Please get regular blood work if you're juicing!

[randy841]

I read about the viagra too but I don't really see taking viagra long term as an option to keep the heart from thickening. Weight lifting in itself will cause thickening of the left ventricular because of the pressure/stress during heavy lifting.

...

The heart thickens with weight training with or without AAS usage. And returns to normal upon 'cessation of activity after deconditioning the body from exercise for 3 months'. Unless underlying heart conditions are present, enlargement of the left ventricle, increased chamber size, and increased heart muscle mass is not dangerous in itself.

[OptimusPrime1980]

ppls with high cholesterol live longer

diovan does th blood pressure job well

for liver enzymes , when your fuck you take break ,,

exactly!!!
closing of arteries and vessels is not CAUSED by cholesterol at all.....
it is caused by inflamation of the artery or vessel wall....
eating a good amount of healthy fats reduces inflamation reactions in your body....
having a high total cholesterol does not mean you are unhealthy!!!!!!!
lowering your cholesterol with meds can actually be very dangerous as your body needs it!
it's all about the hdl/ldl..... how that is divided.
latest research shows fats are not to blame at all..... it's exessive carbs... simpel carbs and high sugar levels in blood...
high glucose = high insuline... insuline kills.....
think about it.... before the industrial revolution... before processed foods.. before it all... a lot less heart diseases... why??
lower insuline levels.... less simpel carbs in the food.... higher protein and fat intake....

[Benoitlapierre]

exactly!!!
closing of arteries and vessels is not CAUSED by cholesterol at all.....
it is caused by inflamation of the artery or vessel wall....
eating a good amount of healthy fats reduces inflamation reactions in your body....
having a high total cholesterol does not mean you are unhealthy!!!!!!!
lowering your cholesterol with meds can actually be very dangerous as your body needs it!
it's all about the hdl/ldl..... how that is divided.
latest research shows fats are not to blame at all..... it's exessive carbs... simpel carbs and high sugar levels in blood...
high glucose = high insuline... insuline kills.....
think about it.... before the industrial revolution... before processed foods.. before it all... a lot less heart diseases... why??
lower insuline levels.... less simpel carbs in the food.... higher protein and fat intake....

awesome post


thk u

[OptimusPrime1980]

awesome post


thk u

no problem bro...
and just facts really.... this whole cholesterol scare is stupid......
 

[honest]

So you really think abuse of aas over a long time 10-20 years will have no ill effects at all on your heart   Give me a fucken break. It lowers HDL levles and raises LDL levels. It increases blood pressure stiffening areteries. Raises rbc and hematocrit levels.

Then you throw high doses of tren in there and 10-20 i.u of gh I'm suprised you don't see more guys having strokes on these boards.

Very good post, I have done quite a bit of bloodwork over the years on how much AAS I can actually take before it  changes in a negative manner,I also kept records when i was competing using higher dosages. My self studies had me conduting bloodwork regularly firstly after being off for years and then when on hrt doses and then on higher. My own personal experaince and results are below, very limited

I can take up to 200mg of test or Primobolan every 10 to 14 days without lowering my HDL, once I go over this amount my HDL lowers and my LDL starts to climb, there is also no increase to my hemocrit or very little at 200mg a fortnight. My HDL was mostly effected by taking orals  particulrly  where i used anadrol . I find that both Deca and Equipoise both build up the hemocrit steadily but less so than orals. I have been higher and my HDL got really low on pre contest cycles.

[notsureifsrs]

exactly!!!
closing of arteries and vessels is not CAUSED by cholesterol at all.....
it is caused by inflamation of the artery or vessel wall....
eating a good amount of healthy fats reduces inflamation reactions in your body....
having a high total cholesterol does not mean you are unhealthy!!!!!!!
lowering your cholesterol with meds can actually be very dangerous as your body needs it!
it's all about the hdl/ldl..... how that is divided.
latest research shows fats are not to blame at all..... it's exessive carbs... simpel carbs and high sugar levels in blood...
high glucose = high insuline... insuline kills.....
think about it.... before the industrial revolution... before processed foods.. before it all... a lot less heart diseases... why??
lower insuline levels.... less simpel carbs in the food.... higher protein and fat intake....

