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Getbig Main Boards => General Topics => Topic started by: 240 is Back on August 08, 2006, 10:59:34 PM
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http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1350815371737518499&q=911+conspiracy
Scroll ahead to 31:00.
Follow the info he's detailing about the smoke. You look down and see very clearly - a 60 story plum of new smoke emitting from the bottom of the WTC.
Seriously folks, if you can see this- and recall the many firefighter accounts of bombs going off everywhere and huge blasts in the basement - can you still deny there were bombs in the building?
The planes had hit and all the damage was up top. Then these clouds appear. I can't believe these haven't come up before. please explain this to me.
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I have a good idea. I don't know if this has been done but it's a good idea. If there were explosives the dust would be full of that evidence. We should obtain samples from people who saved the dust and have it submitted for "explosive trace detection" but not tell them what the sample is. I remember some of the people saying that they couldn't bring themselves to toss out the dust when they were cleaning up their apartments after, said they felt it was sacred. These samples could prove if there was enough explosives to bring down these buildings.
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240 answer these or at least ponder this:
Do you believe the passengers on the planes died or are still alive somewhere?
If you do believe they are alive, then that certainly means that the Airport Authorities are also involved.
IMO there is NO WAY, especially at Dulles/Washington, that NO ONE would have no knowledge of a deboarding and busing off passengers. If you've seen Dulles, it has a Main Building, but all departures and arrivals are at smaller terminals that can only be reached by shuttlebus.
Say I was a driver and I recognized the female reporter, can't remember her name. Don't you think a Media source of any kind would offer me more for info (say 100,000 dollars) than what I was currently making? Like I wouldn't take the money.
I'm sure you believe they are alive, that's why you don't believe the cell phone calls. But why are there AIR PHONES that work on the plane while in flight?
Just a couple of thoughts.
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We need a new thread group named "Conspiracies" where 240 and toxic can post their 20+ bullshit conspiracy posts per day.
I'm sick of this shit contaminating every section of getbig >:(
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240 answer these or at least ponder this:
Do you believe the passengers on the planes died or are still alive somewhere?
If you do believe they are alive, then that certainly means that the Airport Authorities are also involved.
IMO there is NO WAY, especially at Dulles/Washington, that NO ONE would have no knowledge of a deboarding and busing off passengers. If you've seen Dulles, it has a Main Building, but all departures and arrivals are at smaller terminals that can only be reached by shuttlebus.
Say I was a driver and I recognized the female reporter, can't remember her name. Don't you think a Media source of any kind would offer me more for info (say 100,000 dollars) than what I was currently making? Like I wouldn't take the money.
I'm sure you believe they are alive, that's why you don't believe the cell phone calls. But why are there AIR PHONES that work on the plane while in flight?
Just a couple of thoughts.
Well if there is a conspiracy, they kind of plan shit ahead of time. Maybe they did kill them. A lot of people died in the acts committed, do you think they would blink twice about a few more killed in the planes? I don't see how you say the airport authority would have to be involved. I'm sure the government has plenty of nifty tricks up their sleeves...
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Not exactly the same scenario but some of the same problems or questions would have been asked if this part of project northwoods had been approved and went through with. They didn't sound very concerned about making it happen.
(nara.gov doc 141) …Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft should appear to continue as harassing measures condoned by the government of Cuba… It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil air liner enroute from the US to Jamaica, Guatemala, Venezuela or Panama. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday, or any group of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight…
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I'm sick of this shit contaminating every section of getbig >:(
Ah, it's not... most of the posts are made here. This is where you can post anything meant for serious discussion not pertaining to BBing. It's actually really simple, don't clickie the threads you don't want to read ;D
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FAA is gagged. Same with FDNY. They go to jail if they speak on something they know.
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There are other more plossible andeasier to understand explanations for the smoke, like the pressurization and exhuast fans for the parkade were running.
This is possible sine the towers had an emergency generator.
This would easily enduce that big a draft Especially since the smoke dampers were blown out of the building when the shaft was hit.
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There are other more plossible andeasier to understand explanations for the smoke, like the pressurization and exhuast fans for the parkade were running.
This is possible sine the towers had an emergency generator.
This would easily enduce that big a draft Especially since the smoke dampers were blown out of the building when the shaft was hit.
You blame a sudden and one-time blast of smoke clouds from the basement on the vents? There were massive booms before the smoke rises. Seismic data far bigger than the actual planes hitting. Building structure compromised on sub-basement levels. Do you discount the many firefighter recordings complaining of bombs all over the building?
I don't care what kind of mess you have going on at the 90th floor. This does not cause massive bombs to blow off arms and skin on people all over the building. Dozens and dozens of recordings, from civilians, firefighters, WTC employees, all saying the same thing - massive bombs going off all over the building. And, CNN and FOXnews' own coverage let you hear many massive bomb blasts- which they REMOVED from their later coverage.
People had to SUE to get the firefighter recordings to come out. Why would bush block these? These are HEROES who died that day. Why block the recordings? Because those recordings said 2 things: 1) The fires are almost out, and 2) Many people hurt all over the building from bombs all over.
All Fire dept and police are under a gag order. They speak on it, they go to jail. yet some have spoken anyway. They say they know it was an inside job. They say there were bombs all over the building. Who should we believe? Firefighter tapes from men who were there? Or Washington DC *managers* who block the release of those tapes?
i believe the men who were there and who died there. not the men who have placed gag orders on them.
