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Fox News Fascism – Ron Paul Excluded From Debates
December 29, 2007
Fox News has made its bones off of being a fake news agency. Everyone knows it. While it worked for several years the shine has begun to diminish and the people are waking up to the real damage it can do to mainstream media. Granted, most mainstream media is really no better than Fox News, as they are all corporately controlled by companies that are in bed with the war machine. MSNBC is learning the lessons now as such obviously biased hosts such as Joe Scarborough and Tucker Carlson have failed miserably next to the more honest Keith Olbermann. America is slowly coming around to the notion that news should actually be fundamentally fair. Fox of course has been notoriously unfair and imbalanced for years now. Thus it should come as no surprise that Fox News has decided to once again try to subvert the democratic process by excluding Dr. Ron Paul from their upcoming GOP debate in New Hampshire.
This is what happens when people try to laugh off the power a Fox News can have. Because they have been tolerated as being “real”; they have been at the table to host debates. The first GOP debate hosted by Fox was a lesson in bias. On the stage were eight men who were battling over who could blow the world up better, and Dr. Paul. Fox tried their best to marginalize Paul as best they could. He received half the amount of questions as everyone else. You could hear Fox jack up the volume on the other candidates’ microphones when Paul was responding so the snickering could be heard loud and clear. At one point, in a moment that should be embarrassing for news professionals everywhere, the moderator asked a follow up question to Paul that said, “So you take your marching orders from al Qaeda?” Paul swiftly slapped Chris “fake news guy” Wallace back into line by saying he took his orders from the Constitution. Yet after all of this Fox also tried to stack the post debate against Paul as well. They had seen how Dr. Paul was winning all of the online polling after each previous debate so they switched the method. Instead of voting online, you had to text in who you thought won the Fox debate. Lo and behold, Ron Paul was crushing his competition yet again, much to the dismay of Sean Hannity who exclaimed, “Oh no not again, Ron Paul did not win this debate!”
Apparently Fox has figured out how to deal with the Paul phenomena this time around though; they have excluded him from the debates altogether. Never mind that he is polling higher in New Hampshire then some of the others who were invited. Never mind that he has out performed all of his competition in fundraising, WITHOUT taking lobbyist/corporate monies. Never mind that he raised six million dollars in one day. The issue is simply to subvert democracy and have a fake news agency tell you who you can listen to for presidential candidates. It is beyond appalling, it is sickening. I do not care if you are right or left, republican or progressive; you must be disgusted by this move to try and willfully interfere with our electoral processes.
Let’s face it; we know why Fox has taken this tact. First, Ron Paul is the only one who has a different opinion then the rest of the GOP crowd. Fox wants the consistent message of the neocon sent at the debates. Iraq is going great, Iran should be blown up next, and only the big strong republicans can protect you from the boogey-man…and Hillary. Fox does not want to hear Dr. Paul injecting sanity into the debate. They do not want to hear how it is unconstitutional to go to war without congressional approval. They do not want to hear about how the country is broke and we need to pay down the debt. They do not want to hear anything that diverts from the script they have orchestrated.
Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, the machine is scared. They are scared of the momentum they see Ron Paul generating from a real grassroots effort. They are scared of the message that says it is not ok to blow up other countries for the profit of a few. They are scared of the message that says civil liberties matter. They are scared because they see that someone may get elected who understands the precarious situation we are in with our currency. They are scared because all of their efforts to mock and marginalize, to ignore and dismiss have only further emboldened the cause for liberty.
Regardless of the reasons though, it is a dark day for our democracy when any news agency, even a fake one, can purposefully and maliciously try to affect the outcome of a presidential election. I have read that Fox News will be embarrassed if Paul ends up winning the New Hampshire primary despite this blackout. Nonsense. Fox News does not care about being embarrassed. They have been an embarrassment for a decade and they do not care. That is how Rupert Murdoch operates. He does not care about appearance or reputation. He cares only about imposing his narrow-uber-conservative view upon the world. He does not care how he does it.
I would call for a boycott of Fox News but no one really takes them seriously. Just remember this point in history America. The machine is now telling you who you can even listen to and the rest of the media is complicit in their silence over it. There are many waypoints on the road to fascism and today we are staring at yet another. Dr. Paul has warned us repeatedly about the fascist state we are heading more deeply into. I guess that message was heard loud and clear by the fascists who have no decided to try and silence him. Liberty and freedom however have a way of rising above the white noise generated by the machine that seeks to stifle them. I pray that continues to happen in the face of the blatant undermining of everything we stand for as a nation.
