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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: headhuntersix on June 05, 2008, 07:32:48 AM
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Earlier this year, I spent five days in Iraq, walking the same streets in Baghdad where I had served two years earlier as an infantry platoon leader in the 101st Airborne Division.
The visit reinforced for me not only the immense complexity of the war – so often lost in our domestic political debate – but also the importance of taking the time to visit Iraq to talk with the soldiers and Marines serving on the front lines in order to grasp the changing dynamics of a fluid battlefield.
Chad Crowe
It is for this reason that the failure of Sen. Barack Obama to travel to Iraq over the past two and a half years is worrisome, and a legitimate issue in this presidential election.
Since his election to the United States Senate in 2004, Mr. Obama has traveled to Iraq just once – in January 2006. This was more than a year before Gen. David Petraeus took command and the surge began. It was also several months before Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki's government came into office. Although Mr. Obama frequently criticizes the Iraqi leader on the campaign trail, he has never actually met him.
Mr. Obama's conduct is strikingly different from that of Sen. John McCain, who has been to Iraq eight times since 2003 – including three times since surge forces began to arrive in Baghdad. The senior senator from Arizona has made it his mission to truly understand what is happening on the ground, in all its messy reality.
Mr. Obama has dismissed the value of such trips, suggesting they are stage-managed productions designated to obfuscate, not illuminate, the truth. This has become an all-too-common sentiment within the Democratic Party leadership, especially since the surge began to transform conditions on the ground for the better. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid has denied that there is any value in visiting the troops in Iraq, and has never done so.
In fairness, there are a number of Democrats who visit Iraq frequently – namely Sens. Joe Biden, who has made eight Iraq trips, and Jack Reed, with 10 trips. Mr. Obama's absence and cynicism stands in stark contrast to their serious approach. It is especially problematic given his intention to become our next commander in chief.
As anyone who has spent time on the ground in Iraq – speaking with troops of all ranks and backgrounds – can tell you, it is hardly a mission impossible to get them out to speak bluntly and openly about the problems they face.
Indeed, Mr. McCain's own frequent and vociferous criticisms of former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and his warnings, as early as 2003, that the Bush administration was pursuing a flawed strategy in Iraq, were directly informed by his firsthand interactions during his trips to Iraq. Troops and commanders warned him that we lacked sufficient forces to defeat al Qaeda and Iranian-backed militias, and they were correct.
In turn, Mr. McCain's early advocacy for the surge and his prescient conviction that it would succeed were rooted not only in his extensive knowledge of military affairs, but in his close consultations with troops serving in the theater. They recognized that the new strategy was succeeding far before the mainstream media in the U.S. was willing to acknowledge these gains.
That Mr. Obama apparently doubts his ability to distinguish spin from reality, and to draw bad news out of subordinates, does not bode well for his possible future as our nation's chief executive. As I'm sure he will discover, if he wins the White House, these are among the most important skills for a president to possess.
Even more astonishing than Mr. Obama's absence from Iraq, however, is the fact that he has apparently never sought out a single one-on-one meeting with Gen. Petraeus. The general has made repeated trips back to Washington, but Mr. Obama has shown no interest in meeting privately with him. It's enough to make you wonder who exactly Mr. Obama listens to when it comes to Iraq?
Mr. Obama frequently decries the danger of "dogmatists" and "ideologues" in public policy, yet he himself has proven consistently uninterested in putting himself in situations where he might be confronted with the hard complexities of this war. It suggests a dangerous degree of detachment and overconfidence in his own judgment.
After all, Mr. Obama was among those in January 2007 who stridently opposed the surge and confidently predicted its failure – even going so far as to vote against funding our soldiers in the field unless the Bush administration abandoned this new approach. It is now clear that Mr. Obama's judgment on the surge was spectacularly wrong.
Yet rather than admit his mistake, Mr. Obama has instead tried to downplay or disparage the gains our troops have achieved in the past 12 months, clinging to a set of talking points that increasingly seem as divorced from reality as some in the Bush administration were at the darkest moments of the war.