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There are other more plossible andeasier to understand explanations for the smoke, like the pressurization and exhuast fans for the parkade were running.
This is possible sine the towers had an emergency generator.
This would easily enduce that big a draft Especially since the smoke dampers were blown out of the building when the shaft was hit.
your kidding right :-\ ???
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i wrote this in a different thread
without even reading or watching any of the evidence about the bombs,thermite,etc... its pretty obvious that WTC 1,2 and 7 did not come down from the planes and fire alone. im actually surprised that people argue against it.
i guarantee that when each of you saw those buildings come down you all were shocked at how they fell and you all thought that it looked like a controlled demolition. how many hundred or even thousands of people have you talked to or read about that have said the exact same thing.
i dont know exactly what happened that day but im 100% certain its not what we were told "officially". after watching and reading info about the conspiracy and also what the supposed truth is,after seeing what everybody here has to add im still more inclined to believe the conspiracy. TOO MANY COINCIDENCES. TOO MANY NEVER BEFORES. TOO MUCH COVER UP....all in one day
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your kidding right :-\ ???
The smoke clouds are a smoking gun. There were bombs going off all over the building. bombs on the building mean that it wasn't just 19 arabs. It means that someone with access and many hours in the buildings had to have done it.
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Yes, I have heard this conspiracy before.
The CIA, Army, FBI will kill me if I talk about Aliens, or whatever, but I will speak to you. ::)
Right, more likely no one will listen to me because I am crazy, so if I blame the government first that will will make me sound more believable. ;)
I don't believe there are gag orders.
Post a picture of one.
Tell me one person that went to jail over speaking about this.
There is no evidience of bombs.
It doesn't even make sense.
There are all sorts of systems that would explode when a building collapses.
Transformers, gas lines, Boilers, etc.
Each trasferformer on each floor would explode.
Then generator in the basement would also most likely explode.
The generator would likely have 10,000 gallons of fuel.
All of this could easily sound like a different bomb going off.
All of these systems are removed before a building is demolished.
The glass shards and dust from the windows as they collapse would shred the skin.
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No offence 240 or Bust, but I think you're starting to lose it.
Is it the family situation changing fcuking with you?
YIP
Zack
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All is good with me. I'm just learning more and more, and here in the USA this is almost a viral movement going on. lots of emotion. Some folks are very closeminded, some are very angry when they see proof. Some are scared and in denial. Then there are a lot of crazy people who might do something when it comes out. I just want more investigations- I'm happy staying at home and watching it unfold on TV.
Joker - If you found out that thousands of gag orders had been issued to the NY Fire Dept and FAA employees - would that make you wonder a bit, what they had to hide?
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Just after the disaster, Firefighter Louie Cacchioli said, “We think there were bombs set in the building.” Notice he said ‘we’. At 9:04, just after flight 175 collided with the South Tower, a huge explosion shot 550 feet into the air from the U.S. Customs House known as WTC 6. A huge crater scars the ground where this building once stood. Something blew up WTC 6 - it wasn’t a plane; it must have been a bomb of some sort.
If you have the time, read about all the bombs, seismic data, etc. There is no denying there were bombs going off that day
http://www.prisonplanet.com/analysis_lavello_050503_bombs.html
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240- I can't find one credible source about gag orders.
Sibel Edmonds had a gag order placed on her.
But from her site it had to do with the Patriot act and not 9-11.
http://www.justacitizen.com/ (http://www.justacitizen.com/)
The othe group were having open discussion on the Patriot Act and not 9-11. The government wanted to find out who was invloved in the discussion, not on the topic.
http://www.911citizenswatch.org/print.php?sid=670 (http://www.911citizenswatch.org/print.php?sid=670)
Neither group was gaged over discussions of 9-11.
As I said before.
There was enough fuel and fuel tanks in the area that nay of these could have been ignited by an electrical spark and caused the explosion.
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There was enough fuel and fuel tanks in the area that nay of these could have been ignited by an electrical spark and caused the explosion.
But you can't just invent an electrical spark. We don't have witness account of electrical sparks. We have dead serious firefighters and police who, over the radios that day, heard many reports of explosions all over the building.
You can't blindly use the 'electrical spark and fuel tanks!' thing. These sparks and fuel tanks were not mentioned in the Official Report that everyone keeps quoting.
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Neither was thermite
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240, is this exciting viral movement the antidote to the boredom resulting from hanging out at the home front 24/7?
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240, is this exciting viral movement the antidote to the boredom resulting from hanging out at the home front 24/7?
well, of course it's interesting to follow for a boring guy like me.
but I was actually referring to the protests, marches, colllege screenings, interviews, and simple sharing of information that has been happening in the country lately. Even though the mainstream media isn't covering it, it is still happening. And 2006 has been a huge year for it.
I know you probably won't believe it until MSNBC tells you it's real, and that's fine. But someone involved is going to eventually come forward. And when they do, mainstream media will have no choice but to cover it. Until then, all we can do is wait.
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You asked what could cause other explosions.
I told you.
Transformers exploding and fuel tanks exploding have nothing to do with how the tower fell. But they would account for the explosions that you mention.
I am arguing against your supposition that the building came down by thermite. I m pointing out that the explosions could have easily been caused by other things that were already in the building and not thermite.
You brought in things that were not in the report. I am just arguing your suppossion with mine.
