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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Cap on February 12, 2007, 05:33:08 PM
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So what happened to 1984 Beirut, 1993 WTC and 2000 USS Cole? Was Bush reincarnated? Does he have magic powers?
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So what happened to 1984 Beirut, 1993 WTC and 2000 USS Cole? Was Bush reincarnated? Does he have magic powers?
Good thread, Cap.
Islam has a problem far deeper than the Bush family, I'm affraid.
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What's the subject here: Terrorism or Islam. They're not the same.
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What's the subject here: Terrorism or Islam. They're not the same.
Once again, read.
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What's the subject here: Terrorism or Islam. They're not the same.
It's a fact the vast majority of terrorists are Islamic. Until this is not the case, they will be discussed hand in hand.
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So what happened to 1984 Beirut, 1993 WTC and 2000 USS Cole? Was Bush reincarnated? Does he have magic powers?
lol. Depends on who you ask. Some nuts believe the 1993 WTC was a conspiracy/inside job. ::) But you make great points. Our Marines were slaughtered in Beirut by terrorists. Same with our sailors in 2000.
Kind of hard to create terrorists in 2002 when they were attacking us in 1984.
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lol. Depends on who you ask. Some nuts believe the 1993 WTC was a conspiracy/inside job. ::) But you make great points. Our Marines were slaughtered in Beirut by terrorists. Same with our sailors in 2000.
Kind of hard to create terrorists in 2002 when they were attacking us in 1984.
You've got it wrong, we were attacking us. Uh, I think that's it, anyway.
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It's a fact the vast majority of terrorists are Islamic. Until this is not the case, they will be discussed hand in hand.
I forgot. The ones raping nuns and killing children in South America were named "Freedom Fighters",
just as they were during the 80's in Afghanistan when on the CIA payroll. The Panamanian ones are simply called 'drug dealers', and the israeli ones are called 'Friends'.
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I forgot. The ones raping nuns and killing children in South America were named "Freedom Fighters",
just as they were during the 80's in Afghanistan when on the CIA payroll. The Panamanian ones are simply called 'drug dealers', and the israeli ones are called 'Friends'.
Speaking of America haters. . . .
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terrorism was around long before Bush, DAH!
I don;t think it's as much of a threat as it's promoted as.
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I forgot. The ones raping nuns and killing children in South America were named "Freedom Fighters",
just as they were during the 80's in Afghanistan when on the CIA payroll. The Panamanian ones are simply called 'drug dealers', and the israeli ones are called 'Friends'.
What? Do you actually disagree with my statement? I'll say it again:
Most terrorists are Islamic.
Try and deal with it.
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So what happened to 1984 Beirut, 1993 WTC and 2000 USS Cole? Was Bush reincarnated? Does he have magic powers?
Carefully study my topic on Iran, bub.
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Carefully study my topic on Iran, bub.
Okay...
On topic, terrorists need to be wiped out but it will never happen. Let's just off as many as possible.
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Okay...
On topic, terrorists need to be wiped out but it will never happen. Let's just off as many as possible.
They wont be wiped out anytime soon, as the US considers Saudia Arabia and Pakistan close allies.
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They wont be wiped out anytime soon, as the US considers Saudia Arabia and Pakistan close allies.
And Israel.
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And Israel.
Israel? Why shouldn't we?
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Israel? Why shouldn't we?
We give them billions. Hell, America has built Israel from the ground up. When you do that, you support Palestinians being subject to apartheid in their own land.
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So what happened to 1984 Beirut, 1993 WTC and 2000 USS Cole? Was Bush reincarnated? Does he have magic powers?
...........the 72' Olympics
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We give them billions. Hell, America has built Israel from the ground up. When you do that, you support Palestinians being subject to apartheid in their own land.
Israel belongs to the Israelis. They have a right to live, despite what you may think.
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Israel belongs to the Israelis. They have a right to live, despite what you may think.
Of course they do, but you have to admit the British creation of Israel was one of the worst decisions ever. Yeah, put a bunch of eastern europeans in semetic land that is literally the stuff of legend and early human history.
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...........the 72' Olympics
Ah yes. Good assist Joe.
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It started in the early 60's and 70's, thanks to certain actions by the US.
Read my post on Iran if you have enough intellectual horsepower and it'll help to show you why we're faced with this threat.
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Of course they do, but you have to admit the British creation of Israel was one of the worst decisions ever. Yeah, put a bunch of eastern europeans in semetic land that is literally the stuff of legend and early human history.
Where would you have put them? Back in Germany?
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Where would you have put them? Back in Germany?
