Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: tonyboloni on February 20, 2007, 07:52:40 AM
-
should they be legalized?
what did you think of the Bolivian president holding a coca leaf up at the United Nations? Is it a valid crop?
14 reports by PBS/Frontline (http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/drugs/archive/)
Human Rights Violations and the War on Drugs (http://www.hrw.org/summaries/s.bolivia957.html)
177621 Drug-Related News Clippings! (http://mapinc.org/)
Drug Policy Central (http://drugpolicycentral.com/bot/)
-
What about Medical Marijuana? I watched this guy with cancer get hauled off to jail and his dog impounded. He had lost his home and was living with his dog in a car for his last days and using pot to control the pain. He got busted with a bag and no lienience given, just hauled off.(http://www.24hproxy.com/cgiproxy/nph-proxy.pl/111110A/http/www.getbig.com/boards/Smileys/classic/undecided.gif)
-
The war on drugs causes more harm than it prevents, period.
I know most people will have a simplistic, knee-jerk reaction when someone suggests legalization, since they've been indoctrinated with the simplistic message "drugs=bad" since they were children, but the simple fact is that if you objectively look at the totality of the picture, the societal problems associated with the illegality of drugs far exceed the societal problems that would be caused by the drugs themselves if they were legal.
From a practical, utilitarian viewpoint, legalization should be a no-brainer. Those who object (not counting the vast throng of mindless drones who can't get past the "drugs=bad" message) generally do so on moralistic grounds, which tend to be so important to them that they miss the practical effects and net harm caused by either approach (legalization or prohibition).
-
Of course drugs should be legalized, especially marijuana. If you ask most people for the reasons why drugs should be banned, all they'll end up saying is "drugs are bad" and wont back it up with any sort of legitimate arguements.
It's like those anti-marijuana laws you see. First they said marijuana caused cancer and damaged the lungs, but then there was a study showing that there was no link between marijuana and cancer, as marijuana is not cultivated in radioactive soil like tobacco and also contains no natural chemicals that are harmful to the human body. Second they claimed it caused memory loss, but when you looked at the specs of their research, you'd have to basically smoke close to 70 grams a day for it to even hinder short term memory. And the DEA was responsible for the research. ::) They tried to say marijuana is a gateway drug, but in a study commisioned in 1939 by then NYC mayor Fiorello LaGuardia proved that this was not so. Now they just go with stupid messages saying that if you smoke pot you'll end up losing your friends and sit home all day. ::)
The DEA seems to just ignore published studies by universities, doctors and critics. It just picks old information mostly based on moral ideals rather then facts. It uses this bs to justify banning medical marijuana on a federal level.
-
pot should be legalized or completely decriminilized at the very least.
-
I think it's a losing battle... people will always get drugs if they want them.
I think there's a huge difference between weed and other drugs, like coke or heroin.
Steroids should definitely be legal... I'd rather have a bunch of juiced up people than the obesity epidemic we have now in the US.
-
pot should be legalized or completely decriminilized at the very least.
Yeah. Keeping pot banned is hypocrisy as you're allowing alcohol, which is far worse.
Cocaine and Heroin are pretty bad. What we can do for those two is weigh the benefits and risks and then come up with some sort of solution.
Stuff like shrooms and LSD should be legalized.
-
i disagree. i dont think lsd should be legalized. i have known a few people who it really fucked up
-
Of course drugs should be legalized, especially marijuana. If you ask most people for the reasons why drugs should be banned, all they'll end up saying is "drugs are bad" and wont back it up with any sort of legitimate arguements.
It's like those anti-marijuana laws you see. First they said marijuana caused cancer and damaged the lungs, but then there was a study showing that there was no link between marijuana and cancer, as marijuana is not cultivated in radioactive soil like tobacco and also contains no natural chemicals that are harmful to the human body. Second they claimed it caused memory loss, but when you looked at the specs of their research, you'd have to basically smoke close to 70 grams a day for it to even hinder short term memory. And the DEA was responsible for the research. ::) They tried to say marijuana is a gateway drug, but in a study commisioned in 1939 by then NYC mayor Fiorello LaGuardia proved that this was not so. Now they just go with stupid messages saying that if you smoke pot you'll end up losing your friends and sit home all day. ::)
The DEA seems to just ignore published studies by universities, doctors and critics. It just picks old information mostly based on moral ideals rather then facts. It uses this bs to justify banning medical marijuana on a federal level.