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I know you probably won't believe it until MSNBC tells you it's real, and that's fine. But someone involved is going to eventually come forward. And when they do, mainstream media will have no choice but to cover it. Until then, all we can do is wait.
240, i think you're going to wait a long time . . . maybe it's time to send in that law school app?
I'm guessing that any news-show producer worth his salt is going to feel the same way I do (as any reasonable person would) . . . the only story worth following here is the one about the droves of people looking for something "more" to give excitement/meaning to their lives.
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LOL... nah, programming has to be easier than going to law school would be.
Thing is, there are firefighters who have come forward with info they believe shows it was an inside job. The media will not talk to them. They will give Bill O'Reilly a platform to speak to millions with one side of the story from Popular Mechanics, but they will not let the professor they are bashing come on the show to defend himself.
AlGebra, can you seriously look at those buildings coming down in slow motion and not think it is a controlled demolition? It wasn't a weakening then a collapse. The fire was almost out, yet the energy required to PULVERIZE 110 stories of concrete was still there? You can blame "the weight of it all", but the pulverization was of the same velocity and intensity at the top as it was at the bottom. It STARTS with steel girders being fired UP into the air 200 yards.
The weight of 20 collapsing stories would not propel large steel girders 200 yards. That's two football fields. UP. Into the air.
If you can seriously watch it with your own eyes, and believe the energy created to explode a building like that is caused simply by gravity pulling on a nearly burned out group of stories, well, you'll never be convinced.
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AlGebra, can you seriously look at those buildings coming down in slow motion and not think it is a controlled demolition? It wasn't a weakening then a collapse. The fire was almost out, yet the energy required to PULVERIZE 110 stories of concrete was still there? You can blame "the weight of it all", but the pulverization was of the same velocity and intensity at the top as it was at the bottom. It STARTS with steel girders being fired UP into the air 200 yards.
The weight of 20 collapsing stories would not propel large steel girders 200 yards. That's two football fields. UP. Into the air.
If you can seriously watch it with your own eyes, and believe the energy created to explode a building like that is caused simply by gravity pulling on a nearly burned out group of stories, well, you'll never be convinced.
If I trusted my eyes, I would probably never figure out that the earth revolved around the sun . . . it's just not my area of expertise. that is why I rely on other people sometimes . . . and to my critical faculty, their explanations seem more reasonable than yours.
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If I trusted my eyes, I would probably never figure out that the earth revolved around the sun . . . it's just not my area of expertise. that is why I rely on other people sometimes . . . and to my critical faculty, their explanations seem more reasonable than yours.
I'm but a goofy web designer tho- there are people who make the argument way better than I can.
Have you watched the Blue Media 911 piece? They show how each aspect of the towers collapse violated the laws of physics. From the upward launch of debris, the ability of the falling debris to change it course, etc.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3498980438587461603&q=blue+media+911
Or, the abbreviated, 2 minutes review:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8397478226620650110&q=blue+media+911
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I'm but a goofy web designer tho- there are people who make the argument way better than I can.
Have you watched the Blue Media 911 piece? They show how each aspect of the towers collapse violated the laws of physics. From the upward launch of debris, the ability of the falling debris to change it course, etc.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3498980438587461603&q=blue+media+911
Or, the abbreviated, 2 minutes review:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8397478226620650110&q=blue+media+911
i watched your video . . . and wrote a long-ass response to it.
and then
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=87972.msg1259943#msg1259943
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240: http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/08/08/video-popular-mechanics-editor-debunks-911-myths-on-oreilly/
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LOL... nah, programming has to be easier than going to law school would be.
Thing is, there are firefighters who have come forward with info they believe shows it was an inside job. The media will not talk to them. They will give Bill O'Reilly a platform to speak to millions with one side of the story from Popular Mechanics, but they will not let the professor they are bashing come on the show to defend himself.
AlGebra, can you seriously look at those buildings coming down in slow motion and not think it is a controlled demolition? It wasn't a weakening then a collapse. The fire was almost out, yet the energy required to PULVERIZE 110 stories of concrete was still there? You can blame "the weight of it all", but the pulverization was of the same velocity and intensity at the top as it was at the bottom. It STARTS with steel girders being fired UP into the air 200 yards.
The weight of 20 collapsing stories would not propel large steel girders 200 yards. That's two football fields. UP. Into the air.
If you can seriously watch it with your own eyes, and believe the energy created to explode a building like that is caused simply by gravity pulling on a nearly burned out group of stories, well, you'll never be convinced.
I seriously believe you should give some of the political philosophers a try:
Read a book of each from these:
Karl Marx/Friedrich Engels (Communist Manifest)
Adam Smith
Robert Nozick
Simone de Beauvoir (The Second Sex)
Ed Burke
Robert Dahl (If you read only one author, this would be it)
Robert Putnam (Bowling Alone MUST READ)
Samuel P Huntington (Clash of Civilizations)
Mary Wollstonecraft (A Vindication of the Rights of Woman, she was a great influence of John Locke and she was one of the greatest classical liberal philosophers in the late 18th century).
Read Lijphart, Bertrand Russel and others as well.
Knowledge is power.
Do you really want O'Reilly to tell you what to think, or do you want to at least have a chance of using your reason?
Just some suggestions.
YIP
Zack
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240: http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/08/08/video-popular-mechanics-editor-debunks-911-myths-on-oreilly/
I watched that. But they didn't invite both sides on to give evidence. Both O'Reilly and the guest bashed the point of view and that was it.
