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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: benz on November 01, 2007, 01:10:41 PM
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A tru hero, we will nevar4get.
Hope you drope another "little boy" in heaven, just like you did in Hiroshima.
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dropping those bombs saved tens of thousands of American soldiers lives due to not having to attack mainland Japan, jackass.
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Probably biggest mass killer ever?
Little Boy killed around 10k people? Who else has ACTIVELY actually killed that many people with one press of a button?
And we are not talking about giving the order to kill but actually physically doing something that
kills 10k people?
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dropping those bombs saved tens of thousands of American soldiers lives due to not having to attack mainland Japan, jackass.
Weell yeah maybe but I guess It would have been enough to drop in the hills surrounding Hiroshima... and the Bomb on Nagasaki... was kinda pointless.
Make no mistake the US wanted to test the bomb and they saw a good chance to kill two flies so to speak.
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dropping those bombs saved tens of thousands of American soldiers lives due to not having to attack mainland Japan, jackass.
it's debatable, really. i read a few reports that said japan was trying to surrender but stalin was blocking their attempts by not passing the word along. also there's the fact that 10,000 soldiers expect to fight and possibly die, but 300,000 citizens don't expect to be slow roasted. i know it's unpopular, but i'd rather 10 soldiers die than 500 civilians, even if the soldiers are from my country.
oh, and he isn't an hero. he may be a hero, but not an hero. http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/index.php/An_hero
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it's debatable, really. i read a few reports that said japan was trying to surrender but stalin was blocking their attempts by not passing the word along. also there's the fact that 10,000 soldiers expect to fight and possibly die, but 300,000 citizens don't expect to be slow roasted. i know it's unpopular, but i'd rather 10 soldiers die than 500 civilians, even if the soldiers are from my country.
oh, and he isn't an hero. he may be a hero, but not an hero. http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/index.php/An_hero
Fully agree, Hiroshima however was a military target as in there were large numbers of Soldiers present, all the factories and so forth, but yes I agree it was wrong to drop it on a place that had so many Civilians.
But at that time people did not concern them self with collateral damage, I mean look at the massaker at Dresden, no Military target value what so ever... and constantly bombed for 2 days and nights, firebombs included.
Make no mistake the US wanted to kill as many civilians as possible in Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the Brits in Dresden.
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dropping those bombs saved tens of thousands of American soldiers lives due to not having to attack mainland Japan, jackass.
I AGREE, THATS WHY HE'S AN HERO.
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it's debatable, really. i read a few reports that said japan was trying to surrender but stalin was blocking their attempts by not passing the word along. also there's the fact that 10,000 soldiers expect to fight and possibly die, but 300,000 citizens don't expect to be slow roasted. i know it's unpopular, but i'd rather 10 soldiers die than 500 civilians, even if the soldiers are from my country.
oh, and he isn't an hero. he may be a hero, but not an hero. http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/index.php/An_hero
He's a tru hero. Do you think there would be any IRAQ war right now if a man with paul tibbets's balls were alive? No way, another little boy would have been dropped already and many problems would be gone.
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I AGREE, THATS WHY HE'S AN HERO.
Maybe in your country ::) we in civilized country's like to pick our heroes more carefully, for instance a Man that has
contribute to worldpreace and maybe we go mad and call somebody hero who has actually saved life's and not destroyed them.
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I AGREE, THATS WHY HE'S AN HERO.
oh i thought by the "little boy" statement you were suggesting that he purposefully killed children, my bad.
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Stark
Like it or not, he's your hero too. He dropped little boy to guarantee a better future for america.
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Probably biggest mass killer ever?
Little Boy killed around 10k people? Who else has ACTIVELY actually killed that many people with one press of a button?
And we are not talking about giving the order to kill but actually physically doing something that
kills 10k people?
It was much more than that. From memory it was 70k from the initial blast and then a good few more from radiation. This is just from memory though so i may be wrong...
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Stark
Like it or not, he's your hero too. He dropped little boy to guarantee a better future for America.
Yeah but hmm I don't life in the states ;) and he did not drop the bomb to secure a better future ::)
He dropped the bomb because somebody told him to do so...
For me the definition of a Hero is a person that has to make a life or death decision, a decision that could
easily end his own life... a brave decision...
Tibbets just followed orders.
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It was much more than that. From memory it was 70k from the initial blast and then a good few more from radiation. This is just from memory though so i may be wrong...
