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Title: real demands for new mod
Post by: OKMike on March 01, 2007, 06:58:27 AM
militarymuscle69
Getbig II

Posts: 324


     Our moderators are whacked!!!!
« on: Today at 05:33:06 AM » Quote 

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Yesterday a post is made about Gore using to much power and Beserker steps in and demands facts before bashing Gore. Then OzmO makes a post (see: list of things bush has done wrong) and doesn't put one fact in his whole post. Everything in there is opinion based... (oh ok maybe he knew the 3 planes had been hijacked, I guess he should have jumped in the phone booth changed and gone to stop them.) and not one work from Beserker, because as he admits he is politically biased. Obvioiusly OzmO is also. Where is our conservative rep?

I am not the only one who feels the need to have a conservative representative on the political board.  We are tired of only hearing the voice of one side.  The people have spoken!  Right it right and fair is fair!
 
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 01, 2007, 07:04:57 AM
IMO, as long as there are no abuses (IE: moving stuff or deleting based upon political motives), who cares?  If the news says libs are ruining america and Bush is a good guy, share it!  DL is doing a fine job. 
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: ieffinhatecardio on March 01, 2007, 07:08:32 AM
Here we go again with this crybaby crap.  ::)
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: Hedgehog on March 01, 2007, 07:30:32 AM
IMO, as long as there are no abuses (IE: moving stuff or deleting based upon political motives), who cares?  If the news says libs are ruining america and Bush is a good guy, share it!  DL is doing a fine job. 

Incredibly, I find myself agreeing with 240 or Bust.

BTW 240, why dick around on the TA/Magoo issue? Why not come clean on your commitments?

-Hedge
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 07:34:22 AM
militarymuscle69
Getbig II

Posts: 324


     Our moderators are whacked!!!!
« on: Today at 05:33:06 AM » Quote 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yesterday a post is made about Gore using to much power and Beserker steps in and demands facts before bashing Gore. Then OzmO makes a post (see: list of things bush has done wrong) and doesn't put one fact in his whole post. Everything in there is opinion based... (oh ok maybe he knew the 3 planes had been hijacked, I guess he should have jumped in the phone booth changed and gone to stop them.) and not one work from Beserker, because as he admits he is politically biased. Obvioiusly OzmO is also. Where is our conservative rep?

I am not the only one who feels the need to have a conservative representative on the political board.  We are tired of only hearing the voice of one side.  The people have spoken!  Right it right and fair is fair!
 


If you scroll down just a few posts you'll see i put a "list of things bush has done good" before i put the other one up

Here's the link just in case you can't do it.

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=131457.0 (http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=131457.0)

If you can get over yourself you'll see that it's ALL opinion also.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 01, 2007, 07:57:05 AM
BTW 240, why dick around on the TA/Magoo issue? Why not come clean on your commitments?
-Hedge


I didn't mess around on purpose with the names.  i was super slammed busy, and magoo wrote and asked if I would hold he and adonis' bet money, i said sure.  the money arrived minutes later.  then he PMs against last night, asks for a screenshot and a refund, which I did.

i dont know why i wrote widow - he and i have no communication.  perhaps its the multi sylaballic compound words, me working too fast, maybe i read ww's name right before writing, i dont know.

believe me, if i intended to stir the pot, i would have let the controversy stew and blow up bigger.  instead i admitted my error immediately.  magoo paid me.  period.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: Eyeball Chambers on March 01, 2007, 07:58:56 AM
I didn't mess around on purpose with the names.

It was funny as hell.   ;D
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: Hugo Chavez on March 01, 2007, 08:32:58 AM
So everytime I have an argument with someone, they run off and try to get a new mod for the place?  :-\  I give up... This is like trying to run a preschool ???  All this because I wanted questions answered on AL Gore?  All this because he thinks this is a Bush Bashing only forum even though I clearly showed that is a completely false accusation...
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 01, 2007, 08:35:37 AM
So everytime I have an argument with someone, they run off and try to get a new mod for the place?  :-\  I give up... This is like trying to run a preschool ???  All this because I wanted questions answered on AL Gore?  All this because he thinks this is a Bush Bashing only forum even though I clearly showed that is a completely false accusation...