At least bring on a conspiracy theorist, let him/her take their best shot, then correct them. But just bashing their point of view, without letting them present it, is quite one-sided.
Of course, if the conspiracy group was able to deliver arguments that Bill couldn't argue, that would be pretty big news...
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I'm but a goofy web designer tho- there are people who make the argument way better than I can.
Have you watched the Blue Media 911 piece? They show how each aspect of the towers collapse violated the laws of physics. From the upward launch of debris, the ability of the falling debris to change it course, etc.
The beams would hve failed do to shear stress.
These could easily be launched vertically. They could have been cataploted vertically or fly out when they were sheared.
Fly bems could have been redirected by wind gust or the vacuum caused when the building collapsed.
Do you have any idea how much energy is in a stationary building. 1/2 the height of the building X the weight.
Even individual floors have a large amount of energy.
By the way you are asking for a third report.
FEMA and NIST both had separate reviews of the twin tower collapse and came to the same conclusion.
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The beams would hve failed do to shear stress.
These could easily be launched vertically. They could have been cataploted vertically or fly out when they were sheared.
Fly bems could have been redirected by wind gust or the vacuum caused when the building collapsed.
Steel beams could have easily been launched 200 yards? Wind?
Dude, these beams were fired. Not only OUT 200 yards, but UP into the air. When falling floors land upon the floors below it, they do not crush, then launch parts of this floor 200 yards, and UP into the air. Things fall down. Not up.
These projectiles were launched upwards because there were explosions going on. Falling objects do not propel things. Explosions do.
Look at frame 3 here...
The top of this building SHOULD be tipping over. Look at that top chunk. It is following the path of least resistance, as all falling objects do. Given the option of a building (even a weakened one), or air, the top will choose air. It will tumble over the side.
The ONLY way this top chunk of the building chose to continue falling into the floors, instead of chooing to tumble over the side? The material under it had the structural integrity of air. This is ONLy achieved by removing all support columns and floors uniformly and instantly, BEFORE the tumbling chunk arrives. This can only be explained thorugh the use of explosives.
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Catapolt.
Here is an example, place a ruler on the edge of you desk os that an about an inch sticks out.
Now Punch doen on the part of the ruler that is sticking out.
The ruler dhould have gone almost straight up.
That is how things go up.
There are only two forces at work Kinetic Enrgy and Poteintal energy.
The potiential ENergy that each of the towers had was the weight of the building X 1/2 the height.
Now a steel girder might weigh up to 2000lbs.
The Energy required for it to go 200ft. up is 400000 lb ft.
The towers Potential energy would be equal to the weight of the building X 375 ft.
The bilding must weigh at least 1067 bs falling from 375 ft.
The towers would have weighed 1000 X that required weight.
Wind is how the beams would have changed direction.
The Energy in a falling building would easily launch a beam 200 yards.
The building wasn't collapsing until the integraty of the columns failed so it would fall straght down.
The upper levels were not moving unitl the building final collapse do the core of the building failing and caving in on itself.
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http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1350815371737518499&q=911+conspiracy
Scroll ahead to 31:00.
Follow the info he's detailing about the smoke. You look down and see very clearly - a 60 story plum of new smoke emitting from the bottom of the WTC.
Seriously folks, if you can see this- and recall the many firefighter accounts of bombs going off everywhere and huge blasts in the basement - can you still deny there were bombs in the building?
The planes had hit and all the damage was up top. Then these clouds appear. I can't believe these haven't come up before. please explain this to me.
Rob you DO realize that none is gonna believe you..and lose change is NEVER gonna make the movies...
welcome to my world since i ws 13 :-\
1) WE R NOT IN IRAQ TO GET SADDAM...OR ANYTHING TO DO WITH OIL
2) WE NEVER MADE IT TO THE MOON
3) LUNA..THE MOON BASE EXISTS
4) THE ILLUMINATI EXIST
5) FREEMASONS COLTROL THE EARTH ( niel armstrong ws one)
of course..all i said is bullshit...
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The towers were built to withstand several planes crashing into them.
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3) LUNA..THE MOON BASE EXISTS
Huh? Whats that? Link please lol.
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The towers were built to withstand several planes crashing into them.
Really? The builders built them with that in mind? It's in the building specs huh? com on. We are getting carried away here again.
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Really? The builders built them with that in mind? It's in the building specs huh? com on. We are getting carried away here again.
C'mon Ozmo, stop playing devil's advocate.
All skyscrapers, ...especially those in a flight path are designed with that in mind. Ask any architect.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL4isaZRapY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL4isaZRapY)
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Right. And in the very unlikely event that fire did cause the buildings to fall, it'd be a messy ass collapse. Slow, ugly, like we see in any other building collapse. not two near fast implosions in less than 2 hours.
Seriously, if you read a little about physics, study the film, and truly believe there is nothing fishy, you're a brainwashed sheep. Period.
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C'mon Ozmo, stop playing devil's advocate.
All skyscrapers, ...especially those in a flight path are designed with that in mind. Ask any architect.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL4isaZRapY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL4isaZRapY)
Just becuase some guy with bad taste in ties and shirts says it was designed to with stand a 707 slamming into it does mean:
A. That the designed would have worked
B. That they had any data to base a workalbe design from.
The deal is, nothing even close to this has ever happened before. They can make earthquake proof buildings.... but designing 100 story buildings to with-stand fully fueled large passenger jets slamming into it at hundreds of miles per hour is new territory.