I like most of your posts, but i will have to disagree with this one
read here:
http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=319
and:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/the-influence-of-the-subjects-training-state-on-the-glycemic-index.html

[OptimusPrime1980]

I like most of your posts, but i will have to disagree with this one
read here:
http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=319
and:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/the-influence-of-the-subjects-training-state-on-the-glycemic-index.html

your welcome to disagree bro....
but i can surf a little on google and come up with research that backs up my claims...
itīs new research... and it makes sense...
and i read your links a little ... full of errors... sorry...
high insulin... = western world diseases...
why is it that in some desert populations where they eat like we used to... ie: fish, lean meat, a little carbs... fruits and berry's especially... and fats from the meat , and nuts... why is it these people have virtually NO heart disease except for genetic problems??? why almost no cancer? no diabetics type 2.. WHY??
low insuline levels....
why do bodybuilders look like crap nowadays? insulin! why did tom princess and flex wheeler lose kidney's? diuretics?? yes but only because combination with insulin!!! lol i know guys that ABUSED diuretics.. they are fine, why?? no insulin.....
and btw i said simpel carbs... processed foods..... read better...
carbs are not carbs.. simpel carbs have much more impact on bloodglucose as complex carbs...
and about the cholesterol.. go and google.... FACTS! i saw a docter here on tv talking about it just last week..... it's inflamation in the body... inflamation of the artery or vessel walls.... that is where cholesterol gets stuck in... the little lesions....lot's of people wit low cholesterol that get hartattacks...and people with high cholesterol that live to 90....
diet high in (healthy) fats actually prevents inflamation reactions in the body...and yes you NEED sat fat as well!!!!!
insulin should be low!!!!!!! period! not none existant...lol...  but low and stable....

[notsureifsrs]

your welcome to disagree bro....
but i can surf a little on google and come up with research that backs up my claims...
itīs new research... and it makes sense...
and i read your links a little ... full of errors... sorry...
high insulin... = western world diseases...
why is it that in some desert populations where they eat like we used to... ie: fish, lean meat, a little carbs... fruits and berry's especially... and fats from the meat , and nuts... why is it these people have virtually NO heart disease except for genetic problems??? why almost no cancer? no diabetics type 2.. WHY??
low insuline levels....
why do bodybuilders look like crap nowadays? insulin! why did tom princess and flex wheeler lose kidney's? diuretics?? yes but only because combination with insulin!!! lol i know guys that ABUSED diuretics.. they are fine, why?? no insulin.....
and btw i said simpel carbs... processed foods..... read better...
carbs are not carbs.. simpel carbs have much more impact on bloodglucose as complex carbs...
and about the cholesterol.. go and google.... FACTS! i saw a docter here on tv talking about it just last week..... it's inflamation in the body... inflamation of the artery or vessel walls.... that is where cholesterol gets stuck in... the little lesions....lot's of people wit low cholesterol that get hartattacks...and people with high cholesterol that live to 90....
diet high in (healthy) fats actually prevents inflamation reactions in the body...and yes you NEED sat fat as well!!!!!
insulin should be low!!!!!!! period! not none existant...lol...  but low and stable....

I would appreciate if you will do it
i agree about the fact that insulin is indeed 'killer' and the articles aren't disagree with this either.

It's hard to comment on most of what you wrote because there is too many 'ifs', like the desert populations you mentioned, in their situation there can be much more factors rather than just low insulin for them being healthy (also take a note and read about insulin index)

As for Tom Prince and flex wheeler and their kidney problems, well you can't tell it for a fact so who knows....

carb = carb? obviously no, but read the articles and you will get some insight on how different carbs will affect body composition.

I don't tend to get into arguments especially not the kind that related to nutrition, but for the sake of this argument take your time and read my links, if you are going to throw statements than find something to back them up or at least write them in more complete way.

[OptimusPrime1980]

I would appreciate if you will do it
i agree about the fact that insulin is indeed 'killer' and the articles aren't disagree with this either.

It's hard to comment on most of what you wrote because there is too many 'ifs', like the desert populations you mentioned, in their situation there can be much more factors rather than just low insulin for them being healthy (also take a note and read about insulin index)

As for Tom Prince and flex wheeler and their kidney problems, well you can't tell it for a fact so who knows....

carb = carb? obviously no, but read the articles and you will get some insight on how different carbs will affect body composition.

I don't tend to get into arguments especially not the kind that related to nutrition, but for the sake of this argument take your time and read my links, if you are going to throw statements than find something to back them up or at least write them in more complete way.

as i said if i google a bit i can come up with research that backs up my claims... but i am lazy and not in the mood to do so... lol...
and you are talking about arguments... bro relax..... you disagree fine.... i don't care... lol...
i know what i am saying is true...
and desert populations yes..like the inuits for axample... they were healthy people... ate whale, rendear meat , and some berry's.... now they have been westernised... and lord and behold... more diabetics type 2, more cancer, more heart disease..... WESTERN DISEASES! why??? nowadays there is a macD there.... burgerKing, faster life..... more (simpel carbs)... = higher insulin levels.... = unhealthy.... period...
tom prince , and kennie wheeler... yes it's slin that killed their kidneys together with abuse of diuretics.... i know because i have seen it happen irl... seen what slin does to a bb.... high dose for many years that is...
do not even discuss this with me , because i have REAL LIFE experience!!!
and btw nutrition and bodycomposition? you are on getbig.... should know by now that drugs is what influences bodycomposition... lol...
nutrition can only do so much...we were talking about cholesterol and hartdisease.....
still low insulin is where you want to be for health..... trust me....
but feel free to disagree..... no problem.... 