the neocons smell the 911 story collapsing.  They want merge/delete abilities so they can stifle the truth. 
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: Hugo Chavez on March 01, 2007, 08:37:57 AM
IMO, as long as there are no abuses (IE: moving stuff or deleting based upon political motives), who cares?  If the news says libs are ruining america and Bush is a good guy, share it!  DL is doing a fine job. 
Yea, all I did was give my opinion and agrue it over Al Gore, nothing new for me, but mod abuse is exactly what he's trying to lay out against me...  Look at how me and Bruce agrue it out sometimes, yet I have not for a second let that fact hinder his participation in the forum in any way. 
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OKMike on March 01, 2007, 08:30:44 PM
So everytime I have an argument with someone, they run off and try to get a new mod for the place?  :-\  I give up... This is like trying to run a preschool ???  All this because I wanted questions answered on AL Gore?  All this because he thinks this is a Bush Bashing only forum even though I clearly showed that is a completely false accusation...

Berserker, I am not trying to get you replaced as mod.  We have 3 mods here, and they are all quite liberal.  Delusional Liberal has not been making any contributions lately, so a new mod should be chosen to replace him.  The non stop Bush bashing gets old.  The one thead of Bush positives was just put up to placate us.  We will not be placated!  I know there are members who would post here but do not because there is no balance to the forum.  Why do you seem so afraid to have one quality, conservate member elected to moderator?  This should be a true democracy, not a monopoly!  I think we can make this board better than it is now.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 08:35:04 PM
im used to it,, lived in new york my whole life,,  there isnt another conservative for hundreds of miles
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 08:38:04 PM
Berserker, I am not trying to get you replaced as mod.  We have 3 mods here, and they are all quite liberal.  Delusional Liberal has not been making any contributions lately, so a new mod should be chosen to replace him.  The non stop Bush bashing gets old.  The one thead of Bush positives was just put up to placate us.  We will not be placated!  I know there are members who would post here but do not because there is no balance to the forum.  Why do you seem so afraid to have one quality, conservate member elected to moderator?  This should be a true democracy, not a monopoly!  I think we can make this board better than it is now.

There isn't any restrictions on posting.  People post what they want to post.  Changing mods won't change that.

I do agree however, that a new mod might be in order.  But not because the posts are allegedly all slanted towards bashing BUSH, but only becuase of his inactivity.

If you wanted more BUSH loving posts, then by all means post them.  People will debate them just as conservatives debate BUSH bashing posts.

The world will still spin. 
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 08:38:54 PM
im used to it,, lived in new york my whole life,,  there isnt another conservative for hundreds of miles

lol  heheheh.

At least you have the best Italian food on the continent.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 08:58:29 PM
There isn't any restrictions on posting.  People post what they want to post.  Changing mods won't change that.

I do agree however, that a new mod might be in order.  But not because the posts are allegedly all slanted towards bashing BUSH, but only becuase of his inactivity.

If you wanted more BUSH loving posts, then by all means post them.  People will debate them just as conservatives debate BUSH bashing posts.

The world will still spin. 

i have no problem with anyone bashing bush,, hes in the highest position you can achieve in life and what he does is up for criticism. believe it or not i put him at fault for several things.. but most cross the line and criticism has turned into hate. some of you act like he fired you from your job,took your money, and killed your family. thats why i always use the term 'angry liberal'.. the extreme liberals that i deal with everyday seem like pissed off people, and bush is a great target
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OKMike on March 01, 2007, 08:58:38 PM
There isn't any restrictions on posting.  People post what they want to post.  Changing mods won't change that.

I do agree however, that a new mod might be in order.  But not because the posts are allegedly all slanted towards bashing BUSH, but only becuase of his inactivity.

If you wanted more BUSH loving posts, then by all means post them.  People will debate them just as conservatives debate BUSH bashing posts.

The world will still spin. 

Well, at least you are open to the idea of putting a new mod here.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OKMike on March 01, 2007, 09:02:59 PM
i have no problem with anyone bashing bush,, hes in the highest position you can achieve in life and what he does is up for criticism. believe it or not i put him at fault for several things.. but most cross the line and criticism has turned into hate. some of you act like he fired you from your job,took your money, and killed your family. thats why i always use the term 'angry liberal'.. the extreme liberals that i deal with everyday seem like pissed off people, and bush is a great target

I also love it when those "peace loving liberals" become violent while protesting war.   ;)
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: ieffinhatecardio on March 01, 2007, 09:04:47 PM
i have no problem with anyone bashing bush,, hes in the highest position you can achieve in life and what he does is up for criticism. believe it or not i put him at fault for several things.. but most cross the line and criticism has turned into hate. some of you act like he fired you from your job,took your money, and killed your family. thats why i always use the term 'angry liberal'.. the extreme liberals that i deal with everyday seem like pissed off people, and bush is a great target

You remember the Clinton era right? Would you have called the conservatives that were screaming for his ouster "angry conservatives"?