66,000 out of a population of 255,000. 45,000 died the first day and 19,000 during the next 4 months after hiroshima's ethnic cleansing (American Study)
78,150 dead, 13,893 missing, 92,000 in total (missings are pressumed dead by now) (Jap study).
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66,000 out of a population of 255,000. 45,000 died the first day and 19,000 during the next 4 months after hiroshima's ethnic cleansing (American Study)
78,150 dead, 13,893 missing, 92,000 in total (missings are pressumed dead by now) (Jap study).
hahahaha, million degree heat will do that.
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With 2 little boys we could stop the abuse of raged muslims @ iraq & iran. If it worked with japs, must work with muslims haha
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Weell yeah maybe but I guess It would have been enough to drop in the hills surrounding Hiroshima... and the Bomb on Nagasaki... was kinda pointless.
Make no mistake the US wanted to test the bomb and they saw a good chance to kill two flies so to speak.
Nagasaki was to prove we had multiples. But considering how cruel the japanese were in Nanking (up to 300,000 dead) and how they knowlingly allied with the country responsible for the holocaust, I say they had it coming and more.
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dropping those bombs saved tens of thousands of American soldiers lives due to not having to attack mainland Japan, jackass.
It was more like saving a million American lives.
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He's a tru hero. Do you think there would be any IRAQ war right now if a man with paul tibbets's balls were alive? No way, another little boy would have been dropped already and many problems would be gone.
you clearly don't understand world politics. if we nuked iraq, can you imagine what the rest of the Middle East would do? say goodbye to our oil supply. more than that, the message would be sent to NK and iran to "get a nuke quick, or they'll attack!" and then next thing you know it's a global cold war.
the hiroshima/nagasaki bombings ONLY worked because no one else had nuclear weapons. it would be monumentally fucking stupid to drop one now, particularly if that country had any allies that had nukes of their own. it's why we're so careful with korea, because china and russia are on their side.
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"AN HERO"
?????? ::)
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With 2 little boys we could stop the abuse of raged muslims @ iraq & iran. If it worked with japs, must work with muslims haha
I would like to drop couple off fist in your face asshole >:(
What you think about iran drooping couple of little boys on your town and kill your family?
You think dat you are untouchable?
You don't think dat Hiroshima can happen in your yard?
You are wrong!!!
So sit down and shut up and enjoy in your miserly life till you can!!!
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"AN HERO"
?????? ::)
Yeah why? He did a good thing, just accept it!
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I would like to drop couple off fist in your face asshole >:(
What you think about iran drooping couple of little boys on your town and kill your family?
You think dat you are untouchable?
You don't think dat Hiroshima can happen in your yard?
You are wrong :-*
So sit down and shut up and enjoy in your miserly life till you can :-*
Let me guess: You are a terrorist, oh excuse me, i mean, a good muslim
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I would like to drop couple off fist in your face asshole >:(
What you think about iran drooping couple of little boys on your town and kill your family?
You think dat you are untouchable?
You don't think dat Hiroshima can happen in your yard?
You are wrong!!!
So sit down and shut up and enjoy in your miserly life till you can!!!
meltdown
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meltdown
Yeah, typical raged terrorist trying to save his ass from the all mighty LITTLE BOY.
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Little boy, do you know what the name of the other bomb was ;D
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That's what they get for attacking us.
BUT...I do find it funny how we will not allow any other country to have the weapons (which is good) but WE are the only ones,as far as I recall, to ever actually NUKE someone.(even though they were nothing compared to the WMD now) :-\ WE have them...WE have used them...but we are going to tell other countries they are not allowed to have them. hahaha talk about hypocritical. Don't get me wrong, we can't allow the nutcases like Iraq to have them or we would all be done for...but it is sorta like the pot calling the kettle black,so to speak.
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Little boy, do you know what the name of the other bomb was ;D
Fat man I think
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theres only one hero.
(http://www.ishipress.com/saddam3.jpg)
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Little boy, do you know what the name of the other bomb was ;D
PHAT MAN LOL
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it was fat man
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but I can see what spoiled pansy liberals are doing now to sabotage their own country.
me too...putting George Bush in the White House.
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Yup. One of the best moves we made. Thousands were saved. Probably millions in the long run. And, kept Capitalism alive.
People tweak about the, what, 1600 lost in the Iraq war over the past years. That's awful, but what would they think about the 10k lost on D-Day (a single day)? http://www.ddaymuseum.co.uk/faq.htm
And: "Over 425,000 Allied and German troops were killed, wounded or went missing during the Battle of Normandy."