[El Diablo Blanco]

We're all going to die sooner or later.  Better to die with a nice pussy slaying physique than some old fuck who pisses and shits himself.

I was in the line behind an old geezer at the grocery store.  It was evident he shit himself in his depends.  Smelled fucking foul.  I said to myself the day I start shitting myself in public is the day I swallow a bottle of vicadin.

[vascsurgeon]

exactly!!!
closing of arteries and vessels is not CAUSED by cholesterol at all.....
it is caused by inflamation of the artery or vessel wall....
eating a good amount of healthy fats reduces inflamation reactions in your body....
having a high total cholesterol does not mean you are unhealthy!!!!!!!
lowering your cholesterol with meds can actually be very dangerous as your body needs it!
it's all about the hdl/ldl..... how that is divided.
latest research shows fats are not to blame at all..... it's exessive carbs... simpel carbs and high sugar levels in blood...
high glucose = high insuline... insuline kills.....
think about it.... before the industrial revolution... before processed foods.. before it all... a lot less heart diseases... why??
lower insuline levels.... less simpel carbs in the food.... higher protein and fat intake....


Once the endothelial of a blood vessel is damaged, usually by blood flow at a bifurcation point, cholesterol will deposit, the body then sends antibodies to the affected area and this goes on and on until you have a blocked artery.
It is a combination of things, but, in short it is cholesterol that is the issue.
Many years ago people didnt live as long, lifestyle and medical care are vastly different, try to avoid that argument.

[Oly15]

your welcome to disagree bro....
but i can surf a little on google and come up with research that backs up my claims...
itīs new research... and it makes sense...
and i read your links a little ... full of errors... sorry...
high insulin... = western world diseases...
why is it that in some desert populations where they eat like we used to... ie: fish, lean meat, a little carbs... fruits and berry's especially... and fats from the meat , and nuts... why is it these people have virtually NO heart disease except for genetic problems??? why almost no cancer? no diabetics type 2.. WHY??
low insuline levels....
why do bodybuilders look like crap nowadays? insulin! why did tom princess and flex wheeler lose kidney's? diuretics?? yes but only because combination with insulin!!! lol i know guys that ABUSED diuretics.. they are fine, why?? no insulin.....
and btw i said simpel carbs... processed foods..... read better...
carbs are not carbs.. simpel carbs have much more impact on bloodglucose as complex carbs...
and about the cholesterol.. go and google.... FACTS! i saw a docter here on tv talking about it just last week..... it's inflamation in the body... inflamation of the artery or vessel walls.... that is where cholesterol gets stuck in... the little lesions....lot's of people wit low cholesterol that get hartattacks...and people with high cholesterol that live to 90....
diet high in (healthy) fats actually prevents inflamation reactions in the body...and yes you NEED sat fat as well!!!!!
insulin should be low!!!!!!! period! not none existant...lol...  but low and stable....

Nice posts. How do you prevent inflammation of the arteries and anything else that could lead to heart disease or other heart problems?

[vascsurgeon]

Nice posts. How do you prevent inflammation of the arteries and anything else that could lead to heart disease or other heart problems?

Keep LDL low, HDL high, use as little PED's as possible. Get blood work 2 times a year and keep body-weight/fat under 15%.

[TheOne]

If some has got jacked muscles, pearly white teeth, epicly dark tan of the islands and an impressive full head of hair then they must be the picture perfect example of health.

What's his hairpiece made out of?  The pubes from a squirrels ball sack!!!

[Oly15]

Keep LDL low, HDL high, use as little PED's as possible. Get blood work 2 times a year and keep body-weight/fat under 15%.