Mr. Obama continues to insist that "Iraq's political leaders have made no progress in resolving the political differences at the heart of their civil war" – despite the passage of numerous pieces of benchmark legislation by the Iraqi Parliament and unequivocal evidence of grassroots reconciliation across the country.
Mr. Obama also continues to claim that America has "simply thrown U.S. troops at the problem, and it has not worked" – despite the dramatic reduction in violence in precisely those areas of Iraq where American forces have surged, and since handed over to Iraqi Security Forces.
And of course, Mr. Obama persists in his pledge to withdraw all combat forces from Iraq, on a fixed timeline, beginning the moment he enters office – regardless of the recommendations of our commanders on the ground, regardless of conditions on the ground, and regardless, in short, of reality.
America is longing for an informed and principled debate about the future of Iraq. However, such a debate seems unlikely if the Democratic nominee for president won't take the time to truly understand the dynamics on the ground, let alone meet with commanders.
The time for talking points is over. Too much is at stake. When will Mr. Obama finally return to Iraq and see the situation for himself?
Mr. Hegseth, chairman of Vets for Freedom, served in Iraq with the 101st Airborne Division and returned as an embedded reporter.
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earlier this year, I had some cotton candy at a baghdad amusement park.
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Yeah but u can't argue with it either. Obama isn't fit to carry my ruck let alone be my boss.
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Yeah but u can't argue with it either. Obama isn't fit to carry my ruck let alone be my boss.
BUSH was less qualified.
He irresponsibly sent you to war.
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Bush was the gov of a major state. He worked in private industry. Obama really hasn't done much if u look at his resume. Even when he was in state gov he did nothing. We're not talking Bush..he's gone. We're talking the next guy and his resume compared to either Hils' or McCains is pretty damm weak. Forget Bush.
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Bush was the gov of a major state. He worked in private industry. Obama really hasn't done much if u look at his resume. Even when he was in state gov he did nothing. We're not talking Bush..he's gone. We're talking the next guy and his resume compared to either Hils' or McCains is pretty damm weak. Forget Bush.
McCain is the same guy who Sang "bomb bomb bomb Iran" while pandering for votes. He's a whore.
But i do agree he is far more qualified than BUSH. but as far as Obama vs McCain. I'd rather vote for a guy who has the wisdom to keep us out of un-needed wars than someone who signs songs like that.
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He might not go to Iran, but neither will McCain..that ship has sailed. Obama will have us in Africa because thats the next perceived humanitarian darling of the UN. He will raise our taxes, he will try and tell us what to drive and eat.
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He might not go to Iran, but neither will McCain..that ship has sailed. Obama will have us in Africa because thats the next perceived humanitarian darling of the UN. He will raise our taxes, he will try and tell us what to drive and eat.
LMAo....
Africa doesn't happen to have any natural resources we're interested in, do they?
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He might not go to Iran, but neither will McCain..that ship has sailed. Obama will have us in Africa because thats the next perceived humanitarian darling of the UN. He will raise our taxes, he will try and tell us what to drive and eat.
More Fear spin.
I can believe you are actually falling for this.
BUSH spear a big aid package to Africa just recently and you think becuase OBAMA is black that he'll send more aid?
unbelievable.
Our taxes are going to rise. Doesn't matter who's in office. Get use to it. And blame the largest government spender BUSH.
And BUSH told us who to believe. (WMD's) and see where that got us. And Mr. Bomb Bomb is no different.
FEAR SPIN 2008
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He might not go to Iran, but neither will McCain..that ship has sailed. Obama will have us in Africa because thats the next perceived humanitarian darling of the UN. He will raise our taxes, he will try and tell us what to drive and eat.
Actually, my biggest issue with Obama is that he claims he's got a tax cut coming.
If you would take the time to read his political platform, you would see that claim of his.
I still haven't figured out how he's gonna finance it though.
What is needed is someone who is willing to deal with the huge national debt that Bush brought onto US and the world.
