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Radical Plato

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I like Metabolic, he is owning all the low intellect red neck gun worshipping morons in this thread!
V

deceiver

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I think whole concept of sticking to any law just because couple of old fucks 1321312 years ago wrote it down is fucking idiotic.

Question really is - is it proven through statistic methods that guns improve safety? You just cannot show a state with gun prohibition, country without it and say - oh, hey, guns are allowed here and more people die in shootings, bla bla. It's flawed, just like studies on impact of divorce on kids behaviour. Yes, kids from divorced families perform worse later in life, but is it because of divorce or because of something else, which caused both divorce and misbehaviour of kids? As it turns out there is something else, because more sophisticated studies disproved any corelation.

This however requires math and statistics on a level way beyond comprehension of any getbigger, so why even bother discussing shit like this?

Metabolic

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Out of pure curiosity, why not move all of it to trash and write it all over again? I must admit that as a theoretical computer scientist it sickens me to death when I hear about "interpretation" of law, especially when given law applies to situations it shouldn't aply when understood literally but it is, for some fucked up reason. I mean - law shouldn't be a poem.

This is going to be a short answer for a long-ass debate.

First: Constitutions do change, my country had the last one made in the 1980.  The one before that was 1933, so yes, you can say you can send it all to trash and start fresh, it happens in every country.

Second: Constitutions contain pre-established requisites in order for them to be modified, usually a high % quorum of approval of the congress or parliament.  They try to endure through time by these means, they are hard to be changed, hence they stay. THis is all Constitutional Theory and Politics.  The "changing completely" of a Constitution is a factual matter, no constitution says "well, you dont like me, then erase everything and draft a new one", they can be changed but are silent about eliminating themselves completely for obvious reasons.  Typical means of changing are social revolutions which impose new constitutions, like the one in my country in 1973.  Again, this is a factual matter, not a legislative matter.  Fichte has a lot written on his on his theory of right.

The American Constitution "cannot be changed, only ammended".  The sole idea of changing the Constitution itself, the one signed in Philly in 1787, is an aberration for Americans and thats why they have other bodies of Constitutional laws to support it. This may all sound very weird, well it is, the Common Law system has its positive and negative sides, this is one of the flaws (I sill think its better than the Continental Law system).  


Parker

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^Common Law vs Continental Law
http://mobile.wnd.com/2007/12/45281/

Roger Bacon

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This is completely laughable... All Metabolic is doing is repeating his stubborn, close-minded personal interpretation of the 2nd Amendment over and over.  Like a highschooler that took intro to law and now feels he has it all figured out... Disagree with him and you're ignorant on the subject.

I guess I put a little bit more stock in the Supreme Court of the United States District of Columbia v. Heller (2010), and countless other American LAWYERS.

District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008), was a landmark case in which the Supreme Court of the United States held that the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution protects an individual's right to possess a firearm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home and within federal enclaves.

Metabolic

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This is completely laughable... All Metabolic is doing is repeating his stubborn, close-minded personal interpretation of the 2nd Amendment over and over.  Like a highschooler that took intro to law and now feels he has it all figured out... Disagree with him and you're ignorant on the subject.

I guess I put a little bit more stock in the Supreme Court of the United States District of Columbia v. Heller (2010), and countless other American LAWYERS.

District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008), was a landmark case in which the Supreme Court of the United States held that the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution protects an individual's right to possess a firearm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home and within federal enclaves.

Much more than intro to law kiddo, unlike what you can say for yourself.

Also, no need to get mad, you and your S. C. and Lawyers can and will continue to spout whatever they want, just know that you are indirectly responsible for this massacres because of your ignorance and stubborness on the matter (I mean yours and the general american that is against strict gun control).  You cant even begin to fathom what civil responsibility is.


Tapeworm

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Nails

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tbombz

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if we adopt the idea that the 2nd amendment is there in order to protect the citizens ability to "match the power of the military" (the words the video says) in order to fight against the government or against another government.... 

well then all the weapons the government has need to be legal for citizens as well. all the bombs, chemical bombs, radiological bombs, secret military technologies, nuclear weapons. etc. all of them need to be legal based upon that interpretation of the law.

