Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: OneMoreRep on June 07, 2007, 08:03:53 AM
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What is it that makes these so-called Professional bodybuilders, professional? Besides the fact that they get paid to pose on stage and might, if lucky, get some sponsorship, what truly sets them out as a professional in their field?
You don't have to belong to the IFBB to get paid like a Pro bodybuilder, you can work privately and get sponsorship and income by way of the GAY-4-PAY network. So that dismisses the idea that if a person gets paid to do what they do, they, by way of default, are considered professional.
A doctor knows his craft well enough that he can work on his own, a teacher knows his subject matter in a way that he is self-sufficient and capable of providing his students with what they need based on his knowledge base...etc.. What does a Professional bodybuilder truly know?
Pros hire both a trainer and a nutritionist most of the time they compete or even train year round. If they need a professional trainer like Charles Glass to train them, what makes "them" a Professional at bodybuilding? If they need to hire a nutritionist like Chad Nicholls, Tom Prince or even Chris Aceto, what makes "them" a professional at proper bodybuilding diets?
In other words, once you take the training and the eating out of the equation, what the hell else is left?
Genetics you can't change and/or even influence unless you are into breeding humans.
The only thing these guys might be actually pros at is injecting themselves in the ass with hormones and site injections of esiclene...
Again, this goes out to all the so-called pros here, what makes you a Pro?
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Appearently a phone call to the PDI ;D
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Appearently a phone call to the PDI ;D
No, but really Shawn, answer the question, I'd appreciate it. Who cares about the PDI, in a few months they won't exist, this matter is regarding what sets apart a typical bodybuilder from a professional bodybuilder.
Obviously, accreditation can be bought or dealt with by way of a new federation coming into play, so saying that you need a governing body (like that of a university per say) to grant you that title is out of the question, since the PDI dismisses that notion.
Help us out Shawn..
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genetics, REAL LEGIT drugs,amounts,availablity work ethic, timing and a little luck
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What makes a Pro a Pro is quite simple and has been spelled out for many years:
WIN the Pro Qualification Show:
Overall and 1st Runner up at the Mr. USA
All Class Winners at the NPC Nationals
Overall Champion at the North American
Universe Class Winners
Team Uniiverse Winner
Petition the IFBB ala:
* Milos Sarcev, Lee Priest, JJ Marsh and few others from around the way via Wayne Demilia Glory Days of yore! ;D
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genetics, REAL LEGIT drugs,amounts,availablity work ethic, timing and a little luck
Hi Shawn :D
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Hi Shawn :D
LOL that is the worst insult you could ever give me...wtf did i ever do to you
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What makes a Pro a Pro is quite simple and has been spelled out for many years:
WIN the Pro Qualification Show:
Overall and 1st Runner up at the Mr. USA
All Class Winners at the NPC Nationals
Overall Champion at the North American
Universe Class Winners
Team Uniiverse Winner
Petition the IFBB ala:
* Milos Sarcev, Lee Priest, JJ Marsh and few others from around the way via Wayne Demilia Glory Days of yore! ;D
Wow, so you're telling me that any idiot, with no true knowledge of training, nutrition, or even the ability to downright speak, with the help of a Trainer, nutritionist and Posing coach can become a pro?
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Genetics, Luck, being in the right place, timing bla bla bla have nothing to do with actually COMPETING in a PRO QUALIFIER against everyone else on the day of the show and BEATING THEM to EARN your Pro Card!
Is there anything more satisfying than accomplishing that?
Maybe doing it for pay but here is the rub.............There are a few Pro Champions and many more people trying to become Pro but on the day you win your Pro Card, it is reserved and memorialize in our memories as the date of ARRIVAL for those who Dreamed that lttle Dream way back when, the rest of the career as a Pro is but a Blur by comparision to this special day for many.
Peace,
S
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LOL that is the worst insult you could ever give me...wtf did i ever do to you
;D LOL
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Genetics, Luck, being in the right place, timing bla bla bla have nothing to do with actually COMPETING in a PRO QUALIFIER against everyone else on the day of the show and BEATING THEM to EARN your Pro Card!
Is there anything more satisfying than accomplishing that?
Maybe doing it for pay but here is the rub.............There are a few Pro Champions and many more people trying to become Pro but on the day you win your Pro Card, it is reserved and memorialize in our memories as the date of ARRIVAL for those who Dreamed that lttle Dream way back when, the rest of the career as a Pro is but a Blur by comparision to this special day for many.
Peace,
S
Sounds like the wedding day of a special girl...Kidding I see your point.
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genetics, REAL LEGIT drugs,amounts,availablity work ethic, timing and a little luck
You can't help genetics....
Drugs are downright illegal and bad for the sport...
Work ethic?? Many of the NPC bodybuilders I've known and read about can't maintain a regular job or even get hired for that matter because their look only appeals to supplement companies and jobs like bar tender, security guard and/or a shipping company. So what work ethic can these guys truly have? Plus, most pros we know of like that of Dillett and Cormier have shit work ethic and only survive on drugs and genetics..
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There are many examples of the kind of people you just mentioned.
They run the gamit from being Intelligent, Stupid, Ridiculous, Entrepreneurs, Murderer's, Porn Stars, Doctors, Specialists, Etc.
Take a good look at our President of the USA, not the sharpest Tool in the box but he is in the White House nonetheless. :-\
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Geeze,it must be easy to become a pro.I wonder why so few here will ever realise that goal.Perhaps the guys who do it have something we dont.You know,you could practice basketball from now utill the year 3000 and you will NEVER be Michael Jordan.The same for pro bodybuilding.Tons of guys train hard,eat well and take drugs,but how many Shawn Rays are there.One in a million.