Tax cuts and military spendings without balancing of the budget - there's your economic legacy of George W Bush.
As much as I despise Bill Clinton for associating with Rupert Murdoch, I will give him credit for the solid economic years he had.
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No we'll be in Africa because the Dems are bleeding hearts for the UN. He has ties to Kenya but thats beside the point. Listen to some of his early speeches...falling for what...he said it..i have to belive it because he's for hope and change etc.
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No we'll be in Africa because the Dems are bleeding hearts for the UN. He has ties to Kenya but thats beside the point. Listen to some of his early speeches...falling for what...he said it..i have to belive it because he's for hope and change etc.
OK so, you are convinced that we will pour or money into Africa becuase the dems are bleeding hearts and Obama is half black?
Do you believe in that 9/11 was an inside job too?
Because your reasoning is border lining on CT reasoning.
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Dude he said he would..he said it..he's going to do exactly what the damm UN wants..he has some fixation with how we're viewed in the world. He wants to repair our imagine. I don't care about his color. Hil would do the same. Forget color..color is the reason this guy has gotten as far as he has. Nobody with his questionable ties or his lack of experience would have gotten this far. Had Hil's lib idiot campaign team figured this out way before and attacked him on substance instead of worring about attacking a black guy, then she'd been the Dem pick.
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Dude he said he would..he said it..he's going to do exactly what the damm UN wants..he has some fixation with how we're viewed in the world. He wants to repair our imagine. I don't care about his color. Hil would do the same. Forget color..color is the reason this guy has gotten as far as he has. Nobody with his questionable ties or his lack of experience would have gotten this far. Had Hil's lib idiot campaign team figured this out way before and attacked him on substance instead of worring about attacking a black guy, then she'd been the Dem pick.
How we look int he world?
We lost any respect and status becuase of BUSH and McCain is nonly going to continue those kinds of policies.
What has Obama exactly said? that were going to help people? Exactly what?
Is this another of those deals where we ignore the english language like "Iran is no threat" vs. what he actually said?
BUSH has already given money. Money that should have been spent on Katrina Victims.
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I agree...look if I'm going into Africa it better be for something. I don't mind fighting if u get to drive ur SUV.
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OK so, you are convinced that we will pour or money into Africa becuase the dems are bleeding hearts and Obama is half black?
Do you believe in that 9/11 was an inside job too?
Because your reasoning is border lining on CT reasoning.
We'll be liberating Kenya soon ::) ;D
We'll be drinking Obama beer! Renamed after his victory!
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Bush was the gov of a major state. He worked in private industry. Obama really hasn't done much if u look at his resume. Even when he was in state gov he did nothing. We're not talking Bush..he's gone. We're talking the next guy and his resume compared to either Hils' or McCains is pretty damm weak. Forget Bush.
No, you likely voted for Bush. He has the lightest resume in presidential history. The Governorship of Texas is a joke. "Texas has a governor whose role, by constitutional design, is to be a relatively feeble public servant. As governor of Texas, Bush is not allowed to appoint all the members of his Cabinet. He does not write the state's budget, and his ability to write legislation is limited by his constitutional authority and the fact that the Legislature meets only once every two years." http://graphics.boston.com/news/politics/campaign2000/news/Texas_governorship_provides_Bush_with_pulpit_not_power+.shtml
Bush couldn't strike oil in Texas. All his business ventures failed and he was bailed out by family friends.
You have to honor consistency. If you voted for such a lightweight like Bush, what's your problem with Obama?
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I agree...look if I'm going into Africa it better be for something. I don't mind fighting if u get to drive ur SUV.
I stopped driving my Escalade. Wanna buy it? ;D
$3000
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Renamed after Obama
(http://www.diageo.com/NR/rdonlyres/C68211AF-4DCE-4956-9063-7F1ED9E0DFE3/0/Senator140x125.jpg)
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Is it really time for Obama's pandering to the troops to begin? It would look good to a few people but let's face facts....no one over there was drafted.