Use some common sense here.... It's unlikely and very remote anything of this magnitude could have been orchestrated and coverd up. EVEN the king of conspracy theories, Chomsky, says it's far fetched.
The most likely conspiracy is the bush admin knew about the attack before it happned.
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The most likely conspiracy is the bush admin knew about the attack before it happned.
That would be failure to protect the citizens of this country. That would be throwing the constitution out the window. That would be failing to do the only job they were elected to do. And, it would be lying to us today.
Another investigation could reveal this. If 3000 people were "LET TO DIE" in the hands of any other company in the country, you'd better believe there would be some better investigations.
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Yeah, I'm all for it....bring on the hounds! I've always hated Bush btw >:(
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NIST spent four years investigating how the building collapsed.
After all of this they even changed the building code to help fix the mistakes in design so that these types of building failures could be mitigated.
contact any of these people to find out how the buildings collapsed.
http://wtc.nist.gov/WTC_Conf_Sep13-15/presentations905.htm (http://wtc.nist.gov/WTC_Conf_Sep13-15/presentations905.htm)
IT seams that the engineering and the science community has had their two reports and are working on fixing the problems with the building design.
I guess the engineering and science community are in on the conspiracy as well since all of the evidance has forced them tochange how future buildings are desined.
240- have you read all 2000 pages of the NIST report.
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TWO-FORTY-
do you realise the implications of what this would mean? this would mean an UNBELIEVEABLY CORRUPT and EVIL government, not only that, but a thoroghly EVIL and CORRUPT NYC, fdny, cia, every single fucking person involved (and there would have to be hundred if not thousands, and a good portion would have to be americans)...and NO ONE would have leaked info? even undeer the threat of DEATH, at least one of these thousands would have enough guilt to come forward.
even under the fanatical Nazi regime, there was the nazi who declined to obey Hitler's orders to demolish Paris.....the sheer odds indicate SOMEONE, if not may of these people, would deliberately fuck up the plan before it could go thru...human nature is not THAT thoroughly evil.
if they really did do this to ourselves, then i will move and wish nothing but destruction to this evil nation.
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I pray it's not true. It's probably not true. it's not true. That's fine.
I just want to know how that 47-story building fell. The govt closed the investigation before that question was answered. So let's open it, and see why WTC7 collapsed from fire. If there's nothing shady, let's close it. But there are hundreds of people with engineering backgrounds, all over teh world, who have said the collapse was impossible.
So let's check it out. Another investigation would unite America.
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TWO-FORTY-
do you realise the implications of what this would mean? this would mean an UNBELIEVEABLY CORRUPT and EVIL government, not only that, but a thoroghly EVIL and CORRUPT NYC, fdny, cia, every single fucking person involved (and there would have to be hundred if not thousands, and a good portion would have to be americans)...and NO ONE would have leaked info? even undeer the threat of DEATH, at least one of these thousands would have enough guilt to come forward.
even under the fanatical Nazi regime, there was the nazi who declined to obey Hitler's orders to demolish Paris.....the sheer odds indicate SOMEONE, if not may of these people, would deliberately f**k up the plan before it could go thru...human nature is not THAT thoroughly evil.
Sometimes, it's not about tons of evil people. Sometimes people make decisions about acceptable losses. You have to understand the type of pressure that can be brought to bear on people, ...and when they have families that need to be protected, ...they consider it their first priority. I'm not saying it is right or wrong, ...but how many of you in the face of such circumstance having to weigh whether you risk the lives of your wife, children, etc., or 3,000 people who are already dead, and not coming back. For many, 3,000 already dead people is more of an acceptable loss than the potential risk to their loved ones if they open their mouths about what they know.
if they really did do this to ourselves, then i will move and wish nothing but destruction to this evil nation.
Alot of Americans have already left. I know, ...this country is overrun with them. ;)
But don't wish destruction on the nation. It's not the nation that's evil, ...it's the SOB's running it and doing these things. The people still living there, and subject to the lies and manipulation are very much victims too, ...victims of their own government, and often, of their own arrogance, ignorance, ego, and failure to stop being sheep.
Some do speak out tho, ...however they are often muzzled or slimed to undermine their credibility.
You see the very same thing happening in this very same forum. People who speak about subjects others don't like being discussed are slimed, slandered, libeled, and discredited. It's no different offline.
See: The CIA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QYZBMIBOck) <--click me
edit 2006-08-15: Ooops, ...I can't believe I forgot to include the other parts as well. :-[
The CIA pt.2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=no6KwMcmsu8) <--click me
The CIA pt.3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNIxiSS6afI) <--click me
The CIA pt.4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xo6x0SC69vg) <--click me
The CIA pt.5 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71u1Xa6w60Q) <--click me
The CIA pt.6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Frdel-_IWn8) <--click me
as well as: The Chronology of US Aggression (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo1kD9UPoBc) <--click me
Common sense should tell you, it's really only a matter of time when the same activities start taking place at home.
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Yes, common sense tells me that the U.S. government partnered with Osama to plan and carry out 9/11, blow up the WTC buildings, fake a plane flying into the Pentagon, blow up part of the Pentagon, and then everyone has kept quiet about it for over five years. Makes sense to me. ::)
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Yes, common sense tells me that the U.S. government partnered with Osama to plan and carry out 9/11, blow up the WTC buildings, fake a plane flying into the Pentagon, blow up part of the Pentagon, and then everyone has kept quiet about it for over five years. Makes sense to me. ::)
About time you came to your senses! ;D
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Guys, how about a compromise? What if they only reviewed the 47-story building collapse?
