Muslims "get out of Australia"

[Hedgehog]

Well, you can't expect a honest responce from Camel Rapist because he has previously stated he protects islam due to his ethnic ties.

Toxic:
Did muhammad molest a 9 year old girl?
Was he a militant?
Did he kill, and order the deaths of many, many humans?
Did he keep slaves?
Was he a pologymist?
Did he congratulate a man for killing his pregnant wife for cursing muhammad?
Do you actually know anything about islam? Other than being from the part of the world where the devil spoke to muhammad?

The question on whether or not he molested Aisha is still something that's up for debate, what is known, is that he married her when she was 9 years old. How old she was when he first fcuked her, is still discussed. But lets give the guy the benefit of the doubt. Lets say he married Aisha at 9, and waited until she was no longer a kid, then fcuked her.

I would definitely say that Muhammad (PBUH) was a successful warlord, much in the way of Genghis Khan, Napoleon and my own Gustav II Adolf (The Lion from the North).

Killings? Yes.

Slaves? Yes.

Polygamist? Yes.

Congratulating? Yes.

The devil didn't spoke to Muhammad (PBUH). Allah did.


Or at least, so the Muslims think.

Christian faith isn't going to describe Allah as a devil. But rather, Muhammad (PBUH) as a big bluff, and non-ecumenical factor.



YIP
Zack

[Nordic Superman]

Brother, Zacharius...

From Bukhari vol. 7, #65:

            "Narrated Aisha that the prophet wrote the marriage contract with her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.  Hisham said:  "I have been informed that Aisha remained with the prophet for nine years (i.e. till his death).""

 

 

Bukhari vol. 7, #88:

            "Narrated Urwa:  "The prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with Aisha while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e. till his death).""

 

 

Bukhari vol. 5, #234 says:

            "Narrated Aisha:  The prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six.  We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Harith Kharzraj.  Then I got ill and my hair fell down.  Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me while I was playing in a swing with some of my girl friends.  She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me.  She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house.  I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it.  Then she took me into the house.  There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, "Best wishes and Allah's blessing and a good luck."  Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage).  Unexpectedly Allah's messenger came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age."


If muslims dispute this evidence: married Aisha at 6, consummated the marriage at 9 - then the hadiths should be destroyed and declared false.

You cannot pick and chose which portions of the koran and hadiths are truthful, as soon as any muslim starts doing this they have lost.

[Hedgehog]

Hedge, I respect the way you go about things. You hold people accountable without a trace of bias or prejudice in your posts, and I really respect that.

What I was telling Toxic is that what he grew up with might not be Islam in it's truest and most literal form. Just because someone claimed that they're family was strictly muslim doesn't mean they actually were, otherwise Toxy wouldn't disagree on sharia law.
Let's face it, people take from a religion what they like and don't like. Maybe that's how Toxic's family is? For example, are most of the non-married christians on this forum virgins?
My family is sorta like that, they would all claim to be strict muslims, yet some of my female cousins go around in skirts and tank tops and they would disagree with you on Islam. This is partly because 1) They don't know the true nature of the religion and haven't even looked at the Koran 2) They feel an attachment to it and can't let go. You see what's happening here? How many of the 1 billion plus people are actually text book nutjob muslims? There are quite a few, enough to threaten the world. However there are just some moderates and many who don't really follow the stuff, yet they would call themselves muslim. You see what I'm saying?

Sure I do.

This is identical to a lot of Christians. But in their case, sometimes, for some reason, it's the other way?

Trying to hold a Christian Conservative accountable to something like "turning the other cheek"?

Good luck with that mate.

Except with homosexuality and a few other clear cut cases. Christianity definitely speaks out against homosexuality, no acceptance there. If you feel gaying around is A-Okay, then how could you call yourself Christian?

You can't have both.


If the religion has boundaries that you cannot possibly accept, why then, acknowledge the religion?

Be your own person I say (obviously, this is not directed to you  ).

YIP
Zack

[haider]

There IS a discrepancy in the ahadith regarding the issue, and it surely doesn't come as a surpise because....


wait.. Nordic, do you know the difference between a hadtih and the Quran? (without the help of wikipedia or whatever crazy websites u go to)

Here's a good explanation by Johnny (I couldnt come up with anything better), which somehow u managed to skip through:

The age Aisha's was married is a big controversy in Islam. The texts seem to contract themselves in the age she was married. Some imply 9 and others imply much much later.

For instance her supposed age was written down during a time when there was a big upheaval in Islam and the predecessor was Mohammed was unknown. The could of lied about her age and made her seem younger so she couldn't be considered a descendent of Mohammeds cousin ibn Abi and thus the predecessor of prophet of Islam. They didn't want a female prophet.

She was said to of joined Mohammed in the Battle of Badr. No one below 15 was allowed to join in raids. The raid was in 624 AD and she would of had to of been above 15, Meaning she had to of been atleast 13 during the marriage.

In the Sirat Rashul Allah it records Aisha converting to Islam around 610 AD. Meaning she would of had to of been able to atleast talk and walk to convert, meaning at minimum she would of been atleast 15 at 622 AD.



That is the best defense that can be given for that marriage.

