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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: IndustryInsider on December 20, 2006, 09:37:32 AM
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Flex Not for Sale?
Interesting find in my recent copy of the Delaney Report…
“American Media, Inc. (Star magazine, tabloid National Enquirer, etc.) is pulling back on its plan to sell off five magazines (including Flex, Muscle & Fitness, Country Weekly, Muscle & Fitness Hers and Mira). Step taken due to AMI’s financial difficulties and its repeatedly having to ask for extensions on releasing it’s earnings restatements.”
- The Delaney Report Vol. 17 No. 48 December 18, 2006
AMI had no choice but to take Flex off the market. Its no wonder…Flex has performed so poorly over the years, and their slumping sales woes continue! I’m sure that AMI will continue to try and sell Flex privately if they get the right offer, or put it back on the market at a later date. It’s clear that AMI does not have a long term interest or commitment to Bodybuilding.
Discuss
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Actually, you've got it backwards...
Flex and M&F sales arent slumping, and are doing so well that they decided NOT to sell them as they ARE making a profit....They also had some changes at the top which led to the new people involved having a different vision, one which doesn't include selling the mags at this time....
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Actually, you've got it backwards...
Flex and M&F sales arent slumping, and are doing so well that they decided NOT to sell them as they ARE making a profit....They also had some changes at the top which led to the new people involved having a different vision, one which doesn't include selling the mags at this time....
Good cover up Chick, you are a great AMI employee. But here are the facts regarding Flex…
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Subscribers – 36,621 Down 14.8% from the prior year.
Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 72,415 Down 15.4% from the prior year.
Total Circ. 109,036 Down 15.2% from the prior year.
Latest Advertising as reported by min as well as Media Week…Jan ’06 vs. Jan. ’07 issues.
Flex Ad pages - Down 3.56%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Down 9.51%
In the second half of the year their sales continue to go down. Flex has gone from 150,000 copies sold a month to 109,000. If you consider this doing well then God Bless You. I wish you a healthy and PROSPEROUS New Year.
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Good cover up Chick, you are a great AMI employee. But here are the facts regarding Flex…
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Subscribers – 36,621 Down 14.8% from the prior year.
Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 72,415 Down 15.4% from the prior year.
Total Circ. 109,036 Down 15.2% from the prior year.
Latest Advertising as reported by min as well as Media Week…Jan ’06 vs. Jan. ’07 issues.
Flex Ad pages - Down 3.56%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Down 9.51%
In the second half of the year their sales continue to go down. Flex has gone from 150,000 copies sold a month to 109,000. If you consider this doing well then God Bless You. I wish you a healthy and PROSPEROUS New Year.
Whoa, statistics always OWNS someone, good job!
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For new kids to bodybuilding: Muscle Mags are useless to you, what use is a routine Ronnie Coleman or Jay Cutler does for chest, what use is it to you? zero.
you don't need to read muscle mags to know how to train.
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who buys those s**thead magazines anyway...they are loaded with advertisements for the snake oil supplements and they recycle every article...
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Good cover up Chick, you are a great AMI employee. But here are the facts regarding Flex…
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Subscribers – 36,621 Down 14.8% from the prior year.
Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 72,415 Down 15.4% from the prior year.
Total Circ. 109,036 Down 15.2% from the prior year.
Latest Advertising as reported by min as well as Media Week…Jan ’06 vs. Jan. ’07 issues.
Flex Ad pages - Down 3.56%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Down 9.51%
In the second half of the year their sales continue to go down. Flex has gone from 150,000 copies sold a month to 109,000. If you consider this doing well then God Bless You. I wish you a healthy and PROSPEROUS New Year.
Ouch. Even if they continue their decline slightly, this will continue to be a black eye for the company. My guess is that they would get so little for the magazine in a sale - that they figure they have nothing to lose by keeping them.
So much for Weiders vision of this "powerful media company" helping out the industry...
