Author Topic: Dow Crash Coming To Your 401K (2007 to 2022)  (Read 461413 times)

War-Horse

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #425 on: February 06, 2008, 12:43:23 PM »
Every time the economy enters a bad cycles, the doomsdayers come out of the cracks. You hear it every time "this time it's different".  A year and a half later the economy cycles back in the other direction and the dow makes new highs. It's never not happened and this time is no different. If the economy can bounce back from 9-11, it can certaily bounce back from this.     It always has and always will.    So stop with the "this time it's different".    5 years from now we'll be in another bad part of the cycle for some reason we don't even know yet.




Went right over you , didnt it.     Im listing reasons why it could be overcome.   We always had a way out by raising incomes or other.
How will we get out this time?   Borrow more??    NO, there is a tightening of credit standards now.      What will the fed do???   Borrow more money??  Then inflation rises even higher.

This is not a sky is falling thread......looking for sound intelligent answers, not a random  "We will be okay, we always have" shit.

Top Dog

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #426 on: February 06, 2008, 12:45:52 PM »
the problem is is that there no other bubble to latch onto. so this seems to be very real.

don't be so naive


Believe what you want. the one thing we do know is that it has bounced back every other time. How can I be naive when what I say has been true every time. Your prediction of a lack of a bounceback at some point has never happened. But in your defense, your guess is as good as any.

War-Horse

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #427 on: February 06, 2008, 12:50:59 PM »
Thanks stormshadow and War-Horse!  So you are saying that the market has not crashed yet, but for the reasons stated above, it will inevitably crash within months?  

Also, are you saying that once it crashes, for the reasons stated above, it will not recover like it did in 1987?



I think the word crash is too strong.   More like de-flate, like a slow leak in a tire.
Being an american i no way in hell want this to happen, but we must look at the whole picture and prepare for these things as the signs have pointed to.

Of course we will recover, but it puts us in a prime time to be attacked by other govts when we are operating at 60% in a recession/depression.

I NEVER want us to look weak....we must be careful.    NT started this thread to give you a heads up on any investments backed by the stock market or other.

MB_722

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #428 on: February 06, 2008, 12:52:30 PM »
the problem is is that there no other bubble to latch onto. so this seems to be very real.

don't be so naive

Believe what you want. the one thing we do know is that it has bounced back every other time. How can I be naive when what I say has been true every time. Your prediction of a lack of a bounceback at some point has never happened.

this is a credit bubble, with a collapsing dollar. what could possibly be the next bubble? I'm not optimistic.

it's bounced back because of these stimulus packages. all of this stimuli is not correcting the system. the system is screwed. there is only so much they can do.


stormshadow

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #429 on: February 06, 2008, 12:56:02 PM »
Thanks stormshadow and War-Horse!  So you are saying that the market has not crashed yet, but for the reasons stated above, it will inevitably crash within months?  

Also, are you saying that once it crashes, for the reasons stated above, it will not recover like it did in 1987?

Fact: We have only been off the international gold standard for 37 years (ONE GENERATION !!).  Very short period of time, and look at the damage we have done with no standard to secure the currency. 

Nobody knows the time period, but as I hope I've explained, the way our monetary system and government operate is NOT sustainable.

The biggest factor (IMO) is our ability to borrow, and/or steal resources from other countries (oil).  If we can continue to borrow/steal then we will have business as usual.  However, there is a point where the bank (foreign investors) will realize that our government has way more debt than it can handle and they won't lend us anymore, or countries will get fed up with our foreign policy.  After that, the only choice is to print even more money, and the system will implode shortly thereafter.

Bush did not have to work hard to double our debt from 4.5 to 9 trillion.  The bigger the numbers get, the faster it climbs.

We are at the point now where it is impossible to balance the yearly budget and our national debt will never decrease.  That is the reality of a debt based currency, the only way to grow is to incur more debt, and the only way to make your debt service is to grow... See the problem?


Neurotoxin

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #430 on: February 08, 2008, 02:44:41 AM »
Feb. 8 (Bloomberg) -- A U.S. recession is now an even bet as job losses and the housing contraction jeopardize the longest- ever expansion in consumer spending, according to a Bloomberg News survey.