Obama was the only person the repubs could find who was capable of preventing Hillary from becoming President. They're probably counting on people choosing more of the same over a black guy when November rolls around.
Like the old saying goes: "people get the government they deserve". :)
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No we'll be in Africa because the Dems are bleeding hearts for the UN. He has ties to Kenya but thats beside the point. Listen to some of his early speeches...falling for what...he said it..i have to belive it because he's for hope and change etc.
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it George W Bush who is sending his secretary of state Condi Rice to Kenya in order to mend that conflict?
Or is somehow Obama behind that too?
Do you actually believe Barack Obama has some input in how the current president, of the party, is dictating his foreign policy?
Why?
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LMAo....
Africa doesn't happen to have any natural resources we're interested in, do they?
Nigeria; Gulf of Guinea...perfect place to steal oil....
The guy River in particular deposited organic sediments out to sea over millions of years which became crude oil. The Gulf of Guinea region, along with the Congo River delta and Angola further south, are expected to provide around a quarter of the United States' oil imports by 2015. This region is now regarded as one of the world's top oil and gas exploration hotspots.
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so I wonder...What is this change that he continues to talk about---what does he plan to do when he gets in office? Who does he plan to tax...how does he plan on withdrawing from Iraq--what are his plans, ideas---because all i hear from dickhead media outlets is how this is such a great thing for black people--not anything on what this guy will do once he gets into office..granted, mccain isn't much better--i honestly don't think he has an idea on what the hell he is going to do once he gets in office--but obama is being portrayed as some sort of messiah by the media shitheads out there--so as the messiah--what is he going to do? someone enlighten me...please.
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so I wonder...What is this change that he continues to talk about---what does he plan to do when he gets in office? Who does he plan to tax...how does he plan on withdrawing from Iraq--what are his plans, ideas---because all i hear from dickhead media outlets is how this is such a great thing for black people--not anything on what this guy will do once he gets into office..granted, mccain isn't much better--i honestly don't think he has an idea on what the hell he is going to do once he gets in office--but obama is being portrayed as some sort of messiah by the media shitheads out there--so as the messiah--what is he going to do? someone enlighten me...please.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/
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Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it George W Bush who is sending his secretary of state Condi Rice to Kenya in order to mend that conflict?
Or is somehow Obama behind that too?
Do you actually believe Barack Obama has some input in how the current president, of the party, is dictating his foreign policy?
Why?
Uh Hedge...I'd invite u to revisit the 90's. Clinton was a shill for the UN. Sending Condi doesn't mean sending in troops. We're bringing AFRICOM on board and will be running by the time a new President gets in. Barry will want to use his new to toy to spread love and cheer across the globe, no better place then the money pit that is Africa. And before I get some cut and paste article about are involvement in Africa, yes we have tons of SOF doing their thing. Thats alot different then having an Armored Div tearing across the plains..wasting more money in another series of shithole countries.
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Uh Hedge...I'd invite u to revisit the 90's. Clinton was a shill for the UN. Sending Condi doesn't mean sending in troops. We're bringing AFRICOM on board and will be running by the time a new President gets in. Barry will want to use his new to toy to spread love and cheer across the globe, no better place then the money pit that is Africa. And before I get some cut and paste article about are involvement in Africa, yes we have tons of SOF doing their thing. Thats alot different then having an Armored Div tearing across the plains..wasting more money in another series of shithole countries.
Look, I think it's great if not everyone buys into the Barack Obama hype.
But instead of making claims of what you thinks he wants to do, some kind of "secret agenda", why not attack his policies, the ones that he is trying to sell?
My point is, I've seen you claim Barack Obama is naive, that he's untrustworthy because of some kind of "Muslim" connection, that he's a rookie, that he should be in Iraq, that he will pour money into Africa...
But I've yet to see you attack the policies of Barack Obama. The man may actually become the next president. Lets consider that for a moment.
The only one who benefits from the personal attacks on Barack Obama... is Barack Obama.