...not that I'm an expert, but I can see what spoiled pansy liberals are doing now to sabotage their own country.
Amen brother
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me too...putting George Bush in the White House.
Bush is the biggest liberal in Washington.
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The midget Bush and that Rumsfield deserve only to be beaten with shoes by freedom loving people everywhere.
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Bush is the biggest liberal in Washington.
biggest idiot too.
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biggest idiot too.
hahaha, his own party can't stand him, what a fuccking embarassment, the government is at it's all time largest and he's the biggest spender of any president ever and he claims to be a conservative, gimme a fucckin' break.
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biggest idiot too.
Yeah anyone can be president these days.
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The best George could do right now, is to find a new PAUL TIBBETS and nuke those terrorists.
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(http://www.farcereport.com/images/bush-idiot.jpg)
strategery.
The best George could do right now, is to find a new PAUL TIBBETS and nuke those terrorists.
Oh yeah...that would be just brilliant. ::)
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The best George could do right now, is to find a new PAUL TIBBETS and nuke those terrorists.
that's actually the WORST thing he could do, he needs to leave the whole fuccking situation alone and pull the fucck out of there and drop all our support for Israel, that will solve all our problems with the "terrorists".
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The best George could do right now, is to find a new PAUL TIBBETS and nuke those terrorists.
by bombing the 2nd terrorist (first is usa) state Israel?
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Israel is a good target too. The world didnt care in the past, they wont care either now.
go for it!
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hahahaha, million degree heat will do that.
This is the best guide to Squadfather's psyche. Only a psycho weirdo would find mass death something to laugh at. (Then again, Squadfather starts just about every post with hahahahaha. He may have his getbig posts programmed to lead every post this way, even when he is trying to make a serious statement.)
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This is the best guide to Squadfather's psyche. Only a psycho weirdo would find mass death something to laugh at. (Then again, Squadfather starts just about every post with hahahahaha. He may have his getbig posts programmed to lead every post this way, even when he is trying to make a serious statement.)
calm down sister it aint that serious. :P
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Little boy, do you know what the name of the other bomb was ;D
Squadfather...I mean Fat Man.
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This is the best guide to Squadfather's psyche. Only a psycho weirdo would find mass death something to laugh at. (Then again, Squadfather starts just about every post with hahahahaha. He may have his getbig posts programmed to lead every post this way, even when he is trying to make a serious statement.)
Most humor is based on death or loss.
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He's a tru hero. Do you think there would be any IRAQ war right now if a man with paul tibbets's balls were alive? No way, another little boy would have been dropped already and many problems would be gone.
tibbets was just following orders.
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tibbets was just following orders.
He had the balls to not fail, hence, an hero.
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it's debatable, really. i read a few reports that said japan was trying to surrender but stalin was blocking their attempts by not passing the word along. also there's the fact that 10,000 soldiers expect to fight and possibly die, but 300,000 citizens don't expect to be slow roasted. i know it's unpopular, but i'd rather 10 soldiers die than 500 civilians, even if the soldiers are from my country.
oh, and he isn't an hero. he may be a hero, but not an hero. http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/index.php/An_hero
Japan's gov't/military was gridlocked at this point. The dropping of the bombs fixed that problem. Real fast.
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Yeah why? He did a good thing, just accept it!
I was commenting on your poor English. It's "a hero" not "an hero".
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As far as the nuclear bombings of Japan at the end of World War two, it should be remembered that the decisions were made with what we knew THEN.
What we knew THEN was that project Olympia (the code name for the projected Japanese invasion, ironic, no?) would have entailed casualties in the high hundred thousands, maybe a million.
What we knew THEN was that Germany was shipping to Japan in Unterseeboot #235 (another irony, U235) the components for a possible radiological attack on the California coast.
While internationally, the United States is derided for the Jingoism exhibited today (they make it sound as if that is a bad thing, mysteriously), at the time, that attitude was much more prevalent, especially considering the circumstances.
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I want to clarify that last sentence: I think it is a mystery why the international community acts as if the jingo attitude in the United States is a bad thing for the world.
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I was commenting on your poor English. It's "a hero" not "an hero".
I actually love to say AN HERO.
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'e ees ain 'eero.
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Most humor is based on death or loss.
Not "most". Much, maybe.
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I had a stomach ache...I just dropped off 1 fat man and a little boy in my toilet......problem gone. ;D
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"AN HERO"
?????? ::)
Hello...gimme a break, somebody!???