``We're seeing a real squeeze on the consumer,'' said Kurt Karl, chief U.S. economist at Swiss Re in New York, the world's largest reinsurer. ``We're in, or on the brink of, a recession. The Fed will keep cutting rates to help it be a short and shallow one.''

Consumer spending, which accounts for more than two-thirds of the economy, will grow at a 1 percent annual rate from January through March, half the previous quarter's gain and the smallest since 2001. The last time spending dropped was in 1991.

`Cusp of a Recession'

``We're on the cusp of a recession,'' said Stephen Stanley, chief economist at RBS Greenwich Capital in Greenwich, Connecticut. ``Support from the labor market is starting to erode. The consumer is definitely in for a period of weakness.''

The economy lost 17,000 jobs in January, the first drop in more than four years. The unemployment rate will gradually rise to 5.2 percent by the second quarter of 2008, according to the survey median, from last month's 4.9 percent.

`Drying Up'

``If the job market is drying up, which seems to be the case, consumers have nothing going for them,'' said Joshua Shapiro, chief U.S. economist at Maria Fiorini Ramirez Inc. in New York.


``It is a difficult retail environment out there, and I expect it will be going forward,'' Terry Lundgren, chief executive officer of Macy's Inc., the second-biggest U.S. department-store chain, said this week. The retailer cut its fourth-quarter profit forecast and said it will eliminate 2,300 jobs.
Worsening Housing Scene

Meanwhile, the housing industry is bracing for even worse times ahead. The National Association of Realtors yesterday cut its 2008 forecast for sales of previously owned and new homes.


In a sign the slowdown is spreading beyond housing, service industries unexpectedly contracted in January at the fastest pace since the 2001 recession, a report from the Institute for Supply Management  showed on Feb. 5. U.S. stocks tumbled the most in 11 months that day. The Standard & Poor's 500 Index is down for three consecutive months, the longest losing streak since 2003.







guys, think about it, the dot.com bubble ONLY accounted for 15% of our nations GDP and the stock market was hit hard with loses when the bubble finally burst in 2000. tech stocks have still not recovered in 8 yrs. Nasdaq in 2000 = 5,050, Nasdaq in 2008 = 2,293.

the current consumer bubble spurred on by incoherent lending practices in housing, accounts for 70% of our nations GDP.  


15% vs 70% of GDP.


you do the math.



NT



 
 



War-Horse

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #431 on: February 08, 2008, 08:20:13 AM »
WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) -- Congress on Thursday passed a $152 billion economic stimulus package.
 
"This plan is robust, broad-based, timely, and it will be effective," Bush said in a statement released by the White House. "This bill will help to stimulate consumer spending."  

The bill amounts to about 1% of U.S. gross domestic product.

The plan would give tax rebates of up to $1,200 for households.   




bush is hoping to get americans to spend our way out of this recession with money borrowed from china.  ::)


mark my words.......it won't work.









Hahaha   Bush is just hoping to hold the titanic up until he gets out of office, and blame the next administration.
Bush will go down in history as the man that ruined America....

Bindare_Dundat

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #432 on: February 08, 2008, 07:08:10 PM »

i agree, bush is an embarrassment to this country. his ability to get elected 2X doesn't shed a positive light on the american voter's judgement.   ???

dumb as a bag of rocks !


If some of the posts by certain members on this board are a reflection of the rest of america's views on things, we're all fucked.

Slapper

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #433 on: February 09, 2008, 07:31:47 AM »
If some of the posts by certain members on this board are a reflection of the rest of america's views on things, we're all fucked.

That Bush is really not fit for the job is (painfully) obvious at this point. Some people are unable to bring themselves to think that an American president can be a real dumb fuck (and viceversa). Bush is dumbd and took presidential dumbness up a few hundred notches. I think the powers-that-be have noticed how American complacency with a dumb president has been eroding for a while.

Finding a substitute for Geogie boy gonna be haad tho.