Roger Bacon

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The True Adonis

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if we adopt the idea that the 2nd amendment is there in order to protect the citizens ability to "match the power of the military" (the words the video says) in order to fight against the government or against another government.... 

well then all the weapons the government has need to be legal for citizens as well. all the bombs, chemical bombs, radiological bombs, secret military technologies, nuclear weapons. etc. all of them need to be legal based upon that interpretation of the law.
::)

Yes because the average American citizen can afford to enrich Uranium in his backyard.

Roger Bacon

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if we adopt the idea that the 2nd amendment is there in order to protect the citizens ability to "match the power of the military" (the words the video says) in order to fight against the government or against another government....  

well then all the weapons the government has need to be legal for citizens as well. all the bombs, chemical bombs, radiological bombs, secret military technologies, nuclear weapons. etc. all of them need to be legal based upon that interpretation of the law.

Absolutely untrue, look at Vietnam and Iraq.  Guerrilla warfare

The thought alone is enough to keep government in check.

tbombz

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::)

Yes because the average American citizen can afford to enrich Uranium in his backyard.
because people cant afford something means it should be illegal?  ???

..  2nd amendment = protect ability to fight against tyrannical government = protect ability to own all weapons government owns = legal nukes

tbombz

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Absolutely untrue, look at Vietnam and Iraq.  Guerrilla warfare


guerrilla warfare could be effective with steak knives.

cephissus

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who enforces the constitutional laws?
Ultimately, their Supreme Court (which is true for every state-of-law, the supreme tribunal has the last word on the application of the law to the particular case).

Oh brother, the supreme court ENFORCES laws? haha ok mr. law expert...

Nails

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Why do American Citizens Need Nuks for ??? ???

We still at war with Camel jockies in Pajamas , sandals and old russian AK-47s

Urban War fare is where the Victory is won

Roger Bacon

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Oh brother, the supreme court ENFORCES laws? haha ok mr. law expert...

I guess things are done differently in Peru.  He comes from a hotbed of curruption and murder and he's lecturing us about Civic Responsibility.  ;D

tu_holmes

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Oh brother, the supreme court ENFORCES laws? haha ok mr. law expert...

Hehe... Well, they do determine the meanings of laws and interpret the constitution.

So no... Certainly they are not law enforcement, but they determine what laws should and can be enforced.

Metabolic

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Oh brother, the supreme court ENFORCES laws? haha ok mr. law expert...

Who do you think is the ultimate jurisdictional word on application of laws? The S. C.

Cops, by order of tribunals, apply force to the sentence.


Keep trying, brah.

Metabolic

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I guess things are done differently in Peru.  He comes from a hotbed of curruption and murder and he's lecturing us about Civic Responsibility.  ;D

You are just mad I am mopping the floor with the video you thought would "settle it"  ;D

Roger Bacon

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You are just mad I am mopping the floor with the video you thought would "settle it"  ;D

Yeah, I'm furious  >:( >:( >:( >:(

Metabolic

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Yeah, I'm furious  >:( >:( >:( >:(

Next step, cops everywhere, plazas, malls, schools, universities, workplace, ice cream store, Six Flags, Five Guys, McD's...the ultimate state control and vigilance.


Long live the country of freedom you preach for brother!

cephissus

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Who do you think is the ultimate jurisdictional word on application of laws? The S. C.

Cops, by order of tribunals, apply force to the sentence.


Keep trying, brah.

::)

Yes the "the ultimate jurisdictional word of the laws" = givers of the law

"apply force to the sentence" = ENFORCERS of the law

the supreme court does the former, police officers do the latter, as you've even pointed out yourself.

I hope this helps.

Roger Bacon

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Next step, cops everywhere, plazas, malls, schools, universities, workplace, ice cream store, Six Flags, Five Guys, McD's...the ultimate state control and vigilance.


Long live the country of freedom you preach for brother!

Isolated incident blown out of proportion by the media.  Gun laws clearly couldn't have prevented this.  Life goes on, and gun rights flourish in the wake.   8)

Metabolic

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::)

Yes the "the ultimate jurisdictional word of the laws" = givers of the law

"apply force to the sentence" = ENFORCERS of the law

the supreme court does the former, police officers do the latter.

I hope this helps.

Its part of the same thing, execution by the order of a tribunal invested with the power to use the auxiliary force if necessary,  Ultimately the S C (last jurisdictional instance) is the enforcer of a law (how, when, who, etc).  Its the third level of the law (jurisdictional competence, material law, and execution).

Also, Im from Chile, although I highly doubt you know where that even is.

Its getting boring to play this game alone  :-[