Is it just that all your 'roid-freak, drug-bloated, fucckers brain-cells have been destroyed with all dem BB drugs, or were you just born-stupid, and/or are totally uneducated/ignorant about WWII!???.
A few FACTS from WWII history...
The atomic bombings of Hiroshima (approx. top est.: 140,000 deaths) and Nagasaki (approx. top est.: 80,000 deaths) contributed approx. ONLY 3-5% to the total WWII property-destruction/loss-of-human-life of Japan by aerial bombardment.
The single March 9, 1945, B-29 conventional weapon low-level fire-bombing raid on Tokyo, alone, killed an estimated 80,000-100,000 people.
Fire bombing raids, ALONE, on Japanese cities killed an est. approx. 300,000-500,000 Japanese!
Estimates of deaths from the round-the-clock bombing of the German open city of Dresden by conventional bombing on Feb. 13/14 '45 have estimates as high as 70,000-100,000.
Had the A-bombs NOT been dropped on Japan, the Japanese would have fought on...necessitating the planned invasion of Japan (Operation Olympic/Downfall) in the fall of '45. And, this would have resulted in U.S./Japanese combined deaths in the MILLIONS!
My father, who fought in the battles of Guam/Saipan and Iwo Jima as a Marine, was scheduled to participate in Operation Olympic/Downfall.
I am sure he ONLY survived the war, as did hundreds-of-thousands/millions of American soldiers and Japanese, TOTALLY THANKS solely to the WWII droppings of the A-bombs, Colonel/General Tibbets, etc.!!!
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A real American Hero
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Probably biggest mass killer ever?
Little Boy killed around 10k people? Who else has ACTIVELY actually killed that many people with one press of a button?
And we are not talking about giving the order to kill but actually physically doing something that
kills 10k people?
TRY 140,000 PEOPLE.....THIS FREAK SHOULD BURN IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY FOR COMMITTING THIS MASS MURDER AND THEN BEING HERALDED AS A HERO FOR DOING IT.....
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He should have killed more. The Japanese are very very lucky they still exist as a people. I'll always be amazed that the Chinese didn't exterminate the entire population of Japan.... they would have deserved it.
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TRY 140,000 PEOPLE.....THIS FREAK SHOULD BURN IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY FOR COMMITTING THIS MASS MURDER AND THEN BEING HERALDED AS A HERO FOR DOING IT.....
Wow we'd have a lot of "mass murderers" in the US military if this was true....
He was executing an order given to him by his superiors, the US government. If you don't think war is unavoidable in this world, keep dreaming. Hero or not, he certainly helped contribute to the growth of this country, which is every country's goal, no matter where you live.
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It doesn't matter if many of you think this guy is not an hero.
To me, and to the thousands of japs who witnessed little boy fucking hiroshima, Paul Tibbets is AN HERO 4 LYFE.
Going for a beer, the less i can do for this great man.
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Weell yeah maybe but I guess It would have been enough to drop in the hills surrounding Hiroshima... and the Bomb on Nagasaki... was kinda pointless.
Make no mistake the US wanted to test the bomb and they saw a good chance to kill two flies so to speak.
Ok, this is my area of expertise. Pres Truman made the tough decision to drop the Little Boy U-235 fueled atomic bomb as it was projected to save a MINIMUM of 300,000 US soldiers and 2 million Japanese lives had we been required to invade the mainland. WE dropped the 1st bomb and the Japanese still refused to surrender, so we have to drop the Pu fueled fatman implosion bomb on Nagasaki.
Refer to the book " The Making of the Atomic Bomb" by Rhodes
Paul Tibbets carried out his mission and did what was required of him. Trust me had Heisenberg been able to complete a Nazi atomic bomb they would have hit New York NY whenever they were able. Unlike Iraq and Viet Nam , WWII was a war that we needed to win to insure the survival of western civilization.
As was previously stated, the firebombing of Tokyo by incendiary bombs, killed many more people then both A-bombs combined.
Food for thought. The avg 21st century thermonuclear war head in the equiv. of 500-1000 atomic bombs.
The little boy device was 15 Kilotons , where as a a thermonuclear weapon is measured in mega tons.
To see the now declassified atomic weapons testing from 1945 in Los Alamos NM to the early 1960's I refer you to the VHS or DVD version of "Trinity and Beyond, the atomic bomb movie".
I read some of the post on this an am a bit miffed at how some that seem so certain of the so called facts can be so wrong and unaware of what the actual historical and scientific facts are.