And not that I'm defending Clinton but he lied about getting a blowjob from an ugly fat broad not starting a war.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 09:13:51 PM
i have no problem with anyone bashing bush,, hes in the highest position you can achieve in life and what he does is up for criticism. believe it or not i put him at fault for several things.. but most cross the line and criticism has turned into hate. some of you act like he fired you from your job,took your money, and killed your family. thats why i always use the term 'angry liberal'.. the extreme liberals that i deal with everyday seem like pissed off people, and bush is a great target

he irresponsibly got us into a unnecessary war that has cost us thousands of casualties and billions in funds.

Worse IMO than those things in bold.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:21:34 PM
You remember the Clinton era right? Would you have called the conservatives that were screaming for his ouster "angry conservatives"?

And not that I'm defending Clinton but he lied about getting a blowjob from an ugly fat broad not starting a war.

i personally feel that president should be the last one committing adultery, committing perjury, and lying under oath. clinton was convicted of crimes- bush hasnt,, people like to think bush has,but he hasnt.
 if you want to be pissed off about the war then fine-but too many people are singeling out bush. you want to criticize him for the war then include everyone else too, and dont give out the he faked evidence bullshit. if you dont like the war -then dont fucking go. i dont see anyone protesting all the cops in america that are killed every year. i dont see people protesting all of the people killed from smoking every year, i dont see people protesting gang violence.. the war's just something for angey people to be angry about
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 01, 2007, 09:22:17 PM
i personally feel that president should be the last one committing adultery, committing perjury, and lying under oath. clinton was convicted of crimes- bush hasnt,, people like to think bush has,but he hasnt.
 if you want to be pissed off about the war then fine-but too many people are singeling out bush. you want to criticize him for the war then include everyone else too, and dont give out the he faked evidence bullshit. if you dont like the war -then dont fucking go. i dont see anyone protesting all the cops in america that are killed every year. i dont see people protesting all of the people killed from smoking every year, i dont see people protesting gang violence.. the war's just something for angey people to be angry about

was that yellow cake statement true, then?
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: ieffinhatecardio on March 01, 2007, 09:25:24 PM
i personally feel that president should be the last one committing adultery, committing perjury, and lying under oath. clinton was convicted of crimes- bush hasnt,, people like to think bush has,but he hasnt.
 if you want to be pissed off about the war then fine-but too many people are singeling out bush. you want to criticize him for the war then include everyone else too, and dont give out the he faked evidence bullshit. if you dont like the war -then dont fucking go. i dont see anyone protesting all the cops in america that are killed every year. i dont see people protesting all of the people killed from smoking every year, i dont see people protesting gang violence.. the war's just something for angey people to be angry about

I'll pass, too many holes in this post to even begin to debate it.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:25:29 PM
he irresponsibly got us into a unnecessary war that has cost us thousands of casualties and billions in funds.

Worse IMO than those things in bold.

irresponsibly? do you remember 911? we were scared shitless of another attack,, from what we knew we had to expect a  chain of terrorist event.. we had to stop any threat immediately. turns out the threat wasnt as serious as we thought, but thats a different story.
and stop saying HE got us into war,, use the term THEY
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: Hugo Chavez on March 01, 2007, 09:26:41 PM
Here's the way it should go:
The forum it to busy for the current mods to handle or a mod has abused his privlages, members and mods have recognized the problem.  A general concensus agrees that more mods are needed through a vote to find out if more mods are wanted.  If more mods are wanted by the mods and forum a vote thread is created to find a new mod.  Ron is contacted and informed of the demand and new choice. 

Here's the way is currently goes
Forum member gets pissed off at Berserker after debating subject X, within 24 hours there is a thread in General or here demanding different or more mods.


 :-\

Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:27:39 PM
was that yellow cake statement true, then?

ya ya ya.. let me guess, you have top secret cia evidence that was leaked
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 09:30:03 PM
irresponsibly? do you remember 911? we were scared shitless of another attack,, from what we knew we had to expect a  chain of terrorist event.. we had to stop any threat immediately. turns out the threat wasnt as serious as we thought, but thats a different story.
and stop saying HE got us into war,, use the term THEY
 

FOR me this is very simple.  "they" was not Iraq.  Iraq and Saddam did not commit a terrorist attack on the US.   "They" was Al Queda/Taliban.  So therefore "HE" did get us into a war.   

