Is America better off?

[LurkerNoMore]

Some of the replies to this thread are pretty funny.

Hadn't the housing market just took a dump in 2008 and didn't we have double digit UE?

I remember houses in Sacramento that went for 400K in 2007 going for 100K in 2009.

But things aren't better according to our resident conservative curmudgeons.

At least make a case that the blame doesn't fall on OB but instead on a repub controlled congress or something.

But to say things aren't better now than 2008?    

Obama Derangement Syndrome causes many dimwits to grasp onto their delusions.  Not matter how stupid they are in light of facts.

[OzmO]

Obama Derangement Syndrome causes many dimwits to grasp onto their delusions.  Not matter how stupid they are in light of facts.

I think a good debate or discussion would be how much of an impact did OB have on our current state we are in now.  But to say things were better off in 2008?  seriously?

[LurkerNoMore]

I think a good debate or discussion would be how much of an impact did OB have on our current state we are in now.  But to say things were better off in 2008?  seriously?

Yes, things were better in 2008.  The Anti-Christ had not yet fully entrenched himself in the White House and started his demonic agenda that led to the downfall of America.  In 2008, the hopes and tears of those who though the birther issue would be enough to remove him were still fresh and salty. 

[Dos Equis]

I think a good debate or discussion would be how much of an impact did OB have on our current state we are in now.  But to say things were better off in 2008?  seriously?

A number of things are dramatically worse, including the national debt, race relations, national security, employment/unemployment/labor participation, etc. 

[Dos Equis]

Bernie Sanders Says Conservatives Are Right About Unemployment!
Posted on July 8, 2015

Yes, you read that headline correctly. If you’re still reading this, congratulations. You win the internet.



Conservatives have been saying for years that the real unemployment is way higher than 5.5 or 5.3 percent. Why? Well, a few reasons, the biggest being that more people have simply dropped out of the workforce. It’s not that unemployment is down, it’s that fewer people are even attempting to look for work at all. You can’t fail at something you never even attempt.

Everybody ignored the conservatives and tried to pretend they didn’t exist…

Well, that becomes a little harder, when Bernie Sanders comes out saying the exact same thing. Yes, that Bernie Sanders. Unemployment is way higher than the government pretends. It’s pretty damning.
 
The “real” unemployment is 10.8%. We need to put millions of unemployed workers back to work. pic.twitter.com/ETPTSm9UXi

— Bernie Sanders (@SenSanders) June 11, 2015
The crazy thing here, is that Bernie Sanders is loopy enough to think that he may have just discovered this. Still no word on him discovering a comb.

All this does is prove that we were right and people are listening. Even if they pretend they’re not. Also, the left is completely out of original ideas. They’ve now resorted to taking ours and are re-treadding them for the next election.

Still, thanks Bernie for proving Conservatives right about unemployment. You’re a real pal. Now go find a damn comb.

http://louderwithcrowder.com/bernie-sanders-says-conservatives-are-right-about-unemployment/#ixzz3fn1PEh2u

[OzmO]

Bernie Sanders Says Conservatives Are Right About Unemployment!
Posted on July 8, 2015

Yes, you read that headline correctly. If you’re still reading this, congratulations. You win the internet.



Conservatives have been saying for years that the real unemployment is way higher than 5.5 or 5.3 percent. Why? Well, a few reasons, the biggest being that more people have simply dropped out of the workforce. It’s not that unemployment is down, it’s that fewer people are even attempting to look for work at all. You can’t fail at something you never even attempt.

Everybody ignored the conservatives and tried to pretend they didn’t exist…

Well, that becomes a little harder, when Bernie Sanders comes out saying the exact same thing. Yes, that Bernie Sanders. Unemployment is way higher than the government pretends. It’s pretty damning.
 
The “real” unemployment is 10.8%. We need to put millions of unemployed workers back to work. pic.twitter.com/ETPTSm9UXi

— Bernie Sanders (@SenSanders) June 11, 2015
The crazy thing here, is that Bernie Sanders is loopy enough to think that he may have just discovered this. Still no word on him discovering a comb.

All this does is prove that we were right and people are listening. Even if they pretend they’re not. Also, the left is completely out of original ideas. They’ve now resorted to taking ours and are re-treadding them for the next election.

Still, thanks Bernie for proving Conservatives right about unemployment. You’re a real pal. Now go find a damn comb.

http://louderwithcrowder.com/bernie-sanders-says-conservatives-are-right-about-unemployment/#ixzz3fn1PEh2u

For years huh?  UE has been 5% for years? Recent years?

When UE was 5% under Bush were they saying that then too?

[OzmO]

A number of things are dramatically worse, including the national debt, race relations, national security, employment/unemployment/labor participation, etc. 