;) Dr Howard T White Ed D , national board and Ga state certified physics and chemistry teacher , 19 yrs experience and member of the American Assoc of Physics Teachers ;D
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People tweak about the, what, 1600 lost in the Iraq war over the past years.
3,870 dead as of today.
So pretty much the number you said. Then double it. Then add almost 500 more.
Did you stop watching the news in 2005, man?
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A tru hero, we will nevar4get.
Hope you drope another "little boy" in heaven, just like you did in Hiroshima.
Soup, /b/?
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3,870 dead as of today.
So pretty much the number you said. Then double it. Then add almost 500 more.
Did you stop watching the news in 2005, man?
Honestly talking, out fo the 3870, how many of them are PEREZ, LOPEZ, HERRERA, SANCHEZ? If you take away all the spics which illegaly made it to USA in the past and now are considered "americans", the real death toll of TRU AMERICANS would be like 500.
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Soup, /b/?
4chan? No thanks, im not a pedo.
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4chan? No thanks, im not a pedo.
Then you can't direct me to delicious loli?
(http://encyclopediadramatica.com/images/d/d5/Pedobear.png)
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Then you can't direct me to delicious loli?
(http://encyclopediadramatica.com/images/d/d5/Pedobear.png)
I guess i cant help you.
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I guess i cant help you.
In that case, which way to the corruption of LOL?
(http://encyclopediadramatica.com/images/b/b0/Pedobear_23.jpg)
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dropping those bombs saved tens of thousands of American soldiers lives due to not having to attack mainland Japan, jackass.
Japan had been trying to surrender from some time before the bombs dropped. Many historians question how much of an effect it had on ending the war. The bombs werent even dropped on any major infrastuctures or military sites and affected mainly civilians. I know this because I got my degree in east asian studies. Also spend some time studying in japan and some time there while in the army.
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Do you think the Japanese would have done it if the role had been reversed?
Was Pearl Harbor a sneak attack or not?
Were the Japanese (at the time) actively in cahoots with a country who was gassing Jewish civilians?
If the answers are yes... and I believe they all are. Then I don't see how you can say that in THAT INSTANCE that dropping that bomb was the wrong thing to do.
It didn't just save American Lives... it saved lives of many people around the world... Some of these Anti-American statements really seem to be because of what's going on TODAY, and not what actually happened 60 years ago.
Let's keep this real... at the time, it was the best thing to do.
I wouldn't do it today for our problems in the Middle-East, but then, at that moment, it was right.
Personally, I miss Saddam... He kept those neanderthals in check.
Japan had been trying to surrender from some time before the bombs dropped.
Says who? Japan? Would you expect them to say something else?
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Japan had been trying to surrender from some time before the bombs dropped. Many historians question how much of an effect it had on ending the war. The bombs werent even dropped on any major infrastuctures or military sites and affected mainly civilians. I know this because I got my degree in east asian studies. Also spend some time studying in japan and some time there while in the army.
I rfer you to my post above the references there to inform you of the actual facts. Thanks
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In that case, which way to the corruption of LOL?
(http://encyclopediadramatica.com/images/b/b0/Pedobear_23.jpg)
right near the disintegration of the HOPI
friggin retard
quite speaking sputnik and back away from the child in your room, homo
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Do you think the Japanese would have done it if the role had been reversed?
Was Pearl Harbor a sneak attack or not?
Were the Japanese (at the time) actively in cahoots with a country who was gassing Jewish civilians?
If the answers are yes... and I believe they all are. Then I don't see how you can say that in THAT INSTANCE that dropping that bomb was the wrong thing to do.
It didn't just save American Lives... it saved lives of many people around the world... Some of these Anti-American statements really seem to be because of what's going on TODAY, and not what actually happened 60 years ago.
Let's keep this real... at the time, it was the best thing to do.
I wouldn't do it today for our problems in the Middle-East, but then, at that moment, it was right.
Personally, I miss Saddam... He kept those neanderthals in check.
Says who? Japan? Would you expect them to say something else?
Yes Japan was signaling that it wished to surrended and knowing japanese culture they would not say something like that unless they meant it. Japanese culture is based on honor and surrendering can decrease ones honor so indicating surrender is something they would not do.
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Already drinking beer #3, this one is for all the crazy burned japs who thought they were hardcore.
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Yes Japan was signaling that it wished to surrended and knowing japanese culture they would not say something like that unless they meant it. Japanese culture is based on honor and surrendering can decrease ones honor so indicating surrender is something they would not do.
So which part of that honorable code falls under "sneak attack" ala Pearl Harbor?