Other less credible defenses might be..

1.Mohammed probably didn't have sex with her until she was much older. Or possibly never.

2.During the time of Mohammed many young girls were married at young ages all around the world including Britain where young girls were often married as young as 8 or 9.

[Camel Jockey]

2.During the time of Mohammed many young girls were married at young ages all around the world including Britain where young girls were often married as young as 8 or 9.

 

[Nordic Superman]

Haider, so, there are discrepancies in the hadiths? So YOU as a muslim get to pick her age? So i'm unable to critisize and say she was 9, which the strongest evidences suggests?

2.During the time of Mohammed many young girls were married at young ages all around the world including Britain where young girls were often married as young as 8 or 9.

Ahh, so muhammad is comparable to the barbarians which were running around in britain in those ages? Hahaha great, confirmation from both haider and Camel Rapist that muhammad was a murdering warlord!

My work here is done!

[haider]

Haider, so, there are discrepancies in the hadiths? So YOU as a muslim get to pick her age? So i'm unable to critisize and say she was 9, which the strongest evidences suggests?


Ahh, so muhammad is comparable to the barbarians which were running around in britain in those ages? Hahaha great, confirmation from both haider and Camel Rapist that muhammad was a murdering warlord!

My work here is done!

oh brother. Manni you son of a bitch. You're probably a muslim yourself. No way anyone could make arguments that ridiculous.

[Camel Jockey]

Ahh, so muhammad is comparable to the barbarians which were running around in britain in those ages? Hahaha great, confirmation from both haider and Camel Rapist that muhammad was a murdering warlord!

My work here is done!

Your ancestors.

[Nordic Superman]

You're probably a muslim yourself.

Yeah I probably am, with a probability of 1/98954959843984359640530958956950569065054096509

Your ancestors.

Well my parents actually came from Norway 1 generation ago, but the brits are of the same blood, so yeah sure, whatever you say!

But please remember didn't we own India/Pakistan in the not so distant past?

Now haven't you got some koran studies to goto brother?

[Hedgehog]

Ahh, so muhammad is comparable to the barbarians which were running around in britain in those ages? Hahaha great, confirmation from both haider and Camel Rapist that muhammad was a murdering warlord!

My work here is done!

This argument is coming from one of your own, an Atheist. Remember that you and CJ are both Atheists.

Of course Muhammads actions are explainable if you view him as a mere mortal, as a regular bloke, an efficient emperor.

Then the culture of his era is an explanation for his behaviour IMO.

If however, we view him as a prophet, there are no explanations for his behaviors. Allah laid it all out for him.



YIP
Zack

[Camel Jockey]

Yeah I probably am, with a probability of 1/98954959843984359640530958956950569065054096509

Well my parents actually came from Norway 1 generation ago, but the brits are of the same blood, so yeah sure, whatever you say!

But please remember didn't we own India/Pakistan in the not so distant past?

Now haven't you got some koran studies to goto brother?

So you're of savage viking ancestory? When the brits were "owning" us your ancestors were in some hut in some scandinavian village eating shit.

If by own you mean kissing the asses of the Noble population of the Indian sub-continent then I guess you did. You raked in so much money from the subcontinent's resources and the unfair treaties with China, but now times are changing and England isn't so great anymore. 

[Nordic Superman]

So you're of savage viking ancestory? When the brits were "owning" us your ancestors were in some hut in some scandinavian village eating shit.

If by own you mean kissing the asses of the Noble population of the Indian sub-continent then I guess you did. You raked in so much money from the subcontinent's resources and the unfair treaties with China, but now times are changing and England isn't so great anymore. 

Someone sounds bitter 

Your ancestors got PIMPED!

[haider]

Haider, so, there are discrepancies in the hadiths? ?

I've mentioned this before. And you didnt answer my question. Whats the difference between the ahaditha nd the Quran?

So YOU as a muslim get to pick her age? So i'm unable to critisize and say she was 9, which the strongest evidences suggests

what the hell are you talking about?

Explain why you insist that she was a 9 yr old.

Show us all, in light of the counter evidence presented, why you still believe Aisha is 9 yrs old.

Only good at bitching and presenting bits and peices (copy pastes) as "evidence". Very sad.

Ahh, so muhammad is comparable to the barbarians which were running around in britain in those ages? Hahaha great, confirmation from both haider and Camel Rapist that muhammad was a murdering warlord!

You're twisting the argument (which I did not make). Funny how you picked out and attacked us using the weakest argument out of the whole quote.

My work here is done!

Please f*** off  

[Camel Jockey]

Someone sounds bitter 

Your ancestors got PIMPED!

We are taking our revenge by shitting all over your country! And you're bitter over that. 

[Nordic Superman]

I've mentioned this before. And you didnt answer my question. Whats the difference between the ahaditha nd the Quran?
what the hell are you talking about?

Explain why you insist that she was a 9 yr old.

Show us all, in light of the counter evidence presented, why you still believe Aisha is 9 yrs old.

Only good at bitching and presenting bits and peices (copy pastes) as "evidence". Very sad.
You're twisting the argument (which I did not make). Funny how you picked out and attacked us using the weakest argument out of the whole quote.
Please f*** off 

Sure I know the differences, the devil created the koran directly via muhammad. The hadiths written after his death by non-divine sources.