My argument isn't that drugs aren't harmful.... generally, they are. My argument is that the effects of prohibition are more harmful than the effects of the drugs themselves if they were legal. Arguments saying this drug or that drug "aren't that bad", regardless of their legitimacy, really miss the point.
-
My argument isn't that drugs aren't harmful.... generally, they are. My argument is that the effects of prohibition are more harmful than the effects of the drugs themselves if they were legal. Arguments saying this drug or that drug "aren't that bad", regardless of their legitimacy, really miss the point.
good point goat!!!
-
My argument isn't that drugs aren't harmful.... generally, they are. My argument is that the effects of prohibition are more harmful than the effects of the drugs themselves if they were legal. Arguments saying this drug or that drug "aren't that bad", regardless of their legitimacy, really miss the point.
Of course the restrictions are harmful. Aren't more than half of all the people in prison there because of drug related charges? It costs tax payer money to keep these people locked up.
-
i am for pot decriminilization, but as someone who went through a period of smokin several times a day and having a roommate who still smokes constantly i have no doubt it can be detrimental to overall well being. It stunts mental maturity or mental growth. It also tends to make people have unrealistic expectations. People who start smoking on a daily basis in high school never really mature all that well in my opinion. Also, high potency pot promotes patterns of thikning that underly anxiety and depresssive disorders.
But as far as this debate goes, that is mostly irrevelant. Its prohibition is worse than the effects of the drug itself.
-
My argument isn't that drugs aren't harmful.... generally, they are. My argument is that the effects of prohibition are more harmful than the effects of the drugs themselves if they were legal. Arguments saying this drug or that drug "aren't that bad", regardless of their legitimacy, really miss the point.
I can agree with this... It's really the government trying to protect us from ourselves... or is it "control" us...
Hmm....
-
legalize and tax all drugs. People will get them one way or another. People die from cancer from cigarettes, alcoholic deaths, etc
We make choices as to what we put in our bodies. Either you will use them responsibly or you won't.
Sandra
-
Legalize EVERYTHING. Cheaper to provide treatment than "enforcement" that is a failure.
-
first off- ive never or seen any cop ever send someone to jail over weed, let alone prison- thats reserved for major and violent offenders, yes the majority of inmates are drug addicts- but they're not in jail for addiction, there in their for crimes they commite that are driven by the drugs they need..
i can tell you first hand that drugs destroy people and community's. its an endless cycle that can never be stoped. drugs cost money, once your moneys all gone you begin to steal and do whatever it takes to feed the habit.
guess what happens when you legalize it and tax it- prices go up, so there will be a demand for a black market which will sell it cheaper, so theres no need to legalize it anyways.
alcohol/cigarettes- theres really no need for a black market. the guy in his house brewing some beer isnt going to produce enough to make an effect.. people wont grow tobacco to make their own cigarettes. the government has controll of these products so they can tax and regulate them. drugs are a different story
-
Legalize pot. It is getting harder to get the older I get.
Shrooms make it hard to operate a motor vehicle.
-
first off- ive never or seen any cop ever send someone to jail over weed, let alone prison- thats reserved for major and violent offenders, yes the majority of inmates are drug addicts- but they're not in jail for addiction, there in their for crimes they commite that are driven by the drugs they need..
i can tell you first hand that drugs destroy people and community's. its an endless cycle that can never be stoped. drugs cost money, once your moneys all gone you begin to steal and do whatever it takes to feed the habit.
guess what happens when you legalize it and tax it- prices go up, so there will be a demand for a black market which will sell it cheaper, so theres no need to legalize it anyways.
alcohol/cigarettes- theres really no need for a black market. the guy in his house brewing some beer isnt going to produce enough to make an effect.. people wont grow tobacco to make their own cigarettes. the government has controll of these products so they can tax and regulate them. drugs are a different story
Alcohol and tobacco are drugs. How many people's lives are destroyed by alcohol each and every year?
-
Alcohol and tobacco are drugs. How many people's lives are destroyed by alcohol each and every year?
Beer muscles kill.................
-
Alcohol and tobacco are drugs. How many people's lives are destroyed by alcohol each and every year?
I can have a drink and not be drunk; I can't have a hit of heroin and not be high. An important difference, amongst others.