Anyone can admit its fishy - many govt offices located there, and the fire was never fought. if it was a controlled demo, it means those bombs were placed BEFORE 9/11, which gievs us a problem. If it fell just from isolated fires, then it is a HIGHLY unlikely event, and should be studied further. I mean, bigger buildings have had FAR worse fires for days upon days, and when parts did collapse, it was slow over the course of hours. The idea that it hit the ground from start to finish in under 7 seconds in such an organized fashion is incredible.
Remember that no plane hit these buildings, and several other buildings were hit far worse with debris that day. For anyone that just claims "It fell under its own weight", please study the hundreds upon hundreds of building fires from history. NONE have fallen from their own weight. They fall from floors and columns giving out, and it is a VERY disproportionate series events. To accept this building fell from fire alone, you would have to accept the theory that every room in all 47 floors gave way simultaneously. And the two asbestos-covered support columns. They gave out at teh exact same time too.
Do you accept this? And if you think it doesn't make sense, it's because it doesn't. There needs to be a new investigation, even if only for WTC7.
(http://www.waronfreedom.org/pix/wtc7-demolition.gif)
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NIST isn't finished investigating WTC7. I think it would be wise to hold off the conspiracy calls until the final WTC 7 report is released.
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NIST isn't finished investigating WTC7. I think it would be wise to hold off the conspiracy calls until the final WTC 7 report is released.
Dude, um, when is the release date?
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It is going to be in the next few months.
There is some problem trying to figure out the impact of the fuel storage under the building.
Wiki it.
From what I have read, thanks 240, the building was overthe main power generators and transformers for the whole complex.
The results for some of the testing is incunclusove.
The best and brightest ebginnering groups are working on it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_World_Trade_Center#_note-3 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_World_Trade_Center#_note-3)
In response to FEMA's concerns, the Commerce Department’s National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) has conducted a three-year, $24 million investigation into the structural failure and progressive collapse of several WTC complex structures, including 7 World Trade Center. The study included not only in-house technical expertise but also drew upon the knowledge of several outside private institutions, including the Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE), the Society of Fire Protection Engineers (SFPE), the National Fire Protection Association (NFPA), the American Institute of Steel Construction (AISC), the Council on Tall Buildings and Urban Habitat (CTBUH), and the Structural Engineers Association of New York (SEAoNY).
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Question: When the WTC was bombed in the mid 90's, and Clinton was the President, did anyone try to find conspiracy there?
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About time you came to your senses! ;D
Yeah. It took a while. ;D
TWO of my softball teammates cornered me this weekend for almost an hour burning my ear about this 9/11 conspiracy: didn't find the plane at the Pentagon, the buildings were blown up, the Bush family was doing business with Bin Laden. Sheeze. This conspiracy talk is everywhere. They believe the plane that crashed into the Pentagon may have landed somewhere. So my question was, among other things, where are all those people who supposedly died on the plane? And why aren't their families all over the press yelling conspiracy and looking for their loved ones?
I can't believe people take this stuff seriously. It's mind blowing.
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Yeah. It took a while. ;D
TWO of my softball teammates cornered me this weekend for almost an hour burning my ear about this 9/11 conspiracy: didn't find the plane at the Pentagon, the buildings were blown up, the Bush family was doing business with Bin Laden. Sheeze. This conspiracy talk is everywhere. They believe the plane that crashed into the Pentagon may have landed somewhere. So my question was, among other things, where are all those people who supposedly died on the plane? And why aren't their families all over the press yelling conspiracy and looking for their loved ones?
A 911 operator in Illinois received a 911 call from a passenger on the plane that supposedly crashed in Penn. That 911 operator has been gagged from discussing it further, and those call records are sealed.
Why do you think they would gag her and seal these records?
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i dont know about anything else, but WTC7 was so clearly a controlled demo its not even funny.
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There is some problem trying to figure out the impact of the fuel storage under the building.
The results for some of the testing is incunclusove.
The best and brightest ebginnering groups are working on it.
I'm sure that 62 months will give them the truth they couldn't find in 60 months.
And if it was fuel tanks, we STILL wouldn't have seen such a uniform explosion. I mean, every floor, and both columns, failed at the exact same second. If it was a fuel tank, that would have been easy to measure. Seismic data, Silverstein, FEMA, and the 911 commission should have been able to put that together. Why couldn't they? because it still doesn't make sense. There would have been visual signs of an explosion, and it sure wouldn't have been symmetrical.
Look at the twin towers. When they fall, concrete-reinforced, asbestos-covered central columns failed at the EXACT same rate as the much weaker outer floors. This is an important piece of evidence that, as I detailed in that 14-point argument, even the govt would not touch.
I know you want to believe that every other country in the world does evil shit and ours doesn't. I know you will sleep better, believing that. So keep on believing it.
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A 911 operator in Illinois received a 911 call from a passenger on the plane that supposedly crashed in Penn. That 911 operator has been gagged from discussing it further, and those call records are sealed.
Why do you think they would gag her and seal these records?
I don't want to say that I don't believe you but . . . I don't believe you. :) Proof (and not some tabloid web site link)? Even if an operator has been "gagged," I can see national security as a reasonble explanation for a gag order. And I'll ask you the same question: where are all the people who were on that plane and why aren't their family members talking?