Has national Debt been worse under every president  since Carter?

Was there ever a president who lowered it from what it was when he got was elected?

Kind of a weak argument.

Don't know that our national security is worse.  We are better at it since 9/11, the largest terrorist attack on US soil which was under BUSH.   

[Dos Equis]

For years huh?  UE has been 5% for years? Recent years?

When UE was 5% under Bush were they saying that then too?

I don't know.  Regardless, doesn't change the fact that our current unemployment numbers are a farce.  

[Dos Equis]

Has national Debt been worse under every president  since Carter?

Was there ever a president who lowered it from what it was when he got was elected?

Kind of a weak argument.

Don't know that our national security is worse.  We are better at it since 9/11, the largest terrorist attack on US soil which was under BUSH.   

What difference does it make if it has gone up under other presidents?  The question you asked is whether we are better off today than 2008.  The fact our national debt skyrocketed since 2008 is pretty clear evidence that our country as a whole is not economically better off today than 2008.  And remember, this president was supposed to be different.  He called Bush unpatriotic for adding $4 trillion to our national debt.  Obama has added $8 trillion.  By Obama's own definition he is an "irresponsible," "unpatriotic" failure. 

I think our national security is worse because of the instability in the Middle East.  ISIS is running through Iraq because of Obama.  Egypt, Libya, Syria, etc. are a mess.  That is a problem for us, because the growth of Radical Islam overseas has direct implications at here at home.   

[BayGBM]

I don't know about you, but I want to go back to the good old days before the disaster of Obama came along.  You know, the days when the housing industry collapsed; Wall Street and the banking industry collapsed; the airline industry collapsed; the insurance industry collapsed; the auto industry collapsed, and a free Osama bin Laden.  You know, the days when the insurgency was in its "last throes" and Rumsfeld was christened as then best defense secretary the country had ever been blessed with.

[OzmO]

I don't know.  Regardless, doesn't change the fact that our current unemployment numbers are a farce.  

Then they have always been a farce.

So the "farce" they were under BUSH @5% is the same "farce" they are under OB at 5% and the same farce they were at 8-10% under Bush is the same "farce" they were under OB @8-10%

All thing being equal as shown.  Another weak argument.

[OzmO]

What difference does it make if it has gone up under other presidents?  The question you asked is whether we are better off today than 2008.  The fact our national debt skyrocketed since 2008 is pretty clear evidence that our country as a whole is not economically better off today than 2008.  And remember, this president was supposed to be different.  He called Bush unpatriotic for adding $4 trillion to our national debt.  Obama has added $8 trillion.  By Obama's own definition he is an "irresponsible," "unpatriotic" failure.  

I think our national security is worse because of the instability in the Middle East.  ISIS is running through Iraq because of Obama.  Egypt, Libya, Syria, etc. are a mess.  That is a problem for us, because the growth of Radical Islam overseas has direct implications at here at home.  

All presidents make campaign promises and do not deliver them.  They all say they will be different.  So did BUSH.  Our Debt is still sky rocketing and will continue to do so under any president, no matter who we elect.  People don't go OMG my life s fucked  because of our national debt. (only conservative cry babies who are running out of things to cry about) They go my life is fucked because i can't find a job, gas is too high, inflation, etc.   That's why that's a weak argument.

The ME was unstable when BUSH left.  That place was far more stable when Sadam was in power.  Whose brilliant idea was it to remove him?  But regardless, national security has little to do with what's going on in the ME.  ISIS is no different than other terrorist groups before 9/11 which found a way under the last president who was conservative, to attack the USA on USA soil.  Bush established great national security directives and OB hasn't changed them much.

[OzmO]

I don't know about you, but I want to go back to the good old days before the disaster of Obama came along.  You know, the days when the housing industry collapsed; Wall Street and the banking industry collapsed; the airline industry collapsed; the insurance industry collapsed; the auto industry collapsed, and a free Osama bin Laden.  You know, the days when the insurgency was in its "last throes" and Rumsfeld was christened as then best defense secretary the country had ever been blessed with.

Things are much worse now.  Conservative cry babies have less to cry about so now they have to try and make shit up to cry about.  things are terrible for them.

[240 is Back]

it's nice not seeing 911's on our President's watch.   

[Dos Equis]

Then they have always been a farce.

So the "farce" they were under BUSH @5% is the same "farce" they are under OB at 5% and the same farce they were at 8-10% under Bush is the same "farce" they were under OB @8-10%

All thing being equal as shown.  Another weak argument.

What's weak is using moral equivalency to try and justify Obama's poor performance. 

[OzmO]

it's nice not seeing 911's on our President's watch.   