Neurotoxin

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #434 on: February 09, 2008, 04:04:20 PM »
Feb. 10 (Bloomberg) -- Group of Seven policy makers said the U.S. economy may slow further, eroding global growth, and officials forecast more financial-market turmoil.
 ``Downside risks still persist, which include further deterioration of the U.S. residential housing markets'' and tighter credit conditions, G-7 finance ministers and central bankers said in a statement in Tokyo yesterday. U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson said ``we should expect continued volatility'' in markets as risk is repriced.


NT

Bindare_Dundat

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #435 on: February 09, 2008, 05:28:42 PM »
I'm still up 7.7% this year... by instinctively doing the exact opposite of all you said.

I guess nobody really needs your advice afterall, my sweet AOL user.

Would you like me to post who you really are and see how things come together?   :-*  :-*  :-*

 ::)

War-Horse

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #436 on: February 09, 2008, 06:22:52 PM »
I'm still up 7.7% this year... by instinctively doing the exact opposite of all you said.

I guess nobody really needs your advice afterall, my sweet AOL user.

Would you like me to post who you really are and see how things come together?   :-*  :-*  :-*


Why do you feel the need to prove yourself, Alex?    Why not start youre own thread on economics and see if it hits this many pages.
This isnt the Y board. ::)

Bindare_Dundat

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #437 on: February 09, 2008, 06:57:37 PM »

Why do you feel the need to prove yourself, Alex?    Why not start youre own thread on economics and see if it hits this many pages.
This isnt the Y board. ::)

Have you ever seen what he looks like?

People that ugly or with a body that deformed usually try to overcompinsate in other area's, like bragging about how much they make, or buying obtuse vehicles like Hummers that scream, "look at me!, look at me!."

He's looking for acceptance, poor guy. I kinda feel sorry for him.

War-Horse

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #438 on: February 09, 2008, 07:03:33 PM »
Have you ever seen what he looks like?

People that ugly or with a body that deformed usually try to overcompinsate in other area's, like bragging about how much they make, or buying obtuse vehicles like Hummers that scream, "look at me!, look at me!."

He's looking for acceptance, poor guy. I kinda feel sorry for him.


He is desperate, kinda like Trab.....    On the Y board i guess that gets you attention.

stormshadow

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #439 on: February 09, 2008, 07:43:55 PM »
I'm still up 7.7% this year... by instinctively doing the exact opposite of all you said.

I guess nobody really needs your advice afterall, my sweet AOL user.

Would you like me to post who you really are and see how things come together?   :-*  :-*  :-*

Nobody cares dude.

Go back to the gossip board and whore out your pics for attention.

War-Horse

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #440 on: February 10, 2008, 08:16:13 AM »
expose what alex ? the AOL account you're referring to is MY DEAD BROTHERS account. he was a physician who died of a massive heart attack not very long ago. i continue to utilize his account to keep his memory alive. alex, i pray you never lose a younger sibling, cause it really sucks.  >:(




RIP my brother, we love you dearly and miss you immensely.  :'(





My condolences, to you and yours, NT..




NT

benz

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #441 on: February 10, 2008, 08:20:48 AM »
expose what alex ? the AOL account you're referring to is MY DEAD BROTHERS account. he was a physician who died of a massive heart attack not very long ago. i continue to utilize his account to keep his memory alive. alex, i pray you never lose a younger sibling, cause it really sucks.  >:(

RIP my brother, we love you dearly and miss you immensely.  :'(

NT

rip
.

Neurotoxin

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #442 on: February 10, 2008, 09:15:49 AM »
Data to keep stocks on edge with recession looming
Retail sales likely to highlight consumer woes.
MarketWatch Feb. 9, 2008
 
NEW YORK (MarketWatch) -- Investors will closely monitor data next week, given concerns that a recession might already be at hand, while a renewed surge in commodities prices is raising concerns about the Federal Reserve's ability to continue cutting interest rates to boost the economy.
"Anything that points to an economy that is [decelerating] is going to get a reaction," said Owen Fitzpatrick, head of the U.S. equity group at Deutsche Bank.
 