Shoot first and ask questions later IS irresponsible and that's exactly what happened here.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 24KT on March 01, 2007, 09:31:30 PM
i have no problem with anyone bashing bush,, hes in the highest position you can achieve in life and what he does is up for criticism. believe it or not i put him at fault for several things.. but most cross the line and criticism has turned into hate. some of you act like he fired you from your job,took your money, and killed your family. thats why i always use the term 'angry liberal'.. the extreme liberals that i deal with everyday seem like pissed off people, and bush is a great target

GUILTY, GUILTY, GUILTY

...and he's done alot of way worse crap too.

Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: BRUCE on March 01, 2007, 09:32:39 PM
 

FOR me this is very simple.  "they" was not Iraq.  Iraq and Saddam did not commit a terrorist attack on the US.   "They" was Al Queda/Taliban.  So therefore "HE" did get us into a war.   

Shoot first and ask questions later IS irresponsible and that's exactly what happened here.

Or it might have just had something to do with 10 years plus of Saddam defying UN resolutions and the UN doing stuff all about it.  Guess who has the most to fear of Saddam with a nuclear weapon.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: Hugo Chavez on March 01, 2007, 09:35:14 PM
Berserker, I am not trying to get you replaced as mod.  We have 3 mods here, and they are all quite liberal.  Delusional Liberal has not been making any contributions lately, so a new mod should be chosen to replace him.  The non stop Bush bashing gets old.  The one thead of Bush positives was just put up to placate us.  We will not be placated!  I know there are members who would post here but do not because there is no balance to the forum.  Why do you seem so afraid to have one quality, conservate member elected to moderator?  This should be a true democracy, not a monopoly!  I think we can make this board better than it is now.
DL is not liberal.  Ozmo was noted by nearly everyone as being very middle of the road and people wanted him as middle mod because he never had a history of siding with one political leaning.  He would often call BS on a righty right after he called BS on a lefty.  He was overwhelming chosen for these characteristics.  I'm the left leaning mod... If you want balance, having a different righty mod is not going to help you.  What, if say Bruce is modded in that position there's going to be more balance to the forum?  No, his posts aren't going to change are they? 

For those that are newer to the forum, please know why the mod balance was created.

A quoted post of mine, please review this.

A missunderstanding I'm thinking... Remembering back, some of the accusations from some of the people posting in general was that threads would get deleted or merged and in general harsh policy applied to certain people like you or me because the board mods leaned the other way politically.  The balance is so that there is comfort in this area.  A person can post freely knowing that there is not a board of mods that leans all one way politically.  It also means that the accusation can't be levied in the first place.  It also makes it possible for any mod to participate in the board like a normal poster.  Because the person you are arguing with, may not be comfortable bringing an issue to you the very next day.  Since we adopted the mod range, it means everyone should have another choice of mod to go to nullifying the issue before it ever happens.  It was thought that this board would best benefit from the range for these reasons because it is a political board where sides do get drawn and drawn often.  So yes I do agree that politics has nothing to do with being a good mod, but the political balance is there for safety of all who come to the board and is there for us mods too!  Otherwise I would have to guard my participation extensively for the fairness of all.  Hope that explains why there should be a mod balance.  You are also right that the balance of the board comes from those who post here, not from the mod balance.  The mod balance is for the security of all the users, but really has nothing to do with the board balance that is indeed made up of the participants and in that aspect I'm just 1 more voice in a board of voices no better than anyone else.  I don't expect people to listen to what I have to say politically more because I'm a mod.  I would hope I'm gauged like everyone else with my political beliefs.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 01, 2007, 09:35:26 PM
irresponsibly? do you remember 911? we were scared shitless of another attack,, from what we knew we had to expect a  chain of terrorist event.. we had to stop any threat immediately. turns out the threat wasnt as serious as we thought, but thats a different story.
and stop saying HE got us into war,, use the term THEY

If we had to stop the threat immediately, why is the border still wide open, 6 years later?

Seriously, I saw a tv show where a guy rode an elephant across the border.

If the white house was truly worried, that border would be tightened.  If they're not, and they just want to use borrowing to pay for an oil war in the mid east, then the border would be ignored.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:36:47 PM
 

FOR me this is very simple.  "they" was not Iraq.  Iraq and Saddam did not commit a terrorist attack on the US.   "They" was Al Queda/Taliban.  So therefore "HE" did get us into a war.   