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who buys those s**thead magazines anyway...they are loaded with advertisements for the snake oil supplements and they recycle every article...
true im not a crazy mag reader but i'll get one now and again and yeah its usually the same o'l.
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Good cover up Chick, you are a great AMI employee. But here are the facts regarding Flex…
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Subscribers – 36,621 Down 14.8% from the prior year.
Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 72,415 Down 15.4% from the prior year.
Total Circ. 109,036 Down 15.2% from the prior year.
Latest Advertising as reported by min as well as Media Week…Jan ’06 vs. Jan. ’07 issues.
Flex Ad pages - Down 3.56%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Down 9.51%
In the second half of the year their sales continue to go down. Flex has gone from 150,000 copies sold a month to 109,000. If you consider this doing well then God Bless You. I wish you a healthy and PROSPEROUS New Year.
Ladies and gentleman, i believe the term is...
(http://home.swiftdsl.com.au/~raza/owned-bike.jpg)
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I don't know why I'm not enthusiastic about picking up any mags these days anymore, well, not all of them MD got some good info, I cruise through the pages and I'm somewhat satisfied. but almost every other bodybuilding mags these days are Pure bullshits that they kept on Recycling and feeding to the poor kids outthere.
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No, Chick is right Flex is doing good.
who buys those s**thead magazines anyway...they are loaded with advertisements for the snake oil supplements and they recycle every article...
And Flex and M&F limit the number of advertisers, unlike MD, 400 + pages of nothing BUT advertisements
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Well, at least MD try to show you what a fcuking seringue look like
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No, Chick is right Flex is doing good.
unlike MD, 400 + pages of nothing BUT advertisements
No...there's a couple pages of poorly written articles (not that I think Flex & M&F are written well).
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Good cover up Chick, you are a great AMI employee. But here are the facts regarding Flex…
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Subscribers – 36,621 Down 14.8% from the prior year.
Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 72,415 Down 15.4% from the prior year.
Total Circ. 109,036 Down 15.2% from the prior year.
Latest Advertising as reported by min as well as Media Week…Jan ’06 vs. Jan. ’07 issues.
Flex Ad pages - Down 3.56%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Down 9.51%
In the second half of the year their sales continue to go down. Flex has gone from 150,000 copies sold a month to 109,000. If you consider this doing well then God Bless You. I wish you a healthy and PROSPEROUS New Year.
OUCH!
Luckily Chic has IFBB insurance. That gotta hurt. Reality and not just posting responses is a tough lesson in life. Chic just flunked the final.
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I can't believe most of the magazines on the market have lasted this long. It's only the pictures that keep most people buying them, not the training advice. Weider publised his first mag back in the late 30's and in all honesty, he probably could have stopped after five issues and we would have had all the knowledge we would ever need on bodybuilding. You can only pull the same rabbit out of the same hat for so long.
SERGIO!!!!
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Flex is pulling approximately $150,000 in subscription sales and $510,000 in newsstand sales each month, not to mention advertising which is a huge chunk of money there. Take away expenses and it would still seem as though FLEX is turning over a respectable profit.
Is that you Uncle Joe ?.
SERGIO!!!!
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AMI is still in massive debt so I don't see why their new vision would be to keep a profitable magazine. It would make more sense to liquidate a portfolio of profitable titles in order to decrease debt the fastest. Even though FLEX may be making a lot of money, you have to keep in mind there is interest on AMI's debt that needs to be paid and quick liquidation would drastically reduce that debt and related interest payments. I also don't think FLEX's profits would offset that interest to a degree which makes it worth keeping even if it is profitable.
Flex is pulling approximately $150,000 in subscription sales and $510,000 in newsstand sales each month, not to mention advertising which is a huge chunk of money there. Take away expenses and it would still seem as though FLEX is turning over a respectable profit.
Profit does not equal growth. Declining profits (and rapidly as shown here) mean big problems.
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Profit does not equal growth. Declining profits (and rapidly as shown here) mean big problems.