Exactly. Better at the expense of the people responsible and not the people who've inhabited a certain area for over several millenia.
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Exactly. Better at the expense of the people responsible and not the people who've inhabited a certain area for over several millenia.
Erm, okay.
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Erm, okay.
Do they play dodge ball in the land down under?
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Do they play dodge ball in the land down under?
We play AFL:
http://afl.com.au
It would crush you ;)
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It's a fact the vast majority of terrorists are Islamic. Until this is not the case, they will be discussed hand in hand.
That is not a fact.
-Hedge
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That is not a fact.
-Hedge
Sure seems that way.
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Sure seems that way.
Seems like you should back it up with stats then.
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Seems like you should back it up with stats then.
Seems like you should just be quiet already. ::)
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Seems like you should just be quiet already. ::)
In other words, you can't back it up, just like you couldn't back up your claim I was wrong that the majority of Iraqis want us out.
It's hilarious - now that your neocon wet dream is starting to collapse, suddenly every poll or stat is 'hogwash'.
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So what happened to 1984 Beirut, 1993 WTC and 2000 USS Cole? Was Bush reincarnated? Does he have magic powers?
here's what Jag stated on the thread i started
Bush didn't confront terrorists. Bush toppled the sovereign nation of Iraq and gave birth to terrorists.
He provided justification for their cause, and validated them in the minds of many wouldbe terrorists.
He spread the seeds for terrorism, as well as hatred and distrust towards America, and watered and fertilized them well. Now everyone is stuck dealing with the weeds that have sprung up.
unbelievable
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here's what Jag stated on the thread i started
unbelievable
Bush's blunder in Iraq allow terrorism to flourish in iraq where it was tiny beofre the war.
He didn't give birth to them.
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Bush's blunder in Iraq allow terrorism to flourish in iraq where it was tiny beofre the war.
He didn't give birth to them.
Bush did facilitate terrorist growth in Iraq, this is undeniable. Two reasons:
1) Saddam had a set of controls in place so that anytime three people got together, saddam got a memo and they got questioned. None of this roving death squad shit. No civil fighting. Everyone was so scared of saddam they didn't start shit. They respected the law, incredibly. Do they respect it now?
2) There were no jihadist targets in iraq before 2002. There are 130,000 now. :(
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Of course they do, but you have to admit the British creation of Israel was one of the worst decisions ever. Yeah, put a bunch of eastern europeans in semetic land that is literally the stuff of legend and early human history.
Early human history that they were a part of, bright spot. Last time the Palestinians controlled Jersualem, you couldn't walk around in it without getting shot. I forget that you're a sand nig, camel jockey. ::)
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In other words, you can't back it up, just like you couldn't back up your claim I was wrong that the majority of Iraqis want us out.
It's hilarious - now that your neocon wet dream is starting to collapse, suddenly every poll or stat is 'hogwash'.
::)
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Bush's blunder in Iraq allow terrorism to flourish in iraq where it was tiny beofre the war.
He didn't give birth to them.
Not necessarily. I remember reading that Saddam was providing financial rewards to the families of suicide bombers in Israel.
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Not necessarily. I remember reading that Saddam was providing financial rewards to the families of suicide bombers in Israel.
Every one who did was given $25,000.
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Early human history that they were a part of, bright spot. Last time the Palestinians controlled Jersualem, you couldn't walk around in it without getting shot. I forget that you're a sand nig, camel jockey. ::)
I'm not even from the middle east. You can't even argue the point at hand so you resort to racial slurs, which just makes you look bad. Maybe my opinions hit home? Are you jewish? If so, I don't have anything against you or the nation of Israel. Even people like Hedge have come out and said this, so is he a sand guy too?
I was just trying to make you understand the consequences of the creation of Israel. I'm not saying Israel doesn't have right to exist, or anything of that nature. Most Israelis now were born there and have every right to their country. Maybe my opinions hit home? Are you jewish? If so, I don't have anything against you or the nation of Israel.
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Every one who did was given $25,000.
Sounds like sponsoring terrorism to me.
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Sounds like sponsoring terrorism to me.
That's the first time i've heard that about 25K. Was it a PR thing? was it real? I'm sure you have some links.
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That's the first time i've heard that about 25K. Was it a PR thing? was it real? I'm sure you have some links.
Oil-for-food
funded terror
U.S. to reveal tomorrow Saddam used U.N. to aid suicide bombers
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Posted: November 16, 2004
6:36 p.m. Eastern
By Aaron Klein
© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com
A U.S. congressional committee will reveal tomorrow that money taken by deposed Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein from the U.N. oil-for-food program was used as reward payments to families of Palestinian suicide bombers, WorldNetDaily has learned.