Anthony Wade, a contributing writer to opednews.com, is dedicated to educating the populace to the lies and abuses of the government. He is a 40-year-old independent writer from New York with political commentary articles seen on multiple websites. A Christian progressive and professional Rehabilitation Counselor working with the poor and disabled, Mr. Wade believes that you can have faith and hold elected officials accountable for lies and excess.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_anthony__071229_fox_news_fascism__96_r.htm (http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_anthony__071229_fox_news_fascism__96_r.htm)
think they will let him back in? or will he remain blacked out?
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can any people here defend pulling Paul?
He is polling ahead of many who are invited.
He has more $ than many who are invited.
He is strawpolled to WIN in 18 states today.
He was on Meet the Press last week.
Why would FOX not invite him? Anyone?
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come to think of it...
most fox viewers are already hardcore mitt/rudy guys, although huck is stealing them and most have heard of RP by now.
What this does is give more NATIONAL attention to Ron Paul. And it motivates the shit out of his base volunteers and supporters, who need a machine to rage against. FOX is giving it to them. People on all sides of the aisle will question why he's excluded.
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can any people here defend pulling Paul?
He is polling ahead of many who are invited.
He has more $ than many who are invited.
He is strawpolled to WIN in 18 states today.
He was on Meet the Press last week.
Why would FOX not invite him? Anyone?
He might remind people how they're getting fucked ever day of their lives by the Neo Con's or say something else that's not acceptable to Faux New's
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come to think of it...
most fox viewers are already hardcore mitt/rudy guys, although huck is stealing them and most have heard of RP by now.
What this does is give more NATIONAL attention to Ron Paul. And it motivates the shit out of his base volunteers and supporters, who need a machine to rage against. FOX is giving it to them. People on all sides of the aisle will question why he's excluded.
Rudy and Rupert go waaaayyyyy back
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So who is being invited? I really don't see what the fuss is about. According to Fox News polls and others, Paul has no shot to win either the New Hampshire primary or the Republican nomination.
http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/FOX_NH-2_DEC_RELEASE_WEB.pdf
http://www.pollingreport.com/wh08rep.htm
http://mpinkeyes.wordpress.com/2007/12/05/latest-new-hampshire-republican-presidential-primary-poll-1205/
According the Fox poll, Romney, McCain, Rudy, and Huckabee are in contention in New Hampshire. Paul is in the back of the pack with Thompson, Tancredo, and Hunter.
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So who is being invited? I really don't see what the fuss is about. According to Fox News polls and others, Paul has no shot to win either the New Hampshire primary or the Republican nomination.
http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/FOX_NH-2_DEC_RELEASE_WEB.pdf
http://www.pollingreport.com/wh08rep.htm
http://mpinkeyes.wordpress.com/2007/12/05/latest-new-hampshire-republican-presidential-primary-poll-1205/
According the Fox poll, Romney, McCain, Rudy, and Huckabee are in contention in New Hampshire. Paul is in the back of the pack with Thompson, Tancredo, and Hunter.
tancredo isn't in the race
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More:
The “fair and balanced” FOX News has officially given Ron Paul the finger. They have excluded him from a debate on January 6th in New Hampshire, 2 days prior to the New Hampshire Primary. The good thing is that Ron Paul is fighting back along with his army of supporters.
From Boston.com:
PLAISTOW, N.H. — Ron Paul said the decision to exclude him from a debate on Fox News Sunday the weekend before the New Hampshire Primary is proof that the network “is scared” of him.
“They are scared of me and don’t want my message to get out, but it will,” Paul said in an interview at a diner here. “They are propagandists for this war and I challenge them on the notion that they are conservative.”
Paul’s staff said they are beginning to plan a rally that will take place at the same time the 90-minute debate will air on television. It will be taped at Saint Anselm College in Goffstown.
“They will not win this skirmish,” he promised.
The Fox debate occurs less than 24 hours after two back to back Republican and Democratic debates on the same campus sponsored by ABC News, WMUR-TV and the social networking website Facebook.
Paul, the Republican Texas Congressman, was wrapping up his final day of campaigning in New Hampshire until the Iowa Caucuses on Thursday.
He spent much of the day campaigning at diners in Manchester and Plaistow and downtown walks in Derry and Exeter.
The Ron Paul Forums, blogs, mailing lists, and websites are all up in arms over the exclusion. What is perplexing is that Fred Thompson has been invited and he is consistently polling lower than Ron Paul in New Hampshire polls. In fact he’s at 2% to Paul’s 8% in FOX News’ own poll. The letters WTF come to mind.