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Genetics, Luck, being in the right place, timing bla bla bla have nothing to do with actually COMPETING in a PRO QUALIFIER against everyone else on the day of the show and BEATING THEM to EARN your Pro Card!
Is there anything more satisfying than accomplishing that?
Maybe doing it for pay but here is the rub.............There are a few Pro Champions and many more people trying to become Pro but on the day you win your Pro Card, it is reserved and memorialize in our memories as the date of ARRIVAL for those who Dreamed that lttle Dream way back when, the rest of the career as a Pro is but a Blur by comparision to this special day for many.
Peace,
S
Sure Shawn, but what makes them a professional at what they do based on what I have already explained? We know how these guys earn the title, but what makes a pro bodybuilder a professional at bodybuilding?
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There are many examples of the kind of people you just mentioned.
They run the gamit from being Intelligent, Stupid, Ridiculous, Entrepreneurs, Murderer's, Porn Stars, Doctors, Specialists, Etc.
Take a good look at our President of the USA, not the sharpest Tool in the box but he is in the White House nonetheless. :-\
how's the lambo? u still pumpin pac's 'how do u want it' like a rock star!!!!!!!!! best entrance on a bodybuilding dvd ever lol
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Geeze,it must be easy to become a pro.I wonder why so few here will ever realise that goal.Perhaps the guys who do it have something we dont.You know,you could practice basketball from now utill the year 3000 and you will NEVER be Michael Jordan.The same for pro bodybuilding.Tons of guys train hard,eat well and take drugs,but how many Shawn Rays are there.One in a million.
Yeah, but that's not because of skill my friend. You are comparing two very different things. In basketball, if you are over a decent height and have the skill of Michael Jordan, you can and probably will make it to the NBA. Yet, in bodybuilding there is no skill involved as long as you have the right GENETICS and react well to the drugs, that's all that counts. After that, there is NO SKILL involved, with the right trainer, nutritionist and drugs, you can go pro as long as the genetics are there..
In other words, what sets Michael Jordan apart from every other tall black guy is that he has the skill needed to excel in that sport. Skill that came after many, MANY years of practice. His genetics in this case had very little to do, because there are thousands of black guys over 6'6 who can't play ball for shit.
-YET-
What skill is there in PRO bodybuilding that isn't bought from a trainer, nutritionist or drug dealer?
In PRO bodybuilding, GENETICS and your body's ability to react to drugs is what determines whether or not you will be a PRO.
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Sure Shawn, but what makes them a professional at what they do based on what I have already explained? We know how these guys earn the title, but what makes a pro bodybuilder a professional at bodybuilding?
Money. If people pay me to do a job then I am a professional. Does not mean good or bad or qualified. The difference between a hooker and a one night stand girl is when the money is presented.
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Money. If people pay me to do a job then I am a professional. Does not mean good or bad or qualified. The difference between a hooker and a one night stand girl is when the money is presented.
Ok, so if all you do is go to the gym and work out year in and out and instead of competing in the NPC or IFBB, you instead go and pose in trunks covered in baby oil for a room full of GAY guys that pay you $80,000 a year to do this every other night for them, does this make you a PROFESSIONAL bodybuilder?
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Money. If people pay me to do a job then I am a professional. Does not mean good or bad or qualified. The difference between a hooker and a one night stand girl is when the money is presented.
Also, to add to what I just said, not every PRO has a Weider contract or even a sponsorship that pays them, some PROS have to hold a seperate job because they don't get paid anything at all and year in and out go to these IFBB competitions and never place only to go back home broke and depressed, so what about them? They are IFBB pros but do not get paid, what does that make them?
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You are a professional when it (be it bodybuilding, football, carpenting etc) is your profession.
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Ok, so if all you do is go to the gym and work out year in and out and instead of competing in the NPC or IFBB, you instead go and pose in trunks covered in baby oil for a room full of GAY guys that pay you $80,000 a year to do this every other night for them, does this make you a PROFESSIONAL bodybuilder?
no that would make you a professional dancer or stripper or..well you get my point. I am talking getting paid to work out and eat and show up at events and sign stuff. either by contract or endorsment. You could do that without winning any events and IMO that makes you a pro. Different then what other people may write but it's my 2 cents.I don't think it takes winning the super bowl to be considered a pro football player.
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Appearently a phone call to the PDI ;D
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That was great!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;D
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You are a professional when it (be it bodybuilding, football, carpenting etc) is your profession.
You are a professional when it (be it bodybuilding, football, carpenting etc) is your profession.
I beg to differ....
PROFESSIONAL
A professional is a worker required to possess a large body of knowledge derived from extensive academic study (usually tertiary), with the training almost always formalized.
Professions are at least to a degree self-regulating, in that they control the training and evaluation processes that admit new persons to the field, and in judging whether the work done by their members is up to standard. This differs from other kinds of work where regulation (if considered necessary) is imposed by the state, or where official quality standards are often lacking. Professions have some historical links to Guilds in these regards.
Professionals usually have autonomy in the workplace - they are expected to utilize their independent judgement and professional ethics in carrying out their responsibilities. This holds true even if they are employees instead of working on their own. Typically a professional provides a service (in exchange for payment or salary), in accordance with established protocols for licensing, ethics, procedures, standards of service and training / certification.
In narrow usage, not all expertise is considered a profession. Although sometimes referred to as professions, such occupations as skilled construction work are more generally thought of as trades or crafts. The completion of an apprenticeship is generally associated with skilled labor or trades such as carpenter, electrician, plumber, and other similar occupations. A related (though not always valid) distinction would be that a professional does mainly mental or administrative work, as opposed to engaging in physical work.
-----> Many IFBB Pros do not have a sponsorhip or even a Weider contract, so they don't get paid anything and need to take money out of their own pocket to buy the drugs and supplements in order to compete, doesn't that defeat the definition of a pro being someone who: Typically a professional provides a service (in exchange for payment or salary)
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It is a Business when you get your Pro Card.