The big problem is that all the content is offered on the internet free of charge. Take BB.com for example, which is a complete wealth of information:
www.bodybuilding.com (http://www.jdoqocy.com/click-1881271-10409943)
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muscle magazines will always have their own little niche (restroom reading).
but all in all, internet boards have destroyed their longterm prospects.
those with affiliations or committments will have to play the company line and say "we're stronger than ever", but numbers, trends, and your lying eyes are usually a better indicator.
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Ladies and gentleman, i believe the term is...
(http://home.swiftdsl.com.au/~raza/owned-bike.jpg)
LOL ;D
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I agree. I still buy the print mags because I don't being in front of my computer all the time. I sometimes like to just chill out and flip through a real mag.
Yeah, unless I see something I really want to read in the mag, I'd rather see the $5 turn into $38 for my son when he starts college.
240 - you aren't suggesting Bob is an IFBB pawn are you? ;D
No. Bob has said it, himself, that you have to say things to keep your bosses happy, and that 'everybody does it'. I don't think he'd argue that part of his position as a Weider employee is to show his employer in the best possible light. When his numbers are proven wrong, as they may have been here, he will lose credibility in the eyes of the people he's trying to reach, which will equally reflect on his employer. So it's all kinda a tossup.
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Sorry I don't believe some anonymous poster...here's some numbers that support the better:
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Subscribers – 66,814 Up 11.8% from the prior year.
Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 92,145 Up 14.9% from the prior year.
Total Circ. 149,036 Up 15.2% from the prior year.
Latest Advertising as reported by min as well as Media Week…Jan ’06 vs. Jan. ’07 issues.
Flex Ad pages - Up 5.36%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Up 9.00%
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Sorry I don't believe some anonymous poster...here's some numbers that support the better:
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Subscribers – 66,814 Up 11.8% from the prior year.
Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 92,145 Up 14.9% from the prior year.
Total Circ. 149,036 Up 15.2% from the prior year.
Latest Advertising as reported by min as well as Media Week…Jan ’06 vs. Jan. ’07 issues.
Flex Ad pages - Up 5.36%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Up 9.00%
What is your source, Insider?
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Sorry I don't believe some anonymous poster...here's some numbers that support the better:
ABC Analysis for the period ending 6/30/06
Flex Ad pages - Up 5.36%
Muscle & Fitness Ad pages - Up 9.00%
That's why i don't buy flex or m&f anymore.......... now they have the 5 pages special report ( not 4, it's 5 now)
half of whats in the mags, we saw it before, nothing new.......... and we are supposed to believe what they say........... bs.
i find it hard to believe subscribers are going up............
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but all in all, internet boards have destroyed their longterm prospects.
That's true to a point but if I see something half way decent in a mag I will buy it in a heartbeat. However, I haven't seen anything half way decent in a bodybuilding mag in a long, long time and thus haven't bought anything. Like Matt C said, I would rather look at the photos & articles in a mag than see them on a computer screen. I just looked at the latest musclemag international and they had their Olympia wrap. There was practically no photos & the write up was shite, so I didn't buy it. Bottom line, it's the same as people who misguidedly believe that the internet has killed CD sales. If the content is good, real fans will go and buy the product regardless .
SERGIO!!!!
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What is your source, Insider?
I found it!! His source was:
www.madeupstatistics.com
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I found it!! His source was:
www.madeupstatistics.com
What a great find!
They say there's a 0% chance that Don Long will do the 2006 Atlantic City Pro.
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That's true to a point but if I see something half way decent in a mag I will buy it in a heartbeat. However, I haven't seen anything half way decent in a bodybuilding mag in a long, long time and thus haven't bought anything. Like Matt C said, I would rather look at the photos & articles in a mag than see them on a computer screen. I just looked at the latest musclemag international and they had their Olympia wrap. There was practically no photos & the write up was shite, so I didn't buy it. Bottom line, it's the same as people who misguidedly believe that the internet has killed CD sales. If the content is good, real fans will go and buy the product regardless .