I liked everything except the low PED part 

[Dr Dutch]

correct me if i am wrong dr...
but isn't it true that , higher bodyweight, big muscles, heavy weight training ... all these things by themself cause a bit higher bp???   not necessarily
i mean 150/80 to me is not that high for a big dude that weighs 250 plus...  no problem bp
i think people are a bit to freaked on this subject... indeed
also a high dyastolic is worse then the systolic on the higher side... correct?  opinions among dr's differ about that these days
steroids cause high bp , because of the water that you retain.... get that under control and there should be no problem as to bp.... correct
aside from the thicker blood you get from steroids.... that can be solved by taking aspirine...  not entirely
docter asked only 2 things.....
does it run in your familiy and he asked if he smoked.... steroids were mentioned only when he was recovered....
and the doc said they are not the biggest problem at all... sure there are risks... but genetics are factor no1...
and smoking.... smoking is way , way worse than anything.... worse then steroids, worse then alcohol...
sometimes when i go out i have people telling me i will die young because of steroids.. they are standing there being 30kg overweight and drinking a beer and smoking a sigarette.... i just shake my head and say..... sure....     I think you got the idea, my man

[JAM]

Nice posts. How do you prevent inflammation of the arteries and anything else that could lead to heart disease or other heart problems?

Both grandparents had heart issues in my family.  From what I recall, I had read Niacin helps with the arteries.  

http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-924-NIACIN+AND+NIACINAMIDE+VITAMIN+B3.aspx?activeIngredientId=924&activeIngredientName=NIACIN+AND+NIACINAMIDE+VITAMIN+B3

Also I have to agree with Optimus.  The body uses cholesterol and fats to create hormones so you need it.  But of course when you turn that off via AAS you will have extra fat floating around in the blood and hemocrit will increase (thickness of blood viscosity) as a result.  This can be a bad combination based on your level of inflammation / restriction or even shape and size due to genetics.  In fact, I know a guy at work who lives on lettuce leaves, twigs and berries...plus he uses cholesterol meds.  Despite all that effort he still had several bypass surgery and heart stints.  Granted that is an extreme case.

But asprin works to thin the blood as Optimus pointed out.  I think giving blood may help too.  But not too sure on that one.  

[Dr Dutch]

Both grandparents had heart issues in my family.  From what I recall, I had read Niacin helps with the arteries.  



But asprin works to thin the blood as Optimus pointed out.  I think giving blood may help too.  But not too sure on that one.  

hiring a vampire may help as well, you fool....

[JAM]

Funny Bastard!     - good think my phone is on mute with a conference call at work.  That one made me laugh! 

[Oly15]

Thanks for the post JAM.

To anyone who is somewhat knowledgeable about health, would dipping regularly be just as bad as smoking? I keep reading that it is very bad for one to smoke and have high BP, since both dip and smoking constrict blood vessels, are both equally harmful as far as heart disease and BP?

[tren4life]

After 7 years of being on I found out today my liver enzymes are off the charts and the liver is damaged. Blood pressure is high, don't do what I did. Take care of yourselfs, my bodybuilding dreams are pretty much over. Have an unborn son on the way and want to be around.

[JAM]

Thanks for the post JAM.

To anyone who is somewhat knowledgeable about health, would dipping regularly be just as bad as smoking? I keep reading that it is very bad for one to smoke and have high BP, since both dip and smoking constrict blood vessels, are both equally harmful as far as heart disease and BP?

No problem!  From what I recall my grandfather smoked and then switched to chew.  But I don't think it made a difference for the better in his case.  It was probably like switching from crack to strait old cocaine.  (Both being bad one being a little worse)  Safest way is avoid that sort of stuff altogether.  But maybe someone who knows more about dip can answer.   

[ChevChelios]

After 7 years of being on I found out today my liver enzymes are off the charts and the liver is damaged. Blood pressure is high, don't do what I did. Take care of yourselfs, my bodybuilding dreams are pretty much over. Have an unborn son on the way and want to be around.

What  did you use?

[Oly15]

No problem!  From what I recall my grandfather smoked and then switched to chew.  But I don't think it made a difference for the better in his case.  It was probably like switching from crack to strait old cocaine.  (Both being bad one being a little worse)  Safest way is avoid that sort of stuff altogether.  But maybe someone who knows more about dip can answer.   

Alright I'm going to do some researching. Appreciate it.

[tren4life]

Over the years I have used:
Lots of Tren
Lots of EQ
NPP
Deca
Anadrol
Superdrol
Primo
Winstrol
Various test ethers mainly sustanon and ethanate

Also peptides and hgh but don't think those are the cause.

I have been on 3 years straight only taken off a few weeks a year. The last year lots of Tren an EQ. For me I'm predisposed to hypertension. Just watch the blood pressure and check your liver enzymes. It pains me to come off but I would rather be alive for my girl and unborn child. Had a good run, wanted to be national level but its ok, have my career and I will probably shrink to twinkle size. Question GH15 would the hgh help my liver in any way.