-
Legalizing drugs would make the price go UP?? ::)
That is So silly! ;D
-
I can have a drink and not be drunk; I can't have a hit of heroin and not be high. An important difference, amongst others.
On the contrary. Heroin does have many benefits. It is a great diet drug.
-
On the contrary. Heroin does have many benefits. It is a great diet drug.
AIDS is a great way of losing weight too, if you're interested.
-
I can have a drink and not be drunk; I can't have a hit of heroin and not be high. An important difference, amongst others.
Fantastic, and exactly what does that have to do with how many lives are destroyed by alcohol each and every year? ::)
-
Fantastic, and exactly what does that have to do with how many lives are destroyed by alcohol each and every year? ::)
Sorry, I didn't realise I had to think for you too. Do you think legalising heroin is a good idea?
-
AIDS is a great way of losing weight too, if you're interested.
aids is legal, not as glamorous
-
aids is legal, not as glamorous
It's not legal to knowingly infect someone with HIV, but this was just one example from a range of diseases that will get you into those pants for summer (if you make it).
-
Alcohol and tobacco are drugs. How many people's lives are destroyed by alcohol each and every year?
true,, but how many ghettos and cities ruined over tobacco addiction?
go into the suburbs and guess what percentage of the population is addicted to a major drug,,, then go to a ghetto and guess how many people are addicted to a major drug- its not a coincidence that the bad areas will have more drug addicts
-
Sorry, I didn't realise I had to think for you too. Do you think legalising heroin is a good idea?
Here we go with the bullshit again. You were cool for all of two posts.
I make a completely factual post stating that many many lives are ruined by alcohol each and every year and you post some nonsense about being able to have a drink and not get drunk. And you wonder why people think you're a twit.
-
Here we go with the bullshit again. You were cool for all of two posts.
I make a completely factual post stating that many many lives are ruined by alcohol each and every year and you post some nonsense about being able to have a drink and not get drunk. And you wonder why people think you're a twit.
A 'twit', me? I have to say I've been called worse, mate. Believe it or not, my sole purpose here isn't to pal-up with you.
I agree alcohol ruins lives, if I could stop those members of society that can't control themselves from having it, I would. But it's not heroin and I've told you why.
Again, would you support legalising heroin?
-
true,, but how many ghettos and cities ruined over tobacco addiction?
go into the suburbs and guess what percentage of the population is addicted to a major drug,,, then go to a ghetto and guess how many people are addicted to a major drug- its not a coincidence that the bad areas will have more drug addicts
I notice you didn't mention alcohol in your comparison, only tobacco. Why?
While tobacco is clearly addicting and dangerous over a long period of time alcohol can ruin a life much much quicker. There are alcoholics everywhere.
-
If they DID legalize SMACK- would you use it? I Don't think so.
Same people would. Take the profit & violence & crime out of it - Thats is the bigest problem.
Deal w/ out of control addicts later, cheaper and better for us all in the long (short) run.
-
I notice you didn't mention alcohol in your comparison, only tobacco. Why?
While tobacco is clearly addicting and dangerous over a long period of time alcohol can ruin a life much much quicker. There are alcoholics everywhere.
Just a few questions:
Assume you had 100 members of society randomly chosen and handed over to you for an experiment.
One half is given a pint of beer and told to drink.
The other half is given a needle with a hit of heroin and told to inject.
Which half do you think would be more irresponsible afterwards? More inclined to commit crimes? More likely to become addicted?
-
If they DID legalize SMACK- would you use it? I Don't think so.
Same people would. Take the profit & violence & crime out of it - Thats is the bigest problem.
Deal w/ out of control addicts later, cheaper and better for us all in the long (short) run.
Isn't the idea behind law to legislate protection for society with the weakest members given consideration?
Does legalising heroin help them, or does it make the problem worse?
-
Just a few questions:
Assume you had 100 members of society randomly chosen and handed over to you for an experiment.
One half is given a pint of beer and told to drink.
The other half is given a needle with a hit of heroin and told to inject.
Which half do you think would be more irresponsible afterwards? More inclined to commit crimes? More likely to become addicted?
The question is:
Which girls would be more likely to have sex with me?
-
The question should be what way would MOST of us be better off?
You WILL NOT stop smack addicts from fixN up- never.
Save our resources. DO the most good for the largest number with our tax money.