There are huge differences on the revenue portion but the same can be said for the Law School Graduate trying to get with a Law Firm and the graduate that opens his own practice.
Both Lawyers by Law but the dollars separate them from being equals.
Some BBers have more opportunities by way of Exposure to the industry or Marketability and others suffer from lack of exposure and no marketability yet both are in the same business of making money and having to earn their pro cards by the same means.
Professionals "COMPETE" for Prize Money, Amateurs Don't, end story.
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I beg to differ....
PROFESSIONAL
A professional is a worker required to possess a large body of knowledge derived from extensive academic study (usually tertiary), with the training almost always formalized.
Professions are at least to a degree self-regulating, in that they control the training and evaluation processes that admit new persons to the field, and in judging whether the work done by their members is up to standard. This differs from other kinds of work where regulation (if considered necessary) is imposed by the state, or where official quality standards are often lacking. Professions have some historical links to Guilds in these regards.
Professionals usually have autonomy in the workplace - they are expected to utilize their independent judgement and professional ethics in carrying out their responsibilities. This holds true even if they are employees instead of working on their own. Typically a professional provides a service (in exchange for payment or salary), in accordance with established protocols for licensing, ethics, procedures, standards of service and training / certification.
In narrow usage, not all expertise is considered a profession. Although sometimes referred to as professions, such occupations as skilled construction work are more generally thought of as trades or crafts. The completion of an apprenticeship is generally associated with skilled labor or trades such as carpenter, electrician, plumber, and other similar occupations. A related (though not always valid) distinction would be that a professional does mainly mental or administrative work, as opposed to engaging in physical work.
-----> Many IFBB Pros do not have a sponsorhip or even a Weider contract, so they don't get paid anything and need to take money out of their own pocket to buy the drugs and supplements in order to compete, doesn't that defeat the definition of a pro being someone who: Typically a professional provides a service (in exchange for payment or salary)
That in this case would be his body correct? Appearing at events in shape (or close) and talking about themselves or what they are doing and taking home a check..service and payment=professional.
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no that would make you a professional dancer or stripper or..well you get my point. I am talking getting paid to work out and eat and show up at events and sign stuff. either by contract or endorsment. You could do that without winning any events and IMO that makes you a pro. Different then what other people may write but it's my 2 cents.I don't think it takes winning the super bowl to be considered a pro football player.
Dude, the guy in my scenario is a bodybuilder who works out year in and out and gets paid by these gay dudes to buy food, drugs, train and show up at gay bars and sign stuff and also to get into trunks, covered in baby oil and pose for a room full of gay men, the same gay men, which will judge him at the end of the night and let him know what he needs to work on. To add to that, this same bodybuilder can be sharing that spotlight (room full of gay men) with 4 other bodybuilders that are competing with him to get a trophy that night and or maybe an increase in his pay.
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That in this case would be his body correct? Appearing at events in shape (or close) and talking about themselves or what they are doing and taking home a check..service and payment=professional.
So back to my example with the bodybuilder that trains year in and out, and poses only for gay men. He provides a service and receives a payment, is he now a Pro because the united league of homosexuals pay him a salary of $80,000 to trains year round, eat properly, take posing classes, and you get the point..
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Dude, the guy in my scenario is a bodybuilder who works out year in and out and gets paid by these gay dudes to buy food, drugs, train and show up at gay bars and sign stuff and also to get into trunks, covered in baby oil and pose for a room full of gay men, the same gay men, which will judge him at the end of the night and let him know what he needs to work on. To add to that, this same bodybuilder can be sharing that spotlight (room full of gay men) with 4 other bodybuilders that are competing with him to get a trophy that night and or maybe an increase in his pay.
If you take the gay out of your paragraph then what you have is a bodybuilding compitition with a winner and a check, that seems to me to equal professional as per your definition.
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Professionals "COMPETE" for Prize Money, Amateurs Don't, end story.
Shawn, I respect your attempts to answer the question, but I think we are going to have to leave this one to good old Robert Michael. If that statement you made holds true, then being a professional bodybuilder has lost its value in this industry since the PDI has been giving pro cards to amateurs at will. Hence, why your statement holds no weight..
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If you take the gay out of your paragraph then what you have is a bodybuilding compitition with a winner and a check, that seems to me to equal professional as per your definition.
Yeah, but that same bodybuilder wouldn't be considered a PRO bodybuilder by an IFBB pro.
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So back to my example with the bodybuilder that trains year in and out, and poses only for gay men. He provides a service and receives a payment, is he now a Pro because the united league of homosexuals pay him a salary of $80,000 to trains year round, eat properly, take posing classes, and you get the point..
I agree in theory, if you have a league of bodybuilders/football players/fisherman and you have a contest and declare a winner then you have a professional. there are many world champino boxers and boxing associations one is no less different or better then the next. The guys who won in the WBF (Vince) may have never competed before or after and would have by definition professional bodybuilders, being paid to do there job.
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Yeah, but that same bodybuilder wouldn't be considered a PRO bodybuilder by an IFBB pro.
Just because one body won't recognise another does not change the status of the person in that body.
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I agree in theory, if you have a league of bodybuilders/football players/fisherman and you have a contest and declare a winner then you have a professional. there are many world champino boxers and boxing associations one is no less different or better then the next. The guys who won in the WBF (Vince) may have never competed before or after and would have by definition professional bodybuilders, being paid to do there job.
See, that there is the problem Im trying to figure out. Just because someone off the streets gets picked up and paid to go into a classroom to teach a class doesn't make them a teacher. Likewise, there has to be something that makes a professional bodybuilder a professional, because as I stated before, some of these IFBB pros never see any money, hence the issue of needing to get paid to be a professional becomes null and void..