Is FOX News truly afraid of Ron Paul? It’s difficult to believe otherwise.
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tancredo isn't in the race
Yes, he dropped out last week (20 Dec). The Fox News poll in the first link, which shows Paul at 8 percent, is dated 14 Dec. Second link, which shows Paul at 3 percent, is dated 18-19 Dec.
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Ron Paul is with the terrorists.
They want him to win the nomination so we can pull out of the war on terror.
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He's up to 5 percent in Iowa.
http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/Dec/30/br/br1039846275.html
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He (and Kucinich too) might be higher if they weren't ostracized by the media.
Fuck Fox Noise - I don't want Ruperty Murdoch telling me who is a "legitimate" candidate
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yeah, at the least, we've wondered why we continually hear Hannity and others mock Paul... accusing his fans of being able to rig every onilne poll, etc. You'd think the candidates with MONEY would be able to do it, eh? ;)
I've never been one to question polling validity, but in a world where the military admits they put out disinfo to influence public perception, and the media in this case is attempting to influence election outcome, you have to wonder....
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He's up to 5 percent in Iowa.
http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/Dec/30/br/br1039846275.html
After all the primaries, that's the magic number to be included on the ballot to run as an independent.
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even though many right wingers despise his views...I believe Ron Paul is a true republican. He wants low taxes, less government spending, and he wants to tackle domestic problems...I think his ideas are a fresh change.. as for Fox news...well they're news programs can hardly be considered unbiased journalism...
they should let him speak his mind and argue his points.. the American public should hear new options...because obviously what we have been doing the past couple of years hasnt been working..
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even though many right wingers despise his views...I believe Ron Paul is a true republican. He wants low taxes, less government spending, and he wants to tackle domestic problems...I think his ideas are a fresh change..
Correct.
Many people here - like beach bum and Mr Intenseone - voted for Clinton in 92 and 96. THis means their first 'taste' of republican party was the neoconservative element that arose in 2001.
THey don't know what the party used to be aboue - small govt interference, strong constitution, no nationbuilding, and small govt spending. Remember when the DEMS were the spend-happy, constitution-hating idiots who wanted to fix every country but our own?
My, how the times have changed.
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yeah a lot sure has changed...and not for the better...makes me not want to go back to the USA
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After all the primaries, that's the magic number to be included on the ballot to run as an independent.
Requirements for getting on the ballot vary from state to state, but there is no way a candidate can wait till after the primaries and run a successful campaign. Way too late. It's probably already too late for an independent to make a serious run.
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Requirements for getting on the ballot vary from state to state, but there is no way a candidate can wait till after the primaries and run a successful campaign. Way too late. It's probably already too late for an independent to make a serious run.
interesting... does anyone know when Perot entered? He earned almost 20% of the popular vote and while he carried no electoral votes, he sure as hell handed the election to Clinton.
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interesting... does anyone know when Perot entered? He earned almost 20% of the popular vote and while he carried no electoral votes, he sure as hell handed the election to Clinton.
The electoral college is corrupt!
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interesting... does anyone know when Perot entered? He earned almost 20% of the popular vote and while he carried no electoral votes, he sure as hell handed the election to Clinton.
yeah then I remember everyone was bitching about ross perot taking away votes
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I'm not sold on Ron Paul even though I like some of the stuff he says
he's much more of a libertarian than a republican
I think fox is afraid of him but they would be better off letting him participate in the debate
he doesn't have a chance of getting the republican nomination but he could be like the crazy old uncle in the corner
by excluding him I think they make it a story and that makes him look stronger
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yeah then I remember everyone was bitching about ross perot taking away votes
That was such bullshit. Perot didn't take anything away. Voters wanted an alternative to the typical Dem/Repub garbage.
No vote is a wasted vote if you truly believe in what your candidate stands for.
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That was such bullshit. Perot didn't take anything away. Voters wanted an alternative to the typical Dem/Repub garbage.
No vote is a wasted vote if you truly believe in what your candidate stands for.
I agree no vote is a wasted vote - unless it's Ohio 2004 where they were never counted -
But Perot did statistically take away a lot more votes from bush than clinton, and Bush1 would had won if Perot hadn't entered.
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It's really a shame that the 9/11 hijackers didn't hit the Fux Noise building rather than the twin towers.
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Let me tell ya..Fox News isn't afraid of Ron Paul..If he ahd a chance of wiining or drawing more then 5% of the popular vote..he'd be on....he'l draw less. If mickeymouse could draw real numbers he'd be on the debate. Their producers, the guys doing the dabates aren't all hard news guys, they want ratings. If they thought he';d bring that, he'd be in.