-
The question should be what way would MOST of us be better off?
You WILL NOT stop smack addicts from fixN up- never.
Save our resources. DO the most good for the largest number with our tax money.
So how many more will be lured into it, should it become legal?
-
A 'twit', me? I have to say I've been called worse, mate. Believe it or not, my sole purpose here isn't to pal-up with you.
I agree alcohol ruins lives, if I could stop those members of society that can't control themselves from having it, I would. But it's not heroin and I've told you why.
Again, would you support legalising heroin?
Now you agree that alcohol ruins lives yet your other post only compared it to heroin, something I never did. I never even mentioned heroin.
And what does "pal up" have to do with you not making bullshit posts? Which was my point when I mentioned you were cool for two posts.
In response to your query, no, I don't think heroin should be legalized. I do think legalizing marijuana and taxing the hell out of it would be acceptable to myself and many other people though.
-
Now you agree that alcohol ruins lives yet your other post only compared it to heroin, something I never did. I never even mentioned heroin.
And what does "pal up" have to do with you not making bullshit posts? Which was my point when I mentioned you were cool for two posts.
In response to your query, no, I don't think heroin should be legalized. I do think legalizing marijuana and taxing the hell out of it would be acceptable to myself and many other people though.
If pot were taxed excessively, I would not buy it legally, think about it..............Who ever has the best product for the bets price would win. In that case my dealer...
-
Now you agree that alcohol ruins lives yet your other post only compared it to heroin, something I never did. I never even mentioned heroin.
And what does "pal up" have to do with you not making bullshit posts? Which was my point when I mentioned you were cool for two posts.
In response to your query, no, I don't think heroin should be legalized. I do think legalizing marijuana and taxing the hell out of it would be acceptable to myself and many other people though.
Alcohol ruins lives, so does heroin - let's not have both of them out there ruining, okay? Your taxing marijuana idea is bone-headed at best, are you going to tax my veggie patch while you're at it?
-
Just a few questions:
Assume you had 100 members of society randomly chosen and handed over to you for an experiment.
One half is given a pint of beer and told to drink.
The other half is given a needle with a hit of heroin and told to inject.
Which half do you think would be more irresponsible afterwards? More inclined to commit crimes? More likely to become addicted?
What is your point with this? Are you trying to prove heroin is more addicting and dangerous than alcohol? Who's saying it isn't?
My only point was that alcohol is addicting and ruins lives. I never said it was worse than crack or heroin or any other serious drug, only that it ruins lives.
I can't even make a completely valid point without you taking off in a completely different direction with nonsense. ::)
-
I notice you didn't mention alcohol in your comparison, only tobacco. Why?
While tobacco is clearly addicting and dangerous over a long period of time alcohol can ruin a life much much quicker. There are alcoholics everywhere.
most people- like myself, can use alcohol wisely. you cant use heroin wisely, it takes over your life. in my experience alcohol will cause a fraction of the problems drugs do
besides that, a ban on alcohol would kill the economy.
i dont understand why weed is illegal, but like i said i dont care anyways. if your doing something in your house and not causing trouble- nobody will find out. you wont get into trouble for being an addict- you do for crimes. and drugs cause crimes.
-
Alcohol ruins lives, so does heroin - let's not have both of them out there ruining, okay? Your taxing marijuana idea is bone-headed at best, are you going to tax my veggie patch while you're at it?
You're equating your vegetable patch with marijuana? And you're calling me boneheaded? ::)
-
You're equating your vegetable patch with marijuana? And you're calling me boneheaded? ::)
Again, my apologies for not being able to think for you - and I said your idea was bone-headed, not you.
-
most people- like myself, can use alcohol wisely. you cant use heroin wisely, it takes over your life. in my experience alcohol will cause a fraction of the problems drugs do
besides that, a ban on alcohol would kill the economy.
i dont understand why weed is illegal, but like i said i dont care anyways. if your doing something in your house and not causing trouble- nobody will find out. you wont get into trouble for being an addict- you do for crimes. and drugs cause crimes.
You're right that many people can use alcohol wisely. It's also correct that many people can't. I agree heroin is far more harmful than alcohol but I was merely pointing out that alcohol is dangerous as well.
-
Again, my apologies for not being able to think for you - and I said your idea was bone-headed, not you.
Nice save, Johnny. ::)
Your transformation lasted all of five minutes. That's better than nothing I suppose.
