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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 05:08:35 PM

Title: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 05:08:35 PM
200 Pages of pure informative ads... real hardcore and no bull!!!!!


Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Rockhead on December 29, 2006, 05:13:47 PM
Yeah I've got that issue, I passed on buying Jan the other day because I didn't want to pay 7 bucks for half a magazine.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 05:17:23 PM
More ads put more money in the hands of bodybuilding contests which goes directly to bodybuilders and gives us more editorial content.  Ads support the magazines more than subscription sales.  To be honest, I don't personally mind them.  Just my opinion, and I know I will be in the minority here.

Maybe they can finance the mag due to ads and give it to us for free?
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Bluto on December 29, 2006, 05:21:49 PM
I bet Stark wouldn't complain it that was 200 pages of gay4pay ads  ::)
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 05:38:54 PM
I bet Stark wouldn't complain it that was 200 pages of gay4pay ads  ::)

Trying to advertise your service here bluto?
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Bluto on December 29, 2006, 05:40:11 PM
Trying to advertise your service here bluto?

Keep dreaming pal
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 05:41:03 PM
Keep dreaming pal

nighmare bluto nightmares without calves
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: MisterMagoo on December 29, 2006, 05:42:15 PM
I thought of that myself and I imagine if it was the case they would do it.  I think at the very least they need to get back their production costs (printing for example), but otherwise, it is not necessary for them to charge much at all to still profit.  The money is in the ads.

but that only works if people buy the products in the ads. if no one buys the products, the companies don't pay for the ads, the magazine goes ass-up and the athletes get canned.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 05:44:46 PM
but that only works if people buy the products in the ads. if no one buys the products, the companies don't pay for the ads, the magazine goes ass-up and the athletes get canned.

well....they are either way in the mag...maybe if Steve would pass the next chance he could get himself a pink Ferrari
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: danielson on December 29, 2006, 06:11:36 PM
Doesn't anyone care that they blatantly lied about promoting a fight between TA and DA just for attention? I think they are fucking liars and will never support them again >:(
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Slick Vic on December 29, 2006, 07:09:40 PM
Thank you, Stark!!! I rest my case.  ;D
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 07:17:31 PM
Thank you, Stark!!! I rest my case.  ;D

HAH you're welcome
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: gordiano on December 29, 2006, 07:24:47 PM
More ads put more money in the hands of bodybuilding contests which goes directly to bodybuilders and gives us more editorial content.  Ads support the magazines more than subscription sales.  To be honest, I don't personally mind them.  Just my opinion, and I know I will be in the minority here.

Right.

I have no problems with ads themselves, as I understand the need for them to be there.


That said, just don't insult my intelligence and tell me your mag is 400+ pages and "the biggest bbing mag EVER", when hal the fucker is ads....
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: nycbull on December 29, 2006, 07:30:33 PM
Very good thread here. It is important to let these magazines know we aware of  theircommercial assault on our sensibilities.  To know that we are being fed 200 pages of ads in the space of a magazine is sheer commercial crassness. Do they think we are robotic consumers?.   Stark, I think you are on to something here. Keep the ad counts coming each month. It would be interesting to know what they are getting away with.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: gordiano on December 29, 2006, 07:34:07 PM
gordiano - maybe Steve should have said it was the biggest supplement catalog ever?  ;D

Yep. I would have respected that.


Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 29, 2006, 07:34:15 PM
Very good thread here. It is important to let these magazines know we aware of  theircommercial assault on our sensibilities.  To know that we are being fed 200 pages of ads in the space of a magazine is sheer commercial crassness. Do they think we are robotic consumers?.   Stark, I think you are on to something here. Keep the ad counts coming each month. It would be interesting to know what they are getting away with.

Don't worry I plan to fill my day tommorow to count all ads in all MD's I have and somehow with the help of my computer make this all sound dramatic and totaly unbelievable....

Don't miss out it's going to be a ride...
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: timfogarty on December 29, 2006, 08:22:16 PM
for comparison, I pulled out two old MDs at random:   October 1989, and September 1972.

October 1989, glue binding (like today), total 101 pages, of which 32 are ads, 32%

September 1972, staple binding, 72 total pages, 21 pages of ads, 29%
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Cap on December 29, 2006, 08:24:31 PM
200 Pages of pure informative ads... real hardcore and no bull!!!!!



That is how they stay in business.  With some of the crap that they put in there, they need something to keep them afloat.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: thisiskeith12 on December 29, 2006, 08:42:27 PM
If you can ignore the ads, the magazines aren't too bad today Tim.  Granted, you can get all the information online, but I find it's nice to have magazines around to read.  Buying some old mags is definitely on my to do list though.

Here is a question: how does MD's ad content compare with the other major bodybuilding magazines today?