So you accept everything in the hadiths is false right? Like I said, every arguement you have ever made on getbig in defence of islam is null and void if you think it's acceptable to pick and chose which portions of the hadiths are factual in order to give strength to your arguements.

Which brings me to the quotes from the hadiths clearly showing she was 9. Read them yourself, in arabic or english if you like.

You were using the arguement in your arguement... of course I will call you up on it... again trying to pick and chose... fucking idiot.

[Deedee]

Whatever... back to today's world and burkas for a minute.

My guess is that the ban in Belgium may effect public buildings.

Also, nobody would be allowed to work a public office with any religious attire.

That would be a guess.

Just as you have to be bi-lingual to work public office in Canada.

YIP
Zack

The rationale behind the ban on the burka in the small Belgian town was exactly that. Security in public places. People are supposed to be recognizable. (Also, the burkas were frightening young children in the public square).  I think it will be interesting to see what happens in the Netherlands, and the UK for that matter, since the ban is proposed there too, in the next while.  

Hedge I see you're up on the Canadian socio/political scene.  So you know how bilingualism has created such a harmonious, homogenous existence, drawing everyone together.  

[Nordic Superman]

We are taking our revenge by shitting all over your country! And you're bitter over that. 

The muzzies will provide me with some game when hunting in the green fields of England once I become the führer!

[Camel Jockey]

The muzzies will provide me with some game when hunting in the green fields of England once I become the führer!

You wont be ruler of anything except for some group that only admits homosexuals and meets for gay sex 4 days a week.

[Deedee]

The muzzies will provide me with some game when hunting in the green fields of England once I become the führer!

Upon your dapple-grey steed...lance in hand...so many enemies to crush, so many sonnets to compose for the lady who awaits you... too bad you ruined the image with führer reference.  

[Nordic Superman]

Upon your dapple-grey steed...lance in hand...so many enemies to crush, so many sonnets to compose for the lady who awaits you... too bad you ruined the image with führer reference. 

führer actually means leader in germany, I didn't mean for it to come across Hitler-esque.

[Deedee]

führer actually means leader in germany, I didn't mean for it to come across Hitler-esque.

Hello, I'm of German extraction. I know more than you, what it means.

[haider]

Sure I know the differences, the devil created the koran directly via muhammad. The hadiths written after his death by non-divine sources.

Good job retard. An atheist who believes in the devil. Great.

So you accept everything in the hadiths is false right? Like I said, every arguement you have ever made on getbig in defence of islam is null and void if you think it's acceptable to pick and chose which portions of the hadiths are factual in order to give strength to your arguements.

You're fucking smoking something. Like seriously, this is useless. We have went over this many times.
No one is picking and choosing. HOWEVER, because ahadith are merely narrations and the word of mouth, discrepancies are bound to occur. This is clearly shown by the conflicting ahadtih and facts mentioned. You, however, being the idiot that you are acting, insist, beyond a spec of doubt that she was 9 yrs old. The ahadith tell a diffrent story.

So you tell me, who is picking and choosing?

You were using the arguement in your arguement... of course I will call you up on it... again trying to pick and chose... fucking idiot.

no, I merely quoted him. The fact remains that you only picked the weakest of the arguments (which btw the author indicated WAS a weak argument), leaving the better part of the argument completely untouched.

did you mention "picking and choosing? 

[Hedgehog]

Hedge I see you're up on the Canadian socio/political scene.  So you know how bilingualism has created such a harmonious, homogenous existence, drawing everyone together. 

Well, I try.

It's a big world though.

I slightly followed the discussion regarding the Sharia law and Ontario rejecting it.

Important victory for the feminist and secular movement, from what I understand. Hopefully it can build on that momentum.


YIP
Zack

[Deedee]

Well, I try.

It's a big world though.

I slightly followed the discussion regarding the Sharia law and Ontario rejecting it.

Important victory for the feminist and secular movement, from what I understand. Hopefully it can build on that momentum.


YIP
Zack

Didn't mean to put you on the spot.  The Sharia law thing was probably never really in question.  I meant it more in terms of, the rest of Canada appeased and appeased Quebec, and no one has ever really been happy.  Cultures always clash.

[phyxsius]

I don't anti any Muslims in fact I do have Islamic friends.. but for them to think they could press on their religious laws on any land is so damn wrong.

Islamic teachings are almost similar to the Bible in terms of love, etc etc.. but the difference between those two is Christianity offers love and peace regardless of situation while Islam would encourage you to eliminate the infidels of Islam.

I read a book called Jesus and/VS Mohammad.. It clearly depict the difference of both "prophets" (Jesus is the Son of God of course but I was prophet as for fairness)

- Jesus heals and forgive all beings (even Romans) while Mohammed fights.
- Jesus won over the land by his love and teachings while Mohammed won over lands via violence and war.
- Jesus is a virgin while Mohammad had 13 wives in 10 years.
- Jesus died after being accused for spreading "false religion" by the Romans while Mohammad was poisoned by his own people who hated him.