You can't have it both ways you know.
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Yes Japan was signaling that it wished to surrended and knowing japanese culture they would not say something like that unless they meant it. Japanese culture is based on honor and surrendering can decrease ones honor so indicating surrender is something they would not do.
Please refer back to my post on pg 3 and the references stated in it, thanks.
Get the actual facts and please don't infer a conclusion based on mere opinion.
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I rfer you to my post above the references there to inform you of the actual facts. Thanks
That thinking is actually the product of the propoganda promoted by the United States at time. Japan was itneresting in fighting the war for two years, until there resources ran out because they wanted to eventually sue for peace so they had an easier exit strategy in china and they might still have access to the resource rich island of South East Asia{ rubber). There was actually a time clock for public displayed which indicated the level of resources.
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So which part of that honorable code falls under "sneak attack" ala Pearl Harbor?
You can't have it both ways you know.
Actually the united states was aware that Japan intended to attack pearl harbor but choose to ignored it.
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Please refer back to my post on pg 3 and the references stated in it, thanks.
Get the actual facts and please don't infer a conclusion based on mere opinion.
Its not opinion, its based on actually research I had to do.
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Weell yeah maybe but I guess It would have been enough to drop in the hills surrounding Hiroshima... and the Bomb on Nagasaki... was kinda pointless.
Make no mistake the US wanted to test the bomb and they saw a good chance to kill two flies so to speak.
It's damn scary how many people live in this country that absolutely HATE it.
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Actually the united states was aware that Japan intended to attack pearl harbor but choose to ignored it.
The Japanese leaving their consulate is hardly "intention".
Just because we "may" have overheard some static about their attack does not excuse Japan's lack of declaring war with the United States before they attacked us.
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That thinking is actually the product of the propoganda promoted by the United States at time. Japan was itneresting in fighting the war for two years, until there resources ran out because they wanted to eventually sue for peace so they had an easier exit strategy in china and they might still have access to the resource rich island of South East Asia{ rubber). There was actually a time clock for public displayed which indicated the level of resources.
True, the war and conflict in China and into then Manchuria, stretched the Japanese resources to the limit.
They attacked the US in 1941 because they had to try and stop our embargos and interfering with their trade.
We started working on the bomb over fear the Nazis would get one and then used it on Japan when it was obvious they would never surrender. The 600 plus pg book by Richard Rhodes that I refer to in my long post back on pg 3 is a great, long detailed read on this.
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The japs were aware of Little Boy (after hiroshima was cleansed) but they thought they could break usa's hand so they had to suffer the all mighty power of PHATMAN.
Conclusion: Japs learned to stick to sumo & flied lice.
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True, the war and conflict in China and into then Manchuria, stretched the Japanese resources to the limit.
They attacked the US in 1941 because they had to try and stop our embargos and interfering with their trade.
We started working on the bomb over fear the Nazis would get one and then used it on Japan when it was obvious they would never surrender. The 600 plus pg book by Richard Rhodes that I refer to in my long post back on pg 3 is a great, long detailed read on this.
THe bomb was used as a psychological weapon plain and simple and probably had little to do with actually ending the war. The japanese military was essentialy broken by that time and civilian support for the war was very low. As a matter of fact the people of Japan, Im talking civilians, had very little interest in the war from the start. Ive read some of the media documents from japanese news papers at the time and there was decent. Decent was often surpressed but it was there. The United States wanted to occupy japan, not just defeat them. Remember the Russians where interested in occupying Japan as well after being beaten by them.
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THe bomb was used as a psychological weapon plain and simple and probably had little to do with actually ending the war. The japanese military was essentialy broken by that time and civilian support for the war was very low. As a matter of fact the people of Japan, Im talking civilians, had very little interest in the war from the start. Ive read some of the media documents from japanese news papers at the time and there was decent. Decent was often surpressed but it was there
Ok, in all modesty my depth of knowledge in this is most likely way beyond anyone else on this board . I am not trying to be pompous, but in my humble opinion, it is pointless to continue my involvement in the thread here on get big.
Please take no offense and you do have some level of information and seem rather intelligent.
Everyone is allowed an opinion and I am sure you feel yours is more correct than mine based on some things you have actually read. I have no desire to be rude however and will respect your opinion , remain polite, and bow out here saying we will just have to agree to disagree on this. Thanks and no hard feelings. Howard
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Ok, in all modesty my depth of knowledge in this is most likely way beyond anyone else on this board . I am not trying to be pompous, but in my humble opinion, it is pointless to continue my involvement in the thread here on get big.