I think the main point behind this is that they claim to have the "BIGGEST ISSUE EVER!!! 460 pages!!" when there's 200 full page ads. Kind of a hype hype hype deal.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: timfogarty on December 29, 2006, 09:01:58 PM
Would 260 pages of editorial content still be considered the biggest though?

can you write 260 pages on bodybuilding month in and month out?   I couldn't read it, that's for sure.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: thisiskeith12 on December 29, 2006, 09:15:58 PM
Would 260 pages of editorial content still be considered the biggest though?

Not as big as this misleading statement : "460 PAGES! OUR BIGGEST ISSUE EVER!"
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: thisiskeith12 on December 29, 2006, 09:26:14 PM
Yes, I absolutely agree that MD was being misleading, but aside from that, would 260 pages still merit acclaim of any kind?

Think of the whole issue rather than trying to win the debate.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: thisiskeith12 on December 29, 2006, 09:38:09 PM
???

Win what "debate"?  We're having a discussion here are we not?  I already conceded your point and furthered the discussion by posing a separate question.  You make it sound like this topic needs to be addressed in one narrow manner.  The topic brings up other issues open for discussion.

The point of this thread is that the magazine misleads people. You seemed like you weren't seeing that. My apologiez sir.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: thisiskeith12 on December 29, 2006, 09:46:39 PM
Every advertiser should just save their money and advertise with Sirius Satellite Radio! :D
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: MisterMagoo on December 29, 2006, 10:06:25 PM
The point of this thread is that the magazine misleads people. You seemed like you weren't seeing that. My apologiez sir.

what magazine doesn't mislead people? MD is less misleading than most, at least they tell you that they're on drugs and you won't be able to do what they do. the ads? shaddap, ads for everything are misleading to sell their products.

i love it. people complain that a big magazine of just content would be boring, they complain it's repetitive, they complain there are too many ads. they complain that they cost too much. then they complain that they don't give certain pros cover shots (on the magazines you won't buy anyway). i'm glad i don't have a career in bodybuilding coverage, i wouldn't make a dime.  :P

so we won't buy the products because they don't work and we don't like their misleading ads. we won't buy the magazines because of the ads in them. we won't buy the videos the pros release because they're too expensive. we won't buy tickets to a show because it's a waste of money.

i'm curious as to where the ifbb (and the emerging pdi) are supposed to make their money.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Rimbaud on December 30, 2006, 02:48:05 AM
Doesn't anyone care that they blatantly lied about promoting a fight between TA and DA just for attention? I think they are fucking liars and will never support them again >:(

Is this a surprize to you that they lied? Did you really think there would be a fight? I never really supported them in the first place.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Bluto on December 30, 2006, 03:47:04 AM
if they say its 460 pages and it is 460 pages then where's the lie? thats right nowhere.
move on.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: IFBBwannaB on December 30, 2006, 04:03:49 AM
More ads put more money in the hands of bodybuilding contests which goes directly to bodybuilders and gives us more editorial content.  Ads support the magazines more than subscription sales.  To be honest, I don't personally mind them.  Just my opinion, and I know I will be in the minority here.

Wrong.Not to mention that the % of ads compared to content (which is already lame) keeps getting even worse.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Below Me on December 30, 2006, 04:23:51 AM
Where is the MD response to this thread!
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Stark on December 30, 2006, 04:24:26 AM
Where is the MD response to this thread!

Like they give a fuck
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Bluto on December 30, 2006, 04:28:30 AM
response to what? what was the question?
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: timfogarty on December 30, 2006, 05:13:25 PM
if they say its 460 pages and it is 460 pages then where's the lie?

it's not that he lied.  it's that he thinks 460 pages is something to be proud of.   I'd be much more likely to buy a mag of 120 pages of quality content than 460 pages of filler.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: MisterMagoo on December 30, 2006, 05:20:17 PM
it's not that he lied.  it's that he thinks 460 pages is something to be proud of.   I'd be much more likely to buy a mag of 120 pages of quality content than 460 pages of filler.

i'd be willing to bet that magazine would cost a lot more, though.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: timfogarty on December 30, 2006, 06:25:37 PM
i'd be willing to bet that magazine would cost a lot more, though.

Time, Newsweek, etc., are able to publish a magazine weekly without 200 pages of ads.  And they pay their reporters much more than do bodybuilding mags.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: bmacsys on December 30, 2006, 06:27:09 PM
More ads put more money in the hands of bodybuilding contests which goes directly to bodybuilders and gives us more editorial content.  Ads support the magazines more than subscription sales.  To be honest, I don't personally mind them.  Just my opinion, and I know I will be in the minority here.

"More ads put more money in the hands of bodybuilding contests which goes directly to bodybuilders"

Matt, were you born yesterday? :)
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: bmacsys on December 30, 2006, 06:28:32 PM
Does that count the "articles" that are just ads in disguise?
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: gordiano on December 30, 2006, 06:45:43 PM
it's not that he lied.  it's that he thinks 460 pages is something to be proud of.   I'd be much more likely to buy a mag of 120 pages of quality content than 460 pages of filler.