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Just because one body won't recognise another does not change the status of the person in that body.
So then, every gym owner can start his own federation and by way of granting out titles determine that all of his gym members are pros and that would hold true then yes?
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Gentlemen,
I need to take a shit now and because of it, will not be able to respond to any of the answers/ideas provided for a few hours (Thus, I fancy myself a professional defecator)..
be back..
"1"
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See, that there is the problem Im trying to figure out. Just because someone off the streets gets picked up and paid to go into a classroom to teach a class doesn't make them a teacher. Likewise, there has to be something that makes a professional bodybuilder a professional, because as I stated before, some of these IFBB pros never see any money, hence the issue of needing to get paid to be a professional becomes null and void..
See your confusing being good with doing a job. You can walk off the street and teach (learning annix) about a subject you know or hell something made up (building relationships 101) thus you get a check and are considered a "teacher". Just because you get a check for doing a job does not make you good. Just because a bodybuilder has a pro card and makes money does not make him good. You think the term professional relates to knowledge or skill IMHO it does not. There is a wide gap between being a paid to do a job as your profession and being a expert in the field of your profession.
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what makes a pro? lots of drugs, some synthol, lots of self obsession,spending years in gym, lazing around living on mom's food to 'fight for your pro card' , sometimes gay for pay
just about covers everything
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True quote from an IFBB pro here in So Cal:
"The only difference between pros and amateurs is the amount of drugs, that's it! There's no SPECIAL way of training or dieting..." :o
For obvious reasons I'll keep his name confidential ;D
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So then, every gym owner can start his own federation and by way of granting out titles determine that all of his gym members are pros and that would hold true then yes?
Thats how leagues or federations get started. Some guy fronts the cash gets a name and a set of rules. Others join, some sort of organization or contest is held, some win or place and rankings are made and the top people are considered pro's by that group. If it's not reconised by other larger groups then people fight about it. If it is santioned then status is achieved. If that group has enough people that that like the group and the pro's and start to throw cash that direction then it gains fame and with that the general view of people from the outside is its a "real" group and identifies it's top people as Pro's. The USFL in football is a good example, they tried to take on the bigger NFL and it's players became pro's not because of the NFL but in spite of it. IF a new bodybuilding group opposed to the IFBB started up and had a bankroll to make it bigger and better and offer more then after some time it would overshadow the IFBB and a new group of PRO's would be born.
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There are many examples of the kind of people you just mentioned.
They run the gamit from being Intelligent, Stupid, Ridiculous, Entrepreneurs, Murderer's, Porn Stars, Doctors, Specialists, Etc.
Take a good look at our President of the USA, not the sharpest Tool in the box but he is in the White House nonetheless. :-\
Shawanna tells himself this everynite before dreaming of never winning the O ;D
..always the brides maid...eh shawanna ;D
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I dont get the point that there is no skill involved in becoming a pro bodybuilder.Its not a skill in the traditional sense of the word,but there is a skill involved in it.Training year after year is a skill,so is eating right day after day,so is enduring the same thing everday ,day after day.Its funny,most of us work at jobs that a monkey could do and think we are doing something good,but a pro bodybuilder gets ripped for being a one in a million guy.Tell me,what skill is there to driving a truck,or stocking shelves or banging nails.Bodybuilding is a test of ones will and the ones who make it cetainly have done something great.
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I dont get the point that there is no skill involved in becoming a pro bodybuilder.Its not a skill in the traditional sense of the word,but there is a skill involved in it.Training year after year is a skill,so is eating right day after day,so is enduring the same thing everday ,day after day.Its funny,most of us work at jobs that a monkey could do and think we are doing something good,but a pro bodybuilder gets ripped for being a one in a million guy.Tell me,what skill is there to driving a truck,or stocking shelves or banging nails.Bodybuilding is a test of ones will and the ones who make it cetainly have done something great.
Billy,
If your job entails driving a truck, stocking shelves or banging nails, I feel sorry for you. Some of us actually have college degrees, post-grad degrees and make "REAL" money saving lives, defending clients in a court setting and even investing in real estate. Whereas you might think your job is one that a monkey could do, not everyone shares that sentiment.
(As per your comment up top in bold)
Training year after year isn't a skill. These guys do it, because if not for bodybuilding they probably wouldn't have anything else to fall back on. Again, as I have stated previously, these guys don't train on their own, instead they hire PROFESSIONAL trainers to train them. "Eating right day after day" is not something a professional bodybuilder does. Day after day for 80% of the year a PRO bodybuilder is fat and disgusting carrying in excess of over 60 - 80 pounds of weight, horrible for the heart and as aesthetically pleasing as Elton John in a Fitness contest for competitors aged 10 and below.
Everyone/Anyone CAN be a bodybuilder, but not everyone can become a doctor, lawyer, engineer or businessman (loosely used).
Hell, don't even get me started about how the bulk of these "pros" make due by selling drugs and selling themselves to the gay population to make ends meet. Highly unprofessional..
"1"
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Billy,
If your job entails driving a truck, stocking shelves or banging nails, I feel sorry for you. Some of us actually have college degrees, post-grad degrees and make "REAL" money saving lives, defending clients in a court setting and even investing in real estate. Whereas you might think your job is one that a monkey could do, not everyone shares that sentiment.
(As per your comment up top in bold)
Training year after year isn't a skill. These guys do it, because if not for bodybuilding they probably wouldn't have anything else to fall back on. Again, as I have stated previously, these guys don't train on their own, instead they hire PROFESSIONAL trainers to train them. "Eating right day after day" is not something a professional bodybuilder does. Day after day for 80% of the year a PRO bodybuilder is fat and disgusting carrying in excess of over 60 - 80 pounds of weight, horrible for the heart and as aesthetically pleasing as Elton John in a Fitness contest for competitors aged 10 and below.