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Let me tell ya..Fox News isn't afraid of Ron Paul..If he ahd a chance of wiining or drawing more then 5% of the popular vote..he'd be on....he'l draw less. If mickeymouse could draw real numbers he'd be on the debate. Their producers, the guys doing the dabates aren't all hard news guys, they want ratings. If they thought he';d bring that, he'd be in.
if this is true then we're fucking doomed
democracy > ratings
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I agree no vote is a wasted vote - unless it's Ohio 2004 where they were never counted -
But Perot did statistically take away a lot more votes from bush than clinton, and Bush1 would had won if Perot hadn't entered.
Then Bush I should have run a better campaign.
The same can be said of Gore in 2000. The robot democrats were whining like pussies that Nader "stole" votes from Gore. Nader didn't steal shit. The people voted for who they wanted to vote for.
The arrogance of the Democrats and Republicans really sickens me at times.
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Honestly...I'd put him on, why not. They don't put on people who won't draw numbers. If he was black they might put him..but he's white and honestly I don't believ the money nor the numbers he's drawing. They say he's got the most support of any candidate amongst the military...I don't know anybody who is voting for him, most haven't heard of him. Some of his ideas a great...his domestic stuff is good..but his foreign policy is nuts.
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Let me tell ya..Fox News isn't afraid of Ron Paul..If he ahd a chance of wiining or drawing more then 5% of the popular vote..he'd be on....he'l draw less. If mickeymouse could draw real numbers he'd be on the debate. Their producers, the guys doing the dabates aren't all hard news guys, they want ratings. If they thought he';d bring that, he'd be in.
Thompson is in, and he has lower numbers.
Explain.
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http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_anthony__071229_fox_news_fascism__96_r.htm (http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_anthony__071229_fox_news_fascism__96_r.htm)
think they will let him back in? or will he remain blacked out?
How is that Fascism?
I would call it anti-democratic.
But how can anyone label it as Fascism?
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Honestly...I'd put him on, why not. They don't put on people who won't draw numbers. If he was black they might put him..but he's white and honestly I don't believ the money nor the numbers he's drawing. They say he's got the most support of any candidate amongst the military...I don't know anybody who is voting for him, most haven't heard of him. Some of his ideas a great...his domestic stuff is good..but his foreign policy is nuts.
HH - do you really think that Fox is putting on the debate just to get ratings (i.e to sell ad's).
I seriously doubt it. In fact, Ron Paul is such a lightening rod that having him on would most likely increase the ratings. I think Fox (Murdoch) is much more interested in controlling the message and that's why they're leaving out RP. The question is why does a TV network get to frame the political discussion and influence our democracy.
Fuck it - why don't we just skip the election and let Fox News pick our next puppet president
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I have worked with several of their producers in the past...first off these guys All bounce between either cable or the big 3. They are all pretty much primadonna's and once they have what they need from u, u never hear from them again. Its all about ratings to these guys. Several of the folks who work on Brit Hume and Shepard Smith's show are pretty good and seem to care more about the news then any of the others including the other networks. I've worked with one from CNN and they were pretty good as well. But bye and large they're their for ratings which in turn lets em keep their jobs. The higher ups are the folks with the conservative agenda and thats fine. Fox news was created as an alternative to CNN..no harm with competition but..if u watch Fox u can see elements of Fox Entertainment creep in. I laugh when u guys debate the news networks....its all about cash first. In my line of work with the Army we get to train with Fox News as part of Training with Industry, the program is suspended until 09'.
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Fox is now saying that they just don't have room for 5 people and that's why they are leaving out RP and Duncan Hunter. So now it's about lack of space. I still believe this is mostly about controlling the message and probably about removing anything that would harm Murdoch's favorite which is Rudy.
If this were simply about ratings then one would have to conclude that by INCLUDING RP that the ratings would be less than if he were excluded. This makes no sense. Would viewers tune out if they see RP? I doubt it. However it's likely that many/most RP supporters will not watch if he is excluded - hence lower ratings. If this were just about ratings they would definitely want RP on that stage. He's nothing else if not entertaining, especially when he makes the other candidates squirm. That's good TV - IMO
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I would agree...they should include him..but knowing these guys..they want ratings so I'm kinda surprised. Honestly RP supporters won't makea dent in Fox's numbers for the debate and I'm sure many of his supporters will watch, so they can better attack the other candidates.