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i dont know about anything else, but WTC7 was so clearly a controlled demo its not even funny.
Yes. And once you accept this fact, you have to think about when the explosives were placed throughout the building.
Couldn't have been that day - it takes weeks to lace a buildings supports with explosives and wire everything. On 9/11, the building was evacuated 45 minutes after both towers fell. There were a few small varied fires, and firefighters never even attempted to put them out. The building stood empty all day then fell just after 5 pm that day.
So, the building was wired before. Interesting. Why would you do something incredily dangerous like wire your building with bombs? And, since the FBI, CIA, Secret Service, and SEC all had offices in this building, you have to ask... were the feds okay with a building owner filling their offices with bombs? LMAO.. it's almost comical here.
now you begin to accept that "ahhhhh"... something is fishy.
new investigations solve everything.
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Yeah. It took a while. ;D
TWO of my softball teammates cornered me this weekend for almost an hour burning my ear about this 9/11 conspiracy: didn't find the plane at the Pentagon, the buildings were blown up, the Bush family was doing business with Bin Laden. Sheeze. This conspiracy talk is everywhere. They believe the plane that crashed into the Pentagon may have landed somewhere. So my question was, among other things, where are all those people who supposedly died on the plane? And why aren't their families all over the press yelling conspiracy and looking for their loved ones?
The families are screaming to be heard, but the media isn't listening.
Please see: 9/11 Was an Inside Job: Donna Marsh O'Connor Speaks Out (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EymYwYc43iE) <--click me
I can't believe people take this stuff seriously. It's mind blowing.
What's mind blowing is your refusal to think, ...but no one ever said MK-Ultra wasn't skillful.
Please also see: Dr. Robert M. Bowman says 911 was an inside job (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6X_r4DppWk) <--click me
Robert M. Bowman was the Director of Advanced Space Programs Development for the U.S. Air Force in the Ford and Carter administrations, and is a former United States Air Force Lieutenant Colonel with 101 combat missions. He holds a Ph.D. in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering from the California Institute of Technology.
When a man with these credentials says 9/11 was an inside job, LISTEN TO HIM! >:(
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Even if an operator has been "gagged," I can see national security as a reasonble explanation for a gag order.
Please explain why it is "national security". Please.
Because it would reveal that no plane crashed in Penn? I don't see how that would put anyone at risk, except for the shady company that says they identified all the Flight 93 bodies, even though first responders never saw a single body.
"national security" is an awesome tag for "anything that makes the govt look like liars".
Come on dude, if that 911 operator can reveal that the plane was in Illinois, would you agree we need a new round of investigations?
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Please explain why it is "national security". Please.
Because it would reveal that no plane crashed in Penn? I don't see how that would put anyone at risk, except for the shady company that says they identified all the Flight 93 bodies, even though first responders never saw a single body.
"national security" is an awesome tag for "anything that makes the govt look like liars".
Come on dude, if that 911 operator can reveal that the plane was in Illinois, would you agree we need a new round of investigations?
Anything related to the Pentagon could involve national security. That is the nerve center of the military.
"And I'll ask you the same question: where are all the people who were on that plane and why aren't their family members talking?"
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Anything related to the Pentagon could involve national security. That is the nerve center of the military.
"And I'll ask you the same question: where are all the people who were on that plane and why aren't their family members talking?"
Right. But this didn't have to do with the Pentagon. This was a hijacked commercial airline that supposedly crashed in Pennsylvania. If there is evidence that one of the passengers made a call which was picked up by a local cellular tower in Illinois, it means the plane did not crash in Penn.
This is huge. Yet it was gagged.
Where are the people from the plane? Well, the evidence - from both pics and first responders on the scene- says that these people did not die in a Penn field. i dont' know if they're alive or dead. But if the evidence says they didn't die in that field, then that 911 call might be the best lead into findoing out the truth.
yet they gagged it. Weird, huh?
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Right. But this didn't have to do with the Pentagon. This was a hijacked commercial airline that supposedly crashed in Pennsylvania. If there is evidence that one of the passengers made a call which was picked up by a local cellular tower in Illinois, it means the plane did not crash in Penn.
This is huge. Yet it was gagged.
Where are the people from the plane? Well, the evidence - from both pics and first responders on the scene- says that these people did not die in a Penn field. i dont' know if they're alive or dead. But if the evidence says they didn't die in that field, then that 911 call might be the best lead into findoing out the truth.
yet they gagged it. Weird, huh?
So the people on TWO planes didn't die? Are they being held hostage somewhere? Five-plus years and a couple hundred people (don't know the exact number) are unaccounted for? I don't believe that for one second.
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So the people on TWO planes didn't die? Are they being held hostage somewhere? Five-plus years and a couple hundred people (don't know the exact number) are unaccounted for? I don't believe that for one second.
I don't either. You're leaving out the third option - killed in a manner which did not result in a lot of dead bodies spread out on a field, on national TV.
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Again, if these people are alive, then they either:
1. Don't care about any of their families.
2. Are somewhere besides the US.
3. Got paid of hansomely.
BTW, some "children" that traveled alone one Flight 77 were pronounced dead. Tell their parents that their child is alive and getting paid.
There are too many people involved in this to be a Government Conspiracy. Maybe a big oil corperation conspiracy, but not a Government Conspiracy.