Please take no offense and you do have some level of information and seem rather intelligent.
Everyone is allowed an opinion and I am sure you feel yours is more correct than mine based on some things you have actually read. I have no desire to be rude however and will respect your opinion , remain polite, and bow out here saying we will just have to agree to disagree on this. Thanks and no hard feelings. Howard
Dude, I totally agree. If came as pompous I apologize. Its nice to have an conversation on here that didnt degenerate to I fucked your sister. You seem like a nice intelligent guy and I respect your opinion.
Mike
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Dude, I totally agree. If came as pompous I apologize. Its nice to have an conversation on here that didnt degenerate to I fucked your sister. You seem like a nice intelligent guy and I respect your opinion.
Mike
Well said and thanks. I felt I was starting to sound pompous, not you. I am not the end all , be all expert on the bomb and WWII, but do have a decent depth on the topic.
Seriously, check out the book " The Making of the Atomic Bomb" by Rhodes, it is a loooooooong detailed read , but will give you the complete record without any poltical agendas.
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Well said and thanks. I felt I was starting to sound pompous, not you. I am not the end all , be all expert on the bomb and WWII, but do have a decent depth on the topic.
Seriously, check out the book " The Making of the Atomic Bomb" by Rhodes, it is a loooooooong detailed read , but will give you the complete record without any poltical agendas.
Ill defiantely do that, man. Thanks
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And a last beer before hitting the pillow, this one is for those who dont understand that paul tibbets is part of the american dream.
For you Paul, For your Legacy, For the biggest favor a man could do to the society: Stop war.
You rule man
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Ill defiantely do that, man. Thanks
Oh and I know you love seeing the DVD of "Trinty and Beyond" the atomic bomb movie.
It shows all the now declassified nuke tests since 1945 to the mid 60's.
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And a last beer before hitting the pillow, this one is for those who dont understand that paul tibbets is part of the american dream.
For you Paul, For your Legacy, For the biggest favor a man could do to the society: Stop war.
You rule man
He was simply the extension of the policy we had to employ at the time. He did what he had to do.
Sometimes life offers lousy choices and or nation did what it had to do, as did Col Tibbets. I think of him as a genuine hero that faced a mission of incredible preasure and didn't flinch.
Now the present conflict in Iraq over oil.....don't get me started, democracy?????? yeah right.
Jordon, Saudi Arabia , the the UAE, Qatar and Kuwait are nations we all trade with on regular basis and are pretty stable and guess what???? NONE of them are a democracy, they are run by a damn KING!
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Yes Japan was signaling that it wished to surrended and knowing japanese culture they would not say something like that unless they meant it. Japanese culture is based on honor and surrendering can decrease ones honor so indicating surrender is something they would not do.
;D ;D ;D ;D
Like raping little Chinese girls, chopping off the heads of POW's, burning entire cities to the ground. Very honorable.
I still can't figure out why Chiang Kai-shek didn't take his 5 million man army, start at the northern tip of Japan, march south and kill every single Japanese person they found. It would have taken time, but he could have done it.
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Well said and thanks. I felt I was starting to sound pompous, not you. I am not the end all , be all expert on the bomb and WWII, but do have a decent depth on the topic.
Seriously, check out the book " The Making of the Atomic Bomb" by Rhodes, it is a loooooooong detailed read , but will give you the complete record without any poltical agendas.
rhodes is not the most reliable author. that book is a interesting read, but rhodes takes more than a few liberties w his sources.
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the bombs were a war crime. aside from slavery and the awful treatment of the Native Americans, the bombs were the most horrendous events in human history
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Well said and thanks. I felt I was starting to sound pompous, not you. I am not the end all , be all expert on the bomb and WWII, but do have a decent depth on the topic.
Seriously, check out the book " The Making of the Atomic Bomb" by Rhodes, it is a loooooooong detailed read , but will give you the complete record without any poltical agendas.
All writers have agendas, whether they be political or otherwise. And getting a 'complete record' from one source, as you should well know being a physics teacher ('test, test and test again'), would be incomplete.
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the bombs were a war crime. aside from slavery and the awful treatment of the Native Americans, the bombs were the most horrendous events in human history
It would have been a crime to let the war going on, ethnic cleansing against japs was needed, tibbets is an hero.
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All writers have agendas, whether they be political or otherwise. And getting a 'complete record' from one source, as you should well know being a physics teacher ('test, test and test again'), would be incomplete.