Stocks plunged on Tuesday, with the Dow industrials tumbling to their biggest drop in nearly a year, after news that the service sector, which constitutes 70% of the U.S. economy, contracted in January and signaled that a recession may be taking hold.





NT

Neurotoxin

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #443 on: February 10, 2008, 09:52:01 AM »
Feb. 10 (Bloomberg) -- Sales at U.S. retailers fell in January for a second month, signaling the biggest part of the economy may be starting to stumble, economists said before reports this week.

Purchases dropped 0.3 percent after decreasing 0.4 percent in December, according to the median estimate of economists surveyed by Bloomberg News ahead of a Feb. 13 report from the Commerce Department. Other reports may show factory production weakened.




NT

benz

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #444 on: February 10, 2008, 09:54:10 AM »
Anybody here in forex trading?
.

Neurotoxin

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #445 on: February 10, 2008, 10:07:15 AM »
it's about time, been preaching this since Nov.


NT





Poll: Majority of people believe recession underway
   
 
 
By John Gress, Reuters
 
 
WASHINGTON — Empty homes and for-sale signs clutter neighborhoods. You've lost your job or know someone who has. Your paycheck and nest egg are taking a hit.
Could the country be in recession?
Sixty-one percent of the public believes the economy is now suffering through its first recession since 2001, according to an Associated Press-Ipsos poll.

The fallout from a depressed housing market and a credit crunch nearly caused the economy to stall in the final three months of last year. Some experts, like the majority of people questioned in the poll, say the economy actually may be shrinking now. The worry is that consumers and businesses will hunker down further and pull back spending, sending the economy into a tailspin.
 



NT

benz

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #446 on: February 10, 2008, 10:09:14 AM »
it's about time, been preaching this since Nov.


NT





Poll: Majority of people believe recession underway
   
 
 
By John Gress, Reuters
 
 
WASHINGTON — Empty homes and for-sale signs clutter neighborhoods. You've lost your job or know someone who has. Your paycheck and nest egg are taking a hit.
Could the country be in recession?
Sixty-one percent of the public believes the economy is now suffering through its first recession since 2001, according to an Associated Press-Ipsos poll.

The fallout from a depressed housing market and a credit crunch nearly caused the economy to stall in the final three months of last year. Some experts, like the majority of people questioned in the poll, say the economy actually may be shrinking now. The worry is that consumers and businesses will hunker down further and pull back spending, sending the economy into a tailspin.
 



NT


do you use rss feeds to get such amount of info nt?
.

Neurotoxin

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #447 on: February 10, 2008, 10:13:03 AM »

do you use rss feeds to get such amount of info nt?


no, just research.



NT

War-Horse

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #448 on: February 10, 2008, 11:44:34 AM »
Now that this is starting to happen (And i emphasize STARTING)    What do you guys think is the way out of this and what kind of time will it take???

Will the dollar continue to plunge?

Wil other nations switch to stronger currencys?

How long will it take for people to have some money available again?

Is it even possible to free up money with tightened credit standards?

How in the world can we regain money if the War is continued?

Most bancruptcys are over medical bills, couldnt we free up currency by eliminating huge amount of bancruptcys..(Taxpayers Money)?

Obviously, lowering interest rates when people have bad or maxed credit wont work......

Neurotoxin

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Re: Dow crash coming to your 401k..........
« Reply #449 on: February 10, 2008, 11:54:47 AM »
guys, this is the biggest problem our country faces. the outsourcing of american jobs.
service economies can not sustain themselves over the long haul. the bush admin. tried to stimulate OUR service economy through housing appreciation......and that failed miserably. his next attempt is handing out free checks, hoping you'll spend it at home depot to stimulate a floundering economy.  ::)


NT



 (Reuters) - U.S. car maker Chrysler  has signed a 4 billion rupee ($101 million) contract with a New Delhi-based car seat maker to source seats for its Jeep Wrangler, an Indian newspaper reported on Sunday.

This was just the beginning of Chrysler's strategy to outsource automobile parts from Southeast Asia and negotiations were on for more such contracts, the Business Line paper said, citing an unnamed senior company official.