Because that allows him to work his image of being some kind of change and beacon of hope even further.
One question:
The military contractors are for the first time in 14 years investing more in the Democratic Party than they do in the Republican Party.
What does that say about US presence in Iraq with Barack Obama as president?
Shit like that needs to be asked IMO.
Is Barack Obama serious about leaving Iraq?
Does he have the political balls to clean up the national debt, which will take serious slashing of the military fundings?
How can he promise tax cuts?
Nobody seems to ask these questions.
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Look, I think it's great if not everyone buys into the Barack Obama hype.
But instead of making claims of what you thinks he wants to do, some kind of "secret agenda", why not attack his policies, the ones that he is trying to sell?
My point is, I've seen you claim Barack Obama is naive, that he's untrustworthy because of some kind of "Muslim" connection, that he's a rookie, that he should be in Iraq, that he will pour money into Africa...
But I've yet to see you attack the policies of Barack Obama. The man may actually become the next president. Lets consider that for a moment.
The only one who benefits from the personal attacks on Barack Obama... is Barack Obama.
Because that allows him to work his image of being some kind of change and beacon of hope even further.
One question:
The military contractors are for the first time in 14 years investing more in the Democratic Party than they do in the Republican Party.
What does that say about US presence in Iraq with Barack Obama as president?
Shit like that needs to be asked IMO.
Is Barack Obama serious about leaving Iraq?
Does he have the political balls to clean up the national debt, which will take serious slashing of the military fundings?
How can he promise tax cuts?
Nobody seems to ask these questions.
It's called fear spin. and it's infecting even the most bright.
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Hedge has posed some intelligent points. HH6 can you answer these with substance?
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he needs first to go to grand rapids michigan first where the largest iraqi in exile community lives today
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It's called fear spin. and it's infecting even the most bright.
Its funny eveytime we get into economic trouble..hey lets slash the military budget..sorry we're at war..not gonna happen. Slash welfare, slash the numerous BS entitlements, slash every day social program outthere. Obama won't be able to leave Iraq on his time tabel..if he does, we'll be back.
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Its funny eveytime we get into economic trouble..hey lets slash the military budget..sorry we're at war..not gonna happen. Slash welfare, slash the numerous BS entitlements, slash every day social program outthere. Obama won't be able to leave Iraq on his time tabel..if he does, we'll be back.
You and i both know we are not leaving Iraq anytime soon. Whether Obama is in or McCain, doesn't matter.
He's not going to slash military budgets.
He or McCain will raise taxes.
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Its funny eveytime we get into economic trouble..hey lets slash the military budget..sorry we're at war..not gonna happen. Slash welfare, slash the numerous BS entitlements, slash every day social program outthere. Obama won't be able to leave Iraq on his time tabel..if he does, we'll be back.
The problem is that over 50% of the tax dollar is spent on the military, the current foreign policy and huge military sector is the major costs for USA right now.
(http://www.warresisters.org/pages/images/pieFY09.gif)
(http://fc03.deviantart.com/fs4/i/2004/217/a/2/Death_and_Taxes_____.jpg)
Slash wellfare programs and "BS entitlements"? That would give you few percentages lower cost. But the military budget need to be seriously trimmed down.
Slim down the military organisation, make it more effective as well.
BTW, making investments in young trouble kids have been shown to save the society tremendous amounts of money.
Every trouble kid that grows up and becomes a criminal is a cost of at least $5 millions to the society. With a few hundred dollars per year, you can avoid that.
That's saving.
So I'm not sure if slashing wellfare programs is what you want to do. Re-direct them perhaps. And make them better. Or develop them.
But currently, there are too many criminals in the streets for anyone to just think the situation is "good to go".
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He or McCain will raise taxes.
Obama claims he's got a tax cut coming. However that is possible. ::)
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Obama claims he's got a tax cut coming. However that is possible. ::)
Does McCain? It's all campaign crap right now.
BTW, no way military spending will be slashed unless we stabilize Iraq.