Everyone/Anyone CAN be a bodybuilder, but not everyone can become a doctor, lawyer, engineer or businessman (loosely used).
Hell, don't even get me started about how the bulk of these "pros" make due by selling drugs and selling themselves to the gay population to make ends meet. Highly unprofessional..
"1"
1st, not anyone can be a bodybuilder. You can be born without a arm or leg or have some sort of illness that no matter what you do or take you will not put on muscle. You can be a cripple and become a doctor or lawyer or businessman,ect. Unless your mentally challenged given the support and time you can do anything in the above fields except bodybuilding. Training may not be a skill in your opinion but whats the difference between bodybuilding and football or baseball or golf? Being consistent in your chossen field will take you a long away and set you apart. Not everyone is willing to make the sacrifice it takes to be a bodybuilder, same as being a doctor.
I think IMHO your confusing moraility with job choice. If you choose to be a doctor and you push yourself to far for to long you can die (car crash from lack of sleep,mental breakdown,ect) same as with bodybuilding. Anything you do to excess will get you. Just because a bodybuilder has to break the current law (IN the USA) does not take from the choice and drive and desire to make it the same as a havard law or johns hopkins doctor it's just different.
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What is it that makes these so-called Professional bodybuilders, professional? Besides the fact that they get paid to pose on stage and might, if lucky, get some sponsorship, what truly sets them out as a professional in their field?
What sets us apart, isthe fact that each and every one has achieved a level of success that deemed us worthy of comepting as a "professional" in the most recognized federation in the world...no different than being accepted into the NFL as a pro ball player.
You don't have to belong to the IFBB to get paid like a Pro bodybuilder, you can work privately and get sponsorship and income by way of the GAY-4-PAY network. So that dismisses the idea that if a person gets paid to do what they do, they, by way of default, are considered professional.
As a professional "bodybuilder" you compete in a organized (IFBB) competition for a purse, and work in the businesss of bodybuilding i.e.- supp company/ appearances/ seminars, etc...legitimate business, not bullshit.
A doctor knows his craft well enough that he can work on his own, a teacher knows his subject matter in a way that he is self-sufficient and capable of providing his students with what they need based on his knowledge base...etc.. What does a Professional bodybuilder truly know?
They knew enough to earn themselves a pro card in the IFBB...many dr.'s, lawyers, etc. consult with others in the field that may have expertise in certain areas...whether or not a pro bb decides to use someone to maximize their potential, or not, doesn't take away from their title of professional...no more than pro baseball players using a batting/ pitching coach.
Pros hire both a trainer and a nutritionist most of the time they compete or even train year round. If they need a professional trainer like Charles Glass to train them, what makes "them" a Professional at bodybuilding? If they need to hire a nutritionist like Chad Nicholls, Tom Prince or even Chris Aceto, what makes "them" a professional at proper bodybuilding diets?
Once again...the "status" is one of being deemed a professional, not the resources one chooses. The majority of pro's earned their pro cards without any "guru" helping...that comes along later when you're looking to expand your knowledge..much like a professional taking courses in their chosen field to further their education.
In other words, once you take the training and the eating out of the equation, what the hell else is left?
Training and eating ARE part of the equation....you dont take them out anymore than you would take out "hitting and catching" for a baseball player.
Genetics you can't change and/or even influence unless you are into breeding humans.
The only thing these guys might be actually pros at is injecting themselves in the ass with hormones and site injections of esiclene...
Again, this goes out to all the so-called pros here, what makes you a Pro?
Shawn is a great example of being a "pro"....Shawn earned his pro card early in his career, and to this day, has made his living with his craft...being a pro bodybuilder...winning prize money, securing endorsement deals, making appearances, guest posing all over the world, putting on seminars and camps, and most recently, promoting.....He has never to this day, ever held a "regular job"....
There are various levels of how successful one may be as a "pro"...but it doesn't diminish the value or title.
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What makes a Pro a Pro is quite simple and has been spelled out for many years:
WIN the Pro Qualification Show:
Overall and 1st Runner up at the Mr. USA
All Class Winners at the NPC Nationals
Overall Champion at the North American
Universe Class Winners
Team Uniiverse Winner
Petition the IFBB ala:
* Milos Sarcev, Lee Priest, JJ Marsh and few others from around the way via Wayne Demilia Glory Days of yore! ;D
Shawn, I agree that earning your way into the IFBB pro ranks is the one true pro level standard.
The IFBB is not the only pro div, we have many others like the PDI and pro "natural" organizations.However, in my opinion, the IFBB pros ranks is similar to the NFL or NBA in terms of status within their sport.
In the case of Milos and Lee P, they were national champs, so why not consider that legit as well?
The NPC masters nationals is giving out a pro card now as well.
One thing that is good about the NPC, is that you can compete in a variety of top shows, even drug tested ones like the Team U and climb the ladder to the top, if ya got the right stuff. With Kai Green making a big impact now, it shows that giving the Team U winner a pro card was a smart move. is Kai still natural , now as a pro? Doubt it, but who cares. My pt is that ANYONE with the right genetics and hardcore training/diet can EARN an IFBB pro card. Even a drug free or over 40 guy can earn one now. What they decide to do after they turn pro is up to them of course ;). Not too many sports offer that kind of open "try out".
The figure/fitness div is also a wonderful chance for those ladies NOT wanting extreme muscularity to still compete and become a pro in different kind of physique class.