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There are too many people involved in this to be a Government Conspiracy. Maybe a big oil corperation conspiracy, but not a Government Conspiracy.
They're probably not alive.
And I agree - it cannot be a conspiracy that everyone in the govt knows about. but it can involve a small number of neo-conservative politicians, a for-hire military group from overseas, a greedy landlord, and a family that is doing A-OK in the oil business right now. Care to fill in the names? :)
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They're probably not alive.
And I agree - it cannot be a conspiracy that everyone in the govt knows about. but it can involve a small number of neo-conservative politicians, a for-hire military group from overseas, a greedy landlord, and a family that is doing A-OK in the oil business right now. Care to fill in the names? :)
Well that narrows the pool. So this is a neo-conservative conspiracy? No liberals? No moderates?
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Well that narrows the pool. So this is a neo-conservative conspiracy? No liberals? No moderates?
Watch the media coverage from right after 911. It involves people from both parties. You have Gov. Pataki standing at ground zero, explaining to the CNN reporter how concrete has a tendency to 'pulverize itself' when it gets hot, and how the smoke coming from under the wreckage isn't molten steel, but rather "the jet fuel that will continue burning for quite some time".
A small group did it. A larger group knew that week. An even larger group covers it now. Period. And it will come out in our lifetime, there are just too many angry people, and too many educated people who have studing WTC7 collapse and know it is a sham.
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240 -
1. I am Canadian.
2. How come no one blames neo-conservatives for plans on blowing up the towers in the 90's under Clinton.
3. I trust a report from the groups I have previously mentioned more then some wacko site on the internet. These bodies have large memberships and are the cornerstone of engineering and safety in North America. Ther are literally thousands of members that would disagree to a few dozen of your supposed experts.
4. I am glad you challenge a report that hasn't even been finished.
5. If you believe the government is planning these hoaxes, why didn't they plant WMD's 3 years ago.
6. The scale and planning of the attacks like you propose would take more skill and manpower then the government possesses. All other evidence Iraq, Homeland security, Israel and has proven the governemnt is very bad at keeping secrets and even worse at planning them.
7. Accam's Razor.
Believe what you want.
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just leave all the reports and witnesses out. forget them.
watch the videos of what happened that day.......and what the gov has done since. use your own eyes,ears and brain
watch and listen to the buildings collapse(WTC)
notice the lack of evidence(bodies) at the other sites
why the gag orders.
then make a rational conclusion with your head...not your heart
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There are no gag orders.
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There are no gag orders.
You're kidding, right?
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Where is the evidence.
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They're probably not alive.
And I agree - it cannot be a conspiracy that everyone in the govt knows about. but it can involve a small number of neo-conservative politicians, a for-hire military group from overseas, a greedy landlord, and a family that is doing A-OK in the oil business right now. Care to fill in the names? :)
Since you guys hate reading what I post, ...how about watching it instead? :P
9/11 Norad - Cheny was in charge (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I687jvb2uf8) <--click me
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9/11 Norad - Cheny was in charge (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I687jvb2uf8) <--click me
I challenge the doubters to watch this clip. Add this to the new information that NORAD simply LIED about the times on 9/11, and it starts to become clear.
I am beginning to think that anyone who spends 2 hours watching videos or reading about the details of 911 will either be convinced there was at least a coverup, or see evidence of complicity on the part of our govt.
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this thing is growing and growing. its every where and all walks of life are believing it.
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this thing is growing and growing. its every where and all walks of life are believing it.
With very good reason blinky!
Please see: 9/11 Truth: in depth Kevin Barrett Interview on Wisconsin TV (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oi3-pojxD4) <--click me
You see, once you get past all the hostile angry kneejerk rhetoric, and look at the stuff, it gives you pause.
You shall now the truth, ...and the truth shall set you free.
People, please just snap out of the programming and JUST THINK!
</rant off>
OK, ...I'm gonna stop before I do a Berserker style meltdown. ;)
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jag, if youve read any of my past posts on the subject you would know i am a believer
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One of the best source of information about alot of the high crimes and treasons occuring is Mike Ruppert.
This was the guy who first exposed the CIA's hand in the crack epidemic of the 80's.
Without going into detail, let's just say I knew a guy in Southern Cali who used to say he was bulletproof because it was the very highest levels of government who facilitated his activities. I thought he was full of crap, til years later the San José Mercury broke the story, and someone turned me onto to Mike Ruppert and his "From the Wilderness" reports.
I can tell you that over the years it has been a trip to see information, then watch that information unfold in ways that the general public is then co-erced to or made to believe is merely happenstance & co-incidence.
I remember hearing about plans for the release of infected mosquitoes during the Atlanta games to spread disease throughout the states. Shortly thereafter we hear about West Nile... At the time you hear the stuff and you think to yourself "What a bunch of conspiracy nuts!" But when you have a memory like an engraving on a steel plate, the hindsight is always 20/20 when puzzle pieces start falling into place and you begin to see the big picture, as well as understand the MO. It allows you a whole different perspective on a situation, and permits you the luxury of not being sucked into the ongoing and future planned deceptions.
Here are a couple of clips of Mike Ruppert speaking about 911
The Deepest Secrets of 9/11 (means, motives, & opportunity) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McRRD_XbHUQ) <--click me
Conspiracy Fact: The Bush Admin Planned 9/11 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDY6LIKZmIA) <--click me