SERGIO!!!!
yeah... some of the newer mags might have a chance. The new muscle magazine, www.kagedMuscle.com, they focus a lot upon the training/nutrition/other aspects of the sport. Articles and training sessions with Dorian Yates and Lenda Murray... kinda geared toward people who respect the sport's hardworking legends, not starry-eyed kids who wanna be Mr Olympia.
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if you want Real numbers on ad sales revenue and pages, go here
http://www.magazine.org/Advertising_and_PIB/PIB_Revenue_and_Pages/Revenue___Pages_by_Magazine_Titles__YTD_/19917.cfm
which is public information
you can't believe everything IndustryInsider says, you'll notice that M&F actually has the highest growth of the entire Fitness/Bodybuilding category at 24% revenue growth and 17% page growth respectively for Jan-Nov 2006 vs 2005...not exactly in trouble. I wonder what magazine Insider has an affiliation with? since the majority of their posts are blatant made up bashes on Weider titles, or very selective reworked numbers (one specific month where there may be a decrease without the whole picture showing very drastic increases).
Seems like a personal agenda to trash our titles in the majority of his/her posts, it's getting pretty old when you chime in every few months to post useless numbers.
Flex info isn't on the site, but M&F should be enough to show that the #'s quoted are taken out of context without an overall industry evaluation as well.
Now is this really something you need to rehash every few months Insider?...people will buy whichever magazine they feel like without any of this crap.
C
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Amazing...looks like a 17% INCREASE.
Just as I stated...this "insider" gets his numbers from Uranus.
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Contrary to what some may think, bodybuilding is getting more popular within the 18-50 yr age group.
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Bob,
First you try to cover up and then you blatantly lie? Wow. Well for everyone’s edification, including Scribblers’, first I did not mention M & F in my original post, my topic was regarding AMI and the slump that Flex magazine is in. Go back to post 1 if you need a refresher. Second, I have posted here before and whenever I do post something factual that I have learned, it is supported by the name of my source…Credible information from the most reliable resources. To accuse me of doing otherwise is foolish Bob. It is you who are here deceiving the members of the board with your false posts and accusations, not I.
My sources for my original posts as requested. You may now stick this in Uranus Bob.
(http://i14.tinypic.com/497w6yr.jpg)
http://i14.tinypic.com/497w6yr.jpg
(http://i13.tinypic.com/2ujnqjn.jpg)
http://i13.tinypic.com/2ujnqjn.jpg
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In your 2nd post you say that M&F is down 9.6% in ad pages...do you even remember what you post anymore?
What I have said is that it is meaningless to simply post any numbers without the context they are in...how the industry as a whole is doing, or how even magazines in general are doing. Also, if you are who I think you are, you would also know that circulation is not the only number that drives a magazines success...and in fact is not the main factor in some business models. You must also take into account the issues printed, newsstand sell through, ad pages, cost per page etc etc. Not to mention that the total circ number is still pretty impressive for this market.
The magazines are extremely profitable and that is why AMI is keeping them, and that won't change no matter what negative numbers you insist on propogating the boards with everytime you see your chance. I don't know what the goal of this is, but the fact that you posted on almost every message board out there means someone must be pretty desperate to make FLEX look bad...I wonder why that would be?
Like I said before, people will buy the magazine they choose to buy for themselves, this useless banter about things most people don't care about won't change that.
Let's let this crap go please...we've been through it all before-if you want to attack us, at least come up with something original. But it would be great if you would just stop all together...or at least post under your real name so people can see how petty you are.
C
PS and yes, I am scribbler on here, but I don't try to hide who I am, and I won't make negative comments about the other mags on any of the boards whether they are warranted or not
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If you really want som fair comparison...lets see the numbers of the other magazines in the industry.
Oh, that's right...none of the other mags choose to have their numbers audited...how convieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee nient.
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If you really want som fair comparison...lets see the numbers of the other magazines in the industry.
Oh, that's right...none of the other mags choose to have their numbers audited...how convieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee nient.