The committee, led by Rep. Henry Hyde, R-Ill., chairman of the House Committee on International Affairs, will reveal tomorrow that some of the $10 billion Saddam allegedly forced contractors to kick back from the oil-for-food program between 1997 and 2002 was used to fund families of Palestinians suicide bombers.
Israel has said the aid received from Saddam provided major financial motivation to underprivileged teenagers who could help their cash-strapped families with the large payments that would be issued upon completion of a suicide mission.
The U.N. Security Council launched the oil-for-food program in 1996 so Iraq could raise funds for food, medicine and other humanitarian goods in spite of sanctions against the Saddam regime.
Iraq sold more than $67 billion worth of oil before the program was ended by the U.S. invasion last year.
According to the rules outlined by the Security Council, Iraq was allowed to choose its own suppliers and oil traders. Under the program, the Security Council established a separate committee made up of member states, the so-called "661 Committee," to approve all contracts issued by the Iraqi government.
The General Accounting Office, the auditing arm of the U.S. Congress, reported Hussein illegally diverted and sold goods intended for the Iraqi population.
Sources tell WorldNetDaily Hyde will detail the methods used by Saddam to funnel some of the money from the proceeds to fund Palestinian terrorism against Israelis. A U.S. official said the money was wired to an account in the Rafaidan Bank of Jordan then transferred to the personal account of Iraq's ambassador to Jordan, who would then have the money delivered to the Palestinians.
As WorldNetDaily reported, remnants of Saddam's regime may still be funding terrorism against Israel by continuing the payments to families of Palestinian suicide bombers the dictator previously provided, according to a document recently seized in Iraq and obtained by WorldNetDaily .
The document, discovered by a U.S. military unit on the body of an Iraqi combatant in Northern Iraq in September, is a general "Certificate of Martyrdom" honoring a family member who carries out a suicide attack against Israelis. It was provided to WorldNetDaily by an American military source in Iraq.
Unlike documents Saddam issued while in power, the new certificate refers to the former Iraqi leader as a "Freedom Fighter" and is not signed by Saddam himself, but by the "Iraq Sector Command," a reference not previously used in such certificates, indicating that post-Saddam militants may be seeking to fund Palestinian terrorism.
Military analysts experienced in Iraqi affairs told WorldNetDaily the document appears indeed to be post-Saddam, although it is unclear whether it was printed while Saddam went into hiding or after he was captured in December 2003.
While in power, Saddam paid the families of Palestinian suicide bombers as much as $25,000 each. The checks were thought to provide major financial motivation to underprivileged teenagers who could help their cash-strapped families with the payments that would be issued upon completion of a suicide mission.
According to documents captured in 2002 by Israel's Operation Defensive Shield, Saddam set up an "Arab Liberation Front" – a Ba'ath party department in the Palestinian areas used to encourage terrorism and issue checks, usually through the Palestine Investment Bank, to the families of suicide bombers.
The payments were $15,000 at the start of the intifada, and were later raised to $25,000.
Saddam would also issue checks of $10,000 to the families of "ordinary" Palestinians killed in the intifada by other means, such as "through the aggression of the Zionist army."
Along with the checks came the martyrdom certificates, signed by Saddam, that read: "A gift from President Saddam Hussein to the family of a martyr in the al-Aqsa intifada. To those who irrigate the land with their blood. You deserve the honor you will receive from Allah and you will defeat all who bow before your will."
A $25,000 check and martyrdom certificate, for example, was transferred June 23, 2002, to Khaldiya Isma'il Abd Al-Aziz Al-Hurani, mother of the Hamas terrorist Fuad Isma'il Ahmad Al-Hurani, who carried out a suicide attack on March 19 of that year in Jerusalem's Moment Cafe. Eleven Israelis were killed and 16 wounded in the attack.
Checks for $15,000 each were given along with the martyrdom certificates to the families of Hamas suicide terrorists who blew themselves up in Zion Square in Jerusalem Dec. 1, 2001.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41487
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I'm not even from the middle east. You can't even argue the point at hand so you resort to racial slurs, which just makes you look bad. Maybe my opinions hit home? Are you jewish? If so, I don't have anything against you or the nation of Israel. Even people like Hedge have come out and said this, so is he a sand guy too?
I was just trying to make you understand the consequences of the creation of Israel. I'm not saying Israel doesn't have right to exist, or anything of that nature. Most Israelis now were born there and have every right to their country. Maybe my opinions hit home? Are you jewish? If so, I don't have anything against you or the nation of Israel.