-
You're right that many people can use alcohol wisely. It's also correct that many people can't. I agree heroin is far more harmful than alcohol but I was merely pointing out that alcohol is dangerous as well.
like i said before drug addicts go to rehab.. criminals go to jail. why do people commit crimes? to pay for their drug habbit.
ive never seen a case where someone robed somebody else to pay for a beer. someone robs your house- its to by drugs,, someone steals your car- its to buy drugs,, someone robs you on the street- its to buy drugs.
-
guess what happens when you legalize it and tax it- prices go up, so there will be a demand for a black market which will sell it cheaper, so theres no need to legalize it anyways.
Black market is CHEAPER?
No, no no.
When you legalize a product, it can be manufactured by more firms. It no longer needs smuggled in. There are more sellers and less loss. The price goes DOWN when contraband is legalized.
Are you as SURE that legalized products' price goes UP that you are of your stance on 911? ;)
Seriously, this is 6th grade shit.
-
Black market is CHEAPER?
No, no no.
When you legalize a product, it can be manufactured by more firms. It no longer needs smuggled in. There are more sellers and less loss. The price goes DOWN when contraband is legalized.
Are you as SURE that legalized products' price goes UP that you are of your stance on 911? ;)
Seriously, this is 6th grade shit.
I think he's suggesting you tax it at an exorbitant rate.
Just as black-market cigarettes are cheaper than the legitimate ones.
-
Black market is CHEAPER?
No, no no.
When you legalize a product, it can be manufactured by more firms. It no longer needs smuggled in. There are more sellers and less loss. The price goes DOWN when contraband is legalized.
Are you as SURE that legalized products' price goes UP that you are of your stance on 911? ;)
Seriously, this is 6th grade shit.
how much does that legal marijuana shit cost in cali? and how much does it cost on the street?are cocaine dealers charging shipping and handling now? how much does any drug cost without insurance- a shitload.. you must have drug manufactureres mixed up with something else. legalized products and drugs are two different thing's
besides that,, the price wasnt my point
-
1. He shoulda said that, and
2. You legalize weed and people will just grow their own. taxes will be decent but everyone will just fill their yard with it.
-
guess what happens when you legalize it and tax it- prices go up
the price wasnt my point
Oh, okay.
-
I think he's suggesting you tax it at an exorbitant rate.
Just as black-market cigarettes are cheaper than the legitimate ones.
exactly, but theres no money in a cigarette black market,, there is for drugs
-
Sorry, I didn't realise I had to think for you too. Do you think legalising heroin is a good idea?
No, sir, but weed is.
Sorru but I'cr anoigt 20s shots fof soutbn and Icaomt aytpe ya know?
-
No, sir, but weed is.
Sorru but I'cr anoigt 20s shots fof soutbn and Icaomt aytpe ya know?
If you were a Mod you be deleting posts in a haze of smoke right now.
-
legalize them and stop wasting money, time, and manpower attempting to stop something that people don't want stopped...it's like prohibition all over again..make it legal and the crime with it stops.
-
alcohol/cigarettes- theres really no need for a black market. the guy in his house brewing some beer isnt going to produce enough to make an effect.. people wont grow tobacco to make their own cigarettes. the government has controll of these products so they can tax and regulate them. drugs are a different story
The government can do the same with marijuana. If marijuana is grown out, regulated and sold, then people wont see the need to grow it anymore and whatever blackmarket will cease. It's the same with tobacco. The tobacco blackmarket is pretty small and most people don't bother with bootleg, untaxed cigarettes.
exactly, but theres no money in a cigarette black market,, there is for drugs
Tobacco is a drug. ::)
-
Tobacco is a drug. ::)
Actually, Nicotine is a drug... Tobacco is a plant. :D
-
Actually there IS $s in Ciggs Black Market- The Tax is so high!
If any product is sold @ true market prices- THere will not be unusual crime over it!
When is the last time a liquor store owner laid a drive by on a competitor?Huh?
Irrational pricing drives the Black market, and crime.
-
Actually, Nicotine is a drug... Tobacco is a plant. :D
Marijuana isn't a drug, but a plant and THC is the drug. :D
-
Marijuana isn't a drug, but a plant and THC is the drug. :D
I agree with that statement also...
-
Kat Williams on weed... This is the real deal.