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A Pro is not a Pro just because he has a Pro Card. Thats where Sean and a few others have it wrong. An IFBB Pro Card signifies you are now able to compete and make money competing. It does not guarantee it, it only allows you to try. Which is fine. Being a professional means how you make yourself look to the public on AND off the stage, court or field. You may do great in competition and make some money doing it, but if you are an asshole when you aren't competing, then you really are a sad example of a "professional." You are representing something that many people admire and they look up to professionals. WHen a professional acts like an asshole, it reflects on their personality and makes them look like amateurs. As a professional, you have a responsibility to the fans and people who support you by buying tickets to the shows. magazines with your pics in them products with your name and pic on them. Being a professional also means acting professional. Too and Sean and a couple others can only say they are professional, but they are far from it.
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A Pro is not a Pro just because he has a Pro Card. Thats where Sean and a few others have it wrong. An IFBB Pro Card signifies you are now able to compete and make money competing. It does not guarantee it, it only allows you to try. Which is fine. Being a professional means how you make yourself look to the public on AND off the stage, court or field. You may do great in competition and make some money doing it, but if you are an asshole when you aren't competing, then you really are a sad example of a "professional." You are representing something that many people admire and they look up to professionals. WHen a professional acts like an asshole, it reflects on their personality and makes them look like amateurs. As a professional, you have a responsibility to the fans and people who support you by buying tickets to the shows. magazines with your pics in them products with your name and pic on them. Being a professional also means acting professional. Too and Sean and a couple others can only say they are professional, but they are far from it.
Your lips to your ears bro....
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Appearently a phone call to the PDI ;D
Thought you had a house to move into today according to your alter ego Texas Fife. ::)
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Thought you had a house to move into today according to your alter ego Texas Fife. ::)
Alter ego...who are you talking too? Shawn is moving in to his house...call him.
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Alter ego...who are you talking too? Shawn is moving in to his house...call him.
I just called him and you answered. ???
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A Pro is not a Pro just because he has a Pro Card. Thats where Sean and a few others have it wrong. An IFBB Pro Card signifies you are now able to compete and make money competing. It does not guarantee it, it only allows you to try. Which is fine. Being a professional means how you make yourself look to the public on AND off the stage, court or field. You may do great in competition and make some money doing it, but if you are an asshole when you aren't competing, then you really are a sad example of a "professional." You are representing something that many people admire and they look up to professionals. WHen a professional acts like an asshole, it reflects on their personality and makes them look like amateurs. As a professional, you have a responsibility to the fans and people who support you by buying tickets to the shows. magazines with your pics in them products with your name and pic on them. Being a professional also means acting professional. Too and Sean and a couple others can only say they are professional, but they are far from it.
I feel your assessment is a tad to subjective. In my opinion ( my 2 cents) a pro is any bodybuilder/figure or fitness athlete that earns an IFBB pro card. What kind of a "pro" they are after that is a different story.
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I just called him and you answered. ???
And just who am I? I always answer my phone using my name; what was it? Feel free to post my number here too.
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And just who am I? I always answer my phone using my name; what was it? Feel free to post my number here too.
Exactly Sean! Assuming that you are not Sean ::) then how is it that anyone on here knows that you are truely an expert in anything and in what capacity?
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Exactly Sean! Assuming that you are not Sean ::) then how is it that anyone on here knows that you are truely an expert in anything and in what capacity?
There are plenty of folks on this board who know, that's how I got the stars. How do I know your an expert?
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There are plenty of folks on this board who know, that's how I got the stars. How do I know your an expert?
I contributer to this board in many ways and I am sure that you know this already Sean. You on the other hand have never contributed in anyway whether it be under your real name or fake accounts.
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I contributer to this board in many ways and I am sure that you know this already Sean. You on the other hand have never contributed in anyway whether it be under your real name or fake accounts.
Disgusted...don't be hurt. It's okay. Just take a deep breath and move on. We all contribute to this board in our own way.
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Disgusted...don't be hurt. It's okay. Just take a deep breath and move on. We all contribute to this board in our own way.
Even Keith?
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This, this, and these:
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Even Keith?
Hey don't get me involved with texasblubber shit. He gave Ron a blowjob for his expert stars. Only him and ROn know why he got them.
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And fucken these:
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Exactly Sean! Assuming that you are not Sean ::) then how is it that anyone on here knows that you are truely an expert in anything and in what capacity?
He is not Shawn. Dude you are just in love with Shawn aint ya? You think everybody is him. Hell you and a few other people on here thought I was also him. Did Tamali make you act this way? Anyways let it go already
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symetry,,proportion,,doesnt matter much what size you are,,,its all about symetry proportion and muscular development in the npc and anywhere else,,
very good genetic response to training and sport enhancing drugs is a must
time and will is a must too
something uniqe about your physiqe wil help too,,mainly shape of particular muscle group
coming on 100% on the day you are planning to get your pro card will help too! ;)
and yes ray is good example for a proffessional bodybuilder,,even though he jokes on the internet,,he is professional as he been making money from it for ever
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Even Keith?
Yes, even Keith on occassion has something worth reading when is not hating on the IFBB or Shawn.
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Yes, even Keith on occassion has something worth reading when is not hating on the IFBB or Shawn.
Texasbubba,
You are an expert at what? There should be a thread that allows each "PRO" and "EXPERT" be identified by their real identity for the purpose of not just being able to trust that they indeed are who they claim, but also in case anyone would like to purchase their PROfessional services.
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shawn ray was like a white collar worker as a pro ,the top of the line,treated the gym,diet,posing,appearance's,video's,photo's,presentation like a buisnessman.true to the trade and now moved on to a different aspect.