I'm not Jewish but it's just going to show you don't know much about early world history if you don't think the Jews have a claim to that land.
Beachbum, 240 is probably going to claim that article was written by some corrupt NYT reporter and that there's no proof to it.
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Not necessarily. I remember reading that Saddam was providing financial rewards to the families of suicide bombers in Israel.
And this is the same thug that was once our ally and to whom we gave weapons. :-X
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That is not a fact.
-Hedge
AAhhhh, when was the last time you heard of a Christian blowing themselves and other up??
Show me where it's not a fact....and don't go to some conspriacy site to get becuase that will just blow your credibility all to hell!
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I'm not Jewish but it's just going to show you don't know much about early world history if you don't think the Jews have a claim to that land.
I didn't say they didn't, genius. Most of the people that relocated there were of eastern european descent and had little racial connection to the early Israelites. The Palestian people could have been jewish at one time too, but they were converted to Islam in the late 7th century AD. A jewish state could have been created anywhere in europe, but I guess they want to give up their land, so they just created a state on one of their colonies. And I guess they had every right to do so because England gained control of Palestine after WWI, and to the victor goes and spoils of war.
You don't understand me, as I never said that they don't have a claim to that land. I said creating Israel has caused a lot of problems. Try and understand that.
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Thanks, BB.
Very interesting.
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Oil-for-food
funded terror
U.S. to reveal tomorrow Saddam used U.N. to aid suicide bombers
good post beach.
but i think it's moot, they will still defend saddam and terrorists
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Ok, title of this thread...who are the "some" that believe Bush started terrorism?
You must have some specific people in mind and stats to back it up.
Who are the "They" that defend Sadaam and terrorism?
Do they post on this board? If so, name names and proof to back it up.
Just because people have differing opinions means just that. It doesn't automatically make them Bush haters and terrorist lovers.
Open your ears as well as your minds. This is specifically to cap86 if you really believe people posting on this forum think terrorism started with Bush.
Also, specifically to Mighty mouse 72 if you really believe people posting here are supporters of sadaam and terrorism.
Sandra
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Just because people have differing opinions means just that. It doesn't automatically make them Bush haters and terrorist lovers.
Open your ears as well as your minds. This is specifically to cap86 if you really believe people posting on this forum think terrorism started with Bush.
Also, specifically to Mighty mouse 72 if you really believe people posting here are supporters of sadaam and terrorism.
Sandra
Good post, Sandra. I'm so sick of all the "You love terrorists" or "You hate America" bs. Just because you have a difference in opinion doesn't mean you hate your country and support the enemy. I think people make up lables because they can't argue a point.
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good post beach.
but i think it's moot, they will still defend saddam and terrorists
get off it, MM72, libs and anyone who cirtisizes the war ARE NOT DEFENDing saddam!!!!!! They are attacking the IDIOT (bush) who started the war that has COST us and HAS NOT help curb terrorism but INSTAED helped it grow!!
This shit in unbelievalbe what people let themselves believe when it comes to reps and dems!
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That is not a fact.
-Hedge
Yes, it is - Hedge. And the fact you won't admit it is frightening, but typical of the European 'approach' to dealing with terrorism.
Here's a little something for your perusal, let me know if you can find a list from another religion that outstrips it:
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks (http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks)
And that's just the last three months!
Until you and I can both agree Islam has a problem adapting to the new world (to put it very lightly), we're both going to have a problem doing something about it.
I'll say it again, so we can get serious - rather than letting our Political Correctness stop us from speaking the truth.
Most terrorists are Islamic.
Got it yet?
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Yes, it is - Hedge. And the fact you won't admit it is frightening, but typical of the European 'approach' to dealing with terrorism.
Here's a little something for your perusal, let me know if you can find a list from another religion that outstrips it:
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks (http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks)
And that's just the last three months!
Until you and I can both agree Islam has a problem adapting to the new world (to put it very lightly), we're both going to have a problem doing something about it.
I'll say it again, so we can get serious - rather than letting our Political Correctness stop us from speaking the truth.
Most terrorists are Islamic.
Got it yet?
I agree with much of this BRUCE.
But i believe Violent Radical Islam thrives in the fertle ground of a 3rd world culture and country. Modern Muslims, at least in the USA are more practical about what they believe. I have many friends who are muslim and are just like any other christain on friday night at a bar. I realize that may not be the case in England as i've read some stupid stuff that's going on there, but it's somewhat englands fault for allowing it to happen. that kind of crap wouldn't be tolerated here in the USA. How is it in Aussy?