When you said "Amazing...looks like a 17% INCREASE." - were you talking about Flex vs. Flex, or Flex vs. MD?
Cause if you meant Flex (then) vs. Flex (now), the bashing of MD's sales as a defense for your statement is called a 'red herring'. You deflect the task of backing up your claims against Insider's newspaper scans by making an attack which has nothing to with the conversation.
I have no dog in this fight, I just hate it when someone abuses a sexy number...
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When you said "Amazing...looks like a 17% INCREASE." - were you talking about Flex vs. Flex, or Flex vs. MD?
Cause if you meant Flex (then) vs. Flex (now), the bashing of MD's sales as a defense for your statement is called a 'red herring'. You deflect the task of backing up your claims against Insider's newspaper scans by making an attack which has nothing to with the conversation.
I have no dog in this fight, I just hate it when someone abuses a sexy number...
the 17% was M&F's increase in ad pages over the last year
nothing to do with FLEX...noone was deflecting anything-we don't mention the other mags sales
C
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nothing to do with FLEX...noone was deflecting anything-we don't mention the other mags sales
Ah, okay. But when people on your team say things like this, it looks more like an attack on MD than a trumpeted announcement of Flex's successes. IMO, mentioning/insulting competitors only legitimizes them as a threat. :)
If you really want som fair comparison...lets see the numbers of the other magazines in the industry.
Oh, that's right...none of the other mags choose to have their numbers audited...how convieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee nient.
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If you really want som fair comparison...lets see the numbers of the other magazines in the industry.
Oh, that's right...none of the other mags choose to have their numbers audited...how convieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee nient.
The point is that Flex is not for sale according to this report. Which is the opposite of what you stated earlier in this thread. MD is not the topic here.
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The point is that Flex is not for sale according to this report. Which is the opposite of what you stated earlier in this thread. MD is not the topic here.
Bob didn't even mention any specific titles of other mags here, or said that FLEX was or wasn't for sale.
Let's not turn this into another FLEX vs MD thread.
He stated that the reason that FLEX and M&F aren't for sale anymore is that it IS profitable and not the opposite that was stated as the reason.
He was just making a point that it is easier to target our magazines as they are publicly audited each month to provide our advertisers with current circ numbers, unlike some of the other magazines in the category. This isn't to change the subject or point out other magazines, it is simply a statement of fact. My previous post explained how numbers can be twisted to give a different view when taken out of context with all of the facts.
Aside from all of that, I don't understand why these random numbers are continuosly quoted by IndustryInsider...would any of you stop buying a magazine because it sold a few less issues then the year before?
probably not-you would stop buying a magazines if you felt that it wasn't what you wanted anymore, so this negative campaign by II every few months seems pretty futile
BTW from your post in March of this year for the last half of 2005, you state that Flex newstand sales were
"Single Copies (%) (Newsstand Sales)
70,529 (-7.3%)
This is not a sign of poor customer service, producing a withering product editorially is most likely the culprit for the decline in sales here."
with a nice little unbiased comment thrown in there...however, in this thread you now state that Flex's newsstand sales are
"Single copy Sales (Newsstand) – 72,415 Down 15.4% from the prior year."
Correct me if I'm wrong...but last I checked 72,415 was a BIGGER number than 70,529 and certainly not 15.4% less...it is in fact 3% higher...and that is from your own posts over the last year.
Again, why don't you post under your real name and stop with this negative PR campaign...
like it or not, FLEX is going to continue to try and show our sport/industry in a positive light so that maybe we can bring in some new people and generate new interest overall.
C
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scribbs,
good analysis and breakdown.
I also agree that this "Insider" stuff gets lamer by the week. people are so afraid of pissing off those in the industry that they never put their credibility on the line to really accomplish anything. Insider, you lack consistency and credibility by remaining anonymous. Get your stars already, and your past accomplishments will force those aligned with you to take a position or remain quiet, the silence showing they don't disagree.
Come on, this is Message Board PsyOps 101 here...