Shoot first and ask questions later IS irresponsible and that's exactly what happened here.

and if we received a threat from osama bin laden prior to 911,and we went in to capture him, you would bitch about that too. bin laden didnt have wmds either.. and keep in mind we didnt declare war on iraq, were at war with the taliban and any terrorist organization. iraq just became a mess
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 24KT on March 01, 2007, 09:37:19 PM
Or it might have just had something to do with 10 years plus of Saddam defying UN resolutions and the UN doing stuff all about it.
 

If that's the case, Israel ought to be pooping in it's pants right now.
They've been defying UN resolutions and being condemned for it for years.

Quote
Guess who has the most to fear of Saddam with a nuclear weapon.

Which of course goes back to the Anti-Zionist argument that US military shouldn't be an instrument of Israeli policy.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:38:25 PM
If we had to stop the threat immediately, why is the border still wide open, 6 years later?

Seriously, I saw a tv show where a guy rode an elephant across the border.

If the white house was truly worried, that border would be tightened.  If they're not, and they just want to use borrowing to pay for an oil war in the mid east, then the border would be ignored.

i agree 100%.. the bush admin has fucked up when it comes to the border
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 01, 2007, 09:39:05 PM
i agree 100%.. the bush admin has fucked up when it comes to the border

then this beer's on me.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 24KT on March 01, 2007, 09:39:46 PM
and if we received a threat from osama bin laden prior to 911,and we went in to capture him, you would bitch about that too. bin laden didnt have wmds either.. and keep in mind we didnt declare war on iraq, were at war with the taliban and any terrorist organization. iraq just became a mess

The Taliban was not in Iraq
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 09:40:24 PM
Or it might have just had something to do with 10 years plus of Saddam defying UN resolutions and the UN doing stuff all about it.  Guess who has the most to fear of Saddam with a nuclear weapon.

It makes sense until you realize that Saddam, wasn't insane in the respect that he wasn't willing to throw away all he had just to nuke the USA.  He wanted to keep his power, his palaces, women, etc...  That's why he wasn't a threat.  It was someone there we actually had indirect control over. 

All those resolution things?  political manuvering for different reasons at different times from both sides
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:41:53 PM
The Taliban was not in Iraq

any terrorist organization,, any threat -keep in mind we were in the post 911 era
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 09:44:31 PM
any terrorist organization,, any threat -keep in mind we were in the post 911 era

then by that same reasoning, shouldn't we have invaded Jordan, Egypt, Syria, Iran, etc..?

but we didn't did we?  so that reasoning is moot.

KH,  this iraq war doesn't hold water. 
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: BRUCE on March 01, 2007, 09:45:12 PM
 

If that's the case, Israel ought to be pooping in it's pants right now.
They've been defying UN resolutions and being condemned for it for years.

Which of course goes back to the Anti-Zionist argument that US military shouldn't be an instrument of Israeli policy.


You're beyond lost if you're comparing Israel to Iraq.  And which resolution exactly are you referring to?
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: BRUCE on March 01, 2007, 09:46:26 PM
It makes sense until you realize that Saddam, wasn't insane in the respect that he wasn't willing to throw away all he had just to nuke the USA.  He wanted to keep his power, his palaces, women, etc...  That's why he wasn't a threat.  It was someone there we actually had indirect control over. 

All those resolution things?  political manuvering for different reasons at different times from both sides

You're giving a crazed despot way too much credit there.  Saddam was a madman on an unspeakable level, if you don't think he would have annihilated the US given a chance then you're mistaken.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 01, 2007, 09:47:00 PM
You're beyond lost if you're comparing Israel to Iraq. 

Isr has nukes.  They are not allowed to have them.  They admitted it last year.

Of course, you only want to enforce rules on brown people with oil, right? ;)
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:49:26 PM
then by that same reasoning, shouldn't we have invaded Jordan, Egypt, Syria, Iran, etc..?

but we didn't did we?  so that reasoning is moot.

KH,  this iraq war doesn't hold water. 

remember all the shit that happend leading up to the war,, were were told that saddam had chemical weapons,, he didnt but he had the capability and the desire. he kicked out the weapons inspectos and he was up to no good,, we know of terrorists organizations that were hiding there.. jordon didnt give us the same threat
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: BRUCE on March 01, 2007, 09:49:33 PM
Isr has nukes.  They are not allowed to have them.  They admitted it last year.