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What makes a Pro a Pro is quite simple and has been spelled out for many years:
WIN the Pro Qualification Show:
Overall and 1st Runner up at the Mr. USA
All Class Winners at the NPC Nationals
Overall Champion at the North American
Universe Class Winners
Team Uniiverse Winner
Petition the IFBB ala:
* Milos Sarcev, Lee Priest, JJ Marsh and few others from around the way via Wayne Demilia Glory Days of yore! ;D
SAHWN YOU FORGOT WIN YOUR NATIONAL TITLE FROM ANY COUNTRY.....YOU MAKE IT SEEM LIKE ONLY USA CAN TURN PRO YOU D UMB F UCK
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Bro..he mentioned it right here:
Petition the IFBB ala:
* Milos Sarcev, Lee Priest, JJ Marsh and few others from around the way via Wayne Demilia Glory Days of yore!
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WHY I WAS IN IFBB IN AUSTRALIA...WE HAVE IFBB AMATURE DOWN UNDER............SHAWNS A LITTLE BITCH
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Yes, even Keith on occassion has something worth reading when is not hating on the IFBB or Shawn.
hey hey hey. You aren't trying to bond with me are you.
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WHY I WAS IN IFBB IN AUSTRALIA...WE HAVE IFBB AMATURE DOWN UNDER............SHAWNS A LITTLE BITCH
Lee c'mon why be so negative, obviously we all know you are a legit pro. I even mentioned about winning nationals in other nations as well. How goes the race car deal? Howard
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SAHWN YOU FORGOT WIN YOUR NATIONAL TITLE FROM ANY COUNTRY.....YOU MAKE IT SEEM LIKE ONLY USA CAN TURN PRO YOU D UMB F UCK
Lee - dont let sean wind you up - he is a little fat c u nt who cant stay in any sort of shape without boat loads of gear !! Atleast you will still have muscle amd train when your an old man like him !!
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What is it that makes these so-called Professional bodybuilders, professional? Besides the fact that they get paid to pose on stage and might, if lucky, get some sponsorship, what truly sets them out as a professional in their field?
You don't have to belong to the IFBB to get paid like a Pro bodybuilder, you can work privately and get sponsorship and income by way of the GAY-4-PAY network. So that dismisses the idea that if a person gets paid to do what they do, they, by way of default, are considered professional.
A doctor knows his craft well enough that he can work on his own, a teacher knows his subject matter in a way that he is self-sufficient and capable of providing his students with what they need based on his knowledge base...etc.. What does a Professional bodybuilder truly know?
Pros hire both a trainer and a nutritionist most of the time they compete or even train year round. If they need a professional trainer like Charles Glass to train them, what makes "them" a Professional at bodybuilding? If they need to hire a nutritionist like Chad Nicholls, Tom Prince or even Chris Aceto, what makes "them" a professional at proper bodybuilding diets?
In other words, once you take the training and the eating out of the equation, what the hell else is left?
Genetics you can't change and/or even influence unless you are into breeding humans.
The only thing these guys might be actually pros at is injecting themselves in the ass with hormones and site injections of esiclene...
Again, this goes out to all the so-called pros here, what makes you a Pro?
more money more drugs more muscle.
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Are you implying that being a lawyer is more noble then being a bodybuilder.Jesus man,lawyers are hated even more then politicians.Nothing but a bunch of ambulance chasers clogging up our legal system with assanine lawsuits like suing McDs for a coffee burn.There is ZERO skill in being a lawyer.Now,since you asked,I'm a college grad and dint drive a truck etc.However,a pro bodybuilder is EVERY bit as valuable as being a lawyer.In fact professional athletes are THE MOST important people in our society because they give us hours and hours of entertainment.Thats why 40,000 people will go watch them preform.Any doctor or lawyer or teacher drawing in 40,000 to watch them?Put some lawyer on a cover of any mag and see how it sells.No,bodybuilding and bodybuilders are far more important then the scheister lawyers or lazy ass teachers that you seem to think so highly of and thats why you post on a bodybuilding web site all day.
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Billy,
If your job entails driving a truck, stocking shelves or banging nails, I feel sorry for you. Some of us actually have college degrees, post-grad degrees and make "REAL" money saving lives, defending clients in a court setting and even investing in real estate. Whereas you might think your job is one that a monkey could do, not everyone shares that sentiment.
(As per your comment up top in bold)
Training year after year isn't a skill. These guys do it, because if not for bodybuilding they probably wouldn't have anything else to fall back on. Again, as I have stated previously, these guys don't train on their own, instead they hire PROFESSIONAL trainers to train them. "Eating right day after day" is not something a professional bodybuilder does. Day after day for 80% of the year a PRO bodybuilder is fat and disgusting carrying in excess of over 60 - 80 pounds of weight, horrible for the heart and as aesthetically pleasing as Elton John in a Fitness contest for competitors aged 10 and below.
Everyone/Anyone CAN be a bodybuilder, but not everyone can become a doctor, lawyer, engineer or businessman (loosely used).
Hell, don't even get me started about how the bulk of these "pros" make due by selling drugs and selling themselves to the gay population to make ends meet. Highly unprofessional..
"1"
why would you feel sorry for somebody that actually works for a living? are you royalty?
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Are you implying that being a lawyer is more noble then being a bodybuilder.Jesus man,lawyers are hated even more then politicians.Nothing but a bunch of ambulance chasers clogging up our legal system with assanine lawsuits like suing McDs for a coffee burn.There is ZERO skill in being a lawyer.Now,since you asked,I'm a college grad and dint drive a truck etc.However,a pro bodybuilder is EVERY bit as valuable as being a lawyer.In fact professional athletes are THE MOST important people in our society because they give us hours and hours of entertainment.Thats why 40,000 people will go watch them preform.Any doctor or lawyer or teacher drawing in 40,000 to watch them?Put some lawyer on a cover of any mag and see how it sells.No,bodybuilding and bodybuilders are far more important then the scheister lawyers or lazy ass teachers that you seem to think so highly of and thats why you post on a bodybuilding web site all day.