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I would agree...they should include him..but knowing these guys..they want ratings so I'm kinda surprised. Honestly RP supporters won't makea dent in Fox's numbers for the debate and I'm sure many of his supporters will watch, so they can better attack the other candidates.
Remember that Ron Paul has won many of the polls based upon online voting.
He's also leading most if not all of those guys in donations.
And military people donate more to him than anyone else.
There have to be a *few* Ron Paul fans watching the debate, dude. Enough to make a dent.
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I would agree...they should include him..but knowing these guys..they want ratings so I'm kinda surprised. Honestly RP supporters won't makea dent in Fox's numbers for the debate and I'm sure many of his supporters will watch, so they can better attack the other candidates.
Not to belabor the point (but I have nothing else to do today). If RP supporters won't make a dent in Fox's #'s for the debate (I assume you meant if they didn't watch) then how exactly would they lose #'s by including him. Would other viewers tune out if he were included??
i.e - include RP and ratings go down as compared to the same debate without RP?
The "ratings" argument makes no sense (IMO).
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No..I think its cost vs having him thing..honesly they should include him but they may feel that there is a cost/ratings benefit from not having him. As far as the military..how do we know that he's the leading candidate among the military based on donations....I know of nobody voting for this guy, let alone giving him money. I'd need proof..this to me is bullshit. I'd only half believ it if Mccain said it..nobody else.
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No..I think its cost vs having him thing..honesly they should include him but they may feel that there is a cost/ratings benefit from not having him. As far as the military..how do we know that he's the leading candidate among the military based on donations....I know of nobody voting for this guy, let alone giving him money. I'd need proof..this to me is bullshit. I'd only half believ it if Mccain said it..nobody else.
Boom!
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No..I think its cost vs having him thing..honesly they should include him but they may feel that there is a cost/ratings benefit from not having him. As far as the military..how do we know that he's the leading candidate among the military based on donations....I know of nobody voting for this guy, let alone giving him money. I'd need proof..this to me is bullshit. I'd only half believ it if Mccain said it..nobody else.
again - I think the ratings thing is nonsense
explain how it Fox is going to lose money by including RP or give it up
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Boom!
FOX NOISE = LIBERAL MEDIA
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RP has ripped the shit out of Rupert murdoch in his speeches and interviews.
is it any surprise he is excluded from the debate?
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RP has ripped the shit out of Rupert murdoch in his speeches and interviews.
is it any surprise he is excluded from the debate?
You know, one day away from I-day...we will see; I am most concerned about voter fraud though; they pulled that shit in the past.
If the country is going down, it better go down fighting the Neo-cons...(Dems and Repubs=same)!
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No..I think its cost vs having him thing..honesly they should include him but they may feel that there is a cost/ratings benefit from not having him. As far as the military..how do we know that he's the leading candidate among the military based on donations....I know of nobody voting for this guy, let alone giving him money. I'd need proof..this to me is bullshit. I'd only half believ it if Mccain said it..nobody else.
I don't see the harm in including him either, but according to the polls he is clearly not a viable candidate for the Republican nomination.
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I don't see the harm in including him either, but according to the polls he is clearly not a viable candidate for the Republican nomination.
given that Iowa is the first primary and there are many more to go, why not include ALL candidates
primary is the first in a process
let the people decide
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The people are going to decide. Fox doesn't control the election.
I can see arguments on both sides. On one hand, he has done some remarkable things with his recent fundraising. On the other, his poll numbers haven't changed much and the NH primary is next week.
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why start trimming the field before even having the first real vote
fox is most definitely trying to exercise all the influence it can
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Fox has already had more than one debate in which candidates, including Ron Paul, who are in the single digits, were invited to participate. Even after all the buzz, he is still in single digits in New Hampshire:
Poll: Neck-and-neck in New Hampshire
(CNN) -- With six days to go until the New Hampshire primary, there are ties in poll results for the top candidates in both parties.
Sen. John McCain, left, has come back to tie ex-Gov. Mitt Romney in a New Hampshire poll.
With roughly a quarter of those polled in both parties saying they won't make up their mind until the election, both the Democratic and Republican presidential nomination races are up for grabs.
Sen. John McCain of Arizona, whose campaign was languishing six months ago, and former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney are now tied for first place, with each grabbing the support of 29 percent of likely New Hampshire Republican primary voters, the CNN/WMUR poll conducted by the University of New Hampshire found. Watch an examination of Romney's attack ads »
Former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani is at 12 percent with former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee at 10 percent. The remaining Republican White House hopefuls for the 2008 campaign are in single digits.
. . . .
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/01/02/nh.poll/index.html