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I agree with much of this BRUCE.
But i believe Violent Radical Islam thrives in the fertle ground of a 3rd world culture and country. Modern Muslims, at least in the USA are more practical about what they believe. I have many friends who are muslim and are just like any other christain on friday night at a bar. I realize that may not be the case in England as i've read some stupid stuff that's going on there, but it's somewhat englands fault for allowing it to happen. that kind of crap wouldn't be tolerated here in the USA. How is it in Aussy?
Thanks, Ozmo. As if I haven't gone on about this enough already, Mark Steyn's excellent new book America Alone addresses all of the issues you raise in your post.
At one point in his book, he describes the difference between 'moderate' and 'extreme' Islam as being the difference between two men that want your country to be ruled by Sharia law - only one isn't willing to fly a plane into a building to get his way. Europe is in deep trouble for reasons of demographics, lack of will and complete subservience to its recently arrived Muslim population. The Pan-Islamic identity in these countries is trumping the will of these immigrants to identify with the nation they now reside, Europe will soon be Eurabia.
The USA and Australia seem to be the only countries left that are resisting this tide. Steyn says the difference between a group of young Muslims (not 'youths' as they're usually called) in England celebrating 9/11, and the same group in Texas, is a man reaching into his glove compartment and letting the jihadists know who is boss.
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The USA and Australia seem to be the only countries left that are resisting this tide. Steyn says the difference between a group of young Muslims (not 'youths' as they're usually called) in England celebrating 9/11, and the same group in Texas, is a man reaching into his glove compartment and letting the jihadists know who is boss.
I'm guessing you don't have much experience in dealing with muslims in the United States? Most of the muslims here would describe themselves as muslim, but are non practicing and don't really care. Seems to be different in Europe and Australia. The muslims in the US are quite a sucessful demographic, not the case in Australia and Europe, where they seem to be welfare junkies. Maybe Europe should reform its welfare system and force people to integrate, if they don't, then they're out. You don't have that pussy apologist mentality in America, that's why we, despite our fucked up situation with illegals, still handle immigration better than any other country.
My brothers owned several firearms and I'd be willing to take out a .45 to show an Islamist who's boss, but I've never once seen a situation where I've had to do that and I live in New York. ;)
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I'm guessing you don't have much experience in dealing with muslims in the United States? Most of the muslims here would describe themselves as muslim, but are non practicing and don't really care. Seems to be different in Europe and Australia. The muslims in the US are quite a sucessful demographic, not the case in Australia and Europe, where they seem to be welfare junkies. Maybe Europe should reform its welfare system and force people to integrate, if they don't, then they're out. You don't have that pussy apologist mentality in America, that's why we, despite our fucked up situation with illegals, still handle immigration better than any other country.
My brothers owned several firearms and I'd be willing to take out a .45 to show an Islamist who's boss, but I've never once seen a situation where I've had to do that and I live in New York. ;)
CJ, I think if you read my post you'll see that I largely agree with what you're saying - except that Australia is far closer to the US than Europe.
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Yes, it is - Hedge. And the fact you won't admit it is frightening, but typical of the European 'approach' to dealing with terrorism.
Here's a little something for your perusal, let me know if you can find a list from another religion that outstrips it:
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks (http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks)
And that's just the last three months!
Until you and I can both agree Islam has a problem adapting to the new world (to put it very lightly), we're both going to have a problem doing something about it.
I'll say it again, so we can get serious - rather than letting our Political Correctness stop us from speaking the truth.
Most terrorists are Islamic.
Got it yet?
I think most terrorism is Islamic.
That doesn't mean I say it's a fact.
Where do I say that I don't believe that the Muslim community has a huge problem assimilating into today's modern secular society?
I am an avid opponent of Islam, on many levels.
But I will try to avoid making blanket statements about Islam, like claiming that it is a fact that most terrorists are Muslims.
Stick with hard facts about Islam and Muslim culture BRUCE. I promise you, it's enough, no need to bullshit.
-Hedge
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I think most terrorism is Islamic.
That doesn't mean I say it's a fact.
Stick with hard facts about Islam and Muslim culture BRUCE. I promise you, it's enough, no need to bullshit.
-Hedge
Herein lies the difference between you and I.
You sit and ponder, present no facts and make ambiguous wishy-washy statements starting with 'I think'.
I actually source facts, develop sound opinions and propose action - as above.
Until you, and other Europeans, confront facts like this - Islam will take you for everything you have.
You'll no doubt prove what I have written is 'bullshit', or did you mean to say: 'I think it's bullshit'? I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.