Of course, you only want to enforce rules on brown people with oil, right? ;)

Such idiocy, are you suggesting I'm racist?  Has Israel threatened to blow anyone off the map for bigoted reasons?
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 09:50:13 PM
You're giving a crazed despot way too much credit there.  Saddam was a madman on an unspeakable level, if you don't think he would have annihilated the US given a chance then you're mistaken.

Bruce,  think about it.  he held that country in his firm grip for what 25 years?  He ruthlessly calculated his rise to power.  He established material wealth in the billions.  He's no different than a mobster.  Very sane in that regard. 

The nuts you have to worry about are the ones who don't want all those material things, like those leading Iran.

becuase they will nuke us on principle and don;t mind dying in the process.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 09:52:58 PM
remember all the shit that happend leading up to the war,, were were told that saddam had chemical weapons,, he didnt but he had the capability and the desire. he kicked out the weapons inspectos and he was up to no good,, we know of terrorists organizations that were hiding there.. jordon didnt give us the same threat

And Iran and NK didn't?   Iraq was a easy target to further our agenda of power in the area.  It was when preparation meets opportunity.

i understand why the american public for the most part was for it.  That doesn't mean it was prudent.  And we are seeing this now.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: kh300 on March 01, 2007, 09:56:04 PM
And Iran and NK didn't?   Iraq was a easy target to further our agenda of power in the area.  It was when preparation meets opportunity.

i understand why the american public for the most part was for it.  That doesn't mean it was prudent.  And we are seeing this now.

it was the right thing to do at THAT TIME.. of course if we could go back in history we would do a lot of things differently
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: BRUCE on March 01, 2007, 09:57:09 PM
Bruce,  think about it.  he held that country in his firm grip for what 25 years?  He ruthlessly calculated his rise to power.  He established material wealth in the billions.  He's no different than and mobster.  Very sane in that regard. 

The nuts you have to worry about are the ones who don't want all those material things, like those leading Iran.

becuase they will nuke us on principle and don;t mind dying in the process.

With that logic you will then be at a loss to explain why Saddam would ruthlessly attack both Kuwait and Iran, and why he would perform completely horrendous acts of torture on people for trivial reasons.  Did he have any need to do this to remail in power with all his wealth?  Certainly not - he was a madman, with a thirst for blood and deep hatred of America.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 09:58:32 PM
it was the right thing to do at THAT TIME.. of course if we could go back in history we would do a lot of things differently

respectfully, i see what you saying, but do not agree.  i was against war from the start and i didn't even think it was going to end up like this. 

Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: OzmO on March 01, 2007, 10:07:41 PM
With that logic you will then be at a loss to explain why Saddam would ruthlessly attack both Kuwait and Iran, and why he would perform completely horrendous acts of torture on people for trivial reasons.  Did he have any need to do this to remail in power with all his wealth?  Certainly not - he was a madman, with a thirst for blood and deep hatred of America.

i can easily.

Bugsy sees and opportunity to grab some more action and thinks once he does it the "bosses" won't trouble themselves trying to clean up the mess and re-balance power.  So Bugsy makes a miscalculation and ends up in the river with cement shoes.

Saddam at the time was having trouble with money and wealth becuase he was broke from the iran/iraq war.  (of course he had plenty of caviar, but not enough fill his stadium size swimming pool.  He saw an opportunity.  Them Kuwait bastards who had tons of money.  so he went after it.  America knew about it at least a few weeks before it happened.  Sat photographs and intel on logistics would have tipped them off just like anywhere these days.  He wasn't wanred about it from us so he went for it.   

As far as torture:  he had the power to fill his every whim.  Does that  make him a madman in that regard?  yes.  But we are talking about him losing all his power and wealth for making an attack on the USA.  no way he would have done it.  He probably tortured anyone who was even remotely a threat to him.  that's why he had a stable iraq and we can't seem to get there.
Title: Re: real demands for new mod
Post by: 240 is Back on March 02, 2007, 08:07:32 AM
remember all the shit that happend leading up to the war,, were were told that saddam had chemical weapons,, he didnt but he had the capability and the desire. he kicked out the weapons inspectos and he was up to no good,, we know of terrorists organizations that were hiding there.. jordon didnt give us the same threat

Doug Feith cherry picked the intel.  The Pentagon audit admits it now.

People made decisions based upon the "iraq/al q/911" connections report that Feith wrote.

People made decisions on cherry picked intel.



Now, who directed Feith?  Rummy & Bush.