Right.


Quality counts.


So let's say 200+ pages are content, every month we get:


Dexter telling me he's an athlete, and how Met-Rx is the only supp. he's ever used.....

Gustavo Badell, telling me he's "hun-gree" and "nachu-ral".

Dave Henry telling me he's the worlds tallest midget....

Flex wheeler's delusional "battle" recaps....

Valentino's pointless rants.......piggy this, credit card that....

Hany Rimbod's love affair with his black "athletes".

Dave Palumbo's convict picture collection....

John Romano telling me he's got the greatest boss, and no, he's not gay. Really, he's not. He just plays one in real life.....

Chris Cormier's latest baby-mama-drama.....

Ron Harris' 12 month review spectacular, of Ronnie's video.......

Flex's interviews, where he always has to bring himself into the conversation........



*yawn*

Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: gordiano on December 30, 2006, 06:57:55 PM
I'd rather drop some lime juice in my eyes, than read that shit.


I love the one where Doherty repeats every FUCKING THING Ronnie says, and then Ron Harris has to add his own fucking three cents......


It's like a bad three stooges episode that never ends.......
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: timfogarty on December 30, 2006, 07:16:20 PM
More ads put more money in the hands of bodybuilding contests which goes directly to bodybuilding promoters

fixed
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: bmacsys on December 30, 2006, 07:20:50 PM
Economics is my strong suit, so if you want to discuss this, I will be up for that.  I know more about economics than I do in any of my university accredations.

What does this have to do with your math degrees? This has to do with very little to none of the money being made filtering back down to the bodybuilders.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: bmacsys on December 30, 2006, 07:26:32 PM
fixed

Thats more like it Tim.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Karl Kox on December 30, 2006, 11:46:49 PM
how many adds was it can't see anything
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: 240 is Back on December 31, 2006, 12:07:05 AM
Economics is my strong suit, so if you want to discuss this, I will be up for that.  I know more about economics than I do in any of my university accredations.

break it down for us.

For the sake of argument, I contend that the owners of a muscle magazine see writing and photog staff (whether it be bodybuilders, experts, or schmoes) to be a FIXED cost.  That is, it will cost $200k per year, let's say.

Printing is a fixed cost for the typical fixed run, let's say 100,000 issues for simplicity's sake.  yes, variable kicks in with each add'l issue, but let's keep it simple. 

Their variable costs would be advertising their mag (they will buy more or less based upon analysis of needs, ability, and opportunities).

Now, if our mag sells 100 pages of ads, pays all its operating costs, it ends up with 100k profits.  If it sells 200 pages of ads, spends a little more on printing, but ends up with $185k in profits.

What motivation does our magazine, a nice tidy little short-term moneymaker for the owner (since the internet, politics and competitors are nipping at its ankles)... what motivation does the owner have to pay more to writers?  he has a nice staff (10 IFBB pros, let's say) and hiring 20 would be overkill. 

How does "plus some of the money does eventually go to the pros."?

most of mag printing is fixed cost, with limited variables.  I contend that using 100 pages of ads, or 200 pages, the athletes wouldn't necessarily see an extra penny. Thoughts?
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: gordiano on January 01, 2007, 11:42:45 AM
LOL!!!

In short, bodybuilding is the same as any other free market activity.  It seems like some on here think it is a socialist commune or something.  Bodybuilders will get exactly what their market value entitles them to get, and with more money in bodybuilder, whether in the magazines or any other segment of the industry, more money will eventually trickle down to the bodybuilders should their market value entitle them to it.

In short, bodybuilders don't have much market value
.

Say what? These are "pro athletes". They should be on the Wheaties Box, selling me Cialis, or Batteries..........





HAHAHAHAHAHA!
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: Alex Velickovic on January 01, 2007, 11:50:43 AM
Kaged Muscle the new mag by Chris Gethin is worth buying and reading.
Title: Re: OK!!!! I counted Decembers Muscle Development ads....
Post by: hifrommike on January 01, 2007, 11:57:48 AM
Bodybuilding is commerce at the magazine level. It's politics at the competition level.  & it's training & fandom at the individual level.  Very few people make a career from bodybuilding competition. They make careers on the fringes of it, doing personal training or gym managing, appearing in expo booths, or on the underside--hustling or pushing.  

The broadcast media, & the print media, have been completely taken over by companies advertising their products. It's hard to tell the difference between ads & magazine copy, from TIME to MD. In MD, you see product placement in clothes being worn (the "House of Pain" clothes on featured BBs).  The primary purpose of these magazines is to sell us stuff.  That's what keeps the magazine in business.  Whatever else they do is a sideline.  It's true of ALL widely distributed mags in or out of the BB field, not just MD.