do not live in Portland, OR. Unfortunately, their hyper aggressive police force has killed at least three or four folks in the past few years for doing nothing more than acting a little crazy while hanging out on the streets, which is common since there is often nowhere for them to live. They have also injured a fair number of folks. Fortunately, I live in a suburb of Portland, so I have little opportunity to interact with the Portland police. But, if I am ever stopped or questioned, I will play whatever dumb games they want, since I would rather be a little humiliated then dead.

Mrdibbs

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #191 on: May 22, 2013, 01:44:15 AM »
One little correction, there are sometimes unpleasant side effect to the meds given to calm schizophrenia. I think this also has a lot to do with why so many schizophrenic folks stop taking them once they are back out on their own and not in the hospital. My aunt had a lot of good energy except when she was medicated and then she was like a zombie. Unless a person is actually dangerous to others, they should be allowed to make their own decisions about meds. Also, I have problems with locking people up who are suicidal or otherwise might do harm to themselves. If I want to kill myself, it is my business and not the government's....in my opinion. There should not be laws against suicide.

Yes i fully agree. The side effects are in many case disastrous; impotence occurs a lot, extreme uncontrollable weight gain, over all lethargic and shitty feeling. No young guy (or girl) wants to deal with that. I have full understanding for people who say fuck it, im going to try without and enjoy things again for a while (untill the bubble bursts).

The best thing for someone with schizofrenia is to stay away from drugs and build the meds down to the lowest workable dosage with a med that gives them the least side-effects.

The suicide thing im a little twisted on. My experience is that the people who really want it will succeed. Its the people with the personality disorders who do these half hearted attempts of taking shitloads of pills and call the ambulance themselves to get there stomach pumped out.

If a person who did a good attempt with ''bad luck'' gets admitted they usually play the ''i did it in a panic, im fine now, cured will never do it again card'' leaves the clinique relatively quick and does it again (this time good). Safety is relative even in the clinique. Many hang themselves in a unseen moment on year basis.

You can make an attempt succeed if you really want to, the law doesnt stop you.

hipolito mejia

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #192 on: May 22, 2013, 06:16:49 AM »
The mentally ill are everywhere.  One may be posting in this very thread.  Stay vigilant.

Specially the few females that post here...I'd say maybe one is not bipolar from I read from them so far.

Primemuscle

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #193 on: May 22, 2013, 11:33:53 AM »
Specially the few females that post here...I'd say maybe one is not bipolar from I read from them so far.

Thank you Dr. Hipolito Mejia. The emotional highs and lows normally associated with a woman's menstrual cycle are not usually considered as bi-polar disorder. Some men also suffer from  bi-polar disorder. I read that crazy people rarely think they are the one's who are crazy; it is always everyone else who is crazy.

Tapeworm

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #194 on: May 22, 2013, 03:03:22 PM »
Everyone else IS crazy.

The Abdominal Snoman

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #195 on: May 22, 2013, 06:08:35 PM »
Homosexuality was once labelled a mental illness...Tom Cruise doesn't believe in mental illness...

Mr Nobody

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #196 on: May 22, 2013, 06:18:45 PM »
Scientology will resolve this.

Primemuscle

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #197 on: May 22, 2013, 08:53:22 PM »
Everyone else IS crazy.

My thoughts exactly!!!

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Re: Do you really believe in Bipolar as a legit illness?
« Reply #198 on: May 24, 2013, 07:46:13 AM »
Thanks for all the comments  a lot of interesting remarks...

One more thing...(this is not joke)
What about hypomanic episodes ?

I heard that if the girl suffers from Hypomania (bipolar2) she can meet a stranger at a club, dance with him kiss, buy him drinks be VERY SLUTTY...to the point she would give him a BJ at the parking lot ....

then the next day you try to contact her and she's gone forever like she never met you....... Creepy stuff....


Hypomanic?  or just a whore?



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