Are you a real dr. .. dr.chimps?
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Howie.....good post.....right on the money
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the bombs were a war crime. aside from slavery and the awful treatment of the Native Americans, the bombs were the most horrendous events in human history
They purposely tried to attack just minutes after they declared war on us(something like that ;D) but that plan didn't work out.We never knew it was coming. They got what was coming to them.
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Please refer back to my post on pg 3 and the references stated in it, thanks.
Get the actual facts and please don't infer a conclusion based on mere opinion.
I base all my statements on the movies I have seen about WW2 8)
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One has to understand the thinking of the majority of Americans and our govt. at the time of the attack on Pearl Harbor. There was a very strong ethnic prejudice in our country against the Japanese to say the very least! We considered them short, weak, stupid, blind, "bucked-toothed", and way behind intellectually, and technologically, to the West.
We (the U.S.) treated the Japs very condescendingly and just “dared them” to challenge us on several issues/fronts! When we embargoed raw materials to Japan (with the rest of the Western Powers) in early ’41 (in particular, rubber and iron ore), anyone with any knowledge of the eastern mind-set, and their pre-eminent occupation with “pride/saving-face”, knew that war was immediately imminent!
Roosevelt clearly knew this, as did his top advisors, and hoped that when the attack inevitably came, that this attack could be “couched” as a “surprise”/”dastardly” attack (which it was), so as to galvanize the American populace/press with him...which still was strongly “isolationist thinking” at the time! Roosevelt was desperate to get involved directly in the war! He was well aware of the conditions of the Tripartite Pact b/t Germany, Italy and Japan and knew that war with Germany, once Japan launched their “surprise attack” against us was inevitable.
In late 1941, Russia was reeling from the German invasion of 6/22/41, and all of the military experts were predicting their surrender/collapse at any moment with the Germans at the gates of Moscow. Once Russia fell, only a battered and totally inadequate England remained as their enemy. Roosevelt was desperate, and rightly so, and the American people (like now with terrorists flooding across our borders with CBR weaponry) had their heads up their isolationist-thinking/uninformed ass!
The naval commanders at Pearl Harbor (e.g. Kimmel) were deliberately treated like mushrooms (i.e. kept in the dark and fed BS) and deliberately denied crucial info. to be made aware of the imminent attack. Of course, these naval commanders were later sacrificed in trials after the attack as “scapegoats” and Peal Harbor was blamed on them. Again, there was the usual lack of communication, cooperation, cover-up, etc., between govt. agencies to divulge/share vital info., just as existed before 9/11 (times have not changed!).
Prior to the attack, it had been proved in several U.S. military war games (e.g. Billy Mitchell) that the perfect attack on Pearl Harbor was from the northwest out of the shipping lanes, and yet this stark possibility was often ignored in planning the defense of Pearl, etc., etc.!??
I have an old copy of the pre-eminent (at the time) Aviation mag. dated Nov. ’41, I believe, with an article on the Japanese Air Force. The aviation experts writing for the mag. critiqued their air force as totally obsolescent to the West and left out the Japanese Zero fighter altogether! Of course, the Zero fighter, for approx. a year-and-one-half afterward, totally out-maneuvered every U.S. fighter. We paid a terrible price in American blood and treasure for our total disdain, lack of knowledge, and appreciation of Japanese intellect, ability, and technology!
Thank God, we broke their naval code before the pivotal battle of Midway and developed survival fighter tactics to combat the Zero fighter that literally flew rings around our fighters!
From then on, there were just two main U.S. goals to accomplish…sink their merchant shipping and burn/destroy their cities...which we did.
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Howie.....good post.....right on the money
Thanks and I try to base my information on objective facts NOT ineference based on what might have happened and how history is sometimes "revised" to suit an agenda.
Plus, as a former active duty US marine, I can tell ya that war is a dirty , crazy business with horrid acts and insane rules. There is no "nice way" to win a war ,or bomb a country.
In the end, it is you and yours that survive or the other guy.
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everybody should read "Hiroshima in America" by Robert Jay Lifton and Greg Mitchell.
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Thanks and I try to base my information on objective facts NOT ineference based on what might have happened and how history is sometimes "revised" to suit an agenda.
Plus, as a former active duty US marine, I can tell ya that war is a dirty , crazy business with horrid acts and insane rules. There is no "nice way" to win a war ,or bomb a country.
In the end, it is you and yours that survive or the other guy.
Yeah...war is hell
Imagine if it wasn't