Bush did the job well here, after 9/11.  

[OzmO]

What's weak is using moral equivalency to try and justify Obama's poor performance. 

No. 

[Dos Equis]

All presidents make campaign promises and do not deliver them.  They all say they will be different.  So did BUSH.  Our Debt is still sky rocketing and will continue to do so under any president, no matter who we elect.  People don't go OMG my life s fucked  because of our national debt. (only conservative cry babies who are running out of things to cry about) They go my life is fucked because i can't find a job, gas is too high, inflation, etc.   That's why that's a weak argument.

The ME was unstable when BUSH left.  That place was far more stable when Sadam was in power.  Whose brilliant idea was it to remove him?  But regardless, national security has little to do with what's going on in the ME.  ISIS is no different than other terrorist groups before 9/11 which found a way under the last president who was conservative, to attack the USA on USA soil.  Bush established great national security directives and OB hasn't changed them much.

Your question is weak.  If you wanted to ask "are you, as an individual, better off today than 2008," then that's what you should ask.  If you are asking if the country as a whole is better off (which is what your threat title asks), then of course the skyrocketing national debt is a major factor.  

Wrong.  Iraq was stable when Bush left.  It's a mess because Obama sabotaged the SOFA and pulled all our troops out.  Without that, ISIS would not be controlling large portions of Iraq.    

National security is directly related to what happens in the ME.  The attacks on 9/11 were planned in the ME.  The growth of Radical Islam in the ME will unquestionably eventually result in more attacks on our soil.  That's why our intelligence people were so concerned about the July 4 weekend.  

[Straw Man]

I don't know about you, but I want to go back to the good old days before the disaster of Obama came along.  You know, the days when the housing industry collapsed; Wall Street and the banking industry collapsed; the airline industry collapsed; the insurance industry collapsed; the auto industry collapsed, and a free Osama bin Laden.  You know, the days when the insurgency was in its "last throes" and Rumsfeld was christened as then best defense secretary the country had ever been blessed with.

Apparently you're forgetting that we have a black, muslim/atheist, marxist, communist, dictator who hates america as POTUS

when you look at it through that lense we're worse off

[OzmO]

Your question is weak.  If you wanted to ask "are you, as an individual, better off today than 2008," then that's what you should ask.  If you are asking if the country as a whole is better off (which is what your threat title asks), then of course the skyrocketing national debt is a major factor.  

Wrong.  Iraq was stable when Bush left.  It's a mess because Obama sabotaged the SOFA and pulled all our troops out.  Without that, ISIS would not be controlling large portions of Iraq.    

National security is directly related to what happens in the ME.  The attacks on 9/11 were planned in the ME.  The growth of Radical Islam in the ME will unquestionably eventually result in more attacks on our soil.  That's why our intelligence people were so concerned about the July 4 weekend.  

America is defined by its citizens, not by the national debt.  When someone asks is America better off they ask themselves are they better off or are the people better off.  Not if our debt is in order, unless of course you got nothing else to point out to fit into your hate OB agenda.

So if we can't control the ME our National security is weak?  Then by your logic our national security has always been weak.  Our intelligence people will always be concerned, that's there job, which was made easier and more productive since 9/11, because of Bush.

[Dos Equis]

America is defined by its citizens, not by the national debt.  When someone asks is America better off they ask themselves are they better off or are the people better off.  Not if our debt is in order, unless of course you got nothing else to point out to fit into your hate OB agenda.

So if we can't control the ME our National security is weak?  Then by your logic our national security has always been weak.  Our intelligence people will always be concerned, that's there job, which was made easier and more productive since 9/11, because of Bush.

It's unreasonable to use anecdotes to measure the overall financial health of the country.  When someone is engaging in a reasonable analysis, the national debt, unemployment rate, and labor participation rate are very important factors, unless of course you are acting like an Obamabot.

I didn't say our national security is weak. 

[LurkerNoMore]

Some people will argue ANYTHING - no matter how lame - just to complain about Obama.

[OzmO]

It's unreasonable to use anecdotes to measure the overall financial health of the country.   

Such as "look at our national debt clock?" 

When someone is engaging in a reasonable analysis, the national debt, unemployment rate, and labor participation rate are very important factors, unless of course you are acting like an Obamabot.  I didn't say our national security is weak.

A reasonable analysis includes all comparisons.  not one sided ones like "under OB....."

[LurkerNoMore]

Such as "look at our national debt clock?" 

A reasonable analysis includes all comparisons.  not one sided ones like "under OB....."

Are you suggesting there is a difference from reasonable analysis and biased selectivity?

[240 is Back]

Bush did the job well here, after 9/11. 

OJ was a great husband, aside from that one time.