dnt be an idiot, lawyer = good living
pro bbder = g4pay
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Are you implying that being a lawyer is more noble then being a bodybuilder.Jesus man,lawyers are hated even more then politicians.Nothing but a bunch of ambulance chasers clogging up our legal system with assanine lawsuits like suing McDs for a coffee burn.There is ZERO skill in being a lawyer.Now,since you asked,I'm a college grad and dint drive a truck etc.However,a pro bodybuilder is EVERY bit as valuable as being a lawyer.In fact professional athletes are THE MOST important people in our society because they give us hours and hours of entertainment.Thats why 40,000 people will go watch them preform.Any doctor or lawyer or teacher drawing in 40,000 to watch them?Put some lawyer on a cover of any mag and see how it sells.No,bodybuilding and bodybuilders are far more important then the scheister lawyers or lazy ass teachers that you seem to think so highly of and thats why you post on a bodybuilding web site all day.
dnt be an idiot, lawyers are skilled professionals that make decent $$$$
bodybuilders are body dismorphic insecure drug injecting ppl, that make NO $$$$
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practice what you preach retard, dont hit the reply button twice cocksock
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No,LAWER =guy AMBULANCE CHASER DESTROYING OUR CONTRY WITH FRIVOLOUS LAWSUITS AND GETTING SCUM BAGS OFF WITH ZERO JAIL TIME.ALSO THE VAST MAJORITY OF POLITICIANS ARE LAWERS,ENOUGH SAID.
BODYBUILDERS=THE VERY DEFINITION OF MANHOOD.
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isn't it any individual whom wins their card?
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No,LAWER =#### AMBULANCE CHASER DESTROYING OUR CONTRY WITH FRIVOLOUS LAWSUITS AND GETTING SCUM BAGS OFF WITH ZERO JAIL TIME.ALSO THE VAST MAJORITY OF POLITICIANS ARE LAWERS,ENOUGH SAID.
BODYBUILDERS=THE VERY DEFINITION OF MANHOOD.
Yeah buddy, free Titus and put all the lawyers and congress in jail...right on!
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why would you feel sorry for somebody that actually works for a living? are you royalty?
I don't feel sorry for "anyone" that works for a living, BUT I do feel sorry for guys that make a living by driving a truck or even stocking shelves, because it shows that their brain is just taking up space and could much rather do without it. There is a saying that these youngsters now a days use, it goes something like, "Don't work harder, work smarter".
In other words, why would you waste so much time making minimum wage at a shitty job at Mcdonalds when with the right degree you can make what a Mcdonald's employee makes in a week in a few hours?
You don't need to be royalty to understand that life, like Adonis mentioned in another thread, shouldn't be wasted on work day in and out.
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I don't feel sorry for "anyone" that works for a living, BUT I do feel sorry for guys that make a living by driving a truck or even stocking shelves, because it shows that their brain is just taking up space and could much rather do without it. There is a saying that these youngsters now a days use, it goes something like, "Don't work harder, work smarter".
In other words, why would you waste so much time making minimum wage at a shitty job at Mcdonalds when with the right degree you can make what a Mcdonald's employee makes in a week in a few hours?
You don't need to be royalty to understand that life, like Adonis mentioned in another thread, shouldn't be wasted on work day in and out.
Any man or woman that works a steady job is ok in my book. I did a lot of crappy, low end jobs before I became a teacher, and I am not rich doing that obviously
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I don't feel sorry for "anyone" that works for a living, BUT I do feel sorry for guys that make a living by driving a truck or even stocking shelves, because it shows that their brain is just taking up space and could much rather do without it. There is a saying that these youngsters now a days use, it goes something like, "Don't work harder, work smarter".
In other words, why would you waste so much time making minimum wage at a shitty job at Mcdonalds when with the right degree you can make what a Mcdonald's employee makes in a week in a few hours?
You don't need to be royalty to understand that life, like Adonis mentioned in another thread, shouldn't be wasted on work day in and out.
not everybody is born to wealth like you were and consequently has to sell drugs to be successful(smart)
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not everybody is born to wealth like you were and consequently has to sell drugs to be successful(smart)
Drugs to be successful?? You make no sense and obviously are going off on your very own tangent. Thanks, but my conversation with you is over.
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Phone call to IFBB telling them that you have a big waist with a wonderfull GUT
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I don't feel sorry for "anyone" that works for a living, BUT I do feel sorry for guys that make a living by driving a truck or even stocking shelves, because it shows that their brain is just taking up space and could much rather do without it. There is a saying that these youngsters now a days use, it goes something like, "Don't work harder, work smarter".
Some truckers make the same as certain professionals, as do plumbers and electricians. Unless you are Stephen Hawking, you'll need to work hard to reach your goals. Infact, most smart people do work hard because they are able to see the big picture, as opposed to someone who stocks shelves for life. And naturally, young people will not be able to aquire high paying jobs due to inexperience and lack of education. They'll be working simple positions.
And I'd like to see you drive a rig attached to a 53 foot trailer that has 10+ cars. My older brother does that for a living.. He used to be an engineering major are Ohio State university, but dropped out due to drug addiction and several other problems. He isn't an idiot by any means, but he isn't savy either as he's made some bad choices in life.
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and if you OWN the trucking company business or OWN the plumbing business you just might be smart
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Genetics, Luck, being in the right place, timing bla bla bla have nothing to do with actually COMPETING in a PRO QUALIFIER against everyone else on the day of the show and BEATING THEM to EARN your Pro Card!
Is there anything more satisfying than accomplishing that?
Maybe doing it for pay but here is the rub.............There are a few Pro Champions and many more people trying to become Pro but on the day you win your Pro Card, it is reserved and memorialize in our memories as the date of ARRIVAL for those who Dreamed that lttle Dream way back when, the rest of the career as a Pro is but a Blur by comparision to this special day for many.
Peace,
S
Nice explanation from a man who has done it.